Did Chicago Lose Olympic Bid Due To US Passport Control? 1040
An anonymous reader writes "Yesterday, Chicago lost its bid for the 2016 Olympics (which went to Rio de Janeiro instead), and it's looking very likely that US border procedures were one of the main factors which knocked Chicago out of the race: 'Among the toughest questions posed to the Chicago bid team this week in Copenhagen was one that raised the issue of what kind of welcome foreigners would get from airport officials when they arrived in this country to attend the Games. Syed Shahid Ali, an I.O.C. member from Pakistan, in the question-and-answer session following Chicago's official presentation, pointed out that entering the United States can be "a rather harrowing experience." ... The exchange underscores what tourism officials here have been saying for years about the sometimes rigorous entry process for foreigners, which they see as a deterrent to tourism.'"
Comment removed (Score:5, Informative)
Easily the most unfriendly airports in the world (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Easily the most unfriendly airports in the worl (Score:5, Informative)
Just so you know, people at American airports don't treat *Americans* very well either.
"The most ridiculous interview..." (Score:5, Informative)
"The most ridiculous interview I heard with my own ears:
Interviewer: "What did you have this morning as breakfast?"
Applicant: "Bread." I: "Nothing else?"
Applicant: "No."
Interviewer: "According to American law, we cannot grant you a visa."
Applicant: "....".
I was sitting beside the person when he was rejected. You know, it is funny to reject someone according American law just because he only had bread in the morning."
From http://home.wangjianshuo.com/archives/20060519_getting_us_visa_in_china.htm [wangjianshuo.com]
Re:I'm sure it didn't help. (Score:5, Informative)
And let me tell you, if people from the UK are telling you that your border-control is unwelcoming, then it must be! I also live in the UK. You can bounce around Europe crossing borders with little more than a wave of your passport and a friendly nod. Then when you come back to the UK, it's a bit of a shock. Most of the EU find Britain rather silly with how worked up about its borders it gets, given that the rest of it manages with less pomp *and* has direct land passage to outside countries. I've also heard some strong complaints from people I know about entering the US. Aren't they asking for retinal scans or fingerprints in some places, now?
Re:I'm not looking forward to going to the US (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Border Control only? (Score:4, Informative)
Although Brazil has quite a few social problems, they're well on their way to getting their shit to together and I'm thinking in the not too distant future, they'll be a very large power house in the World Economy. I may start taking Portuguese!
Re:Brazil's passport system is no picnic either (Score:5, Informative)
No, they just make you go through the exact same thing a Brazilian citizen goes while going to your contry.
If you're from a Schengen country, come on in. If you're from the US, you need a visa, you need to have your fingerprints taken, etc, etc
Reciprocity's a bitch, isn't it.
Re:I'm sure it didn't help. (Score:3, Informative)
And in no way I am in favor if killing a single human, but I think whatever happened was reciprocation (right or wrong, I am not in favor of any) of certain foreign policies of certain western nations. Nobody is innocent here.
Re:Puhleez... (Score:3, Informative)
As a matter of fact, yes I do.
I struggle think of countries where I would expect a worse welcome than the USA. Maybe Zimbabwe as Mugabee blames the British for all the problems it is facing at the moment.
US Customs Isn't Kind To US Citizens, Either (Score:5, Informative)
I have had similar experiences in the past as well, I once had to pull from the customs booth to the "additional screening" building (single car garage with doors on both ends) where I had to empty my trunk for a customs agent.
So I can't say I'm surprised if the security theater here was a deciding factor against having another Olympics here. Certainly our procedures have changed a fair bit since 1996.
Re:Border Control only? (Score:3, Informative)
I just heard this on NPR this morning. You know what else the Brazilians are pledging? $14 Billion! What was Chicago going to pledge? $5 Billion to this event.
Re:Passport Control? (Score:2, Informative)
Chicago is known for being wet, cold, windy, and expensive.
Actually, Chicago in the summer is know for being miserably, even deadly [uchicago.edu], hot.
Re:I'm sure it didn't help. (Score:5, Informative)
According to Wikipedia, ETA has killed "over 800 individuals" since 1968 and the IRA has killed "around 1,100 members of the British security forces, and around 630 civilians" since 1969. On that measure having the IRA is twice as bad as having ETA.
Re:Puhleez... (Score:4, Informative)
Re:Did Tokyo lose because of this as well? (Score:2, Informative)
Of course as an anti-terror policy it is somewhat silly. The only terrorist attacks I know of in Japan have been committed by Japanese. About the only outside group that might consider a terror attack on Japan is North Korea and being a tall white guy, I don't exactly look North Korean... But I guess applying it fairly beats racial profiling.
On the other hand, crime by Chinese residents is a big and growing problem in Japan. So I can understand them wanting to clamp down on immigration procedures and so on. It's just a matter of executing it in a fair, professional and efficient way which from what I've seen they're doing.
Re:Good for Rio (good for Chicago) (Score:3, Informative)
Obama just wanted it there because he lived there once
"lived there once"? what the hell does that mean? outside of 4 years at harvard he lived in chicago from 1985 until he became president.
Re:I'm sure it didn't help. (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Chicago lost it because it didn't deserve it. (Score:5, Informative)
http://www.areaconnect.com/crime/compare.htm?c1=Chicago&s1=IL&c2=Los+Angeles&s2=CA [areaconnect.com]
Kiss my Angeleno ass. Los Angeles has lower rates of murder, robbery, assault, theft, and burglary.
When Los Angeles, gang ridden shit hole that is, has a not just a lower crime rate, but fewer actual crimes despite its larger population, than your city, you need to shut up.
Re:I'm sure it didn't help. (Score:1, Informative)
There are no requirements for fingerprints or retinal scans in the US, at least not from canadians.
As a Canadian, I have to admit that border requirements have definitely been tightened up to the point of ridiculous long wait times at entry points, but it still just consists of waving a passport and answering some grade school bullies questions about your travel plans.
The biggest downside to the strengthening of the US borders is that the CDN gov't has seen fit to up their q&a at entry points as well. Major PITA
Re:I'm sure it didn't help. (Score:5, Informative)
Every entry point takes fingerprints of every visitor who is not a US Citizen or legal US Resident.
Incorreect. there are at least 20 entry points at the northern border that are unmanned and simply have a phone there asking you tell them you are crossing the border.
If you fly into Canada and then drive to the USA, you can bypass all that crap, hell you can easily enter and leave without anyone knowing you were here in a few places.
Our security is a complete and utter dog and pony show that is 100% worthless in stopping the Evil-guys.
Re:I'm sure it didn't help. (Score:2, Informative)
You know what? If you are lucky to come from certain "non aryan" place and do couple of things very wrong, that "pain in the ass" could become literal.
I have no clue why people travel to USA from certain areas, it is like visiting Germany as a Jew in 1939. Goodwin or not, it is the truth for some. If people with thousands of dollars in their pockets and way better education/personality than that customs nazi guy keeps taking all that treatment, it will never, ever fix.
Re:I'm sure it didn't help. (Score:1, Informative)
The 'Real IRA', as they call themselves, are still killing people and making bombing attempts.
Re:more likely reason: (Score:2, Informative)
Re:I'm not looking forward to going to the US (Score:2, Informative)
Nice idea, but no.
There is no circumstance in which a US embassy can tell you for sure that you will be allowed into the USA.
The guy at the border can always turn you away. Even if you've done nothing wrong. Even if you have a valid visa. Even if you're the fucking Pope. If the guy at the border doesn't want to let you in, you don't come in.
Re:Did Tokyo lose because of this as well? (Score:3, Informative)
I visited Japan during the initial H1N1 scare and even then it was a fairly pleasant experience. I was concerned about missing our connecting flight from Tokyo to Osaka but we were processed and had our luggage within 20 minutes of disembarking and checked in 10 minutes later. We even managed to get a plastic bottle of water air-side. It was taken from us, put through a sniffer machine and very politely handed back.
I wasn't looking forward to the new passport/fingerprint restrictions, but they were all done in a typically low-key Japanese way and I didn't have a problem with any of it.
Re:I'm sure it didn't help. (Score:4, Informative)
It was a security policy. The implication was that by reducing the volume of carry-on, they could examine carry-on luggage more closely. The U.K. has been diddling with this policy on a daily basis, it's hard to know what the rules are on any given day.
Last I checked it was one bag, and nail scissors were approved the day after thye were taken away from me.
link [gatwickairport.com]
It's lunacy. Normally I just throw up my arms and let them do what they like to my luggage.
So Gatwick is okay now. Stansted is still broken.. at least according to gatwickairport.com, which well, probably isn't updated frequently on Stansted policies.
Re:Actually... (Score:1, Informative)
It might not be listed in the report but Montreal just finished paying off their 1976 Olympic Games in 2005.
2nd hand smoke causes cancer (Score:4, Informative)
There, didn't think about that did you? Care about your enviroment, shoot crack.
Re:I'm sure it didn't help. (Score:3, Informative)
There are no requirements for fingerprints or retinal scans in the US, at least not from canadians.
There are, they just aren't enforced against Canadian citizens and permanent residents . However, citizens of others countries residing in Canada will be forced through a fingerprint scan if they try to cross that border (I know from personal experience, I did that twice myself, and I know quite a few people on work visas in Canada who also cross relatively frequently).
However, they still can require any Canadian citizen to go through a scan if they deem you suspicious or something. That said, since you're still on Canadian soil before they let you through, you can refuse the scan and walk away undisturbed (under Canadian privacy laws), and they cannot detain you for investigation - only prevent you from crossing the border.
Comment removed (Score:3, Informative)
Re:I'm sure it didn't help. (Score:3, Informative)
What I think is astounding is the pure gall of the conservatives, blaming president Obama for not getting the Olympics when it was their crap ass policies and politics that put in place the anal probe, 3rd world border treatment afforded our guests these days. Like we're going to forget who was behind it all. But that's been the pattern right along. Absolving themselves from any accountability by trying to pin it on someone else. Pathetic.
Actually the pathetic thing is you doing just what you are accusing conservatives of doing... blaming someone else.
Were US entry policies to blame... perhaps. Has President Obama done anything to make things easier? Not really.
The President does get a fair bit of blame for spending something on the order of $1.2 million dollars for the quick day trip involving several planes (why can't he and the wife carpool anyway?), obviously contributing to global warming along the way while spending millions of US tax payer dollars for transportation and security (in the middle of a recession when unemployment continues to rise) and trying to leverage his much touted international appeal... all to an embarrassing end.
Had the President been as experienced as some like to think he would know that one does not lend his stature to negotiation of this type, instead only appearing when the deal was done and lending his stature to the final successful closing of it... because anything else is a waste of his time and credibility.
Face it... the President failed at something he decided to inject himself into. Do other parties and other reasons share some blame? Perhaps. However that does not change the fact that the President of the United States decided to inject himself into yet another issue that he had no direct responsibility to (as his is pattern), and once again failed miserably to deliver.
Say... how's that Gitmo closing thing going? Or the economy? Iran? Jobs? I'm sorry friend, but the past 9.5 months have not exactly been a bunch of wins for this new administration... and the sooner you realize the actual cause of many of these things, the easier you will sleep at night because HopeNChange... have failed.
Re:I'd *love* to be a tourist in the States (Score:3, Informative)
We may not be as state-of-the-art as Japan, but I just bought one with a 3" flush valve. WHOOSH!
Re:I, for one, boycott the US (Score:0, Informative)
This government efficiency is why we aren't exactly thrilled with the idea of government health care...
Re:I'm sure it didn't help. (Score:1, Informative)
I will be driving across America this coming spring (I-90, I-5, I-10, and I-95).
This is actually the third time I've done this. If any UK citizens or other Europeans would care to join me, I'll show you the *real* United States. No not New York City and its claustrophobia-inducing skyscrapers (yuck). The real United States is a giant expanse of mostly grass with lots of cows, and just a few oasses of civilization (cities) dotting the landscape.
Not just the olympics... (Score:5, Informative)
Re:more likely reason: (Score:2, Informative)
Chicago is famously corrupt, and since I have no interest in visiting it as an American (having seen enough of urban blight and the people who live in it) I can see why the Olympics are being hosted elsewhere. Rio is exotic, Chicago is not. Rio can clear whatever area is needed for the Olympics, while US law exists to obstruct. Labor costs will be lower in Rio. End of story.
Re:I'm sure it didn't help. (Score:3, Informative)
When you travel by car, feet, train or ship throughout Schengen countries, you will notice the border crossing only by change of street signs, language or car plates - or by the ratio of beer:wine, good cuisine:bad cuisine, and so on.
Re:I'm sure it didn't help. (Score:4, Informative)
There won't be an oil shortage any time soon, but if there is a shortage, the problem will be more severe than you think, tractors are currently machines that turn diesel into food, with no oil, getting food to market won't be the problem, growing it at all will be the problem.
Re:Did Tokyo lose because of this as well? (Score:4, Informative)
Re:I'm sure it didn't help. (Score:4, Informative)
Were US entry policies to blame... perhaps. Has President Obama done anything to make things easier? Not really.
He's had 9 months, inheriting a cratering economy, failing banking sector, automotive sector and a health care crisis. I think he's done damn job with what he was given to work with. You don't change direction in a bureaucracy like DHS overnight. Besides, as soon as he starts looking at it or proposing changes, you'll be screaming about how Obama is leaving the country open to attack.
Pathetic AND predictable. Maybe you noticed it was people from outside the US raising this issue? No? That's not surprising.
Nothing but criticism and negativity. I'm sick of it, sick of you. This country would be farther ahead if we carved off a section and let you have your own space. I'd be all for that. You already have a propaganda cable channel and chain of newspapers you can take with you. Vile, disgusting, angry, small-minded, pathetic people. It sucks to have to call you countrymen.
Re:Did Tokyo lose because of this as well? (Score:3, Informative)
London and regeneration. (Score:4, Informative)
The Olympic games in London will take place mostly in East London, an area famous for its gangsters and low lifes of all kinds.
The idea is that by hosting the games in that area they will be an incentive to regenerate it, creating new jobs and businesses and replacing ugly industrial areas with liveable areas and sporting facilities.
This has worked, with varied degrees of success in other venues, for example the are around the Olympic Stadium in Barcelona is now a tourist attraction, before the Olympics it was a very ugly neighbourhood that you wanted to avoid by all means.
Re:I'm sure it didn't help. (Score:2, Informative)
Re:I'm sure it didn't help. (Score:3, Informative)
Stansted and Edinburgh airport do that as well (perhaps all airports). You go into the airport, check in your hold luggage and keep your laptop with you using a laptop bag. No problem. Go shopping, buy a newspaper, a Wired magazine and some shortbread biscuits for gifts. Still no problem. Put these items into a plastic bag. Now, we have a problem. You now have *TWO* bags.
Normally, security would just put these into separate plastic trays and scan them separately. Now, the airline companies like Virgin and Easyjey employ some smart-asses (usually in yellow or orange T-shirts) to *ENSURE* that *EVERYONE* puts everything into the largest bag before being allowed through to
security, so that everyone is carrying only one bag. What do the security people do? Require that everything is taken out of the bag and scanned separately.
Re:I'm sure it didn't help. (Score:3, Informative)
In the crossing points I've been through, you are on US soil when questioned by US guards. So if they don't like something you can be detained.
I find it somewhat strange that US guards could operate on Canadian soil.
Re:I'm sure it didn't help. (Score:3, Informative)
Border formalities have been dismantled for almost all of continental western Europe (excepting Gibraltar, where you still have to show your passport, and Switzerland, where they almost always wave you through and are often out to "lunch"). The German-Danish border you visited many years ago is now just a signpost, with nobody to even wave your passport at.
Re:I'm sure it didn't help. (Score:3, Informative)
I guess I happen to live in one of those shitholes you are complaining about.
Please, get a life. Get out and smell some fresh (and not so fresh due to cattle and other farm animals) air!
More importantly, get out to where the only other human within 20 miles are any companions you brought with you.
I've been to 3rd world countries and even lived in them, and you don't have a stinking clue as to what exists within this country if you think your twisted vision of the USA outside of the metro areas is anything like what you are talking about.
China worse? You know not of what you speak... (Score:4, Informative)
Coming into China at 5:45 AM or 11 PM, I have never had to wait for immigration officers to get to their stations; officers are ready any time passengers are arriving. Contrast that to the last time I entered the US - September 14th, 2009 at LAX on NWA flight 002. The entire plane - a full 747-400 with 403 passengers - had to wait for 40 minutes until 9 AM, when immigration officers finally started their shift. And we then queued into line while the officers strolled out one at a time, took 5-10 minutes to get their station ready, then started processing.
China worse than US? Not by a mile. The US simply sucks in terms of immigration, even for US citizens. But as a US citizen, I've come to expect nothing less of any Federal employee or department; we citizens exist to serve and support them, not the other way around!
Simple: no one takes 3 months off of work. (Score:3, Informative)
>I mean, which law I might have breaking for taking three months off work?
In the United States, the concept of taking three months off of work is inconceivable. The idea of taking a full two weeks off is borderline lunacy. The idea of taking a whole week off is borderline fantasy.
Re:I'm sure it didn't help. (Score:3, Informative)
Switzerland joined the European Schengen Agreement a few years ago, which means no more direct border controls. This applies to most of the EU with the exception of the UK and a couple of other places.
Re:Border Control only? (Score:2, Informative)
Re:I'm sure it didn't help. (Score:3, Informative)
Switherland became part of the Schengen Area on 2008-12-12, which is not exactly âoea few years agoâ. It's less than one year. However, not being a member of the European Union or the European Economic Area, Switzerland is still supposed to check for goods that have to be declared.
The UK is a partial member of the Schengen Agreement.
Re:It is worth it (Score:3, Informative)
If I wanted to pay to be insulted, demeaned, and harassed I'd want it done by a professional - preferably in full leather.
If you're in Australia, I can get you a number on that. Though most of the Dommes I know prefer Latex.