Microsoft Counts Down To XP Death 766
mikejuk writes "Microsoft have just released an end-of-support countdown gadget that ticks off the days until XP is no longer supported — but it only runs under Vista or Windows 7! It focuses the mind on the fact that XP is being forcibly retired. It is a wake-up call to think hard about the unpleasant situation and consider the alternatives.So as you watch the count down to XP's death tick by think about the problems created by using software that actually belongs to someone else..."
oblig (Score:5, Funny)
Re:oblig (Score:4, Funny)
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Activation isn't a problem, but a gadget isn't a zip-file, it is a cab-file.
But the javascript does use some gadgets-specific events like dock and undock. Which would only be available in the dock obviously.
I love how they use table for layout instead of proper CSS like the rest of the world. ;-)
It takes 2 minutes of hacking to disable some of that stuff, it does work on Windows XP just fine.
Re: (Score:3)
Obviously no developers at Microsoft are still running XP to test it...
Re:oblig (Score:5, Insightful)
Luckily your box will continue to work fine; people seem confused by end of life. If you've never had problems and you don't need anything new (like patches to keep up with virus writers) then this end of life won't change your experience at all.
It's like selling you a car with a really long warranty that includes modifications due to changing laws - except the internet is a country that changes it's it's vehicle requirements all the time. When that warranty expires and they're not willing to keep working on your car (for free), doesn't mean you can't drive it around your own lot; leave it parked somewhere as a garage, or even drive on the road and try to avoid the police. It just means that the manufacturer is no longer providing a value added service; when they said they wouldn't.
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I have all the patches I need for the games I play now. I'm behind a router and stopped updating XP since service pack 3 screwed up my network and slowed my machines to a crawl. I have four machines that don't even have anti-virus anymore. I watch my network traffic and scan the shared drives from a machine on the lan.
To get suitable performanc
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And that's because the software world moves on, too. Newer, better frameworks that let you deliver more per developer-hour are not evil.
A computer that will run Windows 7 can be had on Craislist for $50. I shed not a single tear.
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I purchased a brand new retail copy a couple years ago. As far as I know, there isn't anything in the box that says it won't activate after a certain date. I might be willing to hire a lawyer to fling a lawsuit at M$ the day it fails to activate. I don't care about support, but I want to be able to run it in a VM until the day I die. If M$ turns it off, then they have effectively put a kill switch in the product. Something I believe has been ruled to be a no-no in a couple of instances.
Uh, unless you're a programmer... (Score:2, Insightful)
Doesn't *ALL* software "belong to someone else"? Even with FOSS software you depend on others to maintain it. If they stop, then you don't get updates. Now sure, you could theoretically go down to the local college and get a programming degree and learn to do it yourself--but how often does that REALLY happen? At least with MS, I know the software is going to be supported for several years, and not become adandonware because Jeremy got a new job and doesn't have time to update it anymore.
Re:Uh, unless you're a programmer... (Score:5, Insightful)
So then buy from Redhat, or Ubuntu or whoever. Lots of folks will provide support for FOSS software. This is an old piece of FUD you are spewing here.
Re:Uh, unless you're a programmer... (Score:4, Insightful)
But if you can't do it yourself, being dependent on RedHat or Ubuntu really isn't any better than being dependent on Microsoft other than philosophical differences which really don't enter into a business decision.
Re:Uh, unless you're a programmer... (Score:5, Insightful)
It's very different, because there are multiple organisations that provide linux support and nothing to prevent new organisations springing up, while only one organisation provides windows support.
You wouldn't want to grow dependent on anything without there being a second source supplier who can step in if the first one fails. And similarly, multiple competing suppliers will result in better and cheaper service.
Re:Uh, unless you're a programmer... (Score:4, Insightful)
Case in point - Mint. It's perhaps the best version of Ubuntu that's available from a first-time user's standpoint as it comes with all of the basic codecs and sound drivers installed. I found it to simply put, work. The transition to it is no different than any other operating system, and shouldn't be much harder than going from XP to Windows 7 would be.
It's climbed to the #2 spot at Distrowatch for exactly this reason. There's really no reason other than maybe gaming, to be forced to have to deal with moving to Windows 7 any more. But since the PC games are almost all just console clones these days and offer few actual differences and advantages over a console, you can survive without most games these days as well. (ie - just buy your games on your console and leave the PC to doing computer-related tasks.)
Re:Uh, unless you're a programmer... (Score:5, Insightful)
Um...last time I checked there are around 73,357,145,315* companies in the world which will provide support for Micorosoft products
Last time I checked, there was one. And you probably couldn't afford it.
The problem here seems to be a misunderstanding of what 'support' means. Support means being able to get someone on the phone (or your favourite communications technology) and say 'this is broken, fix it,' and have them fix it. If your hardware or software configuration triggers a bug in the Windows 7 kernel causing it to crash, how many companies can offer support? One: Microsoft. A few other organisations have access to the source code, but none have the legal right to ship patches.
Now, if you're running Red Hat Enterprise Linux, and you have a bug like this, then you can get Red Hat to fix it if you have a support contract, but there are also many thousands of other companies willing to do the same work. For Linux and *BSD kernels, there are even individual consultants that a small business can afford to hire who will track down and fix a bug that only affects you. If you're in the same situation with regard to a Microsoft product and you're not a Fortune 500 company or a major government, you're pretty much out of luck.
Huge difference. (Score:3)
Dude, when MS pull the plug on XP, the game is over. No company can spring up to plug the gap. That is the different.
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Um...last time I checked there are around 73,357,145,315* companies in the world which will provide support for Micorosoft products.
But those companies cannot dig down into the guts of the OS, or the apps.
This is very different than the situation for companies that support F/OSS.
Please do not misunderstand, I am not saying that F/OSS is ideal for everything. But, being open, can have significant advantages. At least, in some cases.
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What scenario are you envisaging where Microsoft goes out of business but some other company doesn't buy up the source code to continue selling and supporting ?
Heck, what scenario are you envisaging where Microsoft goes out of business at all ?
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There are plenty of applications where there isn't even a network connection or multiple users or even changes to user software.
For them, loss of patches and updates isn't really a problem. What might be a problem is if it becomes impossible to activate the OS. I assume there are activation hacks out there, but if there aren't, then this event will cause them to become more widespread. Some people care more about the legal implications of this than others.
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You could easily hire people to keep your RHL 9 system patched and going until the end of time. If you truly needed to stay on RHL 9 for some reason, you could do so and still stay up to date wrt security and reliability. You have access to the code, so you can fix it as you need. This is not an option for XP. That's the difference. Buying access to the XP source (and the legal rights to modify it) will cost you much more than the salary of a dev to maintain your own personal fork of RHL 9.
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I laugh at your naive assessment that competing/alternate Linux vendors/contributors will support something that isn't theirs. If SuSe or Red Hat goes belly up tomorrow, or it's announced it will no longer be supported, you seriously expect that someone will *100% for sure* support it to the level required by an enterprise customer?
Far more likely things will change in much the same way as the dropping of support for XP changes things.
Just look at the recent situation with Open Office.
I agreed with one of
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Suse already does provide support for RHEL.
The recent situation with oo.org? You mean they changed the name and life goes on?
If you are willing to pay sure, but we are not comparing this to production support. XP comes with updates and that is it.
Re:Uh, unless you're a programmer... (Score:5, Informative)
If SuSe or Red Hat goes belly up tomorrow, or it's announced it will no longer be supported, you seriously expect that someone will *100% for sure* support it to the level required by an enterprise customer?
Well, considering that Oracle will do that very thing for RHEL right now, I'd say the answer is obviously yes.
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The same thing you'll do if you've got some critical application running on OS/2 or Apple II or MS-DOS 2. You will handle it yourself, or you will be fucked.
Why would you even bother comparing some one-man band distro from 1992 with anything that we're talking about here? That's ludicrous. I had to look SLS Linux up to even find out what the hell it was.
Re:Uh, unless you're a programmer... (Score:5, Informative)
Yup. Because if RedHat won't, and Novell won't... I will.
That counts as one of the best features of Linux. Company-X might not have any desire to help you keep an old box running and secure. But unlike EOL'd Windows versions, if we hear about a new critical vulnerability today, by tomorrow a patch will exist; and unlike Windows (EOL'd or not), it doesn't matter if that vulnerability affects Solitaire or the deepest recesses of the kernel, a sufficiently knowledgeable user still has the power (and legal right) to repair it.
So yeah, in many cases, it might make more sense to upgrade to a newer version. But if you absolutely, positively need to keep an old Caldera 2.2 box up and running, and have enough money to throw at me, we can keep that sucker up and running until the Sun swallows the Earth.
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Yeah, good thing RedHat is still supporting all their releases... Oh ... wait ... no they're not. RedHat 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 - all gone. RedHat Enterprise Linux 1, 2, 3 & 4 - all gone. Gee, maybe retiring old versions of software is just ... universal?
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Not to mention Apple retires OSes in just a few years after release but there's no outcry on here. This is typical Slashdot anti-MS bitching, nothing else. If one bought XP then, it was an incredible amount of value. Expecting the company to support it for forever doesn't make sense.
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Except that RHEL3 is still supported in its extended life cycle phase until October 31, 2013, and RHEL4 doesn't reach the end of its regular life cycle until February 29, 2012 - and then is in extended life cycle phase until February 28, 2015
Red Hat Enterprise Linux Life Cycle [redhat.com]
But yeah - RHEL 2.1 reached EOL in mid-2009, so you're right a
Re:Uh, unless you're a programmer... (Score:4, Interesting)
OK, let's be realistic:
http://www.google.com/search?source=ig&hl=en&rlz=&q=custom+linux+kernel+development+services&aq=f&aqi=g-v6g-j1g-b2&aql=&oq=#q=custom+linux+development+services&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&bih=632&biw=1012&fp=560fefca0938c389&hl=en [google.com]
I bet you could find that one of these companies would be willing to help you with your RedHat 2 problems, for the right price. I also bet that it would be several orders of magnitude less than it would cost you to convince Microsoft to fix bugs in Windows 95, especially the pre-service pack 1 version that was contemporary with RedHat 2. You need to face up, it is not possible for the typical business, for any amount of money, to get fixes to old versions of Microsoft software, while it is possible, both in theory and in practice, to get fixes to old versions of most open-source software.
Re:Uh, unless you're a programmer... (Score:4, Interesting)
XP is dog-eared shit. It's so long in the tooth, that it regards SATA as an exotic technology.
Try installing from a CD onto a piece of post '04 hardware. It will often refuse to recognise disks, displays, and any network devices. Unless you have slipstreamed your own installer with several of the service releases, you must resort to sneaker-net from a working machine to supply the endless list of drivers. Thank God there is working USB 2.
Without a later SP, you cannot even connect to most wireless APs. WPA2 is a blocker, and it's pull a cable, or back to shipping hundreds of megabytes on your flash drive.
Then? Prepare, once you have connectivity, for the 100-odd updates and patches. I suggest you assume 3 hours and three reboots - with a fast network.
That people and organisations continue to prefer this situation to Vista or Win7 is a complete indictment of Microsoft and their utter failure to produce real value for users since 2001.
Apple is shooting through the roof. Corporations where I would see only HP or Lenovo are 20-30 % Mac! Mind you: this means buying from a company with no significant enterprise sales division and no spec customisation for large customers.
When people leave XP? They really want to leave Microsoft. Apple would still be selling single-digit percentages, had MS not so totally and arrogantly fucked their core business.
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xp is FINE for my netbook with that skimpy atom cpu.
you want to FORCE either vista or win7 on me? and I do dual boot to linux; but some things do need windows, still.
my asus netbook is a year old. the o/s is being abandoned? that seems unfair.
xp is a very mature product. win7, not so much. win7 is alright for bigger boxes but WRONG for smaller ones. removing xp is removing a choice that actually did work well enough.
Re:Uh, unless you're a programmer... (Score:5, Informative)
XP was forced onto netbooks because Vista, and 7 are to much for netbooks, and MSFT forced manufacturers to install bigger processors and actual hard drives to get XP onto those machines.
Remember the first netbooks were a lot like the ipad in terms of hardware. small flash memories(4-8 gb) low power processors etc all running Linux. MSFT realized the threat and extended XP's life because that was easier than cutting down windows 7 to fit on the first few Netbooks.
The only thing that really surprises me much any more is just how easy people forget reality and their own history.
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So then run centos/fedora/ubuntu and get patches for free. If you only want patches you don't have to pay at all.
Re:Uh, unless you're a programmer... (Score:5, Insightful)
Total cost of ownerships figures are debatable, what is not is that with closed source sofware you do not decide your own IT strategy.
You just "do as told"..
If you like that, be their guest...
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Linux and FOSS are all well and good and may be a good choice in many areas of IT, but please cut this goddamned FUD bullshit already. Guess what? Linux and FOSS are not an end-all, cure-all for every area of computing. Get over it. XP has be
Re:Uh, unless you're a programmer... (Score:5, Insightful)
Debian, with in place upgrades there is no need for a standing version. Gentoo as well. This whole one version thing is a hold over from proprietary licensing.
If you want to go that route XP has not been supported that long, XP SP1 is for instance no longer supported, I do not believe SP2 is either.
Re:Uh, unless you're a programmer... (Score:5, Informative)
RHEL desktop self-support subscription is $49 a year. Windows 7 Home Premium is $200. Cost is roughly equivalent on a 4-year upgrade cycle, though RHEL support gives you more than a Windows license does.
RHEL Workstation self-support subscription is $179/yr. Windows 7 Pro is $300. Ditto on the qualification re: getting more.
If you're looking at a standard subscription for RHEL Workstation, it's $299 a year. Compare to the same level of support from Microsoft: probably Technet Pro, which is $349 for the first year and $249 for renewals.
How is the parent spreading FUD when you're the one comparing apples to oranges? You're either misinformed, or being disingenuous. If it's the first, then I hope I've opened your eyes. If it's the latter, then GTFO.
Re:Uh, unless you're a programmer... (Score:5, Insightful)
You can upgrade that Ubuntu to the latest version for 0 GBP. People love to claim MS prices are in line, but they forget that they did not get a free win 7 disk in the mail.
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Just because Ubuntu allows you to upgrade to the newest LTS for free doesn't make that a slam dunk solution to the e
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its easy to get into a situation where you simply cannot upgrade to the next LTS without significant cost involved due to major version bumps in package
Precisely why FOSS is better. If there is a business case to be made for supporting RHEL x.x.x, then some company can do it. With windows XP, microsoft has all the cards, and can do what they want. Forcing the world to move on might be convenient for them, and that's the way the cookie crumbles.
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Yep. My work still as not upgraded to Windows 7. We have too many in-house products that are not (yet) certified to run reliably in 7, and we don NOT have the option of just rolling it out and hoping for the best. Hell, we still have a few web-apps that run exclusively on IE 6.
Many people don't get that upgrading for personal use and upgrading in the enterprise are two completely different beasts.
Re:Uh, unless you're a programmer... (Score:4, Informative)
The windows license does not include support only updates. Phone support costs money, call MS and ask.
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Canonical sells ubuntu phone support. They also sell on-site support if you have the money for it.
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XP has been supported for so long because they couldn't offer anything better so their customers (read corporates) insisted on them doing so. Being unable to get Vista/7 to run on Netbooks didn't help them either.
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Way to compare production server support to desktop software upgrades only. Talk about apples to oranges, more like apples to orangutans.
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I've been a user of both Ubuntu (LTS and not) and Windows XP Professional. What kind of support Microsoft gave me that Ubuntu didn't? They looked exactly the same to me: some patches automatically coming down the pipe, automatic installation, occasional reboots required on Ubuntu (only for kernel updates) vs constant reboots required on WinXP. Overall Ubuntu fared better: less reboots (I usually suspend my notebook overni
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OpenVMS - The operating system with uptime as long as the support time of some operating systems.
Re:Uh, unless you're a programmer... (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Uh, unless you're a programmer... (Score:4, Insightful)
Can you clear up the math for me?
150 / 12.75 = 11.76 GBP/year
0/5 = 0GBP/year.
To me the latter looks like a better deal.
The support packages you speak of are for things not included in an XP license, you know phone support.
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Isn't it unfair that you are comparing the desktop version of windows with RHEL?
How about Windows Server 2008 + Exchange + 100 CALs for both products?
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Not at all true, XP with IE6 is SP1 which does not have support anymore.
FOSS companies compete for you to depend on them (Score:2)
Even with FOSS software you depend on others to maintain it.
True, but with free software, you choose on whom to depend.
If they stop, then you don't get updates.
With free software, companies compete for you to depend on them. If they stop, you can switch to another company offering support for the product. True, an unpopular free software product is in the same boat as proprietary software with respect to end of life concerns, but the more popular ones have a wider choice of support options.
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"True, but with free software, you choose on whom to depend."
Just like you can choose to depend on MS. BTW, which linux distro releases patches for 10 year old releases, I'm curious..
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"which linux distro releases patches for 10 year old releases, I'm curious.."
If you installed a 10 year old release of Debian you could likely update it to the current release version with no problems.
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"which linux distro releases patches for 10 year old releases, I'm curious.."
If you installed a 10 year old release of Debian you could likely update it to the current release version with no problems.
Been there, failed at that... Support for jumping revs of glibc is NOT as good as it could be.
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Did Canonical mail you a free Ubuntu 10 disk?
Canonical used to run a program called ShipIt that would, indeed, mail free discs. But it still sells 5-packs for 5 GBP. And for people already fortunate enough to have broadband with a cap in the double-digit GB per month or higher, downloading and burning Ubuntu costs far, far less than a copy of Windows 7.
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As a competent admin I can build packages from source if need be. If the application that it depends on is no longer supported at all, then alternatives will have to be found. Just like moving from XP to 7, or when MS started forcing IE7 on everyone.
Re:Uh, unless you're a programmer... (Score:5, Insightful)
We've seen people taking advantage of that option (for somewhat different reasons) just recently with OpenOffice, and for KDE3 there is the Trinity "fork".
Regarding "Ownership" though - I completely agree, just because MS stops support doesn't mean you can not use the software anymore. Similarly Ubuntu or Redhat will also eliminate support for older versions at some point.
Re:Uh, unless you're a programmer... (Score:4, Insightful)
With FOSS software when the programmers stop updating, new programmers fork the code and continue to update it.
This happened with X11, Open Office, etc etc. As a user of FOSS you can pretty much rest assured that the software you use will be supported so long as it fills a need or isn't replaced by something superior. It won't be abandoned even if you don't code, simply because other programmers can pick up the ball and keep going with the product.
Corporate software is much much more likely to become abandonware. Companies go out of business, their corporate goals change, a product may not be generating enough income, or they simply want to sell something new and shiny. Compare that to a product like Emacs. It was first released in the mid 70's and just had a new release last month. Odds are it'll still be around 30 years from now.
Re:Uh, unless you're a programmer... (Score:4, Insightful)
This isn't entirely about updates. Once Microsoft disables the activation servers, you won't be able to install it anymore. From the article:
Now, obviously the guy writing the article doesn't know when MS will turn off the activation servers.
It's one thing to say you won't get updates ... it's another thing to say that you don't get to keep running the software in a lab for testing or extended support. I can only imagine that point of sale or other things with XP might linger for quite some time. If XP actually phones home to see if it's still allowed to run, it's theoretically possible those could just stop working (though I have nothing to support this suggestion).
At least with FOSS, you're still allowed to install something old and busted -- if MS turns off the activation servers, you might not be able to do that. In this case, "owned by someone else" refers to the ability to disable new installs, and possible basically lock out existing installs.
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RHEL... RedHat.
Forth (Score:2)
Damn glad I stuck with Forth.
OS? I don't need no stinking OS...
derp derp (Score:2, Insightful)
So as you watch the count down to XP's death tick by think about the problems created by using software that actually belongs to someone else..."
Yes, you're better off with opensource. It's much nicer knowing software you depend on may be abandoned without notice.
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So then buy from redhat or another FOSS vendor.
Re:derp derp (Score:4, Informative)
Ubuntu. You can just keep upgrading in place for 0. Debian is another, you could go get a 10 year old disk and if it would install dist-upgrade your way all the way up.
When did MS start giving XP users free win 7 disks?
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LoB
Really? (Score:4, Insightful)
Windows XP is almost 10 years old. Find me a Linux distro that supports 10 year old versions, on the desktop.
No one cried foul when Windows 98 was EOLed, after only 8 years. That was because they liked XP. Microsoft has pushed back the EOL on Windows XP multiple times due to complaints, but it's time to move on.
If you dislike Vista and 7, use something a different operating system. Don't pretend Microsoft should support 10 year old software.
Re:Really? (Score:5, Informative)
Except Microsoft is still selling XP. I mean new copies of it to day. I can still buy a PC that comes new from the factory with XP.
How long did Microsoft support 98 after it stopped selling it? Windows 2000?
That is the difference. Stop XP should have five years from the day they stop selling it.
Re:Really? Not really, they stopped last year. (Score:3)
October 22, 2010 is the last date you can sell a PC with XP on it, from Microsoft. If someone is continuing to sell them, that's between the purchaser and the seller, and Microsoft would not be too happy about it.
http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/products/lifecycle [microsoft.com]
Microsoft is not selling XP, resellers are. And Microsoft would prefer you chose Windows 7, not XP.
Re:Really? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re: (Score:3)
With XP, Microsoft has done its best to preserve legacy applications. If an application working on 98 was not working on XP, the application was the culprit and needed to be repaired.
With Vista, Microsoft has broken compatibility. Application migration is complex. Many drivers do not exist on Vista64 or 7. If you want to keep your perfectly working hardware and soft
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Actually you can't. Vista and 7 no longer have the 16-bit subsystem. (You can probably run them in XP mode, but that's just Windows XP in a VM) The earliest applications you might be able to run are from Windows 95.
kaaaching (Score:2)
Microsoft is trying to ensure the life of their company. XP is not bringing in the revenue for them any longer, so from their perspective it's time to move on. This is really bad for the consumers. People are happy with the product. Companies are saving $$$ by not replacing software and licenses.
This is potentially good for the economy, because corporations across America will soon be forced to update the operating systems and IT departments may need to hire new techs for installations. Conversely, com
Re:kaaaching (Score:5, Insightful)
his is potentially good for the economy, because corporations across America will soon be forced to update the operating systems and IT departments may need to hire new techs for installations.
This is just another version of breaking windows (*sigh* just re-read this, the glass kind) being "good" for the economy because it caused people to buy windows and pay window repairmen. The "good" for the economy would be found instead in people switching to more efficient software, having less system downtime, and more security resulting in less spam/viruses wasting resources. But the simple forced switching causing companies to hire IT workers is not good for the economy.
Don't get me wrong, IT workers are important for a company, but you need to understand that all they do is lose a company money. Like HR, they usually don't produce product, they are on overhead. A good IT person can "save" a company huge sums of money by being efficient and lowering overhead and downtime company wide, but increasing IT budget is always a loss unless that increase is recouped by their ability to increase efficiencies elsewhere.
Re:kaaaching (Score:4, Insightful)
Good for the economy? Would you please look up "broken window fallacy"?
But in a nutshell, it's not of economic benefit to replace something that serves its purpose INSTEAD OF getting something new which serves a new purpose. The resources used "fixing the broken window" cannot then be used to, say, glaze a new window in a new store.
--PM
Re:Pull Your Head Out (Score:5, Insightful)
Dude, XP is over 10 years old. Please inform me which popular Linux desktop distro has backwards support for 10 year old packages?
XP was still on sale last year when I bought my netbook (now wiped and running Ubuntu). The date it was first released is meaningless.
Re:Pull Your Head Out (Score:4, Insightful)
Let me get this straight... (Score:5, Funny)
Manufacturing (Score:3)
I work in manufacturing. We have HUNDREDS of very expensive machines ($100K - $2M cost each) that are controlled by PCs running everything from Windows 98 to NT to XP. In fact, I think there may even be some tools that still have Win3.11 interfaces. I think the majority are still using NT 4.0.
They still chug along. It's getting more expensive to get some replacement parts that work, but it's still cheaper and easier than having the tool control software and drivers completely re-written for a new OS.
I doubt my experience with this is even remotely unique in the manufacturing world. Tools are expensive and tend to stay around for a LONG time.
Activation (Score:5, Interesting)
So what's going to happen to the online activation?
Long ago when XP came out there was an issue of what happens when XP gets killed and there's no more activation. I believe Microsoft claimed that they were going to release a patch to take away the activation before killing XP, but I don't know if that's even true. And if it's not, people may be in serious trouble when their XP thinks their new harddrive requires phoning home and Microsoft refuses to answer. Forced upgrades for everyone.
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I don't know about XP, but Microsoft released a final version of Money that did not require activation, prior to ending their support and all updates. So, historically they have done it before. Then again, there was Plays For Sure...
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>>Oh noes you might have to abandon decades old technology.
The XP UI is absolutely superior to Win7. As a power user, I could do everything faster in XP, and more deterministically. While Vista allows you to keep the classic start menu, Win7 has no such option, and you have to hack it to get the Quick Launch bar the way it used to be in XP.
I actually just upgraded this week so that I could get TRIM support (and for a couple other reasons), but I was in absolutely no hurry to upgrade. Finding Classic S
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Classic start menu: ClassicShell [sourceforge.net]
Precisely (Score:4, Funny)
That's why I write my own OS, drivers and software. I also dug my own well in my backyard, bought a windmill-powered generator, built my own car, bake my own bread and only read stories that I wrote myself. Of course, with the latter, I usually have to wait about five years to forget the plot, but at least I know I'll like it.
Actually, I do bake my own bread, weather permitting.
Re:Precisely (Score:5, Interesting)
That's why I write my own OS, drivers and software. I also dug my own well in my backyard, bought a windmill-powered generator, built my own car, bake my own bread and only read stories that I wrote myself. Of course, with the latter, I usually have to wait about five years to forget the plot, but at least I know I'll like it.
Actually, I do bake my own bread, weather permitting.
I know you're joking but I've several friends who have *built* their own wind-powered generator systems (largely from instructions in MAKE magazine or Instructables) and while small generators like that certainly aren't running their whole houses, they do offset some electricity usage. Likewise, one of them has also made his own inverter for his solar panels, so he can back-drive into the grid (which seems like a Very Bad Idea, but hey he's the one with the master's degree in electrical engineering, not me.)
I was in a car crash a couple years ago and have serious memory problems. Back when my brain worked better I used to write a lot of short fiction, and guess what? I do reread my old stuff with no clear idea of how it's going to end. Le sigh. So your joke is all too real.
Just advertising really (Score:3)
It may very well be that some folks within the company really are trying to be helpful and let you know that, hey, there's something newer and better available.
But in reality, it's just marketing. Advertising. Vista was bad enough when it was released that I think folks wouldn't have wanted to switch regardless of whether they were on Windows 98, much less XP. The situation was exacerbated when the uptake of Windows 7 was still slowed by folks hesitating from moving away from Windows XP.
In fact, it seems similar to how they've had to try to push people away from older version of Internet Explorer. It seems Microsoft is fighting to keep their new offerings relevant. For the most part, I think they're improving. IE is looking much improved over just the last five years. Windows 7 is close to erasing the tragedy of Vista but could perhaps still use some help.
As for Office... well, I think the best thing they could do for Office would actually be to start trimming it down rather than trying to add new features. It's better than it used to be but it seems like they're starting to run into a wall where they've reached the limit of real useful new features they can add and are now trying to just spin straw into gold with smaller features and tweaks and UI changes.
No support != reason to stop (Score:3)
Re: (Score:3)
umm... because xp is in "extended support" http://support.microsoft.com/lifecycle/?LN=en-gb&C2=1173 [microsoft.com]
U are not receiving new features / sp's but you are getting bug fixes currently. The problem with keeping on keeping on with a EOL operating system will be that it will be increasingly difficult to secure it.
Just because ... (Score:5, Insightful)
MS has got a tough fight getting people to switch. (Score:3)
The large majority of PC owners (not the corporate accounts,) take whatever OS comes with the box.
The corporate accounts have staff who absolutely HATE change.
They buy based on functionality and make NO changes. (I know of some FAX servers in an office's closets in the midwest that are still running on IBM hardware and on OS/2 and will until they stop running.)
The people who hate change even more than IT staff are accountants. They LIKE hardware that behaves like it.
That is the nature of their customer base.
The people who buy microsoft's new OSs are OEMs, who don't use 'em either.
Time to concentrate on programming... (Score:5, Interesting)
Killing Windows XP (Score:3, Informative)
Micro$oft is killing Windows XP only because not enough users have switched to something newer.
Per W3Schools, Windows XP is used on 42.9% of computers while Windows 7 is used on only 34.1%.
Per StatCounter, Windows XP is used on 47.32% of computers while Windows 7 is used on only 30.6%.
(Both sets of stats from March 2011.)
The major problem is that I use software with Windows XP that will not run on Windows 7. Those applications do exactly what I want, but there are no new versions for Windows 7. Not only will I have the expense of upgrading Windows, I will also have the expense of replacing otherwise good applications.
Cost of license is only one piece of the equation (Score:3)
For example, upgrade to the latest Ubuntu, say, isn't an issue because it is free and if the hardware won't go there you can just stick with the old version, safe in the knowledge that developers aren't actively trying to find reasons to make their latest offerings not run on it.
Sticking with old versions of Linux can be problematic as well. Unless you're willing to continue using old versions of all of your applications, you'll want to build packages from upstream source. When you try to do this, you'll find that many of them have dependencies on newer versions of libraries which aren't available in the older distro's repository. You can end up in a situation where you're needing to track down and port a whole bunch of libraries yourself... and at the end of the day, you may still find that one of them relies on a kernel feature that simply isn't there. Unless you've got a lot of time to spend mucking around, or are willing to accept the fact that many newer applications simply won't work, running outdated Linux distros isn't going to be a cakewalk.
You also won't be getting automatic security patches (though I suppose older distros are going to be relatively secure via "security through obscurity").
Then Microsoft will turn off XP (Score:3)
As a final act, will Microsoft release an update to XP systems that just disables it, or turns off key functionality?
Remember when Tivo did that? Remember when Sony did that? Do you have a contractual guarantee that Microsoft won't do that?
Start a consortium (Score:2)
Re:Hmm (Score:4, Insightful)
What abuse of power? You can continue using XP for as long as you want; they don't magically make it stop working.
They are just saying they are not going to spend further time and money updating it. After almost 10 years this should have been expected seeing that most software isn't maintained nearly as long.
Re:Hmm (Score:4, Informative)
How the hell is a company choosing, after _13 years_, to no longer support a piece of software "abuse of power"?
Nobody's forcing you to uninstall XP. You'll just have to come to terms with the reality that at some point it will no longer be supported.
Re: (Score:3)
If you've only seen two then you must have been trying very hard to avoid them...
As constrast to your statement, my work laptop has more than a dozen programs that installed themselves as 64-bit by default.
Re: (Score:3)
A decade ago is when XP was introduced. It was still sold as recently as 2 years ago.
XP came with my netbook, which is still in perfect condition, but doesn't have the horsepower to run Windows 7.
Re: (Score:3)
Seriously, the OS is just a way to start applications by clicking on them. XP performs this simple task pretty well.