London Installing Largest Free Wifi Network 158
aesoteric writes "London's Westminster, Kensington and Chelsea districts will be delivered the largest free wi-fi zone in Europe. The plan is to provide the service in time for the 2012 London Olympics, which start in late July, to allow visitors and residents to get more out of their stay."
Read the fine print (Score:5, Interesting)
Read the fine print when you agree to their terms of service.
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Read the fine print when you agree to their terms of service.
Yes, no doubt it says that if you are fucking stupid enough to use unsecured wi-fi to plot terrorist or civil disobedience measures intended to disrupt the Olympics, the police will be down on you like a ton of bricks as they will be monitoring what is going on.
Like the use of CCTV cameras on public streets, I find it hard to think of this as a serious civil liberties question.
All the better to watch you with, my dear (Score:3, Insightful)
I'm guessing it won't be anonymous.
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Re:All the better to watch you with, my dear (Score:4, Insightful)
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Re:All the better to watch you with, my dear (Score:5, Informative)
Depends on your hardware. Recent intel "centrino" wifi chips can not change their MACs- I found this out personally because the driver under linux lets you try to change the MAC, but if you try to use it with one of these new chips it just fails to work over the air.
Re:All the better to watch you with, my dear (Score:4, Informative)
Re:All the better to watch you with, my dear (Score:5, Funny)
A change of your MAC or IP is a criminal offence, remember, as every newborn you have an IPv6 in your birth certificate and screening profile attached to it from day one.
--Judge Dredd
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That's why the FED created Caterday. One by one they will take over every day with cute pictures of our animal overlords.
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Not for everyday Joe, but I personally feel much better on every public network.
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Ther
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Re:All the better to watch you with, my dear (Score:4, Informative)
I'm guessing it won't be anonymous.
I can't imagine how the identification would work.
TFA
In Westminster alone, it could be providing internet access to half a million tourists each day, 250,000 residents and 500,000 workers.
Half a million of tourists - would they plan to ask for a "tourist id" for granting access?
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What is this obsession with false security? (Score:2, Insightful)
Seriously, a MAC address?
Hahahah.
Like a Mac Address cannot be spoofed, cannot be varied, cannot be transferred through exchangeable USB WiFi sticks, or even through a hot spot that bridges to the MuWiFi.
Re:All the better to watch you with, my dear (Score:4, Informative)
Your mac address is as easy to set as you IP on Linux and unlike IP address on wifi you can pick whatever you like (though most are obviously fake).
Take your pick:
http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Changing_Your_MAC_Address/Linux [wikibooks.org]
Its also pretty easy on any other *NIX
Just windows does not come with a built in to do it.
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If you don't know it can be changed, chances are you have no need to change it.
The people who don't know, don't care and probably have nothing to hide and give them selves away in many other ways.
Unless you are paranoid the government its out everyone that is.
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The common tourist doesn't know how to change it. The common iPhone user doesn't know how to change it. I'd even say the common Android user doesn't know how to change it. All because it _can_ be changed doesn't mean it _will_ be changed.
More to the point, it doesn't need to be changed.by most people. If you come to the UK and download child porn or instructions on how to make a suicide bomb kit over a public wifi service, I hope you get caught before your stupidity affects anyone else.
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Just windows does not come with a built in to do it.
Yes it does, it's called regedit.exe. That's no less built-in (and no more obscure) than "add[ing] a variable like [MACADDR=12:34:56:78:90:ab] to the ifcfg-eth0 or similar file."
Anyway, most NIC drivers have an entry right on the "Advanced" tab of the NIC properties in Device Manager for entering a MAC override, either "Network Address" or "Locally Administered Address," which sets the appropriate registry entry.
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Yes it does, it's called regedit.exe.
Yes, but that involves manually manipulating a text file, which is hard to do for most users, and if something goes wrong you could bollocks up your computer. Oh, wait...
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It's called a MAC address
Which is useless. I know nerd paranoia is cool and all, but law enforcement really can't do anything with a MAC address (I work for a company that does extensive digital forensics as related to criminal work). There's no giant "MAC Address Database" that links them to users, and even if there was the data wouldn't be useful as they can be spoofed. Typically this work is done via physical access to the hardware, or via a trojan that you somehow get onto the device.
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I can't imagine how the identification would work.
MAC address, computer/browser fingerprinting or they can just sniff your e-mail/facebook/other login.
Setting up a network of hostile access points would be the easiest thing in the world for a third party.
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MAC address, computer/browser fingerprinting or they can just sniff your e-mail/facebook/other login.
Setting up a network of hostile access points would be the easiest thing in the world for a third party.
Tor network? Organized over some hundreds of points using the same free WiFi?
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Https should be sufficient. Or just install a proxy at home and tunnel all your requests to it via ssh. I mean, ther's a shitload of options here.
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Do you really think anything except DNS, HTTP and maybe POP3/IMAP will be allowed? They will block everything they possibly can, especially BitTorrent and Tor.
Privacy from spying by other users will be an interesting problem. I best most people have never heard of Firesheep and will happily log on to Facebook without a moment's pause. A few years back I ran a free wifi hotspot and we logged all URLs (employer's request), and could easily have gathered hundreds of account details.
Wireless@SG (Score:5, Interesting)
In Westminster alone, it could be providing internet access to half a million tourists each day, 250,000 residents and 500,000 workers.
Half a million of tourists - would they plan to ask for a "tourist id" for granting access?
They should just ask Singapore how Singapore handles it.
Wireless@SG works in most places I've tried it (Changi Airport, Orchid road). I get the code from the info booth at the airport, valid for 4 hours and wander around Singapore for a bit before my next flight. Handy for long stopovers. A beer in SG is expensive enough, doubly so in an airport (S$13 last time I was there).
The simple way would be registration via an email address, get a code for Wireless@LON for 14 days. Beyond this, SMS codes. seeing as these are captive portals, you regester to have an access code SMS'ed to any UK phone (probably work for any EU phone).
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I can't imagine how the identification would work.
There is no reliable way for the proposed amount of traffic and user profile (tourists). I expect the wifi will prompt users to agree to terms of service on first use and then track the MAC to measure the duration of their session. The terms of service screen could also issue a cookie to recognize returning users.
The truly paranoid could counter these if they had to but I wonder why they would. If someone is that paranoid then maybe they shouldn't be using a free government funded wifi service in the fir
VOIP instead of roaming (Score:3)
I hope they keep it up afterwards. It'd be nice to be able to use google voice / skype / other VOIP solutions on my smartphone instead of paying obscene international roaming charges or screwing around jailbreaking and getting local sim cards.
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I was about to say that UK is one of the countries where 3G access (assuming no Olympics/megaoverload as you did) is really dirt cheap (at least compared to, well, everything else you can buy in London) but now I see, you are "one of those". Guess what, the providers are selling locked phones BECAUSE PEOPLE BUY THEM. There is another obvious alternative: JUST BUY A FREAKING UNLOCKED PHONE.
UK also doesn't ask the SIMs to be tied to IDs or sold only to residents or any other nonsense; and many of them don't e
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My work bought it. And stop shouting at me. :)
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Do you really think this? VOIP is a lot more like email than traditional phone service. So far none of the major email companies have gone belly up.
That's the problem, it's so cheap and easy it seems like magical beans. The fact that it's accessible from anywhere (like email, not like mail, home phone, or roaming phones).
I spoke to a city Councillor about getting them to put in the wiring for public internet access while they put it in for "Major Brand" phone p
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O2 is one of the better UK providers in that respect. My iPhone was locked originally, but I went with O2 because at the time (mid-2010) they said they would unlock it properly at the end of the contract period. No jailbreaks, no risk of bricking after software updates, etc.
Now it turns out that they will unlock it even before the end of the contract (though I'm still on the hook for the monthly fee till the end, of course). Just have to ask them.
O2 are great for their signal, but their pricing does take the piss.
When you've finished your contract; maybe try Giffgaff [giffgaff.com]. There's no phone support (it all online), so they're a lot cheaper (£10/mo for unlimited data and text, and 250 mins) - and they still use the O2 network. The support you get from the community is astounding, and they do pay people back quite a lot for helping out.
They've even got a wiki [giffgaff.com] to help you unlock your phone. Definitely worth a look.
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> and they still use the O2 network
That's because... they are O2. Both companies operate from 260 Bath Road, Slough.
GiffGaff is a clever branding of O2's service that appeals to the price-conscious market and which uses the exceptional idea of in-sourcing support to the customers themselves. Very clever and apparently very successful, without cannibalising O2's preferred higher-paying customer base.
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Are you sure that your endorsement is not a result of being able to slip your referral code into the order URL? Clear your cookies and click here to order without giving kickbacks to spammers. [giffgaff.com] Mod spammer parent down.
Hey! That's not spamming to use an affiliate code. Sure; clear your cookies if you want - but you won't get anything extra or lose anything for it; so why are you so offended?
I was just providing a link to a company I've been impressed with. Whatever happened to paying it forward?
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Hey! That's not spamming to use an affiliate code.
No, fuck off and just provide the main company website link. I neither know nor care how "affiliate codes" work, but they must be doing something to your advantage. Ergo, you are a spammer.
Actually, every user on Giffgaff gets a custom affiliate link. It's nothing special or secret. They make it very public. If someone signs up through that link; they pay the affiliate a five pounds. Its so you can give it to your mates and make some easy money for passing on that it's a decent company.
It makes no difference to the person signing up. Without it - instead of the affiliate getting the cash, Giffgaff get it instead. It serves no purpose not to use that link. With referrer tracking, Giffgaff st
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True. But it's nice to be able to have one gadget not two (still need the calendar, contacts etc from the original phone - I'm usually in London for conferences or other work) and even nicer to be able to give people a number to reach you on before you're there.
T-Minus (Score:2, Interesting)
This is going to blow up (in the funny sort of way) when someone downloads CP on this network or harasses some kid on FB. It'd be even crazier if they left it entirely unsecured and someone showed up with firesheep.
Hillarity aside, this could actually drive home the point that an IP address != an identity.
Predictions of the future! (Score:5, Funny)
T minus one week: Everyone scrambles to get the network up and running.
T minus one hour: Large news event, hosted by the BBC, to throw the ceremonial comedically large switch.
T minus zero: Network is live. Cheers occur.
T plus one second: Twitchy, caffeine-addled basement dweller discovers this network will not enable him to download his 58PB of pirated anime porn every month like he thought* he would be able to.
T plus one-point-five seconds: Blog post goes up.
T plus two seconds: Echo chamber agrees, internet declares service to be utterly without merit, useless, and a direct affront to freedom because of this.
T plus five seconds: Someone discovers someone else somewhere might be looking at them while they use the wireless network, immediate accusations of government spying start, numerous ill-informed references to Nineteen Eighty-Four permeate discussion.
T plus five-point-five seconds: Blog post goes up.
T plus six seconds: Echo chamber agrees, internet declares service to be utterly without merit, useless, and a direct affront to freedom because of this.
T plus ten seconds: Cloistered, sheltered nerd sits in complete befuddlement, absolutely baffled as to why on earth anyone would have any objections to him hosting his array of torrents on this network, sucking down every last slice of bandwidth available.
T plus ten-point-five seconds: Blog post goes up.
T plus eleven seconds: Echo chamber agrees, internet declares service to be utterly without merit, useless, and a direct affront to freedom because of this.
*: By which I mean "deluded himself into believing".
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In the UK thats a given with voice http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1041011/MI5-launch-spy-sky-UK-manhunt-British-Taliban-fought-Afghanistan.html [dailymail.co.uk]
"searching for voice matches" "... monitor mobile-phone calls. More recently they have been fitted with equipment capable of picking up signals from wi-fi computer networks."
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Yeah, that's the Daily Mail though. Are there any reports from a reality-based source?
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http://www.thisisgloucestershire.co.uk/GCHQ-increase-UK-surveillance-spy-drone/story-11857893-detail/story.html [thisisglou...hire.co.uk] names the daily mail, but adds new details.
i.e. RAF Northolt.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/8857517/Met-Police-spends-millions-of-pounds-on-secret-aircraft.html [telegraph.co.uk]
and more details on COMINT at
http://www.secret-bases.co.uk/cia-rendition.htm [secret-bases.co.uk]
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So, a local newspaper that sources from the Daily Mail, a conspiracy site, another right-wing extremeist rag which appears to be using the same source as the Daily Mail too? I must admit I can't comment on the veracity of the jewishnewsdaily.com link.
Re:Predictions of the future! (Score:5, Insightful)
Shame you posted AC - and shame I haven't any mod points because this is a pretty good post and a fair reflection on the attitudes of many.
You've missed a few nuances:
The Daily Mail somehow contriving to blame "the fiasco" [ie any deviation from perfect performance] on the BBC, the EU, Muslims...
Rupert Murdoch's mates "hacking" the service (ie just exploiting human fallibility and poor security practices but glamorising it beyond belief)
The Slashdot meme of surveillance cameras everywhere - and how they'd use the bandwidth
The sanctimonious posing by Boris Johnson and cronies about how they're "investing for London" and the "Olympic legacy" -- followed by the quiet dismantling and removing of the service later.
I'm sure there are other suggestions - but your post was particularly good.
Wifi Free? (Score:3)
I read that as "Wifi Free" at first and thought the "wifi causes cancer" nutjobs had won...
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I read that as "Wifi Free" at first and thought the "wifi causes cancer" nutjobs had won...
But, but ... Wifi causes cancer! Or does it not ? ;-)
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I read that as "Wifi Free" at first and thought the "wifi causes cancer" nutjobs had won...
But, but ... Wifi causes cancer! Or does it not ? ;-)
Probably at about the same rate as breathing in and out causes cancer.
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I read that as "Wifi Free" at first and thought the "wifi causes cancer" nutjobs had won...
But, but ... Wifi causes cancer! Or does it not ? ;-)
Probably at about the same rate as breathing in and out causes cancer.
Of course, but since you don't stop breathing while using Wifi, I'd argue it raises your risk of getting cancer !
Best use (Score:3)
1 Rassbery=$25, 1 USB dongle [ebay.com]=$1.5
Use it for whatever you like.
Boroughs (Score:5, Informative)
They're "boroughs", not "districts". Jeeze.
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Re:Boroughs: not exactly (Score:2)
I'm guessing
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What is a jeeze?
and ... (Score:1)
"to allow visitors and residents to get more out of their stay ..."
And the existing providers? (Score:4, Insightful)
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I was thinking the same thing.
If any city in the US did this the carriers would be SCREAMING SOCIALISM!! ... and funding every politican and their brothers to ban and stop this assault on capitalism at all cost and probably then lobbying congress to add anti free WIFI in SOPA or something stupid.
Maybe in Europe the governments there actually listen to their citizens and not corporate lobbiests and vote only on the behalf of corporations? I was just watching the Star Wars prequel tonight and the US and Canad
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If you think the UK is free from the scourge of lobbyists, think again.
They mostly rename it "PR" here, but that PR industry is worth around £7 billion per annum, and has its tentacles deep within the body politic, no matter which party you choose.
You can be sure that someone, somewhere is getting fat on this - if not now then via promises of jobs in the future.
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I was thinking the same thing and then realized it was the UK.
If any city in the US did this the carriers would be SCREAMING SOCIALISM!! ... and funding every politican and their brothers to ban and stop this assault on freedom and capitalism at all cost while probably then lobbying congress to add anti free WIFI in SOPA or something stupid.
Maybe in Europe the governments there actually listen to their citizens and not corporate lobbiests who vote only on the behalf of corporations? I was just watching the
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I was thinking the same thing and then realized it was the UK.
If any city in the US did this the carriers would be SCREAMING SOCIALISM!! ... and funding every politican and their brothers to ban and stop this assault on freedom and capitalism at all cost
Which is odd because they are solidly conservative areas. I don't really see how a private company providing an advertising funded 'free' service counts as socialism anyway.
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Yes, just as the government drives out companies who want to charge for healthcare here. It's a good thing to keep the predators away. Most of the formerly charging wifi hotspots in coffee shops and the like have since become free anyway.
Wifi is a public good; exactly the sort of thing a council should be doing.
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People who've invested their own time, money and effort into providing (and charging for) Wifi must be just thrilled that the council have given a private operator rights to erect equipment in public spaces right next to their premises that effectively kicks their product out of the market. Is the need for public Wifi that pressing that the council are being diverted from their normal duties like, you know, sweeping the streets?
You mean you know someone who wasted money providing a paid for WiFi service that no-one wants.
Should the local Council shut down the nearest Macca's because their free WiFi interferes with his flawed business model?
Bollocks.
I see Azure and Tomizone networks occasionally here in Oz, these ones are captive portals that ask for CC details, I have never used them, it's easier and faster to head down the street and find a Macca's, Subway or cafe with open wifi.
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Any examples of charged-for wifi in that location?
All I can think of is a BT thing where they put wifi units in their public phone boxes and people who subscribe to their home broadband can also access that wifi when they're out and about.
Otherwise, cafés, hotels etc typically have free wifi. Whilst in the early days this was a way to attract custom, these days it's a basic customer expectation. You don't gain custom from having wifi, you just lose custom if they can't get a good data signal while they
Maintenance (Score:2)
Olympics (Score:2, Insightful)
"in time for the London Olympics"... which takes place in the east of London, in Stratford, far from any of these boroughs.
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"in time for the London Olympics"... which takes place in the east of London, in Stratford, far from any of these boroughs.
Most of Londons hotels and resturants are in this area and this is where tourists will spend most of their time and money when not watching the events. Local businesses in East London will see very little tourist money.
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It is where the rich will spend their time.
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Wait, you thought Olympics earnt cities money?
Hahahahahahahaha. haha. ha!
(speaking as a resident of Sydney, host of the 2000 "Best Olympics Ever", after which Sydney seems to have entered a malaise of government inactivity & decline)
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Most insightful post here!
The thing is that the people travelling to London for the Olympics won't want to stay in the hole that is stratford, so we're putting the WiFi where they actually will be.
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"in time for the London Olympics"... which takes place in the east of London, in Stratford, far from any of these boroughs.
Most tourists aren't going to be staying in Stratford, and visiting the many and varied cultural highspots of Stratford though, are they?
No such thing as free (Score:4, Insightful)
Does it Matter? (Score:2)
The only saving grace I can see for it is if it's kept running after the crowds leave and gives some nice access to the residents of the area.
It's not free (Score:2)
Unless you think the equipment to run the network, the cabling, the people to maintain it, electricity, etc cost nothing, it's not free.
In this case, it's the taxpayers of London (possibly the UK) who are footing the bill for this "free" service.
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hmmmm If the CCTV cameras are on wireless it shouldn't be too difficult to watch the feeds yourself.
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At least we don;t have to pay to be spied on.
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"London Installing Largest Government-Run Honeypot" Fixed that title for you
Don't fucking use it them, you paranoid twat.
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Good point actually. Is something wrong in a country where you can't take a leak for free but you can access the internet for free?
Methinks yes. But that's me.
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I wouldn't go in one of those automatically opening jobbies if you paid me.
Re:say what? (Score:5, Informative)
Wtf? Free wifi in a European country?! Does not compute. I was almost certain that "Free", "Insert any service here", and "" could NEVER coexist in the same sentence.... Go to London, pay eleventy pounds for parking, pay to use restroom, pay to breathe air, pay to blink eyes, pay to use sidewalk, but Wifi is now freeeee! Oh wait, only because of the Olympics.
The parking (and congestion) charges are to discourage car use. Many Londoners, including me, don't even own a car.
But there's plenty of free things to do in London -- more than any other city I've ever visited. Some great museums: the Natural History Museum, the Science Museum and the Victoria and Albert Museum (V&A) at South Kensington are free. So is the British Museum, in Holborn. The Museum of London (in the City) is free, as is the Imperial War Museum (Lambeth). That's just the biggest ones, there are at least 20 more not-insignificant free museums.
There are markets, old buildings (cathedrals etc), big art galleries, parks, palaces, the river, theatre, many small gigs are free... and that's just the normal, year-round stuff. There should be free one-off events, though it's obviously worth planning if you want to see something in particular.
Try these websites:
http://www.visitlondon.com/tag/free-attractions [visitlondon.com]
http://www.timeout.com/london/feature/1424/free-london [timeout.com]
http://www.daysoutguide.co.uk/free-london [daysoutguide.co.uk]
http://londonist.com/tags/lotclist [londonist.com]
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St Paul's Cathedral, the largest and best known and arguably most important religious building in London is definitely not free to visitors.
It costs £15 to get in! I was so shocked that I just turned around and walked away.
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St Paul's Cathedral, the largest and best known and arguably most important religious building in London is definitely not free to visitors.
It costs £15 to get in! I was so shocked that I just turned around and walked away.
Many of the free museums are funded by the state (or part-funded), either at national level or from more local taxes. Others are simple charities, or are run by universities (etc) for public education.
St Paul's Cathedral claims they don't get any state funding. I think that's OK, while the building is still used as a church, but I agree it's annoying for visitors.
I have paid to see major cathedrals in other European cities, although there are many that are free.
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The parking (and congestion) charges are to discourage car use. Many Londoners, including me, don't even own a car.
It is more or less impossible to drive to work or generally around London anyway (even if you live/work in the suburbs, certainly not if you need to get into the centre) . The cost is almost irrelevant, it's just that it's so slow you might as well walk.
The only times a car is useful in London are for big supermarket-type shopping (if there's one reasonably close and you're prepared to waste most of a weekend morning) or visiting people outside the capital.
Re:say what? (Score:4, Informative)
I'll give you the benefit of the doubt, and reply courteously.
That's great that you, you know, live in London. As in, you can afford the outrageous cost of living there,
Other than housing, most essential costs aren't much different to the rest of the country (food, fuel, transport, etc). Socialising is more expensive, but outside the centre it's not that much more.
and take what must be an exquisite pleasure to lecture the rest of us on transportation.
You'll get a better experience of London if you use the public transport, rather than try and drive everywhere. Driving in London is frustrating -- it's difficult to find parking, there's a *lot* of traffic, the streets are narrow and dense, there are many one-way restrictions. That's the way things are here.
(Would it be lecturing to advise a European against taking Amtrak and buses round the USA, if they have a limited time for their trip?)
I love how you recommend thieves' dens of stolen merchandise (you called them 'museums' I believe, an interesting bowdlerism if there ever was one) with a straight face.
So don't visit the British Museum. The other museums have completely different collections. The Museum of London, for example, has artefacts from London, often from excavations, or donations.
Surely, being a well-heeled Londoner, you must be acquainted with the idea that if something is free, then it must be worthless. Otherwise, the Great Unwashed will be all over it.
You clearly don't know this city, and I'm not sure what point you're trying to make.
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I'll give you the benefit of the doubt, and reply courteously.
Why bother? GP is either an idiot if you're being generous, or a troll if you're not.
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The GP did have a point about paying to use a restroom in London. I've seen this at railway stations in London and Paris, and was quite surprised.
Agreed. There are still some free public toilets, but a lot less than there used to be. Many have been replaced with a plastic "pod" thing, which charges 50p or something. (London isn't special here -- it's the same in much of England.)
I'm not sure what the thought is behind this. It just means more people piss in the street.
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People can fly from all over the world for two bloody weeks of "games," but G-d forbid they buy a sim or pay for connectivity. All the while, the rest of England get fuck all.
15% of England lives in London.
Any anyway, "The deal, which will run at no cost to the councils or the taxpayer" and "O2 Wifi launched in January 2011 with the ambition to roll out free, fast and open wifi, via strategic partnerships, across the UK."
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15% of England certainly doesn't live in the leafy and expensive boroughs of Westminster, Kensington and Chelsea.
Nor are the Olympics being held there.
Good luck getting your free WiFi from Stratford, or anywhere east of Shoreditch.
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According to TFA it is ad-supported, not tax-payer supported.
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who is paying for this?
According to the article O2, at no cost to the council or taxpayer.
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No reason at all other than to make slashdot a special place with its own spots of insanity.