Cisco VP To Memo Leaker: Finding You Now 'My Hobby' 312
netbuzz writes "A Cisco vice president, who happens to have been a CIA operations officer in the 1980s, believes that the employee who recently leaked an internal company memo to a blogger committed corporate treason and violated a 'family' trust. In an email sent to Cisco employees, the executive invites the anonymous leaker to come clean, concedes that's unlikely, and adds, 'so I will now make (finding) you my hobby. Ask around (and) you will find out that I like to work on my hobbies.' That email got leaked and published as well. The tempest was sparked by a series of stories in Network World examining a host of bidding and contract questions involving the California higher education system."
Jimmies Rustled (Score:5, Funny)
This is why VPs are overpaid children
Re:Jimmies Rustled (Score:5, Interesting)
So wait, the Internet Toughguy act isn't a cool grown-up thing to do?
You'd think a CIA super-spy would have some neat tracking tricks in a guaranteed-to-be-leaked memo, but a visual inspection of the code shows nada, and as for hidden Unicode characters: nope [dotnetpad.net]. It'd be interesting to get multiple copies of the memo from different places to compare, but there's nothing suspicious I can see there.
The thing about confidential information is, there's no such thing at all once you go beyond 10 people or so. More like 3-4 can, maybe, sometimes, keep a secret, but that's pushing it. 2 people knowing a thing is great, because if you didn't tell, you know who did, and 1 is the best of all. There's plenty of ways of getting the behavior you want out of people without being so vulgar as to actually tell them things. He's really got no one to blame but himself for both of the leaks. You think company loyalty exists these days? Hah! I'm sure you'd sell Cisco out in a heartbeat if you saw a profit in it, why do you think your employees, many of whom actually know what it's like to struggle, are any different? You'd think a black-ops specialist would know that, but, obviously, nope.
And the real tricky thing about threats is, you absolutely, positively, must carry them through, or your future threats will mean (less than) nothing. In fact, if you don't already have the proverbial gun to someone's head (preferably without them knowing it's there), it's best not to make the threat at all, although that does take some self-control, which I understand can be a rare commodity in upper-management, and maybe best saved for more important occasions. Although a credible threat can be absolutely terrifying, silence from someone who has a reason to hate you is a lot scarier than hollow chest-thumping. You'd think such an intimidating beast would know that, 20 years after working for the CIA. Time will tell, but I'm guessing that once again the answer will be a big fat nope.
Of course, I'm no 007, I learned all this playing a silly internet spaceships game and reading fantasy books. I imagine this spook knows what he's doing, and we're all dancing on the puppetmaster's strings.
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One is too many. Zero is the optimal number.
Re:Jimmies Rustled (Score:5, Funny)
One is too many. Zero is the optimal number.
Managers in my company have this mastered. Nobody knows anything.
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Because nobody would cut and paste into a SSL connected web mail?
Anybody who would use the company email server to discuss anything but legit business is a moron. They should be fired for incompetence.
If you really wanted to catch them you would plant a company specific service that watched the clipboard for verboten information.
Re:Jimmies Rustled (Score:5, Informative)
I think ex-cia makes Hanlon's razor improbable. They are masters at getting you to help them without you knowing it. Sometimes they let you know.
During WWII, we did similar stunts to help identify and break the Japanese codes. We would send non-coded messages from base to base and have fighter squadrons on patrol talk about things at certain bases or islands on different days as they patrolled the area. The cross talk between planes would be picked up by the japs listening and then we would listen to their coded radio messages reporting this information to find words in common with what was said. After a few strategically altered messages, we had a good idea of code words for certain islands, positions, and other things that aided in breaking the codes as well as protecting implied targets when they communicated about them. Hanlon's razor would simply suggest our fly boys were loose with details ignorant of the enemy listening. But it was much more complicated then that.
Re:Jimmies Rustled (Score:5, Insightful)
I'm amused at the CIA guy going on about "family trust" .. the CIA makes its living off people who break trust, every day. Sometimes literally the trust of family. Unless Cisco is unlike many other corporations, there's no real trust, family or other wise. If corporations want to be free to fire people, they should expect that employees will happily sell the company out if the right offer comes along. Its the flip side of the mercenary behavior corporations engage in. If they would rather have some employee loyalty, then they need to earn it. And repay the loyalty of employees with loyalty TO employees. Loyalty is expensive. Sometimes in cash money terms, but quite frequently in forgone options.
Re:Jimmies Rustled (Score:4, Insightful)
You will find that there are quite a lot of overpaid juveniles running major public companies these days. This is what happens when you promote employees for qualities other than actually doing their jobs well.
Better hobbies. (Score:2)
Fat Boy has James Bond Wet Dream (Score:5, Funny)
Film at 11.
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Yeah, like not being in the mafia. Tell me that's not what this guy sounds like. I think this is revealing of pretty well-known ideas of what the CIA thinks like.
Re:Better hobbies. (Score:5, Funny)
Based on his picture eating is a big hobby for him, and he takes it very seriously.
Re:Better hobbies. (Score:5, Insightful)
"But what I do have is a very particular set of silverware; silverware I have acquired over a very long meal. Silverware that makes me drool over people like you. If you tell me who you are now, that'll be the end of it. I will not look for you, I will not pursue you. But if you don't, I will look for you, I will find you, and I will eat you."
Dead giveaway (Score:5, Insightful)
The email is a dead giveaway that they dont have shit on the person who leaked it. If I were the person that leaked it, I would be rejoicing right now.
Re:Dead giveaway (Score:5, Insightful)
He also sent out the email to discourage any other Cisco employees from potentially engaging in leaking as well. Or, to stop the current leaker from leaking by injecting paranoia.
Had they any leads or information, this step would not have been necessary. The other employees would have been discouraged from leaking by the fact the leaker was busted, exposed, and their career ruined.
Re:Dead giveaway (Score:5, Funny)
Looks like someone is going to be on double secret probation.
The French lesson (Score:5, Insightful)
That is of course the extreme, but the "bigger than God" attitude can come through to a lesser extent to even those remote from extreme extralegal actions, which is why we get this idiot at Cisco pretending to be a gangster.
Re:Dead giveaway (Score:5, Funny)
The email is a dead giveaway that they dont have shit on the person who leaked it. If I were the person that leaked it, I would be rejoicing right now.
But you would have guessed that that would be my reaction - you would have counted on it! So I can CLEARLY not choose the wine in front of me!
Re:Dead giveaway (Score:5, Funny)
Little do you know that the Cisco VP has spent the last few years building up an immunity to iocaine powder.
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Little do you know that the Cisco VP has spent the last few years building up an immunity to iocaine powder.
I do not think "Cisco" means what...
Wait, that can't be right.
Well... (Score:2)
Unfortunately that was done by upping the BMI with jelly donuts. ;)
That would explain why he looks like a R.O.U.S.
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Unfortunately that was done by upping the BMI with jelly donuts. ;)
That would explain why he looks like a R.O.U.S.
Routers of Unusual Size? I don't think they exist....
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You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
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Cisco has unwisely been fighting a land war in Asia [forbes.com] too.
Re:Dead giveaway (Score:5, Funny)
Cisco has unwisely been fighting a land war in Asia [forbes.com] too.
That's LAN war....
Re:Dead giveaway (Score:5, Funny)
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True he might not have anything on him at the time that he sent the email, but he may have something now.
If fat face is smart he sent a slightly different email to each department to narrow down his list of suspects.
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True he might not have anything on him at the time that he sent the email, but he may have something now.
If fat face is smart he sent a slightly different email to each department to narrow down his list of suspects.
I would hope the leaker would be smart enough not to leak this email. Presumably it was leaked somewhere else since it was sent to a large number of employees.
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Hey, I saw that in Miami Vice!
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Doesn't quite fit the meme but here goes:
1. Would send out a slightly different version of the letter (misspell a word, transpose words, different punctuation, white space, etc) to each person disguised as a mass/group email.
2. Find out which version is leaked and trace back to the individual.
3. Profit!
Re:Dead giveaway (Score:5, Interesting)
1. Write software to do steps #1 and #2 automatically
2. Sell said software.
3. Profit!
I actually suggested this to my employer a decade ago when they had a similar problem with a leaked memo, and they said "thanks" but never followed up on it. I haven't gone looking, but I'll bet there's software out there that does it already.
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Or just ask a bunch of random coworkers to forward it to you, citing that you missed/deleted the original and want to make sure you have a copy. Tweak based on the variances you discover.
Re:Dead giveaway (Score:5, Funny)
>Or just ask a bunch of random coworkers to forward it to you
No no, you're not thinking devious enough. Don't ask a random employee.
Ask the coworker you like the least. Leak that one.
Deny everything.
Taa daa.
--
BMO
Corporate treason (Score:3)
Re:Corporate treason (Score:4, Interesting)
From (emp mine) http://www.cisco.com/en/US/prod/vpndevc/ps10128/ps10154/dlp_overview.html [cisco.com]
Data loss prevention (DLP) poses a serious issue for companies, as the number of incidents and the cost to businesses continues to increase. Whether it is intentionally malicious or inadvertent, data loss can diminish a company's brand, reduce shareholder value, and damage the company's goodwill and reputation.
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Ever notice that companies that do right and deal honestly have little to fear and companies that are secretive and deceptive have much to fear?
Not impressed. (Score:5, Insightful)
If this guy had really been a good CIA ops officer, he would have said nothing until he knew who the leaker was.
Re: (Score:2)
Yep,
also a totally transparent tactic to possibly lure the leaker out or scare the hell out of him, that his "Angst" sweat and actions will expose him.
@Leaker
- you are safe
- go with the rest, follow the swarm,
- shut up (no second Manning case please)
- don't ask, don't tell what your hobbies are !
Re:Not impressed. (Score:4, Funny)
@EveryCiscoEmployee
-fess up, all of you, all at once
-act nervous and sweat, he's coming for you next
-speak out, because you're not safe anyway
-do tell all your hobbies, especially the cool ones.
Too much noise in the signal is even better for hiding. And it might actually get the VP fired.
Re:Not impressed. (Score:5, Funny)
If he had been a good CIA ops, perhaps he'd still be working for the CIA.
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And he would have subtly tweaked the message for each employee to find out who leaks the new one.
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And he would have subtly tweaked the message for each employee to find out who leaks the new one.
Probably someone who doesn't read Tom Clancy?
Really? (Score:5, Funny)
I'd think his hobby would be more along the lines of "eating cake among other things."
Re:Really? (Score:5, Funny)
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It certainly is not, "Getting laid"
Assuming said leaker no longer works for Cisco... (Score:2)
What's the worst this asshat can legally do to him?
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Of course, I am not a lawyer, but I like to pretend I'm on on Slashdot.
Re:Assuming said leaker no longer works for Cisco. (Score:5, Insightful)
Given that wacky incident [channelregister.co.uk] where Cisco instigated the arrest (in Canada) of a former executive who had the temerity to testify against them in an antitrust case, I'd bet that they have some nontrivial pull, and certainly don't seem to be afraid of using it.
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I work at a fairly large company, and when hiring, we check names and personal info against a database.
No, you don't.
Re:Assuming said leaker no longer works for Cisco. (Score:4, Informative)
Which is an excellent reason to branch out into far more lucrative industries such as meth production and armed robbery.
Look I understand that certain convictions, not arrests, but actual convictions, should preclude employment in some fields but we've established a bizzaro-world society where trivial crimes become felonies. Peeing in the bushes = registered sex offender for life. WTF
Re:Assuming said leaker no longer works for Cisco. (Score:5, Insightful)
So you have a secret blacklist, that is never verified, and never open for appeal? is that even legal?
As far as not hiring people who have been arrested, do you have any idea how easy it it to be arrested? one of my friends was put in handcuffs and thrown the the back of a police car, for nothing more serious than crossing the street when it said "don't walk"
If I knew your name and address, I could have you arrested right this minute. The arrest wouldn't stick, and I would be charged with filing a false report (if they caught me) but it would still show up as arrest for your on that precious blacklist, and you would be out of a job.
How about (Score:5, Insightful)
Cisco firing and downsizing whenever they see fit? how does that fit into your dumbass view of:
"committed corporate treason and violated a 'family' trust. "?
Also, look up treason.
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Re:How about (Score:5, Insightful)
Agreed. Anyone who tries to say that a company is like a "family" is an asshat trying to get free labor out of his subordinates.
Re:How about (Score:5, Funny)
I don't think that's the kind of "family" he means. More like the sleeps-with-the-fishes kind of "family".
Threat (Score:2)
Memos (Score:4, Funny)
Quinn then underscored his point in a second less widely-distributed memo, in which he added, "I'm all out of gum." Roddy Piper did not immediately return our calls for comment.
Where's wally? (Score:3)
I doubt Mike Quinn could find his own penis.
Cisco needs to keep their VPs on shorter leashes (Score:5, Insightful)
Kind of creepy to hear of "ex" CIA officers in top Cisco positions... advertising this must do wonders for foreign (and domestic) sales...
And ah... continually beating wardrums about an issue which only *reminds* customers of cost issues with Cisco products and services is no winning proposition for Cisco either.
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Kind of creepy to hear of "ex" CIA officers in top Cisco positions... advertising this must do wonders for foreign (and domestic) sales...
And ah... continually beating wardrums about an issue which only *reminds* customers of cost issues with Cisco products and services is no winning proposition for Cisco either.
Don't worry. It's only those chinamen at Huwei who have sinister links to clandestine entities. You can Pay More with Confidence(tm) with your friends at Cisco!
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yea.. kinda would make me leery of using cisco products.
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I doubt he was that good at it. Probably he was a manager at the CIA which means he needs help to find his own ass. There are plenty of talented people in Government service but almost none of them ever make it to management.
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He's an ex-CIA guy, wow. So, he's really good at smuggling cocaine? And selling weapons to dictators?
Honestly, if I were ex-CIA, I'd try to be a little less hubristic about my ability to deal with former allies who are now being unfriendly... Have they ever had luck in that department?
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The head of Huawei use to be in the PLA...
The head of pretty much every major Chinese company was either in the PLA, still in the PLA, or related to a general in the PLA.
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"A Cisco vice president, who happens to have been a CIA operations officer in the 1980s
And now try explaining to me again please: why should we trust cisco, but not huawei?
As Martin Castillo once said: You never get out of the Company.
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A lot of people get out of the military and then get regular jobs. Kind of creepy to hear of "ex" soldiers in top corporate positions... (dramatic pause) The fact that the guy is an ex-CIA officer doesn't mean anything on its own.
I agree with you but it almost does not even matter.
Its what other people think that recommend solutions and write the checks who count...I only mentioned this because the same characterizations were lobbed during Huawei witchunts.
Are you there Barbara, it's me, a Cisco VP (Score:3)
I remembered nothing about this leaked memo, but now that someone's all angry about it, I'm going to go find out as much as possible. Thanks Cisco VP for helping me find some entertainment!
A very particular set of skills... (Score:5, Funny)
Re:A very particular set of skills... (Score:4, Funny)
yeah, but this guy is a manager at Cisco.. the skills he acquirted over his very long career involve licking his superior's ass, stuffing his face with dinner and charging to expenses, stabbing his colleagues in the back and generally not having a clue about anything other than his own ambition.
so in this case its more "I don't know who you are. I don't know what you want. if you are looking for ransom,. I have lots and lots of money but I won't give any of it away. But what I do have are a very particular set of skills; skills I have acquired over a very long career. Skills that make me a laughing stock for people like you. If you let my pride go now, that'll be the end of it. I will still look for you, I will still try to sack you. But if you don't, I will look for you, I will find you - probably behind the photocopier which is where I found my set of postit notes - and I will tell you off, so there".
Really a company-wide email? (Score:5, Funny)
...or did he send a very slightly differently punctuated/spaced email to every employee, just to see which version ended up leaked? I'm pretty sure that's what Bruce Schneier would do.
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And you wonder why the commands are so brutal...it's nearly impossible to write them.
Who does this asshole think he is? (Score:5, Insightful)
Typical corporate jackass. Trying to throw around his (considerable) weight with veiled threats. Yeah, donut boy, I'm sure the memo leaker is just quivering in his boots right about now. If you were a Cisco employee what would you be thinking right about now? I know what I'd be thinking. I'd be thinking I'm not going to work for an idiot like that. Maybe donut boy still thinks he's in the CIA. Maybe he gets off on stupid little power trips. Maybe his wife treats him like shit and the only way he can get back is to take it out on the people he works with. Maybe he's just a fucking loser.
Loyalty is not a one-way street (Score:4, Insightful)
And perhaps some day companies will learn that. http://www.inquisitr.com/283632/cisco-firing-1300-employees-2-of-global-workforce/ [inquisitr.com]
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And perhaps some day companies will learn that. http://www.inquisitr.com/283632/cisco-firing-1300-employees-2-of-global-workforce/ [inquisitr.com]
But, but... Cisco demonstrated again and again its loyalty to the employees. Want a citation? Here's one:
I want you to remember that Cisco puts the groceries on your table every two weeks, ...
What more a human being would want? (stop that subversive BS [wikipedia.org], will yea?)
</sarcasm>
Am I the only one? (Score:2)
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I was picturing him behind the keyboard [blogspot.com].
that constitutes harassment and threatening behavi (Score:4, Interesting)
both of which are generally seen as dangerous behavior by HR types, and policy manuals generally, like those in my outfit, add that such actions are subject to discipline up to and including termination.
make it your hobby, pinhead, to discover which dictionary definition of "termination" you are going to be facing.
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Re:that constitutes harassment and threatening beh (Score:5, Insightful)
I want to preface by saying that I absolutely agree that this is harassment and threatening behaviour.
However, I can say with certaintly that HR does not care one single bit. HR really couldn't care either way on most issues. They do their job. That job is to protect the company and its higher ups.
If a low level employee sent this, then yes, absolutely, they'd be terminated.
Now, when a low level employee brings these concerns to HR, they'll be informed that it is not in fact threatening, but rather a reminder of company policies regardling leaks and an assurance from the VP that he personally takes those policies very seriously. Then she'll offer some candy from the bowl on her desk and ask you if you've remembered to signup for this weekend's company picnic.
Why does he care? (Score:3)
If this is the "leaked memo": http://www.bradreese.com/blog/11-1-2012.htm [bradreese.com]
well...it says nothing of any substance, and it looks generic enough that it was sent to the entire internal sales team, so there are hundreds if not thousands of people that could have "leaked it". But surely a Cisco VP knows that you can't send something to thousands of people and not expect it to be leaked.
Certainly doesn't seem like it's enough to make a VP get all worked up about.
I don't see anything in the memo that Cisco couldn't have published on their home page.
fine, I admit it... (Score:4, Funny)
Bradley Manning's cousin ... (Score:2)
Cisco to world (Score:3)
we are ran by CIA operatives.
He should work for HP (Score:2)
He would be very busy with his hobby.
What part of the CIA did he work for... (Score:3)
In turn, this slashdot posting was also leaked ... (Score:2)
and posted on Internet.
So it's true... (Score:3)
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Re:Violation of Contract vs. Free Speech (Score:5, Informative)
If you were to expose criminal activity, either negligence or malicious you SHOULD expect protection.
Its called being a wistleblower, and its very important.
Re:American executives vs Europeans (Score:5, Insightful)
Europe puts their sociopaths in hospitals. The USA puts them in boardrooms..