Edward Snowden Still Stuck At Airport, May Be Permitted Entry Into Russia Soon 205
sl4shd0rk writes "Edward Snowden, the enlightening NSA Whistleblower, may have been granted refuge in Russia as reported by Interfax News. He has apparently been given papers (and a change of clothes) by the Russian government to allow him to soon leave the Sheremetyevo airport. The delay in exodus, cited by a Russian official, is apparently due to the 'uniqueness' of the situation being cause for thorough review of Snowden's Asylum request."
Reports are conflicting; WaPo and Reuters say Snowden's Asylum application is still in limbo, whereas other sources are claiming only minor details are blocking his exit and he may be allowed to leave as early as tomorrow. What is certain is that he's not leaving today despite early reports claiming he could.
and a change of clothes (Score:3)
They do have a hotel or something like that in there though, right?
Re:and a change of clothes (Score:5, Informative)
CNN has had a couple of corespondents try and find Snowden at the airport. There's actually a hotel has a floor that isn't considered Russian territory (having not passed through customs) that they will bus you off airport property to. There's room service, and probably laundry as well.
http://www.cnn.com/2013/07/11/world/europe/russia-snowden-goodman-transit/index.html?iref=allsearch [cnn.com]
Interesting read actually. And of course they didn't see him...
Re:and a change of clothes (Score:4, Funny)
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If he took the bus (though Russian territory) then obviously that was kept on the down low.
If an airport terminal in a country can be considered "not in a country" and that works, and a hotel can also be considered "not really in a country", why not a bus?
For that matter, the whole idea of countries is purely artificial anyway. The US isn't respecting agreed upon international law anyway. They're only not pulling him out of the airport, bus, hotel, or whatever because that would create more headaches than not taking revenge on him. And because they probably expect to get him anyway.
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And because they probably expect to get him anyway.
Or because they want him to get away. Of course they have to put on a show of trying to get him, but do they really want to? The "Snowden Affair" is quietly fading away, with all the NSA spying intact. Bringing him back to the USA for a trial would put the issue back on the front page. The government prefers that we all focus on Will and Kate's new baby instead.
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They also seem to needlessly be trying to keep the Travyon/George thing going, another thing to help distract from Federal govt spying and persecut
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If an airport terminal in a country can be considered "not in a country" and that works, and a hotel can also be considered "not really in a country", why not a bus?
Quite right. As long as he's continuously under the control of the immigration authority, he's still "in transit".
Not uncommon to bus international passengers between airplanes and customs/immigration, especially if the airport has construction going on.
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It's out?
Why didn't anyone tell me?
Why the change of clothes... (Score:2)
1. The CIA has taken everything but the clothes on his back at the airport. Too many eyes are looking for extraordinary rendition, but that doesn't mean they haven't take all of his luggage in the middle of the night.
2. The government has locked all of his assets.
He has no secrets to sell Russia, the USA wouldn't let him sit in an airport for a month if he, still, had anything of value. Do you see him on youtube? He doesn't have a computer, he doesn't have anything but the clothes on his back. I doubt he's
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Carousel (Score:5, Funny)
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There is no sanctuary
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waiting for his luggage to pop out
How many CIA operatives can fit in a suitcase anyhow?
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The slight delay is caused by the need to reroute his laptops through a Russian code breaking facility.
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I wonder how long it would take the Russians to break the NSA's best encryption?
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He's just waiting for his luggage to pop out on the carousel
Of course he is. In (post) Soviet Russia, luggage containing secret filled laptops carries you (to asylum).
Exclusivity (Score:2, Interesting)
This probably means Snowden has agreed to turn over everything he's got to Russia. That way it can be quietly assimilated at a government level and just kind of go away at the public level. That gives Russia secrets they certainly want, and saves face for America publicly.
No. (Score:2, Funny)
Snowden and Assange are going to be in a new reality show produced in Russia
Re:Exclusivity (Score:5, Insightful)
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Not DESTROYING their recently repaired relationship with the US? You know, one of their big allies, who gives them truck-loads of cash?
That might be something...
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What does Russia have to gain by throwing him out?
Someone just might suffer from the delusion that Putin would tolerate leaks of Russian documents. That males Snowden high maintenance, while his entertainment value --- and political capital ----diminishes with time.
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Russia doesn't even pretend to be pro-freedom. The US paints itself as the bad guy without any help.
It could be as simple as Snowden being a legitimate refugee from political persecution.
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This probably means Snowden has agreed to turn over everything he's got to Russia. That way it can be quietly assimilated at a government level and just kind of go away at the public level. That gives Russia secrets they certainly want, and saves face for America publicly.
And make him an actual, valid in every sense of the word, traitor (as opposed to before, where he was a traitor only if you stretch the term a bit, and even then only in a very limited technical sense).
Re:Exclusivity (Score:5, Insightful)
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Russia is playing a game with the US and is granting Snowden asylum just so they can thumb their collective nose at the US.
"We know you want to arrest Snowden and parade him around as a traitor in front of the press SO badly *BUT* guess what, we will let him stay here just so you can't get him. HAHA bitches!"
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Actually, the Russians are playing it very diplomatically. They already stated he can only stay if he stops with the comments hurting the US. Not everything another country does outside of our interests is "thumbing their nose." They definitely want that next defector with some juicy intel looking their way for an escape route.
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which if you look at the fact that Snowden (and PFC Manning) really didn't have all that much with respect to credentials, it makes sense that a world class intelligence agency most likely already has many assets with higher access than an IT guy with a GED.
Bah ... (Score:3)
Once he's out, I'm sure the CIA or someone will send in a team to black bag him in the middle of the night.
It's not like they've never done that before.
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Amazing how he became the narrative.. (Score:5, Insightful)
He is the story now. What the governement is doing in terms of spying on its own people is now largely forgotten in the news cycles.
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That's because you falsely presume that the majority of people are against what the government is doing. Most of the people rationalize it as okay and then condemn Snowden as a traitor. You need to get out of your nerd bubble to see this, though.
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its not going away no matter how much the govt and media try to get it to go away.
History tells us you're wrong. The US Government wants nothing more than for people to forget this so that they can continue raping the American public. They have had very good success with manipulating our short attention spans by getting involved in other shit that they have no business getting involved with.
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Oh really? [brennancenter.org]
Top Civil Rights Groups Join Challenge to NSA Spying
New York, NY Today, the NAACP and five other leading civil rights organizations joined the growing challenge to the Administrations illegal National Security Agency spying program.
Due you want your crow hot or cold?
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I think once you're done with it, he'll just see if there is any left.
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LOL I'm dumb. Wrong Snowden. Mod me down please.
What Happens When We Actually Catch Snowden? (Score:5, Interesting)
Where's Snoden (Score:4, Funny)
He should wear a red & white striped shirt and hat on the next interview.
Re:We still don't know much of the situation (Score:5, Insightful)
Unreported: how much contact Snowden has had personally with the Russian authorities, just like we have no idea how much contact he had with Hong Kong's.
Is he trading info for asylum?
Let me rephrase this unfounded speculation with the purpose of impugning his character:
Is Edward Snowden selling US secrets because he hates freedom?. We don't know. We're just asking the question. Next on Fox News, why don't we know if Snowden has terrorist connections? Is the mainstream media covering this up? We report, you decide.
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It's not an unfounded speculation. We know he revealed information about US spying on China to the Chinese authorities. In any case, putting himself in Russian custody and begging them for favors (asylum) while in possession of tons of classified information is not a good idea if you actually intend to keep that information secret.
Re:We still don't know much of the situation (Score:4, Informative)
Snowden has been planning this for years. Do you think he hadn't though about that possibility? The Guardian reporter was quite clear that Snowden doesn't want the information falling into the wrong hands. To that end, according to the reporter, the information he is carrying is heavily encrypted and he doesn't have the keys. He spread copies of the encrypted data and copies of the keys to trusted associates around the world. If something happens to him, then they can share their keys and reveal the information. While the Russians could break it in time, by then the information will have considerably less value.
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It's not an unfounded speculation. We know he revealed information about US spying on China to the Chinese authorities. In any case, putting himself in Russian custody and begging them for favors (asylum) while in possession of tons of classified information is not a good idea if you actually intend to keep that information secret.
Is this true? I haven't been following the case that close but if Snowden did do this then yes he is a traitor.
Re:We still don't know much of the situation (Score:5, Insightful)
That poll is bullshit. If a third of people don't know who he was, then the number was larger when the propaganda campaign started. All that this poll shows is that most people are ignorant and influenced by propaganda.
And as far as his lawyer, your claims are ridiculous. In his case he needed to hire a lawyer with connections. In Russia than means that he would likely have contacts with the FSB. If he hired someone unconnected, he would be fucked. But that does not mean that Snowden is giving information to the FSB.
All that you are doing is trying to smear Snowden by association, comparison to a spy, and by misleading polls. Your post is nothing but a smear piece. I have to wonder if your fingers felt greasy before clicking 'submit'. Looking through your comment history reads like the posts of a neo-con. You justify the Iraq invasion, you talk about how Afghanistan is better now, you discount the idea of proportionality, and you unequivocally support spying on US citizens. And that is only in the past couple of days. You are a zealot who has no connection to reality, which explains your above post.
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You are a fucking neo-con and you call my ideas from the fringe? How many wars started, people killed, and rights crushed will it take for your to realize that history has rejected your bullshit?
It is not Snowden's fault that the government created a surveillance program that violated the 4th Amendment. He bravely exposed that. And working at the CIA and NSA, if his goal was to give information to the Russians for asylum, he could have collected far more valuable information on foreign intelligence than dom
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Like Manning before him, Snowden was a pretty low level guy (you know a GED), it's unlikely that the Chinese, Russian, Israeli, British, etc, governments don't already have assets at a higher level than either of these guys.
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If he agrees to wear a muzzle and gag, they may even let him talk to his lawyer at Christmas.
Re:What happened to the real freedom fighters? (Score:5, Insightful)
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they were preemptively "liberated" because jailing them just made them into heroes.
Re:What happened to the real freedom fighters? (Score:5, Insightful)
Bradley Manning's treatment got to them. Going to jail for your beliefs is one thing. Spending a year in solitary confinement with guards refusing to let you sleep for *months* and making you strip naked at random times...before you're even *charged*, is quite another. Indepenent of Manning's guilt/innocence, his treatement before his trial was shameful.
Comment removed (Score:5, Informative)
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Spending a year in solitary confinement with guards refusing to let you sleep for *months* and making you strip naked at random times...before you're even *charged*,
Manning probably regrets making a gratuitous suicide threat, don't you think?
" Manning told a guard that if he wanted to kill himself, he could hang himself with the waistband of his underwear." -- more [aljazeera.com]
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Soldiers are, in theory, willing to die for their country. That certainly doesn't mean they purposely go run into the line of fire, and anyone who would suggest that a soldier need to do so in order to prove they're "willing to die for their country" w
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If you had the info Snowden did, you probably wouldn't even be brave enough to release it to the public, much less hand yourself right over to the government whose corruption your just exposed.
A thousand times this ^ . When you deal with the NSA the first thing they do is let you know that they'll be climbing up inside your ass before you get your clearance, and that they will continue to monitor and track you for the rest of your life "just in case" you decide to do what Snowden did.
If your ethics dictate that you'll keep an immoral secret, you have no ethics. Snowden should be lauded, not lampooned.
Re:He should just go to America and face the music (Score:5, Insightful)
What good is disappearing into a hole forever, with no further contact with the world, going to do for his cause? People will just forget about him. At least this way, he and Assange can blog and publicly comment. That's way more than Bradley Manning will ever be able to do again.
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Ghandi, Mother Theresa, etc...
You die for your principals--
As in I love this country (USA) so much, and believe what has been done is so bad, that I am willing to leak this information to world, but of course I will keep the true secrets out of anyone's hands that could harm the US and it's citizens.
I think that is the OP's point and I don't think it's "Flamebait" at all.
Re:He should just go to America and face the music (Score:5, Insightful)
You die for your principals
As the great General Patton once said, you don't win by dying for your principles.
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Jesus did.
Of course, he came back shortly thereafter.
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Jesus did. Of course, he came back shortly thereafter.
Yeah, but nobody has seen him since.
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Mother Theresa didn't die for her principles. She got old and sick and received better treatment than she ever delivered to the patients under her care. If anything, she compromised her principles in the end by seeking so much expensive treatment to ease her suffering and prolong her life.
Gandhi did die for his principles, but it made sense for him to do so because he was the leader of a movement. The movement that he built outlived him and he continued to give it power after death as a martyr. The same can
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What good is disappearing into a hole forever, with no further contact with the world, going to do for his cause?
His "cause?" As one comedian put it, he's probably just trying to get out of his engagement to his girlfriend. "No honey, I really *do* want to get married, I just have to lay low until this whole 'stolen security secrets' thing blows over..."
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Re:He should just go to America and face the music (Score:5, Interesting)
Are you talking about the guy who was charged with rape by a 'witness' who refused to sign the testimony, for which all charges were initially dropped, then reopened once he leaked the US diplomatic cables?
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No, they weren't reopened. They were, however, assigned to a prosecutor and an extradition was filed to bring him into the country for 'questioning' (like they can't send someone to question him where he is now).
Also, I might add, this happened (prosecutor assigned) 2 days after he leaked the US diplomatic cables, after having lain discarded for months. Odd how the timing of these things works out, isn't it?
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He probably would've stayed in US. However, he saw how US government was torturing Mannings, and he saw how easily US government assassinated their own citizens. I don't blame him at all for escaping. I hope he exposes our corrupt government more once he gets to the safety of Venezuela.
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Yes because Good is Dumb. Or maybe not.
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The consequences of his actions are not going to be in proportion. You agree that what he did is a good thing, then you really should agree that the most likely consequences of his actions will not be deserved.
He isn't just going to jail, he is going to get royaly fucked when he goes to prison. You aren't talking about a few years of jail here, you are talking about quite possibly being imprisoned forever. What good are you with a hero that is imprisoned? If you agree that his revealing of what the NSA is d
Re:He should just go to America and face the music (Score:5, Insightful)
Every time I hear that argument, I have to laugh. If we had any reason to believe Snowden's constitutional rights would be upheld and he'd be given what he has a right to (a fair, speedy, and public trial) I might agree with you. The problem is, Snowden exposed the government in their violations of the basic rights theoretically protected by our Constitution, and it's not as if the government is acknowledging the other rights therein outlined. That's what is at hand here.
Snowden has been in an airport terminal for several weeks precisely because he is aware that his actions have consequences. Neither you nor the US government gets to micromanage what those consequences are, no matter how much Uncle Sam wants to pretend they do.
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Manning was a member of the armed forces, and so subject to a ifferent judicial process. This is no secret.
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How about Jose Padilla? He spent nearly five years in a military prison without being charged with a crime, just because the President labeled him an "enemy combatant."
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He has an opportunity to come home and strike while the iron is hot. There's enough publicity now for him to get the very best legal representation for free. Running away at this point is silly, he needs to finish what he started or it'll all be for nothing.
Re:He should just go to America and face the music (Score:5, Insightful)
I gave him points for what he did, but they were loss by how he is just hiding across borders, because he doesn't want to face the consequences for his action.
This isn't like Martin Luther King Jr spending a few days in jail in Birmingham. The United States government has made it clear its intentions towards Snowden: They've already caused at least one major diplomatic incident involving violating the rights of a foreign head of state to try to get to him. I have every reason to believe Snowden is on the short list for getting the Anwar Al-Awlaki treatment if he goes to somewhere that the US can get a drone to, and the Bradley Manning treatment if he otherwise ends up in US hands.
I'd be on the run too.
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Please offer ANY evidence the US had ANY involvement in that incident.
Tin-foil hat on too tight? Al-awlaki was promoting terrorism, an
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By mere coincidence the countries which denied the landing were all NATO countries. Austria, where he did land, does not belong to NATO.
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Most countries in Western Europe are NATO countries, so that's just the odds.
In addition, I believe the only country that admitted to denying flyover was Portugal, while the other two have contradicted the claim.
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Al-awlaki was promoting terrorism, and associated with Al Qaeda
So if, hypothetically the government pronounces "evilviper" a terrorist associated with Al Qaeda, you'd be ok dodging drone strikes for the rest of your probably short life?
See, the problem with Al-awlaki is fundamentally that there was no trial. No defense. You and Obama even I might all be pretty convinced of his doubt, but that's beside the point. I don't care if the police catch a guy committing a crime red handed having witnessed the crim
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I'm not defending any of the US' actions. I'm just pointing out that Snowden isn't Al-awlaki, nor Manning, and it's pure paranoid psychotic ramblings to claim he'd be treated like either one.
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Re:He should just go to America and face the music (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:He should just go to America and face the music (Score:5, Insightful)
To paraphrase George C. Scott paraphrasing George S. Patton, "You don't win wars by dying for your country, you win wars by making the other poor bastard die for his."
Also, have you noticed what's happened to the prison system in the past twenty years? Not that it was a peachy keen hotel before, but, yeah, this ain't like spending 30 days in the county jail with a window, a bunkbed and a harmonica. He'd be in solitary, in conditions the U.N. considers torture, and unable to communicate his message to the rest of the world.
Jail is one thing. Torture is something else entirely.
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No, I mean "bravely" sacrificing your freedom is stupid.
Perhaps I should say, "You don't bring rule of law by going to jail for your government, you bring rule of law by making the rich and powerful bastards go to jail for their country."
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A real hero would gladly go to jail to prove his point.
What point would that prove exactly?
A politically radicalized scumbag would just run away.
No. The politically radicalized scumbag are the ones who are willing to be martyred to make a point.
Normal people value their lives and their freedom, and aren't willing to throw it away just to make a point to other people who apparently just want to throw them in prison.
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Active resistance is better than passive!?
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he doesn't want to face the consequences for his action.
When Obama faces consequences for his actions, this argument will have some merit.
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And how exactly am I supposed to put Obama in jail?
And what makes you think there's any "suddenly" about it? Every president who authorizes unconstitutional behavior deserves to go to jail. That has always been my position, will always be my position, and is the position of any decent human being.
Re:He should just go to America and face the music (Score:5, Insightful)
That makes him a traitor in my book, regardless of what he ended up finding out.
So investigative reporters who specifically try to dig up all the bad things they can about their own country are traitors. You have some seriously skewed priorities if you believe that someone trying to expose government malfeasence is the wrongdoer.
Re:He should just go to America and face the music (Score:5, Informative)
A traitor to whom? The only people he betrayed are the ones who betrayed the people by spying on them. He did nothing but expose traitors.
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A traitor to whom? The only people he betrayed are the ones who betrayed the people by spying on them. He did nothing but expose traitors.
Maybe I'm missing something, but where did he reveal anything illegal going on? Everything was authorized by the Patriot Act (section 215 and others) and FISA. And really, what is so shocking about the agencies using the powers that Congress explicitly gave them? Traitors? Seems harsh, but if you are going to throw that around, maybe toss it towards the congresscritters that created those laws and the administrations that keep signing off on it.
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I do, but, I never believed in that sort of buck passing. When someone authorizes it, that doesn't make him responsible and the minion carrying it out not responsible, it makes them BOTH responsible.
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He is doing a very good job of upholding his oath. It appears to me like he is defending "the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic," just as he swore to do.
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Snowden stated that he tried to get that position for the specific purpose of digging up whatever he could to use against his country... That makes him a traitor in my book.
Pretty sure he dug it up for his country, and against the real traitors (his employers) who are usurping the autonomy of the people of the United States.
At any rate, he undoubtedly sought the Booz Allen gig because he suspected agency wrongdoing based on his prior experiences with the NSA/CIA. I don't think you could ask for a better whistleblower than this: someone willing to get the full story, obtain and screen evidence, and responsibly disclose the matter to public attention (while giving up a $200,00
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Congratulations! You're part of the problem.
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What would the Russians hope to achieve with that? He probably didn't memorize much and all the data he has is heavily encrypted and he doesn't have, nor know, the keys. I doubt torturing him is really worth their time and the spectacle is far more valuable.