Tor Users Can Be Tracked Based On Their Mouse Movements (softpedia.com) 109
An anonymous reader writes: The way you move your mouse is unique, like fingerprints, and can be used by dark forces to track you on supposedly anonymous and secure networks like Tor, according to a Barcelona researcher. Because the Tor Project has failed to address a ten-month-old issue regarding "time measurement via JavaScript," there are a series of user fingerprinting techniques that are quite accurate at identifying users based on their mouse movements, scrolling speed, and how their browser and hardware reacts to certain JavaScript code. If a user visits a "fingerprinting" website via Tor and then via a normal browser, an attacker can have a general idea about their identity and can even pinpoint them to real IPs. The data that is usually logged in fingerprinting schemes is not 100% reliable or accurate for that matter, but it provides a starting point for future investigations.
Guess it's time to (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Guess it's time to (Score:5, Interesting)
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No script (Score:2)
and how their browser and hardware reacts to certain JavaScript code
Re:Guess it's time to (Score:5, Informative)
I would imagine trackpads are vulnerable to the exact same fingerprinting techniques.
What Cdsparrow is saying is that you use a trackpad on Tor, and use a mouse for normal browsing. Both can be fingerprinted, but they won't be the same fingerprint. When I want to arrange a major drug deal, or hire an assassin, I use a different computer (a second hand Chromebook that I bought for cash), and I connect through a public WiFi. It has a trackpad, a different browser, and a much slower CPU than my desktop.
Comment removed (Score:4, Insightful)
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I'd say the solution is to fight fire with fire.
Javascript is able to catch, and also to trigger, events like mouseclick.
So, just have a plugin that injects a random delay on mouse click, with a slider.
BOOM. Fingerprinting busted.
Re: (Score:2)
Low tech solution (Score:3)
Re:Low tech solution (Score:4, Funny)
Yes but so what? (Score:2)
So i don't understand yet why one cares about this attack. I can see edge cases but I'm not sure I see the main threat but this may be due to my ignorance about how ToR works.
Here's the issue. Suppose the user visits the following three web sites.
1. Mao Mao Mao, via tor, a site secretly run by the chinese military that fingerprints Tor User
2. Falun Gong Spy Network using tor, but not controlled by the chinese miltary
3. Communist party phone directory, not on Tor but using fingerprinting.
So clearly the
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Who cares? Perverts trying to hide from the FBI after they bust a child porn server and are trying to identify people from the logs.
And, and people who want to see the perverts burn also care.
You're right, for freedom of speech under oppressive regimes (the main purpose of Tor) it is not a big deal.
In your scenario though, you'd care a lot if #2 got busted and they had the server logs. But that is true anyways, the content needs to be in a safe country. That is the whole Tor system. So it is only people doi
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Or use the other hand, same strategy as when applying "The Stranger".
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Block scripting and don't use Tor like a proxy? Stay on domain names that end with .onion. Don't use it on "clearnet" for anything. Do not let scripting run unless you're damned sure you can trust them or you really want that access. Tor's actually still really safe so long as the user reasonably smart about practicing safe hex. Just because it blocks some things does not mean it blocks everything. The user still needs to watch out for data spillage.
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Noscript. (Score:5, Interesting)
This one of the reasons why they should have never left noscript off by default.
Re:Noscript. (Score:5, Insightful)
Your cell phone provider already has enough info to know everywhere you are at any point in time, who your friends and family are, who you call and how often. Google knows all your web habits, and what you hobbies are, and you bank knows every cent you spend, where and on what. And this info is freely bought and sold to marketing companies and other bad actors. It only takes one slip to connect a name to this data and your life is captured on record forever. We need to start preparing for a non-private reality, than try to hang onto any semblance of privacy we think we still have. Even as I type this some algorithm somewhere has already tied my writing style to all my other web aliases and is connecting me to my real identity.
Privacy is dead.
Re:Noscript. (Score:4, Interesting)
According to his user number he was born yesterday, and will continue believing that privacy is dead until he graduates from college and gets his own place to live.
Then there is some small, remote chance of discovering that where you shop was never really private, and that you want your bank to know what you spent money on, or else you'd have used cash. And that if you avoid specific behaviors, you get a lot-lot-lot less junk mail than less paranoid people.
If it is private, don't put it on the internet. If it is private, don't leave it on your porch. Don't give your phone number to a store just because you shopped there. (just say "no thank you" when they ask you for your number)
Google knows a lot about most people, but thankfully they don't sell that information. Or send junk mail. Or call your telephone. Or talk about you. Hopefully for your sake, your bank is also traditional like that.
Re:Noscript. (Score:5, Informative)
A real name as a login is a bit of a major clue for that as well.
Why do kids do that today?
Unless you are a public figure that treats stuff you write here as carefully as a press release it is a very bad move to use your real name as a login.
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Your privacy seems to be dead, yeah. That's your problem ; especially if you did it by stupidly giving away private information to random private corporations.
Just don't believe that we all share your privacy-killing way of life.
Use Tor, disable javascript by default, only use free-software, don't bring your cellphone everywhere you go (and keep it turned off most of the time), use email encryption, and don't stay logged in gmail/google when you browse the web!
But maybe, you wo
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Use Tor, disable javascript by default, only use free-software, don't bring your cellphone everywhere you go (and keep it turned off most of the time), use email encryption, and don't stay logged in gmail/google when you browse the web!
All of which may seem good advice, but then again, being invisible on the net is such an unusual thing nowadays that this in itself may attract unwelcome attention.
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Use X, disable Y, only use Z, don't bring A everywhere, use B, and don't stay C
Oh right, that's freedom right there...
But maybe, you would prefer that privacy were actually dead, because that would allow you to rationalize that you made the right choices accepting these intrusive behaviours from private corporations, now that you have become dependent on the convenience they provide..
Oh ok then. Ignore the facts, blame me instead...
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Your cell phone provider already has enough info to know everywhere you are at any point in time, who your friends and family are, who you call and how often. Google knows all your web habits, and what you hobbies are, and you bank knows every cent you spend, where and on what.
Actually, if you have an Android phone or if you use Gmail, Google knows all of this.
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Privacy is dead.
You're absolutely right, and this is why I (after others) have been railing about how we need to build a society where it doesn't matter if your information comes out rather than worrying about how to keep it private. There's no putting the cat back in the bag, and we're going to either build that society or fail miserably because the tech eliminates all other possibilities.
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It's kind of like how the last bastion for commoners is the supercompanies (and governments) holding each other back. Or kind of like living with an incurable disease, but one of symptoms you can somewhat resp
Gee Fucking Whiz (Score:1)
"time measurement via JavaScript,"
There's like a dozen betters ways to track someone using javascript.
If a tor user has javascript on, they should assume they're not anonymous.
Re: (Score:2, Interesting)
Absolutely right. I keep seeing stories about how TOR users can be tracked . . . and they always involve javascript . . . what gives? Perhaps the headline should read "javascript users can be tracked by mouse movements?"
If there was a story about people being tracked by network analysis of TOR traffic, or some other novel means, that would be news.
1. Use the Tor Browser Bundle to access .onion sites
2. Check that noscript is set to block all javascript in the Tor Browser. (it might not default to block all)
3
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That's really the crux of the issue.
Frankly, TFS sounds like an anonymous reader's pet bug hasn't gotten the attention he feels it deserves, so he submitted it to Slashdot to make it a bigger deal. Ultimately, though, it boils down to user error.
Fixing an information leak is effectively making a blacklist for particular attack vectors. It's never going to be complete. The only way to actually ensure that an anonymizing method works is for the user to ensure that he's behaving anonymously. If that means usin
Re:Gee Fucking Whiz (Score:5, Interesting)
Yeah but if you're not on Tor, you're not doing anything illegal and you're not worried about tracking of that sort because normally of course the remote server knows your IP and everything, and there are a zillion potential logs or whatever in the middle.
If you're on Tor for free speech, of course you don't care because you're not there for privacy; you're there to disguise your activities from local observation of the network. You already have to trust the remote server not to tattle to your government in that case.
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If you're on Tor for free speech, of course you don't care because you're not there for privacy; you're there to disguise your activities from local observation of the network. You already have to trust the remote server not to tattle to your government in that case.
This comment makes no sense. Of course you want privacy for free speech if you're using TOR, and the whole point of TOR is to prevent the server or anybody else from identifying you.
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... the whole point of TOR is to prevent the server or anybody else from identifying you.
Nope, complete fail. You can just google tor and find out what it is, who funded it, what it is for, all that stuff. You don't have to just go with whatever somebody told you in a chat room.
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The "complete fail" is on your part. First you misunderstand TOR, then you come back with conspiracy theories. You're all over the map.
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It is a US government-funded thing, sorry. That was the whole point; people who wish they had our laws, can get on Tor and their network experience happens as if they live here. So that they can engage in free speech for political and creative purposes that are banned in their countries.
It was not invented to hide from the US Gubermint. It was invented for people who wish they had our Freedoms, and all it does is hide their activities from their ISP and State-sponsored firewall. It is up to them to hide the
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The server would be using for these speech activities would generally be located in some western country in the offices of some ex-pat group from their country, except for where they're just using it to access mainstream international news.
But the whole point of TOR is that the server doesn't know who the real TOR user is. So your original statement "You already have to trust the remote server not to tattle to your government in that case." doesn't make any sense.
There is no conspiracy theory involved. This is all stuff you would find out if you went and looked it up .
I didn't need to look it up because I already knew the origins of TOR. What you don't understand is that while it may have come out of the US government, it's a neutral protocol.
As for the technical details of where the logs are expected to be and where not, you didn't actually say anything other than "hurr durr ur wrong."
Then follow your own advice and look it up. This is basic info. But here, let me spoon feed you: https://w [torproject.org]
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No no no, you have to go read technical documents first, since you don't understand the subject in detail already. Then, after having done that, you'll know which servers to expect to have which information.
Where you say "the server doesn't know," you didn't even just reference a specific server. Lets put this in logical terms:
Some servers know who Tor users are. Some servers do not know who Tor users are. Therefore, "the server" doesn't know who the Tor user is. T/F
Yes, you really do need to look things up
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Holy shit, dude, just admit you don't know what the fuck you are talking about. You've got the fog machine on full blast. You made a mistake, you were corrected, deal with it.
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There's like a dozen betters ways to track someone using javascript.
It depends if you're tracking them as they browse, or by analyzing the logs afterwards.
...a starting point for future investigations... (Score:2)
I don't see it. (Score:2)
Re:I don't see it. (Score:4, Insightful)
They don't have to. They just have to parade some "experts" in front of a jury and say they're pretty sure they matched your mouse movement to a pedo. Sort of like how the FBI handles hair analysis. If the government wants you gone, this is just another tool in the toolbox.
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If the government wants you gone they just use the IRS (or whatever the local variant is called where you live).
That's how they took down Al Capone.
Looking at it the wrong way (Score:2)
Others such as the scientologists have taken care of that angle as well as the law enforcement angle.
Paranoia Will Distrory Ya... (Score:2)
You know, there are LOTS of little things that are particular to a particular person that can ID you if tracked. You can be tracked by your farts is the peroper telemitry is in place. Mouse movments? I choose not to be that paranoid.
NoScript? (Score:1)
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Freenet is a bit more paranoid than that. They don't even let the JS tags hit the browser.
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The Tor Browser has four "security levels". At the default (low) level, NoScript is set to "allow scripts globally". Now you know.
Possible solutions (Score:3)
- Change hands every so often
- Manually alter your mouse's tracking and acceleration settings to different values before starting Tor
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- Change hands every so often
I do, but I find it too difficult to use the mouse while I'm using my right had.
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Foot-control of the mouse maybe? Oh! Never mind, it will be a sticky mouse!
Poor results (Score:2)
Ubercookie did a poor job as reconnecting my identities when surfing in normal and private modes. Only two numbers in clientRect match, everything else is different.
Jitter Plugin (Score:2)
Well, I guess it's time to write a jitter plugin for Chrome. It's going to make using the browser with jitter enabled sort of like trying to perform a delicate operation after five or six beers, but without the false confidence, or everything's-funny, added benefits of beer...
The one guy using Tor with Parkinson's is going to have a lot of problems pretty soon.
Just Leave A 2nd Mouse Plugged In. (Score:2)
nonsense (Score:2)
There are no silver bullets (Score:2)
I don't know who's dumb enough to be surprised that any technology can singularly solve a problem as large as privacy.
Tor solves the network connection problem, moderately well. There's more to privacy than that, and it's ridiculous to expect Tor to solve that all by itself.
Big surprise! If you use tor to log into facebook, facebook knows who you are! Where's the outrage?!?!
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If you ... log into facebook, facebook knows who you are! Where's the outrage?!?!
Actually, I hear people belly-aching about that all the time!
Yeah, not so much (Score:2)
When in the office, did I ride my bike to work or drive? Cafeteria o
Okay (Score:2)
Okay, now that's just creepy and more than a little unsettling.
use mouse with other hand (Score:2)
just sayin'...
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I imagine I would be identified by... (Score:2)
I imagine I would be identified by my hardly using the mouse. I tend to use the keyboard unless I have to use the pointer. In addition, if I had a touchscreen, I would be using that where possible. But the basic fix in the browser is something like we see with Android, but on a per-site basis: if your javascript wants access to timing information, it needs explicit permission.
Hasn't been addressed? (Score:1)
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APK is that you?
By the way you keep cross posting this, one would think that MS has patented the HOSTS file or something.