Silicon Valley Tech Workforce Is Vastly Different From US, Say Feds (computerworld.com) 222
Reader dcblogs shares an article on Computer World: In recent years, major high-tech firms have started releasing workforce diversity data, along with a promise to improve. And there is much room for improvement, according to federal officials. Among the top 75 Silicon Valley tech firms, whites make up 47% of the workforce, Asian Americans 41%, Hispanics, 6% and African Americans 3%, according to an analysis by the U.S. Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC). Women account for 30% of the workforce at these 75 firms. The diversity makeup of these Silicon Valley high-tech firms is very different from the national employment picture. When compared to overall private industry employment, the tech sector nationally -- not just Silicon Valley -- employed a larger share of whites (63% to 68%), as well as a larger share of Asian Americans (6% to 14%) and a smaller share of African Americans (14% to 7%) and Hispanics (14% to 8%). Employers with a workforce greater than 100 file reports to the EEOC about their employees' race, color, gender and national origin. Nationally, 64% of the employees in high-tech are men versus 52% in the broader workforce. Women account for 36% of the tech workforce, versus comprising 48% of the broader workforce.
Desi Indians? (Score:5, Insightful)
So, my takeaway from this is that Indians (i.e. from the subcontinent, not the reservation) self-report as white.
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Yeah, that was my first question. Are they lumped in under asian or white or both?
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The study itself said "Asian American." People who came here directly from India and are not citizens have NO "American" in them, so they can't fall under that group. They would be just plain "Asian." Funny how I didn't see that category in the study.
Re:Desi Indians? (Score:4, Informative)
Obviously Asian (Score:2)
How is this confusing? It said Asian American not Chinese American. India is part of Asia.
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How is this confusing? It said Asian American not Chinese American. India is part of Asia.
Because Indians are culturally and genetically closer to Europe than East Asia. Do you consider Jews to be Asians, since Judea was in Asia?
Nearly all race data in America, is based on how people self-identify, and many Indians (and Paks) self-identify as "white" when given a binary choice.
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at the end of the day there's a continent called Asia, if your ethnic background is from there then you're Asian.
By the logic of literalism, Azerbaijanis are "Caucasian" since the Caucasus mountains cut through Azerbaijan, while English people are not. People in the southern suburbs of Istanbul and the people in the northern suburbs speak the same language, worship the same God, have identical cultures, and are genetically indistinguishable. Nobody would consider them separate races or ethnicities just because they are on different continents. And only Frosty the Snowman is literally "white".
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It isn't literalism (is that even a word?). At the end of the day,this is a function of special interest groups...
Interest groups that want to be "counted" pressure the government to not allow self identification and press for definitions that give them the most advantages. For example, if you are "pink" and by criteria "A" you are 3% of the population, but by criteria "B" you are 5% of the population, and the government is setting aside minority contracts (or affirmative action quotas) based on this numb
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You clearly have not met people who are albino.
Albinos are not white. They are pink.
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Huh. Seems like it's both white and Asian:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wik... [wikipedia.org]
Re:Desi Indians? (Score:4, Insightful)
These figures have never matched with my experience in software, unless they're talking about all the non-tech people at tech companies. In 10 years in Silly Valley and Seattle, across 5 companies, the usual mix is about 40% Indian, 35% Asian (mostly Chinese), 20% White, 5% I don't know.
People born in America are around 2%. Yup 2% - I've been the only one on the team of 50-100 born in the US, with the exception of just one company. When I see a white engineer, I automatically assume they're either Canadian or Russian/Ukrainian. All this talk about "diversity" and whatnot in the US schools has always seemed entirely irrelevant to West Coast software development jobs.
Maybe it's different outside of software?
Re:Desi Indians? (Score:4, Interesting)
Welcome to the meritocracy, where people who will work for less have more merit.
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That's the free market economy plain and simple. If two companies are selling comparable hamburgers, and one is selling for $3 and the other one is selling for $5, I'm going to buy the $3 one. If two programmers have comparable skill, and one will work for $60,000 a year, while the other one is asking for $80,000 a year, then I'm going to hire the guy who will work for $60,000. Even if skill levels aren't equal, if you're have $1,000,000 to spend on salaries, are you going to hire 16 of the $60,000 guys,
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Except that it's not a free market economy.
Indians pay no Federal Income Tax (read my lips). Oh yeah, it's deducted from their pay, but they get it all back when they file.
Indians are willing to live 4+ in a two-bedroom apartment; are you willing to compete with them on that?
Ever been to Mumbai, India? Like pooping in the street? That's what Americans are competing against.
Oh, your hamburger example is stupid too, plain and simple. All of the "chain" resta
Re:Desi Indians? (Score:5, Insightful)
Indians are willing to live 4+ in a two-bedroom apartment; are you willing to compete with them on that?
I am white, and born in America. For my first 8 years in Silicon Valley, I lived in my office (and saved a ton of money doing so). I have never had any problem competing with Indians, or Chinese or anyone else. Here is my secret: Be worth what you are paid. You can do that by focusing on getting-shit-done instead of whining about how the world is oppressing highly educated American born white males.
Re:Desi Indians? (Score:4, Informative)
that's crap.
you can't show the world what you can do if you never get HIRED.
dumb ass.
we are complaining about the lock-out. its one thing to get underpaid. its quite another to be denied work, time after time, because you are perceived as 'too expensive, we wont insult you with our offer'.
you may be lucky. I may be unlucky, but I know a lot of people like me who have also gone long periods of time without work. its not about ability and you can't compete if you are not given the job.
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you can't show the world what you can do if you never get HIRED.
The tech unemployment rate in Silicon Valley is 3%, just as low as at the height of the dot-com boom. I get unsolicited job offers several times a month. If you can't get hired in today's job market, the problem is with you.
you are perceived as 'too expensive, we wont insult you with our offer
Then put a "salary expectation" on your resume. That lets prospective employers know exactly what you are willing to accept. I see that on about 10% of the resumes that I read, especially with non-traditional candidates, that may be self-taught or have an unusual employment history.
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Indians pay no Federal Income Tax (read my lips). Oh yeah, it's deducted from their pay, but they get it all back when they file
Indians are in fact [irs.gov] required to pay Federal Taxes, they are not required to pay into social security (SSID)because they can not get it when they retire. Their work visas simply expire since they no longer hold a job and return to India or apply for permanent residency.
Clearly you have not since they don't live like that and haven't for a long time. Do you really think companies are hiring some homeless indian with an OLPC laptop hooked up to a car battery living in th
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Bite your tongue.
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"You really don't want to be paying guys $120,000 a year and then have them sit around browsing slashdot all day because you ran out of work for them to do."
The old beancounting mentality...
It is not costs what drive business, is net revenue!
I of course would very happily pay those guys $120.000 a year for them to sit around browsing slashdot for most of the time if the little time they do not, they bring me some hundred millions in revenue. Of course vastly over the other option, have a lot of $60.000 tha
Re: Desi Indians? (Score:2)
Why work for some fool and build their dream? Work for yourself. Especially in software, if you are a programmer there is no excuse nowadays for not being able to make money. I have made companies with little or no investment. Sitting around waiting for someone to call you up and say "hey I am so glad u are alive, here's a job because you deserve it" is not a good idea. While yeah that happens I am sure it's rare. Make your own company, run your own business quit expecting other people to pay you because th
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"Why work for some fool and build their dream? Work for yourself."
Enterprises are (supposedly) a team affair. Yes: despite of what you thing, good teams can achieve more than the mere sum of their parts.
And then again, there *are* ways to team up so you are still working for yourself but, of course, things like cooperative societies sound like "evil comunism" in USA, so they won't happen so, OK, just work for yourself.
"I have made companies with little or no investment."
And you are still wasting your time
Re: Desi Indians? (Score:2, Insightful)
Same thing with the spelling bee I don't know why they allow so many Indian kids do so well in it. The prize money of $40,000 cash is so low that only Indian kids want it. They need to make the prize money higher so that American citizen kids would want to compete:/study for it too.
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Welcome to the meritocracy, where people who will work for less have more merit.
They don't work for less. These are among the best paying companies for software in the various published surveys. Not the very top (that's companies like WalMart that pay a premium to overcome who they are), but up there. This isn't a "they turk our jurbs" story - at each of the 5 I've been at, we interview everyone we can find, and pay enough to "almost never lose a candidate on pay" (excepting some fresh-out-of-college hires, where it's more common to lose to Google on pay).
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Then the only other possibility is that they do a better job.
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In Silicon Valley, I could almost believe that. However, in my personal experience ALL H1B's have been underpaid. The Indian ones were all no-talent scabs. The non-Indian ones were all exceptionally talented while being underpaid.
Some places don't even bother to hide their abuse of the system.
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Well that's what I originally thought, but then the other guy said H1Bs make the same money.
I don't know.
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H1Bs make a bit less, usually works out to the cost of the corporate lawyers processing their greencards apps and whatnot. All the salaries are public, if you know where to look.
But again, most have been here long enough to not be H1-Bs. A green card comes in just 2-3 years these days if you have a masters degree, which most do.
Re: Desi Indians? (Score:5, Insightful)
You don't understand. Diversity doesn't mean Indians or Asians. It means more African Americans, women, and transgendered people, regardless of what portion they already make up.
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You don't count either, you're just an oppressor.
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It means more African Americans, women, and transgendered people, regardless of what portion they already make up.
Go work for government IT. Problem solved.
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And on every college campus they get lumped in with the Diversity department.
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Maybe, but more importantly, it's different outside of the West Coast. Where I am in the southeast, Asian tech workers are much less common and almost everybody is a natural-born citizen. At my previous job there were more black programmers than Asian ones (which isn't saying much: it was the difference between "a few" and "maybe one?"). The breakdown among tech workers was probably something like 90% white male, 5% female of any race, 3% black, 2% Asian. At my curre
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While I'm at it, I should also mention that we in the Southeast are much more diverse in one way Silly Valley is not: by age. Lots of my coworkers have been in their 40s and 50s (probably a few in their 60s too) and, as far as I can tell, they aren't discriminated against. I'd say at least half of the software developers I've worked with in my career so far have been over 40.
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In most places in the US, there are two major kinds of tech companies: Those that go heavy on contractors and H1Bs, and those that do not. The ones full of contractors are exactly as you say. The others are 90% white. Movement between those kinds of companies is uncommon.
With female developers, it's also pretty similar, but with smaller ratios: There's places where the only women are recruiters and HR, and others where it's rare to find a team without a woman that programs. In this case, it's all about netw
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I've never worked for a company that went heavy on contractors.
None of the big 5 are contractor-heavy (unless you're talking about "IT", not software). None of the big 5 is 90% white. None of the second tier is 90% white, AFAIK.
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pretty much the same experience, here.
I'm white, born in the US and lived in the bay area for about 25 yrs.
I work in software (when I do have a job..) and over the last 10 years or so, I'd say the ratios are more like 80-90% indian, 5-10% asian and everyone else fits into the remainder. the last 2 interviews I had, everyone I spoke to on my itinerary list was indian.
diversity. it means nothing; its just a word that somehow gets dragged out and some numbers are faked to show the right results and managers
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Clearly you missed them. Those two groups of people are on opposite sides of a very big continent. Each differ widely from each other and among themselves. They clearly represent distinct groups both genetically and culturally. This can demonstrated this with both genetics and linguistics.
Other "Asians" include Russians, Arabs, and Eskimos.
Likely a Number of Causes (Score:5, Insightful)
I do not find the racial and sex mixture for Silicone Valley to be odd considering the following factors. I am not saying these are good things, but they are the big influences IMO:
1) Privilege and Opportunity - It has been my experience that many of these people either grew up in a solidly middle class or upper middle class environment. A good education was available for them from birth, right through to university. This education makes a big difference.
2) Birds of a Feather Flock Together - People often associate themselves with others who are like-minded, and similar in a number of characteristics. This could even include race.
3) Females & Sciences - Women in general are under-represented in the sciences, especially within IT. IT has built itself a nice little sausagefest.
Having noted all of the above, SV is getting more diverse now by giving the high paying jobs to people with H1B Visas. I am not so sure this is a good thing. It would be awesome if the USA can get more opportunities for its current population.
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Yep, the causes are quite well understood now. Rather than more articles like this that simply state the problem and enrage Slashdot commentators, it would be nice to have more coverage of the solutions in action. We are at the stage where we can compare how well they work and if there are unintended consequences.
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3) Females & Sciences - Women in general are under-represented in the sciences, especially within IT. IT has built itself a nice little sausagefest.
Um, yeah...seems this problem has been going on for decades and not by choice. I would have loved to have more girls hanging around us nerds but alas, they were busy with the jocks. Am I now supposed to feel sorry for them being under represented in IT? No one felt sorry for the under representation of nerds with dates at the prom.
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I do not find the racial and sex mixture for Silicone Valley to be odd considering
Silicone valley is the one near LA [wikipedia.org], right? Also, I don't find the mix of sex there surprising at all!
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What about age diversity? How does the SV employee population compare to the general workforce and society at large? What about ideological diversity? How does the distribution of Republican/Democrat/Independent in SV compre to the general workforce and society at large? Religious diversity?
Great points AC. I am only a sample on one, which can be dangerous but I notice the following:
Age Diversity - It may as well be the sixties in SV. The mantra could be "do not trust anyone over 30". If you are 50, good luck getting a job.
Ideological Diversity / Republicans / Democrats - A lot of Libertarians, and Democrats.
Religious - What religion? Most seem to be atheist or agnostic.
SV is not a very diverse place in my opinion.
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Religion certainly is. Clearly you're ignorant of the law. Or perhaps you just think that you get to abuse certain "undesirables" because they aren't fashionable right now?
Conspiracy (Score:5, Insightful)
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Why is this being pushed as news? Possibly because of the current dust-up between conservatives (Fox News) and Facebook, accusing Facebook of bias in editorial decisions affecting the "trending now" section; there's talk of overwhelmingly liberal workforce in silicon valley, and anything that supports the idea that silicon valley is not representative of the rest of the country would help buoy that complaint. Or maybe for completely unrelated reasons, I dunno.
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I only work 10 hours a day and mortgages are usually cheaper than renting.
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Who the fuck would throw money down an infinite hole and get nothing to their name for it if they could throw LESS money down a fite (if large) hole and eventually own a house for the trouble?
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typo: "fite" should be "finite"
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For those where (rents mortgage interest + property tax) for an equivalent house (after tax deductions are taken into account). It's not a very common situation but it happens. Especially so in places like San Francisco who managed to snag a rent-controlled place.
That's assuming you don't expect housing prices to inflate faster than the average long-term CD as well. Again, not a common situation but it happens.
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*rent is less than (mortgage interest + property tax)
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Houses in my neighborhood tend to rent for about $500 more than my mortgage + property tax + home owner's insurance + escrow fees
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You're forgetting about rent control.
This makes owning property less lucrative or impractical in a place like Silicon Valley, Canada, or Western Europe.
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Every once in a while I tell my sons they need to stop paying someone and extra $300-$500 a month for the privileged of paying his mortgage and taxes and just buy a house.
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That's great advice assuming you live some kind of backward place where what you say about rents and mortgages is true. Where I live it's far from it; I'd basically have to put 50% down on a house before the interest alone on the mortgage would be less than my rent.
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Think of it like this if I own a property I have to charge you more than I'm paying in taxes, insurance, and any debt otherwise I'm loosing money which means the value of what you are renting is much less than homes you are looking to purchase. In order to get a real idea of what I'm talking about you need to find a house in the same neighborhood with close to the same value and see what it's renting for. You can't compare a $200k house to 1 out 10 apartments in a $1m apartment complex because they are wort
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These people being snooty about places with affordable real estate are gleefully sabotaging their financial future for the privilege of looking down on the rest of us. They would rather live the European lifestyle than have some hope of getting out of the rat race ever.
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They're not he's comparing a 900sq ft apartment in a complex with a gym and a swimming pool to a 2000sq ft home with a 2 car garage and a swimming pool. Which in that case yes he would be right the apartment is way cheaper.
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I live in the US where first time home buyers have all kinds of special programs to help them out like no down payment mortgage loans. Although you do have to have decent credit.
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> people need capital to buy a house dumbshit
That hasn't really been true since the 80s. Mortgage criteria continue to be very loose. If you can't manage the "capital" to buy a house then you have ZERO margin and the least little hiccup will send you into bankruptcy.
Understandable if you're a ditch digger, otherwise not so much...
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Business pursues diversity because by spreading the net wider and attracting a wider range of applicants (e.g. with more flexible hours, advertise widely rather than just via existing contacts and networks) means a better chance of getting the right person for the job.
I don't buy your implication that white people are more easily exploited. In every other area middle class white people are the first to get out of exploitive industries, especially when they start importing labour.
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This election cycle has made me less and less worried about being insulted by "progressives". It seems like you're not doing things right unless you're being insulted or boycotted by one set of wingnuts or the other.
Parental education is a large factor (Score:5, Insightful)
If you look only at 2nd-generation-or-more Americans (those whose parents were born and raised in America), parental education probably accounts for most of the difference for Whites, African-Americans, and Hispanics.
High-tech is typically skewed towards the highly-trained, which is correlated with parents who value education.
Among those whose parents aren't immigrants, having parents who value education is correlated to having educated parents. Having educated parents is also correlated to growing up in a middle-class-or-higher household.
Thanks to American's sad history of racial discrimination, having educated parents is also highly correlated to being non-Hispanic white and negatively correlated with being anything else, at least with respect to people whose parents were raised in the United States.
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So it has nothing to do with personal responsibility of either the worker or the parent, it's "all society's fault". What a load of horse shit. There are blacks that have been in the middle class for generations. They manage to thrive despite the Vonnegut style handicaps. Why don't others.
Perhaps they don't see themselves as victims and don't listen to others trying to preach that sad sermon.
Worst thing you can do to a man is call him victim. It's worse than calling him nigger.
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Thanks to American's sad history of racial discrimination, having educated parents is also highly correlated to being non-Hispanic white and negatively correlated with being anything else, at least with respect to people whose parents were raised in the United States.
The rest of the free, non-racial discriminating world is more than welcome to hire anyone other than a white American and out perform Silicone Valley. Now where exactly in the world would this non-racial, non-cultural biased utopia be?
Need more Asians (Score:4, Informative)
Needs more data to assess (Score:3)
Or bring up the diversity numbers through staff brought in from the necessary demographics via H1-Bs, of course.
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What about qualified applicants for these jobs? (Score:5, Insightful)
Articles such as this suggest a lot of things in a very hypocritical manner, or are at least exceedingly one-sided in scope. The author is jumping to conclusions without having any data to back it up.
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To be fair, the employer was the subcontractor of a contractor, and Tesla is committing [teslamotors.com] to setting this straight.
Bay Area demographics are worth considering. (Score:2)
Women are definitely underrepresented. But if the article's numbers are accurate; 47% white with the remainder consisting of minorities is within a reasonable margin to the demographics of the community.
http://www.bayareacensus.ca.go... [ca.gov]
As of the 2010 census, whites make up 52.5% of the Bay Area's population, with the remainder again consisting of various minorities. A 5.5% discrepancy is not unreasonable, and quite possibly within the combined margin of error of the census and the study. Asians appear to
Generally this could be true of any isolated look. (Score:2)
Race doesn't matter... (Score:3, Insightful)
...culture does.
Until people start rejecting thug culture, or barrio culture, and start embracing "white" or "asian" culture, with proper english, a commitment to academics, and a disavowal of violence and misogyny, they're not going to get into the well paying tech jobs.
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Not all latinos embrace barrio culture. Not all whites embrace "white" or "asian" culture (aka, rapping wiggers).
That all being said...
Second generation asians generally speak perfect english, and are whipped into doing so by cultural drivers that emphasize academic excellence.
Second generation hispanics often don't speak proper english, and are given a pass by cultural drivers that emphasize community, family and tradition.
The difference isn't the racial background, it's the culture. If you swapped babie
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So, your assertion is that proper english, or education, or a professional attitude should be avoided because it might, in incredible rare circumstances, make you more likely to commit suicide?
People should give up thug culture, and barrio culture, and the other victimhood cultures because they lead to poor outcomes even more often than the alternative. For every rare suicide you could point out for a white male, there are hundreds of welfare thugs with kids with no father.
If you want the high paying tech
Affirmative Action needed for Asians (Score:3)
Americans of Asian descent were very badly treated in the past. For a good example, read Robert Louis Stevenson's "Across the Plains", published in 1892.
"Despised Races
Of all stupid ill-feelings, the sentiment of my fellow Caucasians towards our companions in the Chinese car was the most stupid and the worst. They seemed never to have looked at them, listened to them, or thought of them, but hated them a priori. The Mongols were their enemies in that cruel and treacherous battle-field of money. They could work better and cheaper in half a hundred industries, and hence there was no calumny too idle for the Caucasians to repeat, and even to believe. They declared them hideous vermin, and affected a kind of choking in the throat when they beheld them. Now, as a matter of fact, the young Chinese man is so like a large class of European women, that on raising my head and suddenly catching sight of one at a considerable distance, I have for an instant been deceived by the resemblance. I do not say it is the most attractive class of our women, but for all that many a manâ(TM)s wife is less pleasantly favoured. Again, my emigrants declared that the Chinese were dirty. I cannot say they were clean, for that was impossible upon the journey; but in their efforts after cleanliness they put the rest of us to shame. We all pigged and stewed in one infamy, wet our hands and faces for half a minute daily on the platform, and were unashamed. But the Chinese never lost an opportunity, and you would see them washing their feetâ"an act not dreamed of among ourselvesâ"and going as far as decency permitted to wash their whole bodies. I may remark by the way that the dirtier people are in their persons the more delicate is their sense of modesty. A clean man strips in a crowded boathouse; but he who is unwashed slinks in and out of bed without uncovering an inch of skin. Lastly, these very foul and malodorous Caucasians entertained the surprising illusion that it was the Chinese waggon, and that alone, which stank. I have said already that it was the exceptions and notably the freshest of the three.
These judgments are typical of the feeling in all Western America. The Chinese are considered stupid, because they are imperfectly acquainted with English. They are held to be base, because their dexterity and frugality enable them to underbid the lazy, luxurious Caucasian. They are said to be thieves; I am sure they have no monopoly of that. They are called cruel; the Anglo-Saxon and the cheerful Irishman may each reflect before he bears the accusation. I am told, again, that they are of the race of river pirates, and belong to the most despised and dangerous class in the Celestial Empire. But if this be so, what remarkable pirates have we here! and what must be the virtues, the industry, the education, and the intelligence of their superiors at home!
Awhile ago it was the Irish, now it is the Chinese that must go. Such is the cry. It seems, after all, that no country is bound to submit to immigration any more than to invasion; each is war to the knife, and resistance to either but legitimate defence. Yet we may regret the free tradition of the republic, which loved to depict herself with open arms, welcoming all unfortunates. And certainly, as a man who believes that he loves freedom, I may be excused some bitterness when I find her sacred name misused in the contention. It was but the other day that I heard a vulgar fellow in the Sand-lot, the popular tribune of San Francisco, roaring for arms and butchery. âoeAt the call of Abraham Lincoln,â said the orator, âoeye rose in the name of freedom to set free the negroes; can ye not rise and liberate yourselves from a few dirty Mongolians?â
For my own part, I could not look but with wonder and respect on the Chinese. Their forefathers watched the stars before mine had begun to keep pigs. Gun-powder and printing, which the other day we imitated, and a school of manners which we never had the delicacy so m
So many Percentages! (Score:2)
That many percentages raises alerts in my B.S.ometer
Percentages are a great way to hide data, and the truth.
Say there are a small handful of really large companies that have discriminatory hiring practices. While many of the others are more on par with the rest of the population. To say Silicon Valley Culture is out of step due to a few big bad Apples really messes things up.
What is the variance across companies. How are these distributed across all the companies? You know real analysis not just percenta
Simpson's Paradox (Score:3)
Women is tech is actually more like 10% (Score:2)
Just because someone works at a tech company doesn't mean they are doing tech related work. It's very contradictory that the media keeps pointing out how few women there are and making a fuss about it but then applauding the companies for trying to be more inclusive but ignoring the fact that the EEOC reports show that all the "women in tech" are actually "women in HR, middle management, and labor." The reports show that only 10-15% women are actually in any sort of tech related role at these companies.
I do
H-1B (Score:2)
This would change drastically id the US ever decided to enforce the letter of the H-1B law. As things are, they get no oversight and very little press, something Big Tech (fill in the names) have lobbied hard to maintain. Money talks.
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I really doubt that.
We think because we can code we are that much smarter then those who cannot.
However a bunch of us started to Code when we were just kids... So really how smart must the average tech person has to be if they can do kids stuff.
Sure Silicon Valley workers may be above average... However that will hold true for any other professional field.
While full time jobs in other industries may have below average.
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Moreover, who decided that "diversity" was a good thing in the private sector? It's one thing not to discriminate against ethnicity/gender/religion/etc, it's something else entirely to actively try to hire a more diverse workforce.
Besides, it's ludicrous to think that you have the monopoly on what "diversity" means. Do you look down on people with a corporate background in your hiring process for your startup? Do you make sure there's not an astrological sign that's underrepresented in your workforce? Do yo
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Furthermore, wouldn't it be considered discriminatory to hire a person to simply to fulfill a certain demographic quota, when there may be another, better-qualified individual applying for the same position at the same pay?
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It's not minorities. That's too broad a term. Clearly there are many minorities that are present or even overrepresented in silicon valley. Minorities and diversity are newspeak terms that only apply to African Americans and Hispanics. Get with the program.
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People in Silicon Valley are far less bigoted about sexual orientation than most other people. However, there aren't nearly enough women and minorities there.
It sounds like you are inferring that women and minorities are more bigoted about sexual orientation.
Re:I agree (Score:5, Insightful)
That just seems wrong to me.
Show me reports of minorities and women trying to work in tech and not being able to find jobs, enough of them to make up for the disparity; then I'll agree we need to hire more of them. Until then, I'll go on assuming that those who want to work in this field do work in this field, and I'll be fine with that as I'm, personally, against forcing people into positions.
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And you wonder why there are zero women around.
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Question for you. When you go to have some surgery, do you insist on the best surgeon? Like, the best in the world. Or just they best in the country. Or that hospital.
And how do you determine the best? If it's the success/failure ratio (accounting for difficulty, medical history, complications etc), how do you intend for new surgeons to enter the field? Practice on other people before opening you?
Or is it really just a question of you needing some routine surgery and a competent, qualified doctor and suppor
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Wait... You picked the "best" based on some stats, without correcting for experience or the type of surgery, and based partially on anecdotes. And one of them was so irresponsible they were caught driving drunk. I think your method may be flawed.
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Note that in this thread, the first to use "diversity hire" was a race-hater I was replying to. I didn't start using it, but used the same words as him to show it's a stupid term. Apparently you are liberal, as you are agreeing with someone that you imply is liberal (wherein both think the term is silly and shouldn't be used).
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