Want to read Slashdot from your mobile device? Point it at m.slashdot.org and keep reading!

 



Forgot your password?
typodupeerror
×
Communications United States Government Entertainment

The Ham Radio Parity Act Unanimously Passed By US House (arrl.org) 195

This week the U.S. House of Representatives unanimously passed "The Ham Radio Parity Act" -- a huge victory for grass-roots advocates of amateur radio. Slashdot reader bobbied reports: This will allow for the reasonable accommodation of amateur radio antennas in many places where they are currently prohibited by homeowner associations or private land use restrictions... If this bill passes the Senate, we will be one step closer to allowing amateur radio operators, who provide emergency communications services, the right to erect reasonable antenna structures in places where they cannot do so now.
The national ham radio association is now urging supporters to contact their Senators through a special web page. "This is not just a feel-good bill," said representative Joe Courtney, remembering how Hurricane Sandy brought down the power grid, and "we saw all the advanced communications we take for granted...completely fall by the wayside."
This discussion has been archived. No new comments can be posted.

The Ham Radio Parity Act Unanimously Passed By US House

Comments Filter:
  • The real issue (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Saturday September 17, 2016 @06:51PM (#52909095)

    Is that deed restricted properties are even allowed under law.

    Only complete idiots thinks it's a good idea to hand over the deed right to you property to an association that can foreclose on you because you let your grass grow to 3" instead of the maximum allowed 2.5".

    These types of places were tolerable only until they started taking over ALL available property within the best school districts, good locations in cities, and other important qualities of a property. Generally based on municipalities who want to collect taxes but not be held accountable for maintaining common spaces (parks, pools, sidewalks, etc.) and thus _require_ all new development to be done under a deed restricted plan. It's a "lovely" work around to that whole pesky property rights issue that governments face due to federal, state and local constitutions, laws, etc.

    • Re:The real issue (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Wrath0fb0b ( 302444 ) on Saturday September 17, 2016 @08:01PM (#52909313)

      The real issue is that some people want to live in a place where their neighbors can't leave trash out or have cars on their lawn (and to have enforcement that has teeth, unlike some municipalities). Some people want to raise roosters, other people think that owning a rooster violates your neighbors' right to quiet enjoyment of their homes. People that want those restrictions, and are in turn willing to accept the reciprocal restrictions on themselves, can voluntarily and knowingly live in a place where everyone agrees on that basic deal.

      Now, that sort of thing isn't for me (and I bought a house in a nice district with functioning public parks and whatnot with no HOA) but it is extremely illiberal to deny a group of people the right to voluntarily associate in a manner than they all find beneficial. And since we are on the topic of choice, I see you are somehow suggesting that the non-HOA living arrangement is somehow in danger, which is patently ridiculous since 20% of existing homes and 40% of new homes don't have one [zillow.com].

      TLDR: Freedom includes the right to create your own arrangements. Some of them might seem silly to us, in which case we should just not partake instead of being righteous about it.

      • Re:The real issue (Score:4, Interesting)

        by Shane_Optima ( 4414539 ) on Saturday September 17, 2016 @08:53PM (#52909479) Journal

        but it is extremely illiberal to deny a group of people the right to voluntarily associate in a manner than they all find beneficial.

        As a "deregulation libertarian" (for lack of a better term), I really despise this all-too-common perversion of the word "liberalism", whereby one is deemed illiberal if one don't agree with the unlimited privatization of the law and freedom of association is conflated with an unlimited "freedom" for deep-pocketed corporate entities (not actual, singular human beings) to unilaterally foist contracts of adhesion on individuals.

        The perverted (but commonly accepted) libertarian or classical liberal argument is that every contractual restriction that the courts deem invalid is a gross example of big government trampling on individual freedom. I tend to believe exactly the opposite: that every enforcible contract provision, beyond the minimum necessary for societies and essential institutions to function, represents an enlargement of government and should be considered by default undesirable unless there is a compelling argument to the contrary. This is particularly evident in any situation where contracts are neither simple (like the sale of goods) nor negotiable. It also should be particularly evident when one person is signing a multi-page contract with a fictitious legal "person" who has access to a half dozen layers.

        At the end of each one of these "voluntary association" contracts, the vast majority of which are non-negotiable, there are the police with guns drawn to enforce the terms. You can call that many things, but it is not small government, and it is not the pinnacle of freedom.

        Corporations forcing consumers to use shitty, pro-corporate watered down versions of the court system with zero right of appeal (due to binding arbitration clauses) is not liberal. And as the grandparent said: allowing HOAs to snap up all the good land (a limited resource that government traditionally aims to ensure equitable access to) and then set up their own capricious set of permissible usage rules that are ultimately enforced by public police paid for with my tax dollars is not a particularly liberal state of affairs.

        If you still disagree, then I have a simple question for you: do you think people should be allowed to sell themselves into slavery? If not, where do you think the line should be drawn regarding the rights people are allowed to "voluntarily" sign away? It is just on this side of slavery, or are there perhaps other areas that the government shouldn't be sticking their noses into, regardless of what any piece of paper says?

        • At the end of each one of these "voluntary association" contracts, the vast majority of which are non-negotiable

          Yes they are, you had the option to NOT buy the property...

          do you think people should be allowed to sell themselves into slavery?

          Yes, they should... Why not? Do you not own your life and yourself?

          • you had the option to NOT buy the property

            Of course you did: you had every right to move to another country. In today's new-house market, that pretty well sums up your options.

            • In today's new-house market, that pretty well sums up your options.

              Oh, nonsense!

              My parents wanted a new house. They looked around for some land out in the country but near to town (and hospitals, they're not getting younger), bought nine acres, built a house to suit them.

              Far as I know, the only requirement that the land purchase had was that they couldn't subdivide the lot. Not even sure that that was there, but I think I remember hearing mom say that back when they bought the place.

              Yes, you're not g

            • In today's new-house market, that pretty well sums up your options.

              The facts do not support your statement...

              Less than 50% of new homes built today are in a HOA...

          • by dywolf ( 2673597 )

            HOAs are interesting.
            on the one hand its a form of self-government or organization to have a say and protect each other from each other.
            which is fine when everyone joined originally.

            but when someone sells and leaves, the case of the person moving into the area and being forced to join with no option is interesting as a debate topic. the original owner joined willingly when the HOA was setup. But the new owner is joined because the membership is now tied to the property.

            --

            as for slavery, no they shouldn't, b

          • At the end of each one of these "voluntary association" contracts, the vast majority of which are non-negotiable

            Yes they are, you had the option to NOT buy the property...

            Actually, the argument I've heard goes this way. There are not really any houses available which are of similar age, cost and location that don't have CC&R's. I know in my area, nearly ALL the builders have boiler plate CC&R's that prohibit ALL antennas, and good luck finding a new house that doesn't. So in a way, hams don't really have a choice. Sure, they can incur a longer commute, spend more, or buy an older home that's not subject to CC&R's, but in many cases economics and location pret

        • by dywolf ( 2673597 )

          HOAs are like many things a blessing and curse.

          The idea of protecting property values from outside influences outside the scope of zoning law is a good one. there is a benefit to preventing a neighbor from turning his home into a sewage treatment plant (or dog poo manufacturing facility, with 6 dogs in a 4k sq ft lot), and thus negatively impacting the value of everyone around him's most valuable investment.

          but there are also the HOAs that go too far: the anal rules about, grass, color, what can and cant be

      • Re:The real issue (Score:4, Insightful)

        by whodunit ( 2851793 ) on Saturday September 17, 2016 @10:22PM (#52909783)

        ... so 80% of existing homes ARE subject to an HOA?

      • I see you are somehow suggesting that the non-HOA living arrangement is somehow in danger, which is patently ridiculous since 20% of existing homes and 40% of new homes don't have one.

        What is ridiculous is your lack of facility with the written English language. I'd be quite upset if 80% of existing homes were under the thrall of an HOA.

        TLDR: Freedom includes the right to create your own arrangements. Some of them might seem silly to us, in which case we should just not partake instead of being righteous about it.

        Communism is your neighbor forcing you to fork over fees, and then ordering you as to what you can or cannot do on your property or they'll seize it. It sounds like you're the one being sensitive about criticism for your fascist/pinko lifestyle choices.

      • Re:The real issue (Score:4, Interesting)

        by evilviper ( 135110 ) on Sunday September 18, 2016 @03:04AM (#52910789) Journal

        some people want to live in a place where their neighbors can't leave trash out or have cars on their lawn (and to have enforcement that has teeth, unlike some municipalities). Some people want to raise roosters, other people think that owning a rooster violates your neighbors' right to quiet enjoyment of their homes.

        That's called zoning and code enforcement. You don't need an HOA for any of that at all. Just move into an area zoned residential and you'll have no roosters. If codes aren't being enforced, you let your city representatives know it's important to you, and your family and friends will vote them out next election if they don't make it a priority.

        HOAs are just a bunch of busy-bodies deciding what color you can paint your bike shed, and taking your money so they can play like they're doing something important. Governments keep having to preempt HOA restrictions, no requirements for green grass during a drought, no restrictions on antennas, etc. And it will keep going until HOAs are powerless, as it should, because they're fundamentally detrimental to everyone and everything.

        you are somehow suggesting that the non-HOA living arrangement is somehow in danger, which is patently ridiculous since 20% of existing homes and 40% of new homes don't have one.

        There are big geographic areas in which you simply cannot buy a home without an HOA restriction. If you want to live there, you're screwed. In other areas, you can't find an HOA no matter how hard you try. It's not a nice even mix where you can pick and choose whether you'd like an HOA area, or not.

        HOAs are like an addiction... Whatever the reason you were convinced to start, you can't ever make it stop. At least personal service contracts are limited to 7 years by law. Your property is stuck with that horrible HOA on it for centuries, and owner after owner. A contract you can't ever get out of is borderline slavery.

        • If codes aren't being enforced, you let your city representatives know it's important to you, and your family and friends will vote them out next election if they don't make it a priority.

          Only works if your family and friends constitute a majority. And since that is almost never the case, what you're saying here is basically nonsensical.

          HOAs are just a bunch of busy-bodies deciding what color you can paint your bike shed, and taking your money so they can play like they're doing something important.

          "Governm

          • Only works if your family and friends constitute a majority.

            Nonsense. That would mean the candidate(s) is/are otherwise getting 100% of the vote. How often does that happen?

            "Government is (among other things) a bunch of busy-bodies deciding what color you can paint your bike shed,

            Except for just a few historic districts, the government practically never sets restrictions on what color you can paint your property, while it's very common with HOAs. Governments just set laws you can follow, while HOAs lord

            • by fyngyrz ( 762201 )

              Only works if your family and friends constitute a majority.

              Nonsense. That would mean the candidate(s) is/are otherwise getting 100% of the vote. How often does that happen?

              What? How do you figure? A majority is anything over 50%. Including 51%. If you don't have a majority (which is not a requirement for 100%) with you, you can't set the path of a new ordinance by voting; and you generally can't set it at all by trying to reason with the town/city/whatever council, unless you create a petition with a signi

              • If you don't have a majority (which is not a requirement for 100%) with you, you can't set the path of a new ordinance by voting; and you generally can't set it at all by trying to reason with the town/city/whatever council

                You don't seem to know much of anything about civics, so I'll take one quick attempt at explaining...

                If a politician won his last election with an 80% majority, then you only need to control 30.1% of those who voted for him to cause him to lose next time. Your 30.1% plus the presumed exis

      • The real issue is that some people want to live in a place where their neighbors can't leave trash out or have cars on their lawn (and to have enforcement that has teeth, unlike some municipalities).

        The real issue is that people want to point fingers instead of lending a helping hand. Well, fuck them right up their arrogant assholes, and fuck their HOAs too.

        Deed restrictions genuinely are shit. They should not exist, period, the end.

    • Is that deed restricted properties are even allowed under law.

      I almost agree with you. Think about the long term affects of CC&R's and I shudder to think what's going to happen in 40 or 60 years. It's going to be a mess to clean up all this legally when we want to redevelop the all these lots with the ramshackle old shacks which need to be leveled.

      Personally, I believe that CC&R's should have a sunset provision, where the HOA and the CC&R's should be required to demonstrate that the majority of lot owners still want the covenants every decade or so, or

  • by StandardCell ( 589682 ) on Saturday September 17, 2016 @07:22PM (#52909173)
    There is an entire body of stealth antennas that have been developed for legally and space-constrained homes, such as flagpole antennas, magnetic loops, folded attic dipoles, and even tuned metal gutters! Yet these are all compromise antennas due to their limited height from the ground , proximity to metal objects and wiring, and size (for the 40m band on HF, you need at least a 10m/33ft vertical plus one or more counterpoises of that length on the ground). Some HOAs are even more draconian and allow nothing outside of a strict approved list of items per the HOA contract. This means that even a 1/4 wavelength vertical wire antenna that is barely visible to the eye is disallowed. Ironically, it's these same antennas that contribute to RFI issues for neighbors, increase RF exposure and worsen problems that would not be present with a properly deployed non-compromise antenna. HOA agreements have a disproportionate impact on hams who tend to be older and often use ham radio to communicate with their friends. Some of these are ex-military and civilian volunteers who are part of the Military Auxiliary Radio System [army.mil] or Civil Air Patrol [capmembers.com], or participate in volunteer civil safety services such as Amateur Radio Emergency Service [arrl.org], Radio Amateur Civil Emergency Service [usraces.org] and Skywarn [skywarn.org] that use HF frequencies as well.

    The HOAs have been vociferously opposed to this act as an infringement of civil liberties and have written both to the FCC and to congress opposing this. Yet there are already FCC-mandated requirements for such things as satellite antennas on HOA-governed properties that supersede any restrictions that may be contained in HOA contracts on spectrum which is technically regulated by the FCC. The intent is not to replicated a nearly 200' tall antenna tower with stacked Yagis [qrz.com], but to provide reasonable accommodation. A 1/4 wavelength vertical wire antenna barely visible to the eye can literally communicate with the entire world, yet somehow the HOA board fanatics claim that even these should be restricted. Even one of the trapped multiband vertical antennas in a back yard can make a big difference in getting out and participating in radio, but they again want no part of it.

    There is bias against what we don't know or don't want to know. Heck, people think that there is an environmental impact to these antennas [napavalleyregister.com]. I'm hopeful this will get passed and withstand scrutiny in the inevitable court battle that will ensue over it. But in a country turning its back on science for sports, maybe even the discussion with the non-ham folks might actually activate a few brain cells.
  • by Applehu Akbar ( 2968043 ) on Saturday September 17, 2016 @07:33PM (#52909221)

    This legislation is a needed benefit for the ham community, but the NIMBY problem is far bigger than this. I have seen cases where a small group of Concerned Citizens (aka tinfoil yammerheads) can prevent needed cell towers from being installed in their town because 'radiation'.

      What I would like to see is legislation that would strip NIMBYs of court access to prevent the construction of any public infrastructure project that conforms to published specifications for safety, appearance, and environmental impact for the project type, as adjudicated by the relevant regulatory agency. To obstruct a project, an opponent would be burdened with proving that the project did not conform to its type specification.

    • Be careful what you wish for.

    • by DewDude ( 537374 )
      The tinfoil types have had less and less power with the number of documented cases of them complaining about a tower that's not even turned on. When local municipalities find out 99% of the complaints from these people in other areas are about towers that aren't even turned on; credibility goes out the window.
      • I have a ham radio buddy who used the same strategy. Whenever he moved to a new town, he would set up his big antenna first and left the rest of his rig crated. He would wait about six weeks for all the neighbors to complain about impotence and dead pets. Then he would invite everyone over and show them the setup. Never a peep after that.

        • by DewDude ( 537374 )
          Well...the biggest problem is that no one understands the science behind this...and they don't want to. Instead...they resort to believing Facebook types and people who have alternative motives behind it.

          Take for example one "RF Crusader". This woman films videos of her driving around in her car with some sort of detector constantly going off....talking about the doom and gloom. She stops on corners, points at things she things are towers...then rants at how "everyone at this intersection is getting cancer
          • "Lady wound up in a psych ward."

            In too many cases, she winds up in a legislature, or Congress, instead. It's why we can't have nice things.

    • by dywolf ( 2673597 )

      how very libertarian of you to demand peoples' access to the courts be stripped.

      • how very libertarian of you to demand peoples' access to the courts be stripped.

        If you're going to have any adjudicating body at all, we should have the right to demand that it observe scientific facts when it renders judgements.

        Or we could do it the strict Randian way: protesters would take up arms against construction crews, who would then get to shoot back.

  • dit dit dit da da da dit dit dit - Pre ASCII
  • This will allow for the reasonable accommodation of amateur radio antennas in many places where they are currently prohibited by homeowner associations or private land use restrictions

    Much as I hate such limits on use of private property ("painting permit" anyone?), is not such Federal overwrite of local laws and rules against the spirit and even the letter of the 10th Amendment [wikipedia.org]?

    The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States

    • by DewDude ( 537374 )
      There's this thing in FCC regulations called "PRB-1", it is a reasonable accomdiation law that prevents local governments and municipalities from restricting ham antennas. In many cases where a local law has outright said "no"; this regulation has been cited to overturn the local law. It's happened in many places, though it's usually not easy. Sometimes you walk in to a planning office and show this to them; they know they have no alternative but to issue a permit. This depends if your state has any laws on
      • by mi ( 197448 )

        There's this thing in FCC regulations called "PRB-1", it is a reasonable accomdiation law that prevents local governments and municipalities from restricting ham antennas.

        An FCC regulation is even worse (weaker) than an actual Congress-passed and President-signed law...

        But, yes, I'm aware of the federal laws on the matter — my point was, such laws (and "regulations") need to be Amendments to be able to trump local laws, should they not be?

  • I sent my reps the email.

    I am glad that it may have helped.

    (Amature Radio Service Operator).

  • This is very good news for the RAYNET guys in the USA.
    73's

A triangle which has an angle of 135 degrees is called an obscene triangle.

Working...