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Earth The Almighty Buck United States

President Trump Is Reportedly Considering Buying Greenland (wsj.com) 344

According to The Wall Street Journal, President Trump has -- with varying degrees of seriousness -- floated the idea of the U.S. buying the autonomous Danish territory of Greenland. From the report: In meetings, at dinners and in passing conversations, Mr. Trump has asked advisers whether the U.S. can acquire Greenland, listened with interest when they discuss its abundant resources and geopolitical importance and, according to two of the people, has asked his White House counsel to look into the idea. Some of his advisers have supported the concept, saying it was a good economic play, two of the people said, while others dismissed it as a fleeting fascination that will never come to fruition. It is also unclear how the U.S. would go about acquiring Greenland even if the effort were serious.

U.S. officials view Greenland as important to American national-security interests. A decades-old defense treaty between Denmark and the U.S. gives the U.S. military virtually unlimited rights in Greenland at America's northernmost base, Thule Air Base. Located 750 miles north of the Arctic Circle, it includes a radar station that is part of a U.S. ballistic missile early-warning system. The base is also used by the U.S. Air Force Space Command and the North American Aerospace Defense Command. People outside the White House have described purchasing Greenland as an Alaska-type acquisition for Mr. Trump's legacy, advisers said. The few current and former White House officials who had heard of the notion described it with a mix of anticipation and apprehension, since it remains unknown how far the president might push the idea. It generated a cascade of questions among his advisers, such as whether the U.S. could use Greenland to establish a stronger military presence in the Arctic, and what kind of research opportunities it might present.
The report says that Trump told associates he had been advised to look into buying Greenland because Denmark faced financial trouble from supporting the territory. The person who told the Journal about Trump's comments said they seemed like more of a joke about his power than a serious inquiry.

According to U.S. and Danish government statistics, Greenland relies on $591 million of subsidies from Denmark annually, which make up about 60% of its annual budget.
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President Trump Is Reportedly Considering Buying Greenland

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  • by lazarus ( 2879 ) on Thursday August 15, 2019 @10:22PM (#59092402) Journal

    It is somehow ironic that Erik the Red duped people into moving to the frozen wasteland by naming it "Greenland" and thanks (?) to global warming it looks like it will be primarily "green" one day soon after all.

    Trump's environmental policies are "helping" Greenland live up to its name.

    How do I leave this timeline? I've been stuck here for a long time.

    • It is somehow ironic that Erik the Red duped people into moving to the frozen wasteland by naming it "Greenland" and thanks (?) to global warming it looks like it will be primarily "green" one day soon after all.

      This is just another facet of the "New Green Deal" that has been all the rage these days.

    • Re:Erik the Red (Score:4, Interesting)

      by tindur ( 658483 ) on Friday August 16, 2019 @03:48AM (#59092920)
      Greenland has a huge resource Trump can dig into once he has removed the ice: https://www.reuters.com/articl... [reuters.com]
    • by quenda ( 644621 ) on Friday August 16, 2019 @03:48AM (#59092922)

      It actually all just started with a spelling error.

      Trump wanted to acquire more Nuuks.

    • by EricTheRed ( 5613 ) on Friday August 16, 2019 @05:51AM (#59093074) Homepage

      I do seem to have this reputation ;-)

    • Re:Erik the Red (Score:5, Informative)

      by Rei ( 128717 ) on Friday August 16, 2019 @09:08AM (#59093540) Homepage

      The "Iceland is green, Greenland is icy, both names were chosen to trick people" thing is rather misleading.

      The official history for the naming of Iceland (Ísland (EES-lawnd) - literally, "Ice Land" - although today "ís" is mainly used to mean ice cream ;) ) traces back to Flóki Vilgerðarsson (also known as Hrafna-Flóki, or "Raven Flóki"), who set sail with caged ravens. He'd release them, and - being land birds with good eyesight - they'd immediately gain as much altitude as they could to try to find land. If they were unable to, they'd return to the boat, but if they beelined in one direction, they could be followed to land. Flóki's first winter was at Barðaströnd, where he saw pack ice floating in the water. While this is actually rare in Iceland, he dubbed the country Ísland as a response. While most of Iceland is unglaciated (~11% glacier coverage today, more back then), there are extensive glaciers that approach close to the sea - particularly the terminal glaciers of Vatnajökull in the southeast, the very direction that most settlers were coming from. So most of them probably didn't question the name much - nor would they have during our long winters.

      Greenland, the island, was known about before Eiríkr "Hinn Rauði" (TH)orvaldsson (thorn replaced by TH due to Slashdot) - a land of ice beyond some skerries (the identity of which are now disputed, and are said to have collapsed into the sea). There had been attempts to settle the skerries and the small rocky coastal bands not covered by glaciers, but none of them lasted long. Eiríkr was banned for a period for "some killings" - what said banishment basically meant is not that some government would punish him, but rather anyone else was free to kill him if they saw him, without them being punished in return. He sailed along the (known) icy land to the west further than anyone else had gone, until he found... wait for it... green lands, entirely unglaciated. These parts of Greenland are still green and support towns today. He named the place he found "Grænland" (GRINE-lahnd / Green Land). While he stated that he did so in order to have an appealing name to attract settlers, it wasn't some sort of trick to get people to settle on a glacier - the area wasn't that different from his home in Vestfirðir.

      As for this whole "Trump buying Greenland" thing - the US actually once tried to buy Iceland, too. It fell apart because the US had just controversially bought Alaska, and there was a lot of negative PR about that, so when the potential of an Iceland deal came out, there was a lot of pressure in the US to abandon the effort. I imagine that Greenlanders' response would be pretty much the same as that of the Icelandic independence movement at the time - basically, "We won't accept it and just peacefully become part of the US, of course - but this is *great* PR to use in our struggle, showing how Denmark would be willing to sell us away for a bit of cash - putting the lie to their claims of caring about us."

      (The US not only tried to buy Iceland once, but it also occupied the country once as well. You weren't bad overlords, though - Iceland made a lot of money off of that, used it as an excuse to tell Denmark to pound sand, and you didn't try to keep the country afterwards ;) )

  • by No Longer an AC ( 4611353 ) on Thursday August 15, 2019 @10:24PM (#59092410) Journal

    We might want to invest in some more icebreakers first.

    Meet the neglected 43-year-old stepchild of the U.S. military-industrial complex [latimes.com]

    But they're not as sexy as other military hardware I guess.

    The United States spends $2 billion a day on the most advanced military ever assembled, with more aircraft carriers, fighter planes and nuclear submarines than any other nation. The Pentagon intends to develop a space fleet of orbiting lasers, missile sensors and satellites.

    Then there is the Polar Star.

    The only U.S. ship capable of bludgeoning through heavy ice, it is the neglected 43-year-old stepchild of the U.S. military-industrial complex.

    • Interesting story thanks for the link!

    • Is that article available from a source where I don't first of all have to circumvent an adblocker?

    • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

      Please don't... Militarizing the poles is a bad idea, much like militarizing space is.

      The goal should be to de-escalate, not ramping up the tensions. If this happens you can be sure Russia will respond.

  • by Alain Williams ( 2972 ) <addw@phcomp.co.uk> on Thursday August 15, 2019 @10:25PM (#59092414) Homepage

    The USA is not exactly awash with cash. If I were the Danish Prime Minister (Mette Frederiksen) I would not accept anything other than cash - and not in USA dollars.

    • by MightyMartian ( 840721 ) on Thursday August 15, 2019 @10:46PM (#59092466) Journal

      Greenland is a self governing part of Denmark. I think the residents of Greenland, who receive quite a few benefits from Denmark might not be thrilled with becoming the Puerto Rico of the Arctic Circle.

      • by Strider- ( 39683 ) on Thursday August 15, 2019 @11:01PM (#59092508)

        They would more likely want to join Canada... Which would also end the dispute over Hans Island, the world's most friendly territorial dispute.

      • Greenland is a self governing part of Denmark. I think the residents of Greenland, who receive quite a few benefits from Denmark might not be thrilled with becoming the Puerto Rico of the Arctic Circle.

        They might not be thrilled with it, but unless they can cough up the money to buy the land from Denmark, they may not have much choice in the matter.

        • by benjymouse ( 756774 ) on Friday August 16, 2019 @04:33AM (#59092984)

          Greenland is a self governing part of the Kingdom of Denmark. A treaty has been drawn that at any point, the Greenlanders can hold a referendum and leave the Kingdom of Denmark. At which point they would also forfeit the subsidies. Denmark is not in a position to "sell" Greenland. Greenland would simply vote to leave.

          With a sufficiently good offer you may incite the Greenlanders to leave Denmark and join some other country. Given their independent minded nature and the way US treats it's other poor territories (see: Puerto Rico) I believe the offer must be exorbitant along with guarantees of self-governing, environmental guarantees, guarantees against resource exploitation etc. Really, it's a non-starter.

          Somebody played a cruel joke on Trump. Now he runs around embarrassing himself and US. Greenland is not for sale. Trump is just blinded by the prospect of having his name on another piece of real-estate.

          Trump is set to visit Denmark september 2nd. He will meet with the Queen. Greenland and Greenlanders hold a HUGE place in her heart. She will be very, very offended if he enquires about buying Greenland. Danes will be offended.

      • by cascadingstylesheet ( 140919 ) on Friday August 16, 2019 @06:58AM (#59093170) Journal

        Greenland is a self governing part of Denmark. I think the residents of Greenland, who receive quite a few benefits from Denmark might not be thrilled with becoming the Puerto Rico of the Arctic Circle.

        And Puerto Rico is a largely self governing part of the United States.

        It has been ruled by leftists for decades. It kicked out the US Naval base (with celebrity activism, etc.), and then a few years later had massive help poured in - as best it could be, sure would have been a lot easier with that naval base still there - after the hurricane.

        Leftist poverty and mismanagement is the cause of Puerto Rico's problems, not being part of the US.

    • by skoskav ( 1551805 ) on Thursday August 15, 2019 @11:09PM (#59092532)
      To be pedantic, Denmark has separation of powers, meaning that their legislative branch (Folketinget) has to approve it, then the prime minister's executive branch can execute it.
    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by Darinbob ( 1142669 )

      This is Trump, he probably honestly thinks that this would reduce the national debt and trade deficit simultaneously, and then give everyone a tax break to celebrate.

    • He's going to swap it for California. He never much liked that hippy lefty state anyway
    • by hey! ( 33014 )

      The idea that the US economy is especially vulnerable and the US government on the brink of bankruptcy is a political boogie man used to frighten voters who think of the wealth of nations as if it were currency stuffed in a mattress somewhere (or gold in a vault, which conceptually is the same thing).

      That's not to say that US government finances can't be mismanaged, or that the US economy can't be damaged. But running out of cash is not a realistic problem. It's not like we're going to dig into the mattr

    • Re:Oil (Score:4, Funny)

      by Anonymous Coward on Thursday August 15, 2019 @10:39PM (#59092446)
      Wow, I'm suprised America hasn't tried to bring it freedom yet.
      • Maybe we ran out? Who'd have guessed that freedom wasn't a renewable resource.

      • We only bring freedom to brown people.

        Then again... the Kalaallit there look kinda ... at least they don't look like proper whites, that should do.

    • And Denmark can not afford to keep it with 100 bn barrels of oil? Makes no sense. Purely about national security methinks, and Long term investment with climate change.

    • by Chrisq ( 894406 )
      It also comes with the rights to a large arctic territory [wordpress.com]. This too is thought to have oil reserves.
  • by Marcus Allen ( 6144156 ) on Thursday August 15, 2019 @10:27PM (#59092420)
    Keep in mind, Trump was concerned about the cost of supporting Puerto Rico after Hurricane Maria devastated the territory. Micronesia is an independent republic associated with the United States, but hasn't exactly been supported well. I see nothing to convince me that the US would be any more willing to support Greenland.
    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      by AHuxley ( 892839 )
      Thats would depend on the action of the gov in Greenland and how they send out the support the US provides.
      Much like Puerto Rico could have/should done with the support the US gov sent.
      What a gov of Puerto Rico does with help sent is a matter for the gov of Puerto Rico.
      The USA got the support in place. The Puerto Rico gov was the gov to do something with that US help and support...

      US support for Greenland would be much like its support for Alaska as it would be part of the USA.
      Not another "Puerto Ri
      • The politics and governing of Greenland currently results in a 60% subsidy from Denmark (per above)â"so it isn't self sustaining. Of course, once part of Glorious US of A, Greenland would be raking in dough from the Trump golf course, the Javanka oil fields, the Donnie's Detention for-profit prison franchise opportunities, and the invisible bridge building project!
    • Support?

      You didn't quite understand the idea behind neo-colonialism.

    • Keep in mind, Trump was concerned about the cost of supporting Puerto Rico after Hurricane Maria devastated the territory.

      Puerto Rico is exploiting its territorial status to fleece the U.S. treasury. As a territory, its citizens are U.S. citizens and enjoy the benefits and services the U.S. government provides. But they do not have to pay Federal income tax [wikipedia.org]. In a nutshell, status as a U.S. territory is only intended to be temporary. The territory should ASAP either vote to become a full-fledged U.S. st

  • Asking for trouble (Score:5, Informative)

    by Livius ( 318358 ) on Thursday August 15, 2019 @10:28PM (#59092422)

    There's an island off Greenland that is the subject of a border dispute between Denmark and Canada. If Trump gets involved there's no telling how far that border dispute could escalate.

    • It's the cutest border dispute in the world! I'd hate to see that go.

      As I recall, it's just a barren rock, and folks from the two countries occasionally sail over to it, take the other country's flag and the bottle of booze the other country left for them, leave their own flag and booze, and sail off.

  • by PopeRatzo ( 965947 ) on Thursday August 15, 2019 @10:29PM (#59092424) Journal

    He thinks "Greenland" refers to the number of putting greens available there.

  • by Waffle Iron ( 339739 ) on Thursday August 15, 2019 @10:53PM (#59092488)

    We're going to need a place like Greenland to move most of his supporters once the southern USA ends up under water and/or becomes too hot to support human habitation.

  • by Goonie ( 8651 ) <robert.merkel@b[ ... g ['ena' in gap]> on Thursday August 15, 2019 @11:04PM (#59092518) Homepage
    Hmmm...conversation over breakfast in Nuuk this morning

    A: "Hey, Trump wants to buy Greenland for the United States"

    B: "What? Seriously?"

    A: "Apparently"

    A&B look at each other

    A & B simultaneously: HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

    • by Way Smarter Than You ( 6157664 ) on Friday August 16, 2019 @12:19AM (#59092652)
      Louisiana purchase? Hello? Does NO ONE know anything about American history? Whether or not buying Greenland is a serious possibility, the idea absolutely has HUGE precedent in US history. Laughing at the concept without consideration of the real possibility is more revealing of the lack of imagination of some posters here than the administration.
      • Louisiana purchase? Hello? Does NO ONE know anything about American history? Whether or not buying Greenland is a serious possibility, the idea absolutely has HUGE precedent in US history. Laughing at the concept without consideration of the real possibility is more revealing of the lack of imagination of some posters here than the administration.

        Since Trump goes shopping, he should also buy France, and since he's at it, buy the whole Europe. "Laughing at the concept": no. But we're not in an "infinite" world territory anymore, where leaders would give up precious parcels of Earth, like Napoleon did. What is funny is that you really think Denmark would sell Greenland...

  • He'll tell you from his bunker in Greenland while the continental US turns into a scorched lifeless wasteland.
  • I was thinking that moving all the "Uninvited foreign guests" to one place would save a lot of money. /s?

    And once the ice is all gone, it would probably be a nice place with vast untapped resources.

  • Not happening, but (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Miamicanes ( 730264 ) on Thursday August 15, 2019 @11:38PM (#59092590)

    If the US "bought" Greenland, it would be buying sovereignty, not necessarily ownership. There's nothing that says Denmark couldn't retain fee-simple ownership of Danish-owned land (including mineral rights) while selling the right for Greenland to join the US, if that's what it votes for.

    Its residents would probably get a good deal... dual Danish/EU + US citizenship (though their future kids would be only US citizens), and quite probably cash payments of their own. Going forward, if the US wanted outright ownership of land, it would have to go through the usual eminent-domain proceedings & pay a fair price (though the treaty would probably provide a special, expedited process for the US to buy land owned by Denmark or its royal family). If Greenland entered as a state, I'm sure the new state government would end up as the legal owner of infrastructure & public buildings presently owned by "Greenland".

    For Denmark itself, it could be a great investment... selling sovereignty, while retaining fee-simple ownership & mineral rights in a vast area Denmark itself lacks the resources to fully exploit and develop on its own. If Denmark invested the money in its own infrastructure, it could expedite the construction of 3 or 4 more bridges/tunnels (say, Fehmarn, Rostok, and Helsingborg) & make itself the unquestioned commercial crossroads of Scandinavia. Yeah, it already has one route from Germany to Malmo... but it's badly choked with traffic & somewhat out of the way. More bridges/tunnels would free up capacity along the current road for Danes *themselves* to take advantage of & sprawl along.

    Even if the US agreed to give original Greenland residents $25k/year for the rest of their lives to mitigate the loss of social welfare from Denmark, with only ~55,000 eligible residents, it would barely be a rounding error in the federal budget.

    Anyway, the point is that "buying Greenland" wouldn't necessarily change OWNERSHIP of Greenland's real estate or mineral rights, just ultimate federal sovereignty.

    It would be a long shot, but ultimately could be profitable for everyone... Greenlanders, Danes, *and* Americans. Especially if it resulted in a short-term immigration boom (and explosive real estate surge) by Danes eager to slide under the wire & walk away with free dual-citizenship that continued with new American investment. If the population of the entire *country* (ok, autonomous land, or whatever) is 55k to start with, it wouldn't take much immigration at all to double, triple, or quadruple its population almost overnight (or at least, the population of the Nuuk metro area).

    • by aquabat ( 724032 )
      (conspiracy hat on)

      Russia would have an epileptic wargasm if it could control Greenland. Why hasn't Russia bought Greenland? Is it because Denmark is a NATO country, and would never sell to Russia? Ok.

      If Greenland were part of a country where Russia had more influence, Russia's agenda could be advanced more realistically.

      (conspiracy hat off)

      • (borrows conspiracy hat and puts it on)

        Which is why Russia is going to have Trump buy it for them. Then wait a year, finally say, "Global Warming is Real, I was misinformed and fired the people who misled me. Oil is bad. Therefore we will be selling the oil rights to these conglomerates."

        Conglomerates = Company within company within company ultimately owned by Russian oligarchs.

        Russia will, of course, send troops to protect such a vital and strategic area. Then the next year Trump will say it is a burden on

    • Well, instead of bridges and cars I rather go to Denmark viking style: with a boat!

    • by hherb ( 229558 ) <<moc.lacidemogirrod> <ta> <tsroh>> on Friday August 16, 2019 @04:41AM (#59093000) Homepage

      How would that be a good deal? Only a US American might think such absurdity. What parent would sell out the future of their children?
      Compared to the USA, Denmark is a paradise. Far more freedom and security for all, and full access to Europe. EU citizenship is worth more than US citizenship - just check which countries EU citizens can access visa free, and which US citizens can (https://www.atlasandboots.com/best-passport-to-have/).
      Also check what rights and entitlements EU citizens have, and how few US citizens have in comparison.
      Not everybody is willing to sell their future and freedom for a little short term luxury.

      • Denmark might very well be a paradise... but Greenland is more like Denmark's bastard child that's not quite unloved, but isn't the equal of its half-brothers & knows it painfully well.

        Right now, Greenland's economy is going nowhere. It's a distant outpost with little to attract outside investment or induce others to move there. Becoming part of the US might or might not matter long-term, but it almost certainly would attract new outside investment for a decade or two just from investor exuberance.

        As ot

    • Having dual U.S. citizenship is not all it's cracked up to be [forbes.com] due to the IRS taxing based on citizenship rather than based on residency like most of the rest of the world. That is, if you're a dual U.S. citizen, you still owe taxes and have to file a tax return with the IRS, even if you've never stepped foot in the U.S. Many people who are dual U.S. citizens pay out the nose to give up their U.S. citizenship [brighttax.com] once they run afoul of this.
  • Manifest destiny would look more plausible when Canada is surrounded by Alaska, US-owned-Greenland, and the contiguous states.

    • by Minion of Eris ( 1574569 ) on Friday August 16, 2019 @01:28AM (#59092738)
      Lets just hope he follows Adolph and Napoleons blunders and invades in winter, we might have a chance.
    • Ha! You’re falling into the First Nations’ trap!

      Once you’re preoccupied with your western, eastern, and southern borders - the Great Army of the North will come thundering down from the Northwest Territories! Their vast armada will fill the Hudson’s Bay!

      Hope you’ve brushed up on your Inuktitut... you’re gonna need it!

  • For the past two years, in secret, he has been negotiating behind the scenes. He is now making it known to get the public ready for the takeover of Canada! He plans to surround them and force the end of their socialistic paradise!
  • Does he know that Greenland is not where Marijuana comes from And that its not actually green.
  • Denmark should be worried: the US has a history of taking the land it wants by force if it can't acquire it another way.

    Thankfully, it merely seems a temporary whim from His Orangeness...

  • "financial trouble" (Score:5, Informative)

    by adamxi ( 2875671 ) on Friday August 16, 2019 @01:25AM (#59092736)
    As a Dane i can tell you - Denmark does not have financial troubles lol.. And certainly! not compared to the US. Trump is, as usual, full of shit.
  • Headline: Country buys country, sovereignty remains intact, details at--start the thyroxine injections.
  • Is Denmark actually willing to sell it in the first place.
    I know Trumps grasp of economics isn't great (to put it mildly), but surely even he understands that you cannot buy something that isn't for sale.

    • Is Denmark actually willing to sell it in the first place.

      In one word: No.

      I don't know who, but somebody has played a joke on Trump and now he is embarrassing himself and the US.

      Greenland is *not* for sale.

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