Why the Earth's Wobble Means Your Zodiac Sign Isn't What You Think (wsj.com) 126
As the planet spins on its axis, it teeters back and forth like a child's top, and after millennia of staggering along its path around the sun, it no longer aligns with the constellations of the zodiac on the dates that were established in ancient times. From a report: Because of that, Leo ain't what he used to be -- and neither are Aries, Taurus, Gemini or any of the rest. In astronomical terms, the wobble is known as precession, and it's caused by gravity tugging on the Earth's distended midriff. "The Earth bulges at the equator, and the gravitational pull of the sun and Moon together act on that bulge," said James B. Kaler, professor emeritus of astronomy at the University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign.
Over a period of roughly 26,000 years, the planet's wobble traces a full circle, gradually making the stars appear to shift to the east by about one degree over the span of a human life. "It sounds slow," Dr. Kaler said, "but it changes the polestar." The polestar appears directly above the North Pole and marks due north. Today, Polaris, which is sometimes called the North Star, is located at the tip of the Little Dipper's handle and is the Earth's polestar. A few thousand years from now, Vega, the brightest star in the constellation Lyra, will occupy that position. The creeping discrepancy in the alignment of the Earth, sun and constellations was first noticed by the Greek astronomer Hipparchus, who lived from 190 B.C. to 120 B.C., and is considered the founder of trigonometry.
Over a period of roughly 26,000 years, the planet's wobble traces a full circle, gradually making the stars appear to shift to the east by about one degree over the span of a human life. "It sounds slow," Dr. Kaler said, "but it changes the polestar." The polestar appears directly above the North Pole and marks due north. Today, Polaris, which is sometimes called the North Star, is located at the tip of the Little Dipper's handle and is the Earth's polestar. A few thousand years from now, Vega, the brightest star in the constellation Lyra, will occupy that position. The creeping discrepancy in the alignment of the Earth, sun and constellations was first noticed by the Greek astronomer Hipparchus, who lived from 190 B.C. to 120 B.C., and is considered the founder of trigonometry.
So, Astrology may not be accurate? (Score:5, Funny)
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My concern is that I've spent all these years stalking Meryl Streep to give her a hickey, in vain!
Re:So, Astrology may not be accurate? (Score:5, Interesting)
While Astrology isn't a real study. It did help open the door to real scientific reasoning.
Being that people were paid to watch, track and predict the position of stars, allowed to a lot of detail records, and observations in which we were able to come up with more scientific models of the universe and solar system.
If Mars crosses over Orion means something, then we should know how Mars moves so we know when it crosses over Orion. Then they record and find a pattern of movement. Then with that pattern we then can find out the easier motion was circular (then elliptical after more detail measurements) which then created a more complete picture of the universe. To a point that Astrological patterns are understood, thus realizing it doesn't coincide with fortune telling, but forecasting from existing patterns.
Look Orion is visible in the night sky, then Winter is coming, it is out then summer after it is gone. It had its place for predictions before we calculated its patterns. Then of course the Astrologers got greedy and started making stuff up.
This is not news (Score:5, Funny)
While this is true, I'm surprised it is here, since it is not in any way news: the precession of the equinoxes has been known for thousands of years.
...If Mars crosses over Orion means something, then we should know how Mars moves so we know when it crosses over Orion...
If Mars crosses over Orion it does mean something: it means that there has been a catastrophic event in the solar system.
Re: This is not news (Score:2)
Why would that surprise anyone? This is Slashdot home of the nerd, land of the dupe. Even 2k year old ones...
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My aunt - who actually believes in this shit - gave me a book to read about... well, I don't quite know, because I gave up before the author got too deep into her past lives in ancient Egypt. But there was one chapter in there about how the Earth's wobble corresponds to 2000-year cycles related to which constellation the axis is pointing to (apparently, we've been entering the Age of Aquarius for decades now).
Anyway, it's interesting that the desire to believe mystical bullshit is strong enough to motivate
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One thing I find somewhat interesting is that people claiming past live always pick some era for which we have records. How come they don't have past lives of people 100,000 years ago, modern humans were there then. Or Neanderthals, no one claims to have been a Neanderthal. This sort of anti-ancient bias must stop. Ancient people have just as much right to be reincarnated as historical humans. Maybe Fox News should take this up, give their Evangelical nutjobs a thrill for once instead of preaching to the ch
Re: So, Astrology may not be accurate? (Score:2)
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To be fair, the population was a lot lower back then so statistically you're less likely to have been one.
Assuming that you can only be reincarnated once.
Also assuming that it's not a total load of old horsefeathers.
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Gees, chill as long as they are having fun, who cares. Sure there are asshats who exploit the gullible but like all con artists they should simply be reported to the authorities for investigation and prosecution.
Belief is a human evolutionary trait, the prime belief, the belief in reproduction and this clearly demonstrated by how tightly reproduction is tied to religion, from the earliest fertility dolls to the current sick crazy crap wrapped around Islam, buying female minors to abuse, sick as.
Astrology h
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But Astrology might be accurate-ish (Score:2)
While I feel sympathy for people that think the position of planets and stars has something to do with their personality, I did come up with an alternative theory. For any given period of time within something like 100 or 1000 years or so, the position of the planets and stars may correlate with the time of year. If you were born during a particular season, say winter, then as an infant you may have been taken outside less often or had been held closer more often by your parents to keep you warm. These thin
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Also the age you enter school depends on whether you are born before or after some cut-off date. Being 11 months older than the youngest kid in the class (or vice versa) might have an effect on how you develop.
I know, typical <star sign redacted> theory :)
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...If you were born during a particular season, say winter, then as an infant you may have been taken outside less often or had been held closer more often by your parents to keep you warm. These things might actually have an effect upon your personality....
In America, time of year also determines whether you are the youngest in your first-grade class, or the oldest. This has impact on both physical and intellectual maturity. That could account for sun signs, which are basically just a place-holder for time of year.
But actual astrologers don't just look at your sun sign; that's newspaper-column astrology, not "real" astrology. They pay attention to what zodiac sign all of the planets are in, and what their angles are to each other ("aspect"), which one is a
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Cats born in winter usually are smaller as adults than those born in spring or summer ... obviously you can stick a star sign on that.
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Cats born in winter usually are smaller as adults than those born in spring or summer ... obviously you can stick a star sign on that.
What about cats born with Jupiter ascendent?
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It also helps that the personality descriptions associated with each sign are written such that they emphasize complementary traits so that everyone naturally thinks "yes, yes that is me of course."
Virgos are "friendly, intelligent." 99% of people who read that will think, "wow, what an accurate description of me, specifically!" Capricorns, by contrast, are "ambitious, practical." Yep, again, most people will identify with those traits. They are all like that...so nobody fits the description 100%, but e
Actually, astrology knows about this (Score:2)
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I thought it was something to do with the Moon being in the seventh house (whatever the fuck that is) and Mars aligning with Jupiter.
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It is accurate. But only if you currently live in ancient Greece.
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Your skepticism means you're probably a Scorpio.
Oh, no! (Score:3)
Good thing astrological signs are pure bullshit.
That being said, you still can't trust Giliacs.
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I once read a personal ad that sounded really promising. Then, at the end, it said, "person must be a Gemini" (or something like that).
Dafuq? Are you serious?
Glad we got that out of the way before I bothered responding.
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Frankly, it's about as odd as "person must have red hair". Though if you can't handle the possibility that your Soon-To-Be_SO might not agree with you 100% about everything, then it's better to find out sooner than later....
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>Dafuq? Are you serious?
Of course not.
Sirius is in Cancer, not Gemini . . .
[duck]
hawk
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Well, you might have actually missed out on something.
Crazy chicks are really FUN to fuck....no, you're not looking for a relation ship here, and yes, best to keep their hands in full eyesight the whole time, but whew....they are often one of the best rodeo rides you'll ever have.
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Crazy chicks are really FUN to fuck....no, you're not looking for a relation ship here, and yes, best to keep their hands in full eyesight the whole time, but whew....they are often one of the best rodeo rides you'll ever have.
True is true...just make sure you NEVER give them your real name or home address. NEH-VER. Understand?
If you do, things will end badly. Ask me how I know.
Re: Oh, no! (Score:2)
Re: Oh, NO! (Score:2)
Pray tell, how do you know...?
Because they get obsessed with you once you dump, ghost or fade from them. They try to call you 400 times a day, wait outside places you hang out or show up where you work.
Yep, they are a crazy fuck. Always wear a condom because they will try to trap you with a pregnancy. More so when you take the condom off, tie it off and flush it because yes they will go that far. If they trap you, your life will become a living hell.
Usually they are women who suffer from Borderline Personality Disorder, the bor
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Words of wisdom. Pretty much every single thing you said is true.
Crazy chicks are hell in bed, but they're also hell out of bed. They'll ruin your life and never give it a second thought.
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Pray tell, how do you know...?
Lets just say...things ended badly.
It's the kind of 'badly' where you wake up in a cold sweat wondering OMG, what the fuck have I done, what have I done?? Are you prepared to lose everything, and I mean everything? Your home, your job, your family, your freedom?
I was damn lucky to get away when I did, or god only knows what would have happened. It was bad but it could have been soooooooo much worse.
Read MrKaos' post below and realize that everything he said is true. If anything, he downplayed it.
Re: Oh, no! (Score:2)
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First of all this is true. Second most chicks and gay guys like to at least pretend paganism things and astrology are real even if they aren't crazy. Figuring that out and playing along with increase your getting laid success rate by a minimum of 10%
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Well, you might have actually missed out on something.
Yeah, years of stress. She was probably asking about star signs as a indicator of the prototype of personality she has had success in manipulating in absence of any other way to understand people.
Crazy chicks are really FUN to fuck....no, you're not looking for a relation ship here, and yes, best to keep their hands in full eyesight the whole time, but whew....they are often one of the best rodeo rides you'll ever have.
Only if you take proper precautions. [slashdot.org] Generally, just don't. Go skydiving instead, it's less risky.
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If this life really is a "simulation" as Elon Musk puts it, then it seems not so far fetched to think that there really are 12 or so distinct "base classes" from which every person born is derived from.
So far I've determined that Leo + Cancer doesn't work so well. Sample size of one.
If this is a simulation, I'd like some cheat codes please.
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The infinite money cheat gets a bit boring after a while, but you get to experience most of what the game has to offer.
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If this life really is a "simulation" as Elon Musk puts it,
Even if it is, so what?
We still have to live our lives in it as if it was real, so what difference does it make?
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Stop talking about simulation theory. If too many people catch on they will end the simulation.
If there was a button I could push that would do it, I'd push it so fast you wouldn't even see my hand move.
And none of us would ever even know it happened, so what's the problem?
Fancy that (Score:2)
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Granted that means you will have 300,000 people in the world having the same future as you would be having.
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I think Calvin from Calvin & Hobbes said it best.
April 13, 1992 [gocomics.com]
It isn't what I think? (Score:2)
Are we going to have a story about the efficacy of crystals next?
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Since you asked...
https://www.sciencealert.com/s... [sciencealert.com]
Finally! (Score:2)
Proof that horoscopes are flawed! Phew!
This was News for Nerds (Score:5, Informative)
... in 127 BC, which is when Hipparchus described the precession of the equinoxes in his book *On the Displacement of the Solsticial and Equinoctial Points and On the Length of the Year*.
Hipparchus demonstrated the precession of the equiboxes by comparing his positional data for Spica and Regulus with those of his predecessors. He also found a corresponding discrepancy between the length time it takes the sun to return to an equinox and the time it takes to return to a fixed star.
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True, this is not news at all, I know that my sign is Ophiuchus aka Serpentarius because of this.
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The real question is why the WSJ is even publishing this bullshit.
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Because they ripped it off from a live science article where the astronomers were bitching about how broken astrology is and WSJ figured if they stole it then it might get them a couple new subscribers.
https://www.livescience.com/9292-wobbly-earth-means-horoscope-wrong.html
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Some bohunk POW in WW1 figured out the three main cycles - that one plus orbital eccentricity and perihelion precession because, frankly, he had fuck all else to do for four years.
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Okay Hipparchus.
Re: This was News for Nerds (Score:2)
Made me laugh
I now can explain it (Score:1)
I knew I was really a Taurus even though I was always labeled as a Gemini since birth. I have self-identified as a Taurus for many years now and now I have scientific evidence that I was correct.
Suggested: Read "A Scheme of Heaven" (Score:5, Interesting)
If you want to read a fun and academic book on astrology, check out "A Scheme of Heaven: The History of Astrology and the Search for Our Destiny in Data"
by Alexander Boxer. He's a physicist out of MIT that takes a deep dive into the history of Astrology and it's consequences on modern life and science.
In the book he explains that what you know of as astrology today (your zodiac sign) was really just a recent thing produced for mass media. Your "real" ancient astrological horoscope that would have been calculated at your birth is much much more complicated.
Re:Suggested: Read "A Scheme of Heaven" (Score:4, Interesting)
Don't laugh too much at astrology. If the Catholic Church and other nobles in the middle ages didn't finance astrology science and mathematics as we know it probably would not exist.
Even modern Astrology gets stupid complex (Score:2)
Finally, some answers! (Score:2)
Now I know why my horoscope has been wrong all these years - the Earth's nutation screwed up the otherwise laser-accurate predictions! Damn Isaac Newton!
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Re:More details (Score:5, Informative)
This is slashdot. We want to know by how many degrees it is off. This per year, century and millenium. The fact that it is off is known for a long time. Last I remember is by onesign, so 1/12th or 39 degrees. [typo: should be 30] Not sure over what time period.
One sign per 2,150 years. Astronomically, the Sun moved over into the Age of Pisces in 68BC, so it won't shift to the Age of Aquarius until the year 2218. But astrologers differ (both with astronomers and with other astrologers.)
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I think your math is wrong. -68 + 2150 would be 2082.
Vedic Astrology and Sidereal Astrology (Score:2)
BTW, I'm the author of a few pieces of astrology software, including the website https://www.QuantumAstrology.com [quantumastrology.com] which provides free, daily Vedic Astrology predictions.
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both account this into their calculations in the same way that astronomers do. Typically Western Astrology doesn't. BTW, I'm the author of a few pieces of astrology software, including the website https://www.QuantumAstrology.com [quantumastrology.com] which provides free, daily Vedic Astrology predictions.
That's great to hear. I'll remember that when I'm losing my faculties and start thinking that things like astrology are worth pursuing.
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Have you read "A scheme of Heaven" yet?
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Gotta throw the word "quantum" in there for maximum woo [rationalwiki.org].
Ophiuchus (Score:2)
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Yup, that's me, I know this for years, and the rare time someone asks for my sign, I say Ophiuchus the Serpentarius
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John Sladek wrote a book about how the patriarchy was suppressing the truth about the 13th sign of the Zodiac.
He stopped writing about it when he discovered that too many people didn't understand that it was satirical.
Phases of a year (Score:5, Interesting)
I think we all agree - it's hard to argue that the stars control our personality.
Now with that said, you could absolutely argue that some of your personality comes from when in a year you're born. hink about the things in our society that are cyclical around the solar year. School years, holidays, vacations. Seasons too.
If you were born just before the beginning of the school year, you're almost a year younger/smaller than your classmates who were born just after the beginning of the school year.
If you were born near Christmas, you probably got stiffed on gifts because you got combo christmas/birthday presents. If you were born in the summer, fewer friends might be around to attend your birthday parties.
So do the stars affect our personalities? Nah probably not. But maybe our brithday does.
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If you were born near Christmas, you probably got stiffed on gifts because you got combo christmas/birthday presents. If you were born in the summer, fewer friends might be around to attend your birthday parties. ....
For me it was opposite as every one claimed my little brother would not grasp it and would be jealous.
And on my birthday, no one was available for party as no one goes to a birthday party just after christmas and most were away on holidays skiing anyway
Actually it became common that families he
Never forget... (Score:2)
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I am wishing Betelgeuse's supernova reaches us in our lifetimes.
This is not new "news" (Score:2)
I remember hearding someone talk about this back when I was a kid, and I'm in my 50s.
Do I need all this science (Score:2)
To say that astrology is totally bullsh|t?
Nope! It's enough to look at those who believe in it, without even taking Earth rotation in consideration!
Middle Age Man (Score:2)
Mod Points (Score:2)
Can anyone tell me how to use my modpoints to vote this story as troll?
Kidding, not kidding.
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If you want to read that much into it, sure. The article in no way suggests your sign influences your behavior or future though.
Or is that what's bugging you?
It only points out the discrepancy; that the moment you are born, the sun is in front of any one of 12 constellations that line up along the elliptic (from Earth's perspective) known as the zodiac (Greek for "zoo") which traditionally indicated your "(sun)sign"; and this article, which seems to come around about once a year because people have short m
Not a duplicate, exactly... (Score:2)
But this is old, old news. That the astrological zodiac is now one full constellation off because of accumulated precession is long-term common knowledge. Old but slightly more recent news is that the poor souls who are born under Cetus and Ophiuchus get skunked (no, there isn't a constellation Mephitidus) completely.
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Not necessarily. There is no widely accepted astrological zodiac constellation boundaries. There is no firm authority on where one constellation ends and another begins. Further, the constellations are not equal sizes.
So, you are quite wrong as is the original post.
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Constellation boundaries have been mapped and highly specific since the nineteenth century and before, so that astronomers can name objects by location. And precession is what causes the celestial poles to appear to move in large circles across the sky, at the same time changing the position of the ecliptic. In Egyptian times, Thuban (Alpha Draconis) was the north star.
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That the astrological zodiac is now one full constellation off because of accumulated precession is long-term common knowledge. ...
Nope. Precession is exactly how "ages" work. There is nothing off regarding precession.
We have a new zodiac sign because the sun, and that means the whole solar system is traveling through space. Has nothing to do with precession at all
If the universe were a machine... (Score:2)
If the universe were a machine I paid for, I'd go back to the maker and demand my money back.
This is the most broken-ass clock I've ever seen, it can't keep time fer shit!
Age of Aquarius (Score:2)
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The Pope wears Versace slippers because this is the age of fuckery.
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The fish is the symbol of Christianity and the Pope wears the shoes of the fisherman because that was beginning of the Age of Pisces the Fish. ... can't be so hard ...
Nope, Jesus was a Fisher
Seriously? (Score:3)
Seriously, what kind of ninny still believes in this shit?
yo, what's your sign? (Score:2)
The way I would debunk astrology (Score:2)
There was a fad for astrology when I was in college, and I read up on it a bit. I even got my horoscope done by a professional astrologer. (I can't be sure of course, but I think the guy was sincere, not a charlatan.)
Anyway, whenever somebody wants to debunk astrology they bring up this stuff about the wobble of the earth's axis, which I think is, well, missing the obvious. The thing to do is to look at the lives of 'astral twins'. Check hospital records, find where two babies were born in the same hos
Sigh (Score:2)
In case you aren't into paywalled articles here is coverage of the same thing.
https://www.livescience.com/9292-wobbly-earth-means-horoscope-wrong.html
So here are the "real" dates of astrological signs, according to astronomers:
Capricorn: Jan. 20-Feb. 16.
Aquarius: Feb. 16-March 11.
Pisces: March 11-April 18.
Aries: April 18-May 13.
Taurus: May 13-June 21.
Gemini: June 21-July 20.
Cancer: July 20-Aug. 10.
Leo: Aug. 10-Sept. 16.
Virgo: Sept. 16-Oct. 30.
Libra: Oct. 30-Nov. 23.
Scorpio: Nov. 23-29.
Ophiuchus: Nov. 29-Dec
It's not? (Score:2)
Really? I'm shocked. Because so far I thought astrology is a bunch of bullshit. It's not?
You can simulate this is Stellarium (Score:2)
4 centuries of realizing NA isn't India (Score:2)
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Petrichor
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Pleb. Everyone knows it'a a d100.
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The problem as I see it is just pointing out precession messes with signs a bit is still playing the game. "Oh, astrology is real-ish, you've just got your labels off, silly Rabbit."
How about the fact that there are thirteen constellations in the band, but for some reason they dropped one (Ophiuchus - I'm probably spelling that wrong) , and tried to evenly distribute the remaining 12 across the night sky, as if they're in perfect portions? Nope, even that's playing the game.
The real objection, like Morpheus
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Bet you are a hit at parties.