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EPA Plans To Waive Some Compliance Requirements Amid Coronavirus Crisis (wsj.com) 108

Posted by msmash from the tussle-continues dept.
The Environmental Protection Agency is planning to waive compliance requirements and deadlines for a range of industries, including oil refiners, water utilities and sewage plants, as it seeks to help businesses affected by the coronavirus pandemic, according to Trump administration officials. From a report: The biggest change likely will be to waive or postpone coming deadlines to switch to cleaner-burning summer-grade gasoline, according to administration officials and a business lobbyist. Several states have already issued waivers or said they won't enforce them, an analyst said. And many have asked EPA to step in to clarify nationally, according to one administration official. The EPA is preparing to act following an onslaught of requests from businesses and state regulators seeking help, according to the administration officials, who expect the decision to be announced this week. Any action is expected to be scrutinized by environmental groups concerned that the EPA and business groups will take advantage of the situation to skirt environmental regulations. Under President Trump, the EPA has moved to amend environmental policies that the White House views as overly harmful to business.
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EPA Plans To Waive Some Compliance Requirements Amid Coronavirus Crisis More

EPA Plans To Waive Some Compliance Requirements Amid Coronavirus Crisis

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  • Morons. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by WindBourne ( 631190 ) on Wednesday March 25, 2020 @10:28AM (#59870036) Journal
    The last place that you allow pollution from is large companies. They amount quickly overtakes society. Look at America in the 60s, China in the 90s, 00s, and now. If you are going to relax pollution to help businesses, do it on start-ups and small amounts of pollution.

    • Re: (Score:2, Informative)

      by CaffeinatedBacon ( 5363221 )

      The last place that you allow pollution from is large companies. They amount quickly overtakes society. Look at America in the 60s, China in the 90s, 00s, and now. If you are going to relax pollution to help businesses, do it on start-ups and small amounts of pollution.

      Did you even read the summary? Or have any idea what you're talking about?

      including oil refiners, water utilities and sewage plants,

      How many startup sewage plants do you know about? How about startup water utilities?
      There must be a few startup oil refineries though right?

      • I love how /.ers who get their panties in a bunch when people suggest programming is easy, or say dumb things about computers are suddenly petroleum engineering and logistics experts.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Uberbah ( 647458 )

        Did you even read the summary? Or have any idea what you're talking about?

        Far more than you, apparently. Try actually reading his post and try again?

        • Actually, he is a Chinese troll that posts under multiple IDs, as well as AC. Sadly, he does not have morals or intelligence.
        • LOL Do you also think a temporary waiver of complying with regulations during a pandemic crisis will turn American pollution back to the 60's.
          • Yep. Countries are seeing air quality improvements as manufacturing shuts down.

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by Uberbah ( 647458 )

            If you're obnoxiously obtuse, I suppose you could see it that way. It's not that this will turn the entire atmosphere polluted or whatever straw man you were going for. It means we could easily have more Super Fund sites or poisoned rivers. [ohiovalleyresource.org]

            • Delaying the change over to summer-grade gasoline will create poisoned rivers? Really. Better tell those scientists.
              Do you think they just dump the extra winter-grade gasoline into a river?

              I was replying to this well known moron [slashdot.org] who claimed

              The last place that you allow pollution from is large companies. They amount quickly overtakes society. Look at America in the 60s,

              If that's who your willing to defend, be my guest.

      • The last place that you allow pollution from is large companies. They amount quickly overtakes society. Look at America in the 60s, China in the 90s, 00s, and now. If you are going to relax pollution to help businesses, do it on start-ups and small amounts of pollution.

        Did you even read the summary? Or have any idea what you're talking about?

        including oil refiners, water utilities and sewage plants,

        How many startup sewage plants do you know about? How about startup water utilities?

        There must be a few startup oil refineries though right?

        You're kind of backing up his point, you're suggesting there aren't any?

        Then why are we easing regulatory burdens for large, established industries?

        Does big oil need a bailout? At least have the balls to ask for it instead of beating around the bushes.

    • Never let a good crisis go to waste (Score:4, Insightful)

      by rsilvergun ( 571051 ) on Wednesday March 25, 2020 @12:20PM (#59870404)
      that's the American way. Expect there to be some general nastiness here and there. Several GOP governors have used this crisis to shut down abortion clinics.

      • that's the American way. Expect there to be some general nastiness here and there. Several GOP governors have used this crisis to shut down abortion clinics.

        It ain't just the Reps...the Dems too.

        Heck, look at the house what all crap they were trying to squeeze into the virus aid bill.....funding for the Kennedy center?

        Seriously?

        I mean in a time of crisis, people out of work, pandemic....they add bullshit in there like that to a much needed stimulus bill that needs to move?

        That one is the most outlandis

        • Re: (Score:1)

          by Anonymous Coward

          >both sides
          you guys only have 1 side: the billionaires side.

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by ranton ( 36917 )

          Heck, look at the house what all crap they were trying to squeeze into the virus aid bill.....funding for the Kennedy center?

          There was funding for the arts in both Senate and House bills, although in different amounts. The National Endowment for the Arts and Humanities for instance were proposed to receive $300 million each by Democrats and $100 million each by Republicans. Unless you are just getting your outrage from Bill Johnson's tweets (and probably Fox News' reporting on them) you should be able to realize there are 5.1 million jobs associated with arts and culture in 2017. The arts and humanities are not something to ignor

      • You -do- know the "never let a crisis go to waste" is a Dem quote, right?

        https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Rahm_Emanuel#2000s

        Educate yourself.

      • Some other governors have tried to shut down gun shops. A freedom-minded compromise is to allow both to remain open.

    • Here is a sample of the rigamarole refiners have to go through to comply.

      According to ExxonMobil, there are at least 14 unique types of summer-grade fuel sold nationwide. While the majority of states fill up with conventional 9.0-psi RVP gasoline, refiners must produce blends that are oxygenated, to reduce carbon monoxide; reformulated, in 17 states, to further reduce ozone and smog-forming toxins; for California only; and more. It gets trickier with ethanol. Since 97 percent of all gasoline sold contains ethanol—and, according to the American Petroleum Institute, ethanol blended up to 10 percent results in gasoline with a 10.0-psi RVP—the EPA counts such blends, called E10, as meeting the 9.0-psi standard. But many states, including the entire Northeastern seaboard from Delaware to Maine, don’t cut ethanol any slack. So gasoline refiners must be creative to reduce summer gas volatility, and creativity is expensive.

      https://www.caranddriver.com/n... [caranddriver.com]

      • Yes, but they have the cash to not pollute. Keep in mind that society is stuck with the costs of these. I do not mind a small amount of pollution to create a startup, but once they are going, they need to be responsible for their actions. It is as crazy as companies pushing for no tax, no minimum wage, but then want gov. To feed and take care of their workers. Good example is Amazon. Bezo is now asking others including the gov. to cover his employees health care.
        • No, actually with oil down around $30 a barrel from the Saudi/Russia oil price war, American energy companies are super fucked and are going to have to shutdown most/all of their US based production. If you think the oil companies are in great shape then put your money down and buy some energy company stocks right now. You'll get wiped out.

        • I do not mind a small amount of pollution to create a startup,

          FFS you're clueless.
          Who is going to create a startup petroleum refinery in the middle of a pandemic where everyone is sheltering in place?

  • If they're open enough to pollute... (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Thruen ( 753567 ) on Wednesday March 25, 2020 @10:42AM (#59870066)
    If these business are up and running enough that they're generating this pollution, what's stopping them from following through with all these commitments they already had? "The biggest change likely will be to waive or postpone coming deadlines to switch to cleaner-burning summer-grade gasoline," seriously they can't manage to switch to a cleaner gasoline despite remaining open? I'm not subscribed to WSJ, somebody please tell me there's at least a major availability issue or something cited in the article to justify this.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Junta ( 36770 )

      I've no idea how much they may have automated, or how much the changeover requires more people than usual to come together to do the work. It may be the case that they have optimized day to day so that very few people are required to keep a facility open, except for the process to reconfigure.

      It certainly warrants scrutiny to make sure it is not some excuse, but it's plausible that there is a good cause for this specific postponement. Fortunately, all the people staying home happens to give them some marg

    • There's tons of gas filling up tanks at refineries that is winter grade. What would you like them to do with it?

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Thruen ( 753567 )
        A few years ago, we had the opposite problem, they had more summer fuel than they would need months before it was time to switch to making winter. They just started making the winter fuel early. The switch from winter to summer production normally happens in April, they could switch now, though they should've already switched as it's not like the global economy just started slowing down yesterday. If they didn't, that's really their own responsibility, and they can eat the costs of having to deal with it. E
        • The whole summer blend thing is an archaic 90s law that was passed to address US automakers not able to pass emissions standards that are now completely eclipsed. The amount of pollution that will be released is minimal.

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by Thruen ( 753567 )
            Citation please? Not saying you're wrong, just seems to me like the oil industry is constantly lobbying the government for things, and if this is really no big deal they would've been lobbying against it already since it costs them money to switch over. I did a quick search and didn't find anything agreeing with you, but obviously you have a source or you wouldn't have said it, so can you link it please?
            • The oil industry makes just as much money with summer blend as winter blend since everyone has to comply, that is how regulatory capture works.

              • Re: (Score:2)

                by Thruen ( 753567 )
                What? No, that is absolutely not how it works. Everyone spending money on the same thing does not mean they make just as much money as if they didn't, it just means everyone spends money on the same thing. It's exactly why industries band together against regulations they perceive as unfair, because compliance typically costs money. And you still haven't cited anything to support your argument that the difference between using winter and summer blends would be minimal. I am disappointed, entertain me better

      • There's tons of gas filling up tanks at refineries that is winter grade. What would you like them to do with it?

        I guess they could just burn it.......

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by sinij ( 911942 )

        There's tons of gas filling up tanks at refineries that is winter grade. What would you like them to do with it?

        My understanding is that there is no such thing "tons of ... winter grade". Refineries produce 100% gasoline, then prior to shipping add various additives that make it winter or summer gas. Summer gas is more expensive, mostly due to mandate for ethanol content. Winter gas has less or none as in extreme cold it doesn't flow well.

    • The biggest change likely will be to waive or postpone coming deadlines to switch to cleaner-burning summer-grade gasoline," seriously they can't manage to switch to a cleaner gasoline despite remaining open?

      They can't change the productions facilities with a flip of the switch.

      They actually shut down for days and a lot happens before they can come back up online with the different formulations.

      it isn't just machines either...requires manpower which may be in short supply lately.

  • example (Score:4, Interesting)

    by bugs2squash ( 1132591 ) on Wednesday March 25, 2020 @10:55AM (#59870086)
    It would be interesting to me to see an example of a regulation that prevents a substantial amount of polution, that has been made substantially harder to meet because of the pandemic and that presents an unreasonable burden in this specific timeframe. Without examples my hunch is that this is just abusing a health crisis to push an agenda that has been lobbied for rather than addressing a genuine need.
    • The winter and summer gasoline formulations [aaa.com] are different to reduce pollution. The winter formulation burns better in colder temperatures, the summer formulation cleaner in warmer temperatures. However, contrary to what you see in The Walking Dead, you can't use gasoline which has been sitting for months or years. As anyone who's tried to start a gas lawn mower after the winter knows, it goes bad after about 6-12 months. Some of the more volatile components start to break down, causing it to burn poorly
  • what is next? Funding of wall with Mexico to stop Covid-19?

    • Re: (Score:2, Interesting)

      by sinij ( 911942 )
      Not to defend Trump on this, but considering that Mexico is still not on lock-down [mexiconewsdaily.com], shit about to hit the fan big times over there. In two weeks there will be massive Mexican refugee caravans trying to go North to escape COVID. So a sturdy wall would have been very helpful to keep them out.

      • Not to defend Trump on this, but considering that Mexico is still not on lock-down [mexiconewsdaily.com], shit about to hit the fan big times over there. In two weeks there will be massive Mexican refugee caravans trying to go North to escape COVID. So a sturdy wall would have been very helpful to keep them out.

        Joining massive caravan ... to escape viral epidemic.

        Stop trolling please, it makes no sense that that motivation would cause that behavior.

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by sinij ( 911942 )
          Yes, because epidemic with 10% expected casualty rate in an unmitigated scenario will also have a good chance to shut down infrastructure as people start panicking. Caravans won't be about escaping epidemic, but escaping collateral damage due to epidemic.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Uberbah ( 647458 )

        Not if the USA is ahead of Mexico on infections.I would expect more people to try and head where its hot as the virus doesn't do well over 80 degrees.

      • ?massive Mexican refugee caravans

        peeeeeeeeep

        arf arf woof

  • This is euphemism for adding ethanol to gasoline. Doing so is costly, as ethanol cost more. Doing so reduces mileage by about 10%, as ethanol is not as energy dense. Doing so makes gas spoil sooner, as ethanol absorbs water and separates, reducing octane rating of fuels in only couple months of sitting. Doing so increases failures of internal systems as ethanol is highly corrosive and attacks metal and gaskets.
    • The whole ethanol thing was a bogus deal with automakers in the 90s because the cars weren't passing emissions standards of the times and has zero bearing on newer less polluting cars.

      • Re: (Score:3)

        by sinij ( 911942 )
        This is not entirely true, adding ethanol to gasoline (2-3%) does make combustion cleaner and slightly reduces emissions. More ethanol does not make it even more clean, so anywhere from 2% to 15% ethanol is about the same insofar as emissions. however, at around 10% ethanol a lot of bad things start happening mechanically inside the engine and fuel delivery system - this is because ethanol is a strong solvent and degreaser. For example, ethanol will wash off oil from cylinder walls making your pistons go me
        • What part of what I stated is not entirely true? Cars now are far cleaner than the 90s even without ethanol. I am guessing that with the sophisticated sensors in modern cars, they adjust for the ethanol and the net effect is zero.

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by sinij ( 911942 )
            The part where you stated: " has zero bearing on newer less polluting cars." It isn't zero.

  • It's a conservatives-driven trap (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Rick Schumann ( 4662797 ) on Wednesday March 25, 2020 @12:13PM (#59870366) Journal
    Sure, sure. 'Ease' compliance in the face of a disaster. Then, when the disaster passes (and it will), they'll quietly, conveniently decide to leave the lack of compliance in place, becoming the de-facto new standard. Just like the anti-abortion groups demanding abortion clinics close 'temporarily'; if they get their way, once this all passes, they'll demand they stay closed.
    This is all Old Playbook stuff: leverage a disaster/crisis situation to slide in things from your agenda; who's going to notice? Do it all quietly enough and no one will notice because they're all running around waving their arms in the air and screaming in terror over whatever.
    • Not a conservative tactic. Politicians of every persuasion will do this if they can: "You never let a serious crisis go to waste. And what I mean by that it's an opportunity to do things you think you could not do before." Rahm Emanuel

  • Can anyone clue me in? (Score:3)

    by Opportunist ( 166417 ) on Wednesday March 25, 2020 @12:18PM (#59870392)

    What does one have to do with the other?

    • Psychopaths smelling an opportunity.

    • The tl;dr: The supply chain currently has an oversupply of winter gas due to no one using it. Regulations prevent winter gas from being sold after May 1st and summer gas from being sold before April 1st (which is why they didn't want to switch production over too early).
      Shifting the May 1st deadline prevents the gasoline companies from having to burn the extra gas to make room for the summer grade one.

  • What could possibly go wrong?!

  • If about 70% of ALL government regulations were done away with!

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