A Record 6.6 Million Americans Filed For Unemployment Last Week (nbcnews.com) 277
A record 6.6 million Americans filed for unemployment benefits last week, the latest brutal reminder of the toll the coronavirus pandemic is taking on the U.S. economy. From a report: Analysts had predicted a jobless claims total of anywhere between 3 million and 6 million, after huge numbers of businesses across the country were forced to close down due to the need for social distancing, leaving millions of Americans without work. Thursday's figure eclipses even the record-shattering 3.28 million jobless claims from the week before, the first real marker of the number of people out of work, according to data released last week by the Department of Labor for the period ending March 21. Still, some economists said the actual number of unemployed could be much higher, since many applicants had experienced trouble filing a claim, as state labor departments became overwhelmed. "These are numbers that are way out of the range that we have seen," Michelle Meyer, head of U.S. economics at Bank of America, told NBC News. "During the financial crisis, we were seeing a peak of about 650,000 [first-time applications] a week."
Bye bye health insurance (Score:5, Insightful)
We love having our employer pay for our insurance. And when we lose that job, why, we can use COBRA to pay the full price of that insurance. While unemployed. God bless capitalism!
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We love having our employer pay for our insurance. And when we lose that job, why, we can use COBRA to pay the full price of that insurance. While unemployed. God bless capitalism!
My company did a pay, er, ahem, hour cut (I guess there's a difference?), but also allowed for people to take LOAs and apply for unemployment without contesting it and would continue to provide benefits while you were on the LOA. But with the wife already on disability (and therefor reduced income) for just giving birth (her company doesn't provide maternity leave) I couldn't risk the very real possibility of being on less than half our income for a month by taking the LOA and getting denied unemployment.
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I think I know where you work, as my company has the exact same setup. I'm waiting for the first month of LOAs to pass so I can see if they got their unemployment approved or not before deciding to take May off as an LOA.
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Unemployment benefits have been increased by $600/week as part of the recent stimulus bill.
I have concerns about employers "pretending" a worker is unemployed by "agreeing not to challenge unemployment claims" made by workers that opt for a leave of absence... That sounds like the kind of thing that will bite them in the end - seasonal workers file for unemployment after being actually fired when there's no more work, an employee choosing to take a leave of absence doesn't qualify as "unemployment" in the l
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I have concerns about employers "pretending" a worker is unemployed by "agreeing not to challenge unemployment claims" made by workers that opt for a leave of absence... That sounds like the kind of thing that will bite them in the end - seasonal workers file for unemployment after being actually fired when there's no more work, an employee choosing to take a leave of absence doesn't qualify as "unemployment" in the legal sense, I suspect.
That's what I was worried about. If I could get unmployment, that plus the $600 week would probably come out monthly to about what I am making while working with my 25% cut. But I expect a lot of the voluntary leaves won't get approved.
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From everyone who I have met in my lifetime. There is only a small handful of people willing to scam the unemployment and welfare system.
Employers especially those who often will need to face public scrutiny if they are saying they had laid off more workers then absolutely necessary.
When they begin to hire again, they will need to convince the public that they are a safe place to work. Having a higher than normal layoff rate doesn't help.
Back in 2008, I worked for a company that laid off half its workforce
Re:Bye bye health insurance (Score:5, Insightful)
Every time you see a TV show about people on benefits or an article about some benefits scam remember that it's probably just trying to trick you in to voting against your own safety net for the benefit of people who will never need it. All that anger you feel is just pushing to vote for the policies *they* want.
It's not an LOA (Score:2, Flamebait)
It's just that we've stopped using the words "furlough" and "laid off" in their literal sense because nobody wants to say the "F" word ("Fired").
The point isn't that there isn't work to do, it's that the employees should not be going to work. Period.
You are correct though, our system of unemployment and social welfare isn't set up to stop a global pandemic. These people could technically go to work so that you didn't have to pa
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Or the state could provide healthcare like in other less psychopathic western countries .......
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I was helping someone try to submit their unemployment claims, since they are elderly and don't have a true computer.
I was confronted with a nifty little web interface that looked as if it hadn't been updated since about 1995-6....and specifically mentioned it likely wouldn't work with mobile devices and works BEST with MS Internet Explorer and possible Mozilla Firefox.
I got everything filled in and hit the sub
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You obviously haven't used private health care software such as Epic if you think the private industry is doing a good job modernizing. And Epic is one of the good ones in that industry.
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Re:Bye bye health insurance (Score:5, Informative)
No, that's the Republican Party's notion of government. They've underfunded parts of the budget for years and now those parts are weak. Whenever a proposal comes along to fund those parts better, the Republicans honk on about waste and abuse and taxes, apparently they cannot be raised lest legions of Satan's devils are unleashed.
And now they campaign, like your complaint, that the Fed. Gov. doesn't work.
Re:Bye bye health insurance (Score:5, Insightful)
Right... the same massively understaffed government workers. I mean, what did you think all the tax breaks for the rich were about, just giving them more money?
For that matter, they've massively cut IRS staffing, so the percentage of big companies and wealthy individuals getting audited is... someday.
This is what downsizing the government means - when you need it, the staff's not there.
You voted GOP, you voted for this incompetence, negligence, and understaffing.
But you're probably too young to remember the nineties, when even the WSJ, I think it was, said that downsizing wasn't about "rightsizing", it was about Wall St. rewarding the CEO's stock options.
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The decline of the IRS started a decade ago, when Obama was president, with his party completely in control the first two years, a split congress for the next four, and republican control for the last two. Blaming republicans seems disingenuous at best. You can see the slope here [irs.gov].
A better thought would be "automation has made many employees redundant, and the current tax code is far simpler for most non-corporate filers, with the size of the standard deduction making itemization a rare thing" but that is
MUMPS (not state controled is bad as well) (Score:2)
https://thedailywtf.com/articl... [thedailywtf.com]
https://thedailywtf.com/articl... [thedailywtf.com]
https://thedailywtf.com/articl... [thedailywtf.com]
https://thedailywtf.com/articl... [thedailywtf.com]
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The difference is that when government doesn't provide you something, it's because they were denied the resources to provide it. When CORPORATIONS deny you something, it's because they'd rather you die than risk the
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Cherry picked bullshit. Like private sector workers are somehow infallible. My mom's insurance tried to screw her when she got pancreatic cancer. Luckily, she had a friend in the UK who let her stay there. The UK took care of her even though she wasn't a citizen, when our own capitalist vultures cut her loose.
I work for the state I live in, and nobody I work with is lazy or incompetent. Stop spreading malicious lies about state workers.
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I believe that was the FDA.
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Funny, I was about to comment :
"Still.....better than having Hillary".
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Except it couldn't possible be worse than Trump. Someday, his supporters are going to have to come to terms with the fact that they elected a sociopathic, narcissistic, senile, incompetent who bankrupted every business he ever touched. Reality will force that realization on you. There will come a day when you don't have the option to remain deluded, because something finally hits close enough to home for you.
Re:Bye bye health insurance (Score:5, Insightful)
She would probably have left the pandemic team in Wuhan that Obama put there to monitor for outbreaks.
She would probably have had the domestic pandemic response team that she hadn't disbanded advise her about testing and isolation rather than just shutting down plan travel to one country and saying problem solved.
She probably would have shortened the economic shutdown by starting it earlier so the virus dies out faster.
She probably would have realized that the "WHO-designed tests" are actually a German design which worked extremely successfully for them, and not blocked independent manufacture in order to ensure her son-in-law's biotech firm got the contract.
She probably would have paid attention to experts on the matter, which again she wouldn't have previously fired, instead of assuming (against all evidence) that she was the smartest person in the room.
Messes happen. But being prepared for them, having the right team in place, and leading the country competently through them can make a huge different. There is absolutely no reason why so many Americans had to die now, just like there was no reason thousands of Americans had to die in Puerto Rico or any of Trumps other messes. She's probably the most competent person to run for the office in ages. But emails!
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The biggest problem I see with Single-Payer Health care is the fact that the Government is going to penny-pinch (often in a Penny Wise and Pound Foolish method)
Health Care institutions will often run at cost with Medicare, and below cost with Medicaid, meaning your private insurance companies are being charged for the cut in costs for the Government Services.
A single-payer system will need to make sure its fee schedules will allow Health Care systems to grow, expand, modernize and prosper. Now, this should
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Are you insane? You think the government will penny pinch more than insurance? We already have death squads, bud. They are called insurance adjusters and they want your granny to die so they don't have to pay for her meds.
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That would cut into the freedom of the people to choose whether they want to live or not. We can't have that, that could lead to socialism.
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"it’s in the hands of God" - Hobby Lobby CEO David Green after laying off employees without offering a severance or insurance.
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Good news from god. He told Hobby Lobby to open back up https://slate.com/news-and-pol... [slate.com]
Re:Bye bye health insurance (Score:5, Insightful)
Good news from god. He told Hobby Lobby to open back up https://slate.com/news-and-pol... [slate.com]
Gotta pay for more of those fake Dead Sea Scroll fragments somehow.
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You also have 90 days to sign up for cobra benefits.
So a furloughed worker can "coast" for a couple months, only paying the actual cost (employee + employer portions) of their coverage if and when they actually need the coverage. Of course they have to pay for back coverage from when they lost their job.
Also, remember, losing your healthcare coverage from your employer instantly makes you eligible for one of those "don't worry, the Democrats have your back" PPACA healthcare plans (AKA Obamacare), so no worr
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PPACA healthcare plans ....you mean the ones provided for by the law that Trump and his goons are attempting to get the Supreme Court to declare unconstitutional? The plan that Trump decided didn't need to extend open enrollment so the people screwed could get unscrewed? Damn, what a baby Christian.
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Oh, we're all eligible for the same ACA plans? Unless you live in a red state that has screwed it's citizens. I'm lucky, I live in a blue state but I pity the red staters who lose their jobs and can't pay COBRA.
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Fallacy #2: Private option is significantly different from public option. Health insurance in the USA is a disaster. Private, public, doesn't matter. You're a sheep to be sheared unless you own a million shares of United Health Group.
Falla
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#1 Waiting for a few hours for a bed in an overcrowded hospital is not nearly the same as waiting 10-12 hours in an ambulance outside an ER waiting to be admitted into an NHS hospital, because the hospital has to have every patient, once admitted, be seen by a doctor within 60 minutes. The only way to achieve that is to throttle admissions at the door.
#2 75% of Americans were happy with their private care before Obamacare, now the number is closer to 50%, and is artificially propped up because major groups,
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just show up sick at the ER with an fake name / ID
Re: Bye bye health insurance (Score:3)
You know Americans give to charity at higher rates than any other nation? Not exactly the avatars of selfishness. But go on with your nationalistic bigotry, please.
Re: Bye bye health insurance (Score:2)
Citation needed....
https://www.forbes.com/sites/niallmccarthy/2019/10/15/the-countries-where-the-most-people-donate-money-to-charity-infographic/#3ff43af7323d
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]
I mean, the forbes link is a self-reporting AMOUNT of people donating, with no mention of how much is donated.
I could totally be wrong about my link provided as well - I have very little skin in this game, I don't care, and I've never researched it, but providing only the first Forbes link seems at best, misleading.
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The US does donate the most, even as a percentage of GDP, but that also has something to do with the taxing structure in the US. As another Forbes article posted here has already pointed out, the average US citizen does not donate at a high rate compared to many other countries. But we do donate a lot to churches (32% of our donations). We also give tax breaks to donations, so a number of services which are paid for by taxes in most developed countries are instead covered (less universally) by non-profits.
O
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On top of all that, a nation with more wealth would tend to donate more even as a percentage of their wealth. Donating 10% of your income when making a $40k salary is a much greater sacrifice than donating 20% of your income when making $400k. I would certainly consider the first individual the more charitable of the two (even though I would still give props to the latter).
And yet people act like billionaires are super charitable when they give a million dollars to something, despite being less than 0.1% of their net worth. Even the ones who seem really charitable now like Bill Gates spent decades hoarding all their wealth to become the richest man in the world. So that's my game plan too, first I'll become the richest man in the world then I'll become a philanthropist. Still working on step one.
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The effectiveness of the charity is often dubious.
A lot of it is political donations where people use it to gain influence with people in power.
A lot will go to religious institutions that may vary on the level of good it does. Will it go to buy more food for the shelter, or will it go to give the Pastor a private jet so he could "spread the word of God".
Also, a charity may not get to the people who are in need, because there are some things that may tug the heartstrings.
Eg. During Christmas the giving tre
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If you voted for Bernie it would be even MORE FREE and much better.
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That'd be the guy who couldn't take office until next January and would still need both Congress and the Senate to pass any legislation reforming the medical system? Yeah that would have saved you.
Re:Bye bye health insurance (Score:5, Interesting)
That is simply untrue. Unemployed are NOT necessarily eligible for Medicare or Medicaid. You MAY be eligible for a low cost ACA plan. If you live in a blue state that isn't fighting tooth and nail against "Obamacare."
Medicare is for the elderly only. Medicaid is for the disabled. Neither is for the healthy, young unemplyed.
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The problem with people hoarding money during the great depression as faith in banks had dropped became a big problem. Frozen wages was a good way to make sure that money was moving in the system. After a particular level, we can sit on more money (especially with 1940's sensibilities). Health Insurance and other benefits are given to attract more employees to keep the money flowing, especially as Health Insurance benefits means money if flowing from the Company to another one who is hiring employees to ma
I am one (Score:5, Informative)
I am one of them on furlough. was for 2 weeks but they extended it a lot longer. first time I have ever filed for unemployment. fortunately the company is letting us keep their health insurance. unfortunately, the past premiums will come out of out checks when we return. that 600 extra a week unemployment sure will come in handy to help with that.
I don't think anyone could have predicted this - especially the unemployment rate. I knew it was happening in China but figured it would be like the last time when the swine flu was a problem. did not think so many to be out of work. I just wonder how many businesses will reopen after this.
Re:I am one (Score:5, Insightful)
I don't think anyone could have predicted this
The unemployment was unpredictable. That Americans would get screwed by it due to lack of social safety net and that the medical system is a financial burden on all but the privileged, that was a given.
I hope a lot of republicans are affected. They may actually realise that the free market solution to everything is every bit as stupid as foreigners mock Americans for over abusing.
Re:I am one (Score:5, Interesting)
I hope a lot of republicans are affected. They may actually realise that the free market solution to everything is every bit as stupid as foreigners mock Americans for over abusing.
Based on what I see on Facebook, which admittedly is limited in scope, that is definitely not happening. My longtime best friend is a conservative Republican and he is very disillusioned with how Trump has handled things, but he seems to be the exception to the rule. Most of what I see on Facebook is how every bit of this is really the Democrats' fault because "Obama!" and Trump has zero responsibility. I'm also seeing a lot of skepticism on how bad this really is. And I keep hearing that Trump's approval rating has never been higher in his presidency. so I don't think anybody in the Cult of Trump has learned anything from this.
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One thing is clear, Americans are stubbornly stuck in an us-vs-them debate that will never end. Trump's approval ratings are almost at an all time high (they were briefly higher when he just came into power), but then look through the past several years and what can you see:
Trump starts major international crisis
Trump solves major international crisis
Trump does something highly popular and highly regarded by his own party, and not necessarily disagreed by democrats.
Trump was impeached.
Trump presided over an
Multiple doctors and epidemiologists predicted it (Score:5, Insightful)
The government has known since Bush Jr that a pandemic was coming and we were critically short of ventilators. A plan was put in place during the Obama administration to create a national stockpile. The government would buy them for $3k/each from a medical supply company.
One of the larger medical supply companies, who sells them for $10k/each, didn't like that. They bought out the smaller company and shelved the project [threadreaderapp.com]
Doctors were shouting to anybody who would listen back in December about this pandemic. They've been saying since the early 2000s that a pandemic like this was coming. There were no shortage of them clamoring for China to regulate the Wet Markets. And there were plenty saying that wouldn't be enough, that the increase in travel would mean even with the wet markets closed or regulated this still was going to happen.
We stopped listening to experts. This is the result. Why did we stop? Because the people in power need you to see them as your only source for objective truth. This is a classic technique of dictators and cults. And while it's debatable [duckduckgo.com] if our current rulers fall into that category [bbc.com] I think it's pretty clear they at least use the tactic of discrediting experts in order to set themselves up as the single source of Truth.
It doesn't help that our News Media is basically turned into an arm of the mega corporations [duckduckgo.com]
One last thing I should add (Score:3)
You should also realize that the top 1% will more than likely be untouched by this. A few of them might not, but most will come out unscathed. That's important, because on
Re:I am one (Score:4, Insightful)
I don't think anyone could have predicted this - especially the unemployment rate
WTF? You close restaurants/bars/etc and even if the small bus could afford to pay the wages, a huge part of waitstaff income is tips.. That won't ever be recovered, but then this is the US. Most states have 0 worker protection, its 100% predicable that workers are going to be laid off.
Uncharted territory (Score:4, Informative)
This is really unprecedented. We have people that find themselves unemployed through no fault of their own, or for that matter, the company they work for. Some businesses are simply being forced to shut their doors and have little choice other than to start laying people off.
What I was hoping would be in the stimulus bill but isn't is to provide 6 months of paid COBRA for anyone that finds themselves without medical insurance as the result of a layoff. COBRA is really expensive and a last resort for most people. Pray you don't find yourself in that boat.
Of course (Score:5, Insightful)
In a country of 320 million people we have over 175 million income tax filers, AKA workers.
In a country of 175 million workers, when all but essential businesses are shut down by government action, tens of millions, approaching a hundred million workers will be put out of work.
Once the government loans for small to mid-sized businesses (up to 500 employees) [0] to keep workers on the payroll for shuttered companies in in place, these wild multi-million unemployment application numbers will go down, until then the numbers will be unlike anything we've seen before.
Once the government starts covering the payroll of tens of million employers, these crazy unemployment numbers will go away.
[0] The government loans are to be available starting 4/3/2020 and are to allow small businesses to continue to keep workers on company payroll while company is shut down. Once the shelter-in-home/shutdown orders are lifted, if the business used the loan money to cover payroll during the shutdown and no one was unemployed, the loan will be forgiven.
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No, you overstate the influence Pelosi had on the stimulus bill.
The money for small and mid-size companies was always a loan that would be forgiven based on how money was used.
Pelosi is trying to save face after her latest political miscalculation - her boldest lie is that everything she proposed was for workers and their families - like racial/gender quotas for company boards? Carbon-neutral airlines by 2025? Twenty five million for the Kennedy center? She is trying to take credit for the bipartisan bill t
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But that'll only work if it's enforced though (Score:2)
What I'm going to want to do is take the money, lay off the workers and pocket the loan money. I might even fold the corporation when I'm done so I don't have to pay back the loan. Meanwhile there are billionaires who own "small" businesses applying for these loans...
I'm not saying we don't need to do this, we do. Even if the rich screw us over during the bail out they have too much power for us
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No, its going to get worse. Those unemployed workers are going to stop buying stuff, which is going to cause even "critical businesses" to loose revenue. An at least in the US, the first plan is to dump the employees because they are the least protected. The landlord at the now empty retail/office/etc space will still get their rent. Which will in turn cause even more lost revenue....
The only winners here are the grocery/etc markets where mandatory purchasing has shifted.
This Ain't Ending (Score:2, Insightful)
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South Korea is one of the nations managing the crisis the best.
The USA is among the worst. Some cities and states are doing their best, some aren't even trying, and the Federal government is doing a shit job.
The idea that you can use South Korea to predict how things will go in the US is a spectacularly dumb one.
Herd immunity doesn't really work (Score:2)
The way this will play out if all goes well is this:
1. Social distancing flattens the curve, giving hospitals time to minimize dying.
2. We get a small boost to herd immunity from that 12-18 months, flattening the curve a bit more.
3. After 12-18 months we get a vaccine.
After that what comes next is up to us. What we need to do is a bottom up approach to rebuilding the economy, Marshal Plan style. This is basical
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and my return troll upped the ante better.
Want to up your chances of surviving? Exercise! Quit smoking! Eat basic healthy foods that aren't processed! Wash your hands often! Avoid contact with others outside your household! Engage in activities that keep your brain stimulated and that you enjoy!
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You realized you already had inhaled millions of whatever viruses he had, if he were infected? Because that's what happened. Also, you'll very likely only get minor symptoms, if anything.
Just Need One Source (Score:2)
For specific numbers, WHO shows the global death count after two months worth of
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The WHO flu death numbers are essentially arse pulls. They are not lab confirmed, but guesstimates. Actual lab confirmed numbers for flu are far lower and are in the low three digits for any single first world country. The coronavirus numbers are, on the other hand, very real and since the hospitals are overfilled by a far lower number of critically ill people compared to the WHO number of flu deaths it shows just how wrong these estimates are.
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Perhaps because the number of deaths is doubling approximately every week [worldometers.info]? If that exponential growth were to continue indefinitely, the entire human population would die within about the next four months. Do you just not understand exponential growth? I'm guessing you don't, because you misunderstood what your "trend in coronavirus deaths" graph was saying.
(And of course the exponential growth won't actually continue indefinitely. Without countermeasures that can be summarized as "extensive worrying and pr
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I'm not sure if you are genuinely unaware of the studies that have been published or are just argument from ignorancing. I'm quite sure that your biology background is pretty sparse.
You won't find COVID-19 studies of the same calibre as influenza studies because there simply hasn't been time to complete them. However, there are plenty of good studies available and more coming out all the time. I suggest starting with the New England Journal of Medicine's coronavirus topic [nejm.org].
The bottom line is that you are
Re:The "cure" is worse than the disease (Score:5, Insightful)
You need to start taking this virus SERIOUSLY. You are not helping. You cannot keep life going "as normal". This is a civilization changer!
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Sadly it's probably not going to change as much as you think. The bailouts and welfare will still be for big corporations that last year returned billions to their shareholders, not for individuals who need it to get through tough times.
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Fully half the stimulus package just past is either direct cash payments to citizens ($1,200/adult, $500/child), extended unemployment benefits, supplemental unemployment benefits ($600/week for up to 4 months), and loans to help employers with 500 or fewer employees to continue paying idled workers, and the loans will be forgiven if they are used to maintain payroll while the company is shuttered.
Oh, and the other half of the stimulus can not be used for stock buy-back for two years.
And your problem is wha
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Christ, you really have no idea do you. You people are in for a serious shock.
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The world didn't have to be this way. It wasn't inevitable, and the future is unwritten. We can build a world that values life or a world that values money. It really is as simple as that.
To defend the GP (Score:2)
We're asking about 70% of the country to go to work while 30% take a 3-6 month paid vacation. That 70% probably can't swallow it. They're going to demand the 30% go back to work, and damn the consequences.
I honestly don't know how to get thr
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Who the F*ck do you think you are trying to convert 70% of Americans?
You are literally making up stats and sweeping generalizations.
Here's the thing, by my guess, a third of the workforce is still reporting for work, a third is working from home, and a third has been furloughed.
People reporting for work are getting their normal pay, as are people working from home.
Furloughed workers are getting unemployment, and a $600/stipend for the next four months (or less, as needed).
EVERYONE will get the $1,200/adult,
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The people who are going to die from this virus will die regardless whether they get it now or in 2 months time. However we CAN save the people who might die due to economic collapse.
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The way society is structured around concentrated urban centers the things that can only be obtained by money or barter are essential to life. Goods and services for money are essential.
People already over the virus can go back to work, which might even be a third of the populace by early indications testing.
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Sucking is NOT recommended at this time as it can be a vector for infection. Stop giving out inaccurate information! This is the Internet. Where is Rei with the analysis and breakdown of the current situation? I need some graphs.
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instead of graphs think how much better your life is even now compared to most of humanity. Thus far this is nothing compared to hardships the country has been through in the past. It possibly might get worse than most of times in the next four weeks but that is no reason to cry the world is ending.
I'm old, maybe this thing will do me in but that's not what is going to happen to most here. Most will be fine and be able to work and make the economy move again.
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hahaha, the rest of you have decades left and probability says I do too. You're being a worry-wart and a pessimist who's lost touch with reality.
Re:The "cure" is worse than the disease (Score:5, Interesting)
Sweden will have to just not treat a lot of corona patients. It'll probably end up going so that if you're a risk patient, you don't get intensive care, you get a death bed and a pat on the shoulder.
Now don't get me wrong, I'm not judging the Swedes at all. This MAY actually be the best decision overall because if we burn through our medical personel in a foolish and misguided (not saying it is, this is a what if) attempt to stand at the beach and catch that tsunami with our bare hands, we may weaken our economy for nothing and lose half our medical pros in the course of this.
May you live in interesting times indeed.
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Given only 15% of people get ill enough to be admitted and the fatality rate is around 0.4% in people under 50 how exactly will we lose all of them? In your own time...
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The problem is that if you don't have enough protective gear OR personell, you suddenly have people on the frontlines for 18 hours, seven days a week with few to no breakes because a break means new protective gear.
Do this long enough, and the toll on your body will weaken you to the point that you do become part of the high risk group. And being in the middle of it all all the time I'd say chances are pretty good that most medical personell cannot avoid contact with the virus altogether.
One way to look at
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The problem is that if you don't have enough protective gear OR personell, you suddenly have people on the frontlines for 18 hours, seven days a week with few to no breakes because a break means new protective gear.
You have no idea what you are talking about. Healthcare professionals don't throw away face masks when they take a break.
You have ignored the real issue, a shortage of healthcare providers, instead explaining that because the current administration didn't have countless billions of face masks gloves we have a serious "going to lose half the population" health crisis.
At its root, the real issues are:
1) China lied, and continues to lie about the disease
2) After the swine flu was conquered, govt tried to figur
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Go look up "immunity" you prize clown and after that go get yourself a clue and read up some history because economic collapse is WAY more than about money.
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Err, getting a disease and getting better generally means you have immunity afterwards unless said disease mutates. How do you think vaccines work you window licking cretin?? Are you truly this stupid or do you have to practice at it?
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That's a choice. It doesn't have to be that way.
People will starve unless you provide good for them. People will be homeless unless you pay their rents or enforce a mortgage holiday. You can do those things, people don't have to have their lives ruining or die because of a short term problem like this. It's a choice to allow it to happen, a choice not to help.
Part of the problem is people think of these things as helping other people with their money. They never look at it as insurance for themselves in cas
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If that happens your government will have catastrophically fucked up even harder than I think the Trump administration is capable of.
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if the world economy tanks and we head for a 1920s style great depression the end result will be FAR worse in terms of lifes lost and ruined than the deaths of (mostly) elderly and ill people via this virus.
You are stupid if you still think only the elderly and those with precondition will die because of covid-19.
Italy is going through this right now, when all your hospital beds and ICU are filled with covid patients, *everyone* who need any kind of medical care suffers. Cancer treatment gets postponed, simple surgery gets postponed so easily cured problem will be left to become worse.
Pregnant women need to risk getting infected to have their check ups, and pray they don't have any complications when the baby
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"You are stupid if you still think only the elderly and those with precondition will die because of covid-19."
Which part of "mostly" didn't you understand?
"No amount of economic depression will cause as great a harm as letting covid-19 run rampant across the country."
LOL, oh boy, if you think overflowing hospitals is worse than total economic collapse then you really are a fool who's in for a nasty shock like all the rest of them. Guess what - with an economic collapse there is NO MONEY for the hospitals an
Re:The "cure" is worse than the disease (Score:5, Insightful)
There's no reason for there to be total economic collapse. Private investment has tanked, so they're parking their money. The cost for the government to borrow right now is *negative*.
As Paul Krugman has pointed out, this isn't a recession, it's a disaster, and this money is disaster relief. The government easily has the power to cover this bill for now, and so to make sure the economy can restart once the worst of this has passed, it has to basically just hand out money to make sure rents get paid and food gets bought. After that, it'll need to inject money into the economy in the form of a fiscal stimulus so people start going to restaurants and buying phones again.
This is all more than survivable, it just takes some will.
And never forget, the economy is an invention, it's just a way of allocating work. When this is all over, we'll have plenty of workers and they'll still have all the skills they did when this started. Getting them back to work isn't hard if we just actively move to do it. We know a lot more now than we did during the depression.
Re: The "cure" is worse than the disease (Score:2)
Ok thanos
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Indeed, and these people are going to take us all down with them.