US is 'Looking at' Banning TikTok and Chinese Social Media Apps, Pompeo Says (cnbc.com) 140
The U.S. is "looking at" banning TikTok and other Chinese social media apps, Secretary of State Mike Pompeo told Fox News. From a report: His comments come amid rising tensions between the U.S. and China and as scrutiny on TikTok and Chinese technology firms continues to grow. When asked in a Fox News interview if the U.S. should be looking at banning TikTok and other Chinese social media apps, Pompeo said: "We are taking this very seriously. We are certainly looking at it. We have worked on this very issue for a long time," he said. "Whether it was the problems of having Huawei technology in your infrastructure we've gone all over the world and we're making real progress getting that out. We declared ZTE a danger to American national security," Pompeo added, citing the two Chinese teleommunications networking companies. The remark comes days after India banned TikTok and 58 other apps and services developed by Chinese firms citing cybersecurity concerns.
free speech (Score:4, Interesting)
You have a right to free speech, unless it's foreign propaganda?
It's not acceptable for arms of a foreign government to collect personal information on American citizens. It's fine if American businesses or Uncle Sam does it.
We need to ban things on the internet because your average person is too dumb to make the right choice. Let big brother decide for you. He will protect you from voter manipulation. This way no voter needs to build up skills for critical thinking or for sniffing out bullshit.
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Ah but China isn't in the Five Eyes club.
Re:free speech (Score:5, Insightful)
The US Companies are collecting data on people around the world.
Oddly enough I care less that China knows about my personal life than the United States. as China has no jurisdiction over me and what I say or feel. America while I am suppose to be protected by the first amendment, doesn't mean there are people with power who can actually make my life difficult.
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^^^ This this this. Mod parent up.
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Oddly enough I care less that China knows about my personal life than the United States.
That is odd. We buy everything else from China, what makes you think the US Gov't can't buy your personal information as well?
Re:free speech (Score:4, Insightful)
Oddly enough I care less that China knows about my personal life than the United States. as China has no jurisdiction over me and what I say or feel. America while I am suppose to be protected by the first amendment, doesn't mean there are people with power who can actually make my life difficult.
Jurisdiction is not the only kind of power. China has repeatedly shown that they don't care [nytimes.com] if you're an American speaking out in America, if you're badmouthing China they will do what they can to make your life miserable. Of course they'll wrap their demands in weasel words and so will the corporate chain and your business partners but the real message is "STFU or we'll lose our business with China". Like any negotiations will be mysteriously stuck in a quagmire that'll equally mysteriously resolve itself once you're relieved of your position or the partnership is terminated.
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Well, that's a good reason to support cutting off business with China. There are others. I just think that a measured approach is best.
OTOH, an invasive program can do a huge amount of damage in a small amount of time. Consider even normal malware. So cutting off software known to be under the control of an aggressive competitor could well be seen as a smart move. But you probably don't want to telegraph your actions too far in advance. And you need to consider how to deal with any problems that it co
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Foreign governments are collecting data on US citizens right now.... specifically the UK at GCHQ... and allow the US government access to it via 5eyes.
False. This is just a "what if they" type of thing.
The idea is that there is some sort of gatekeeper to data on US citizens, and so if you see a gap between the gatekeepers legs you just run through.
But that isn't how it works. There is no external gatekeeper to sneak past. Instead, the same rules that stop US law enforcement from collecting the data directly, also prevents them from collecting it indirectly through a government program.
The only end-run around the normal restrictions are if it is a company
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On what do you base your claims? Saying "the rules" doesn't carry much weight when the rules are so frequently shown to be violated without consequence. I can believe that "the rules" prevents you from paying them for the data, but I don't believe that they would prevent you from trading favors. Financial details are more often subject to examination (though given the "black budget" I'm not even really convinced of that).
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You have a right to free speech, unless it's foreign propaganda?
It's not acceptable for arms of a foreign government to collect personal information on American citizens. It's fine if American businesses or Uncle Sam does it.
We need to ban things on the internet because your average person is too dumb to make the right choice. Let big brother decide for you. He will protect you from voter manipulation. This way no voter needs to build up skills for critical thinking or for sniffing out bullshit.
Stop conflating the two.
First, both do us harm.
And having advertisers and political campaigns use our data against us is just as bad.
But let's be clear, China is a foreign power who will use commercial products for their state's interests. That does all of us harm here in the USA. Let me be clear - this is a foreign power using social media and other products and services against us Americans.
Now, OUR government as well as corporate interests abusing it is another matter.
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But let's be clear, China is a foreign power who will use commercial products for their state's interests. That does all of us harm here in the USA.
Please explain that assertion. Cite prior examples if possible.
Let me be clear - this is a foreign power using social media and other products and services against us Americans.
Can you explain in what way social media is dangerous in the hands of an adversarial foreign power?
Here it is. [theguardian.com]
And honestly AC, there is no way you are THAT uninformed -unless you watch Fox News.
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Not even a fan of fox news, but why do they get singled out for bullshit reporting?
Right now CNN/MSNBC/NYT/Slate etc have all tacitly decided that removing trump from office is more important than journalistic integrity.
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I don't know about other people, but to me Fox News is singled out for bullshit reporting because they are the company that went to court to defend their right to knowingly lie during a news broadcast.
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How is that not journalistic integrity?
The truth isn't partisan.
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I think you're misattributing the posts you're objecting to. I suspect that they are from supporters of the Chinese government.
It has been definitely proven that Russia, or entities operating from Russian ISPs, bought political ads on Facebook. Last I heard it hasn't been proven that they had any effect. And, of course, "entities operating from Russian ISPs" could be any of a wide number of folks. Still, it's strong evidence of external attempts to influence the election.
To presume that a company contro
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So, just to be clear:
Corporations blacklisting citizens: does not violate free speech after all it is their platform.
Citizens rejecting foreign corporations from the networks they built: Violates some imaginary right that a CCP controlled corporate entity should have on US soil?
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I love this post, but thinking it's OK for platforms to ban citizens doesn't inherently contradict thinking it's not OK for governments to ban platforms. Your heart is in the right place though.
Re: free speech (Score:2)
Except that all companies who do business internationally are de facto CCPcontrolled platforms, and in many cases de jure.
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The problem with that conclusion is that we aren't exactly talking about "Citizens rejecting foreign corporations", but rather about governments doing so. I'm still not sure that's not both legal and reasonable, but it is a bit closer to the line.
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When asked in a Fox News interview if the U.S. should be looking at banning TikTok and other Chinese social media apps, Pompeo said: "We are taking this very seriously. We are certainly looking at it. We have worked on this very issue for a long time," he said.
In other words: There's an election coming up and he went on TV said exactly what Fox news viewers want to hear from his party.
Politics as usual.
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Your ability to translate Trumpers sucks.
Corrected translation: "We'd have done it a long time ago if our lawyers could figure out a way that would get past legal scrutiny."
They're lawyers are all busy trying to defend the shit they already blundering halfway through, they don't have bandwidth for new controversies. They have a lot of staff turnover, too.
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Pompeo said: "We are taking this very seriously. We are certainly looking at it. We have worked on this very issue for a long time," he said.
TRANSLATION:
Pompeo said: "Oh yeah, like fer sure. We're talking about saying we'll look at it but whatevs. We'll claim that we 'worked on this very issue for a long time', even though we haven't done shit cuz' we really just heard about it or whatever." he said.
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I wouldn't call Tictok propaganda.
Yes China has a free speech and human rights issues. However the real question is why are the banning these apps. Or are they just doing it because people using these sites don't like Trump, and they hurt his feelings. While they can't legally close American companies they can do so with foreign own ones.
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I wouldn't call you a ham sandwich, but that is no reason not to ban murder hornets.
I can't even tell if you don't understand English grammar, you don't understand the accusations, or you simply don't know what the words mean.
It could be anything.
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I would ban those applications as prospective malware under control of an adversary. Even if the current version is not malware (prove it!), who can tell what the next update will be.
What the legal grounds for doing so would be, however, is a bit trickier. But I don't understand even the legal grounds for banning ordinary malware so long as it doesn't engage in fraud. Yes, it needs to be done, but that's not a legal justification.
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you know, i read a bit earlier that this might be more about 'wechat' and stopping money laundering/tax evasion by chinese nationals in the US. Basically using wechat to exchange RMB for goods and services (with or without sending the funds back to china) -- and not paying taxes or any kind of reporting.
The tiktok stuff is window-dressing.
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Why not its exactly what China is doing to the USA with American movies and shows being blocked unless the Chinese government get script approval.
Tit for tat policy when dealing with an authoritarian regime imperials our democracy. It's not a good strategy if you value individual liberty.
It might be an effective war strategy, but I weep for the society that accepts the view that every activity is a battlespace [militarytimes.com]
I'm sorry but access to markets is a two way street so unless your argument is "America should be everybody's bitch" you really don't have a leg to stand on.
I agree that reciprocal openness is the only fair way. If American multi-national corporations cannot operate in China, then Chinese multi-nationals should not operate here. But we do operate there, in a limited way. But there are degrees here.
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To me it's a matter of trust. I'm a person who doesn't usually trust Javascript, because the code hasn't been vetted by people I trust. Who knows what a particular program will do under what circumstances, when you can't see the code, and nobody you trust has seen the code? And when the updates are controlled by someone you don't trust, how can you trust the updated version?
I'm totally behind banning closed source software from adversarial countries that control the companies operating within their borde
On occasion.... (Score:4, Insightful)
This proposal is NOT racism or sinophobia. This is a prudent step towards companies that exist in a country where the government and business are basically the same.
Maybe this will get the kids to vote? (Score:3)
I'm too old and have too many responsibilities to care about TikTok. However, from what I've read, few over 25 use it. So if it's really popular with the 18-25yo crowd, get your stupid butts out to vote. I don't have an opinion on TikTok one way or the other.
If you think the administration is right and the executive branch should have to power to arbitrarily ban any Chinese app they feel like, including this one I hear you like, get your but
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Banning some company is NOT banning free speech - TikTok, facebook or what goes away, we all still have free speech. And BTW, my fellow old bastard, I do not use those either.
So, banning a CHINESE app that uses data against us and our government is the same as arresting spies.
Re:Maybe this will get the kids to vote? (Score:5, Insightful)
social media has been weaponized - meaning it has been used to collect data on people and that data used to manipulate them to VOTE and act against their own interests.
I could make exactly the same argument against Fox News, when it's causing folks who have no access to healthcare to cast their vote for leaders who oppose the concept of healthcare as a basic human right. I still wouldn't use that as a justification for censorship. Try to realize, we're talking about adults here who are responsible for their own decisions - we shouldn't have a nanny state deciding that the citizens are in perpetual childhood and must be protected from corrupting influences.
The fact is, people are manipulated by the media - social or otherwise. It's the cost of having a free society. It beats the alternative.
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Try to realize, we're talking about adults here
Allegedly. They behave more like spoiled children.
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When? Oh just every single day for a dozen years non-stop, ever since they heard the name "Obama".
Seems like a very indirect way to destory America (Score:3)
Listen my fellow old fart, social media has been weaponized - meaning it has been used to collect data on people and that data used to manipulate them to VOTE and act against their own interests.
Banning some company is NOT banning free speech - TikTok, facebook or what goes away, we all still have free speech. And BTW, my fellow old bastard, I do not use those either.
So, banning a CHINESE app that uses data against us and our government is the same as arresting spies.
My current understanding is most TikTok threats are theoretical and involve data gathering...no different than facebook or Google. It seems pretty weak to me...sure, they could get really really creative and misuse the data, but you can say that about any advertising platform, so I am not sure why they're any more risk than any other advertising/data-gathering platform.
I'd personally take this more seriously if someone gave more specifics about the activity they were engaged in or specific guidelines t
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On occasion, this crazy administration does shit that I agree with.
This proposal is NOT racism or sinophobia. This is a prudent step towards companies that exist in a country where the government and business are basically the same.
The unending manipulative power of the Donor Class, confirms that America is "basically the same".
The fact that neither party represents The People anymore, also validates it.
The blatant hypocrisy coming from the Finger Pointing Generation isn't cute or funny. It just makes us look stupid and ignorant. We can't even smell our own bullshit anymore.
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The unending manipulative power of the Donor Class, confirms that America is "basically the same".
The unending hair growing from your ears confirms that your neighbor grows carrots.
The fact that neither party represents The People anymore, also validates it.
Your attempt to reassign my vote, and the votes of the rest of the People, has failed, is failing, and will continue to fail.
The blatant hypocrisy
OK, now look up the word "hypocrisy" and see if it says "actions I disagree with." (spoiler: it says something different than that)
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... a country where the government and business are basically the same.
Are you talking about China where government dictates terms to business or the US where corporations and banks basically own the government?
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or the US where corporations and banks basically own the government?
Comments like this demonstrate how derpiness transcends the details of policy arguments.
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On occasion, this crazy administration does shit that I agree with.
This proposal is NOT racism or sinophobia. This is a prudent step towards companies that exist in a country where the government and business are basically the same.
The brush you're painting with seems pretty wide, on what principle does TikTok get singled out?
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The brush you're painting with seems pretty wide, on what principle does TikTok get singled out?
The second part of this sentence places the first part in bad faith.
If you don't know what the accusations are, you are not in a position to characterize anything at all about the dispute, and it is therefore dishonest to do so.
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The brush you're painting with seems pretty wide, on what principle does TikTok get singled out?
The second part of this sentence places the first part in bad faith.
If you don't know what the accusations are, you are not in a position to characterize anything at all about the dispute, and it is therefore dishonest to do so.
The accusation seems clear to me, don't deal with companies where "government and business are basically the same", one could of course interpret this as applying to all Chinese companies, in this context I do not and as I stated "The brush you're painting with seems pretty wide". I believe a narrower definition was intended that somehow applied specifically to companies like TikTok. To assume that OP wants to ban all Chinese companies and TikTok just happened to be the one discussed atm would IMHO be an in
FTG (Score:5, Insightful)
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They ban FB and Google then so be it. We ban them.
Re:FTG (Score:5, Interesting)
Can we ban both Facebook AND TikTok?
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Can we ban both Facebook AND TikTok?
Motion seconded ...
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And when they came for Slashdot, there was no one left to say anything.
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Or are we no longer taking the moral high road but start acting just as morally reprehensible countries?
In my opinion TikTok is absolute garbage and I'd advise anyone with half a brain to give it an even wider berth than facebook. I can also understand if they were banning it for employees of the sate. But banning it all citizen? Isn't that going a bit too far?
Re:FTG (Score:5, Insightful)
We've tried taking the high road with China for many decades, and they've fucked us over at every possible turn. Enough is enough. Appeasing despotic regimes has never worked, and we've done this for far, far too long.
How many human rights do they have to squash before we recognize them as the threat they are? Hong Kong is gone. Tibet is gone. They're making aggressive moves elsewhere. Hollywood kowtows to their every whim, because money. Businessmen don't want to break ties, because money. It's beyond fucked up, and it's a black stain on us that we've put up with it for so long.
I'm completely fine with limiting the access of Chinese corporations to US markets, just like they've done with us for decades.
Re: FTG (Score:2)
Well said Sir. As the saying goes, "what is the most important thing about being a Gentleman?"
Knowing when to stop being one.
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Isn't that a rather childish response?
Unfortunately, this ad hominem is common among adults, so no, you're not being childish, just intellectually dishonest.
Or are we no longer taking the moral high road but start acting just as morally reprehensible countries?
You don't comprehend having the moral high ground, or taking the high road, obviously. When you take the high road, and you meet fellow travelers on that road, you treat each other with parity, but it does not imply that taking the road means submitting to bandits without opposing them. Taking the high road might actually involve being the one who steps forwards to clear the bandits and kee
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What kind of reasoning is that? Instead of having made a point about China doing horrible things like most recently annexing Hong Kong, which should be the reason for strong sanctions, the reason goes:
They do it too. So when we're going to do it, it must be fine! Or:
Have a taste of your own medicine!
Maybe that rings a bell? It's the old and tired tu quoque. And acting up spitefully. And while being old and tired i
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Isn't that a rather childish response?
You must be new here.
Not Possible? (Score:2)
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No.
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No. Your voice can go out into the ether legally, but the US doesn't have to allow the packets to make it across the ocean to specific foreign business entities.
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No. Your voice can go out into the ether legally, but the US doesn't have to allow the packets to make it across the ocean to specific foreign business entities.
From TFA:
“TikTok is led by an American CEO, with hundreds of employees and key leaders across safety, security, product, and public policy here in the U.S. We have no higher priority than promoting a safe and secure app experience for our users. We have never provided user data to the Chinese government, nor would we do so if asked,” a spokesperson told CNBC in response to Pompeo’s comments.
TikTok has previously said that U.S. user data is stored in the United States, with a backup in Singapore. The company also said that its data centers are located entirely outside of China, and none of their data is subject to Chinese law.
I don't see how you can ban TikTok and make it stick unless they actually are transferring data to China and their business depend on it. The app seems popular so even if they somehow manage to formulate a ban, TikTok could just start a US company and comply with US rules until someone can show in court that they are not.
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If the data is going to Singapore, it would be easy to formulate a ban regarding Singapore.
I never said I agree with it, but the US had export restrictions on strong encryption for many years despite it being merely speech. It's been tested and proven legally.
But you're right about "formulating." You can't make laws that favor/discriminate against companies by name. You have to formulate the rules in an equally applied way that doesn't call out the entity by name. I have no idea what the legal precedent
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If the data is going to Singapore, it would be easy to formulate a ban regarding Singapore.
I never said I agree with it, but the US had export restrictions on strong encryption for many years despite it being merely speech. It's been tested and proven legally.
But you're right about "formulating." You can't make laws that favor/discriminate against companies by name. You have to formulate the rules in an equally applied way that doesn't call out the entity by name. I have no idea what the legal precedent is, but probably to do with protecting freedoms. If you ban a company from storing data on Chinese servers, you lose all the companies that operate this way.
Export restrictions on encryption was from being classified as a weapon of war (dual use). Conceivably some sort of export restriction on data to Singapore based on national security interests could be made, but for the reasons you brought up it wouldn't be easy and TikTok would switch their backups elsewhere long before.
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In addition, a court decided that crypto code WAS speech. The ruling was revoked pending en banc review, and then mooted when the Clinton Administration changed the export rules.
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Nobody cares if you hire a local to run your local effort, if the business is owned or controlled by a foreign entity, then it is a foreign entity for national security purposes.
It is simple-minded to imagine that hiring a local would put a foreign military outside of US regulation.
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Nobody cares if you hire a local to run your local effort, if the business is owned or controlled by a foreign entity, then it is a foreign entity for national security purposes.
It is simple-minded to imagine that hiring a local would put a foreign military outside of US regulation.
I'don't follow what you're trying to say. A local CEO is under local jurisdiction, if there are local rules that prohibit the export of personal data to foreign military and you can show that to be the case for a specific company then that's an open-and-shut case against among others the CEO? Banning an app seems like a very roundabout way of handling the situation that's not very effective.
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Or just ban TilkTok for being useless trash, no other reason required. And ban FB, IG, Twitter and the rest as well.
Seriously, it doesn't matter if the CEO is American. It matters who controls the company and what they do with data and meta data. That quote claims they don't send user data to China. What DO they send? And what orders come FROM China? Who is on their board? Who are their investors? That's what counts. The CEO is nobody.
From an emotional standpoint I can sympathize with your feelings, from a political and legal view you're way off-side. In the US companies have freedom of speech and are innocent until proven guilty. The Chinese owners are BytedDance Ltd. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org] the US TikTok CEO is Kevin Meyer https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org] who is responsible under US law.
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Why do you think a Chinese government owned corporation would enjoy rights enumerated in the United States Constitution?
For extra points, tell me why american citizens should not have these same rights, if they disagree with you politcally?
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I am neither a lawyer or even an American... but would this not be in conflict with the 1st amendment?
No one is talking about banning TikTok for private citizens. They're talking about banning its use by government employees (and possibly contractors) in the workplace.
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I'm an American but not a lawyer. While downloading the app might fall under the domain of speech, other things probably don't. The Federal government has broad powers outside of regulating speech that can dramatically reduce the use of, if not actually ban the app in total. For example, some other posters are saying TFA says this currently only applies to government contractors. The Federal government can specify that contractors not use certain apps if they want to get the contract.
The government co
Bluster (Score:3)
Good luck banning speech. You'll need more than apps to keep your fire burning, what will come next?
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Good luck banning speech.
Just because you're speaking, doesn't automatically convert all the other actions you might take at the same time into speech.
Just as tossing leaflets onto the ground is littering, even if it contains copies of your manifesto. Banning littering bans neither speech nor the press, and that is true even if you use the word "speech" while you litter.
They can say whatever they want. It does not mean they're automatically allowed to import or export your data, or to take direction from a foreign military while th
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Va. Pharmacy Bd. v. Va. Consumer Council, 425 U.S. 748 (1976)
https://supreme.justia.com/cas... [justia.com]
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Was gambling otherwise legal in many/most of the places it was used? No. Selling illegal drugs, online or otherwise, is banned too, so what?
If they want to claim that there is a national security issue then they should be able to produce some evidence of that. If there is no national security issue then I don't see how they can ban an app, something else will quickly replace it. I could see how maybe they could ban it for those in the military. I can't support calls to eliminate products or ideas just be
It's about f***ing time (Score:4, Insightful)
Does anyone trust a Chinese internet company to not be doing the bidding of the CCP? I don't trust the NSA either.
In addition, China's persecution of Uyghers, Falun Gong, Muslims, Christians and Hong Kong freedom fighters should make Chinese companies persona non grata. China is also a significant player in the illicit Fentanyl trade into the US.
Why are we afraid of TikTok? (Score:2)
Does anyone trust a Chinese internet company to not be doing the bidding of the CCP?
So what exactly would the CCP do with TikTok's trove of videos of adolescent Americans dancing? I suppose they could be training a face recognition network with it. They could predict what music will become popular and invest in music studios. But shouldn't we be more concerned with something like FaceBook which has tons of personal data, political commentary, links to news sites, private groups, etc? Or does TikTok t have those things? (I don't have an account on there.) Is the fear that it eventuall
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Do you really want the Chinese government amassing data about your children?
Do you think they respect the GDPR? Do you trust them to turn over all data about you if you request it, and to delete it if you so request?
Who fucking cares what they plan to do with it, they need to be prevented from collecting it in the first place.
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Do you really want the Chinese government amassing data about your children? Do you think they respect the GDPR? Do you trust them?
Of course not, that would be nonsense. But just saying "OMG they are bad guys!" doesn't add anything meaningful to the discussion. Take a look at the reply by amorsen which explained the scope of the problem.
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TikTok collects way more than dance videos. TikTok collects your location, the nearby Wifi networks, and all sorts of other things.
TikTok can use that to find out who associates with who, and that is one of the most powerful tools for a totalitarian state to deal with opponents.
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TikTok collects way more than dance videos. TikTok collects your location, the nearby Wifi networks, and all sorts of other things.
Ohhh....it's an app, not just something you upload videos too! Yeah, okay, I see. Forget what data they collect - I just don't want people installing Chinese-backed apps on their phones at all! I also forget that not everyone turns off the location tagging on their cameras.
The same logic as killing abortion doctors (Score:2)
Somehow, doing the same thing you claim to oppose when China does it seems... wrong.
Nietzsche wasn't kidding about the abyss staring back into you.
Nationalism sucks (Score:2, Interesting)
Nationalism sucks, the world is becoming more and more insular and hating of each other from every nation. Ever since the nationalists created this virus to destroy global foreign relations and travel they have been winning. Inevitable result is world war again. You Fools.
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We've tried responding to China's ultra-nationalism with capitalism. It hasn't worked at all. It's time to try something else.
Globalism sucks (Score:2)
Globalism sucks too. It just created an opportunity for multinational corporations to run amok and erode the will of the people in various places. Open borders have created social unrest, and industries have become concentrated in various places leading to monopolist-like behavior.
We shouldn't be a slave to any -ism. Pure isolationism is bad. Pure globalism is bad. We should be looking to optimize trade, immigration, and other factors instead of striving for ideological purity in either direction.
Retaliation (Score:5, Insightful)
I would expect this has more to do with the embarrassment the President received at the hands of Tik-Tokers trolling his Tulsa rally.
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I would expect this has more to do with the embarrassment the President received at the hands of Tik-Tokers trolling his Tulsa rally.
And leaving negative reviews of his businesses
Teenagers are now trolling Trump by leaving negative reviews on his businesses [indy100.com]
After reportedly requesting tickets for Donald Trump's failed rally in Tulsa, Oklahoma and not showing up and pretending to buy merchandise on his online store but never choosing to pay for any of it, teenagers are now encouraging others to go to review sites and leave bad scores and comments for businesses owned by Trump.
As reported by Daily Dot, many videos have started to appear on
To What End? (Score:4, Insightful)
Okay, so let's play this game...
Trump bans Tiktok. How is he going to do this? Issue an executive order preventing Apple and Google from listing it in their App Store?
Bypassing that on Android is trivial; kids will sideload the APK like they did with Fortnite...and you can bet that whatever legitimate privacy issues were present with Tiktok will be ten times worse with the actual-malware included with half of those APKs. Either way, on Android it's a speed bump.
On the Apple side, remember, Apple went up against the federal government in the San Bernadino case and won. This becomes a proxy war where SCOTUS gets to answer the question "does the government have a say in what apps can and cannot be listed in the App Store". If Apple was able to win the case against the FBI when the question involved a terrorist attack, I'm putting the odds of Cupertino beating out DC at levels high enough that I would be comfortable buying Apple stock when Tim Cook hits the stand.
"So, don't block the app, block the traffic". That sidesteps the court case problem, but now you need cooperation from all of the ISPs to do that sort of blocking. Voila! "We're gonna build a Firewall...and China's gonna pay for it!" Should such a thing come into existence, you've now tipped your hand that the government *has* such a firewall...or such control over the ISPs that 'everyone closing ranks' is a distinction without a difference.
Meanwhile, you've now started a game of cat-and-mouse. Tiktok traffic blocked? Great, now China has to pay a few hundred bucks a month for an AWS instance, putting Jeff Bezos in the position of deciding whether to stick to his principles or get officially shut out of China. Jeff plays ball with China while 'accidentally' leaking the AWS instance IPs to ISPs, China changes instances. Rinse and repeat a few times, China moves to Azure or GCC or puts a rack full of Poweredge servers in a colo somewhere in the US. Or, they move their Tiktok servers to the EU somewhere, and we've once again, gotten nowhere.
Alternatively, now you have NordTikTok, a Tiktok app that transparently sends its traffic through NordVPN or some other company where it's just a matter of bouncing around and letting all that outbound traffic be proxied. It's not a video chatting app so latency won't be an issue, and now one must decide whether to give up and let Nord do what they will, or to start making it a scorched earth campaign where anyone who proxies traffic for Tiktok is now subject to some sort of litigation.
All of this to stop...what, exactly? Yes, Tiktok's data scraping is terrifying, and really shows the need for something like Xprivacy Lua [github.com] or PmP [protectmyprivacy.org], that, unlike Android's permissions model, won't tell the app 'no' but instead can feed Tiktok all the information it wants, randomly generating it each time...but, I digress. China's collecting too much data for a Youtube successor, sure...but to what end? Yes, it's possible that China is playing the long game here and is gathering data that will be useful in a decade, but the continued popularity of Tiktok is yet to be seen. "Why are they scraping the data then" is a very fair question, but a part of me argues that if we're okay with Google having basically the same data, and Google can be NSL'd into forking over the collected data while Tiktok cannot, then the issue ceases to become data collection.
And, let's pretend for a moment that this is actually successful. Somehow, some way, a ban is implemented successfully. If Net Neutrality taught us anything, it's that if there's an internet outage with someone to blame for its intentional disfunction, that's how you get people to lose their s!!t. If this goes through and Trump says anything other than "I am launching an investigation to find out who blocked Tiktok this way without my approval" (which he is very unlikely to do), and doesn't have a sacrificial lamb from the Democratic party to blame by election day *with* restoration of Tiktok service...that's how you mobilize the younger kids to get off their asses and vote against him in November.
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Okay, so let's play this game...
Trump bans Tiktok. How is he going to do this? Issue an executive order preventing Apple and Google from listing it in their App Store?
Yeah, I can see how "thinking" might appear as a game if you're so simple-minded that you can't even follow the arguments.
He issues an executive order that prevents the US Government, government employees, and contractors from using it. This forces all major companies to institute a policy that it is now allowed on any device used for work in any capacity. If they don't carry two phones, they won't be able to use it. That will cover so many people that usage by profitable demographics will plummet, and it w
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"We're gonna build a Firewall...and China's gonna pay for it!"
Best comment of the day!
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Sorry I stopped reading after the first part where you started inventing technical solutions.
The US State Department already has a list of countries that are blacklisted and provides IPs that must be blocked.
Done.
The article - which I did, in fact, read - described a nationwide ban, not just the State Department banning it internally. So, my friend who apparently is not Way Smarter than Me, how does 'the state department having a list of banned IPs and Geo-IP ranges' translate into banning Tiktok in places that aren't The State Department, effectively, and without some form of collateral damage?
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The article - which I did, in fact, read - described a nationwide ban
You make two claims; that you read the article, and that it described a nationwide ban.
The article did not describe a nationwide ban, or give any details about what was meant by "ban."
Did you lie about reading it, or did you in fact read it but choose to lie about what it says? Or are you just an idiot who doesn't comprehend the literal meaning of words?
TikTok May be Security Swiss Cheese (Score:5, Interesting)
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Mod Parent Up!
Please, Mr. Trump (Score:2)
Don't stop at TikTok and other Chinese social media apps, also ban FaceBook, Twitter, LinkedIn and all the other major social media bullshit.
look at it (Score:2)
Yeah, don't think about it or analyze it or quantify it or test it, just "look at it", the way you clowns "look" at everything. Like the way you "looked" at healthcare or infrastructure or deficit reduction or, I dunno, a response to a pandemic.
reddit (Score:2)
Its pretty obvious when you look at the community and how the vote system is played. Its probably worse than facebook in the mind fuck department, interspersed dope hits per article, overtly social agenda...its pretty obvious when you see through it all...but then again I see through /. ...its just not as in your face. It feels like every media source these days has some sort of bent or agenda....whatever happened to the people in the middle?
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We're cast out by both sides because we don't fall in line with every single talking point on every one of their agendas. As soon as you disagree on a single, minor point, you are accused of belonging to the "other side" and your opinion is immediately disregarded. It's not that bad if you don't feel compelled to fit in but now more than ever, everyone wants to fit in and that means picking a side and giving them blind obedience.
Isn't there a First Amendment issue here? (Score:2)
I would think that an app would qualify as "speech" in much the same way that a novel or movie would. Regardless of the merits in the TikTok case, would the US government have constitutional grounds to ban it?
Wechat should be No 1 on the list (Score:2)
Wechat is the nastiest most dangerous spyware app in the world - CCP doesn't even try to hide the fact that they have root level access and a backdoor to every device it is installed on. All of your data is collected, including full text of chats and emails, audio of calls, and local files, web history, passwords, etc.. The data collection extends to all of the contacts in every contact list on the device.
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Someone recently brought up the hilarious proposition that Yeezy (Kanye West) could pull enough votes from Biden if he actually runs that Trump would end up winning somehow. It's absurd and I'd peg it at very nearly impossible in reality, but the thought was absolutely hilarious to me. Peak absurdity.
What the fuck happened to this country? The far left is insane, the far right is insane, and they are both driving the conversation. Say what you will about people like Dubya or Clinton or Obama but you can't a