MIT and Harvard Sue DHS and ICE Over International Student Rule 182
Shag writes: Two days after US Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) said international students must leave the US if their fall classes will be taught entirely online, MIT and Harvard are suing ICE and the Department of Homeland Security. "ICE is unable to offer the most basic answers about how its policy will be interpreted or implemented," said former international student L. Rafael Reif, President of MIT. Massachusetts' state Attorney General has announced that her office will also challenge the ruling in court. Of course, MIT also develops various technologies for DHS.
I don't see how ICE can do differently (Score:4, Interesting)
Student visas are offered for people studying on campus in the US.
If student visas now apply to remote learning then everyone enrolled in online learning could theoretically apply for a student visa.
Re:I don't see how ICE can do differently (Score:5, Insightful)
Yep. The entire point of a student visa is to allow someone to be in the United States while they ATTEND class AT a US institution.
If they're not ATTENDING a physical US institution, you can't get a student visa. Those are the rules. You can't come to US simply by attending any of the many online-only universities.
This is no different.
Don't like it? Change the law. ICE is, as they generally are, simply following the laws.
(Or just hold classes as normal. If it's safe enough for people to hold "protests" it's safe enough to hold classes.)
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Don't like it? Change the law. ICE is, as they generally are, simply following the laws.
The executive branch can absolutely choose not to enforce the law selectively. That is one of the checks and balances that our government has. Do you really think our government is capable of responding fast enough to "change the law" in time?
Re: I don't see how ICE can do differently (Score:4, Informative)
At the very least, case law. Have you ever gotten pulled over for speeding and not received a ticket? That's selective enforcement.
Have you ever driven past a police officer while speeding and not been stopped at all? That's selective enforcement too.
Re: I don't see how ICE can do differently (Score:2)
Entirely different situation. That's called discretion. If the cop pulls over everyone going 1 mph over the limit then he's going to be too busy to nail the guy going 30 mph over.
In this case we're talking about a nation wide policy. And in general, no the executive doesn't have that power and it SHOULD NOT have that power.
Example, "my guy" with the correct letter after his name on the ballot gets busted red handed committing a federal crime. But he's "my guy" so we use that executive discretion you arg
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In this case we're talking about a nation wide policy. And in general, no the executive doesn't have that power and it SHOULD NOT have that power.
We already have DACA. It is far from the only thing. Case law has already shown that Executive does have that power. It's pretty much the only thing that makes "Executive Orders" bear any weight whatsoever. Executive orders set policy on how to actually enact things that have been passed into law.
"my guy" with the correct letter after his name on the ballot gets busted red handed committing a federal crime. But he's "my guy" so we use that executive discretion you argue for. But when "your guy" with the other letter after his name does the exact same thing, we destroy his life. Is that the world you want to live in?
That would violate the equal protection clause of the 14th amendment. You have to be equitable when you selectively enforce - can't ticket the black men but not the white men. And it's been held up as a valid
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Does the 14th provide equal protection under the law for political party registration?
Equal protection even prevents you from writing laws that call out a business by name. That's why you see so many laws aimed at a specific company but written based on the description of what they do. It goes way beyond race or protected classes. The same rules apply to everyone - and if they're provably not, then it is unenforceable.
That Obama made an illegal executive order or that Trump has been denied his authority to over turn it with a stroke of the pen?
The inability to overturn it was because the order failed to follow proper administrative procedure. So far, they haven't wanted to file properly basically because of the w
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Your feelings don't coincide with reality. If you've ever been let off from speeding with only a warning, are familiar with DACA, or countless other cases of selective enforcement or prosecutorial discretion, you're seeing it in action. The exception is anything that violates a citizen's 14th amendment "equal protection" rights (you can't adjust enforcement based on race, for example).
A large number of Presidential Executive Orders involve the extent to which laws are enforced. Just in the last couple mo
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Country of Origin, is not a race. It is called the human race for a reason. Different appearance does not denote a different human race, just a different appearance. Different human societies will produce people of different social characteristics, some more violent than others, also rules associated with breeding will also reflect in the proportion of psychopaths and narcissists to the rest of the population (genetic traits) the higher the ratio the more unstable and violent a society. So yes, it is reason
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Yeah...DACA was grounds to impeach Obama. Can't magic up work permits and call it "prosecutorial discretion." Obama was wrong to do it, Boehner was wrong to let it slide, and Roberts was wrong to keep it alive on the thinnest of technicalities because Orange Man Bad.
On what grounds do you accuse Roberts of being motivated by "Orange Man Bad" in that decision?
Re: I don't see how ICE can do differently (Score:2)
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"Speeding is not a federal offense."
How about speeding in a national park or on federal property?
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The executive has a long history, from Washington up to and including Trump, of not enforcing the strict letter of the law when they don't want to. We don't have enough agents to prosecute fully every case that comes along, which is why plea bargaining is a big deal and why the district attorney is always a political office and not a technocrat office.
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OK can you stop the charade of pretending you're ok with Chinese/Indian students getting an education? We know you guys TRUE belief on the matter.
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Haha I don't need to be asked that by people who don't believe black lives matter. Let me ask you, are YOU willing to fund black education? Of course you aren't. The foreign students are paying for their own education, and thereby they are indirectly funding seats for black and white US citizens and even slow people such as you. Your misdirection attempt failed. Facts are that you are against foreign students AND also against blacks. Whereas I am in favor of education for all people. Education access for ev
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I am against stupid laws that are rooted in unfounded fears. I am in favor of laws that uplift humanity. We can have immigration laws, but then those laws should never assume the worst about people because of the negative actions of a small percent. I support a points based system similar to what Trump proposed ONLY if it has humane enforcement (no deportation of people who grew up here and lived without commiting violent felonies) and doesn't reduce the entry of refugees. Refugees should be allowed entry a
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I want increased engagement and trade with the world because ultimately, fuck it .. within 200 years or so I hope we do get a world that no longer requires borders.
Mercantile interests have been profiting from the existence of those borders for 400 years, literally since the Age of Mercantilism began. The policies are somewhat different than actual mercantilism dictates, but the profit remains. Those borders aren't going away. Not in 200 years, not in another 400 years. There's too much money to be made.
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You said "laws" and "uplift humanity" in the same sentence. Mistake, or unfounded optimism?
Re:I don't see how ICE can do differently (Score:5, Informative)
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While I am one of the few conservative on /. I think this should be overridden by the president. The cost of travel, breaking leases and establishing residency twice in different countries is huge while not really upholding the spirit of the law.
I agree it sucks for the students caught in the mess. I think though if they don't make this clear the logical outcome is schools will game the system and admit many more international students while keeping the bulk of them in remote learning. It will become another visa scam.
Hopefully the schools will come up with a plan to conduct classes for international students on site and the issue is moot.
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Required in-person exams, say 3 times per term, scheduled over a 3 or 4 day period so you can do the social distancing thing.
What I'm wondering about is the colleges/universities with "underclassmen must live in on-campus housing/dorms" policies that are also only teaching virtually/online....
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While I am one of the few conservative on /.
HAHAHAHAHAHA
"few conservative[s] on /."
Go on, pull the other one.
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And it's disasterous for the universities who are going to lose enrollment from overseas, which is often a huge part of their income which helps greatly to offset the cost to local students. This then leads to a loss of prestige for the US education system, which is already taking deep hits from the cost (especially relative to other countries where top tier university education is very often cheap and subsidized). Does the president want to Make America Great Again, or Make America Gimped Always?
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Are you sure people want to go to all those other universities? Seems like everyone is always so desperate to come to the USA to study, but why do all that if you have a quality university right in your home country?
I imagine most of those universities just aren't all that great OR those countries don't have nearly enough universities for their population.
Not like they would ever want to come to USA. I mean, we have guns, republicans, Trump and massive, systemic racism. Got to be crazy to come here, right?
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Don't like it? Change the law. ICE is, as they generally are, simply following the laws
Maybe. But the lawsuit doesn't say that they don't have the authority to change the rules. They do say that they didn't follow the rules for changing the rules. So, in essence, they are not following the law.
(Or just hold classes as normal. If it's safe enough for people to hold "protests" it's safe enough to hold classes.)
First, you are implying that the people having the protests are the ones holding the classes. That is not necessarily true. There probably is some overlap, but far from 100%.
Second, the most significant difference with protests with respect to safety is that protests are held outdoors. The vast majority
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I've attended regular classes outdoors. We sat out on the grass in the quad. It was actually pretty god damned awesome and I was a lot less antsy than sitting on the crappy classroom chairs.
Why do they need indoor classes? My local restaurants are now seating outside on the sidewalk and over former street parking spots.
Teach outside. Problem solved.
This is all going to get complicated in the northern states in winter
Exponentially worse isn't good enough (Score:3)
Covid infection rates are exponential on the base reproduction rate. In other words, the number of new infections each month either grows exponentially or falls exponentially. Covid cases are still rising - it's getting worse. Things won't be "safe enough" until they have been falling for a while.
That REALLY sucks, but "sucks" doesn't make it less true.
> (Or just hold classes as normal. If it's safe enough for people to hold "protests" it's safe enough to hold classes.)
Mass protest outdoors is not safe.
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I think there should probably be some discussion within our government about not enforcing this particular bit of law for those that intended to attend real classes and were forced into online only by the covid situation. The problem with direct interpretation of this law in this moment is the ever fluctuating circumstances that most schools find themselves in right now.
My state's schools announced an expected loss of local revenue (not direct payments to the schools, but local spending outside of school)
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Yep. The entire point of a student visa is to allow someone to be in the United States while they ATTEND class AT a US institution.
If they're not ATTENDING a physical US institution, you can't get a student visa. Those are the rules. You can't come to US simply by attending any of the many online-only universities.
This is no different.
Don't like it? Change the law. ICE is, as they generally are, simply following the laws.
I'm certain this is far from the only case where COVID-19 restrictions mean the law as normally enforced would screw some people over.
The big difference is the administration takes action to make sure those other groups don't get screwed over while it pretends it's hands are tied when it's foreigners getting screwed.
(Or just hold classes as normal. If it's safe enough for people to hold "protests" it's safe enough to hold classes.)
If you constantly feel the need to take unrelated pot-shots in comments then it's a sign your politics are clouding your judgment.
Re:I don't see how ICE can do differently (Score:5, Insightful)
Student visas are offered for people studying on campus in the US. If student visas now apply to remote learning then everyone enrolled in online learning could theoretically apply for a student visa.
In fact, those are the normal rules, which make sense for the reasons you say.
The current problem is that students who are already here whose schools are offering a bunch more online classes than normal so as to spread people apart in existing classrooms (or even pre-emptively going all online for Fall semester again) are screwed by ICE doubling-down on this otherwise reasonable rule. They're here already, halfway through their studies, and are now being told to leave. Given that most countries aren't even letting people in from the US (even our good buddies in the UK) because we're so bad at public health, it's unclear how those students are even supposed to follow the rules and GTFO.
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Student visas are offered for people studying on campus in the US.
If student visas now apply to remote learning then everyone enrolled in online learning could theoretically apply for a student visa.
In fact, those are the normal rules, which make sense for the reasons you say.
The current problem is that students who are already here whose schools are offering a bunch more online classes than normal so as to spread people apart in existing classrooms (or even pre-emptively going all online for Fall semester again) are screwed by ICE doubling-down on this otherwise reasonable rule. They're here already, halfway through their studies, and are now being told to leave. Given that most countries aren't even letting people in from the US (even our good buddies in the UK) because we're so bad at public health, it's unclear how those students are even supposed to follow the rules and GTFO.
The administration said one motivation is to encourage schools to reopen. Do you really think Harvard should be entirely remote this fall, at full price?
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The administration said one motivation is to encourage schools to reopen
There's no question they're using Mafia-like tactics to try to force states and cities to treat the pandemic as if it was nothing important. It certainly bears no relationship to Harvard's pricing - their costs aren't going to decrease. If anything, they'll increase. Why would you lower your price when your costs go up? The facilities aren't being used but they still have to be maintained and on top of that you have a whole second infrastructure to support.
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The administration said one motivation is to encourage schools to reopen
There's no question they're using Mafia-like tactics to try to force states and cities to treat the pandemic as if it was nothing important. It certainly bears no relationship to Harvard's pricing - their costs aren't going to decrease. If anything, they'll increase. Why would you lower your price when your costs go up? The facilities aren't being used but they still have to be maintained and on top of that you have a whole second infrastructure to support.
They could easily admit 10x more students for remote learning and cut tuition accordingly
Re:I don't see how ICE can do differently (Score:4, Insightful)
Just because remote learning uses a computer does not mean it is automated or run by one. There's a huge amount of human interaction involved. And training for new staff. Not to mention that poaching students from other schools does nothing to solve the problem at the national level.
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Just because remote learning uses a computer does not mean it is automated or run by one. There's a huge amount of human interaction involved. And training for new staff. Not to mention that poaching students from other schools does nothing to solve the problem at the national level.
It's not a zero-sum game. Expanded virtual offerings at a much reduced price means you can attract a global audience of a huge age range.
They aren't treading new ground, these remote learning problems have already been solved. There are exceptions of course, like if you need to be in a lab, or doing clinical work, in the gym, etc. But I'd say 80% of my university classes could easily have been remote. In fact, being able to pause and replay the lecture would have been very beneficial.
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The administration said one motivation is to encourage schools to reopen
There's no question they're using Mafia-like tactics to try to force states and cities to treat the pandemic as if it was nothing important. It certainly bears no relationship to Harvard's pricing - their costs aren't going to decrease. If anything, they'll increase. Why would you lower your price when your costs go up? The facilities aren't being used but they still have to be maintained and on top of that you have a whole second infrastructure to support.
They could easily admit 10x more students for remote learning and cut tuition accordingly
Only if the students received much less personal attention from the faculty and staff. Much of the point of going to an elite institution is the opportunity to interact with world-class minds.
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The administration said one motivation is to encourage schools to reopen
There's no question they're using Mafia-like tactics to try to force states and cities to treat the pandemic as if it was nothing important. It certainly bears no relationship to Harvard's pricing - their costs aren't going to decrease. If anything, they'll increase. Why would you lower your price when your costs go up? The facilities aren't being used but they still have to be maintained and on top of that you have a whole second infrastructure to support.
Harvard already offered online courses so the infrastructure was already there. It's hard to justify the value proposition of paying to be at Harvard when all your classes are online and they previously offered many online classes for free:
https://online-learning.harvar... [harvard.edu]
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They would actually end up with more money, and they aren't using price to manage resources (they use admissions requirements for that).
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Harvard should put their endowment in index funds and use the better returns and massively lower fees of such and completely eliminate tuition.
Princeton, in fact, did exactly this a few years ago, and there is considerable pressure on their competitors to follow their lead. A student choosing between the two schools now has the choice "Princeton, and no tuition, or Harvard, and a second mortgage? Hmmmm....."
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Do you really think Harvard should be entirely remote this fall, at full price?
The price is a negotiation between the students and the University. The student can accept it, choose to leave by themselves or attempt to negotiate (ok, unlikely to be successful but they might have some chance in these circumstances). This is especially true of foreign students who almost always pay full price.
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The administration said one motivation is to encourage schools to reopen. Do you really think Harvard should be entirely remote this fall, at full price?
All schools, from Harvard down to the CC down the street are wrestling with this question. Keep in mind that the administration has somehow decided that strong-arm tactics which stands to damage one of the few things the world still wants to buy from the US (a $45.3B export value in 2017/18, https://www.trade.gov/educatio... [trade.gov] ) is somehow a good idea. Harvard's got the resources to challenge this BS, more power to them.
Re: I don't see how ICE can do differently (Score:2)
damage one of the few things the world still wants to buy from the US (a $45.3B export value in 2017/18
Total US exports are about 2.4 trillion per year, so your "one of the few things" is less than 2% of the total. Gonna guess that the other 98% is more than a few things.
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As a public health matter, I think it would be an appropriate measure to be 100% remote this fall. It sucks, but colleges (undergrad, anyway) are just as much a petri dish as kindergartens: outbreaks are easy and frequent.
At full price? That's a separate question, and not really the point behind this policy. Does anyone think that immigration polic
Re:I don't see how ICE can do differently (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:I don't see how ICE can do differently (Score:5, Insightful)
I feel for the students who are getting screwed over due to a political pissing contest between two world super powers.
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What about graduate students who have duties beyond learning. TAs, class graders, research assistants, etc.
Good questions. How will they be doing their jobs in this remote learning environment?
I'm guessing that except for lab work those people will be remote too
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I think these are questions that are being asked and ICE has no answers.
Those aren't questions for ICE. If the school is fully remote they must have a plan for these people to do their jobs too, assuming the job needs doing
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ICE does have discretion. Wait, I can't believe I said that with a straight face... I meant discretion in these matters, they can choose to enforce or not when unusual circumstances arise, otherwise we could have robots do the enforcing rather than mindless humans.
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What if those students don't necessarily need to attend classes with other students, but would be better served having access to campus resources like libraries, labs, etc.?
Harvard, MIT and other colleges did not design all their programs to be online. They are only doing this to prevent the pandemic from getting worse.
Insane interpretation by ICE. (Score:5, Informative)
Even if you are attending the campus via video link, it's nuts to ship out international students. This creates a heavy burden on international students to attend in classes in a different time zone than they live in. The students in question are from overseas so it's not a one or two hour difference, it's like 5 or even 14 hours difference.
Regardless of authority, this is a nonsensical decision.
Re:Insane interpretation by ICE. (Score:5, Funny)
On the other hand, if they're deported, they're more likely to have access to a decent ISP, which will help them with distance learning :)
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I'm definately struggling to see whats gained by doing this. Its undeniable international students bring a lot of money into the country and create jobs, and their fees subsidize local students.
What exactly , other than mindless "foreigners out!" nationalism , is the goal here?!
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What's gained is maintaining rule of law. If the law is unjust, it should be changed rather than ignored. Allowing a bad law to stay in place just makes it easier for selective enforcement to be abused.
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Education (Score:2)
Only conservatives are threatened by having more educated people in the world. Nobody with a functional brain disputes that the vast majority of conservatives actual wish is that Chinese students be blocked from ANY access to education online or offline.
Re:Education (Score:4, Insightful)
I am a conservative with a functional brain and I dispute your assertion: Neither I nor anyone I know has a desire to stop the Chinese from receiving an education. Quite the contrary: the CCP has its own schools and universities which its citizens can attend, and there are myriad options around the world (apart from the US) should they wish to study abroad. I do not, however, feel that they have any right to attend school here, particularly when it has been shown time and again that they engage excessively in espionage for their nation.
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You think ICE is staffed by conservatives?
Liberals wouldn't work there. QED...
Link to the complaint (Score:3)
http://orgchart.mit.edu/sites/... [mit.edu]
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Why should the US educate people that will most likely work for a hostile competitor(CCP or Chinese company) after college?
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Funny how you word that, the vast majority are paying for their tuition here at full price. Better question would be why USA would no longer want to participate in international higher education since we are the choice for 25% of students, and of course 11 percent of our students study abroad at some point in their college education.
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Or, we could retain the brightest ones? In addition, the consumer (read that as quality of life) benefits by improved products and competition.
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That's a bit of a sick reason to block someone's education btw. More educated people = good for everyone. That's like puncturing your competitor's tire in a car race .. except in this case everyone wins when theres improved human productivity .. but that shouldn't be the reason for making ethical/humane decisions.
Foriegn students get priority for being on campus. (Score:2)
If foreign students are required to attend a physical university to continue to stay in the country then the universities should be open for them and the USA citizens can stay home for another semester.
I can't imagine the percentage of foreign students is so high that you couldn't run the campus for them while keeping some social distancing and face masks going on.
Probably upset a lot of citizens but universities are businesses and we are very pro-business, so this shouldn't be to hard of a decision. It's o
Re:Sue away, and piss into the wind.... (Score:5, Interesting)
Last time I checked the federal government has all the rights (one of the things federal government is actually tasked to do) to shut borders and secure the country however they like.
But that doesn't mean this is what the citizens want or need right now. Forcing someone to get on an airplane at this point in time is unreasonable if you ask me. They're already here and their status is changing through no fault of their own. Besides, universities need every tuition dollar they can get right now and they won't necessarily keep those dollars if the student goes home.
This is not something that the federal government has to do. Even if they would be otherwise legally not allowed to stay, the executive branch can still selectively enforce this law and make an exception for the pandemic. To not do so is just the sort of petty thing this administration would do - but it isn't necessary or even helpful.
Re:Sue away, and piss into the wind.... (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Sue away, and piss into the wind.... (Score:4, Insightful)
It's more malicious and considered than that. It's also a deliberate attack on universities, a favourite target of every authoritarian, and it's an attempt to force re-openings an idiotic attempt to help the economy.
Re: Sue away, and piss into the wind.... (Score:2, Interesting)
What?
I swear...if Trump endorsed Biden tomorrow, he'd win in a landslide from all the lefties who'd instinctively do the opposite.
Re: Sue away, and piss into the wind.... (Score:5, Insightful)
I swear to god, I miss decent arguments with right-wingers. Ones where they had intellectual capacity, assumed the other side did too, engaged with substance of what was being said, and attempted to win substantively. Instead, all I get now is what you've done here: re-framing one's opponent's argument to be cretinous, and then declaring victory. You can't possibly be think you've made a convincing argument here, can you?
Sigh.
Anyway:
- Yes, Trump is attacking the universities
- No, it's not by "forcing them to resume operations". That's the re-framing of my argument to be cretinous so you can declare victory
- Instead, the attack, which is Trumpian in nature but which as far as I understand doesn't originate from Trump himself, is forcing universities to make choices between two very bad outcomes: either re-starting in-person teaching when they are convinced it's unsafe to do so, or losing students and income.
Sigh again.
Re: Sue away, and piss into the wind.... (Score:2, Troll)
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Oh looky, you nearly engaged with a substantive debate! But of course, absolutely zero acknowledgement of the fact that you had previously re-framed my argument to be cretinous so you could declare victory. But it's what you did, and it's there for all to see, along with your lack of acknowledgement.
Re: Sue away, and piss into the wind.... (Score:2)
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I asserted that liberals instinctively oppose whatever Trump does without considering the move on its merits.
And that's silly. It only takes a few seconds to consider the merits. And there usually isn't any. Could be that your idea of ethics is just so equally bad that these look like good actions to you.
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I literally wrote out your re-framing, and it had nothing to do with the Trumpy bit of what you wrote. I literally wrote: "No, it's not by "forcing them to resume operations". That's the re-framing of my argument to be cretinous so you can declare victory". If you have an explanation for how that's not a reframing, by all means share it, because I could do with a laugh.
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now is a time for bravery
Speaking of bravery, now would be the time to tell President Bone-spurs to start wearing a surgical mask and lead by example. Wearing a mask requires little to no bravery at all. And having more Americans wear masks in public would help the economy restart a lot faster.
After all, we're not all like Joe Rogan, or like the White House. Most of us can't afford an in-house doctor to test all the people that get in the same room with us. Even the testing regimen imposed by Harvard, most schools don't have the re
Re: Sue away, and piss into the wind.... (Score:4, Informative)
I will not label you as a "lefty" Heck, I'm not even a "righty". I believe you're just a person, and it appears you're from the US. Also, I understand you don't like President Trump.
Your "opinion" the president is attacking universities is in my opinion incorrect. Good argument? To me it seems flawed to directly correlate making people leave (or not enter) the country on student visas to attacking universities. You just stated this as fact but this is your opinion, which is a weak argument at best.
By the way, have you ever considered this is just a policy and if it wasn't the President doing it, it would be a great idea. I believe we all let our personal beliefs get in the way of logic. For your information: Canada just opened it's borders to student visas to their universities. As of a couple of weeks ago, they were allowing no one enter the country as a student. Where was the outcry for this earlier? I know this because I have a daughter in this situation.
Also putting people down personally weakens your argument. You will do better to try and convince then attack. I would be more open to listen.
Lastly, there is no argument about my real comment. The Federal government has all the rights to do this.
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Shall we start with time difference?
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Why can't international students continue attending online classes from their home countries?
1. They're not home right now. So travel expense, for one. I don't support any sort of undue burden even if they're not citizens. There's not a good enough reason for it.
Re:Sue away, and piss into the wind.... (Score:5, Interesting)
Policy seems clear to me. If you have an online offering, stay home and use it. If not, then they have an exception.
This isn't a matter of "stay home and use it". This is a matter of "violate state procedures that mitigate the spread of the coronavirus by forcing students to return home and use it there".
New students shouldn't come into the country for remote learning, and the article doesn't argue that. The argument is that students already here shouldn't be expelled from the country at this time. This is much more reasonable to decide per state, not by a federal agency. The officials are well within their rights to challenge this now rather than in the fall.
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Or they could get their congressmen to amend the law to include such an exception. This development shouldn't be a surprise and they still have a month or so to either get that passed or modify their plans to let the international students stay legally. No need for a lawsuit ... yet.
I think pushing the executive branch into ignoring the law just takes congress off the hook for fixing the law. Prosecutorial discretion is a necessary evil that is ripe for abuse. We should avoid normalizing it in cases whe
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Or they could get their congressmen to amend the law to include such an exception.
Changes to a law will take about 2 months. The universities have to submit their plans by the end of the NEXT WEEK.
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They've had three months to get this figured out. The law changes should already be in process.
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They've had three months to get this figured out. The law changes should already be in process.
The guidance came a WEEK ago. It gave universities two and a half weeks to come up with a plan.
This is malice from Trumpian agencies, plain and simple.
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This isn't something that should have needed guidance. The schools know what the rules are on student visas. They should have anticipated that response and been prepared.
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Last time I checked, governments don't have rights. People have rights. Governments have powers. If you can't get basics like this correct, it's pretty much a given you've fucked up the rest of your thinking too.
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OK...? How is that a bad hustle? How is Chinese money coming into the US bad? Yacht sales, maintenance crew, marina workers etc. are all jobs created by someone who buys a yacht. Do you suggest that money stay in China?
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Don't elect Bidens [scmp.com] — problem solved.
Seriously, using a Hong Kong source? Does it come with rubber dog shit too?
Instead of being distracted by the fake Hunter Biden/Ukraine interfering in our election for Democrats bullshit fake narrative to distract all of us; I think we ALL should home in on the issue: Hunter (naming a kid for a trade? How about Plumber?) used his father's name and position to get a very well paid cushy job that none of us could have gotten.
I think he got the job because the Russian crooks who ran Burisma wanted some influ
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Why not? Whatever they publish against CCP's interests can be trusted.
But here is a more detailed overview of Bidens [theintercept.com], from a source unimpeachable in your circles.
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I want to protect America and I will dispute any bullshit that harms it - like you bullshit. And I think you are just a foreign troll and liar who is trying to manipulate us. I actually posted a PRO conservative comment and you attacked me.
And you are the AC who posted so YOU are the liar.
Fuck You Troll!!
America
Re: Hunter takes Daddy's bribes worldwide (Score:2)
In your first comment you say it happened. Then, when he agrees, you write a second coment saying it didn't happen. And then you pretend to care about the truth. Hilarious.
Coming in for second place for hilarity is your linked google search for "fiona bill testamony cpatiol".