E-Scooters Should Be Legalized, Says UK Transport Committee (bbc.com) 69
E-scooters should be legalized on roads but riding on pavements should be prohibited, the United Kingdom's Transport Committee of MPs said. The BBC reports: Currently, privately-owned e-scooters are banned to use in the UK anywhere except on private land. The committee argues the vehicles, which usually travel 9-15mph, could offer a green alternative to the car. Official trials of rented e-scooters have already been announced in some places in England. While supporting the introduction of e-scooters, the Transport Committee said the government should use trials to monitor the numbers and types of collisions that take place.
Describing riding e-scooters on pavements as "dangerous and anti-social," the committee said the law should "prohibit their use on pavements" and that "robust enforcement measures" would be needed. Further committee recommendations include allowing local authorities to determine the speed of e-scooters and encouraging users to wear helmets. It also said there are "valid environmental concerns" about the processes used to recharge e-scooter batteries and advised the Department for Transport to monitor the environmental impact.
Describing riding e-scooters on pavements as "dangerous and anti-social," the committee said the law should "prohibit their use on pavements" and that "robust enforcement measures" would be needed. Further committee recommendations include allowing local authorities to determine the speed of e-scooters and encouraging users to wear helmets. It also said there are "valid environmental concerns" about the processes used to recharge e-scooter batteries and advised the Department for Transport to monitor the environmental impact.
Ever see Creaky Blinder on YT? (Score:3)
Pavements (Score:2)
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So you can only ride them on dirt roads? Ever tried to ride an e-scooter on a dirt road?
Governments are so stupid. If i buy one I'm riding it where ever the fuck I want. Give me a ticket if you don't like it. I mean I wont pay it but if it makes you feel better then go for it. I know I will feel better after I wipe my ass with that ticket.
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Ever tried to ride an e-scooter on a dirt road?
Get a scooter with fat tires. Like the one I had when I was a kid (minus the motor). They work fine on dirt paths.
Re: Pavements (Score:2)
Re:Pavements (Score:5, Informative)
In the UK, pavement means sidewalk.
Re:Pavements (Score:4, Funny)
In the UK, pavement means sidewalk.
Wouldn't that make it especially social? I mean, running right into people?
I'm kidding, but thanks, that makes some sense.
Re:Pavements (Score:5, Funny)
In the UK, they should be banned on sidewalks so they don't collide with pedestrians.
In America, riding e-scooters on the sidewalks is fine because we don't have pedestrians.
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In the UK you are not allowed to ride a bike on the pavement, only on the road with other traffic. eScooters are the same except that you ALSO need a driving licence. This rule is widely ignored and flouted as far as I can tell, I see kids on scooters all over the place.
Presumably if legalized they would still have to be ridden on the road, just licence-free like a bike.
Re: Pavements (Score:2)
I'm maybe confused by your change between escooter and scooter, but escooters are Illegal in the UK, whether you have a driving licence or not (except on private property). Scooters (non motorised) are unregulated and kids can ride them where they want, Just like skateboards.
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In the UK you are not allowed to ride a bike on the pavement, only on the road with other traffic. eScooters are the same except that you ALSO need a driving licence. This rule is widely ignored and flouted as far as I can tell, I see kids on scooters all over the place.
I believe it's the scooters that also need to be licensed, so they need to be fully legal complete with a number plate, lights, indicators and an MOT, minimum depth of tread and everything. I think it's not even clear if a driving license ca
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I think you are right, bloody IKEA furniture assembly dulling my usually child-safety-scissor sharp like mind.
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Your experience and laws may differ from country to country.
Comment removed (Score:4, Funny)
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I've spent many years in Britain. I'm fairly confident I know what a pavement is.
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Pavement is foot paths. Footpaths are for foot traffic unless specifically designated as dual use. Scooters, like bicycles are not foot traffic and therefore belong on roads and specifically designated dual use pathways. On specifically designated dual use pathways, scooters and bicycles have to give way to foot traffic. Your experience and laws may differ from country to country.
It's awesome how that British use all the same words we do, but nothing they say makes any damn sense to me anyway.
I'm including most of what you just said.
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I'm not British. ;)
I understood him completely, except maybe what an e-scooter is
Ban the scooters, they are dangerous in car traffic & dangerous in foot traffic areas too.
We have dockless scooters and bikes littered everywhere, blocking paths, blocking cars, and making walking too unsettling in many areas.
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It's awesome how that British use all the same words we do, but nothing they say makes any damn sense to me anyway. I'm including most of what you just said.
I think you'll find it's the other way around. English is originally a British language. Sidewalk makes no sense, you're not walking sideways and you don't walk on the bit cars drive on so why is it called the sidewalk?
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The problem is scooters and bicycles are considerably slower and more vulnerable than other road vehicles, so a lot of people don't feel comfortable riding on roads.
Riding somewhere designated for pedestrians also shouldn't be a problem if there are no pedestrians around.
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Scooters most definitely do not belong on roads, the centre of gravity is the worst in can be. Any emergency manoeuvre will result in the scooter attempting the manoeuvre whilst the person leaves the scooter and continues on that path, falling on the ground, likely to be run over by what they were trying to avoid.
The only reason to put scooters on the road at 15km/h kill as many idiots as possible and blame them for it.
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I've ridden both and I think bicycles are more dangerous.
Having a large metal triangle tangling up your legs in an emergency situation? Not good.
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Scooters most definitely do not belong on roads, the centre of gravity is the worst in can be.
It's nowhere near as bad as a bicycle.
Re: Pavements (Score:2)
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It's just another example of British English being nonsensical. If the walk is a pavement because it's paved, why isn't the roadway also a pavement? It's paved...
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Ahh yes... The old "Why do we park in the driveway, and drive on the parkway?"
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It makes even more sense when you understand that "back in the day" the sidewalks were paved (if anything), but the streets were not.
Re: Pavements (Score:2)
Two nations divided by a common language
Look at all the e-scooter problems 1st UK (Score:3)
Yes, they are more green than automobiles but at what cost?
Just take a look at every city in the US that has had e-scooters. Most of them have now placed such heavy restrictions or outright bans on their use that most companies gave up. But the question is WHY THE HEAVY RESTRICTIONS AND BANS? Because, people were acting like idiots on them and then they left the e-scooters everywhere and the e-scooters became a huge eyesore as well as hazards.
If the UK allows e-scooters in they need to have all the pertinent restrictions in place before the first e-scooter "officially" hits the road.
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If they want green and safe they should promote https://www.utahtrikes.com/ [utahtrikes.com], safe for all ages and they would become much cheaper mass produced. Old, young, less chance of falling over, far more comfortable and can carry your shop readily. They really need to work on the price though, limited production runs cost lots of money.
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They look similar to the Christiana Bikes (christianiabikes.com) which are very popular in Copenhagen (or were when I was living and working there).
Big issue is that Copenhagen (like Amsterdam - and much of Denmark, Netherlands in general) is cycle friendly and has the road layouts to accommodate cars and bikes safely.
Many towns and cities in the UK (not just London - but that is a particularly difficult case) have grown up from mediaeval street plans and are not really suited to motor traffic, let alone s
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Because, people were acting like idiots on them and then they left the e-scooters everywhere and the e-scooters became a huge eyesore as well as hazards.
That'd be the rental scooters.
Over here people actually own their own. They're not going to leave them "everywhere".
(In fact leaving them outdoors is a big problem, there's no easy way to chain them up)
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Are they really more green? Look at the energy it takes to build them and distribute them. Note that they will have a far shorter lifespan than cars, even the old ICE cars. And there is the impact of having to round them up, charge them and redistribute them.
A full accounting should be made of the true lifetime environmental costs of these scooters. Then factor in the safety of them and they might not come out as rosy as some would have you believe. Of course, they can be fun, and somewhat convenient,
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Cars use a lot more energy to build and distribute but also require more space for parking and cause traffic. If you can provide 20 scooters for the same resources as a car, then your car has to last 20 times longer at the very least.
Re: Look at all the e-scooter problems 1st UK (Score:2)
It appears that you are thinking of life span in terms of years.
Perhaps you should think in terms of usage. That is. Passenger miles.
I would bet good money that the average car has more than 20 times the passenger miles on it when it meets its maker than a scooter does. It is probably even greater than 100 times.
We should ask these questions and get real answers. I took offense with the unsupported assertion that scooters were more environmentally friendly.
Remember, we once thought "biodegradable" plast
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I'm sure the average car has far more than 20 times the passenger miles, but that's not a good comparison. People aren't replacing cars with scooters for longer trips. I used years because I'd guess the car will fail or be replaced for other reasons going these short distances.
I haven't heard much about biodegradable plastic bags being used that widely, but I still use them for some of my compost because the alternative would be something that wouldn't degrade or would just make a mess
Licensing.. (Score:1)
I assume therefore tat they will be licensed, with legal visible ID, required inspections, insurances, and taxes all paid?
yes? no? thought not.
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I assume therefore tat they will be licensed, with legal visible ID, required inspections, insurances, and taxes all paid?
Why on earth would you assume that? This is the whole point of the law, currently they need to be licensed but there is no way of getting them road legal because the category doesn't exist.
Requiring someone to license something that's a similar cost, speed and level of danger as a bicycle would be a great way of killing a new, effective mode of transport stone dead. They are a vastly bet
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In many cases one is required to license motorized bicycles, and they're still around (and increasing in number.) I think e-scooters could survive licensing requirements, so long as they were not egregious.
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In many cases one is required to license motorized bicycles,
Not in the UK. In actual fact the distinguishing things are the pedals (human power), which is why surprisingly powerful ebikes are legal unlicensed but even the weediest escooter is not.
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Sounds like someone needs to put pedals on an escooter, and the problem is solved.
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Sounds like someone needs to put pedals on an escooter, and the problem is solved.
Probably would, the law cares not for such trivialities as "practicality".
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In Germany,
insured: yes
id: yes
taxes: no
inspections: no
Small stuff does not pay road tax. Nor does it require inspections - what is next? Road tax for bicycles and bianual mandatory inspection?
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Road tax for bicycles and bianual mandatory inspection?
Why not? We have extensive (and expensive) infrastucture for biking here in the Netherlands. Seems only fair that cyclists start paying their way... except that we (rightly) want to encourage people to cycle more, so we don't tax them.
As for inspections... seems a bit impractical, but in elementary school we used to get a couple of cops over at the start of the school year, they'd check out our bikes, pointed out issues, helped fix small things like loose brake cables or blown bulbs, and if your bike w
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In Germany they still do that. But for first graders, the way to school is usually only a few hundred meters by foot (well: in bigger cities, in rural areas they need to get picked up by a bus). I used bike from grade 5 on, about 7km to my school.
Elsewhere... (Score:5, Informative)
They are EVERYWHERE. People are driving them on the pavements, driving into pedestrians, and then just throw them in a bush or on the street when done (despite the designated parking/pickup areas).
Apparently you have to be 18 years to use one, and apparently whatever app they use to check that doesn't work as I see kids aged 11-12 driving around with them every single day.
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E-scooters are legal and should be outlawed.
They are EVERYWHERE. People are driving them on the pavements, driving into pedestrians, and then just throw them in a bush or on the street when done (despite the designated parking/pickup areas).
So people are spending $500 on a personal escooter, then throwing it in a bush after one journey? That sounds deeply suspicious to me, so I say [citation needed].
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So how's that relevant to this story?
Rental companies might need regulation, sure, but that's not got much to do with whether it's legal to ride an e-scooter on the Queen's highway.
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That's rental services. Most riders in the UK own their scooters so obviously won't be throwing them away after a single use.
It's illegal to ride a bike on the pavement here. You have to use the road, and the roads are pretty dangerous between poor drivers, narrow lanes and potholes.
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and the roads are pretty dangerous between poor drivers, narrow lanes and potholes.
You forgot to mention: they are driving on the wrong side, too!!
Re: Elsewhere... (Score:1)
Re: Elsewhere... (Score:2)
Now an e-scooter would be perfect for commuters. I wanted one (before COVID). Use it to go to the train station instead of the car. Use it for the last two miles to work. Perfect for me. And the scooter would be owned by me, so itâ(TM)s not going to be dumped.
The problem is that the U.K. is overrun by bloody idiots with no sense, no r
Trying to reaching climate goals they are great. (Score:3)
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On a side note i got a spam mail yesterday for a 7000w scooter that goes 120kmh / 75mph. That seems to me to be a good way to die fast in my oppinion. :P Think about Piago or Vespa.
That most likely was not a "scooter" but a small motorbike. On the continent small motirbikes are called "Scooters"
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The scooters that are rented out have a very short service life. The amounts that are produced to replace old broken bikes are not good for the environment.
They also tend to be dumped in places where they don't belong, which isn't good for the local environment either.
Compare that with pedal-bikes that are easier to refurbish and recycle because of them not having custom electronics, and which don't have batteries that could leak, expand or cause fires.
Why E-scooters at all? (Score:2)
The world plus dog already knows and has seen for itself that skateboarding down the pavement is an order of magnitude more dangerous than walking, and that skateboarding on the roadway is pretty much a recipe for death and injury.
So, what would be the expected result of using E-scooters? In all likelihood, far greater levels of death and/or injury.
Why? (Score:2)
The scooter shown in TFA is a kid's toy with a motor. They offer a lousy ride, are unstable and uncomfortable to ride for more than a few hundred m. I can see one use case: someone who uses public transport and wants to speed up the walk to/from the bus stop/station. Otherwise, a bike is a far superior solution.
Too slow for roads (Score:2)
Safety, ecology and behaviour (Score:2)
With their short life span, use of batteries and custom electronics, i wonder if e-scooters are more environment friendly then cars or mass transit. I suspect they are not at all.
Another problem is the very small wheels of most of them although that may be corrected. Small wheel on roads are a danger. Even with my road bike i am afraid of potholes.
Another problem is simply social. Their users ride like assholes and suicidal psychos. That could be corrected by education but i am dreaming out loud here. One t
Glorified toys (Score:1)