As Two Pilots Eject, US Military Plane Crashes Into Texas Neighborhood (abc7news.com) 82
"Y'all a plane just crashed into all those houses," one eyewitness says in an online video. "People jumped out of the plane with parachutes."
The two people — jumping from the 38-foot-long training plane — were both hospitalized, reports CNN: Police were notified of the crash...around 10:53 a.m. (11:53 am ET) and on arrival found one pilot who had ejected from the military training jet caught in power lines, Lake Worth Police Chief JT Manoushagian said during a Sunday afternoon news conference. Another pilot also ejected from the training jet and was found in a neighborhood nearby...
None of the homes involved in the crash took a direct hit, said Fire Chief Ryan Arthur. A little bit of damage occurred to the areas around the homes, he said. "This incident could've been much worse knowing that this plane went down in a residential area here in Lake Worth," Arthur said.
ABC News has more information: One of the occupants was burned by power lines and another landed in a tree as they parachuted to the ground, authorities said. One of the crew members was in critical condition, the other one was in serious condition, authorities said...
WFAA-TV reported that the plane crashed in the backyard of a home, and no one on the ground was injured. Power was also knocked out to around 1,300 customers in the area.
ABC News identifies the aircraft as a T45 Goshawk fighter jet trainer, a plane first developed in 1974 by McDonnell Douglas and British Aerospace (before McDonnell Douglas's 1997 merger with Boeing). But Boeing.com notes they "delivered the 221st and final T-45 training jet to the Navy in November 2009." The company continued to support the T-45 fleet by providing engineering, logistics and support equipment in partnership with BAE Systems, the successor company to British Aerospace, which had supplied the aircraft's rear and center fuselage sections, wing assembly and vertical tail. On Aug. 26, 2010, Boeing joined the U.S. Navy at Cecil Field in Jacksonville, Florida, to celebrate the Naval Air Training Command's one millionth flight-hour with the T-45 Goshawk.
The two people — jumping from the 38-foot-long training plane — were both hospitalized, reports CNN: Police were notified of the crash...around 10:53 a.m. (11:53 am ET) and on arrival found one pilot who had ejected from the military training jet caught in power lines, Lake Worth Police Chief JT Manoushagian said during a Sunday afternoon news conference. Another pilot also ejected from the training jet and was found in a neighborhood nearby...
None of the homes involved in the crash took a direct hit, said Fire Chief Ryan Arthur. A little bit of damage occurred to the areas around the homes, he said. "This incident could've been much worse knowing that this plane went down in a residential area here in Lake Worth," Arthur said.
ABC News has more information: One of the occupants was burned by power lines and another landed in a tree as they parachuted to the ground, authorities said. One of the crew members was in critical condition, the other one was in serious condition, authorities said...
WFAA-TV reported that the plane crashed in the backyard of a home, and no one on the ground was injured. Power was also knocked out to around 1,300 customers in the area.
ABC News identifies the aircraft as a T45 Goshawk fighter jet trainer, a plane first developed in 1974 by McDonnell Douglas and British Aerospace (before McDonnell Douglas's 1997 merger with Boeing). But Boeing.com notes they "delivered the 221st and final T-45 training jet to the Navy in November 2009." The company continued to support the T-45 fleet by providing engineering, logistics and support equipment in partnership with BAE Systems, the successor company to British Aerospace, which had supplied the aircraft's rear and center fuselage sections, wing assembly and vertical tail. On Aug. 26, 2010, Boeing joined the U.S. Navy at Cecil Field in Jacksonville, Florida, to celebrate the Naval Air Training Command's one millionth flight-hour with the T-45 Goshawk.
Okay, but (Score:2, Insightful)
Why is this on Slashdot?
Re: Okay, but (Score:2, Insightful)
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The issue causing the crash may be technical. Also, the tag line is news for nerds, stuff that matters. That is a list (think of it as an array). This certainly matters, though it is not just for nerds.
I never saw that tagline as either-or - I always felt like posts here were meant to justify both phrases, unless it was an overwhelmingly big news story (like the 9/11 attacks).
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I always felt like posts here were meant to justify both phrases
Well, your feelings have never reflected the site's reality, and with that UID I'm pretty sure you realize that. "News for nerds" has encompassed such stories as the theft of a million pounds of maple syrup from the Canadian Strategic Maple Syrup Reserve in the past, and what people's reaction to passersby putting stuff in their trash cans. It's no longer Rob Malda's brain-dropping repository, but they do have a tradition to uphold. Of course so do you I suppose, of someone complaining "This isn't news f
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Also, the tag line is news for nerds, stuff that matters
The keen observer will note that "news for nerds, stuff that matters" no longer appears anywhere on the site and hasn't for quite some time. Apparently, slashdot could no longer live that lie.
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It's more that the astroturfers can't just stay with Reddit and all the other swamps that nobody in their sane mind touches, they noticed that sane people don't go there and had to infest sites like this one, too.
Re: (Score:2, Interesting)
The issue causing the crash may be technical.
They flew into a power line.
Why didn't their GPS warn them of the powerline?
The obvious technical solution is to get pilots out of planes and replace them with computers. Not only would a computer avoid the power line, but the training flight would not be needed at all. Computers don't need to be trained, just programmed.
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Why were they flying so low that they hit a power line?
Re: Okay, but (Score:1)
/s
Re: Okay, but (Score:4, Informative)
Why were they flying so low that they hit a power line?
They weren't. ShanghaiBill apparently can't read.
on arrival found one pilot who had ejected from the military training jet caught in power lines
One of the crew's parachutes tangled with lines on their way down.
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Heh, he was pretty much all the way down when the chute hit those power lines.
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They did not fly into a power line. One of the pilots landed on a power line.
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They did not fly into a power line. One of the pilots landed on a power line.
Ah hell, not incredibly fortuitously, it really only matters who is reporting the story... a power line was violated. Who are we to judge? #Methree.
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Why didn't their GPS warn them of the powerline?
Because a GPS tells you where you are.
A Ground Proximity Warning System (GPWS) will warn you if you are about to fly into terrain. However, if you are flying low enough to be hitting a powerline in a residential neighborhood, you are most likely on a low-flying exercise and you'll have turned off all those pesky alarms.
Signed,
Someone who flew low enough to be hitting a powerline during flight training.
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But the question is, why was a training flight being conducted over populated areas - especially a low flying training flight? There is plenty of empty unpopulated land where such flights can be conducted, the military even built several fake towns complete with building shells for training purposes.
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Because towns grew in the empty area around the airbase?
They might be using a 50 (or more) years old airbase, built back when Texas (or that specific area of it) had a tenth of its population.
A big military airbase will have a huge growing effect on nearby communities, and compounded over 50 or 70 years (WW2 started about 80 years ago)...
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And now we have the USAF flunky trying desperately to cover up the fact of this low level training exercise. Obviously they were chasing a UFO while on a training exercise - being the only AF jet in the area able to pursue.
I'm hoping we can get some blurry photos of a blob out of this at least. That officially don't exist, of course.
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Second, actual training maneuvers are typically conducted in sparsely populated areas which are designated as Military Operation Areas (MOAs) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org] However in order to transition between the training area and the airport, you must frequently overfly populated areas. Just as an example, an engin
Re: Okay, but (Score:1)
Re: Okay, but (Score:1)
Doesn't matter to most people.
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It's a plane crash, it's interesting.
Its a damn site more interesting that seeing story after story about Ivermectin, Bitcoin, Year of Linux, Facebook stole my virginity etc etc etc
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Sight. "a damn sight"....
Because Dicedot is turning into Yahoo (Score:1)
The editors don't care or they'd cease shitting up the place with stuff that is simply NOT computer or tech news.
The aviationists here don't come here for generic trash news, we go to professional sites where everyone serious about aviation get their news. We don't fucking need normie ABC links wasting space.
Further, until the crash investigation is finished there's zero point in speculation/wanking.
Re:Because Dicedot is turning into Yahoo (Score:5, Interesting)
Hate to break it to you, but Slashdot has *never* been just about computer or tech news - I've been wasting my time here now for 23 years, and I can remember loads of non-tech, non-computer stories from way back when.
Stop moaning, its not just about you and what you want to see here - I'm an aviation enthusiast as well, and I most definitely like to come here for aviation stories because the comments are often interesting, because its largely a different demographic to places like Airliners.Net (which has all its own issues). And judging by how many comments many aviation-orientated stories get, theres a lot of other people who find it interesting as well.
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It was pretty tech focused 24 years ago. The big change came when Slashdot realized how much, um, discussion it could generate by covering US political news.
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Convenient that you picked a time one year before the time when I said I have been active for here....
Even if thats true, you are well past the time of when complaints mattered.
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His id trumps yours though!
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Yup, totally didn't do that on purpose because it's funny.
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Clearly, heavier-than-air flight is not technology; it's magic.
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Why is this on Slashdot?
What do you believe should be allowed on /.?
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Poor bastard (Score:1)
That one pilot has some seriously bad luck. Not only are they involved in a training flight that obviously went very south (no pun intended) but then when they eject they manage to get caught in power lines. And of course this is all going on in the middle of a pandemic in a state where local officials have been actively working to allow the virus to spread and mutate, so best case scenario the doctors and nurses at the hospital are beyond exhausted after around 18 months of dealing with covid patients non-
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This is why you shouldn't perform jet training exercises over populated areas. Doing that is inviting back luck and risking civilians.
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This is why you shouldn't perform jet training exercises over populated areas. Doing that is inviting back luck and risking civilians.
Maybe not all training, but some training needs to be over populated areas. Presumably when a real call for action occurs, that action may need to be over a populated area. Training should cover all realistically expected conditions (and probably also some unrealistic ones as well.)
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Unfortunately, airports are often in populated areas, requiring airplane to fly over them to get to the airport.
Re: Poor bastard (Score:2)
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Urban growth. When Seatac airport in Seattle was built it was in the middle of nowhere, and there was nothing but industrial sites around all three of Boeing's airfields. Now they're all surrounded by residential neighborhoods.
Learn more before commenting (Score:3)
Aircraft have flown millions of perfectly safe sorties to training ranges. There are very few completely empty areas left in the world and given the loss rate the risk is trivial.
Training does not "invite bad luck" and safety stats are excellent with crashes quite rare. Civilian training flights also overfly population (else it would be impossible to land at most airports!).
Training flights are typically quite ordinary low-risk missions, not DACT etc which are done over ranges or remote areas. Sorties are
Re:Poor bastard (Score:5, Informative)
Glide angles (Score:2)
How do they handle their landings, do they keep the plane high enough to be able to glide in in case of an engine failure (like you should on a light airplane), or do they come in at 3 degrees and hope for the best?
(Might not have been engine failure of course. Indeed, probably was not if they ejected so badly.)
Also, in an eject, if successful and they are under silk, can they steer the parachute at all, like to avoid power lines?
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Depends on the ejection system. The T-45 is old enough that they probably are just along for the ride.
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Well, they would not be considered safe for non-military single engine aircraft. I certainly always like to come down nice and steep, full flaps that can be raised if needed, and almost had the fan stop once.
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Pandemic is irrelevant in this case but I understand the desire to throw it into every discussion. Rescue helos have their choice of military hospitals and can fly to any suitable location including Brooke Army Medical Center.
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It's just one more bit of shit luck. First you have to eject from your plane, then you get caught in power lines... the cherry on top is you're going to be hospitalized in a high covid spread area, so there's a not insignificant chance of catching covid while in the hospital being treated for burns. It's already common enough for people to get secondary infections from bad burns without an airborne contagion floating around.
Re:Poor bastard (Score:4, Informative)
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Fort Worth naval base? Why is there a naval base 700 miles from the ocean and even further than that from any other navigable waterway?
Aborted Too Late (Score:1)
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When was Texas **not** an embarrassment? Hell, they couldn't even be bothered to free their slaves until a couple of months after they had definitively lost the Civil War, and there are families who have resided there for 400 years which Texas still pretends aren't citizens.
The U.S. seem to have a problem with powerlines (Score:1)
...also, how can one burn from power lines? Electric arc?
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Also make sure to hold the metal pole with your LEFT hand, so the current goes right through your heart and kills you instantly.
If you do this before you procreate, you'll get a FREE Darwin award!
Same disclaimer as parent post.
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No need to be offensive...
I presume a pilot doesn't eject holding poles, saline solutions etc. but like a bird, would end up perched on a power line. Or is the parachute enough if it got caught and he touched the ground?
Re: The U.S. seem to have a problem with powerlin (Score:1)
The breakdown voltage of human skin is several tens of volts. Thus if you are barefoot or have wet sweaty shoes on, touching residential 110V is a bad idea.
The breakdown voltage of a flight suit is somewhat higher but since it's not designed for handling high voltage, it might be effectively zero.
The voltage of most anything I might describe as a "transmission line" is usually measured on tens of kilovolts, which will jump on right through anything not specifically designed to withstand it.
Transmission line
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Even if only the pilot's parachute got caught on one high tension line, there's possibly enough humidity to allow the parachute cords to be wet enough to conduct. In that case, the pilot would then reach tens of kV too, and would get some arcing.
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I live within shouting distance of a 153 kV 3-phase line. In 27 years, I have never seen a bird get anywhere near it.
Re: human skin, even a 12 V car battery can get nasty with fingers shredded and wet, as I discovered while helping someone with a corroded and loose battery connector.
When I was young I got across the terminals of a photoflash battery used as the B (plate supply) battery in a vacuum tube radio control transmitter. I don't remember much, except somehow ending up a distance away on the f
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No need to be offensive...
I presume a pilot doesn't eject holding poles, saline solutions etc. but like a bird, would end up perched on a power line. Or is the parachute enough if it got caught and he touched the ground?
Are you thinking he landed feet first balanced on a single line? WTF?
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Typically you or some part of your parachute, or both, touches two lines, a line and a pole, or something like that. You get a nice spark and maybe some stuff on fire. Usually it also messes with your parachute so you fall the rest of the way to the ground.
For example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?... [youtube.com]
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High tension lines are generally just bare metal, no insulation. The insulation between them is provided by the air gap. Bridge the air gap with anything, even parachute cords dampened by the humidity of the Gulf Coast, and you'll be passing current.
Fun fact: If you bridge it with something conductive like a copper wire it will vaporize and turn to plasma, now there is a conductive plasma current between the lines and if breakers upstream don't open fast enough you can have some really impressive firework
Most importantly: (Score:2)
There are two more people in the world who will be motivated to make sure that anyone they meet from Martin-Baker will not be able to pay for their own drinks. Ever.
Re: Beer keg for Egress Shop (Score:2)
Was the usual tribute in earlier days.
BTW Congress needs to fund more spares! (Score:2)
https://www.military.com/daily... [military.com]
Drawl (Score:2)
"Y'all a plane just crashed into all those houses"
I wonder what effect that Texas drawl has in the response time of emergency services.
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I was about to ask how they got hospitalized so fast when all the hospitals are overrun with COVID patients.
Karma (Score:1)
They'll be court martialed... (Score:4, Interesting)
For sure. A military pilot over a populated area has an absolute obligation to make every effort to ensure the plane does not hit a civilian area, up to and including dying with the plane if that's what this requires. This happened over San Diego like a decade ago. I said the same thing then, and it's exactly what happened. It's going to be what happens this time, too.