UK Will Not Copy EU Demand for Common Charging Cable (bbc.com) 205
The UK government says it is not "currently considering" copying European Union plans for a common charging cable. From a report: The EU has provisionally agreed all new portable electronic devices must, by autumn 2024, use a USB Type-C charger, a move it says will benefit consumers. Critics say it will stifle innovation. Under the current post-Brexit arrangements, the regulation would apply to Northern Ireland, according to EU and UK officials. According to the a December 2021 parliamentary report, the "new requirements may also apply to devices sold in Northern Ireland under the terms of the Northern Ireland protocol in the Brexit agreement, potentially triggering divergence of product standards with the rest of the UK." The treaty works by keeping Northern Ireland inside the EU's single market for goods, while the rest of the UK is outside it. A row between the UK and EU about how to reform the Northern Ireland protocol remains unresolved. A UK government spokesperson said "we are not currently considering replicating this requirement."
"stifle innovation" (Score:5, Insightful)
They scream into their pillows while both Displayport and Thunderbolt were folded into the USB-C umbrella.
Now those moves have admittedly made the thing a little bit of a mess but there is plainly room to innovate while still keeping to a cable standard. Your innovation has to actually be "innovative" enough to warrant inclusion into the specification.
Since by "critics" we can assume they mean "Apple" so I would say what really stifles innovation is hiding your very good magnetic connector behind patents and litigation rather than making it an open standard the rest of the industry can use to its betterment.
Re:"stifle innovation" (Score:5, Insightful)
This is cutting off our nose to spite our face. It doesn't even matter, everything will come with a USB C port anyway because nobody is going to make a special extra crap version just for the UK market.
Brexit has been a disaster and the government is desperate to prove that there are some tangible benefits. One way they are doing that is by rejecting EU standards in favour of stupid ones, like the imperial measurements system (feet, pounds, groats etc.) instead of metric. Any way we can punch ourselves in the face is promoted as an "independent country" doing "what's best for it, free from EU sanity".
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If de Pfeffel is so keen on Imperial measures he should do two things. Firstly piss off back to his country of birth. I hear they still use Imperial measures. Second perhaps he should hold a referendum on the subject and see what the general public think. Even my 77 year old mother who was actually brought up on Imperial measures would vote against it.
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Even previously safe Labour seats now have a Conservative MP.
When they stand in line at the airport in Malaga for 3 hours waiting to come home from their summer holiday, they look over at the EU only lanes and think "This isn't the Brexit I voted for" like the idiots they are.
Do UK politicians still not understand? (Score:5, Insightful)
They don't have a say in the matter. If the EU adopts a common charging cable requirement, that's what the UK will get anyway.
This is pure posturing from the BREXITEERs.
Re: Do UK politicians still not understand? (Score:5, Insightful)
No they do not, so be thankful (Score:2)
The EU market has 400m users. It really doesnâ(TM)t matter that UKG says, the de facto standard will happen.
Please don't let the idiots in charge hear you say things like this. If they ever figure this out they'll be clamouring for laws to ban USB-C charging ports just to prove the UK is different.
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For example try buying a none RoSH compliant iPhone in the USA. The EU decided lead based solder in electronic devices was bad and the rest of the world pretty much fell into line.
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It's because it's basically one device - and China also adopted RoHS rules pretty much so it limits non-RoHS production to other areas. The benefits of leaded solder for mass produced devices doesn't really justify the expense and difficulty in setting up a production line for Europe and one for everywhere else.
Also since China co
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In China that compliance is "Print a RoHS logo on the box. Also print FCC, ISO 9001, 128 gigabytes soild state, and an Apple logo. The product in the box is a screwdriver."
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Based on the summary, it's not that they are trying to have a say, it's that they don't care either way.
I don't see that as posturing.
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Maybe you aren't familiar with brexit. It's all about posturing, because there's nothing else. No benefits at all, only downsides.
With this the politicians can say they are giving British companies flexibility to screw over consumers with proprietary chargers, and fill our landfills with more e-waste. British e-waste.
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I've seen "Not for sale in California" on some small engines, so there's still enough of a market for some non-compliant products to be made. I don't see Apple doing something like that, though.
Same deal with a lot of powertrain mods for cars. No way to even make them legal in Cali, but they are still useful and effective in many other places.
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I've seen "Not for sale in California" on some small engines, so there's still enough of a market for some non-compliant products to be made. I don't see Apple doing something like that, though.
Why not? They can sell "USA-connector" phones in the UK. The world market is big enough for two models.
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Many nations not in the EU also want to reduce e-waste and have simply waited for the EU to do this to create a big enough market to force the issue. They will then follow suit.
I bet the USA won't, because.... lobbyists, bald eagles and and freedumb.
If Apple USA doesn't follow then the market is big enough that they can have two models and keep on playing their stupid games wherever possible.
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Or it doesn't matter, so why bother passing a law for something that will happen anyway. Don't they have parties to go to or something.
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If this was 1992 and we were in third grade that would be a very insulting comment.
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Will the US get it? Tesla still uses proprietary charging cables in the US, but has been required to use the CCS standard in Europe. I wouldn't say it's a certainty at all.
Maybe that's why the UK wants to avoid it. Makes it easier for the US to flood our market with US spec products.
If we don't mandate it in the UK, some companies, mostly British ones, will screw us with proprietary chargers. Depends how profitable it is. They already have to make a special plug for the UK, since we don't use the EU standar
LOL (Score:3, Insightful)
Sorry UK, no one is going to produce special products for you. How you have not realised that after several years of Brexit failure is beyond me. There's literally no upside to being different other than reducing a potential market share.
I'll wager even British companies based in the UK will follow the EU's rules. After all having 10x the potential market size without a different SKU saves a lot of costs.
Big man Boris can beat his chest all he wants to look tough for his country bumpschkin voters, all the while they'll text each other how much better an independent Britain is on their mobile phones with USB-C ports.
Re: LOL (Score:2)
I don't see anyone claiming this is a win for Brexit, certainly not in the linked article.
You're right, we and producers will follow it anyway, which is fine and what everyone wants regardless of their opinion on Brexit. And this is why we have no need to bother legislating - it's not that we are opposed it it, we just have no need to copy it.
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Recent polling now shows that all areas of the UK think that brexit has been bad for us. Demographic wise, only leave voters over 65 think that it's actually going well.
Even some Tory MPs have been talking about getting back into the Single Market via the EEA, as a way to resolve the problems on the island of Ireland. I say problems, inflation in Northern Ireland is 8% lower than it is in the rest of the UK, so it's only really the unionists who have a big issue with it.
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Where are you getting that they want special products produced?
They're just choosing not to legislate on the issue.
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Where are you getting that they want special products produced?
They're just choosing not to legislate on the issue.
Omissions are telling. You may understand this if you were paying attention to Brexit propaganda the past 6 years. A significant portion of debate was about UK companies being able to do what UK companies want without the "tyranny" of EU rules.
Remember the biggest Brexit wins: Pint glasses now have the CE marking removed and replaced with with the crown emblem (not that EU rules prevented a crown emblem in the first place) and that passports are now blue (not that EU rules prevented blue passports in the fi
Stifle innovation? (Score:3)
Critics say it will stifle innovation.
I think they misspelled "profitability".
Doesn't make any difference (Score:3)
We don't need to copy it, so why waste legislative time on it. USB C is rapidly becoming the defacto standard anyway, it's really only Apple that needs to be forced. They aren't going to stick to lightening just for the UK once they move to USB C for the EU (and almost certainly the rest of the world too).
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What happens when we enter a post USB-C period?
Re:Doesn't make any difference (Score:4, Insightful)
Maybe we don't really need to for a good couple of decades, at which point the laws can be changed if anybody comes up with something that has genuine advantages that make it worth it to go back to non-standard charging interfaces. If things like RJ45 and 3.5mm jacks can last decades, I don't see why we can't stick to USB-C for a while. It seems to have plenty of room to grow. At least as cell phones are concerned.
Also, the law doesn't state that you can't put any other port on your device. So if some company comes out with a port that is truly revolutionary and will change the world, they can add that to their phone in addition to USBC.
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Maybe we don't really need to for a good couple of decades, at which point the laws can be changed if anybody comes up with something that has genuine advantages that make it worth it to go back to non-standard charging interfaces. If things like RJ45 and 3.5mm jacks can last decades, I don't see why we can't stick to USB-C for a while. It seems to have plenty of room to grow. At least as cell phones are concerned.
Also, the law doesn't state that you can't put any other port on your device. So if some company comes out with a port that is truly revolutionary and will change the world, they can add that to their phone in addition to USBC.
I don't think there's a big incentive for manufacturers to invent new USB connectors, pissing off your customers with a weird connector is not good business. Even Apple only did it because the previous standard sucked so much and they had the brand name recognition to make do with alternate connectors.
I'm not certain why Apple doesn't want to switch to USB-C. I suspect it has to do with a) they don't want to piss off their existing customers with a switch, b) they want the royalties from lightning accessori
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Same things as this now that USB2.0 seems to be on the wane. Complete with people complaining that in spite of the standard being updated in a timely fashion twice, they're sure it will never happen again.
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They aren't going to stick to lightening just for the UK once they move to USB C for the EU (and almost certainly the rest of the world too).
It's Apple, they like to Think Different. They're going to ride out Lightning for as long as they can, and since they already don't include chargers in the box, the same box they produce for US markets can work in the UK just as well. Well, not literally the same box, they presumably have localized marketing materials for warranty information and the like, but you get the idea.
My bet is that the EU will get special proprietary Apple wireless charging-only iPhones once the mandate is in place, because the ma
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My bet is that the EU will get special proprietary Apple wireless charging-only iPhones once the mandate is in place, because the mandate only applies to devices that can be charged via wired chargers.
I wouldn't take that bet, because I think there's a good chance you're right. But I think there's a good chance you're wrong, too, due to the proliferation and popularity of portable chargers.
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It's about reducing the amount of waste that ends up in landfill.
but what about scotland and northern ireland? (Score:2)
but what about scotland and northern ireland?
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Scotland will be in the same boat as the rest of the UK. I'm not sure the Scottish government will have any say in the matter as I don't think this will be a devolved issue.
Two Models? (Score:2)
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Would Apple make two different versions of the I-Phone, one with lightning and one with USB-C? Would it be region specific, as to where you buy each model? All signs point to 'no', because that costs Apple more money to have two separate production lines and separate inventories.
Samsung does this already. Popular phone models like Galaxy have entirely different CPU and video SOCs for the North American market (Snapdragon/Adreno) and the Euro/Asian (Exynos/Mali) markets.
Yeah, you would not want to make many variations, those would be better considered as different models, but two seems to not be a big deal.
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> "Samsung does this already. Popular phone models like Galaxy have entirely different CPU and video SOCs for the North American market (Snapdragon/Adreno) and the Euro/Asian (Exynos/Mali) markets."
blows my mind, they still do this.
Boy do I not miss Samsung.
Just do the one and be done with it, fools.
Doesn't matter (Score:5, Insightful)
They'll use exactly the same connector... (Score:5, Funny)
They'll use exactly the same connector, but the British one will be measured in inches.
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They'll use exactly the same connector, but the British one will be measured in inches.
I hope "exactly" the same. I've been buying JST connectors from China, sold as 2.5mm spacing. Some are exactly that, others actually the traditional 0.1" . With 8 pins, that adds up to 0.3mm, which is bad! (sorry, 1/8" - death to imperial measurements.)
UK "wanting" is irrelevant. (Score:3)
It doesn't matter what they "want". If companies decide to follow the EU laws/guidelines/whatever then the UK will get it regardless.
So saying you're "not planning on following" is utterly pointless, and sounds like a political statement more than something that will actually have any actual impact.
But eh, it's Bojo's government, so I'm not expecting brains there.
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It's just the old "fog in Channel, continent cut off" in a new guise.
British phones ... (Score:2)
I want to charge my phone with a Tesla supercharge (Score:2)
While standardizing can hinder some innovation, say with a smaller cable that will allow a smaller form factor, or a larger cable that can charge your device faster. Being that most device makers even without EU laws, had mostly decided on USB-C for charging. Also most EV makers have settled on the CCS-2 port for auto charging. We only have Apple and Tesla (in America) being the outliers there. However each of those companies are big enough to support their own standards. But really don't offer anything s
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The legislation itself is set to be reviewed. When the phone companies think USB-D is a better option, they can lobby for it, drafting a white paper or signing an open letter asking for a review. The Commission sends drafts of their working programmes to academia to gather comments on what else to include in their upcoming packages of measures. Also academics on their own initiative draft and send white papers to the Commission about evolutions of their field of technology and whatever they suggest the EU s
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If all the other phones are still on USB-C how does one break into the new tech.
You sell a UK/USA version with the new tech. And when the European customers cry about being left behind, Brussels capitulates.
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Or you could actually read about the legislation which has provision for revision in it precisely so they don't get stuck on an old standard. But it's easier to just invent stupid reasons to hate the EU, I get it.
This was the point of brexit (Score:3)
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The EU even sets standards for the US (Score:3)
Because companies don't want to make two products. A company I worked for made two different products for ROHS and then ended up switching everything to ROHS. Apple could easily produce two iphones models with different ports, but they probably won't.
To all the retards in the comments... (Score:2)
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This is taking back control, right here. We get the dregs of EU legislation anyway but with no opportunity to influence them in any way.
It doesnâ(TM)t matter. (Score:2)
The whole world will adopt this, if the EU makes it a requirement.
And this will result in what, exactly? (Score:2)
Oh yeah, my dear old country, UK - you know, that country which is world renowned for producing electronic devices and exporting them the world over ... ... oh wait, I must've dreamed that.
This "stance" by whoever made this pointless vacuous statement, is a pointless one.
It _would_ be valid if the UK actually manufactured and exported a significant amount of consumer electronic goods.
They don't. I'm not sure what the percentage is, but it's going to be super super low.
It seems my current government is under
Re:Contrary to their own detriment. (Score:5, Informative)
This will not stifle innovation. USB-C supports ALT mode. When you turn on ALT mode you can do whatever you want on the wires. There are ALT modes for DisplayPort, Ethernet, PCIe -- even Lightning functions. Note -- this is not USB running those protocols, in ALT mode the wires carry the actual electronic signals for these interfaces.
Apple knows this because their own laptops support ALT mode for DisplayPort.
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Clueless and Proud (Score:2)
The British can't all be that clueless.
Oh yes we can - have you seen our prime minister or the rest of the government? The last three prime ministers have all been vying for the title of worst prime minister ever which, in a country with a history as long as the UK is quite an achievement. Neville Chamberlain probably still holds that title but his grip on it is much less firm than it used to be and Boris is doing his level best to wrestle it from him.
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Neville Chamberlain probably still holds that title
I read an article recently which pretty much changed my mind on that. They put forwards a pretty convincing idea that he knew war was inevitable but (a) wanted to buy as much time as possible to rearm and (b) convince an unwilling public with recent memories of the great war that another was needed.
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The British can't all be that clueless. You see the articles where clueless brits say this isn't the brexit I voted for and then they prove it was by being contrary.
I tells ya, unless the world follows the EU's unquestionable wisdom, this is the end of the Western world, and possibly human civilization!
People have already died because Apple doesn't have the right connection, global warming has just been upgraded a degree C, and Jezuzz sAid anyone not obeying the EU's perfect decision is going to go to the 7th level of hell.
Sorry, but if you judge cluelessness on a freaking connector, we're going to have to retire "first world problems" and replace it with "Europe
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It's actually getting hard to distinguish fringe outrage from sarcasm these days. The only reason I can tell you're being sarcastic is that you're mixing your ideologies.
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It's actually getting hard to distinguish fringe outrage from sarcasm these days. The only reason I can tell you're being sarcastic is that you're mixing your ideologies.
I am being severely sarcastic.
The whole idea that the EU has all the right ideas is silly. If Apple kept with whatever it is that has the entire continent in an uproar, and is making life damn near impossible for the beleaguered citizens of all Europe..
(dropping out of sarcasm). It wouldn't make any difference at all. Nothing would actually change. GB neither loses nor gains anything by not participating in the foolishness.
Apple users haven't complained. It is just EU meddling in things that don't
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Most of the good laws that really made things better for British citizens came from the EU.
Everything passed since brexit has taken away our rights and protections.
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Most of the good laws that really made things better for British citizens came from the EU.
Everything passed since brexit has taken away our rights and protections.
You wont get me disagreeing with that. Brexit is a Trumpian move in England. We might have avoided it.
Seems this guy wanted to help both Trump and the Brexit cause. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]
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If it aint broke , break it (Score:2)
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Yes, you can spot them by fact that they recognize all the consumer benefits that were burned on the funeral pyre of British relevance by Leavers
Re: Contrary to their own detriment. (Score:5, Informative)
Roaming charges? What roaming charges? Don't travel much, do we?
Anyways, 4-day lorry driver waiting lines spring to mind, food shoetages, visa requirements, inflation, mess in NI, tariffs on exports to the biggest market, tariffs on imports from the biggest goods and food suppliers, you'll be wanting more I suppose?
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The fact that I will never, ever order anything from the UK ever again. I used to go on ebay.co.uk all the time but not any more. Outrageous shipping costs and 20% tax has killed it.
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That has happened in the US as well, not living in the US shipping costs from amazon have gone through the roof, its not because of brexit though.
Re: Contrary to their own detriment. (Score:2)
I don't need to do no fucking research, I'm in "roaming" on o2 all the time, I pay nothing. Reatard. Go viol8 your mum some more.
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Yes well done, only O2 arn't.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/bus... [bbc.co.uk]
HTH. Go find about this useful website called "google". Need that spelt in crayon for you? That'll be after you find your braincell hiding somewhere.
Re: Contrary to their own detriment. (Score:3)
Do you seriously think weâ(TM)ll get different iPhones to the rest of Europe? Weâ(TM)ll follow the EU laws through choice or otherwise! Part of the UK will have to follow this law anyway because Boris lied, sold out N. Ireland, undermined the UKâ(TM)s sovereignty and territorial integrity and turned part of it in to an EU vassal. Brexit isnâ(TM)t even done yet: see them going back on their word after five minutes and trying to remove part of the Brexit deal they signed up to (the NI P
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Do you seriously think weâ(TM)ll get different iPhones to the rest of Europe?
Sure, why not?
I assume Apple won't be putting USB connectors on any phones in the USA (or rest of the world) so that's the version you'll be getting in the UK. They'll probably charge you extra for it, too.
PS: If you switch to Android you'll even be able to post on /. like a normal person.
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PS: If you switch to Android you'll even be able to post on /. like a normal person.
You're probably just trolling, but disabling "Smart Quotes" on iPhone and iPad is easy.
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You're probably just trolling, but disabling "Smart Quotes" on iPhone and iPad is easy.
So why do so many people fail to do it?
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So why do so many people fail to do it?
Because most people don't post on slashdot and smart quotes work just fine everywhere else?
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So why do so many people fail to do it?
Lets's face it. iphones are simpler to use than Android. So IOS users are not accustomed to customising anything. Half of them don't know what that clockwork cog icon is used for. Android forces people to think slightly more. (only slightly)
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Lets's face it. iphones are simpler to use than Android.
Lol wut.
No they're utterly opaque if you're used to Android.
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Yes, Apple has stopped making translucent devices a few decades ago.
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Why would Apple split its product lines like that?
Because they make money on special chargers and special cables.
And once you're heavily invested in expensive chargers and expensive cables you're less likely to go to another brand.
Re: Contrary to their own detriment. (Score:4, Insightful)
I'm American but even I known that the consequences of Brexit are only starting to be felt. It will get much, much worse before it gets any better. And it is all your fault. You literally fell for focus group tested propaganda, put out by the rich, designed to keep more power for themselves at the expense of your country's well-being and financial success.
Honestly not unlike America...
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I'm American but even I known that the consequences of Brexit are only starting to be felt.
To be fair to the brexiteers it is hard to tell whether many of the effects being felt in Britain are a direct result of Brexit or the continuing utter incompetence of the current government.
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Brexit was implemented by the very same government so this would be distinction without a difference.
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It's possible that the GP was being fed their own personalized propaganda. We now know that Cambridge Analytica used Facebook to target individuals that were susceptable to lies and xenophobic messages down to an individual level.
Not that there weren't enough mainstream lies, that to this day people believe.
Brexit is like voting for Trump (Score:2)
It was a scream of rage at a complacent establishment that was ignoring the views of a large proportion of the population.
Re: Contrary to their own detriment. (Score:4, Insightful)
"You literally fell for focus group tested propaganda," that was what triggered the fear of "unregulated mass immigration from the EU". The reason it was done it seems was "put out by the rich, designed to keep more power for themselves at the expense of your country's well-being and financial success."
I know you may think your post was in disagreement with the parent, but at best it was orthogonal.
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Yep. It was the same old rhetoric about all your problems being due to the "foreigners".
It got Trump into power, too.
And Hitler.
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Funny. The most interesting articles I read about Brexit in the Guardian and Economist were talking about dodging the EU banking laws that were making it inconvenient for certain kinds of banking. Now that the EU is out of the picture the government is free to run whatever sort of laundry they wish. And driving out the skilled trades -- like doctors, nurses and lorry drivers will create lots of opportunities for anyone willing to acquire the skills. From a distant perspective (Canada) it seems like someone
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AHAHAHAHA! Wow. Really? Is that what they told you? And you believed them?
And now you are whining about not having enough workers?!?! By God, Brexiters are even dumber than I thought.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?... [youtube.com]
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Just how is Brexit going?
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lol. Apple aren't going to make a special UK charger version.
Like a lot of things coming up, you'll get the version dictated by the EU one.
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If we hadn't committed brexicide we could have been involved in shaping the standard, and as consumers we would benefit from it. Instead we get to be screwed over with proprietary chargers, when it is profitable to do so.
It's being different for the sake of being different, which is idiotic.
Re: Contrary to their own detriment. (Score:2)
Except that isn't likely to happen and if it were we could introduce a similar law whenever we wanted to. Unless you have some evidence to the contrary, to actually back up your opinion?
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Boris will soon bring back the grain [wikipedia.org] so you mean 15,680,000 grains.
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No, you can't. Apple will just lump you in with the EU anyway and sell you whatever they're selling them.
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You going to bring back the Whitworth thread system too in case the metric system doesn't catch on?
https://www.boltscience.com/pa... [boltscience.com]