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Earth

Korea Shatters Its Own Record for World's Lowest Fertility Rate 248

An anonymous reader quotes a report from Bloomberg: South Korea has once again shattered its own record for the world's lowest fertility rate as it faces the prospect of its population of 51 million people more than halving by the end of this century. Korean women were estimated, based on 2021 data, to have an average of just 0.81 children over their lifetimes, down from 0.84 a year earlier, the statistics office said Wednesday. The number of newborns declined last year to 260,600, which equates to about 0.5% of the population.

The number of women of child-bearing age fell 2% to 11,620,000 last year, signaling the fertility rate is only likely to deteriorate further. A typical Korean woman gave birth to her first child at age 32.6, up from 30.2 a decade earlier, according to the stats office. Her partner on average would be 35.1, compared with 33 a decade earlier. By region, the capital Seoul showed the lowest fertility rate at 0.63, while Sejong, home to government headquarters, had the highest at 1.28, according to the stats office. The most populous province, Gyeonggi, recorded 0.85, closer to the average. In the decades following the 1950-53 Korean War, the population at least doubled and in an effort to curb the baby boom in the early years of economic development, the government encouraged couples to have only one child. That policy was scrapped around the turn of the century as births started to sharply fall, prompting the government to spend tens of billion of dollars each year to encourage more children, but with little success so far.
"Korea is the world's fastest-aging nation among economies with per capita GDP of at least $30,000," notes Bloomberg, citing United Nations global population projections and World Bank data. "By 2100, its population will fall by 53% to 24 million, up from a 43% decline forecast in 2019."

"The forecast is a sobering reminder of the demographic threat and associated economic challenges confronting Bank of Korea Governor Rhee Chang-yong and President Yoon Suk Yeol, who both took office earlier this year."
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Korea Shatters Its Own Record for World's Lowest Fertility Rate

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  • by rsilvergun ( 571051 ) on Wednesday August 24, 2022 @11:34PM (#62820689)
    That after growing up on decades of science fiction telling me how the world was going to be massively overpopulated finding out that under population is likely to be a problem. It turns out that people don't just want to keep spitting out kids as fast as they can when they don't need them to tend to farm. And in fact many of them don't want any of them at all.

    It's possible that we'll see a handful of religious extremists Force the kind of poverty on the people and lack of access to birth control that can lead to increased birth rates but the problem with that is what tends to happen is our society collapses and then War and famine prevent the population from growing any further. So either way we're not likely to get much above the 8 billion that we're at now. Heck even China and India are having trouble growing their populations. In Africa won't be growing much longer if at all since they're rapidly modernizing.
    • by NFN_NLN ( 633283 ) on Wednesday August 24, 2022 @11:38PM (#62820703)

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]

      "Behavioral sink" is a term invented by ethologist John B. Calhoun to describe a collapse in behavior which can result from overcrowding. The term and concept derive from a series of over-population experiments Calhoun conducted on Norway rats between 1958 and 1962.[1] In the experiments, Calhoun and his researchers created a series of "rat utopias" – enclosed spaces in which rats were given unlimited access to food and water, enabling unfettered population growth. Calhoun coined the term "behavioral sink" in his February 1, 1962 report in an article titled "Population Density and Social Pathology" in Scientific American[2] on the rat experiment.[3] He would later perform similar experiments on mice, from 1968 to 1972.

      Calhoun's work became used as an animal model of societal collapse, and his study has become a touchstone of urban sociology and psychology in general.[4]

      • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 ) on Thursday August 25, 2022 @06:29AM (#62821365) Homepage Journal

        Human beings aren't rats though. In the case of SK it's the cost of raising children that is the main issue, and to a lesser extent women having greater expectations from relationships and their careers.

        Same thing is happening in Japan and in parts of Europe. People are realizing that they can have a lot more money and a fulfilling life with one or zero children. Effective and widely available birth control makes it practical.

        • by VeryFluffyBunny ( 5037285 ) on Thursday August 25, 2022 @07:39AM (#62821481)
          Yes, I remember reading about fertility problems after the emancipation of women in some Scandanavian countries. Apparently, professional women were delaying starting families, having fewer children, or not having children at all because of the financial & career burdens it imposed. What worked well was statutory, paid maternity leave, affordable or state-funded childcare, & laws against workplace discrimination. Like almost all OECD countries, S. Korea has statutory maternity leave but it's only (check's OECD's stats) 90 days.

          Who's going to care for their 3 month old babies when they go back to work? Who wants to go back to work when they're still recovering from pregnancy, childbirth, sleep deprivation, & exhaustion? Korea's also infamous for the typical numbers of hours people put into their jobs, & therefore what's expected of them. When are parents going to have time to spend with their children?
          • by Ed Tice ( 3732157 ) on Thursday August 25, 2022 @09:07AM (#62821691)
            Things like paid maternity leave and state-funded childcare "worked" in the sense that they made women believe that the burden of children would be less. Then women realized that, even with all of those things, children are still time consuming, expensive, and a career hindrance. You can mitigate those effects but you can't eliminate them. Even with all of those things, as the OP pointed out, having zero or one child does remains the most desirable choice in developed countries.
            • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

              It doesn't have to be perfect and mitigate all down sides to having children. Especially if men share the same burdens as much as possible.

            • by eth1 ( 94901 )

              Even with all of those things, as the OP pointed out, having zero or one child does remains the most desirable choice in developed countries.

              My wife can't have children due to some health issues, so when we got married, we decided to try an experiment (and also irritate her siblings with kids, because that's what siblings do...). We opened a separate bank account as the "No Kids Fund." We calculate everything we *would* have spent on kids (diapers, school supplies, doctors, extra mileage to get them to activities, everything), and put it into that account instead.

              It's basically our vacation fund, but we both work, so we can't actually take that

          • Re: (Score:2, Interesting)

            by Luckyo ( 1726890 )

            In most East Asian cultures, grandparents have raised children and parents took care of work, because those cultures were far more competitive in terms of time needed from parents for far longer.

            This has been true for Chinese for example, since communists banned foot binding for women, and they could be put to work next to men. It is even more common in Koreas and Japan.

            In Scandinavian cultures, it's even worse. The things you mentioned "What worked well was statutory, paid maternity leave, affordable or st

            • In Scandinavian cultures, it's even worse. The things you mentioned "What worked well was statutory, paid maternity leave, affordable or state-funded childcare, & laws against workplace discrimination." didn't not just work. They did the opposite. They took birth rate off the cliff.

              Telling us things that seem true in your head without checking any data?

              Sweden has a higher fertility rate than the U.S. 1.7 vs 1.6. It was 1.5 in 2000. So they actually seem to have had some success in boosting the fertility rate (or possibly you were thinking of an anti-gravity cliff). Perhaps they can up the rate more, with more of those policies which you imagine are a disaster.

              Denmark also recovered from a fertility low of 1.38 in 1983 to the 1.7-1.9 range were it has fluctuated now for over 30 years.

              S

        • The same thing is pretty much happening throughout the industrialized world, and in countries that are industrializing. Even China is seeing a population decline (and no, the irony is not lost). Some of it is cost of living, a lot of it is simply a long understood demographic effect of wealthier populations tending to have less children. Demographers have observed it even in population estimates from Early Modern England, where a growing middle class began to have smaller families, whereas the lower classes

    • by youngone ( 975102 ) on Wednesday August 24, 2022 @11:45PM (#62820727)
      The Bank of Korea Governor seems to think its a problem, mostly because his remit will revolve around endless economic growth and that is helped by an increasing population.
      Koreans are clearly not too bothered, in much the same way that the Japanese got rich and decided to stop having children too.
      One of my offspring has decided he has no interest in breeding, and most of his friends seem to feel the same way.
      To be really honest, if I was 20 again and know what I know now I would not have any children either.
      • The Bank of Korea Governor seems to think its a problem, mostly because his remit will revolve around endless economic growth

        It's not a problem for him, he'll be dead.

      • Koreans aren't bothered because they're stuck in a nightmare rat race and don't have time, energy or money to for dating and family. Same with Japan.

        • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

          by MBGMorden ( 803437 )

          Tell that to a tribesman walking around hunting for dinner or a medieval serf just barely managing to feed themselves. Life throughout most of history has been SIGNIFICANTLY harder than it is now, yet people still were reproducing in great numbers.

          Most people who claim to not have the time, energy, or money to have children are just lying to themselves. They simply now have the option to not have children if/when they don't want them. I'm not saying that's a bad thing, but culturally its an option that's

    • by OrangeTide ( 124937 ) on Wednesday August 24, 2022 @11:52PM (#62820747) Homepage Journal

      if you want to lower birth rates. make sure women in your society are educated and your highly industrialized economy means a couple both have to work full time careers in order to afford a house. keeps people from having more than one or two kids once they realize how much it costs to raise them and send them to college.

      • And keep the religious nuts from gaining political power.

      • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

        by quonset ( 4839537 )

        if you want to lower birth rates. make sure women in your society are educated

        Thank you. Came here to say the same thing. It's a known fact that societies where women are educated have lower birth rates than those where they're not. You can look at any country and compare education levels and see this.

        I remember reading years ago that when immigrants migrate to this country (the U.S.) who come from locations where women spit out babies left and right, the birth rate of their offspring declines to about 1 o

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by Train0987 ( 1059246 )

      All the entitlement programs you guys have created for yourselves over the past century require an ever-growing population of taxpayers to pay for them. Underpopulation wouldn't be a problem if you'd stop stealing money from people who haven't even been born yet.

      • by OrangeTide ( 124937 ) on Thursday August 25, 2022 @12:23AM (#62820785) Homepage Journal

        I guess we could probably live without a few of these aircraft carriers, save a trillion or so. Maybe skip a few oil wars, save a few more trillion. Makes Biden's 10k debt forgiveness seem like a drop in the bucket.

        • by Orgasmatron ( 8103 ) on Thursday August 25, 2022 @03:13AM (#62821043)

          Aircraft carriers cost around $13 billion dollars. Biden's "10k debt forgiveness" is going to cost somewhere in the vicinity of $300 billion, or about two dozen carriers (which is more than twice as many as we actually plan to build).

          We have smaller carriers too, but the math gets worse for this comparison when you aren't looking at the brand new fleet carriers.

          • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

            by Anonymous Coward
            $13B if you don't want to design one, have any planes on it, nuke fuel it up, have any trained pilots or sailors, etc. Your "2 dozen" is probably a lot more like 6.

            Much like how you can build a nuclear missile silo for like $1M. It only really costs anything when you want it to be capable of the thing you actually built it for and include the cost of the rocket and warhead. But don't that that stop you from 4-digit-UID whining about spending what amounts to a rounding error on helping people.
          • by angel'o'sphere ( 80593 ) <angelo,schneider&oomentor,de> on Thursday August 25, 2022 @04:32AM (#62821179) Journal

            A carrier might cost 13 Billion.
            The planes on it cost 100 Billion more.
            A year of operation is probably 25 billion ...

        • by quantaman ( 517394 ) on Thursday August 25, 2022 @11:32AM (#62822185)

          I guess we could probably live without a few of these aircraft carriers, save a trillion or so. Maybe skip a few oil wars, save a few more trillion. Makes Biden's 10k debt forgiveness seem like a drop in the bucket.

          The war in Ukraine has made me much more forgiving of the US defence budget than I would have been a year ago.

      • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 ) on Thursday August 25, 2022 @06:32AM (#62821367) Homepage Journal

        The boomers assumed that things would carry on as they did for them, forever. Gave themselves really great pensions and hoarded all that wealth.

        Now it's all falling apart they feel entitled to it, because they "worked hard all their lives". Meanwhile the younger generations are locked out of much of that prosperity by house prices, and all the really good pension schemes are closed.

        • Indeed. Baby boomers are the wealthiest generation in human history. They literally had the world handed to them by their parents; who fought a world war, worked their asses off to build a massive economic engine. The Boomers took it, bought themselves cheap educations, life-long careers, voted like-minded individuals into power who could keep the whole thing rolling, and now that they're dropping off, the rest of us have to figure how to clean up the financial and environmental mess they left.

    • That after growing up on decades of science fiction telling me how the world was going to be massively overpopulated finding out that under population is likely to be a problem.

      Underpopulation is not a problem. Growth economics is. Wealthy nations relying on the fact that the young support the ever older and pushing debt down the generations. Don't let Korea fool you. Type "population of the world" into google and have a look at the trend, you could never get a straighter and more linear line, South Korea doesn't even register on it. We are still adding a billion people to the planet every 12 years.

      • You can have economic growth without population growth. And even if you don't have GDP growth you can have lifestyle growth. If efficiency increases at a rate greater than population decline, there will still be a net increase in lifestyle quality.

        This seems entirely possible as the cost of energy, at some point, will plummet. With less people, the cost of materials will go down. And we are getting better and better at production with less labor.

      • by timeOday ( 582209 ) on Thursday August 25, 2022 @09:21AM (#62821743)

        Underpopulation is not a problem. Growth economics is. Wealthy nations relying on the fact that the young support the ever older and pushing debt down the generation

        There is no economic system in which a lower ratio of workers to total population will not cause economic pain.

        • There is no economic system in which a lower ratio of workers to total population will not cause economic pain.

          I guess you could look at this two ways: Either we're making a mistake now by producing less children, or we've been making a mistake for the past two centuries by producing so many children that a crash was inevitable.

          A weirder thing about what you're saying is that if you look at it industry-by-industry, what you're saying is theoretically correct but empirically wrong. As the ratio of agricultural workers to total population has gone down, for instance, the amount of surplus food has kept going up.

          • Oh, I agree that population growth is a sort of pyramid scheme that could not have increased forever. (Just as the same is true of population decline, if the human race is to continue). I also agree that a declining ratio of workers to total population could be offset by increased worker productivity. Although those workers might feel annoyed that an ever-larger share of their ever-increasing productivity is being "taken away" and consumed by people other than themselves. All of this has already begun i
            • by clawsoon ( 748629 ) on Thursday August 25, 2022 @10:37AM (#62822017)

              Although those workers might feel annoyed

              One thing that jumped out at me during the pandemic was how many essential workers were poorly-paid. It got me thinking that we've organized our economy around having the most desperate people do the most important work as a way of ensuring that it gets done. A trust-fund kid probably won't show up for their second day shoveling out the hog barn or checking out a thousand people at the grocery store, but somebody who has barely enough money to get through the week probably will.

    • by jlar ( 584848 )

      So either way we're not likely to get much above the 8 billion that we're at now. Heck even China and India are having trouble growing their populations. In Africa won't be growing much longer if at all since they're rapidly modernizing.

      The most recent UN projections do not show a decline in World population in the coming 50 years but rather an increase to around 10.5 billion with the population in Africa having by far the highest population growth rate of any continent. In 2022 the population of Africa is around 1.4 billion (17.7% of World population) while it is projected to reach 3.4 billion (32.2% of World population) in fifty years.

      So what we will be seeing in the next 50 years will be rapid population growth in Africa (increase of ar

    • That after growing up on decades of science fiction telling me how the world was going to be massively overpopulated finding out that under population is likely to be a problem. It turns out that people don't just want to keep spitting out kids as fast as they can when they don't need them to tend to farm. And in fact many of them don't want any of them at all.

      It's possible that we'll see a handful of religious extremists Force the kind of poverty on the people and lack of access to birth control that can lead to increased birth rates but the problem with that is what tends to happen is our society collapses and then War and famine prevent the population from growing any further. So either way we're not likely to get much above the 8 billion that we're at now. Heck even China and India are having trouble growing their populations. In Africa won't be growing much longer if at all since they're rapidly modernizing.

      This is incorrect. Most of the Baby Boomers were not born to farming families. Most of them were born in the newly-built suburbs to families created from soldiers returning from World War II.

      That causes of decreased children are numerous:
      - People delaying having children until much older in life. This is right in TFS. If women start having children in their mid-thirties, they are already well past their peak fertility and only a few years away from the fertility cliff.
      - This goes hand-in-hand with people re

      • This is incorrect. Most of the Baby Boomers were not born to farming families. Most of them were born in the newly-built suburbs to families created from soldiers returning from World War II.

        True, but just barely. By 1945 the suburbs hadn't yet grown the way they have now, and nearly half of America were indeed living in rural areas (*). But rural families, even then, tended to have more children than urban (or suburban) families, so a large fraction of baby boomers were born in rural areas.

        They tend to be ignored in popular culture because "listen to country music and drive a beat-up pickup truck" doesn't fit the stereotype "baby boomer."

        ...
        That causes of decreased children are numerous:

        1. Women can have fewer children, due to the advent o

      • You can raise a child for relatively cheap, but most people don't want to do that. Why would they? The median amount spent on a child is around US$300,000 and families that can sacrifice to do that do so. People don't have children in order to help population demographics. They have children because they want to. And once they have children, those children tend to be the center of their world which is some combination of great reward and huge sacrifice. I don't know how these statistics are calculate
    • Cultural evolution will take place.

      The cultures and societies that place importance and value on having children will remain and those that opt to not have children (or not enough of them) will wither and die.

      The only thing evolution cares about is producing offspring. Whether its your genes, your culture, or your attitude that prevents that, its irrelevant - those who do not reproduce are dead-ends.

  • Decreasing the human population a bit will be helpful to the environment. But doing it too abruptly will create havoc.

    This may be a little too fast.

    The next few decades may be interesting. Economies have not been designed for shrinking populations.

    • If that happens over here in the US, who is going to pay off the national debt? At least there won't be as many students left to forgive.
      • National debt is just "paper", or to be more accurate digits. Will the US have potentially high enough productivity and natural resources to maintain a high median standard of living? Obviously yes, it's "just" a question of resource assignment. The paper can be printed.

        • Debt has two sides - the borrower and the lender.

          Printing paper impoverishes the people who were counting on an honest repayment of that debt - pension funds, individual retirement accounts, etc. If the plan is to default or soft-default on that debt, those people (just about everyone, I think) are going to need to rethink their retirement plans.

      • The US has effective monetary policy and the "debt" is just Treasury bonds. That is easy to manage in all reasonable scenarios. If the dollar needs to be a little weaker to shrink the "debt," we can dictate that.

      • by skam240 ( 789197 )

        As long as the US is a draw for immigrants this wont happen here unless we let it by not letting at least some in.

    • There are, of course a few interpretations of a shrinking population that have not yet been explored. If geneticists devise methods of making people smaller. the population can both shrink and grow to many benefits, Much of the heavy work is now done by machines and with AI being developed to replace human thinking with a much superior thought mechanism, human brains will be mere extravagance not needed in playing computer games which is all that remains for humans to do. If they are reduced to the size of
  • Make it clear that the world they're being brought into should be better than the one the mother was brought into, and I'd expect this situation to straighten out in short order.

    A child that can expect to be appreciated as a contributor to society, and who'll live in a less crowded world with a recovering environment? That's the ticket!

    • by backslashdot ( 95548 ) on Thursday August 25, 2022 @01:25AM (#62820923)

      So far, there is an inverse relationship between wealth and reproduction. In fact poor people more financial insecurity have the most kids.

      • by RobinH ( 124750 )
        A lot of that is just access to sex ed and birth control. It's no coincidence that something like 75% of the women accessing abortion services in the US live below the poverty line, and over half of them already have at least one kid.
      • by mjwx ( 966435 )

        So far, there is an inverse relationship between wealth and reproduction. In fact poor people more financial insecurity have the most kids.

        This is mainly because in poorer countries where good, high paying jobs aren't plentiful and no social security safety net, kids are the retirement plan. In developing countries kids aren't as expensive as they are in developed nations and can be put to work earlier.

        In countries like Australia and the UK, this kind of thing can be put down to poor impulse control, but when looking at why the UK has an average of less than 2 children per woman and Colombia has an average in excess of 4, this is less of an

  • by alvian ( 6203170 ) on Thursday August 25, 2022 @12:43AM (#62820819)
    Relax the immigration laws. US is also experiencing low birth rates but it is the immigration thatâ(TM)s growing the overall population. Problems for more homogeneous countries like Korea and Japan will be racial tensions from immigrants.
    • Because there's nothing like racial tensions in the US, allright...

    • But but but brownpeople, they must be kept out! Also on a related note why can no one get staff right now!

      It always sickens me to hear people say that immigrants are "stealing" jobs that they themselves don't actually want to do.

      • There is a lack of staff in the same way as McDonalds have a lack of food for sale. If you go to McDonalds and are only willing to pay 10 cents for a burger, they won't sell you one.

        • There are many businesses that are only marginally productive and won't be economically viable paying living wages. I'm not so sure I'll miss them but that's a separate discussion.
  • by ihaveamo ( 989662 ) on Thursday August 25, 2022 @01:10AM (#62820875)
    Almost every single major issue on the planet comes down to resources (aka "too many people") ...... Why is it "Sobering" that South Korea is reducing its carbon footprint by half?
    • Globalised society is fragile, if it collapses the number of eaters it could sustain would collapse too and the number of useless eaters even faster. That would be a bit of a shit show. Malthus ahoy.

    • Why is it "Sobering" that South Korea is reducing its carbon footprint by half?

      South Korea much like the west has built a society based on pushing the needs of old onto the young in an unsustainable way. The sobering part is not the carbon footprint, or the resources of the planet. The sobering part is the very real risk of economical / societal collapse when the bill comes due and there's no one to pay it. The issue isn't low birth rate, it's aging population.

    • Lack of resources is caused by too few people, not too many.

      The days when "resources" were just lying around waiting to be picked up are, for the most part, long gone. Resources are the result of human action - we build and develop farms, we build and develop mines, we build and develop factories. These are the places where our resources come from.

      I can only think of one resources off the top of my head that is still gathered: (ocean) seafood. I'm sure there are others, but the list isn't long.

  • The only solution for Korea is in-vitro gametogenesis. There is no other way. In fact that is the solution for humanity as well. We need to decouple reproduction and sex. Sex is for pleasure. Replication is for propagation. Why should the two be connected? Evolution had to trick us into replicating by coupling pleasure with it.

    • Break out the Axolotl Tanks!

    • Just create AGI and call the androids our kids. Why stick with messy biology? Family gives emotional attachment to bio kids, but without I fail to see much difference.

      • That would be fine until all the human 'parents' die and there's only androids left. It's a cool plot for a SF novel but I'm not sure how I'd feel about that IRL

        Besides, current AI is nothing like AGI. At the rate things are going climate change and/or nuclear war will take care of us long before we get anywhere near to having AGI.

    • by kubajz ( 964091 )
      Does that mean that the in vitro kids would be raised by robots? I must be missing something, because you seem to imply that the hardest time when having kids is before they are born?
  • If north korea waits for long enough they'll win, because there won't be anyone in south korea.

    • Well, North Koreans aren't exactly breeding like rabbits either, and there's also that thing with famine and a lack of healthcare.

      • by qaz123 ( 2841887 )
        1.91 fertility rate in North Korea
        as opposed to 0.81 in South Korea
        and the last famine happened in the 1990s
        • and the last famine happened in the 1990s

          You should get internet access, you'd be able to access news even with your busy schedule!

  • ....but not a threat to people who will all have better lives with less children and less people

    If your economy is built around population growth, then it fails when the population shrinks - but the people themselves are individually richer

  • To prevent a 2C average increase and catastrophic tipping-point anthropogenic climate change, we need to emit less than 2.1 tonnes of CO2e per person per year [iop.org] in the short term, and 0 tonnes by the medium term.

    Having 1 child averages 58.6 tonnes of CO2e per parent per year [iop.org], 23.7 in poor countries, and 117.7 in rich countries like the USA (2050 vs life expectancy).

    58.6 > 2.1.

    We need to have a fertility rate of about 0.01 per person for several decades, or we'll turn the Anthropocene extinction into
  • ... they go out and vote!
  • One thing that this discussion doesn't seem to mention much is the impact on caring for aging parents when there is only one child. I have known people who were only children who had to care for their parents, and it was a significant burden compared to those who had brothers and/or sisters with which they could share the effort. And then there is the matter of childless couples who have no one to care for them when they get older. Hopefully they'll have lots of money saved up from never having to raise kid
  • What is the average education level of a SK woman? A study I read about showed a direct correlation showing the more educated the woman was, the fewer children she had. This was even starker where it was Mathematics or STEM she was educated in. I think the Taliban Moslems know this implicitly and that is why they do not allow women to get schooling. If a woman knows she has options and can get a good job, she is less likely to stay at home an have babies.

Suggest you just sit there and wait till life gets easier.

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