NYC Could Lose 10,000 Airbnb Listings Because of New Short-Term Rental Law (npr.org) 114
An anonymous reader quotes a report from NPR: A new short-term rental registration law put forth by the administration of New York City Mayor Eric Adams could remove thousands of Airbnb listings from the market next month. The new measure, which will go into effect in January, will require Airbnb hosts to register their short-term rentals with the city's database -- including proof that the hosts themselves reside there, and that their home abides by local zoning and safety requirements. If Airbnb hosts fail to comply, they could face $1,000 to $5,000 in penalty fees.https://codelibrary.amlegal.com/codes/newyorkcity/latest/NYCadmin/0-0-0-133488
Christian Klossner, executive director for the city's Office of Special Enforcement, told the New York Daily News that he expects to see 10,000 listings disappear after the new regulations go into effect. "Every illegal short-term rental in our city represents a unit of housing that is not available for real New Yorkers to live in," New York State Senator Liz Krueger said in July, following news of the lawsuit. "In the middle of an ongoing affordable housing crisis, every single unit matters." There are nearly 40,000 Airbnb listings in New York City alone, according to InsideAirbnb, which tracks these numbers. More than half of those listings, according to the database, are for an entire home, or apartment. A spokesperson for Airbnb said the new regulations will hurt average New Yorkers who are struggling to keep up with rising costs.
"Airbnb agrees regular New Yorkers should be able to share their home and not be targeted by the City, and we urge the administration to work with our Host community to support a regulatory framework that helps responsible Hosts and targets illegal hotel operators," Nathan Rotman, public policy regional lead for Airbnb, said in a statement to NPR on Wednesday.
Christian Klossner, executive director for the city's Office of Special Enforcement, told the New York Daily News that he expects to see 10,000 listings disappear after the new regulations go into effect. "Every illegal short-term rental in our city represents a unit of housing that is not available for real New Yorkers to live in," New York State Senator Liz Krueger said in July, following news of the lawsuit. "In the middle of an ongoing affordable housing crisis, every single unit matters." There are nearly 40,000 Airbnb listings in New York City alone, according to InsideAirbnb, which tracks these numbers. More than half of those listings, according to the database, are for an entire home, or apartment. A spokesperson for Airbnb said the new regulations will hurt average New Yorkers who are struggling to keep up with rising costs.
"Airbnb agrees regular New Yorkers should be able to share their home and not be targeted by the City, and we urge the administration to work with our Host community to support a regulatory framework that helps responsible Hosts and targets illegal hotel operators," Nathan Rotman, public policy regional lead for Airbnb, said in a statement to NPR on Wednesday.
In that case, lock up airbnb (Score:5, Insightful)
Airbnb's whole basis of profitability is that people are buying and/or renting homes and turning them into airbnbs. And even supposedly legitimate use still removes units from the rental market, including partial units needed by people with low incomes.
Re: In that case, lock up airbnb (Score:3, Insightful)
Eh, Airbnb works for me. I don't want to stay in LA any longer than I have to, so I don't want a lease. And if the rental isn't what was promised, or an outright fraud, then you have another means of disputing it besides the courts, and if that doesn't work, there's always the nuclear chargeback option.
Re: In that case, lock up airbnb (Score:5, Informative)
Eh, Airbnb works for me. I don't want to stay in LA any longer than I have to, so I don't want a lease. And if the rental isn't what was promised, or an outright fraud, then you have another means of disputing it besides the courts, and if that doesn't work, there's always the nuclear chargeback option.
There's these things called hotels and motels. Regulated, no need for a lease.
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Clearly there is a market for these types of places, but the hotel/motel is the only option outside of these houses for rent.
The other plus would be that it might be closer to somewhere, or a convenient location for whatever you are doing.
The downsides are no regulation, low accountability, and someone can literally put spy cams in the house and you wont know unless you really look (regulation should take care of th
Re: In that case, lock up airbnb (Score:4, Insightful)
Renting was the first thing I was looking at doing as prior to this I was thinking airbnb was basically an alternative to a hotel, until somebody pointed out to me that you can do months at a time, with no lease required. Main reason I decided to do airbnb wasn't even the reasons I stated, rather in LA it's very hard to find any kind of apartment that has an actual laundry room. Where I'm from, Phoenix, it's basically a foregone conclusion that anything you rent will have a laundry room, but here in LA it's basically a luxury, and no fucking way am I going to babysit my laundry every week at a laundromat. Another advantage I have with airbnb is that I don't have to go through all of the crap of setting up accounts with the local utilities, or even pay utility bills at all.
Overall a LOT less hassle than renting.
Re: In that case, lock up airbnb (Score:4, Interesting)
Laundromats are great. Most of my girlfriends I've had thats exactly how I met them. Its one of the joys of inner city living, if you know what your doing.
Re: In that case, lock up airbnb (Score:2)
âoeI met most of my girlfriends at a laundromatâ may say more about you than you think, Colonel. :D
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âoeI met most of my girlfriends at a laundromatâ may say more about you than you think, Colonel. :D
...He dates laundry!
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Short-term furnished rentals have been 'a thing' for countless decades, long before Air BNB's founders parents were even born.
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Re: In that case, lock up airbnb (Score:3)
Yeah....no. I'm not staying in a hotel for 3+ months. That would get real old real fast, not to mention cost even more in what is already an overpriced, overcrowded city. Another reason I didn't rent an apartment here is because apparently in Los Angeles, having a laundry room is considered a luxury. I'm not babysitting my laundry every damn week, and hotels have the same problem.
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So do the WFH (work from home) thing. It's all the rage, it's here to stay, and it's damn convenient.
If your current line of work can't be done remotely, then why not change it - a lateral pivot to something closely related can work out well.
1. Lowered expenses == bigger profit margins;
2. WFH means getting to sleep in, work late (doing an article right now at 10 pm while spareribs are cooking for company coming over later this week - can't do that in an airbnb or hotel because I'd be in the wrong cit
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So do the WFH (work from home) thing. It's all the rage, it's here to stay, and it's damn convenient.
If your current line of work can't be done remotely, then why not change it - a lateral pivot to something closely related can work out well.
I thought you said you were retired? Anyways, my previous job was work from home, but I find I prefer going to the office where I work now. Lots of reasons, among them:
1. It's entirely dress casual
2. Socializing with coworkers
3. The stuff we have here is just fucking cool. Although you don't know what I'm talking about, you've seen it.
1. Lowered expenses == bigger profit margins;
If I had utility bills to pay, it would actually cost me more to be at home. I basically turn everything off when I'm gone.
2. WFH means getting to sleep in, work late (doing an article right now at 10 pm while spareribs are cooking for company coming over later this week - can't do that in an airbnb or hotel because I'd be in the wrong city);
I don't really have a clock to follow to begin with.
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Retired in 2016. Devoted myself to volunteer work. But now that I have developed computer environments that actually let me work the way *I* want, instead of using stupid screen readers and magnifiers, I've been busy also doing other things in the second half of this year. And there's a problem I can bring my unique insights to, so I'm doing the start-up thing.
This is completely congruent with what I told my co-workers in the 90s when they asked me when I was going to retire. At 97, a week before I drop d
Re: In that case, lock up airbnb (Score:2)
Anyway, I've finished for the evening, tomorrow is time to cook 10 pounds of chicken (company coming). The menu includes spanish rice, baked potato wedges with choice of melted mozzarella or sour cream, veggies, various ice creams, wine and soft drinks.
Sounds like a lot of work. It cost me $5 to get half a pound of beef tri-tip with a side of basmati rice, ravioli, lo mein, some delicious peppers that I can't remember the name of, and chicken soup. Soft drinks, including the barista bar, are free all day long. There's a frozen yogurt bar that's also free, but I only do that once or twice a week.
After work I just went to the beach -- it's only waking distance.
All I have planned for tomorrow is a booty call till next year.
And not a single story on the front page about Musk's twitter fiasco, when it's been major news on mainstream media? I guess they can be even less relevant, but they'd have to really work at it.
You judge the quality of a "nerd" t
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>Airbnb's whole basis of profitability is that people are buying and/or renting homes and turning them into airbnbs. And even supposedly legitimate use still removes units from the rental market, including partial units needed by people with low incomes.
Most I've stayed in would not have been part of the rental market:
* Tiny ADUs
* Vacation homes in places few people live year-round
>There's these things called hotels and motels.
* Typically much more expensive. A nice AirBNB vs s two-star ?otel with lo
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There's a saying about people who know the cost of everything and the value of nothing.
If your employer is paying for it, let them pay accordingly.
If you're doing this as a vacation thing, spend the damn money to ensure you have a really good time.
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"Better hotels" generally don't exist, or are booked. They also rarely have usable kitchens.
When I stay at an AirBNB, it's never paid for by my employer.
> If you're doing this as a vacation thing, spend the damn money to ensure you have a really good time.
Among the reasons to avoid hotels even on the rare occasions they exist.
Re: In that case, lock up airbnb (Score:4, Interesting)
There's a difference between a rental that someone resides in, even if it's not for a year or even six months, than a rental that numerous people each rent as a secondary accommodation to their permanent residence, and sits vacant more than half the time.
My neighborhood doesn't have an HOA but it does have CC&Rs that are still 'live' in that the neighborhood can get together and follow a process to propose amendments, have dialogue on those amendments, and vote on approving them. Since we don't have an HOA, we saw investors attempt to come in to start turning houses into short-term rentals, complete with a couple of incidents that require the police to respond to those houses, and we saw realtors trying to advertise houses in our neighborhood as being good for this sort of thing. So we got together and amended the CC&Rs to prohibit rentals under 30 days. Of the eighty or so lots, only four owners voted against, and those were the four that were trying to commoditize our neighborhood.
Part of the reason we had to do this is our city has been hamstrung by the state government, prohibiting them from enforcing laws governing short-term rentals. But now one of the richest towns in the metro area is seeing its houses being turned into party-houses, so it sounds like pressure is being put on the state legislature to revoke its proscriptions on enforcement.
Re: In that case, lock up airbnb (Score:4, Interesting)
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No AirBNB I've ever stayed in matches that pattern.
Hotels are multi-guest.
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There's a difference between a rental that someone resides in, even if it's not for a year or even six months, than a rental that numerous people each rent as a secondary accommodation to their permanent residence, and sits vacant more than half the time.
In the case where they're not there at least six months, it's literally sitting vacant more than half the time. One solution would be to tax such residences significantly, with the proceeds specifically earmarked for housing. You can avoid the tax by taking on a tenant.
Re:In that case, lock up airbnb (Score:5, Insightful)
Its the whole “ride-share” bullshit again.
The argument “for” both Airbnb and Uber is “people want to do something with their spare X” where X for Uber is “spare seat on my journey from A to B” and for Airbnb is “my spare room”, when in reality both companies core service providers are people doing it professionally - be it driving a car full time to move people from A to B, or buying apartments to rent out (either in full or room by room).
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yes. government agencies should have subpoenaed all records for drivers for uber/lyft type companies and when it was demonstrated that drivers weren't engaging in business in the passenger-dropoff areas, hit them with fines for violating passenger livery laws.
Re: In that case, lock up airbnb (Score:4, Insightful)
That's exactly the problem, indeed. In many European cities, locals have seen rental fees go up beyond their financial means to the point they're fleeing their native cities because some are buying up real-estate with the sole purpose of turning it into AirBNB rentals, driving up the prices.
That's why cities like Venice, Amsterdam, Paris and countless others have moved to strict regulations for AirBNB.
Barcelona, after years of regulations circumventing by AirBNB, even banned them completely: https://www.nytimes.com/2021/0... [nytimes.com]
Original article seems all written by AirBNB or some fanboi, "lost 10k AirBNB listings". No, NYC just gained 10k family homes that are no longer lost to AirBNB. That's more than any social housing project, I'd recon. Congratulations!
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What I reckon would work better for residents would be to make Air
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Landlords are turning apartments into AirBnB units, especially in rent controlled districts. The result is long-term residents being driven out for any pretext: I've a colleague this occurred to, along with several cancer survivors living in the same building.
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And? Build more housing units and don't tell people what they can or can't do with their property.
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Build more housing units
I'm not a builder, and I'm not in charge of planning or zoning either, so it's unclear why you would make that suggestion to me.
and don't tell people what they can or can't do with their property.
That's how we got here, where we are now, and that clearly isn't working. Why do you want to do more of what is provably not working? You just want to see it all burn down? Because that's what will happen if you continue to prevent people from having a stake in your society.
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Airbnb's whole basis of profitability is that people are buying and/or renting homes and turning them into airbnbs. And even supposedly legitimate use still removes units from the rental market, including partial units needed by people with low incomes.
The problem is, AirBNB is sold as "got a spare room, rent it out to tourists for some spare cash"... not "are you a large property developer looking to rent out a flat for several times what you'd get from a normal tenant". If it were just mums and dads doing it, it wouldn't be a problem (even if they were renting out a second home.
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Most of the damage from airbnb is that it takes otherwise vacant homes and takes them off the market for standard rental. airbnb renters get 'hotel' level pricing which removes it from the housing market, yet they don't pay any of the hotel taxes and are completely non-compliant with hotel rules.
airbnb, or 'bnb' as a category, is about people renting out a home that they live in and run. This doesn't do a whole lot against local housing markets except maybe cause people to buy larger homes to facilitate t
vocabulary fail (Score:4, Insightful)
"Airbnb agrees regular New Yorkers should be able to share their home and not be targeted by the City, and we urge the administration to work with our Host community to support a regulatory framework that helps responsible Hosts and targets illegal hotel operators"
That's what this is. People who comply with the new rules are responsible hosts. People who don't are illegal hotel operators. Like... duh.
Re:vocabulary fail (Score:4, Insightful)
Seriously? (Score:2)
On that approach to life you'd have given up driving because of car crashes, flying because of crashes and lost luggage and living in anything except a nuclear bunker because of people being hit by meteors.
AirBnB offers customers the chance to comment on both the rental and the tenant. You thus have real previous users response to their experience to guide you. I've used AirBnB a couple of times and have found the experience to be entirely satisfactory. Worth consideration.
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Not really. You run comparisons against something equivalent.
Cars vs nothing else? Well keep choosing cars, in any case they are governed by strict regulations.
Flying vs no alternative? Well keep flying, but incidentally a lot of people are tracking their own luggage manually because of what you mentioned. Plus there's mandatory compensation.
But AirBnB, that didn't exist for all time. What came before? Hotels. So we compare AirBnB to Hotels and suddenly you realise that the former is actually a shady unregu
Not that easy to offer a review (Score:3)
You get to review the premises when you've stayed and paid for it via AirBnB, who will take a cut. Therefore the review costs real money for the landlord to create; we're not talking repeat reviews by a single user. So yes, reviews are worthwhile. And remember that a single really bad review will be attached to the rental indefinitely...
Your pessimism is showing ;)
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And 150 years ago if there was no hotel you could maybe sleep in a farmers barn, etc. Kinda like AirBNB. Long term in the town? Why see Mrs Johnson, she runs a fine boarding house....
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i dont know if this is a really good example... because i would absolutely love to see the airline industry getting regulated to where they arent allowed to overbook, and are actually punished for losing baggage. We can start with having them not be able to lie to you when you go to them asking for compensation for lost luggage (because the law that forces them to compensate you is already on the books, they just lie to you and say it isnt)
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OTOH, AirBNB does little or nothing when a host screws over the guest.
A recent one had built out an ADU with a (separate entrance) over a garage, and advertised the garage as a game room, e.g. with a ping-pong table. The host did no sound proofing yet also insisted on working in a room adjacent to said garage/game room and with a superflous interior door into the ADU stairway, where a wall should have been. Threw a screaming fit because my special-needs son wasn't silent at 6pm, claimed that he kn
A good first step... (Score:5, Insightful)
AirBnB and other rental sites are removing too much residential housing from the market. This is helping to fuel homelesness and rising house prices. You want to make money renting a place to stay to tourists? Go buy/build a hotel. That's what they are there for. My stupid county is forcing more 'affordable' dense housing into our cities, while still allowing short-term rentals all over the place. Idiots, the lot of them.
As I like to point out to people how dumb our local officials are: They are allowing residential housing to be used like hotels for tourists, while turning hotels, meant for tourists, into housing for homeless residents. It's insane.
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The fact that AirBnB places actually get filled and make money should tell you that people, despite hotels being available, are choosing to stay in a private house/apartment during their visit/vacation to another city. There has to be a reason. I don't understand why you can't let people make their own choices. Your solution is to shove hotels down their throats by removing AirBnB as an option. It's like when a nice, new option becomes available, a ton of people fight tooth and nail to remove the option
Re:A good first step... (Score:5, Insightful)
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It's not like an Airbnb is cheaper than a hotel. Not the ones I've used in the western US.
It's that an Airbnb is a house. You're not sharing a wall or a floor with strangers.
A hotel can't rent you a separate building. Most don't have kitchens, or multiple bedrooms and bathrooms.
And very few hotels will let two adults and three children stay in a single room.
the neighbours bear the costs of extra traffic
What extra traffic? My vehicle going to and from a house in a neighborhood is no more traffic than if the owner had stayed home that week.
There's a reason for zoning.
Again, we're t
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It's not like an Airbnb is cheaper than a hotel. Not the ones I've used in the western US. It's that an Airbnb is a house. You're not sharing a wall or a floor with strangers. A hotel can't rent you a separate building. Most don't have kitchens, or multiple bedrooms and bathrooms. And very few hotels will let two adults and three children stay in a single room.
the neighbours bear the costs of extra traffic
What extra traffic? My vehicle going to and from a house in a neighborhood is no more traffic than if the owner had stayed home that week.
There's a reason for zoning.
Again, we're talking about a single family short-term renting a single family home in a residential neighborhood. No zoning ordinances are being violated. Airbnb is providing a service you can't get at any price from a hotel.
There are plenty of AirBnBs in condo buildings and apartment buildings. So we're definitely not talking just about single-family homes here. Especially in cities.
And yes, zoning ordinances and HOA rules are being violated for short-term rentals in many residential areas.
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Re:A good first step... (Score:4, Insightful)
What zoning ordinance and HOA rule? You know when those are being violated, there are fines that are associated with them. For instance, our HOA covenants forbade parking a work van (like Heating and A/C contractor) from being parked in the driveway. In the HOA it outlined that you'd get a first warning, then a 2nd warning, then fined $25/day. If you didn't pay it, the HOA would put a lean against your house. If there are zoning laws and HOA rules that are being violated, then fine the person renting out the house/condo under the guidelines.
That's kind of my point. You can't just rent out a place willy-nilly in many situations. Apartments, condos, single-family dwellings governed by HOA rules, zoning laws, mortgages and loans that are governed by usage covenants or restrictions in the mortgage or the insurance policy, etc.
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What zoning ordinance and HOA rule? You know when those are being violated, there are fines that are associated with them.
Ordinances and HOA rules aren't self-enforcing, and most folks aren't going to just say "well, ya caught me" when and, more importantly, if, someone in a position to do so learns what is going on and assesses a fine. Since these people aren't putting a big "AirBnB" billboard on their house with hours and a phone number...
If there are zoning laws and HOA rules that are being violated, then fine the person renting out the house/condo under the guidelines.
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Since these people aren't putting a big "AirBnB" billboard on their house with hours and a phone number...
If you struggle to detect the "problem," is it really a "problem."
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In cities with heavy tourist trade, the AirBnB's are often a fraction of the nightly price. I've encountered this for trade shows. Even motels within easy commuting distance were profoundly more expensive.
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It's not like an Airbnb is cheaper than a hotel. Not the ones I've used in the western US. It's that an Airbnb is a house. You're not sharing a wall or a floor with strangers.
That's not always the case. An Air-BNB we stayed at last summer was a literally a house garage converted to living space. The bathroom was a very amatuer DIY project that would not fly in a normal hotel, and I suspect wasn't up to any sort of code. The "kitchen" was a small sink, a dorm fridge, and a microwave oven. The existing door linking it to the house was simply deadbolted shut.
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So I don't know why you've got such a bee in your bonnet over these simple statements of fact.
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Municipalities have the right (and the obligation) to regulate the use of properties within their jurisdictions. This is also where their taxing authority comes from. And it's much better to have everyone playing by the same rules, so you know what the rules are. Or would you rather someone operate a toxic dump next door?
funnily... (Score:3)
I have yet to find an airbnb where when all cost are counted, including cleaning fee and whatever-fee , you are actually below the cost of the average local hotel, for which I will remind you you don't have to clean or do the bed.
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Most AirBNBs I've seen forbid parties and I've never seen evidence of one. When one or two people on a block have an ADU, or there's a modest vacation home on a couple of acres on an island, traffic delta is moot.
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Re:A good first step... (Score:4, Insightful)
Yeah that reason is the same reason that counterfeit goods sold off a sketchy fly-by-night website are so much cheaper than the real thing: They're cutting every corner possible and then some in under to undercut the price on the legitimate product, externalizing the costs, and then fucking off the moment someone actually tries to hold them responsible for anything.
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They're cutting every corner possible and then some in under to undercut the price on the legitimate product, externalizing the costs, and then fucking off the moment someone actually tries to hold them responsible for anything.
You just provided the definition of “capitalism” as practiced in much of the US and world. As it occurs in many cases, but not all, with any good or service. Regulated or not. Which includes all accommodations, including hotels.
Caveat Emptor,
Re:A good first step... (Score:5, Insightful)
I don't understand why you can't let people make their own choices.
Once you are renting out a home on a short term basis, you are now a business. These homes are zoned for residential.
Your solution is to shove hotels down their throats by removing AirBnB as an option.
I'm not 'shoving' anything down anybodies throats. You don't have to visit my area. If you want to visit, there are lots and lots of hotels to stay at, some are nicer than my home. I'm not telling people to go stay in a dungeon or anything.
And I don't believe AirBnB is the reason for homelessness.
Neither do I: "This is helping to fuel homelesness and rising house prices." There are lots of things contributing to these problems, one of which is short term rentals removing residential housing from the market.
Home prices in the middle of Tennessee have risen as well. Home prices have risen everywhere.
Which is where AirBnB operates: Everywhere.
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You don't have to visit my area. If you want to visit, there are lots and lots of hotels to stay at, some are nicer than my home. I'm not telling people to go stay in a dungeon or anything.
I don't know what "nice" means when talknig about a hotel. It's still a hotel. It's like going on vacation to an apartment without a kitchen.
I can tell you a number of cities in recent years have gotten my family's tourism dollars that we would never have visited without Airbnb or Vrbo.
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without a kitchen.
I don't know where you're staying, but a number of hotels have kitchenettes as part of the room. As I mentioned in a post above, both hotels I stayed at on my trip to Boston last weekend had kitchenettes.
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a number of hotels have kitchenettes as part of the room
A microwave oven doesn't count.
And of course it's still a hotel, not a house. I'm not a student anymore; I'm done with the multi-unit dwelling stage of life.
Any city that makes it illegal to stay in a house on vacation is going to lose tourists.
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Any city that makes it illegal to stay in a house on vacation is going to lose tourists.
Well... bye.
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Any city that makes it illegal to stay in a house on vacation is going to lose tourists.
And the higher property, occupancy tax and sale tax revenue that will instead be collected from the residents of that jurisdiction.
Short term rentals provide cities with added tax revenue they would otherwise not be able to collect.
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Rooms aren't homes.
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10,000 is 0.5% of that
First, .5% of millions of units is a LOT. I don't think you realize how much of an impact a number like that can have on costs. Second, the 10k number is how many could be LOST, not the total number of AirBnB in NYC. One site estimated that the number could easily be double that.
Re:A good first step... (Score:4, Insightful)
The fact that AirBnB places actually get filled and make money should tell you that people, despite hotels being available, are choosing to stay in a private house/apartment during their visit/vacation to another city. There has to be a reason. I don't understand why you can't let people make their own choices. Your solution is to shove hotels down their throats by removing AirBnB as an option. It's like when a nice, new option becomes available, a ton of people fight tooth and nail to remove the option because they don't like it, just like all the people who believe Uber and Lyft contractors need to be treated like an employee.
I don't think anyone, anywhere, is claiming that there is no demand for AirBnB. That's actually kinda the problem. There's a demand for black market access to all manner of limited resources needed for survival. The reason is that, for a lot of people, the impact of their actions on others is not really a concern. It's not their problem if actual residents, working jobs they can't afford to leave, have to choose between rent and food this month. That AirBnB is just so much more comfy than an extended stay hotel, and you can't put a price on that - especially if the price is just something meaningless, like the misery of the poor. They should have thought about that before they went around being all poor and gross.
And I don't believe AirBnB is the reason for homelessness. Population of NYC is 8.5 mil. Even if an average of 4 people live in a unit (which they don't), that's +2 mil units. 10,000 is 0.5% of that. That is not the reason for homelessness. And you're also not right about rising house prices. Home prices in the middle of Tennessee have risen as well. Home prices have risen everywhere.
I absolutely *love* you people. It's either the sole cause, or it's unrelated, right? It also contributes to the overall cost of living, not just homelessness - you don't have to be homeless to be miserable. I don't know if, perhaps, your experience with such things consists of that one time you had to skip the appetizer at Applebees because you left your wallet at home, but this stuff has very real consequences for people on the very edge of existence. That's the main reason so many of us "fight tooth and nail to remove the option" because we "don't like it". It's exploiting the poor, you selfish ass.
Also, I don't know if you heard, but they have AirBnB in Tennessee too. [airbnb.com] They actually have it in a lot of places that aren't NYC, it turns out. When you pull a rental unit off the housing market and turn it into an AirBnB, it decreases the housing supply. The demand for housing, however, remains the same. That increases the cost on the remaining units. I don't know if perhaps you dropped out after eighth grade or whatever, but that's a fairly basic principle of economics. I have no idea how you think it doesn't apply here.
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Re:A good first step... (Score:5, Informative)
I have a neighbor who just bought his _seventh_ house in our community, all of which are for short term rentals. It's a lake community so ever week we get a new bunch of assholes who don't know anything about the rules for using the lake, don't care about the noise ordinances, or even the speed restrictions on the local roads. One of the houses that was a constant source of complaints recently burned down and it's widely suspected that someone finally got sick and tired of the behavior and torched it and I would not be surprised if it happens to more of his listings.
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The way to deal with noise annoyances is to make the rules clear to locals and visitors and have law enforcement, well, enforce them.
Speed restrictions: Install speed cams and collect fines?! If it doesn't help enough, increase the fines.
Arson: If it is 'widely suspected', ask those who suspect to share their evidence with the police or else make themselves liable for collusion.
None of what you posted is *caused* by Airbnb. It rather seems to highlight some intrinsic societal problems, which is not necess
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The way to deal with noise annoyances is to make the rules clear to locals and visitors and have law enforcement, well, enforce them.
They don't want to, or at least, not very hard. Visitors spend money, and you can also write them speeding tickets they're definitely not going to contest and make some easy money for the PD. Property taxes are paid the same whether the house is occupied by renters, or vacationers, so from the city's (or whatever's) standpoint there's no drawbacks.
None of what you posted is *caused* by Airbnb.
It's willfully enabled by Airbnb. What do we call those who willfully and knowingly aid and abet illegal activity? It's literally their business model.
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It's willfully enabled by Airbnb. What do we call those who willfully and knowingly aid and abet illegal activity? It's literally their business model.
Have you ever used Airbnb? It has a checkbox for 'No parties or events' per property. *Hosts* have the choice
to check/uncheck this box and take / avoid action in case of noncompliance.
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Have you ever used Airbnb? It has a checkbox for 'No parties or events' per property.
That is not even what I was talking about. The hosts are engaging in illegal behavior before they even get that far, it's called tax evasion.
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Your entire post is very naive.
"The way to deal with noise annoyances is to make the rules clear to locals and visitors and have law enforcement, well, enforce them."
It's a small community with a part time constable who covers a lot of other areas and even then, all they're going to do is tell them to quiet down and then the next visitors come and it happens all over again.
"Speed restrictions: Install speed cams and collect fines?! If it doesn't help enough, increase the fines."
We looked into this. Do you h
If you don't own it you should have no say (Score:1)
You don't get to pretend you are compassionate by telling others they have to sacrifice. That's not compassion it entitlement.
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If I own a property I should be able to do whatever I want to do with it.
So long as you comply with the proper regulations and taxes. Running a business, especially a rental business, comes with responsibilities. Unless its an airbnb, but hopefully that'll change real soon now.
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If I own a property I should be able to do whatever I want to do with it.
Sure. Up to the point where you infringe on the rights of your neighbors. You can't have ragers all night. You can't be a nuisance when people are trying to sleep. You can't let your property go to shit and drag down the community property values. Etc. Like they say, no man is an island. We live in a society.
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If I own a property I should be able to do whatever I want to do with it.
Can I have your address? I'd like to buy the houses on either side of you and turn them into homeless shelters. Or maybe store highly flamable, toxic chemicals there. Remember, its' MY property that I own!
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If I own a property I should be able to do whatever I want to do with it.
No.
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If I own a property I should be able to do whatever I want to do with it.
So if I want to run a nuclear reactor in my backyard, or a casino, or a brothel, or a chemical factory, or a for-profit prison, I should be able to, just because it's my property? Have you really never heard of zoning, or are you being willfully ignorant for the sake of argument?
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Scarcely-populated islands and tiny ADUs aren't residential housing. Hotels suck.
As for NYC, residents there do it to themselves. Landlords there are notorious for forking over renters, and the prices were already absurd long before AirBNB. This all happens because residents allow it, instead of voting with their feet.
That was entirely the point (Score:5, Insightful)
This thing where we screw over basically everyone except a handful of older voters who already bought their houses has got to stop. You can't keep backing people into a corner and not expect problems. The most obvious one is plummeting birth rates that mean social security is going to collapse. Not in 10 years or 20 years but while those older voters are still alive and counting on it. And the stock market where your investments are will collapse too leaving you eating cat food in your old age.
And that's assuming our country doesn't fall into a violent revolution. Ask yourself how well you think a bunch of retirees are going to do during a violent revolution fueled by angry Young people unable to start families. Who do you think is going to be the target for their rage?
New York gets it and they're trying to do something about it despite a hell of a lot of lobbying. I wish the other states would wake the fuck up before it's too fucking late
Not average New Yorkers (Score:5, Insightful)
Protip: If the new rule affects you, you are not an average New Yorker. You own a residence that you don't live in (how many "average" New Yorkers can afford a second home in NY?) and you are renting it out illegally.
This doesn't affect average New Yorkers, and it doesn't affect *law abiding* more-affluent-than-average New Yorkers.
At least some of those 10,000 currently-illegally-operating Airbnbs will probably be converted to long term rentals, providing housing for people who actually are average New Yorkers. Airbnb doesn't want this, and current slumlords don't want it either because it'll increase the housing supply and create a little bit of competition.
"Average New Yorkers" (Score:5, Insightful)
A spokesperson for Airbnb said the new regulations will hurt average New Yorkers who are struggling to keep up with rising costs.
Oh yeah, "average New Yorkers." Residents of New York City with so much property to spare that they can lease it out as an Airbnb.
More likely, what this law will affect is landlords with multi-unit properties who are illegally Airbnb-ing some of their units instead of signing leases.
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It's about time (Score:3)
It's about time they cracked down. AirBnB has been violating NYC law for years
Corrected Headline: (Score:2)
NYC & Airbnb looking out for different New Yor (Score:4, Interesting)
A spokesperson for Airbnb said the new regulations will hurt average New Yorkers who are struggling to keep up with rising costs.
Airbnb is not lying. However, Airbnb and NYC have different concepts of who the "average" New Yorker is. For Airbnb, that average person has enough money or collateral to buy a place that can be rented out. For NYC, the average person is unable to buy a place. Either viewpoint will benefit some people and hurt others.
Re: NYC & Airbnb looking out for different New (Score:2)
âoeAverageâ has a distinct meaning. Itâ(TM)s not a matter of opinion. No definition of an âoeaverageâ New Yorker includes owning rental properties.
meh (Score:2)
Trying to codify the complexities (Score:2)
As with much law and regulation, this is a case where 'one size doesn't fit all'. Yet because we work with law and not 'what's fair', we have no alternative but to play 'wacamole' when the law doesn't cover the situation how we want it to.
AirBnB exists because there are issues which weren't being addressed. At its best it provides an income stream to home owners who weren't otherwise getting any income from their intermittently excess space. It also competes with the excess fees that hotels charge. At its w
Not exactly a bad thing (Score:2)
Airbnb has been causing rent to skyrocket, as people keep taking houses off the market and putting them in airbnb. It's about time they stop allowing it to continue.