Catch up on stories from the past week (and beyond) at the Slashdot story archive

 


Forgot your password?
Close
typodupeerror
×
AI Education

'There's a Good Chance Your Kid Uses AI To Cheat' (msn.com) 59

Posted by EditorDavid from the AI-ate-my-homework dept.
Long-time Slashdot reader theodp writes: Wall Street Journal K-12 education reporter Matt Barnum has a heads-up for parents: There's a Good Chance Your Kid Uses AI to Cheat. Barnum writes:

"A high-school senior from New Jersey doesn't want the world to know that she cheated her way through English, math and history classes last year. Yet her experience, which the 17-year-old told The Wall Street Journal with her parent's permission, shows how generative AI has rooted in America's education system, allowing a generation of students to outsource their schoolwork to software with access to the world's knowledge. [...] The New Jersey student told the Journal why she used AI for dozens of assignments last year: Work was boring or difficult. She wanted a better grade. A few times, she procrastinated and ran out of time to complete assignments. The student turned to OpenAI's ChatGPT and Google's Gemini, to help spawn ideas and review concepts, which many teachers allow. More often, though, AI completed her work. Gemini solved math homework problems, she said, and aced a take-home test. ChatGPT did calculations for a science lab. It produced a tricky section of a history term paper, which she rewrote to avoid detection. The student was caught only once."

Not surprisingly, AI companies play up the idea that AI will radically improve learning, while educators are more skeptical. "This is a gigantic public experiment that no one has asked for," said Marc Watkins, assistant director of academic innovation at the University of Mississippi.

'There's a Good Chance Your Kid Uses AI To Cheat' More | Reply

'There's a Good Chance Your Kid Uses AI To Cheat'

Comments Filter:

  • This is largely irrelevant (Score:4, Insightful)

    by rsilvergun ( 571051 ) on Sunday March 16, 2025 @05:42PM (#65238701)
    They still have to learn the material to pass the tests. The only thing this does is make homework trivial and we have reams and reams of studies that show homework is less than worthless.

    Basically we are using schools to decide who gets to have a decent life and who doesn't because we don't want to give more than about 20% of the population a decent life. That's for a wide variety of terrible reasons.

    So we overwhelmed kids with homework to see which ones will break. It's not a good system but it is a system.

    There was a sci-fi show a while back about a world where if the kids didn't get good enough grades they were euthanized. Honestly with how we treat the bottom 80 that might be less cruel.

    • They still have to learn the material to pass the tests. The only thing this does is make homework trivial ...

      From TFS:

      Gemini solved math homework problems, she said, and aced a take-home test.

      ChatGPT ... produced a tricky section of a history term paper, ...

      • Take home tests are as dumb as homework.

        A proper test is administered at school with someone monitoring to make sure the kids don't cheat.

        Ideally we wouldn't even do that at the high school and college levels. All testing should be done by a separate group than those who do the educating, so that there is no incentive nor option to inflate grades under a misguided attempt at leaving no child behind.

        Grades that do not objectively measure competence are worthless.

        • Re: This is largely irrelevant (Score:4, Interesting)

          by kenh ( 9056 ) on Sunday March 16, 2025 @06:38PM (#65238789) Homepage Journal

          You understand that kids are graduating without mastering basic math/reading, right? And this is before ChatGPT.

          One girl is suing her school district because while she graduated with honors and got a scholarship to state college, she can't read her diploma and her learning disabilities (dyslexia, for one) wasn't diagnosed until the final month of her senior year.

          https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2025/0... [cnn.com]

          A couple years ago Baltimore was in the news for having 13 high schools that had the distinction of not having one child in the graduating class that could read or do math at grade level - yet, oddly, I'm positive each HS had a valedictorian at graduation, who, just like his or her classmates, struggled to read her diploma.

          https://mynbc15.com/news/proje... [mynbc15.com]

          Don't get distracted by AI m's influences in public education, let's worry about the systemic issues in the public school system.

          • Agreed.

            High schools should not give diplomas. All they should do is prepare kids for the GED test. And the high school cannot administer the test.

            We have strong political pressure for schools to churn out lots of smart students. Well, how is their success in this effort measured? By the grades that they give to those students. It is a whole lot easier to just give high grades to kids that have not earned them than it is to educate the kids. So, that's exactly what many schools do. Schools are run by

            • All they should do is prepare kids for the GED test.

              We've seen what happens when a singular test is used to determine pass/fail: schools teach to the test, and kids learn very little. For that reason, we should just close all the public schools and do as you suggest. Then all kids can be home schooled, as it should be. Public schools have been failing kids for a very long time.

              • "Teaching to the test" is better than giving out diplomas to every kid that shows up.

                If the test is inadequate, we can make the test better.

                Homeschooling is not an option for most working families. There simply aren't enough hours in the day.

      • WTH is a "take home test"? And how on earth could anybody possibly prevent cheating on such a thing, even if students had nothing but quill pens?
      • You can call it a take-home test all you want it's still homework and at the end of the day the kids are still having to take tests in the classroom and if they don't pass those tests they don't pass the class.

        So renaming homework to a take-home test doesn't change anything or anything related to my comment. Homework still sucks. It still doesn't actually help anyone learn. And this isn't about helping people learn or making the world a better place this is about putting people into boxes so we can deci

    • There was a sci-fi show a while back about a world where if the kids didn't get good enough grades they were euthanized.

      I imagine even then there were rich kids who didn't really learn anything, yet still managed to graduate anyway ... and become President.

      (Wondering... In the show, could they be euthanized *after* graduating? Asking for a *bunch* of friends. :-) )

      • Why would they ever need to be smart? We've had a number of Presidents that are obviously well down the path of dementia but get elected anyway cause it's not the other guy. Reagan and Biden were both great, recent examples of that.
      • It's called a , "gentleman c". Both Bush Jr and Donald Trump received them. Basically at expensive schools the rich kids get passed no matter what. Also it's pretty fucked up that we have now had two presidents in my lifetime that received a gentleman's c.

        • I'd say that's crazy, but the proof is in the pudding-heads ... :-)

          It's also been reported [dailykos.com] (and other places) that one of Trump's professors at Wharton said:

          "Donald Trump was the dumbest goddam student I ever had.” Dr. Kelley told me this after Trump had become a celebrity but long before he was considered a political figure. Dr. Kelley often referred to Trump’s arrogance when he told of this — that Trump came to Wharton thinking he already knew everything.

          That last part seems spot-on, even now.

    • They still have to learn the material to pass the tests. The only thing this does is make homework trivial and we have reams and reams of studies that show homework is less than worthless.

      That depends on the purpose of the homework. In my engineering class, homework counts as 10% of the grade. As I tell the students, "I make the homework worth just enough points to make it worth your while to turn it in."

      I acknowledge on the first day of class that it is trivially easy to cheat on the homework, but if the

      • I get this a lot with ex engineers who go into education when they retire or can't find work because we don't build things anymore. This is the problem with being a math teacher who's an engineer first and a teacher second. It's why it's important to actually study the art of teaching..

        Again you've made the homework worth their time but that doesn't mean that they are effectively learning anything while doing the homework. This is been pretty well studied and extensive and large amounts of homework are
        • Youve made no less than 5 comments on the same article, tripping over all the contradictory points youre making, and now falslely accusing a teacher of trying to box in their students. Did you get your degree in social justice warrior or just angry moron? You stated in an earlier comment- "They still have to learn the material to pass the tests. The only thing this does is make homework trivial and we have reams and reams of studies that show homework is less than worthless." .....So its obvious you know
      • I believe you are absolutely correct to grade this way. Youve given your students all the core concepts to learn, ask for proof (via homework) that they have learned it, then (via test) ask them to demonstrate it. Those who passed the homework should have no problem and no excuse. When it comes to engineering in the real world, you dont get a second chance. Good job.

        • I believe you are absolutely correct to grade this way. Youve given your students all the core concepts to learn, ask for proof (via homework) that they have learned it, then (via test) ask them to demonstrate it. Those who passed the homework should have no problem and no excuse. When it comes to engineering in the real world, you dont get a second chance. Good job.

          As a fellow engineer, you get it. People like rsilvergun do not and never will.

          In my courses, the purpose of homework is to force the student

    • You should really look inward and figure out why you hold this belief given the complete lack of any actual data to back it up. You are forming synthesis with a propaganda facade instead of with reality.

    • Re: (Score:3)

      by narcc ( 412956 )

      I'd like to see those "reams and reams of studies". A quick search on Eric doesn't turn up much to support the claim that it's "less than worthless" (reduces achievement). From what I've read, the best we can reasonably say is that there is little correlation between completing homework and achievement, with support at home playing the larger role.

      As you might know, I sometimes teach AP CS at a local private school. I've adopted a "flipped classroom" approach, where "homework" is recorded lecture, which f

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by gr8dude ( 832945 )

      > studies that show homework is less than worthless

      Can you point to your favourite studies that look into this matter? I am intrigued and surprised by your assertion. I was under the impression that the amount of time spent on a problem is positively correlated (at least up to a point) with the likelihood to solve it.

  • AI (Score:2)

    by ebonum ( 830686 )

    If all you are good for is copying and pasting AI answers, why do I need you?

    Kinda reminds me of Office Space:
    "I already told you: I deal with the god damn customers so the engineers don't have to. I have people skills; I am good at dealing with people. Can't you understand that? What the hell is wrong with you people?"

  • Beginning of the End (Score:1)

    by Anonymous Coward
    I feel like we're hitting the beginning of the end of original thought. As a professor of mathematics and computer science, I'm teaching analytical thinking and problem solving, but if students are using AI, they never develop this ability. If AIs are trained with our current knowledge and skills, then humans use AI in place of developing new knowledge and skills, how are we not going to get stuck in a cycle of feeding an AI the same crap it spits back out endlessly?

    • The AI that we have now aren't actually good enough to replace knowledge workers. At best they can just save some time, but only if their output is reviewed by said knowledge workers.

      So, those who rely on AI will not succeed as knowledge workers in the working world. Actual competence will be a differentiating factor, rather than what grades one got.

  • In for a surprise (Score:4, Insightful)

    by fahrbot-bot ( 874524 ) on Sunday March 16, 2025 @05:57PM (#65238725)

    why she used AI for dozens of assignments last year: Work was boring or difficult.

    Wait until she gets a job ...

  • Nothing anyone does is going to put the genie of ubiquitous and readily available information and reasoning back in the bottle. It's time to re-think what the purpose of education is, and what we want to accomplish from it.

    I really don't care that a student can regurgitate the date of a US Civil War battle. I do care that they can place the civil war after the founding of the US and before WWI, and know what the Emancipation Proclamation was and about when it occurred, and what the Cold War was and about

    • ...and know what the Emancipation Proclamation was....

      Unfortunately, schools don't teach this. Instead, they teach the myth that Lincoln freed the slaves via the Emancipation Proclamation because he was anti-slavery.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by tragedy ( 27079 )

      You have two paragraphs:

      I really don't care that a student can regurgitate the date of a US Civil War battle. I do care that they can place the civil war after the founding of the US and before WWI, and know what the Emancipation Proclamation was and about when it occurred, and what the Cold War was and about when it occurred.

      Being a member of American Society in 1974 was significantly different than being a member in 1874, which was a bit different than in 1774. The gap between 1974 and 2074 is going to be an order of magnitude different from any of these; we should be preparing children for that future, not the one-room schoolhouse from the past.

      While the precise dates are not the important part, I agree, I have to note that the rest of that is something we really should care that students know. Your very next paragraph notes that there are differences between 1974 and 1874, and 1774. One wonders how -- if you truly hold the opinion from paragraph one and apply it to yourself -- you know that there are differences between those time periods and what those differences are? It's a weird sort of meta-criticism, using your knowl

  • But cheating is nothing new, or parents doing papers for kids. She had to move to pen-and-paper for tests starting last year. Evidently the kids won't study the material, but will find time to learn to beat whatever blocks and such the schools try to apply to their Chromebooks so they can cheat.

    She has also seen teachers using AI to create lessons. So now we have an AI cycle with human spectators if you don't break it with pen-and-paper somewhere... the AI-sourced lesson is tested with an AI-assisted che

  • From economist Satyajit Das - all of "tech" of the last 20 years has been about advertising. All the big, profitable San Francisco companies are advertising companies. It has not provided anything substantial. Look at Mark Zuckerberg, could there be a less inspiring "tech" billionaire. Made nothing, furthered nothing, contributed nothing.

  • Cheating with AI is just plain wrong. Kids nowadays are doing things all wrong. They should return to cheating the way their parents did it, by getting help from Cliff Notes, past tests/papers/projects, crib sheets, notes stored in calculators, hand signals, friends, family, the free-enterprise market of "study aids", etc.

  • It produced a tricky section of a history term paper, which she rewrote to avoid detection.

    Somewhat better for learning than just buying the whole thing off a website, I suppose, or getting some geeky guy to write it for her ...

  • You need to have kids first to have em cheat the tests.

  • ... to that person who who wrote a report (humorous) on Tito. He Googled "Tito", got a bunch of hits for articles about Tito Jackson, Tito Puente and Josip Broz Tito. He threaded it all together in a few paragraphs about a guy who was the ruler of communist Yugoslavia, played percussion and led a Latin band and backed up Michael Jackson. He did a pretty good job of threading it all together, as an extra credit submittal, got a pretty decent grade for the creativity aspect.

  • In 2025 any teacher giving their students "take-home tests" is, at best, astonishingly naive.

    More likely, they're lazy as fuck.

    The only tests that matter now will be ones given IN a classroom where phones are banned, or oral exams with a teacher where they can actually test knowledge. I'm not saying either are practical, just that no other tests really matter when cheating is so easy.

  • "'There's a Good Chance Your Kid Uses AI To Cheat' " Themselves!

    • "'There's a Good Chance Your Kid Uses AI To Cheat' " Themselves!

      You seem to be under the delusion that schooling equals education. It does not, unless entirely by accident.

  • If everyone is going to be doing this anyway and you can't detect or stop it, why are you fighting? It's like trying to punch the ocean because the tide is coming in towards a sand castle you have built.

    So what can you do instead? Help them learn to prompt AI more carefully, but also how to evaluate the results, and grade them down harshly for failures. It's in the evaluation they will have to learn enough to evaluate what is a good or bad (or even real) answer, if you are worried about them learning not

Slashdot Top Deals

IBM Advanced Systems Group -- a bunch of mindless jerks, who'll be first against the wall when the revolution comes... -- with regrets to D. Adams

Close