Slashdot infringing on Microsoft patent #US5819032 183
Anonymous Coward writes "After reading about Microsoft's successful attempt to patent style sheets, I tried typing the word "Microsoft" into the IBM patent server. It is amazing how many of these bloody things they are generating in the patent office. I selected a patent at random to see how "novel" it was and just by chance I fell on this one. It was filed May 15, 1996.
"
They have 25 claims with this one patent (mostly related to dragging and dropping comment files in response to articles in online magazines), with each claim being successively more inclusive. The last claim is the killer (the comments in square brackets [] are mine):
25. A subscriber system for use with an electronic magazine that is distributed from a publisher to a subscriber, the subscriber system comprising:
- a computer having a communications port coupled to a back channel to the publisher, a processor, and a display; [like a browser connecting to a web server]
- a graphical user interface executing on the processor to present a magazine screen on the display, the magazine screen containing at least one article box indicative of a magazine article; and [a browser displaying a web page]
- the graphical user interface being configured to relate time within a publishing period for the magazine to the article boxes so that when a user manipulates the graphical user interface to selectively identify different times within the publishing period, ones of the article boxes are added and removed from the screen to demonstrate which articles were published at which times within the publishing period. [clicking back and forth between back issues of Slashdot]
STFU (Score:0)
This SUCKS. (Score:0)
This is just ridiculous...
Kain
kain@bfg10k.smsu.edu
Amusing. (Score:0)
No Subject Given (Score:0)
STFU (Score:0)
STFU (Score:0)
Yep, damn right it matters that it is Microsoft. They are so bad, it looks like they are just not going to stop their outrageous claims on everything.
Is there any other company remotely as bad? Tell me that!
That Videogate episode this past week was really just too much. Look, we already knew they were up to their usual deception, but why did it have to come off so blatantly? >:(
This could be used agaisnt linux (Score:0)
Fuck Microsoft and THEIR MEDIOCRE PRODUCTS! If they ever enforce this, I will quite my IT support job and become a real estate broker or something. SCrew THEM ALL! I will not let them controll my computer and my job. ITS MY COMPUTER AND MY OS!! IF I WANT TO USE LINUX, THEN ITS MY CHOICE. I WILL QUIT COMPUTING FOREVER IF THATS WHAT IT TAKES. I WOULD RATHER HAVE NO COMPUTER AT ALL THEN TO SUBMITT TO A UNDESERVING COMPUTER COMPANY THAT DESERVES NO REWARD FOR SCREWING ME! FUCK YOU!!
aaa that feels alot better.
Try And Enforce It (Score:0)
I would imagine that most of the stupid patents are filed by big companies to keep some jerk from gaining a broad patent and suing everybody under the sun to get a quick buck. After all, someone patented recently patented the concept of "plug-ins" & "applets" and is suing MicroSoft for infringement. It just saves them time, money and negative publicity later.
Even if they did decide to try and enforce it, they would be played out as the "big bully" in the media. I bet most companies would rather let a minor infringement go by then get butchered in the media. Just ask the makers of Ajax or Toys "R" Us.
And if some idiot in one of these companies still decides to enforce it the lawyers fees would eat any money they recovered in all but the biggest of these cases.
It's actually kind of comical if you think about it. Hackers seem to be paranoid about patents from businesses & businesses are very paranoid about hackers breaking into their systems.
My $0.02
This is nothing! (Score:0)
"First thing we do is kill all the lawyers."
US Patent office incompetence (Score:0)
infringes on some US patent. Thankfully most patent
owners don't have the resources to monitor whats
out there and sue.
OFFTOPIC: recomend an assembler tutorial? (Score:0)
Thanks
Patents in society--it's worse than what you say (Score:0)
What's so bad about the MS marketing machine is not only the damage they have done so far, but what lies ahead. Consider the recent flurry of "MS employee" posts in an older article. MS has built up a human arsenal that has convinced itself not only of the One Microsoft Way, but also that this is morally acceptable.
It is amazing how, without exception, they fail to recognize that no matter how cool or helpful they think their work is, it is built upon stolen success. And they have no problems with that. Gates and co. are clever manipulators, you have to give them that.
Yo Bill! (Score:0)
Patent this muthufukuh!
OFFTOPIC: recomend an assembler tutorial? (Score:0)
Fundamental Algorithms
Learning the MIX assembly language
will teach you the fundamentals of
computers. You can't go wrong with
Knuth.
If I was Richard Stallman... (Score:0)
I would patent the whole open source concept and use the proceeds to fund the movement.
How would people feel about that?
Patent Game is Getting Rediculous [sic] (Score:0)
THIS is the Big Hammer that Microsoft... (Score:0)
as soon as the DOJ trial is over.
Look, guys, I've been saying this for a
year or more now. Microsoft's only real
weapon is Patent Litigation.
De-comoditizing protocols, a'la the haloween
memo, just isn't going to work. Open Source
developers are just too good. Remember,
the Haloween memos cited DAV as something that
OpenSource would never duplicate, and what,
a week later Apache comes out with a DAV
module?
So look for the 'Cease and Desist' letters going
out to Caldera, RedHat, Suse, and the fortune
500 as soon as the trial is over.
--cary (gotta check my medication)
CSS/XSL are W3C Recommendations. . . . (Score:0)
Uh...bullshit? (Score:0)
So, as you say, STFU. It just happens that he was looking into what patents MS claim, and this one came about. Stop being so fucking insecure about your choice in software companies that you need to get offended and protect them, and look at the larger issue: PATENT ABUSE.
Straight up (Score:0)
There seriously needs to be some heavy reform in computer/communications related patent law. No doubt.
Re: STFU (Score:1)
How long has Slashdot been around? (Score:1)
It dosen't even apply!!!! (Score:1)
VideoGates (Score:1)
(see all the EmbeddedCaps :)
Selective quotation. (Score:1)
If that snippet above makes it look like the patent applies here, this one doesn't:
No icons here.
Incompetence+Ignorance+supidity=Patent Office (Score:1)
is getting seriously on my gingiva. Guess one
should seriously kick the patent-offices into
their scrotum. Abolish them.
The moon is still for sale. (Score:1)
People will sell (and buy) anything.
Erm, slight problem. (Score:1)
Patents in society (Score:1)
Enter Microsoft. The only work they put into their patents was the idea of patenting something that no one else has. Again, we can see that the Microsoft corporation is based soley on marketing, not on furthering technology, helping others, or even producing helpful software. How dare Microsoft make a mockery of the patent process. How dare the individual(s) responcible for allowing them to patent such rubbish make these actions, eventhough I'm sure they were under much -persuasion-.
threaded, GUI'd news reader would infringe! (Score:1)
not pure democracy (Score:1)
You're right, though, we aren't true to the Athenian way of doing things. I stand corrected.
We aught to try these patents now. (Score:1)
Overturn bogus patents.
what about dejanews?? (Score:1)
with this supposed GUI infringement - what would deja news be then? don't they have a fashion of posting present and past articles from practically every newsgroup known on the hierarchy? even microshaft??? ugh - i think m$ needs a good boot to the head!!
mho
pennacook
Actually.... (Score:1)
The /. community has expressed it's concern about stupid patents very voiciferously regardless of the patent filer. As evidence of this I would say that you ought to RTFM.
That ought to hold you for a while. And these are just recent discussions.
Vote doesn't count when electorial college exists. (Score:1)
This is dammed unfair. Third party candidates not only can't win (which is to be expected, a bit), but they also can't even get any notice at all because those who vote for them get their votes erased by this messed up system. So if a candidate has like 10% of the popular vote, it looks like he has 0% instead. This prevents anyone not in the big 2 from getting any noteriety at all. A slow buildup of support for a new party, year after year, is literally impossible when everything small rounds down to zero.
The electorial college made sense back when getting a real count of the votes was technologically infeasable. But today it makes no sense at all. At the very least they could stop rounding entire states to 0% or 100%, such that if a candidate gets 20% of the vote, then he gets 20% of the electors from that state. That would be sensible, but this is America. Land of the status quo.
MS relies on Intellectual Property... (Score:1)
That ain't right.
TedC
Try And Enforce It (Score:1)
Huh? Wouldn't prior art be quicker, easier, and cheaper to create than a frivolous patent and provide just as much protection? I really doubt that these companies have any good intentions.
Patent madness (Score:1)
We must dump patents NOW - or they'll dump all creativity and intelligence on Earth.
Prior Art (Score:1)
US patents are scary ...
I think I'll patent taking a shit ... then everybody who will take a shit from now on will have to pay me a $1 for the privilage ... I don't want much ... and I just want what is rightfully mine for the idea of patenting it ...
STFU (Score:1)
Bah, what a joke (Score:1)
This is indeed America (Score:1)
Actually, We are a Democratic-Republic, which is rather different than a true Democracy. We vote for representatives, who have free reign to do whatever they want (which is what they SHOULD do, not pander to the popular vote).
I have to say that I sure am glad that the government doesn't decide who sleeps in a box and who gets to buy an island, though. Pinko COMMIE!@#^%^!@!~~!Q1``
This is America (Score:1)
Man, we have TOO MUCH culture. "Culture" is way overrated. Preserving culture is just annoying. Why not just do what we like, and let that be our "Culture" instead of trying to act like our ancestors, or whatever silly things people try to do? WHO CARES what language you speak? WHO CARES what you wear? WHO CARES what you eat, as long as you enjoy it all? I like diversity to the point of eliminating "culture." Asians that talk with southern accents... White people who talk with asian accents... YES! Bring it on!
Lets do our own. (Score:1)
Just an idea. Probably a bad one...
Matt.
--
Microsoft DOES NOT controll distribution (Score:1)
> a whole bunch fatal signal 11 errors. I noticed
> when I try to recompile somtething multiple
> times, the compiler seems to stop at different
> places with the signal 11 error and something
> about program cc. If any of you know what is
> going on, please tell me.
This is most likely a problem with your hardware. Check out the GCC Signal 11 FAQ [bitwizard.nl] for more info.
This was done already (Score:1)
Shee's it says the filing date is 1996.. as far as I can remeber BBSes, AOL, Prodigy, Compuserve and many many others have been around way before 1996.
AOL , Comopuserve and Prodigy were gui driven and carried articles and magazines from various print companies. So what's new here?
-Ex-Nt-User
As I said (Score:1)
a good laugh once in a while.
OFFTOPIC: recomend an assembler tutorial? Me 2! (Score:1)
Specifically, assembly for the Intel x86 microprocessor. I'm sure there's a glut of stuff out there, but does anyone have any reccomendations?
I'm fine with high-level languages, and have some experience with the Motorola Z80, so am not looking for a "beginner's" book, but something that assumes familiarity with high-level languages (C/C++ is fine), and some understanding of assembly would be ideal.
Any ideas? TIA
- Sean
- SeanNi
Actually, no. (Score:1)
   - Sean
- SeanNi
I like that--the VideoGates scandal!! (Score:1)
OFFTOPIC: recomend an assembler tutorial? Me 2! (Score:1)
BTW: I have a wealth of Z80 proggies and many with a GUI system (with mouse!) built in. I can post them on my web page if there is interest. I don't know if anyone still designs with the old reliable, but cumbersome Z80. All that and the largest program was 2000 lines!
This is America (Score:1)
Welcome to America. World Domination. In this great country of America, we were all taught in our history books at a young age that our ascestors came over here on ships from England. It was easy to get a pass if you were a criminal or undesired. So a lot arrived on this contenent and had problems getting along with the Native Americans (indians.) Furthermore, some enterprising imigrants passed by Africa and kidnaped people of identifiable color for lifetime slavery. Let me tell you, talking about all this stuff is pretty much taboo here. But you get the idea. Some things never change. But they should.
Bill Gates is one of the last fucking assholes alive.
How long has Slashdot been around? (Score:1)
Patents and Copyrights are obsolete. (Score:1)
As for M$, they would make an ideal place to begin the phase out. As part of the remedy in the federal anti-trust trial, M$ patents should all become public property. Each new M$ copyright would only have a duration of 3 years.
Sound resonable?
Bill Gates and bio tech (Score:1)
Soon patenting DNA sequences will also belong to Bill. He will own your desktop and your DNA too.
Enforcement Required & Impossible (Score:1)
Oh yeah, and to that troll who said no-one would care if it wasn't Microsoft: go **** off. Everyone agrees that broad patents suck, regardless of what company files them.
David E. Weekly (dew)
CHANGE SLASHDOT (Score:1)
Why wasn't this posted? (Score:2)
According to the Arcana Mailing List [ml.org] the culture in the U.S. Patent office calls for approving more and more patents, and they're already approving 80% of patent submissions. Here's a cool excerpt from these E-mails [ml.org] from people who've worked for the patent office:
> This needs to be made clear to more people. The Patent Office is heavily
>biased towards rewarding examiners who allow a lot, and it is creating a
>culture to match. Unfortunately, our 'customers' are collectively paying
>the higher costs of confusion and legal help to sort the whole mess out.
A,B,C, et cetera (Score:1)
Patent Game is Getting Rediculous (Score:1)
Doesn't apply to Slashdot (Score:1)
"from the publisher to the subscriber"
leaves slashdot out. None of us subscribe, AFAIK.
About a month ago I had to obtain a trial subscription to Slate in order to read one little article. I can read all the slashdot I've got time for without ever subscribing and I don't even have to give a name or address to post replies.
Put Ur $ where Ur ... Slashdot still may be sued. (Score:1)
If M$ tries to sue
However, after reading all of the threads submitted so far I see that no one has yet to ante up to the
Rob, I use my real name when I post because I stand behind what I say, and you have my email addres should you need to contact me.
I pledge $100 to the
The rest of you: If the need arises put up or shut up.
Here is some related humor... all to real though. (Score:1)
Hello?! (Score:1)
Imagine one person owning the process of free speech. There are hundreds-of-thousands of magazines in the world, printed on tangible paper with tangible ink.
The patent office is handing out to someone the web's equivalent of publishing almost anything which is 'periodical'. How can that be legitimately patented?
If this were in print-media, this would mean every high-school in the country would be infringing such a patent by printing a school paper. Same with churches, stores, major papers and magazines.
This is the same thing.
They can't do this to SuSE, Pacific HiTech (Score:1)
brightest to work for them? So they can
pack up and leave the US when MS files a suit?
No, the bigger they are the more they fill the
docket in their federal district. If you did that, you would be come less popular with the
local judge who handles all your frivolous suits.
Eventually you will bog down, and won't be able
to sue anyone, no matter how much money you have.
(There is only so much time, and only so much the
government will allow you to take advantage of).
Even if you are Bill Gates.
Billionaires are not always everybody's best friend. It's not that there are people who can't be bought, it's that there are people to whom
he is not giving any (or enough) of his money.
I am one of these people.
But, Microsoft is hiring. Maybe work there, and
change policy... The old guard is retiring soon
anyway.
Dune! Dune's coming back to haunt us! (Score:1)
Bill Gates and Genome (Score:1)
Paul/copyright/Happy Bday (Score:1)
Matt
This is indeed America (Score:1)
Honestly, I get so tired of the Right WingNuts bringing up this false distinction between "Republic" and "Democracy". At least the "Tastes Great" vs "Less Filling" debate, while equally mindless, had at least some entertainment value and helped to sell beer. This "debate" has no redeeming value whatsoever, so just don't even start that crap here.
Who cares what the fsck it's called? We all get to vote directly or indirectly on matters of public importance, and it works, most of the time.
Let's split hairs over something important, shall we? Thank you.
Zontar
(somewhere in tenn.)
Patent Game is Getting Rediculous (Score:1)
Next someone will patent wiggling your pecker to get rid of that last drop.
The lawyers will inherit the earth.
If I was Richard Stallman... (Score:1)
- d
It is time to publicize this. (Score:1)
1) Find out about each patent in IBM site,
2) Send an e-mail to patent office and register
your objections
3) Let us form a web-site where everyone can
register their complaints, their opinions
and the actual history of patent under
question.
4) Publicize this in the newsgroups.
5) Let the publishers/magazines/authors
know about this. More articles the better.
Since Microsoft seems to have no shame, let us shame them into it.
Sinan
Erm, slight problem. (Score:1)
Also, what, exactly, makes people think the moon falls under the earth's laws anyway?
And if it does, the Heinlein story had a point...if the moon is under the laws of earth, then, logically, the people who own land under it own it. There is no 'you don't own land over your property if it's not connected to your land' exception to the property ownership laws. The law has already decided you own all the way down to the center of the earth, and you own the air over your land (technically, airplanes and stuff have the same kind of right of passage that 'landlocked' people have to get to a road), so, logically, if the moon passes over your land you own it while it does so.
Erm, slight problem. (Score:1)
Also, what, exactly, makes people think the moon falls under the earth's laws anyway?
And if it does, the Heinlein story had a point...if the moon is under the laws of earth, then, logically, the people who own land under it own it. There is no 'you don't own land over your property if it's not connected to your land' exception to the property ownership laws. The law has already decided you own all the way down to the center of the earth, and you own the air over your land (technically, airplanes and stuff have the same kind of right of passage that 'landlocked' people have to get to a road, called an easement), so, logically, if the moon passes over your land you own it while it does so.
patents, copyrights, and trademarks. (Score:1)
A patent covers an invention. If you use light to disrupt the electrical charge on a plate and then add toner to the plate so that it sticks only where there was not a lot of light and then transfer the toner to some paper making a copy of the image then Xerox can stop you while thier patent was (is?) in effect. If you change the shape of the plate so that it is on a cylinder for example, and change the metal, toner and other elements enough you can go ahead an make your copying machine, especally if your version works better.
Before Reagan you could not patent software, now you can not only patent software but tiny, trivial, obvious notions that are vaugely related to your software. A B1 bomber has several thousand components, each of which could involve several patents. The software has 7 million lines of code, it takes perhaps three lines of code on average to violate a software patent. It is highly doubtfull that there is a single piece of functional, usefull software that does not violate at least a few patents.
Copyrights cover creative works in a fixed medium. Noone can copy anything you create without your permission (though in posts like this there is a great deal of implied and implicit permision).
How about Patent Generator? (Score:1)
Somebody care to make a patent generator which can spit out hundreds of ideas every hour, then compare them against the patent archive followed by submitting all patents?
Let's see how patent office can deal with THAT
It IS out of hand.... (Score:1)
Seems Sun Microsystems has patented device drivers.
And could this one be taken as the patent of an OS kernel?
http://www.patents.ibm.com/details?pn=US0558403
This is nothing! (Score:1)
What it comes down to is that someone owns the method to cure you of something - or how you can even reproduce. And when they see money in it, they'll squeeze us all. I know. I watched my boss turn down several collaborations with some big universities (our company made the purest form of large proteins/peptides *snythetically* - no one else can do that) because he wanted more money out of them or didn't like some member of their staff.
Total arrogance and stupidity. Who knows what could have came out of those collab's.... Makes me really wanna live on another planet and start all over.
Let's see... (Score:1)
this is getting STUPID. M$ needs to be cut down at the knees.
_______
Some Perspective on Patents (Score:1)
Here's an article [callaw.com] I came across in the newsgroups.
cDc started in 1985 (Score:1)
Nicely organized with dates and titles.
Looks like M$ got fucked by the cDc again
--
Four years in jail
No Trial, No Bail
STFU (Score:1)
I wouldn't care who did it; the patent is poorly awarded. That it is Microsoft is largely irrelevant, but they do seem to be doing rather a lot of it the last couple of years.
Einstein (Score:1)
The moon is still for sale. (Score:1)
Troll Troll Troll (Score:1)
Second, If you don't like microsoft bashing go somewhere else. Part of what makes slashdot slashdot is microsoft bashing. Either like it, ignore it, or go somewhere else.
I herby claim... (Score:1)
This is almost as absurd...don't you think?
patents (Score:1)
Personally I think that the USPTO is slacking an just issueing these things. Again the Patent Examiners are not qualified!
Don't think there is infringment here.... (Score:1)
Beyond this specific case, i noticed another comment that mentioned the 'patent everything' phenomenon. I agree that this really needs to be stopped, companies know that the majority of the patents that they have been granted are overly broad and unenforceable, but they also know that in all probability there are at least one or two of theirs that aren't and those two will more than make up for the money spent getting the other few thousand, and will likely bring them lots of $$$. Software patents are a tricky thing because it is so easy for people to come up with similar looking things that function totally differently. There is some place for software patents, like encryption methods, encoding methods, compression methods, just as an example. I think it comes down to the fact that 99 to 100% of the people in the patent office don't understand the technology, if they did, alot of patents wouldn't be awarded.
On US Patents... (Score:1)
1) In the US, proof of original concept is required. That is, the first to think of and implement (and have proof of this), can patent something. So, if you can prove that you implemented something before someone else who has a patent on something, you can fight it.
2) Software is patentable... but only the interface, which is why, I suppose, MS was able to get the patent described above.
3) Algorithms are patentable, but only in some sort of interface. So, a pure algorithm cannot be patented, but use of that algorithm in a program with a interface can be patented.
4) Patents now last 20 years from the time of filing.
Now, everytime I see one of these crazy patents, it makes me mad. I think, "How the hell could they allow these things to be patented?" Well, I was told that the patent office is understaffed, and that they are looking to hire more examiners. The problem is, the salary is only about $27000 US/year. My guess is these people don't know very much about computers.
The other thing is, yes, it is irritating to see these patents, but the thing is, they go away. And once they do, they become public domain.
I patent life and existance. (Score:1)
by reading this message you agree to be my slave.
By not reading this message you agree to sell me your whole family for $2. (AND be my slave).
-- begin message ---
Every living person should pay me.
Every existing atom is my property.
While I'm at it, I copyright the words "Hello", "are" and the first 18 letters of the english alphabet.
Everybody that wants to use them, must pay me loyalties.
Have i forgot anything?
Well, I claim mars to be mine, and also the pacific ocean.
(this case reminds me about the man who claimed the moon and sold millions of dollars worth of property)
"A patent is only as good as its defense" (Score:1)
In fact, if the patent holder had any smarts, they'd prosecute individuals and small, underfunded companies first, because then they could build up a case law upholding their patent, before taking on those who had the money needed to really contest it. I wish that our system worked better than this, but in reality I know that it doesn't. In my opinion, this can only be fixed by LEGISLATION, not LITIGATION -- although unfortunately that seems unlikely as well, at least in the near future.
-- Frustrated Individual
Selective quotation. (Score:1)
Look like Icons to me.
Patents and Copyrights are obsolete. (Score:1)
But in this information age, the timings of it all are growing bad. If I publish an idea on the internet, other companies can still patent that same idea within a year, without me being able to stop them, even losing my rights on the idea if I don't patent first! Did I do something wrong? I don't think so...
Even now, big companies drop patents (software, mostly) after a couple of years, not willing to pay for all 17 years they are entitled to.
So do not drop patents, but change them to fit the needs of current society. Three years for a software feature would suit me.
Incompetence+Ignorance+supidity=Patent Office (Score:1)
Or is it that because ... (Score:1)
... Bill Gates is
micro + soft
(small) + (limp)
sidster--
I think I'll patent writing (Score:1)
The application of ink, graphite, or lead to a piece of paper (or other writing surface) for the purpose of presenting words, images, or other visual representations.
I'll make a fortune on the licensing
Good for microsoft. Bad for standards. Bad for us. (Score:1)
Microsoft is not being prosecuted for being sucessful. It is being prosecuted for being devoid of a soul. Yes corporations should have one of those.
A lot of people say that Microsoft isn't a monopoly in the classic sense. The oil and steel companies controlled the railroads forcing compeditors to take obsene rates.
Its true that microsoft doesn't rely on classic means of transportation like the railroads. It relies on the new electronic means of transportation the internet. By controlling preexisting standards like network protocols and css and creating propietary standards like activeX they are forcing the computer world to live by their terms.
Fortunately Microsoft is finally reaping what it has sowed. Not only by being prosecuted by the feds, but by being mired in their own legasy. Recent news of the W2K problem will be only the tip of the iceberg.
I only hope to see who divorces themselves from Microsoft next.
XXIII
STFU (Score:1)
Disgusting beyond words (Score:1)
Wired Mag 1996 (Score:1)
I guess that puts it before autumn '94 - I remember registering at Wired's website when I began at university autumn of '94. I don't remember what their interface looked like at that point, though.