Little Red Book Draws Government Attention 1088
narcolepticjim writes "An unnamed Dartmouth student was visited by Homeland Security for requesting a copy of Mao Zedong's Little Red Book for a class project." From the article: "The student, who was completing a research paper on Communism for Professor Pontbriand's class on fascism and totalitarianism, filled out a form for the request, leaving his name, address, phone number and Social Security number. He was later visited at his parents' home in New Bedford by two agents of the Department of Homeland Security, the professors said."
Real funny given the latest news (Score:3, Interesting)
Bush just admitted eavesdropping on US Citizens http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051217/ap_on_go_pr_w
Then of course, the politicians is claiming that we need the "Patriot Act" to protect us. Are we sure that 9/11 was not a setup for the Patriot Act?
Just remember:
"They who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security, deserve neither liberty or security." -- Benjamin Franklin
Of course, Bush would put Benjamin Franklin on a terrorist watch list.
Re:This is unfortunately predictable (Score:2, Interesting)
Let's see...
Finally, just a minor nit. The submitter claims the student was a "Dartmouth" student, whereas the article states that the student was from "U Mass-Dartmouth".
Exactly. Little details like "U-Mass" mean the difference between an Ivy League school (which is likely why it caught the editor's attention) and a state-run university.
Re:Wait, WTF??!?!?!? (Score:4, Interesting)
"He's a communism!" and off you went to a prison..
The people in power now are the children of the cold war era.. terrorist, communist, witch or heretic. Same name, same tactic, different era.
History repeats it's self. We have a revolution, we say "we've fixed it", so we care for a while. Then we get lax and more idiots come in and do the same thing over again. Revolution is needed right now, revolution is very difficult though. You have to scrape the bottom of the barrel before you see how bright the sky truely is.. we're getting to the bottom of the barrel now, the question is how long untill something happens to let people see the sky.
Time for some critical thinking here (Score:5, Interesting)
Nevertheless, I find the details fishy:
- Why would a student have to write down a SSN for a book loan, but not have to write down the class for which he is requesting the book?
- If he *did* have to write down his class, then why would the NSA waste resources on this case?
- Why would a book by Mao be on a watch list? Surely the NSA isn't having flashbacks to the 1950's!
- Why does it seem just a little too convenient that this unnamed student is being investigated by the NSA while doing research for a class on "fascism and totalitarianism"?
- Why are none of Robert PontBriand's classes [umassd.edu] (the professor in question, according to TFA) listed as "fascism and totalitarianism"?
No doubt there are good answers to these questionsHow much more of this are we willing to take? (Score:2, Interesting)
But did anyone see this report [crooksandliars.com] on MS-NBC only a few days earlier?
This has to reach a breaking point right? Or do the American people just continue to bend over and take it?
US college students starting peasant revolutions (Score:5, Interesting)
There's definitely a major major threat that college students reading Mao's Red Book are going to go out and start peasant revolutions - here in the US they'd need to learn to sing country music first, and then they'd find that most of the farms have been taken over by large agribusinesses like Tyson Chicken and Archer-Daniels-Midland, who've got other ways to be connected to power. I mean, sure, the Little Red Book was popular reading back in the 1960s, since the US hadn't had a Cultural Revolution and reading was still legal, but the Feds are starting to catch up with Mao.
At least they don't have to worry about anybody reading "Das Kapital" and believing Marxist economics - it's a really dull read and the economics are transparently bogus, unlike the Communist Manifesto which is at least short and enthusiastic.
Abuse of Power (Score:2, Interesting)
Tinfoil Hat on Order (Score:2, Interesting)
To borrow a quote, "They who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security, deserve neither liberty or security." (Benjamin Franklin)
Re:SSNs as College Student ID Numbers (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Memorize this phrase... (Score:5, Interesting)
Life with the Department of State-er, Homeland-sec (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:SSNs as College Student ID Numbers (Score:5, Interesting)
In Canada the equivalent of the SSN is the SIN (Social Insurance Number). In any case a few years ago it became law that you cannot be refused a service because you refuse to give out your SIN. The exception to this is that it has a valid use (Pretty well the only valid uses are ones that deal directly with taxation, for example you must give it to your employer so they can report income tax stuff correctly).
That being said companies can ask you for your SIN but you are not obligated to give it to them. For me that meant waiting 3 weeks longer for a credit card, but at least VISA doesn't have my SIN
The main reason why I am so paranoid about my SIN is I actually had mine stolen a while back. A company I used to work for outsourced their pension stuff. About a year ago the place got broken into and computers containing my SIN along with 30000 or so other people got stolen. The process of making sure that no one can apply for credit in my name is something I do not want to repeat.
You're full of shit, sorry (Score:5, Interesting)
First, what "pro-terrorist cranks" do universities "enjoy hiring"? Even Al-Arian in Florida, who is hardly in any way representative of the kinds of professors hired at most universities in the US, was acquitted of any wrongdoing. But he lost his job as a result of the controversy, and you can bet that professors likely to cause such controversy are going to be passed up by most hiring committees.
More importantly, however, can you please tell us what "dots" can possibly be "connected" to terrorism based on a professor checking out a book of quotations from a library? You make a big deal out of the fact that this guy wanted the right version of this book - as if a concern for accuracy makes one a terrorist suspect. This is ludicrous. I have no problem with the Feds monitoring purchases of large quantities of dangerous chemicals, but books? Full of quotations? By dead Chinese dictators? Come on.
As a professor who writes and teaches about war and terrorism (among other things), I often find myself checking out and buying books about terrorism, al Qaeda, and other things far more "threatening" than Mao's red book (not to mention visiting websites, etc.) My research interests have caught the attention of the feds before [slashdot.org], but never from just checking out a book from the library. The idea that certain books are flagged simply for ideological content is a sign of significant problems in terms of academic freedom and freedom of thought generally.
The fact that a forty-year old book of vague quotations about "people's war" that is also the second most popular book in the world [wikipedia.org] (second only to the Bible) is on that list just shows how surreal and absurd this war on terrorism has become.
I am Spartacus (Score:4, Interesting)
On the other hand, the original student was extremely foolish to tell anyone this, since doing so is a Federal felony in itself. We won't be hearing from him again, I'm afraid.
fascism called democracy (Score:4, Interesting)
Grown up in the eastblock I know a little bit about the USSR - believe me when I tell you how common this state was to the USA of today when it comes to ideology.
Communism is out, replaced by fascism (Score:3, Interesting)
Supporting occupied peoples in regaining their freedom [whitehouse.gov] is clearly a hindrance to trade when politicians and their corporate cronies have manufacturing bases to export and bucks to be made. It is interesting how the empires of Mao and Lenin, both of whom remain on display full of preservatives, have turned to imperialist fascism (made infamous by their past opponents Japan and Germany respectively, although e.g. the British Empire certainly had such tendencies as well) in order to "earn their rehabilitation" in the eyes of the West.
Western leaders are full of love and affection for dictators like Putin and Hu Jintao (aka the Butcher of Tibet after his brutal crackdown on Tibetans during his reign as the supreme chinese party chief in occupied Tibet) while the non-expansionist socialist dictators of smaller countries, like Cuba's Castro and Zimbabwe's Mugabe, are still being treated like pariahs.
If the western democracies actually asked their electorate which is worse, a small non-expansionist socialist state like Cuba or a genocidally expansionist one-party dictatorship like China, would the western leaders have to act surprised by the answer?
Re:And if you are lonely this holiday season... (Score:5, Interesting)
Feh! (Score:5, Interesting)
Within minutes, I was hassled by a very hot and loud bitch cop (120 dB of pure bitchery and 120 pounds of hot chick). Within minutes I was surrounded by 6 cops and transit security.
During the ensuing shouting match, none was ever able to say what illegal act I had committed. I eventually gave my (cellphone) number to the bitch ;)
6 months later, a "national security division" cop of the RCMP [rcmp.gc.ca] calls me on the cellphone and wants to talk to me.
- This is a cellphone.
- Oh. Sorry. Well, call me at 555-555-5555.
Not being stupid, I make sure I don't call him from $ORKPLACE. They're the police, so they surely can find my home number in the phone directory, no? And if they check google with my name, they can find I'm a transit buff, no?
Well, I guess not. And if they are doing "national security" investigations, 6 months later is pretty fast, I guess...
Re:And if you are lonely this holiday season... (Score:5, Interesting)
Even though it was voted against, Bush has stated that he will continue to authorize illegal phone taps and other forms of spycraft on US citizins. NYTimes article here [nytimes.com] He was, in fact, filled with rage at the tresonous liberal media who dared to leak the fact that he is authorizing such illegal activities in the first place, and that they may well have murdered innocent people through their deplorable actions. :)
This comes right on the heels of the use of torture being approved by the Bush-McCain agreement. Although on its surface it appears to ban the use of torture by US personnel, it in fact grants them 100% immunity from any problems that may arise from the use of torture, under the constraint that they must have reason to believe that such torture is an order. Standing orders are any and all means are authorised, therefore, this law grants immunity from prosecution or court martial to any US troops or CIA agents who with to torture or execute to gain information. Finally, the house and senate have both backed a measure that will make evidence gained through torture admisable in court, as well as holding people, both citizins and not, indefinatly without trial, and without access to a lawyer.
So there you have it. Bush is overriding the Judicial branch and issuing warrants himself, torture is legal, and evidence tortured out of a suspect is admissible in court, you have no right to a speedy trial, nor to confront witnesses. What a week! Ammendments lost this week: I, IV, V, VI, VIII.
Visited by FBI for buying a joystick (Score:3, Interesting)
A single agent dropped by his house in the evening, looked around, noted the flight-sim on his computer, and the joystick, and CDs and books and manuals on the subject, asked him some questions, and left.
WTF?
Re:Wait, WTF??!?!?!? (Score:3, Interesting)
Other books or instances? (Score:1, Interesting)
There was also a man who Photoshopped an image of guns next to George W. Bush's head who was checked out. These stories are always hilarious and begin with "I woke up, opened my door, and shit myself." Please, more.
the quote you want (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Wait, WTF??!?!?!? (Score:1, Interesting)
"If he is requesting a book through inter-library loan, at which point do all the requests get channeled through the FBI for vetting?"
Secondary question:
"Am I the only one who is asking this?"
Sidenote:
"I can't believe that no-one else has asked this already"
Re:Memorize this phrase... (Score:1, Interesting)
That's okay, we're already sniffing all the packets that match on your IP address.
Re:And if you are lonely this holiday season... (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Memorize this phrase... (Score:3, Interesting)
http://www.mediastudy.com/cm.html [mediastudy.com]
Re:And if you are lonely this holiday season... (Score:5, Interesting)
Is it? GWB admin is fighting the release of a number of other photos and information from Gitmo and Iraq. Apparently, they belive that it will inspire the enemy to rise up as well as encourage others to join. So how bad is it?
Last I heard, it was to go to the supremes.
Re:And if you are lonely this holiday season... (Score:5, Interesting)
Peking Version? (Score:5, Interesting)
Random points, in no particular order:
1) It's too coincidental. It happened (or was published) a day or so after secret eavesdropping policies from the administration made front page news in the New York Times.
2) Why the hell would agents bring the book? Can you imagine NSA agents walking into a remote library (and not the local library, because he needs the extra-special "Peking" version of the world's secondly most commonly printed book) and checking out this "rare" copy of a book? *How* did they check it out? Do they keep library accounts with all the universities in the state? And, why? Just so they can wave it in his face? What did they do with it after? Just toss it in the mail? Drive it back across town or to another city to return it? It makes no sense.
3) As best as I can tell, there's no such thing as the extra-special Peking Version of the book. My fiancee is Chinese, she's never heard of it (though she dislikes Communism, and isn't an expert on it either). Google '"Peking Version" Quotations of Chairman Mao' (or Little Red Book) and you get no results. Even the name is a bit suspect since Peking is the British name for Beijing, and the communists worked to change the name on everything to Beijing (via the uniform adoption of the standardized Pinyin system). But it's an older book, so it could be legit (the Pinyin reforms didn't happen for a while during Mao's reign). But neither does "Beijing Version" get any hits. Even the 1st edition was published in a variety of places, not just Beijing, so it would be a misnomer to call it a Peking Version.
Here's quotes from the article:
'"I tell my students to go to the direct source, and so he asked for the official Peking version of the book," Professor Pontbriand said. "Apparently, the Department of Homeland Security is monitoring inter-library loans, because that's what triggered the visit, as I understand it."'
and
"In the 1950s and '60s, during the Cultural Revolution in China, it was required reading. Although there are abridged versions available, the student asked for a version translated directly from the original book."
There is a rare-ish 1st edition, but it's only two chapters shorter than the common 2nd edition, and the text isn't different in any meaningful way (I think there was a typo or two fixed.) Having the student request a rare 1st edition wouldn't make any sense since (beyond the obvious fact the English versions aren't rate), he doesn't speak Chinese, and there's no textual changes between the English versions based on the different editions (2 chapters were added for the 2nd edition, and one for the 3rd).
4) The Little Red Book IS the bloody abridged version of the multi-volume Selected Works of Chairman Mao. But in the article it states the kid wanted the 'unabridged' version (of an abridged book??), and one that was "translated directly from the original version". Heh, I didn't know the Quotations of Chairman Mao (again, 2nd most published book in the world) was so rare that most American versions were, what... translated from the original Japanese? This request of the student's is nonsensical.
5) The professor is up for tenure. Which may or may not make a lick of difference, depending on the professor. He seems cool enough, though, doing some sort of extreme history thing in Afghanistan.
http://www.brianglynwilliams.com/ [brianglynwilliams.com]
6) Another quote: "The professors had bee
This is why it led to a fed visit. (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:This is unfortunately predictable (Score:1, Interesting)
Re:And if you are lonely this holiday season... (Score:5, Interesting)
Supposedly some of it includes rape, including that of children held captive. One of the videos includes a 15 year old boy being raped by one of the employees according to a reporter that claims to have seen it. Good God, I hope that it's not true.
I know that's not what you want to read, but you asked.
Stolen library book? (Score:2, Interesting)
Communism: A political theory which states that, among other things, everything within national boundaries belongs to the government, and can be seized for the good of the people.
Soviet Communism: And we get to spy on you, too.
DHS: "We came down here to see what you're up to, so we're gonna take your library book."
The Bible, The Hadith, The Torah: "Thou shallt not steal."
The U.S. Constitution: Governemnt can't take your property without compensating you.
The Law: Stealing is a crime.
Ironically the DHS comes out looking like the communists whose book they allegedly suppressed.
Protecting the U.S. Constitution does not authorise the government to suppress political opinions. Such a suppression would be unconstitutional.
Re:And if you are lonely this holiday season... (Score:3, Interesting)
The explanations (from memory - keep in mind this is going back 4 decades):
They'll release parts of their study, but they WON'T release all the JFK stuff. Gee - maybe Bubba Hotep trailers [yahoo.com] was on to something ...
Re:This is unfortunately predictable (Score:1, Interesting)
Re:And if you are lonely this holiday season... (Score:3, Interesting)
1. Knows what is going on.
2. Cares.
I would contend that neither is presently true, though #1 is starting to happen.
I would encourage other Americans (people in districts whose representatives are actually voting for these horrid bills) to remember to use the various boxes in the proper order. Ballot comes -way- before ammo. Vote in the mid-term elections. Vote against everyone who votes for draconian laws that violate our basic civil rights, regardless of their party. -That- is the way to win our freedom back---one slimy, back-stabbing congressman at a time.
Re:This is a bunch of hearsay.... (Score:3, Interesting)
A true contrarian is a pure moderate. 90% of both sides is pure Dogma. And 99.9% of the POV of individuals in unresearched hearsay.
Being that I don't know the full story, I will withold judgement, or use it as an allegory to discuss freedom. It doesn't stop people from drawing (valid) lessons from the Bible (or other unconfirmed scriptures), that the work may be fictional.
It MIGHT have happened though, since the student reporting this alleged act would be breaking the law.
Re:And if you are lonely this holiday season... (Score:5, Interesting)
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is it's natural manure." (Thomas Jefferson)
"All freedom and all security in this country rely utterly on three things, the right to free speech, the right to vote anonymously and the right to bear arms. Everything else is meaningless without those three. " (Lt Col. Jeff Cooper, Marines(ret))
I had never shared the viewpoint of pro-gun doomsayers who warned that losing the right to bear arms would *inevitably* lead to a further erosion of all other rights, but in light of the past years revelations regarding the Bush administration's policies, I have been forced to change my opinion. The right to free speech : gone The right to free assembly : gone (see the Seattle WTO protests of '99) The right to vote : rendered meaningless. (see the Florida scandals and the related but underreported scandals with absentee ballots and the ballots of overseas servicemen The right to bear arms : been crippled for years at the state and federal levels. The right to freedom from discrimation regardless of race, creed, color(sic) faith, sexual orientation or physical ability. gone (ethnic/religous profiling has been a news headline for years and the current administration is clearly biased against same-sex couples) Slashdotters, being largely IT people, are naturally more interested in how the Bush administrations reindeer games are affecting things like access to information, privacy and the right to due process. I think it would also be worthwhile to check out a well written article on how the Second Amendment is involved in all this: http://www.gunsandammomag.com/second_amendment/050 9/ [gunsandammomag.com]
I'm wondering, where is this "Land of the Free and home of the Brave" I have heard so much about?
Re:And if you are lonely this holiday season... (Score:4, Interesting)
Not really. We have been them for quite some time. One of my ex-GFs was a Panamanian who spent about 6 months in Noriega's dungeons during the 80's. The most interesting part of it, was that there were Americans there who never once touched a prisoner( She says that they were CIA). But they directed the others telling them what to do. Obviously, she was raped many times. Beat a number of times by padded sticks which broke a few fingers. They never did the cold feet stuff, but did have her stay awake for several days. But it was all about trying to get information from her. Her father was in opposition to Noriega, so they rounded up the family. To this day, she has a love/hate of America, but hates many of our politicians. Interestingly, she said that Reagan's pix was in the jail. The way that somebody would display it behind a desk. I wonder how many pix of bush/cheney/rumsfeld are hanging in abu grave or gitmo?
Re:I don't know about "innapropriate". (Score:2, Interesting)
"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. -- That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, -- That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness."