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Education Science

Scientists' Success Or Failure Correlated With Beer 349

mernil sends in an article from the NYTimes that casts a glance at a study done in the Czech Republic (natch) on what divides the successful scientists from the duffers. "Ever since there have been scientists, there have been those who are wildly successful, publishing one well-received paper after another, and those who are not. And since nearly the same time, there have been scholars arguing over what makes the difference. What is it that turns one scientist into more of a Darwin and another into more of a dud? After years of argument over the roles of factors like genius, sex, and dumb luck, a new study shows that something entirely unexpected and considerably sudsier may be at play in determining the success or failure of scientists — beer."
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Scientists' Success Or Failure Correlated With Beer

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  • by LinuxDon ( 925232 ) on Wednesday March 19, 2008 @05:42AM (#22793260)
    I guess that people having more fun in their life have better results!
    I hope that this article doesn't result in more alcoholics though..
  • by BadAnalogyGuy ( 945258 ) <BadAnalogyGuy@gmail.com> on Wednesday March 19, 2008 @05:42AM (#22793264)
    The study says that beer consumption is inversely proportional to academic success. The more beer you drink, the less likely you are to produce high-quality, well-regarded papers.

    It's been long known that beer is the drink of the underclasses. Wine, of course, being the preferred drink of the upper classes. And hard liquor a habit of the dregs of society. Is it any wonder, then, that people who consume beer, being from the lower classes, would be unable to create and innovate at the level that wine drinkers do? No, it only stands to reason that, as Murray 1996 shows, that intelligence is intricately tied to success. Therefore, the lower average intelligence of beer drinkers would necessarily be unable to compete with the higher average intelligence of wine drinkers.

    In other words, beer consumption is a symptom, not the cause of the lower quality academic product.
  • by sw155kn1f3 ( 600118 ) on Wednesday March 19, 2008 @05:45AM (#22793282)
    One day I read that to 100% restore high-level brain functions, one needs 2 weeks of sobriety. The one who has couple of beers/wine etc each week or two is simply working on suboptimal level if brain is the main tool. It's ok for other workers and maybe CEOs, but not for scientists, where you need as much advantage as you can.
  • Paper beers (Score:5, Interesting)

    by hweimer ( 709734 ) on Wednesday March 19, 2008 @05:58AM (#22793338) Homepage
    In many research groups it is common to go out and have a few beers once a paper has been accepted. So this should lead to a positive correlation between beer consumption and research output. However, it is likely that among Czechs these paper beers do not have a large effect on their overall consumption (they drink even more beer than Germans).
  • Yay for statistics (Score:5, Interesting)

    by thorsen ( 9515 ) on Wednesday March 19, 2008 @06:10AM (#22793372) Homepage
    Women in Denmark have larger breasts than women in Canada. There are more moose in Canada than in Denmark. So more moose means smaller breasts.

    Statistics are like miniskirts; they show a lot but hide the most important facts.
  • by SimonGhent ( 57578 ) on Wednesday March 19, 2008 @06:15AM (#22793398)

    It's been long known that beer is the drink of the underclasses. Wine, of course, being the preferred drink of the upper classes.


    Not completely true.

    Beer is the drink of Northern Europe, wine is the drink of Southern Europe. The UK and Europe as a whole tend to aspire to Southern Europe; the Mediterranean diet and reverence for the classical world. This has created the image of wine = good and rich, beer = bad and poor.
  • by PineGreen ( 446635 ) on Wednesday March 19, 2008 @06:43AM (#22793542) Homepage
    As a professional scientist who travelled a lot between universities in Europe, USA and Japan, I can say the following:

    a) Correlation does not imply causation. Some regions are generally poorer, meaning their universities get less money, they attract less good scientists, etc. And these regions also have higher alcohol consumption. And so observation that alcohol consumption anti-correlates with scientific achievements doesn't necessarily imply that drinking makes you bad scientist.

    b) I just moved from UK to USA and the amount of alcohol people drink in UK is completely unheard of in USA. Basically, we used to have three British pints 4 times a week. Properly drunk. In USA I can convince my colleagues to have one beer (over two hours!!) once a week. And yet, UK is THE most scientifically successful country per dollar spent.

    c) My feeling is actually the opposite: alcohol acts as a social lubricant and many personal frictions can get dissolved that way. After two pints, the guy who you hate so much for having more papers than you, suddenly seems an ok chap. People are more likely to speak about their work, share opinions on papers, don't be secretive about future projects, etc. This effect must have bigger positive impact than negative effects of drinking.
  • by Moraelin ( 679338 ) on Wednesday March 19, 2008 @06:55AM (#22793600) Journal
    Because if you keep perturbing a self-tuning biological system in one direction, it will start compensating in the other direction. That's how physiological addiction happens.

    E.g., smoking a cigarette makes you feel better, among other things, because it blocks MAO-B. So basically your normal "reward" pathways in the brain get unbalanced by blocking the part which pulls your mood back down to the baseline. But _very_ soon the brain chemistry starts to compensate by producing more MAO-B. Oops. Now you feel shitty without a cigarette, and eventually you need them even to get you back to the baseline.

    Alcohol works much the same, and is a pretty addictive thing.

    Now drinking a couple of beers a day won't give you Delirium Tremens [wikipedia.org] when you're sober. But that's just a matter of nuances. Your brain chemistry hasn't deviated _that_ far from the baseline, but it has deviated a little anyway, if it regularly has to compensate for alcohol intoxication. So, yes, you won't be as impaired as someone who's gotten to the delirium tremens point, but you'll be a little impaired anyway.
  • by shaitand ( 626655 ) on Wednesday March 19, 2008 @07:30AM (#22793734) Journal
    What I find interesting is that the article makes it seem like this is some ridiculous myth and there is no justification to believe it.

    Personally I would not be surprised to see that it is alcohol consumption rather than beer that is the problem. Alcohol is a poison that some individuals consume readily and it would not surprise me a bit to discover that it has long term affects on the body and mind. I suspect it has more to do with the brain than science specifically but the effect may be subtle and show itself more readily in a hard thinking field like science.

    As for other drugs, I wouldn't make the wild leap to assume that anything that causes euphoria is bad for you. Last time I looked it was still completely preposterous that many medications list euphoria as a NEGATIVE side effect.

    There are all kinds of things that it is coming to light are probably good for our brains in small doses. Nicotine, Caffeine, Cannabis, and even MSG all have negative effects at high doses and positive effects at low doses. Amusingly, MSG in high doses (which isn't much for msg) mass murders brain cells and yet we use buckets of it in our food, where Cannabis has no known permanent effects on the brain and we throw people in prison for possessing it. The difference? Euphoria of course.
  • by popmaker ( 570147 ) on Wednesday March 19, 2008 @07:31AM (#22793738)
    Oh, yes oh, yes oh, yes!

    Also: How many scientists have not been pushed into obsession because lack of companionship? You know Newton never married and never had a girlfriend. He didn't have too many friends either I think. So could not some of his work have been created by a man that had nothing else to do? By someone who is desperately fighting the loneliness that comes creeping up anytime he closes the book?

    I have written some of my best things (granted, I'm still just studying for a BS) on a saturday or a friday night. You simply have so much more uninterrupted time to get very heavily into something you are working on. The downside is, of course, loneliness.
  • by Moraelin ( 679338 ) on Wednesday March 19, 2008 @07:39AM (#22793780) Journal

    Except that if your brain actually fully compensates, there would be no negative effects.


    It actually works that way, to a point, yes. If you drink lots and regularly, you build up "alcohol tolerance". I.e., small quantities of alcohol which would make someone else tipsy, just get you back to the baseline. It compensated all right.

    The problem is that that compensated state remains so even when you're sober. That's how eventually DT happens. The brain chemistry is "compensated" to work right with a lot of alcohol in the system. Without that alcohol, however, you're fucked up and can even die.

    It's, if you will, like compensating for pushing a wardrobe to the right. Hard. So you compensate by slanting it to the left. When that force is applied, congrats, the components cancel out and the wardrobe stays like that. But when that force isn't applied any more, now it falls over to the the left.

    That's in a nutshell how you die of DT. It's not the alcohol that kills you, it's the lack of alcohol. At that point your brain has changed so much to keep working when marinated in alcohol, that eventually it became unable to function without it.

    That incidentally, also has the following implication for the post-alcohol-impairment I was talking about. It's easy to think "bah, I'm resistant to alcohol. Why, I only even start feeling a little warm after the fourth pint." Congrats, if you're at that point, your brain's equilibrium is now already waay off center. You _will_ have decreased brain power even when alcohol has left your system. In fact, _because_ all alcohol has left your system.

    Anyway, it is wrong to just look at the effect of alcohol on your ability to think; the smartest people are not necessarily the ones that successfully reproduce. Modest alcohol consumption seems to have positive effects even today, and until a century ago, alcoholic beverages were pretty much the only ones that were safe to drink.


    I couldn't care less, actually. Equally, a couple of century ago, mercury was the only known treatment for syphilis. It doesn't mean we should keep doing that. Nowadays we have better ways to deal with that.

    Similarly, nowadays we know how to filter and disinfect water. So whatever need for alcohol might have existed, doesn't exist any more.

    Smoking also seems to have a complex mix of risks and benefits, both to the individual and society. I'm glad smoking is banned in public places, but I think anybody who wants to smoke should be allowed to do so and have to live with the consequences.


    I'm not proposing to ban either alcohol or tobacco. If you want to nuke your brain, be my guest. I wouldn't even stop you from hanging yourself or playing russian roulette. If you want to, by all means, go ahead.

    I'm _only_ saying "don't be surprised if it affects your IQ", really. But if you can live with that, go ahead and drink yourself silly, for all I care :)
  • by presarioD ( 771260 ) on Wednesday March 19, 2008 @07:54AM (#22793872)
    amen to that brother! My most productive 2 years of research were in a miserable city of south california where the absence of anything remotely close to culture almost depressed me. My most enjoyable "cultural" experience was taking a good book and going to a locally owned coffee shop to read...

    scientists are a very weird cast and most of them have been stuck to pre-adolescent personality development stages. So they identify their scientific persona with their own self and unable to distinguish between the two they strive for development and perfection of the former at the expense of the latter...

  • by dbcad7 ( 771464 ) on Wednesday March 19, 2008 @08:01AM (#22793920)
    I think in the US that you will find that drinking is a logistical problem.. If your going to go out drinking, it requires a way to get back.. It's a pain in the butt.. I know I guy who got popped for driving a bicycle while intoxicated.. and he was riding the bike because he thought he was doing the right thing by not driving a car.. Taxis are also not numerous or cheap in many towns.. and if you have to walk, what are the odds a pub will be withing a couple of block of your house ?
  • by hey! ( 33014 ) on Wednesday March 19, 2008 @08:01AM (#22793922) Homepage Journal
    Actually, American versions of Pilsners, while evolving towards lightness, didn't become insipid until after Prohibition. When Prohibition was repealed, Americans were ready to drink anything. Only a few breweries left, which had survived selling malt for malted milk and root beer, provided a thirsty nation with beer that you could drink a lot of, very quickly.

    I've done a bit of home brewing, and the funny thing is that an American style beer is actually an extremely difficult style of beer to make. Replacing much of the malt with rice means that you end up with a very light flavor. The tiniest off flavor is immediately detectable. Get anything wrong with the fermentation, or the water, or the storage and it tastes really bad.

    In contrast, I've made Russian Imperial Stouts that have a starting specific gravity so dense the hydrometer wouldn't go into the wort, it just sat on top. Practically speaking, the wort was syrup. While the recipe is complicated in that it has lots of stuff in it, it's actually quite easy to succeed with. You could probably brew it with swamp water, and the three types of malt plus roasted buckwheat would beat the swamp muck taste into a mere "peaty overtone".

    When I started homebrewing, wife was afraid I was going to turn into an alcoholic, but in fact there are easier ways to get drunk than spending a day mixing sticky ingredients in carefully sterilized equipment then nursing a yeast culture for weeks before you get something minimally drinkable. I got interested in brewing for its chemistry-set aspects; I'd been mucking around with sour dough and yogurt, and moved onto brewing as a logical next step.

    The thing is, I still don't drink very much, and I give away most of what I make. For myself, I'd bottle my beer in six ounce bottles if I could, since I'm more interested in the flavor and feel of the beer than its effects. But I do know a lot more about what is a good beer and what is a bad beer than before. And American "Pilsners" are not bad beers, they're just uninteresting beers (and they certainly aren't the same thing as "real" Czech style pilsners). Since, when I am thirsty, I prefer water to beer, and when I am drinking beer, I prefer complex to simple, I don't bother with beers like Bud. But they have their place; I've heard them called "lawnmower beers".
  • Re:WWFD? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by The Fun Guy ( 21791 ) on Wednesday March 19, 2008 @10:58AM (#22795552) Homepage Journal
    Feynman gave up drinking [wordpress.com] in the middle of his career. He toasted his own Nobel prize with ginger ale.

    Feynman was fascinated by the phenomenon of sensory deprivation and even tried marijuana, ketamine and LSD to experience altered consciousness. He gave up drinking alcohol after he showed early signs of alcoholism, saying that he didn't want to do anything that would harm his brain. Feynman had a very liberal view on sexuality, visiting topless bars regularly and even giving a chapter on how to pick up girls in a bar in his biography.
  • by rasputin465 ( 1032646 ) on Wednesday March 19, 2008 @04:45PM (#22799712)

    1. The popular usage, which just means "compulsion". You're considered an addict by society if you have a compulsion to do something, to the extent of it interfering with your life.

    2. The physiological addiction, which just means that the brain chemistry compensated in the opposite direction.

    We're obviously talking about meaning number 2, so let's explore this. The definition you give isn't entirely accurate, because "compensation by brain chemistry" isn't exactly a well-defined statement. Physiological addiction requires a dependency, and by definition, requires that the user exhibit withdrawal symptoms. That's actually important, because in a medical sense, a person cannot be considered an addict without withdrawal symptoms.

    While the level of usage required to incite dependency varies from person to person, it is highly unlikely that a single drink will cause this. Withdrawal symptoms will occur when there is a chemical imbalance in the brain, and only if there is a chemical imbalance (unless we're talking about psychological addiction, which is much more difficult to define).

    Thus, to say that "A single beer... gave your brain a jolt in one direction [and that] it can take two weeks or more for that compensating effect to decay back to negligible" is not true. If the compensating effect were present for two weeks, there must also be withdrawal symptoms present for an equal duration, and that rarely accompanies a single drink.

    As an interesting side note, while alcohol is one of the few legal drugs, it has the most severe withdrawal symptoms of any drug. It is commonly believed that drugs such as crack and heroin are the most addictive, but this reputation exists due to ease with which a dependency develops with those drugs. Alcohol withdrawal is the only one severe enough to regularly cause seizures or even death.
  • by nguy ( 1207026 ) on Wednesday March 19, 2008 @04:47PM (#22799736)
    Similarly, nowadays we know how to filter and disinfect water. So whatever need for alcohol might have existed, doesn't exist any more.

    That's incorrect; in fact, moderate alcohol consumption appears to have health benefits. And its health risks don't appear to result from effects on the brain, but on the liver.

    It actually works that way, to a point, yes.

    No, it doesn't. The way the body changes in response to repeated exposure to alcohol is nowhere near as simplistic as you dreamed it up.

    The problem is that that compensated state remains so even when you're sober.

    Again, nice fiction, but totally incorrect. Alcohol is a CNS despressant, but alcohol withdrawal doesn't make you manic.

    I'm _only_ saying "don't be surprised if it affects your IQ",

    Well, moderate alcohol consumption actually seems to improve cognitive ability slightly.

    If you want to nuke your brain, be my guest.

    I don't drink. But that's besides the point.

    Stop making things up: you evidently have no clue about the physiology of alcohol or alcoholism.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcohol_consumption_and_health [wikipedia.org]

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Effects_of_alcohol_on_the_body [wikipedia.org]

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcohol [wikipedia.org]

Ya'll hear about the geometer who went to the beach to catch some rays and became a tangent ?

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