US Adults Score Poorly On Worldwide Test 745
New submitter Norwell Bob sends this excerpt from an Associated Press report:
"It's long been known that America's school kids haven't measured well compared with international peers. Now, there's a new twist: Adults don't either. In math, reading and problem-solving using technology – all skills considered critical for global competitiveness and economic strength – American adults scored below the international average on a global test, according to results (PDF) released Tuesday."
Re:Color me shocked! (Score:5, Informative)
Ha! You mean to tell me that all those kids who 10-20 years ago were getting a shit education grew up to be adults that don't know shit? Say it isn't so! Next thing you'll tell me is that correlation isn't causation and there is some bigger root cause we just haven't figured out yet.
There's a cause alright, and it's quite deliberate [cantrip.org].
I'll agree that he's a fucktard, but... (Score:5, Informative)
Don't assault Neanderthals. Their being "stupid brutes" is a terrible misconception.
Re:Charles Darwin Wrote (Score:5, Informative)
Neanderthals had larger brains than us. Your argument isn't terribly effective.
Re:It's a good thing... (Score:5, Informative)
Joke (noun) -- a thing that someone says to cause amusement or laughter, esp. a story with a funny punchline.
Re:JIT Education (Score:5, Informative)
Bwahahaha, I guess you are modded insightful because it is the new funny? I actually lol-ed a little at your comment. Compared to many areas in Europe, yes, but compared to many of the better scoring nations, and especially the #1 scorer, Japan, which is well known for work-a-haulism (among other -ahaulisms), Americans definitely are not work-ahaulics.
Actually, the average America works more hours per year than the average Japanese by about ~40 hours. The times vary from year to year. Last year (2012) it was 45 hours, but in 2011, it was over 60. Go see for yourself:
http://stats.oecd.org/Index.aspx?DatasetCode=ANHRS [oecd.org]
As for education, I do have to agree with you for education up to and including high school education. The current system in the USA is completely broken, which isn't surprising as it was designed in the 1800's, not the 21st century. It is still based on concepts and criteria to produce factory line workers and farmers, not critical thinkers, engineers, inventors, entrepreneurs, or artists. Even the very concept of the "school year" itself is based on 1800's agricultural needs of the children to be home working on the farm planting/harvesting crops, which is why there exists such a thing as "summer vacation". More is lost in the 2-3 months of "summer vacation" than is taught in 2 months of classes (more for students of low income families). That actually means that in terms of education knowledge gained, our students only have 5-6 months of school while countries that do not have a 2-3 month summer vacation received 10-11 months in the same time period. It is no wonder our students do not do as well....
Re:Charles Darwin Wrote (Score:1, Informative)
"There you will see that despite blacks making up 13% of the population in the US, they are [arrested] for a significantly greater proportion
of violent crime."
That's a more accurate statement. Also, what's more likely. people with higher melanin levels are more violent, or laws written
by the majority population are biased against the minority population.
Re:Not surprised (Score:5, Informative)
Only 57% of those eligible voted at all.
Re:JIT Education (Score:4, Informative)
Then as an educator you should know what the real problem is. It breaks down to 3:
1. Localized school boards more interested in political gains than education. They are busy trying to maintain their kingdoms that they have built and trying to expand it.That leads to differing results from community to community.
2. Changes in laws such as No Child Left Behind (an Orwellian title if ever there was one) mandating that teacher retention be tied to student performance has made it necessary for self preservation for teachers to teach to the tests. Add in dwindling budgets and anything not directly related to those tests gets cut from the curriculum. Many primary schools have dropped music, art and classics from their teaching programs all together.
3. Lack of parental involvement in their children's education. This may be one of the most important reasons that education is failing in the US. With both parents needing to work just to make ends meet because the average income level has declined while costs have increased, it makes it difficult for parents to spend the proper amount of time with their kids education.
Until these issues are addressed, we will continue to see a decline in education in the US.
Re:Computer literacy + social skills (Score:4, Informative)
How dumb is it to have the bank offer you a loan so you can afford to live in a house you couldn't afford? These people were mostly former renters. That's their frame of reference. The banker, knowing full well the situation and the buyer's mindset, explains, "You will have fixed mortgage payments of $600/mo for 3 years and then depending on interest rates, it can go up or down." The buyer hears, "I will have fixed rent payments of $800/mo for 3 years and then the rent will go up (because it never goes down)." He compares the house he's being offered with what he can rent for that amount and decides the house is a better deal -- because it is. He makes a possibly rational decision that even if he's foreclosed on, he's way ahead taking that mortgage over the $1200/mo mortgage with traditional financing -- $14400 over that three years. He's a RENTER. He was figuring to move every 3 years anyway.
So what? What did he lose when he stopped making payments after they ballooned to $1200? Nothing. The loan company didn't lose anything either; they MADE money on the fees that they rolled into the note. It's the "smart" people who bought the mortgage-backed securities that the bank fraudulently sold to them as AAA that lost money. They are checking their math over and over and it doesn't add up. They should have studied harder.
Re:Does it matter? (Score:5, Informative)
You might need to broaden your research. Finland vastly outperforms the U.S. in education, and they have the same summer vacation:
http://calendar.zoznam.sk/school-enfi.php [zoznam.sk]
Re:McFly, is that you? US DID well until hubris (Score:4, Informative)
No, that is the conservative fantasy of what America was. You conveniently leave out in your talks of the "American Dream" about the 10s of millions of slaves who never had any such chance. Or the then subsequently-freed slaves who themselves and their progeny faced nearly another hundred years of segregation. Oh and lets not forget how women used to not have the right to vote, were paid less than 50 cents on the dollar that a man made, were routinely were denied admission to college, etc. That is also before we also get to the robber baron era where a couple of greedy people paid their workers shit wages, made them work 80+ hours a week and all in unsafe work environments while they got ultra-wealthy and stifled any and all competition against them. The "American Dream" you refer to was only available to the wealthy, white males for more nearly 200 of the first years of America's existence.
Re:Decline of the American Empire? (Score:2, Informative)
"oligarchs used to look after their people...".
This is not exactly true. School teachers used to be paid by the parents and were directly answerable to them. And parents cared that their children were taught properly. Now we have neither. Lack of family structure and teacher unions that don't care about good teachers don't exactly make for good education.
Transferring education completely to the control of the government results in the education system equivalent of the U.S. Postal System.
Then why does Germany rank higher in literacy and numeracy?
German education is almost entirely under government control. Evil socialism.
Re:Charles Darwin Wrote (Score:5, Informative)
From this article [wikipedia.org]:
Orangutans: 275–500 cc (16.8–31 cu in)
Chimpanzees: 275–500 cc (16.8–31 cu in)
Gorillas: 340–752 cc (21–45.9 cu in)
Humans: 1,000–1,900 cc (61–120 cu in)
Neanderthals: 1,200–1,900 cc (73–120 cu in)
I think you're overestimating the orangutan brain size. It gets worse if you try to correct for body size using the encephalization quotient. You then get 7.4-7.8 for humans and 1.8 or so for orangutans.
Re:Charles Darwin Wrote (Score:0, Informative)
Although you're on the right lines, there is more to it than that.
Statistics show that, in the US:
- People of colour are more likely to be stopped by police (numbers from NY's infamous stop and frisk programme provide strong evidence that the stopping is not properly objective).
- White people are more likely to be let off with a warning.
- Once charged, PoC are more likely to see their case turn into a federal one, with the associated higher penalties.
- Convictions for the same crimes in the same courts typically see harsher sentences for PoC, controlling for other factors.
So, although the laws themselves might not be biased, the enforcement of them clearly is from top to bottom. This is one of the biggest problems facing the US criminal justice system, not least because there's no obvious way it can be fixed.
Re:No adult left behind (Score:5, Informative)
Take a look at the countries with better education rates then the US. A lot of them have political systems that are more socialized (education, health, etc) then the US.
If you want to solve problems you need to stop throwing idiology at each other and start thinking.
My (US born) wife and I were discussing last night. The word "unamercian" is thrown out a lot on conversations about these things. We live in Canada, and can't recall hearing the phrase "uncanadian", as in, it sounds odd to our ears, feels weird to say.
It's sad that there is a word in the lexicon in a country settled by immigrants and which claims to espouse the ideals of equality which means "You don't belong with us".
Now back to the topic,
If there's one thing I've learned from the political narrative in the US, it is that teachers are government employees, too incompetent to tie their own shoes
Canadian schools are publicly funded, 94.4% of children here are enrolled in public schools (vs private). The US has 90% enrollment in public as opposed to private schools (data taken from statistics Canada and US Institute of Educational Sciences - the latter via google cache due to govt shutdown).
This suggests to me, given Canada's ranking above the US on every survey category mentioned that the "government is too involved in education" answer is at least not the sole deciding factor in the relative rankings.
Min