Please create an account to participate in the Slashdot moderation system

 



Forgot your password?
typodupeerror
×
Graphics The Almighty Buck Hardware Technology

Oculus Founder Explains Why the Rift VR Headset Will Cost "More Than $350" 174

An anonymous reader writes: When Oculus took to Kickstarter in 2012, the company sought to create the 'DK1', a development kit of the Rift which the company wanted to eventually become an affordable VR headset that they would eventually take to market as a consumer product. At the time, the company was aiming for a target price around $350, but since then the company, and the scope of the Rift headset, has grown considerably. That's one reason why Oculus Founder Palmer Luckey says that the consumer Rift headset, launching in Q1 2016, will cost more than $350. '...the reason for that is that we've added a lot of technology to this thing beyond what existed in the DK1 and DK2 days,' says Luckey.
This discussion has been archived. No new comments can be posted.

Oculus Founder Explains Why the Rift VR Headset Will Cost "More Than $350"

Comments Filter:
  • by Anonymous Coward

    This sounds like a classic case of feature creep. Good luck to them, but at this point, things look very bleak. This team is lacking strong management that can throw the bullshit flag on the field and rein them in.

    • by Anonymous Coward

      At first glance that sure seems the case, but VR is already quite hard to sell people on. It would be hard to release a "sub-par" version and get enough traction to iterate on that on a yearly release or something. People would buy it and not be too impressed with the result, which would make it harder to justify a subsequent purchase of an improved model.
      On the other hand, what they did, you can hold off and release a better version to start with, which I can't help but feel is the right choice.
      It's always

    • quite the opposite actually. Think about it, it's been 3 years since the first of this new generation of VR started. I've followed it very closely and own a couple of the devkit headsets that have come out over those three years. I have watched it evolve from a barf inducing curiosity to an established and amazing new format. 99% of the work that has gone into it is finding out what you can and can't do in VR. Some people are nearly immune to the motion sickness (John Carmack, Oculus CTO) others are hi

  • by Overzeetop ( 214511 ) on Friday October 02, 2015 @06:37AM (#50643289) Journal

    The parts of cheap. Make 100 Million headsets and you could sell them profitably for $150. They've got a mountain of engineering debt to pay off, though, and they're sure as hell not going to sell 100 million.

    People (and research) are expensive. That's why it's going to cost so much.

    • by KGIII ( 973947 )

      The only reason I'd want such a critter would be for augmented reality and, frankly, I'd rather not want to meander around with these sorts of things on my head to enjoy that. It'd be neat to get "information overload" when viewing the skyline. As I hopped onto the Skyway (I'm in Buffalo still, I have my reasons) I was curious as to when and where the idea came from, how tall it was, etc... It'd be neat to have that information available in small text inside my glasses but, you know, I probably shouldn't dr

      • by KGIII ( 973947 )

        Oh - and occasional time to immerse into a VR world but, as a general rule, I'd probably avoid that. If done well, I think it'd be too addictive.

        • Just curious, have you tried one of the modern (2015) versions of VR?

          Even the late 2014 development kits were pretty amazing and has replaced my previous gaming with headset gaming.

          • by KGIII ( 973947 )

            I haven't. I tried a long time ago at a convention and wasn't really impressed. I am also not really a gamer. The last game I played seriously was Fallout 2 and I gave up playing games when Fallout Tactics came out and turned out to be mentally handicapped (i.e. retarded). That doesn't mean I don't amuse myself, I just do it in other ways - such as 'conversing' on Slashdot.

            • It's difficult not to rant and rave about it, but I will say you should give it a try. GearVR isn't even really game focused. It does have a lot of games but has much more passive content that is pretty amazing. I've had mine since Feb and I still feel like I'm participating in the future.

    • by Osgeld ( 1900440 )

      so is dragging your ass for 4 years and not really having any product

      • No shit. It's this and the feature creep with the stupid headphones and useless controller that really pisses me off.

        What they try to build is some sort of Matrix while what everyone actually wants are just head-tracked 3d goggles to play plane sims in.

  • "added a lot of technology " but fails to mention what they added. Yup lenses. Expensive display. "sensors". Yes, and a lot of small parts add up quickly. If you need to add a high end pc as well, they better heve some steaming content!

  • Perhaps it's just one of those inflation controversies? [dollartimes.com]
  • You just charged $5 for the perfect glass of lemonade. Your total profits for the week are down. Would you like to alter your lemonade recipe and pricing scheme?
    • When life hands you lemons, don't make lemonade. Make life take the lemons back.
      • by Anonymous Coward

        When life hands you lemons, it's time for a Gin and Tonic!

    • No need, just make it up on volume the following week.

    • The problem is that you've spent $50,000 on lemonade taste testing and recipe development. Making a $5 glass of lemonade using a recipe which uses $0.35 of raw materials instead of $0.60 isn't going to allow you to make a bigger profit if you have to sell it for $4.75 or less.

      They have two plans:
      1) Sell their VR headsets for $500 and pray they sell enough
      2) Declare bankruptcy, buy the tech back at liquidation, and start a new company selling the same headset for $200

      Note: this is how golf courses get built.

  • by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 02, 2015 @07:05AM (#50643435)

    I've been a huge supporter of Oculus since the Kickstarter. When people complained about the Facebook buyout, I tried to point out that a major player in the tech industry (like them or not, they are a major player) just dropped a massive investment in VR. When people complained about how long it was taking, I argued that doing something like this, and doing it well, has to take time - an inferior product could be a major issue for VR adoption. When they balked at releasing specs, I reminded myself that it's probably best, they wanted to make sure they had it right before they committed to something.

    My first doubts started when they finally released the specs. I was really hoping for a 4K screen. After all the time and money, it seemed logical - come out of the gate with something really great or stay home. Sure, 4K isn't necessary, but there are applications for VR that would really benefit from it. Game will be the vehicle that carries the initial adoption of VR, but there are a ton of real-world applications waiting to be discovered. Personally, I want to throw out my monitors and use a VR headset to create a virtual workspace. But, anything less than 4K isn't going to give me the detail I need to write code on a virtual monitor "floating" a few feet in front of me.

    My next doubts came when I started looking at the amount of "executives" and "directors" and people who stand up and do a lot of talking. I've noticed a trend (it's not new, it's always been there, I just finally noticed) - the more talking heads you have in a company, the longer, more expensive, more feature bloated (and never the features we actually want), more disappointing a product becomes. All these people swooped in and promptly buried something really cool in all the typical corporate ("we're not corporate, man! we're a startup that just happens to look like a bloated corporate monstrosity) BS.

    Then this. After all the talk keeping it affordable, then they pull this crap.

    I get that things add up, but I'll put this in perspective - I work for a company that is supplying them, and I know what we're charging (very low piece prices, and we're expensive compared to our competitors that do larger volumes). I also have access to price sheets from the kinds of suppliers that they're working with. Let's put it this way - there's no legitimate reason that they can't make a 4K rift with all the sensors they have, sell it for $200-$250, and still make a profit. So, either they've gotten a little top-heavy in the salary department, or they're getting greedy. Or both.

    Either way, I'm done offering my (measly, not-reall-worth-much) support. My money is on Valve now (we're supplying them too, I've gotten to see some pretty cool stuff)

    • I was really hoping for a 4K screen

      Wait, so you wanted the Oculus headset to release with a $3K pricetag? And that is probably a huge underestimate, is it even possible with current tech to shrink 4K down into an 1"x1" screen?

      Personally, I want to throw out my monitors and use a VR headset to create a virtual workspace.

      Ohhhh. Well you could of just told us your're an idiot upfront and saved us the effort of reading your opinion.

    • by Anonymous Coward

      there's no legitimate reason that they can't make a 4K rift with all the sensors they have, sell it for $200-$250, and still make a profit

      You are nuts. 4K screens at those sizes would be extremely costly. They don't exist, they'd have to get someone to develop them and they'd want to recoup the R&D costs. Even the insane 4K screens Sony is putting in their new smart phones are much too big, and the pixels there are already TINY.

      • by axedog ( 991609 )

        4K screens at those sizes would be extremely costly. They don't exist,

        Even the insane 4K screens Sony is putting in their new smart phones are much too big, and the pixels there are already TINY.

        You said it yourself - they do exist! The rift screen is a phone, and 4K phones exist.

        • You'd need a 4k screen for each eye. On top of that there are very few graphics cards capable of rendering even lower end graphics at 4k. The top of the line nVidia card can only do it with a bunch of the rendering options kicked down to low and medium. People won't be very impressed with VR if they have to make the game look like 2000 era game to make it playable.

          You are deranged to suggest that 4k is achievable.

        • Even the insane 4K screens Sony is putting in their new smart phones are much too big, and the pixels there are already TINY.

          You said it yourself - they do exist! The rift screen is a phone, and 4K phones exist.

          DK2 is a phone screen, CV1 display is customized for VR with much higher fill factor.

    • Then this. After all the talk keeping it affordable, then they pull this crap.

      You've come an awful long way to be discouraged by something that still costs significantly less than the phones that most people buy yearly. Look at what people spend on other components and this still isn't out of line for what you get. I bet they could have charged $500 and still sold tons of units.

    • there's no legitimate reason that they can't make a 4K rift with all the sensors they have, sell it for $200-$250, and still make a profit.

      You do realize that if they made it 4k, you would need a $1500 video card just to be able to use it?

      Even the current specs require a pretty damn beefy graphic card.

    • I get that things add up, but I'll put this in perspective - I work for a company that is supplying them, and I know what we're charging (very low piece prices, and we're expensive compared to our competitors that do larger volumes). I also have access to price sheets from the kinds of suppliers that they're working with. Let's put it this way - there's no legitimate reason that they can't make a 4K rift with all the sensors they have, sell it for $200-$250, and still make a profit. So, either they've gotten a little top-heavy in the salary department, or they're getting greedy. Or both.

      My understanding one of the practical limiting factor is HDMI 1.3... there simply isn't an interface you can currently physically plug into that will drive a 4k display at 90hz even if you had a cheap GPU that could drive it.

    • by bongey ( 974911 )
      700 years of making glasses: no one has made the mistake making the frame of fabric.
      Wouldn't put your Oculus CV1 in the clothes washer when it gets dirty.
      Predicting someone will be canned for the decision and the CV2 the fabric will be gone.
      • by Anguirel ( 58085 )

        Hmm. I wonder what that strap holding my safety goggles on was, then... Weird, I could have sworn is was an elastic fabric, with some fabric-style padding around the face.

        • by bongey ( 974911 )
          You do realize the frame and strap are different parts? No real issues putting safety goggles through the wash, they will still work as safety googles afterwards.
          • by Anguirel ( 58085 )

            Yes, but if you really meant the frame, then I don't see the relevance of your post. The frame is plastic and metal. It's a solid chunk. It is definitely not fabric. There might be some edging that is foam or fabric in the final design - however, for masks and helmets that's not uncommon and is pretty easy to clean by hand. Maybe it'll even be a modular part that can be replaced easily (that'd be best - also allow for more custom fits with different size foam pads, similar to bike helmets), but I have no id

            • by bongey ( 974911 )
              The CV1 frame is made fabric. An entire presentation at oculus connect 2 was spent bragging about how they made the frame of fabric. Fabric just like your shirt, Oculus had pictures of shirts in the presentation. I have demoed the CV1 multiple times, it is fabric just like your shirt but no way to clean it like your shirt. The back of the fabric is harden using some kind of epoxy. You can read more about it here http://www.digitaltrends.com/c... [digitaltrends.com] .
              I really hope they abandon the idea or at least coat with
              • by Anguirel ( 58085 )

                Ok, I think you're taking the "fabric" part in there a little too seriously.

                First: Fabric hardened with epoxy is no longer fabric. It's essentially plastic with fiber for stability. For example, a plaster medical cast is made that way. Fabric (a bandage), is dipped in an epoxy (plaster), and then wrapped around your arm. After it hardens, I wouldn't call a cast a "frame made of fabric", although technically that might be what it is.

                So let's look at what the article you linked says... Internals secured by fa

                • by bongey ( 974911 )
                  No the exterior is soft type of fabric and isn't removable, they are doing it for comfort and breathability . The fabric is semi-transparent to allow light and sound to pass through it(the CV1 has microphones in it). I demoed the current prototype and it was very easily to get dirty. I was really confused like you when I first held it. I thought the fabric was a removable soft cover when it is not. The same design goal allowing the fabric to be semi-transparent will be a great attractor for dirt. I hope the
  • Why should a company have to explain this at all? For things that aren't a public good it's morally a company's right to charge what the market will bear. Obviously charging $30 for a surgical mask after 9/11 or $750 for an AIDS pill that costs $1 to make is immoral, but we're talking about a new, innovative product used for entertainment. They don't owe it to the public to charge as little as possible.

    If another company can make one just as good for a cheaper price, that's awesome. Until then this is a lu
  • Content / Experience. Go back to the early flip phone days and ask if anyone could ever see paying $700 for a mobile phone (!). They would have you committed (or give you millions in VC money, because, insanity). "Surely not more than a few thousand die-hard fanboys will shell out that kind of money for a phone"

    The content / experience has helped drive mobile phones to be valued so highly, and VR will likewise be dependent. If it becomes the Must See TV of 2017 then all projections are out the w
  • by JohnFen ( 1641097 ) on Friday October 02, 2015 @08:14AM (#50643797)

    Oculus Rift was dead to me the instant Facebook bought it.

  • I would not want my worst enemy to experience VR with a cheap headset. It takes precision, quality materials, high resolution low latency display panels, tracking, etc. I don't even know why this is a conversation at 350$ .. $850? Yes, then I would say hmm. But I'd almost expect even an $850 unit. You're talking about state of the art VR technology that you would not want to put down and it could transform how you even use computers. Let the knockoffs with poor quality components cater to the cheaper crowd.
    • You're talking about state of the art VR technology that you would not want to put down and it could transform how you even use computers.

      Eventually, maybe. But not in the near future. The only way that VR technology could transform how normal people use computers is if it can be done without a headset (or at least one that isn't much more massive that eyeglasses or a phone headset) and if it is inexpensive enough.

  • by yodleboy ( 982200 ) on Friday October 02, 2015 @09:03AM (#50644175)
    Why is it any thread about 3d or VR brings the party poopers out in force? We get it already. Really. You don't like 3d or VR. You got a tummy ache when you tried it or maybe your widdle noggin hurt. The idea is completely without merit and just a way to scam people out of their money, therefore no one should make or use these technologies. You point to the numerous failures to deliver, but decade after decade, someone tries to do it. It's just a matter of time before the killer app and the technology finally converge.

    If the product is not for you, move along. I swear, sometimes this place is just filled with people that seem to WANT things to fail.
  • by DrXym ( 126579 ) on Friday October 02, 2015 @09:22AM (#50644369)
    There is no denying VR sounds cool. In some cases it might actually be cool - I'm thinking particularly of racing / flight / space sims where you sit in a cockpit and the range of movements in game roughly correspond to real life - you sit in the game, you sit in real life, you have buttons and controls in the game, you have buttons and controls in real life.

    But for other kinds of game I really don't see the benefit. Yeah it could be used for first person shooters (for example) but then the game has to somehow reconcile a person running, spinning, jumping, aiming, shooting, standing, crouching and throwing stuff to someone in real life sat on a couch. It's likely that it will be extremely disorientating and puke inducing.

    And aside from FPSs what can we expect? Probably some lame jump scare horror games. Probably some table top style games. But nothing that particularly justifies the experience. I bet most games will work as well if not better in 2D.

    The strange part is there are at least 3 major efforts to do VR plus a number of smaller ones and they'll end up cannibalizing the market for what it is. It's going to be a bloodbath.

    • by xtal ( 49134 )

      This is game changing for simulators, and simulators are big business. Not just for games, either.

      Even if every other application flops, that one alone, even just in the safety training space, will be a billion dollar industry very quickly.

      A text readable experience also is game changing right away in a number of spaces. That and 3D mechanical design, or even 2D design for things like PCBs.

      I actually think FPS games are the worst application. Maintaining orientation is probably impossible.

      • by DrXym ( 126579 )
        I play Stumovik Cliffs of Dover which has some amazing cockpit models and I can't help but think what it would be like if I was actually looking around with my head instead of with some stupid hat control. But sims are a niche. Not everyone likes flying planes around (or trains, trucks, tractors etc.). And even of those that do, only a fraction stump up for a stick let alone a peripheral costing $350 and requiring high end hardware.

        So I don't see that sims would save the tech. Nor do I expect Oculus would

    • There is no denying VR sounds cool. In some cases it might actually be cool - I'm thinking particularly of racing / flight / space sims where you sit in a cockpit and the range of movements in game roughly correspond to real life - you sit in the game, you sit in real life, you have buttons and controls in the game, you have buttons and controls in real life.

      But for other kinds of game I really don't see the benefit. Yeah it could be used for first person shooters (for example) but then the game has to somehow reconcile a person running, spinning, jumping, aiming, shooting, standing, crouching and throwing stuff to someone in real life sat on a couch. It's likely that it will be extremely disorientating and puke inducing.

      And aside from FPSs what can we expect? Probably some lame jump scare horror games. Probably some table top style games. But nothing that particularly justifies the experience. I bet most games will work as well if not better in 2D.

      I expect you're right about cockpit games, and I'd add giant robot cockpits to your list. They will work and work very well, and that might be enough to drive a major market.

      I also agree that FPSs that are anything like modern FPSs just aren't going to work. There may be FPSs, but it will be like Rainbow Six with the realism turned up to 11, otherwise they will make you sick.

      You left out a couple of major categories though.

      God games? AWESOME in VR. You control the view, and you don't have to pan very fa

    • by chihowa ( 366380 )

      Yeah it could be used for first person shooters (for example) but then the game has to somehow reconcile a person running, spinning, jumping, aiming, shooting, standing, crouching and throwing stuff to someone in real life sat on a couch. It's likely that it will be extremely disorientating and puke inducing.

      I agree that it may be better suited for cockpit-style games, but why would the FPS mechanics necessarily make anybody sick? When playing an FPS on a flat screen, you're still "running, spinning, jumping, aiming, shooting, standing, crouching and throwing stuff" in game, while really just sitting on a couch. Even worse, turning your head in real life has no effect on the game viewport, which is instead turned with buttons while your head remains stationary. If that doesn't make people sick, I don't see why

    • by Toshito ( 452851 )

      VR is a lot like 3D movies... it get reinvented every 20 years and flops every time.

      When I went to the very last World of Commodore in Toronto, circa 1993, VR was everywhere, it was the hottest subject going on in the Amiga community. I still have some flyers somewhere...

      At the time I tought that we would have VR headsets in our homes in a matter of 2 or 3 years, and yet 22 years after we still don't have any practical VR.

      Sadly, I don't think we'll have Holodecks or Better than Life headbands in my lifetime

  • Tested a demo Oculus (Score:3, Interesting)

    by iotaborg ( 167569 ) <exa@[ ]thome.net ['sof' in gap]> on Friday October 02, 2015 @11:45AM (#50645679) Homepage

    At work they had an Oculus VR demo this past week and I got the chance to test one (I don't know the full specs of that particular unit). My experience and comments from the 5 min demo:

    - Very first thing I noticed when I wore the headset was that the resolution seemed low, and the screen wasn't that bright.
    - I had no control over the motion of the demo; as a result during panning, I could feel a twinge of motion sickness. Don't know what the framerate/latency was.
    - It is a bit disconcerting to look at your virtual self, and while you move your real legs/arms, you don't see your virtual legs/arm move.
    - The overall experience is very interesting and I think VR could be quite an enjoyable entertainment medium, but it definitely needs some work.

    • I've got my DK2 working with a kinect.

      It's not _that_ much better when your virtual self does move.

      Biggest problem I've got is Unity won't let me disable motion tracking with the build in VR support. So the viewpoint won't stay at the eyes.

  • I've tried the Occulus Rift DK1, DK2, and Crystal Cove. I've also tried the Samsung GearVR. Here's my experience. DK2/Crystal/GearVR fixed the latency/movement issues. The problem is the resolution is too low. Now the Gear VR was the highest resolution headset. It is 2560x1440 so the resolution is 1280x1440 per eye. A 4K screen is 3840x2160 so 1920x2160 per eye. This resolution will be quite good, I don't think it will give you full presence however. But it will look a lot better than a 1990s DOS game. I su
  • consumer Rift headset, launching in Q1 2016

    i just don't think this will happen

Pascal is not a high-level language. -- Steven Feiner

Working...