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Businesses United States

QR Codes Replace Service Staff as Pandemic Spurs Automation in US (ft.com) 132

American workers in manufacturing plants and distribution centres have long worried that their employers would find ways to replace them with robots and artificial intelligence, but the Covid-19 crisis has brought that threat to service workers, too. Businesses are increasingly turning to automated tools for customer service tasks long done by low-wage staff. But rather than robots, it is the ubiquitous QR matrix bar codes that are replacing humans [Editor's note: the link may be paywalled]. Financial Times: Many restaurants have begun to experiment with QR codes and order management systems such as Toast that allow diners to order food to their table from their phones instead of with human servers. Grocery stores have increased their investments in self-checkout kiosks that replace human cashiers, and more convenience stores including Circle K are experimenting with the computer vision technology pioneered by Amazon Go to allow customers to make purchases without standing in a checkout line at all. The shifts mean that some of the 1.7m leisure and hospitality jobs and 270,000 retail jobs the US economy has lost since its February 2020 high are unlikely to return.
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QR Codes Replace Service Staff as Pandemic Spurs Automation in US

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  • by ghoul ( 157158 ) on Wednesday September 01, 2021 @03:27PM (#61753287)
    or a lowly software automation coder. All depends on your perspective.
    • by MobileTatsu-NJG ( 946591 ) on Wednesday September 01, 2021 @03:33PM (#61753313)

      The whole point of our system of Capitalism is to drive the cost of producing goods as close to zero as possible. Job obsolescence is built-in. I don't think we've planned enough for what the eventual endgame of that philosophy is.

      • With the birth rate plummeting, perhaps it's just in time
        • by bjwest ( 14070 )

          With the birth rate plummeting, perhaps it's just in time

          The birthrate in the U.S. may be plummeting, but the unskilled immigration rate is increasing tremendously. Immigrants will need someplace to work, otherwise our unemployed rate will skyrocket and our social services network will collapse.

          • Renaissance periods can fill this. Note the use of the word "can", it's not a guarantee that a culture has a renaissance and I think one example we can look at is China. Maybe some brilliant western historian who knows Chinese history better than me will correct me but for a few years now, I certainly haven't found any real evidence of this.

            If you look up "renaissance" period, you will notice how they mention "economic rebirth". As inventions reduce labor, society can focus more on aspects like art, archite

      • I had been wondering when we were going to start hearing stories about how the COVID pandemic has driven automation. I know in the last 18-20 months trying to contact any form of support has resulted in a LOT more automation hell than what I remember in the past. Even smaller companies are going for it. Hell, MY company is starting to look at it for internal helpdesk requests. Which is dumb beyond belief as 99% of our helpdesk requests are "Backend isn't sending print jobs" or "Printer got pushed off th

        • by Ziest ( 143204 )

          I had been wondering when we were going to start hearing stories about how the COVID pandemic has driven automation.

          It is already happening. Before COVID we here in the San Francisco Bay Area had toll takers on our bridges. There were some fast-trac lanes but most lanes had a toll taker. Today all of our bridges are fast-trac and the toll authority is planning on removing all the toll booths within the next year.

      • by JBMcB ( 73720 ) on Wednesday September 01, 2021 @04:00PM (#61753465)

        The whole point of our system of Capitalism is to drive the cost of producing goods as close to zero as possible.

        The point of Capitalism is to find the price of goods and services, and to move resources through the economy in an efficient manner.

        If you can drive the cost of production down, that can help you sell more, but not always. MD 20-20 manages to make a bottle of wine for $4, that doesn't make it popular. Likewise, McDonald's is loosing market share to Five Guys, which sells more expensive burgers.

      • That isn't the "whole point" of Capitalism.

        It happens to be one way that companies try to compete with one another in pursuit of profit, which if there is a "whole point" to the thing it is that. There are plenty of examples of products where cost is added in order to meet demands of the market.
        • To some people, the entire point of any economic system is the worker and nothing more complicated than that.

          Keeping simply allows one to act cynical while offering no alternatives. For example, is MobileTatsu-NJG arguing that we should not look for efficiency or that we should stop looking for efficiency once it affects the labor market? In which case, I sincerely hope he is still mailing instead of emailing wherever possible.

          • For example, is MobileTatsu-NJG arguing that we should not look for efficiency or that we should stop looking for efficiency once it affects the labor market?

            No. What I said in my post was that we are overlooking a serious flaw in the concept and need to explore it. I could share with you how I think it should be done (for example I don't think sabotaging automation is practical...) but I do not represent enough people or have an innovative enough idea to propose something for productive debate. Example: What would work for the United States won't likely work for Mexico. That's the low-hanging fruit someone with a frivolous reason to argue with me would

            • we are overlooking a serious flaw in the concept

              The automation "concept" has been happening since the invention of the steam engine 300 years ago. Since then, our living standards have improved twenty-fold. That isn't a "flaw".

              Every pointless dead-end job that can be replaced with a QR code means one more worker available for a job that actually produces something that adds to our collective prosperity.

              • Assuming relative velocities don't change, sure. Suppose self-driving semis displace hundreds of thousands of truck drivers faster than they can be trained in a new field? If we're gonna act like wages for unskilled labor are only appropriate for teenagers living with their dual-income parents you've got a heck of an itchy issue brewing in a hypothetical like that.

                What actually happens between "automation!" and "shit's better!" may not be a stable metric, glossing over it is unwise.

                • Suppose self-driving semis displace hundreds of thousands of truck drivers faster than they can be trained in a new field?

                  The same was said about the hundreds of thousands of switchboard operators, bank tellers, and hay stackers.

                  The automation of the trucking industry will take a decade or more. There are 500,000 long-haul truckers. Our economy created 850,000 net new jobs in June.

                  The belief that pointless unproductive jobs are "good for the economy" is known as the Broken Window Fallacy [wikipedia.org].

                  Every dollar that we don't spend on a pointless job that can be done by a robot or QR sticker, is a dollar that can be spent to create new

                  • The automation of the trucking industry will take a decade or more. There are 500,000 long-haul truckers. Our economy created 850,000 net new jobs in June.

                    I specifically asked what happens if your assumption of the time it takes is horribly wrong. That's exactly what I was griping about being overlooked. Heh.

                    EVERYTHING is improving, including how fast a technology can be adopted.

                    • I specifically asked what happens if your assumption of the time it takes is horribly wrong.

                      So instead of a decade, let's say that we magically create 500,000 self-driving trucks in three weeks.

                      Can our economy absorb that many ex-drivers? The BLS jobs report from June says we can.

                      However, if all the trucks are all produced in one week, we'll have a problem.

                      Now, let's go back to reality: Even a decade is very optimistic (or pessimistic from your viewpoint).

                    • However, if all the trucks are all produced in one week, we'll have a problem.

                      Now, let's go back to reality: Even a decade is very optimistic (or pessimistic from your viewpoint).

                      And what exactly is the mechanism keeping your misleadingly-silly extreme in check?

      • The government forcing labor wage costs up definitely pushes this faster.

        • The government forcing labor wage costs up definitely pushes this faster.

          Government-mandated minimum wages are lower than the prevailing market wages almost everywhere.

      • The whole point of our system of Capitalism is to drive the cost of producing goods as close to zero as possible.

        You are correct only if you accept the common-but-flawed definition of "cost". If you adopt a realistic definition of the word, then in addition to expenses defined by our voodoo economics you must also add externalities such as environmental damage, global warming, depletion of limited natural resources, etc. In that case, the cost of goods is often increasing; but we're keeping prices artificially (very) low by stealing from future generations, who will be stuck with the REAL cost of the mess we've made i

      • by w3woody ( 44457 )

        Job obsolescence is built-in.

        Except we're saved, in a sense, by having infinite wants and an ability to invent new things no-one thought of before.

        I mean, if we were to live using the goods and services that existed a hundred years ago, the vast majority of people would be unemployed as we only need 2% of the population (rather than the vast majority) to produce the food we need to survive.

  • Humans or gtfo (Score:5, Insightful)

    by psergiu ( 67614 ) on Wednesday September 01, 2021 @03:31PM (#61753303)

    The Walmart in my city closed down all cashier booths and switched to self-checkout.
    I voted with my wallet and I now pay a little bit more for my groceries at other stores that have actual cashiers.

    • by psergiu ( 67614 )

      Also - what would be the recommended tip to leave to a QR-Code in a restaurant ?

    • I prefer self-checkout.

    • by quall ( 1441799 )

      Thanks for reducing the self-checkout line length by staying out of Walmart. Nothing beats self-checkout. Generally quicker and you don't have to deal with anyone in most cases.

      • You know what ticks me off at Walmart is sometimes they close down self-checkout aisles until there are only enough open that there is still a line.
        • That annoys me as well. And you still see 3 walmart employees laughing yet ducking away the moment you try to make eye contact.

          The only thing more guaranteed is that the cop that they are paying for security is hitting on an underage or married greeter. I am assuming those are the cops not allowed to police the local high schools anymore.

    • Well they still have to pay someone to keep the sneeze-screens clean.

    • by PPH ( 736903 )

      You are missing out on quite an opportunity [youtube.com].

    • I wouldn’t mind self checkouts if they offered a discount. The company is saving money and they certainly aren’t passing those savings on to me.

      • The time saving for me is worth it.

        The company is risking more items not being scanned and paid for so I'm ok not getting a discount.

        That said, in Texas, I love going to HEB (which is a big local chain) where they not only still use cashiers, they still have baggers.

      • I wouldn’t mind self checkouts if they offered a discount. The company is saving money and they certainly aren’t passing those savings on to me.

        This, exactly. I often find it much slower to do self-checkout - especially at Home Despot - and if I'm both taking more time and helping to eliminate someone's job I should at least get a discount.

        That reminds me of a line my wife came up with that I've used a couple of times:

        Employee: "Would you like to go to a self-checkout station"?
        Me: "No, I can't do that".
        Employee: "Why not"?
        Me: "Because I don't work here"!

        And that's really what it comes down to - I don't get paid by the fuckers, so why should I do

      • by tlhIngan ( 30335 )

        I wouldnâ(TM)t mind self checkouts if they offered a discount. The company is saving money and they certainly arenâ(TM)t passing those savings on to me.

        Unfortunately, they aren't saving any money - sure they're saving money in not having a human working, but they're spending those savings in increased amounts of shoplifting.

        It often takes place of someone scanning a cheaper item to pay for a more expensive item. in the UK, a bobby (police officer) was caught scanning a UKP10 box of doughnuts as a

    • I haven't ever shopped at Walmart on a regular basis. The only time I have in decades has been middle of the night and the 24 hour one is the only place open that would have what I want in an emergency. If it's not an emergency, I can wait to go to a store that doesn't make me feel like I need a shower the second I walk in the door.

    • What's the point of forcing people to sit at a cash register? Why not just tax the QR code reader and use that revenue to pay the salary of the person who would have been sitting there? We could pay them to watch "review" Netflix shows instead of slowing things down at Walmart.

      • I got one better! We fire that poor meat-bag, tax the QR code and then waste it on some random train to no where. That's what ends up really happening.

    • good move. Your safer going to a place with humans at the registers.

      I used to install/service POS systems. One of the things I noticed is that when you have someone who works with a terminal everyday, like a cashier or other service staff, the experienced users would catch those occasional "that doesn't look right" situations a lot faster than the general populace would.

      Most of the times it would be the simple soon to be out of paper in the receipt printer or miss-entered SKU that would be corrected befor

  • I think waiting staff are safe for the moment.

    (Also -- most restaurants have godawful shitty web apps linked to those QR codes.)

    • by ranton ( 36917 ) on Wednesday September 01, 2021 @04:06PM (#61753493)

      I think waiting staff are safe for the moment.

      Like almost all automation concerns, the issue isn't whether these apps will completely replace all waiting staff jobs. The concern is whether a restaurant which previously needed 10 waiters for a Friday night can get away with 5 waiters after these apps are in place.

      Then again, I generally prefer restaurants with no wait staff (other than people to bus tables after you leave), so this is a welcomed change for me. Filling my own drink is almost always better than waiting for someone to come around.

      • Depends on the age and tech savvy of their clientele. They might need 12 if the app ordering is required - they'll spend more time on tech support than they would have spent on manually taking orders.

        Fewer wait staff actually means better tips / better wages for those that remain. I'd be happy to see tipping culture entirely replaced by living wages, though.

    • I think waiting staff are safe for the moment.

      Some will be safe (although delivery robots might take care of that). You'll also need to be able to quiz someone on whether the vegan risotto has free range rice in it. But you can get away with half to a third of the current staff if all you need is someone to shuttle plates.

      Oh, and who's going to interrupt us to ask "how are we enjoying our meals?". My wife and I are enjoying them quite a bit. I sure as hell hope you're not sneaking snacks while we're not looking.

      For me, the big win is the "pay at the ta

    • by ghoul ( 157158 )
      Hospitals already have self driving carts that deliver meds. Heck they can even handle elevators. Restaurants could get that to deliver the food. If you miss the chit chat add an iPad and have someone in India chit chat with you on the iPad screen for 1 dollar an hour. And no need to tip !!!!
  • Good (Score:5, Insightful)

    by davide marney ( 231845 ) on Wednesday September 01, 2021 @03:33PM (#61753317) Journal

    Any job that can be so easily displaced is not a job that required the attention of an independent, human agent in the first place. That person's time could have been much more profitably employed.

    But there's the rub. If the business is smart, it will use its freed-up human capital to grow and expand its services and products. If not, it will just let them go and take the one-time savings.

    You can save money or make money, both increase wealth. But only one of them grows.

    • If the business is smart, it will use its freed-up human capital to grow and expand its services and products.

      The people being replaced are cashiers and servers in restaurants.

      It should be possible to completely eliminate servers in a restaurant by adding robots to deliver the food to the table. Once that happens, one goes from needing 10 servers, to needing 5, to needing, 1 or even 0 servers and a few table bussers. Restaurants don't need servers to expand their products and they won't be adding more services.

      Cashiers are currently being replaced by self-checkout. Just look at the comments in this thread. A r

      • by thomn8r ( 635504 )

        It should be possible to completely eliminate servers in a restaurant by adding robots to deliver the food to the table.>

        X-Files did it: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]

      • Those freed-up cashiers and servers can now be used to provide add-on services to customers. Just off the top of my head:

        - Personal shopper
        - Infuencer/targeted marketer
        - Delivery
        - Home health services
        etc.

    • That person's time could have been much more profitably employed.

      While I agree and I actively like restaurants which dispel with the customer service BS, the sad reality is in America staff are almost wholly dependent on tips that relate this BS. I don't have any qualms with it in Europe as the people more actively employed not giving others fake smiles and over attending them at least are paid a proper wage.

      In America the concept of tips being your wage needs to be torn up first before QR codes could be considered a benefit to society because the very people doing somet

    • You are REALLY over-estimating the abilities of some of these retail staff. Trust me, if I wasn't on a really old contract with a really awesome work schedule that I write myself every week and a slew of benefits not found outside of government, well, I would be finding work else where.

      I work with a lot of unmotivated, lazy people. I'd say about 20% of the employees get 80% of the work done. I'm fairly insulated away from it and I'm not management, so these people aren't my problem.

      Many of these people real

  • by crow ( 16139 )

    History teaches that every time a new technology arises that displaces workers, the end result is more jobs, not fewer. However, what we're seeing now is change coming much more rapidly than at any time in the past, so even if that remains true (which it likely will), the adjustment will be much more chaotic and traumatic for the employees.

    • History also teaches us that every time a new technology comes along that displaces workers, there are years if not decades of turmoil as a result. Me personally? I think we have enough turmoil right now for anyone that isn't rich enough to own their own island. I don't believe we need any more of it. But it's coming whether we like it or not. So, who knew the apocalypse would take so long and be so boring along the way?

    • by thomn8r ( 635504 )

      History teaches that every time a new technology arises that displaces workers

      What this theory leaves out is the occasional war or pandemic that conveniently removes a few million excess workers.

  • Why do we think multiple 8.5X11 inch pieces of paper will be just as readable on a 5 inch phone screen? It's fine for reading a story, or a short message, but a menu needs to display all of the options at a glance.
  • Terrible annoyance (Score:5, Insightful)

    by enigma32 ( 128601 ) on Wednesday September 01, 2021 @03:45PM (#61753379)

    I've eaten in some places that force all ordering through the QR codes on the table. Like I couldn't even walk inside the place and order a second drink at the bar partway through my meal. (Inside seating was open and there was a bartender standing there at the bar.)

    Also it's offensive that they want me to tip (while placing the order through a website or app) before service has been rendered.

    I'm all for progress, but forcing everything in this direction is a bit ridiculous.

    • If forced to do it up front, just give a tip of $0.
    • What service are they providing that requires a tip?
      • by thomn8r ( 635504 )

        What service are they providing that requires a tip?

        None - they're simply cashing in on tradition.

    • by garett_spencley ( 193892 ) on Wednesday September 01, 2021 @04:16PM (#61753539) Journal

      I don't like being tethered to my phone and I'm pretty disturbed by the number of things that I hear about moving to phone apps (student IDs, driver's licenses etc.)

      If I could not own a cell phone at all, I would. I have one so that I can be in contact with my wife and children in case of emergency. On the rare occasion that I'm travelling in unfamiliar territory I will turn location on and open maps. Or if I'm at a brick + mortar store and considering a major purchase sometimes I'll open a browser and look up product reviews. That's the extent to which I use the thing.

      It's always in DND model. It is common for people to text or call me and to have to wait a day or two to get a response when I finally remember that the thing exists.

      If a restaurant wants me to use a device to place an order, I prefer that they provide said device. There is an all-you-can-eat sushi restaraunt in my home town that brings tablets on the table for this purpose. I have no problem with that, in fact it has features that a paper menu doesn't which are pretty nice. Just don't expect me to use my own device, which I probably left at home anyway.

    • Also it's offensive that they want me to tip (while placing the order through a website or app) before service has been rendered.

      As I've said elsewhere and as you've just alluded to, this concept won't work in America. You find the tip offensive. They rely on it due to this absurdity that restaurants don't pay employees a decent wage over there.

      That said I can't agree with your ordering a second drink problem. That sounds like a shitty implementation. The places I've eaten with QR codes check out at the end, so you can keep ordering however much you like and the drink appears as if by magic.

      • One good outcome of the pandemic is that I've seen a number of [normal, non-QR-code-nonsense] places combine a service charge into the normal bill---and they advise against tipping separately. It would be nice to see the whole country move in that direction, but I can't see that happening anytime soon.

        Your "pay at the end" experience sounds much better than anything I've seen here.

  • by Oligonicella ( 659917 ) on Wednesday September 01, 2021 @03:49PM (#61753403)
    I think any restaurant that does this (especially combined with food Rumbas) is sorely underestimating how much people like interacting. I don't go to my fav cafe for the food so much as the ambiance. I know the owners and staff and have been friends with the waitresses for years (one since she was 16). If I went in one day and sound them replaced by a keyboard, I wouldn't even order a meal and I'd never return.

    "Hey, we have that special today you like so much." will never be something you'll hear from an automated system without it sounding more like stalking than friendliness.
    • I think any restaurant that does this (especially combined with food Rumbas) is sorely underestimating how much people like interacting. I don't go to my fav cafe for the food so much as the ambiance. I know the owners and staff and have been friends with the waitresses for years (one since she was 16).

      These kinds of restaurants are great but rare.

      • They didn't used to be. Hell, even the big chains were that way back in the eighties. My dad took clients to pizza hut so often that the entire wait staff, half the people that worked in the kitchen and the managers all knew him by name. Going there with him was like walking into Cheers with Norm.

        In the town I'm in now it's down to a couple bars that serve good food and one local place that's just a family owned single restaurant. Everything else is impersonal as all hell.

      • by tsqr ( 808554 )

        They're actually not all that rare at all. But people who seek them out are definitely becoming more scarce. This thead is littered with comments from people who actively avoid human interaction. Someone who prefers to refill their own drink because its faster probably isn't accustomed to conversing with a dining companion while receiving friendly and efficient service from skilled wait staff.

    • by King_TJ ( 85913 )

      I predicted it was headed this way a while ago, but had no idea we'd see the acceleration towards it we reached over the last year.

      I also predict it will swing back the opposite direction, after it reaches a saturation point, for the reasons you stated. Efficiency and a work-around for a tight labor pool is all well and good, but after it becomes the new normal, people will value the nostalgia of the "good old days" when humans served your meal. Might turn into a "value add" situation where people gladly pa

    • I think any restaurant that does this (especially combined with food Rumbas) is sorely underestimating how much people like interacting.

      No thank you. I don't want to interact with staff unless I'm eating at a restaurant by myself and then I'm normally reading a book. I normally take people with me to restaurants who are much more fun with to interact than someone putting on a fake smile in exchange for tips.

      But you're not talking about a restaurant as much as you're talking about a village pub. There's a whole one restaurant I consider to be anything remotely the way you describe, and I eat out ... way too much.

  • Trusting a business' QR code is just as reckless as clicking a URL link in an email from an untrusted source.

    • What happens when a QR code gets hacked?

      What? It's a string of text. If by hacked you mean someone physically changes them, then sure. If instead you mean they used a questionable data-mining QR code generator that has a redirect, then that's a problem but is not a QR code "being hacked."

  • by rsilvergun ( 571051 ) on Wednesday September 01, 2021 @04:29PM (#61753583)
    Applebee's had automated ordering kiosks 5 years ago. The tech is getting cheaper and cheaper that's all that's happening here. As it gets cheaper they can put effort into making it more reliable without cutting into profit margins. That in turn makes it practical to deploy.

    I'm really sick of all these articles telling us that if we don't suck down low wages and long work hours and a crappy quality of life that the job creators are going to just take their ball and go home and leave us to starve to death.

    The YouTube channel Some More News had a hilarious and disturbing skit they did the modern job interview that ended with the interviewer asking the interviewee if they wanted to live, making the point that without a job they wouldn't be able to afford food shelter and healthcare and would eventually die. It ended with the interviewee begging for her life. She got the job, but at the end said something that displeased the interviewer and lost it. The acting was surprisingly good and you got a good sense for when she realized she was going to die.

    What I don't know is why we choose to live like this, and why we choose to pretend we're not living like this. In any case automation's coming no matter what. And no matter how high your skilled it's going to affect you because the people being automated aren't just going to put a bullet to their head. They're going to struggle and some of them will succeed and compete for the job you have now driving down your wages. No man is an island.
    • "No man is an island"

      There is the problem. The people who own and operate our economy (and politics) do not believe this. It doesn't affect them personally.


      "I'm really sick of all these articles telling us that if we don't suck down low wages and long work hours and a crappy quality of life that the job creators are going to just take their ball and go home and leave us to starve to death. "

      Me too. Personally, I hope they actually *do* take their ball and go somewhere else. We don't want those kinds of

    • by King_TJ ( 85913 )

      Well, first of all? Yes, it has a lot to do with COVID, because those ordering kiosks were at a number of restaurants for years - but they didn't cause job losses. They were more of a tool chains experimented with to see if it would improve order accuracy and make customers happier if they didn't have to flag down a busy waiter/waitress just to pay the tab to get up and leave.

      The sudden change in the last year has a LOT to do with people feeling afraid to come in to jobs where they interact directly with hu

      • Go look up the percentage of Americans working in the gig economy. It's at 34%. Those aren't real jobs. It's piece work you take out of desperation. And it's now over a third of our economy. You haven't noticed because the press doesn't talk about it and it hasn't affected you personally. But real unemployment is it crazy high levels and it's being masked by a rather nasty scheme of fake unemployment.
  • Many restaurants have begun to experiment with QR codes and order management systems such as Toast that allow diners to order food to their table from their phones instead of with human servers.

    I find it insane that this tech is just now hitting some stores. When I was in Japan 9-10 years ago, there were a number of sit down restaurants you could go to and place orders off a screen/tablet at the table. It's not that much different from how the tech was in most places in the US, you just cut the middle man out. When you put in an order at McDs or Chili's, the waiter just goes and puts it in the register and then it pops up on screens near the cooks. This pretty much screams "My job is mostly useles

  • ...that QR codes don't demand $15/hour 'living wage' to do brainless, replaceable jobs.

    Just sayin'.

As far as the laws of mathematics refer to reality, they are not certain, and as far as they are certain, they do not refer to reality. -- Albert Einstein

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