Posted
by
Hemos
from the upgrade-upgrade-jiggity-jig dept.
ethaz writes "Tivo has announced dual tuner support in version 2.5 of it's software for DirecTV-capable Tivos (DTivos). So much for Ultimate TV's advantage." Too bad it's only DIRECTV TiVos - with the larger hard drive, better output, my TiVo pales in comparasion.
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Actually, the hard drive is the same size. The increased space is due to the fact that it takes the actual mpeg2 stream straight from directv, so it's a lot more efficient than the SA tivos, since it doesn't have to be reencoded. the increased quality is due to this as well, since DTV uses hugely sophisticated encoders to get the best mix of quality and size, the tivo doesn't have to use it's $5 encoding chip to do the work.
If this is the case, what would it take to let those of us with separate boxes send the optimized mpeg2 stream out from a DirecTV receiver to a TiVo recorder? I guess we gotta get the HackHU guys talking to the TiVo underground...
Are you sure? I was under the impression that it had a 60GB hard drive in it...(I actually haven't cracked open my DirecTivo due to the warranty)
Also, I've never seen an MPEG2 data stream that took 1/2 the space of an MPEG1 data stream of the same quality.....
30GB Tivo = 9 hours of HQ recording time 30 Hours at a quality slightly better than a slide-show...
DirectTivo = 35 hours of HQ recording time (no choice as to recording time)
It HAS to have a larger HD in it... MPEG2 CAN'T be 4x more efficient than MPEG1.
It HAS to have a larger HD in it... MPEG2 CAN'T be 4x more efficient than MPEG1
Actually it can because the MPEG2 stream from dish networks has several advantages. First the input signal is much cleaner than the signal you get after transaling the pictures into NTSC, bouncing them through the ionosphere and demodulating them with a cheap circuit. Second the compression hardware they are using is very much more powerful. Third they are using a better algorithm
What that amounts to is much higher compression for at least the same end quality.
I Just wonder when I can get me DishNetwork version of the same.
It HAS to have a larger HD in it... MPEG2 CAN'T be 4x more efficient than MPEG1
-----
Actually it can. I'm pretty sure the DirectTivo's take advantage of Variable Bitrate Recording on the MPEG stream. Basically the signal coming from the dish is compressed based on how much action is going on in the scene.
A fight scene has more information in it so the compression is low. A scene with just two actors talking(and not moving much) doesn't have much information changing in it so it gets compressed heavily.
by Anonymous Coward writes:
on Thursday August 30, 2001 @09:11PM (#2237572)
On August 28, TiVo closed a $51.75 million private placement with financial and strategic investors.
The private placement was done using what is commonly referred to as "death spiral notes," aka "toxic notes." These are convertible notes (bonds), but unlike typical converts, their conversion rate is based on a fixed dollar amount, not a fixed share rate. The lower the stock price goes, the more shares the bonds can be converted for, which equals more dillution for current shareholders, which equals a lower stock price. Rinse, repeat.
Excite@home issued these notes just weeks prior to its demise. These notes encourage the holder to dump the stock price of the company (via shorting the stock.) The lower the stock price goes, the more shares the toxic note holder gets. Unlike @home, TiVo has a "floor" (maximum conversion rate), but these are not standard convertible bonds by any stretch.
I wish TiVo the best of luck (I own one), but the future isn't so bright they have to wear shades...
According to Reuters [yahoo.com], India plans to subsidize television sets so couples can sit back and watch television instead of having sex and contributing to India's burgeoning population.
That's the kind of news I'd expect to hear from adequacy.org [adequacy.org], but it's gotten me thinking: if mere television can be successful, then how much better would India's public funds be spent on TiVo instead? Television can be watched at length, but there's a limit to the amount of interactivity. With TiVo, couples would not only be watching more television than they'd previously wanted to (because of the convenience TiVo offers in recording shows otherwise missed); they'd spend additional numbers of hours every year fiddling with options and programming their device.
If there are any Indians in the audience, I encourage you to write your representative in parliament and encourage him or her to consider TiVo instead of television. Thousands of geeks use it, and they're having less sex than perhaps any other segment of our population. The choice is clear.
I'm not certain of the laws and regulations, but this may well cause more problems if they'res porn available.
"Look hon, we got a TV from the government"
"Oooh, they're playing porn, let's sit back and watch"
"I'm horny, let's fuck like bunnys while we watch porn!"
this is india. Last i checked, they can't even show people kissing in movies. (there is a lot of fruit kissing, i.e. the guy will kiss an apple, then the girl will kiss the apple --wow, erotic.)
mainstream movies show kissing, but you can get indian porn.
My indian friends have found it on the net and it looks pretty good to me.
must be something about indian chicks...
I have yet to do that, but apparently it's all good.
The best one would have to be watching yourself fucking, either in a mirror or on a tape.
I wonder if can talk my girlfriend into this?
Sony glass tron...
DV Cam outputting to glass tron...
girl friend giving you head...
You wear the glas trons while recieving, and the act is being outputed to the glass trons... Imagine it if you can. We gave up, it made our heads hurt.
My Indian friends are geeks, however new zealand has no population problems.
We even want those afghan boat people.
Fuck TV, sex is better and it lasts longer than the average movie.
Something I really wish TiVo would release is a unit with a built-in Ethernet interface. Granted, I have TiVoNET, and it rocks, but for those not-so-ardent TiVo fans (and not as technically inclined) a factory installed eth0 would be terrific.
That provides a perfect segue into my next request: an easily configurable web-based interface. I've installed the Tcl-based TiVoWEB package, and I have to say that aside from Slashdot, it is my favorite destination on the web now. Something similar that comes pre-installed would be an instant hit for home users.
I'm pretty darn proud to own a TiVo, and it's great to see a good company who makes a great product do so well.
Don't be so quick to be proud! There's word that the DirecTV folks have pressured TiVo to include "protection" against hacking the DirecTiVo units in the new 2.5 upgrade. Details are still unclear, but according to http://www.avsforum.com/ubbtivo/Forum6/HTML/006643.html [avsforum.com] it seems that:
the new kernel keeps a cached copy of all files on the root partition and performs a checksum on power up. If any actual files in root don't checksum out correctly they are replaced (prior to boot) with the copies (stored in compressed form) in the kernel image.
This appears to be end of hacking on DirecTivo boxes.
Effectively, this locks out any changes such as getting a bash prompt via serial port or telnet via TivoNET from working with DirecTiVo 2.5! Too bad. It was rather refreshing to see a company as successful as TiVo letting hackers extend their systems unabated... until now...
That is until the BIOS is hacked as well. Alternatly; the compressed kernel image on HD could be replaced with a modified one. Give it time it will happen
The modifications that they made to the kernel and GPL tools are right here [tivo.com] in source form.
On the other hand, the application that does the recording, scheduling and rendering has been written by them from scratch, and as such they decided to keep it closed source. It's their right.
Must we wait until a competitor comes out with dual-tuner for our boxes to get the dual-tuner upgrade as well? My understanding is that the hardware is there, it's just not activated. grrr...
Maybe ReplayTV will burst back on the scene and increase their feature-set. It's pretty lame that TiVo only upgrades when they *have* to.
The standalone TiVo, as opposed to the DirectTiVo, doesn't have dual tuners. The DirectTiVo has dual tuners, but lacks MPEG compression chips, so you can't record from any source other than DirectTV.
The DirectTiVo has dual tuners, but lacks MPEG compression chips, so you can't record from any source other than DirectTV.
That's exactly why I bought a stand-alone Tivo, instead of the DirecTivo recorder - because the DirecTivo unit wouldn't record anything but satellite feeds - no local channels for lots of people (most?) that only have a satellite dish, but no cable.
Since a lot of what I like to record are on the major networks, during Prime Time (usually when I'm working too late coding), I definitely need the Tivo to be able to record the OTA broadcast channels.
The dual tuner feature is a great idea, but why can't these units include a UHF/VHF tuner, or whatever would be required to receive antenna feeds?
That said, after having a Tivo for a year now, my wife and I can't imagine not being able to *pause* (phone call), *replay/rewind* (how'd he catch that!), or simply watch programs whenever we want.
I'm just waiting for a 8 second back-skip button for my car radio.. "What'd he say there?"
Audio doesn't take up nearly as much memory as video - seems like it would be easy enough to fit a car stereo with a 20 or 30 second memory stick or something.
Your understanding is flawed. The SA units only have a single tuner and a single MPEG encoder chip. The DirecTiVo units have two tuners and no encoder chip (since they record the digital bit stream direct from the satellite).
It would be nice to have two tuners in the SA box, but there are a LOT of technical issues that would have to be worked out. It wouldn't be too difficult for straight CATV RF input, but for people with external tuners (cable boxes, satellite receivers of all types), TiVo would have to provide twice as many inputs on the back of the box (and there isn't much space for that). The setup interface would be significantly more complex (is the cable box hooked up to tuner input 2? what about the IR blaster?) for arguably little gain. Some "power users" may want dual tuners, but most of the power users already have TiVo. The target market for TiVo now is the grandmas that sit their and watch their VCR blink "12:00" all the time. How many of those are going to care about (or understand) dual tuners?
How many of those are going to care about (or understand) dual tuners?
That's what is so great about Tivo. It is far easier to program (no blinking 12:00), and operate than a VCR. People are not going to NEED to care about (or understand) dual tuners, unless they don't have one. If said grandma wants to record two (or more!) show that are on at the same time, on different channels, she is currently SOL.
With a dual tuner box (or even beter one that can tune X channels at once... That would really be cool) all one would have to do is pick which shows to record, and worry about storage space. Time would really cease to have any meaning (as far as TV scheduling is concerned).
Your understanding is unfortunately incorrect. The stand-alone TiVo's only have a single tuner, so this software update won't do any good (although there are a few other nice toys in the update...). Also, don't expect the 2.5 update for standalones until probably Q1 of next year.
That said, there has been considerable discussion in the TiVo forums on what it would take to make a dual-tuner stand-alone TiVo, and frankly, it doesn't seem likely to happen any time soon. You'll notice that the dual-tuner boxen are all satellite-related (either DirectTV TiVo or Microsoft's UltimateTV).
What are those technical details? I know they sell TV sets with dual tuners for Picture in Picture that only need one cable hookup. For those of us who hook the cable right into the back of the TV(no cable box) why wouldn't this be an easy thing to? (with additional hardware of coures)
What are those technical details? I know they sell TV sets with dual tuners for Picture in Picture that only need one cable hookup. For those of us who hook the cable right into the back of the TV(no cable box) why wouldn't this be an easy thing to? (with additional hardware of coures)
They wouldn't just have to have dual tuners. Straight dual-RF would be pretty easy. The problem is that they'd also have to deal with dual cable boxes, which means twice as much hardware. And the interface would become exponentially more complicated, as you try to explain which input is connected to which cable box, and try to configure two separate IR blasters running on the same frequencies, etc. etc.
Right now, TiVo is not being marketed to power users (which are the ones who would want dual-tuner capability). They're trying to sell it as a VCR replacement.
now, does this mean I can pirate TIVO service as well. I really LOVE those Canadian satelite hackers. For under 100$ I have all the DirecTV I can handle, and HU card in a reader/writer atached to a pc to do the decoding and protect my fragile card from a BURN signal. By my calculations it is traffic in the FREE airwaves and MINE for the taking:)
Um, you're wrong. DirecTV HAS lost in court in Canada, 31 times. DirecTV has NO rights to broadcast in Canada, and therefore gives away any service it sends up there (since it is tough to tell satellite to stop on specific geographic boundries). I wished I lived in Canada, because I would do it to. But in the US it is illegal and unethical, so I don't.
Sure, go ahead and pop your hacked HU card in a DirecTiVo. There are no technical problems that would prevent it from working. Keep in mind that DirecTV and TiVo are sharing all data collected from DirecTiVo boxes (unlike the SA Tivo's), so don't think you'll have your setup active for too long.
Do you think its really that smart to post something like this in a public forum? You just never know who is reading this. Hey, who knows, someone reading this may have links in DirecTV's Office of Signal Integrity (aka the DirecTV cops). *cough*.
I just got to thinking, you're not able to pirate TiVo from DirecTV. The reason: DirecTV sends TiVo your activation data, and TiVo takes care of the rest. None of the activation signals for tivo are sent through the satellite. So don't bother.
I wonder is there will come the day where Cable service will offer TiVo's as part of a package, much like cablemodems are dealt with these days. It would be a bonus, but seeing as TiVo offers the service and the Cable companies would have to pay TiVo subsidies, how likely is it that we'll see this any day soon? TiVo could in itself build a cable service branch out of itself offering the service and cornering the market. Wouldn't it be sweeet:)
I currently get Cox digital cable, and when they installed the service, the installer showed me how to get into the diagnostic screen on "boot-up" of the box. The box clearly details several bits of information on SCSI adaptors found, etc. As far as I know, there isn't any drives in the box, but the box is essentially a small computer with custom MPEG decompression hardware. It isn't x86 based, though (not sure what it is, and don't really care to try to crack the case - many times they put traps in the boxes to kill the service/box/both if you try to open them, from what I understand).
The crap thing is it will probably be wrapped in so many licenses, DMCA crap, etc - that it will suck as a real useful service...
I'ts coming I'm sure. Personally I would love that. Then I could watch a movie/event I had done Pay-per-view on when I wanted to. It would skip the 'When do you want to watch it" syndrome. I talked to someone almost 5 years ago with this same idea. Cable companies would be able to use the bandwidth more effectively that way, and offer more movie choices per month.. Can you say Multicast?
In my RL job I deal with the makers of the set-top boxes that cable companies install.
They are all building set-top boxes with PVR (personal video recorder) capability built-in. Some will roll out within six months in select areas. PVRs will be standard gear in new digital cable boxes within 18 months.
I'm not clear on the patent issues, with the interlocking mess of things between Gemstar & Tivo, but Tivo will probably start making substanital monies from the patent licensing aspect alone.
http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/20010827/en/tele vi sion-replay_1.html
"ReplayTV is planning a post-Labor Day introduction of a souped-up DVR that could store as much as 320 hours of TV programming and send programs by email to other DVRs. It may also allow users to copy photo files from a PC to the DVR."
"Survey describes in detail the new product and asks respondents how much they would be willing to pay for it. Pricing proposals in the survey range from a model with 40 hours of storage capacity that could retail for $699 to a 320-hour model that might sell for $1,999."
"According to the email survey, the product could work with a standard dial-up phone modem for a monthly fee of $4.95 or a broadband Internet connection using an Ethernet home network at no monthly charge. The broadband connection is required for sending TV programs by email."
I love my ReplayTV 3030. I might have to get a second one...assuming my job stays there when these have been out a while.
The article is a bit strangely worded. Replay hasn't announced this product, they've just sent out a survey. If they send out a survey about what features people would like last week, they're hardly gonna start selling them next week...
They might announce something then, presumably to be available at some later date, but bear in mind that "post-Labor Day" is a very long time...
but bear in mind that "post-Labor Day" is a very long time
Sure, if you consider next week a "very long time." ReplayTV will apparently be announcing whatever it is at a consumer electronics show here in Indianapolis. Their web site [replaytv.com] has a "teaser" on the front page about an important news announcement on September 5th...
This article has already gotten its own Slashdot story about 3-4 days ago (I'd post a link, but search and viewing older articles seems to be broken right now). General consensus seems to be that this is nothing more than unfounded hype built up over marketing research. ReplayTV merely wants to figure out what the demand would be for a unit of that capacity at that price. From the article I read, they haven't even cooked up a component list for a 320 hour unit, yet. My gut instinct says that they probably won't anytime soon.
Not sure what Hemos means by better output, but the larger hard drive is no problem. I hacked a second, 80 gig, drive into my Tivo and have it up to 128 hours capacity. Others have hacked in even larger capacity drives in both primary and secondary and boosted their capacity into the multiple hundreds of hours. At that level, it must start getting tough to manage all the programming, though.
I'll admit, as a TiVo owner, the thought of having a dual tuner would be really nice. A few times it is a problem, but I haven't ran into anything so serious that I would record on TiVo while watching another program on another channel on another TV. Of course, this isn't the same for all people.
For those of you who MUST have this functionality, you've got to decide if you're going to swap for a DirecTivo/UltimateTV (where possible --- major markets), or buy another standalone TiVo aka a "conflict TiVo" with limited storage.
Conflict TiVos are somewhat popular, and you only need a 15gb drive to handle the cases (typically prime time) where it happens. And TiVos are running REALLY CHEAP right now!
Nice to hear about TiVo's cash burn rate. As a *subscriber*, that is good news. If it didn't have a service element to it, and I wasn't dependent upon TiVo, personally, I'd go for a company that has a very high cash burn rate and get all the goodies I can below cost.
My current favorite is "1-800-555-TELL" (YES, an ACTUAL REAL telephone number... try it, especially the "phone booth" option). I'm calling an 800 number for free to get news/weather/games and to make a free 1 minute telephone call. I'm attracted to companies that have a high burn rate. Except, of course, ones that I am dependent upon.
Shameless plug. The Tivo Web Project [lightn.org] is designed to give you a web interface to your TiVo. And it does, the TCL branch allows you to browse, edit, create, delete entries in now showing, todo, season passes, browse the channel guide, look at suggestions, preferences (thumbs ratings), etc. It's themable, modular, runs directly on the TiVo and is pretty mature.
The last time I posted on a tivo article the TCL branch wasn't released, and I haven't seen as many downloads as I would expect so far. So have fun.:)
1. The ability to add drive storage as I see fit. 2. The ability to record and play back MP3s from any source (TV, radio, CD, etc), as well as load MP3s from a network or CD-ROM. 3. The ability to record into the system from any video medium (tape, DVD, VCD, mpegs off the net, etc). 4. Other file storage for regular data files, etc. 5. Network support using standard protocols. 6. Open spec system, to allow OS choice!
In other words, a very damn nice file server, with special hardware for sound and video recording, ala Tivo. I want this to act as a central home server (there could be other possibilities as well - x-10 control, video security, web admin, etc), that was nice and expandable, easily - like a PC.
It damn near can be done today with commodity hardware, but the video record/simultaneous playback/channel guide stuff isn't there yet - we need a fast filesystem for that stuff (the simultaneuous record/playback so you can "pause" TV). Does anyone know of such a filesystem being worked on?
I am planning on building a largish networked fileserver, but it won't be anything like I described - at best it would be able to play back MP3, maybe record to it, but it wouldn't be an all-in-one solution. Is there anything like this at all - even ultra-expensive solutions used by TV studios for quick DVR editing?
I doubt we'll ever see such a thing (short of a major hacking effort - though I bet the antcomputing guys could pull it off) - it would allow the user too much control...
It damn near can be done today with commodity hardware, but the video record/simultaneous playback/channel guide stuff isn't there yet - we need a fast filesystem for that stuff (the simultaneuous record/playback so you can "pause" TV).
Are you referring to the ATI Radeon All-in-Wonder? Sorry to deviate from the topic a bit, but anyone know how this compares to a Tivo? The review on AnandTech suggests it does what it is supposed to do pretty well. Any info would be greatly appreciated as I am about to buy one..
I see no reason why you couldn't get a stripped down OS X system embedded with iMovie and iDVD built in.
OS X 10.1 is pretty fast, it would do the job well.
What are you doing to overcome the simultaneous record/playback/pause TV issue?
While this function isn't the biggest thing needed, it is a nice function.
I can think up one way around it:
Use a dual motherboard/TV tuner/capture card setup, with independant drives, and a 100 meg dedicated network between them - one system could be doing the "taping", while the other allowed you to do the watching (via some sort of custom RAID-like solution) - you would have to have a custom switchbox on the backend for the video out, to do the video selection for the TV, plus a custom case for both systems - but it could all probably be done in some manner.
Making it small would be another issue, but I could see a such a system built be using the same motherboard for each system, with each MB having on-board 100baseT ethernet, add PCI risers for the TV cards, and stack the boards using spacers, low profile cooling fans, and a forced fan air system from front to back - probably be able to fit it in a few Us of space - be a bitch to work on/upgrade, though...
TiVo is essentially a single-purpose PC and with the Ethernet hack, and having opened a shell on the TiVo, and with the needed skillz, you could network in the rest via another PC or single-purpose box in the house and write the interfaces you want (I assume that anyone seeking the functionality you're talking about is already set with a home network).
That's the way I want to head (when more money shows up) -- wireless card in the TiVo so it can stay by the display of my choice, eventually reroute mp3s/video through the house.
Because when I finally get a house (in about 6 months, if everything goes to plan), I would like to have a central wiring closet for everything - phone, cable, ethernet, audio, video - would all go in to this closet, which would be a cool clean environment, and easily maintainable.
I guess the whole thing wouldn't have to be in one box - if I could get cheap upgradable 1U devices - one for video, one for fileserving, another for mp3s - that would work too. Drop them in a rack mount unit, route the network, and you would be set (ideally, though - everything would be on gigabit ethernet, with access terminals at each end point - need a phone, plug it in the network, need a video feed, plug the TV in there as well - use a switch/hub as needed - would be a tad expensive at today's prices, though)...
but I thought I'd share it anyways. Getting rid of the frustration of one day is worth some Karma.;)
I promise it's somewhat on-topic though!
Today a person came by to install my DirectTV dish. This 6 weeks after I had bought the dish and UltimateTV (bad, bad me!) from Circuit City. The 6 weeks is particularly important because we where very interested in the "free" installation, about which we would be contacted within 48 hours to make an appointment, so assured the salesman. Needles to say that I had to contact them after roughly 48 days...
The "free" installation cost $75,- (Ah,- chimney mount, that's $25,- extra. Ohw, dual LNB, that's $50,- for the extra line.). I think we got away pretty cheap.
The salesman told me that a phoneline was needed for the 'guide' services, and the person installing was obviously not too keen on running the 'included with free installation' 25ft of phone cable. Hence recommended a "wireless phone-line" solution. A while before (say 6 weeks), the salesman was thinking about selling it to me, but remembered (and told me!) though that that did not work with UltimateTV. The installer told me that few salesmen know how to operate a remote control let alone saying anyting remotely clever about wireless phone-lines. And thus left with the phone-line uninstalled.
!!!The on-topic part!!! Taking this a step back: The installer went on to tell me that Tivo had dual tuners and could record/watch two show at the same time. The salesman had told me that this was the exact advantage of the UltimateTV over the Tivo, but he must have been fiddling with his remote a lil too much.
Additionally it is interesting to note that I pulled the harddrive out of the UltimateTV upon arrival back home, and attached it to my removable Firewire IDE setup, connected to a Win2K machine (Oops, did I say that out loud?). Consequently, Win2K locked up to only revive after a push of the 'BIG' button. Hmmm, "Chinese wall" uh, Microsoft?!
As I sit here typing this, I am rudely interrupted by people actually watching this great new addition to personal entertainment, with the urgent message that the sound/video synchronization of the TV is fsck'd up. Great...
I'm glad I'm only programming OS's for a living. Don't want to think of what it would be like to get a real job.
they plan to upgrade the TiVo units with the dual tuners first, alla DirecTV ones. then they will upgrade the rest. they said the priority is the DirecTV systems then the normal ones.
But when are these devices (and TVs) going to come with built-in digitial tuners for all types of digital signals? That is, someone with The Dish or cable digital service can't take advantage of these devices yet, can they?
WOW! How did I ever get along without this thing? I've had it for two days, and have very rarely actually watched "live" TV.
I got the Sony 30 hour (Tweeter says the Phillips had a lot of returns). I started punching in the shows I wanted to watch (easy searching) and it started to record other shows that I might be interested in. If I don't watch those shows, they just get erased. Given the local PBS station is showing Red Dwarf and Red Green at 1AM, I can get my Red* fix the next morning, since Tivo has already recorded it for me.
My wife and I are still getting used to being able to hit "pause" to go to the bathroom, answer the phone, etc.
It seems like a lot of the functionality of a tv-recording unit that people want can be implemented by hooking a computer (with an mpeg-2 compression chip on some video capture card) up to the tuner box, and making a little infrared control that comes out of your serial port or something, and controls the tuner box. That way you can have as many tuner boxes as you like, the computer will capture it all onto a hard drive that is as big as you see fit, and you can play it all back whenever you want. So what I'm asking is this -- why isn't there a software package out there that does all of this already? Maybe it would come with a $100 tv card... It seems like there's a spot in the market for it.
no new hard drive (Score:5, Informative)
Re:no new hard drive (Score:1)
count3r
Re:no new hard drive (Score:3, Interesting)
Also, I've never seen an MPEG2 data stream that took 1/2 the space of an MPEG1 data stream of the same quality.....
30GB Tivo = 9 hours of HQ recording time 30 Hours at a quality slightly better than a slide-show...
DirectTivo = 35 hours of HQ recording time (no choice as to recording time)
It HAS to have a larger HD in it... MPEG2 CAN'T be 4x more efficient than MPEG1.
Re:no new hard drive (Score:2)
Actually it can because the MPEG2 stream from dish networks has several advantages. First the input signal is much cleaner than the signal you get after transaling the pictures into NTSC, bouncing them through the ionosphere and demodulating them with a cheap circuit. Second the compression hardware they are using is very much more powerful. Third they are using a better algorithm
What that amounts to is much higher compression for at least the same end quality.
I Just wonder when I can get me DishNetwork version of the same.
Re:no new hard drive (Score:1)
-----
Actually it can. I'm pretty sure the DirectTivo's take advantage of Variable Bitrate Recording on the MPEG stream. Basically the signal coming from the dish is compressed based on how much action is going on in the scene.
A fight scene has more information in it so the compression is low. A scene with just two actors talking(and not moving much) doesn't have much information changing in it so it gets compressed heavily.
Re:no new hard drive (Score:2)
The dual drive has a 30 gig and a 15 gig.
The single drive has a 40 gig.
Both get "about 35 hours" despite the 5 gig difference between them. I think there's some extra space reserved on the 45 gig model for other uses.
Nice "financial speak" (Score:3, Interesting)
The private placement was done using what is commonly referred to as "death spiral notes," aka "toxic notes." These are convertible notes (bonds), but unlike typical converts, their conversion rate is based on a fixed dollar amount, not a fixed share rate. The lower the stock price goes, the more shares the bonds can be converted for, which equals more dillution for current shareholders, which equals a lower stock price. Rinse, repeat.
Excite@home issued these notes just weeks prior to its demise. These notes encourage the holder to dump the stock price of the company (via shorting the stock.) The lower the stock price goes, the more shares the toxic note holder gets. Unlike @home, TiVo has a "floor" (maximum conversion rate), but these are not standard convertible bonds by any stretch.
I wish TiVo the best of luck (I own one), but the future isn't so bright they have to wear shades...
Re:Nice "financial speak" (Score:1)
TV good, TiVo better? (Score:5, Funny)
That's the kind of news I'd expect to hear from adequacy.org [adequacy.org], but it's gotten me thinking: if mere television can be successful, then how much better would India's public funds be spent on TiVo instead? Television can be watched at length, but there's a limit to the amount of interactivity. With TiVo, couples would not only be watching more television than they'd previously wanted to (because of the convenience TiVo offers in recording shows otherwise missed); they'd spend additional numbers of hours every year fiddling with options and programming their device.
If there are any Indians in the audience, I encourage you to write your representative in parliament and encourage him or her to consider TiVo instead of television. Thousands of geeks use it, and they're having less sex than perhaps any other segment of our population. The choice is clear.
Re:TV good, TiVo better? (Score:1)
"Look hon, we got a TV from the government"
"Oooh, they're playing porn, let's sit back and watch"
"I'm horny, let's fuck like bunnys while we watch porn!"
Re:TV good, TiVo better? (Score:1)
Indian Porn (Score:1)
My indian friends have found it on the net and it looks pretty good to me.
must be something about indian chicks...
Watching porn while fucking… (Score:1)
The best one would have to be watching yourself fucking, either in a mirror or on a tape.
I wonder if can talk my girlfriend into this?
Re:Watching porn while fucking… (Score:1)
Sony glass tron...
DV Cam outputting to glass tron...
girl friend giving you head...
You wear the glas trons while recieving, and the act is being outputed to the glass trons... Imagine it if you can. We gave up, it made our heads hurt.
Re:TV good, TiVo better? (Score:1)
We even want those afghan boat people.
Fuck TV, sex is better and it lasts longer than the average movie.
My TiVo Wish List: (Score:2, Insightful)
That provides a perfect segue into my next request: an easily configurable web-based interface. I've installed the Tcl-based TiVoWEB package, and I have to say that aside from Slashdot, it is my favorite destination on the web now. Something similar that comes pre-installed would be an instant hit for home users.
I'm pretty darn proud to own a TiVo, and it's great to see a good company who makes a great product do so well.
DirectTivo lockout (Score:1)
-Ray
Re:Only for now (Score:1)
Re:Where is the source??? (Score:1)
On the other hand, the application that does the recording, scheduling and rendering has been written by them from scratch, and as such they decided to keep it closed source. It's their right.
What about standalone TiVo? (Score:2)
Maybe ReplayTV will burst back on the scene and increase their feature-set. It's pretty lame that TiVo only upgrades when they *have* to.
Re:What about standalone TiVo? (Score:3, Redundant)
Re:What about standalone TiVo? (Score:1)
That's exactly why I bought a stand-alone Tivo, instead of the DirecTivo recorder - because the DirecTivo unit wouldn't record anything but satellite feeds - no local channels for lots of people (most?) that only have a satellite dish, but no cable.
Since a lot of what I like to record are on the major networks, during Prime Time (usually when I'm working too late coding), I definitely need the Tivo to be able to record the OTA broadcast channels.
The dual tuner feature is a great idea, but why can't these units include a UHF/VHF tuner, or whatever would be required to receive antenna feeds?
That said, after having a Tivo for a year now, my wife and I can't imagine not being able to *pause* (phone call), *replay/rewind* (how'd he catch that!), or simply watch programs whenever we want.
I'm just waiting for a 8 second back-skip button for my car radio.. "What'd he say there?"
Audio doesn't take up nearly as much memory as video - seems like it would be easy enough to fit a car stereo with a 20 or 30 second memory stick or something.
Re:What about standalone TiVo? (Score:3, Informative)
It would be nice to have two tuners in the SA box, but there are a LOT of technical issues that would have to be worked out. It wouldn't be too difficult for straight CATV RF input, but for people with external tuners (cable boxes, satellite receivers of all types), TiVo would have to provide twice as many inputs on the back of the box (and there isn't much space for that). The setup interface would be significantly more complex (is the cable box hooked up to tuner input 2? what about the IR blaster?) for arguably little gain. Some "power users" may want dual tuners, but most of the power users already have TiVo. The target market for TiVo now is the grandmas that sit their and watch their VCR blink "12:00" all the time. How many of those are going to care about (or understand) dual tuners?
Re:What about standalone TiVo? (Score:2)
That's what is so great about Tivo. It is far easier to program (no blinking 12:00), and operate than a VCR. People are not going to NEED to care about (or understand) dual tuners, unless they don't have one. If said grandma wants to record two (or more!) show that are on at the same time, on different channels, she is currently SOL.
With a dual tuner box (or even beter one that can tune X channels at once... That would really be cool) all one would have to do is pick which shows to record, and worry about storage space. Time would really cease to have any meaning (as far as TV scheduling is concerned).
Re:What about standalone TiVo? (Score:2)
That said, there has been considerable discussion in the TiVo forums on what it would take to make a dual-tuner stand-alone TiVo, and frankly, it doesn't seem likely to happen any time soon. You'll notice that the dual-tuner boxen are all satellite-related (either DirectTV TiVo or Microsoft's UltimateTV).
FP
Re:What about standalone TiVo? (Score:1)
Re:What about standalone TiVo? (Score:4, Insightful)
They wouldn't just have to have dual tuners. Straight dual-RF would be pretty easy. The problem is that they'd also have to deal with dual cable boxes, which means twice as much hardware. And the interface would become exponentially more complicated, as you try to explain which input is connected to which cable box, and try to configure two separate IR blasters running on the same frequencies, etc. etc.
Right now, TiVo is not being marketed to power users (which are the ones who would want dual-tuner capability). They're trying to sell it as a VCR replacement.
Re:What about standalone TiVo? (Score:2)
And what a VCR replacement it is! I NEVER fire-up my VCR anymore... except to Archive something off of the Tivo!
Re:What about standalone TiVo? (Score:1)
Re:What about standalone TiVo? (Score:2)
Nope, I beleve the only unused hardware in the stand alone TiVos is the 2nd decoder for picture-in-picture. I'm not in any real hurry to get PIP.
LOL, I've been pirating DirecTV for about 6 months (Score:1, Offtopic)
Re:LOL, I've been pirating DirecTV for about 6 mon (Score:1)
Re:LOL, I've been pirating DirecTV for about 6 mon (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:LOL, I've been pirating DirecTV for about 6 mon (Score:1)
Re:LOL, I've been pirating DirecTV for about 6 mon (Score:1)
Cable TiVo (Score:1)
Bet on it happening... (Score:2)
The crap thing is it will probably be wrapped in so many licenses, DMCA crap, etc - that it will suck as a real useful service...
Re:Cable TiVo (Score:1)
I don't need a TiVO, I've got 2 cable boxes.
And I know how to set a VCR, so why bother with one?
Downloadable Movies (Score:1)
Yes, it is happening (Score:2)
They are all building set-top boxes with PVR (personal video recorder) capability built-in. Some will roll out within six months in select areas. PVRs will be standard gear in new digital cable boxes within 18 months.
I'm not clear on the patent issues, with the interlocking mess of things between Gemstar & Tivo, but Tivo will probably start making substanital monies from the patent licensing aspect alone.
Replay (Score:3, Interesting)
http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/20010827/en/tel
"ReplayTV is planning a post-Labor Day introduction of a souped-up DVR that could store as much as 320 hours of TV programming and send programs by email to other DVRs. It may also allow users to copy photo files from a PC to the DVR."
"Survey describes in detail the new product and asks respondents how much they would be willing to pay for it. Pricing proposals in the survey range from a model with 40 hours of storage capacity that could retail for $699 to a 320-hour model that might sell for $1,999."
"According to the email survey, the product could work with a standard dial-up phone modem for a monthly fee of $4.95 or a broadband Internet connection using an Ethernet home network at no monthly charge. The broadband connection is required for sending TV programs by email."
I love my ReplayTV 3030. I might have to get a second one...assuming my job stays there when these have been out a while.
Rumor, not announcement (Score:2)
They might announce something then, presumably to be available at some later date, but bear in mind that "post-Labor Day" is a very long time...
Re:Rumor, not announcement (Score:1)
Sure, if you consider next week a "very long time." ReplayTV will apparently be announcing whatever it is at a consumer electronics show here in Indianapolis. Their web site [replaytv.com] has a "teaser" on the front page about an important news announcement on September 5th...
Re:Replay (Score:2)
Re:Replay (Score:2)
Hmm (Score:1)
Sounds like Hemos has Tivo envy.
Larger drive is no problem (Score:1)
Dual tuner? Kinda nice. (Score:4, Interesting)
For those of you who MUST have this functionality, you've got to decide if you're going to swap for a DirecTivo/UltimateTV (where possible --- major markets), or buy another standalone TiVo aka a "conflict TiVo" with limited storage.
Conflict TiVos are somewhat popular, and you only need a 15gb drive to handle the cases (typically prime time) where it happens. And TiVos are running REALLY CHEAP right now!
Nice to hear about TiVo's cash burn rate. As a *subscriber*, that is good news. If it didn't have a service element to it, and I wasn't dependent upon TiVo, personally, I'd go for a company that has a very high cash burn rate and get all the goodies I can below cost.
My current favorite is "1-800-555-TELL" (YES, an ACTUAL REAL telephone number... try it, especially the "phone booth" option). I'm calling an 800 number for free to get news/weather/games and to make a free 1 minute telephone call. I'm attracted to companies that have a high burn rate. Except, of course, ones that I am dependent upon.
Re:I've been beta testing TiVo w/ dual tuners (Score:1)
TiVo Web Project (Score:4, Informative)
The last time I posted on a tivo article the TCL branch wasn't released, and I haven't seen as many downloads as I would expect so far. So have fun. :)
What I want to see... (Score:5, Interesting)
1. The ability to add drive storage as I see fit.
2. The ability to record and play back MP3s from any source (TV, radio, CD, etc), as well as load MP3s from a network or CD-ROM.
3. The ability to record into the system from any video medium (tape, DVD, VCD, mpegs off the net, etc).
4. Other file storage for regular data files, etc.
5. Network support using standard protocols.
6. Open spec system, to allow OS choice!
In other words, a very damn nice file server, with special hardware for sound and video recording, ala Tivo. I want this to act as a central home server (there could be other possibilities as well - x-10 control, video security, web admin, etc), that was nice and expandable, easily - like a PC.
It damn near can be done today with commodity hardware, but the video record/simultaneous playback/channel guide stuff isn't there yet - we need a fast filesystem for that stuff (the simultaneuous record/playback so you can "pause" TV). Does anyone know of such a filesystem being worked on?
I am planning on building a largish networked fileserver, but it won't be anything like I described - at best it would be able to play back MP3, maybe record to it, but it wouldn't be an all-in-one solution. Is there anything like this at all - even ultra-expensive solutions used by TV studios for quick DVR editing?
I doubt we'll ever see such a thing (short of a major hacking effort - though I bet the antcomputing guys could pull it off) - it would allow the user too much control...
Re:What I want to see... (Score:1)
Are you referring to the ATI Radeon All-in-Wonder? Sorry to deviate from the topic a bit, but anyone know how this compares to a Tivo? The review on AnandTech suggests it does what it is supposed to do pretty well. Any info would be greatly appreciated as I am about to buy one..
OS X filesystem? (Score:1)
OS X 10.1 is pretty fast, it would do the job well.
Thats my Idea heheh (Score:1)
Re:Thats my Idea heheh (Score:2)
While this function isn't the biggest thing needed, it is a nice function.
I can think up one way around it:
Use a dual motherboard/TV tuner/capture card setup, with independant drives, and a 100 meg dedicated network between them - one system could be doing the "taping", while the other allowed you to do the watching (via some sort of custom RAID-like solution) - you would have to have a custom switchbox on the backend for the video out, to do the video selection for the TV, plus a custom case for both systems - but it could all probably be done in some manner.
Making it small would be another issue, but I could see a such a system built be using the same motherboard for each system, with each MB having on-board 100baseT ethernet, add PCI risers for the TV cards, and stack the boards using spacers, low profile cooling fans, and a forced fan air system from front to back - probably be able to fit it in a few Us of space - be a bitch to work on/upgrade, though...
Re:What I want to see... (Score:1)
TiVo is essentially a single-purpose PC and with the Ethernet hack, and having opened a shell on the TiVo, and with the needed skillz, you could network in the rest via another PC or single-purpose box in the house and write the interfaces you want (I assume that anyone seeking the functionality you're talking about is already set with a home network).
That's the way I want to head (when more money shows up) -- wireless card in the TiVo so it can stay by the display of my choice, eventually reroute mp3s/video through the house.
Single box? (Score:2)
I guess the whole thing wouldn't have to be in one box - if I could get cheap upgradable 1U devices - one for video, one for fileserving, another for mp3s - that would work too. Drop them in a rack mount unit, route the network, and you would be set (ideally, though - everything would be on gigabit ethernet, with access terminals at each end point - need a phone, plug it in the network, need a video feed, plug the TV in there as well - use a switch/hub as needed - would be a tad expensive at today's prices, though)...
Not much to see here (Score:1)
I promise it's somewhat on-topic though!
Today a person came by to install my DirectTV dish. This 6 weeks after I had bought the dish and UltimateTV (bad, bad me!) from Circuit City. The 6 weeks is particularly important because we where very interested in the "free" installation, about which we would be contacted within 48 hours to make an appointment, so assured the salesman. Needles to say that I had to contact them after roughly 48 days...
The "free" installation cost $75,- (Ah,- chimney mount, that's $25,- extra. Ohw, dual LNB, that's $50,- for the extra line.). I think we got away pretty cheap.
The salesman told me that a phoneline was needed for the 'guide' services, and the person installing was obviously not too keen on running the 'included with free installation' 25ft of phone cable. Hence recommended a "wireless phone-line" solution. A while before (say 6 weeks), the salesman was thinking about selling it to me, but remembered (and told me!) though that that did not work with UltimateTV. The installer told me that few salesmen know how to operate a remote control let alone saying anyting remotely clever about wireless phone-lines. And thus left with the phone-line uninstalled.
!!!The on-topic part!!! Taking this a step back: The installer went on to tell me that Tivo had dual tuners and could record/watch two show at the same time. The salesman had told me that this was the exact advantage of the UltimateTV over the Tivo, but he must have been fiddling with his remote a lil too much.
Additionally it is interesting to note that I pulled the harddrive out of the UltimateTV upon arrival back home, and attached it to my removable Firewire IDE setup, connected to a Win2K machine (Oops, did I say that out loud?). Consequently, Win2K locked up to only revive after a push of the 'BIG' button. Hmmm, "Chinese wall" uh, Microsoft?!
As I sit here typing this, I am rudely interrupted by people actually watching this great new addition to personal entertainment, with the urgent message that the sound/video synchronization of the TV is fsck'd up. Great...
I'm glad I'm only programming OS's for a living. Don't want to think of what it would be like to get a real job.
Breace.
actually... (Score:2, Informative)
Re:actually... (Score:2)
more digital tuners (Score:1)
Just got a Tivo (Score:3, Informative)
I got the Sony 30 hour (Tweeter says the Phillips had a lot of returns). I started punching in the shows I wanted to watch (easy searching) and it started to record other shows that I might be interested in. If I don't watch those shows, they just get erased. Given the local PBS station is showing Red Dwarf and Red Green at 1AM, I can get my Red* fix the next morning, since Tivo has already recorded it for me.
My wife and I are still getting used to being able to hit "pause" to go to the bathroom, answer the phone, etc.
Now watching: Son of Flubber
roll your own tivo (Score:1)
for under $79? I doubt it (Score:1)