Star Wars II Trailer Online 585
Jager writes: "You can download the new starwars trailer here. Enjoy." Seemed to me as if Lucas was worried about the "love story" emphasis in the previous teasers, and wanted to make sure people knew there would be plenty of zapping and slashing.
George Lucas/Steve Jobs Axis of Evil (Score:4, Funny)
Re:George Lucas/Steve Jobs Axis of Evil (Score:2, Informative)
Of course, this being Slashdot, you probably think it should be free (beer and speech, but mostly beer). Bleh.
On the other hand, I'm really not happy with the nagging. Oh well. *shrug*
Quicktime pro is needed for hi-res version (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Quicktime pro is needed for hi-res version (Score:5, Informative)
Divx5 version (Score:4, Informative)
http://node2.callihq.net/
Re:Divx5 version (Score:2)
Nice Divx5 Up (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Nice Divx5 Up (Score:2)
Re:Nice Divx5 Up (Score:2)
Re:Nice Divx5 Up (Score:2)
Re:Nice Divx5 Up (Score:2, Informative)
/.'ed (Score:5, Funny)
Vader: I find your lack of faith disturbing, Admiral.
*Admiral chokes under weight of a full frontal Slashdotting.*
I have to admit, Im impressed. We took down Apple.
Re:/.'ed (Score:2, Insightful)
OR you could just go to http://starwars.apple.com/ep2/clone_war/ [apple.com] and watch it work?
-Ando
Re:/.'ed (Score:2, Funny)
Summary of Posts (Score:5, Funny)
101 Posts reposting the original link
57 Posts discussing
4 Posts that rip-off yoda there be only
13 Posts that post a new link, also dead
12 Posts that declare that link dead
41 Posts declaring that the trailer sucked, but that they'll see the movie anyway
17 Posts declaring that the trailer sucked, but that they'll rent it
2 Posts declaring that Star Wars is dead
31 Posts declaring the dark side (Walmart?) alive
Re:Summary of Posts (Score:2)
11 "All your trailer" posts
8 "Summary of Posts" posts.
Oops...
Re:Summary of Posts (Score:3, Funny)
Those Crafty Apples (Score:2, Funny)
Gee. I wonder why that is?
:-)
-hack
Get trailor (Score:2, Informative)
Cut and paste the link into your browser
(Don't click on the link as it detects the referer address and it will block you.)
http://starwars.apple.com/ep2/clone_war/index.h
Dave
To Those Who Complain. (Score:3, Interesting)
To those people who do not think this movie will be worth seeing, reconsider -- the visual effects in Phantom Menace did not disappoint, and from the looks of it, this movie will be just as nice with the CGI. As a fan of CGI, I was very happy with the pod race scene on a 40 foot screen, and I think I'll get my money's worth seeing the new movie when it comes out at theatres.
If you've read this far, you probably agree with me.
Re:To Those Who Complain. (Score:3, Insightful)
Everyone marvelled at the CGI in Toy Story, but it was the characters, the laughs and the plot that made it a success. Compare to FF.
Final Fantasy (Score:2)
The problem that Final Fantasy encountered was bringing an anime-esque film to the mainstream audience.
Re:Final Fantasy (Score:2)
Not familiar with it. However the Gaea concept is there. ;) I also have spent plenty of time telling people who thought FF:the Spirits Within was "too New Agey" that Shinto, a traditional Japanese religion holds that the land (sometimes the world, sometimes Japan specifically) has a spirit, along with many many other aspects of nature (all those little shrines throughout Japan are generally Shinto). Shinto predates Buddism in Japan. "New Age" indeed.
Hideaki Anno might write using western religious imagery, but most asian authors (or any author in general) use the themeatic, mythic and metaphorical imagery of their own culture. Audiances from other cultures often miss fundimental points or think that a trite, overworked theme is new.
--
Evan
Re:Final Fantasy (Score:2)
The problem that Final Fantasy encountered was that its plot was so twisted, poorly explained, and generally nonsensical that it proved impossible to care about the characters, their future, or indeed what the heck was even going on... another case of too cool CGI, too flawed writing.
Re:Final Fantasy (Score:2)
Re:Final Fantasy (Score:2)
Re:To Those Who Complain. (Score:5, Insightful)
The pod race that you all drool over is nothing more than "Days of Thunder" with different pictures (and hey, did that film ever suck!) - nice speed effects, but nothing interesting happening to make you worry about the character. The ground battle scene sucked by taking place on a manicured lawn and the simple question "if they have bombs, why don't they get other better weapons?". The storming-the-palace scenes sucked by the "oh hey, they all suddenly get guns with ropes on, yeah right" bit. And the space bit was just "Home Alone" - kid lucks out with slapstick to save the day. Never mind the totally irrelevant fish-chasing-the-submarine sequence.
The only new and interesting thing in the whole film was the Jedi fight scenes - they finally worked out how a Jedi (who can use the Force to jump and stuff) would be able to fight.
Grab.
Re:To Those Who Complain. (Score:3, Informative)
Actually, it's the chariot race from Ben Hur. Seriously. It's almost a shot-for-shot homage, as Lucas and McCallum both said several times in various interviews.
cartoon (Score:3, Insightful)
It doesn't look real. Something about the models, miniture sets and mock-ups of Hoth and other planets in the first three movies had a texture to them that made them more believeable. Also the camera didn't fly all over the place constantly.
Looks like another pod race type scene (a big CGI jack off session that has nothing to contribute to a story) and a lot more characters that you won't care about (but hey, if Lucas throws 300 new characters in he can sell figures of them all to people that have to buy every single one.
This crap almost makes you feel like becoming a Trekkie (shudder). At least they come up with an interesting story and leave the visuals as a compliment to it.
D
Among other things.... (Score:2, Interesting)
Agree with the "too much CGI" comment though.
Realism plug-in (Score:5, Funny)
I think someone needs to come up with a plug-in for Softimage (or whatever program they use) that will prevent the virtual camera from doing anything a normal camera couldn't do in real life. Like if you moved it too high, it would make you build a virtual crane to hold it in position. Or if you moved it around in the air, you'd get a $3,000 virtual helicopter rental fee deducted from your bank account.
Fox trailer conspiracy against Tivo! (Score:5, Funny)
Blocked referral, type manually (Score:5, Informative)
DivX 5, MPEG and WMP8 versions here (Score:5, Informative)
Mirror Of the DivX ;-) Copy Here (Score:5, Interesting)
http://www.compsci.duq.edu/~silicon/ep2_clone_w
I figured I'd mirror this since the usual
Good, but... (Score:2, Interesting)
But...I wish Lucas still had the mentoring of Joseph Campbell for these movies. I was an avid reader of Campbell's before I found out that he was a consultant on the mythological aspects of the movies for Lucas. And once you read something as easy as "The Power Of Myth" you can see Campbell's influence.
Regardless, I'm still going to the movie to see lightsabers.
Mirror (Score:2, Informative)
I grabbed the divx5 version of the large trailer that was posted on another thread and mirrored it on my site. Grab it here [bill-williams.org].
Looks better than the first one (Score:2)
Oh, and thank God I didn't see Jar Jar Binks anywhere. Did George mercifully leave him out of it?
Jar Jar is there ... (Score:2)
Re:Looks better than the first one (Score:2)
not a chance... he needs to finish selling all the Jar-Jar action figures left over from Episode I.
Besides, he's listed in the Ep. II credits [imdb.com]
hmmm (Score:3, Informative)
BTW, was it just me, or was the music on the trailer a bit nondescript? One of the decent things about TPM was the "duel of the fates" track.
I thought whoever converted the trailer to divx should have added after the "the saga continues may 16th" something like "divx coming to your favourite file-sharing network May 20th".
And before you mod me down for not being entirely negative about the film, just think: Christopher Lee! Big battles! Natalie Portman!
graspee
The music (Score:2)
As a matter of fact, I don't think we've heard any of the new pieces in any of the trailers
Maybe Williams is not done recording them ?
Re:The music (Score:2)
To watch the trailer in Linux (Score:2)
Mirror (Score:2)
Re:Mirror (Score:2)
...$ for Ep2 vs. anti-MPAA not the only issue... (Score:5, Insightful)
- Lucas's movies from the 70's are the primary reason (debatably equal with Spielberg's movies) for the "blockbuster-centric" state of the movie industry today. (i.e. opening weekend-oriented, with receipts fading fast even for popular films, therefore "hyper-able" films with a fast return get the most attention). ergo, supporting a new Lucas film is consistent _not only_ with generally supporting the MPAA, but also with supporting the "big (and not necessarily smart, therefore often stupid) movies advertised with big $$" business model which the major studios are so slavishly following.
(hey! lucas started a tsunami of crap! he's indirectly responsible for tomb raider! lucas is bad!)
- OTOH, Lucas is in the ultra-elite group of filmmakers who is beholden to _none_ of the movie studios (i.e. MPAA). He doesn't _have_ to create "big blockbusters", this is the kind of movie he _wants_ to make. Lucas even has the clout to create his own distribution company (in addition to Lucasfilm's production end), ala the Spielberg/Geffen/Katzenberg Dreamworks, were he interested.
(hmm... lucas is powerful! but independent... therefore good?)
- Lucas has, in fact, been using his clout to push digital production _and_ display techniques (which would be going faster were it not for distributor/theater overgrowth and mismanagement... which is a side result of the "blockbuster mentality, but I digress...). Aesthetic questions of "digital film" aside), these techniques can dramtically lower distribution costs while increasing theater flexibility, and thereby create new opportunities for distribution and showing of "non-blockbuster" films (independent or otherwise low(er) budget)...
(yay! Lucas is good! he's undoing what he hath wrought! and doing cool digitial stuff! Lucas is good!)
- Lucas's narratives tend to reflect a rather benevolently feudal/fascist view of the world, in which an elite group (Jedi) rules over/provides protection to the general classes; he has furthermore stated his preference for "benevolent dictator" style organization for his businesses (Lucasfilm/ILM/etc.), as well as indicating that his films are very specifically his own (versus "for the fans")... this idealized feudalism is further reflected in his deity-like relationship with his (legions of) fans. i.e. Lucas' s "independent" streak is very much a part of a tendency towards complete control over his work.
(boo! Lucas is anti-democratic... but he's an artist, so it's OK... but he does this in business, too... and see how he treats his fans... but we love him! Lucas is, uh, is...)
Anyway, Lucas's position in Hollywood/business practices/audience relations/artistic bent are very much an integrated and consistent (but still complex) thing - at least to the point that it's hard to reduce it to pure "good" or "bad". Let's just call Lucas a unique, smart, lucky bastard and focus on more concrete matters.
Just something to chew on.
Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery... (Score:3, Informative)
So I guess that Lucas is flattering The Fifth Element [fifthelement.com]. Or am I the only one who had a little deja vu with the "speeding through three dimensional traffic patterns with futuristic cars, followed by vertical plunge shot?"
Also, blocking slashdot referrals? No class.
Requiring quicktime pro for the large screen trailer? No class.
Yet another "milk the shoddy trilogy" moment.
Re:Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery... (Score:2)
And to top it off, the car they were in was yellow. Did anyone notice a checker pattern? :-) I'm waiting for this scene later on:
Yoda: Mmm. Great distance he has travelled to be here.
Obi-Wan: Yeah, I know. I was there when he took off.
And what's up with the "I hate flying" schtick? Was that Ewan MacGregor or Woody Allen? Looks like typical Lucas: Lame dialogue framing kick-ass battle sequences. I'm not looking forward to the Kenobi/Skywalker buddy-cop scenes. But it should be interesting to see the political conflict between the Jedi and Palpatine. (ObRipoff: Shades of the Alliance and Pres. Clark in Babylon 5?)
Yawn.. can't we have something really spectacular? (Score:4, Insightful)
When are we going to see films that really capture the true scale of the energy levels we're going to be flinging around? I don't want to see ships throwing primary coloured blobs at each other, I want to see them fling high yield nukes, antimatter weapons that light up the sky and threaten to melt any surface nearby, I want to see missiles that fill space with incandescent plasma that fades before being blown appart as it's lanced by otherwise invisible beams of radiation.
I want to see acceleration an issue; I want to see people who couldn't get to a chair to scream in agony as they get crushed down by high G forces or get torn to bits by decompressions, not a few panels exploding and some lame shaking.
I want to see ground troops frying acres of land as they desperately try to kill an enemy, I want to see them blowing shit up with gauss guns and worryingly powerful antimatter devices, or proper ray guns where you only see what's reflected off dust and things they're melting/frying (and which cause the atmosphere to explode like lightning). Screw phasers.
I want to see believable universes, filled with Humans for a change; no humanoid "aliens" who happen to act like certain stereotypes (aliens will, of course, get a look in, but not as human analogs ffs); there's huge scope for different cultures, technologies, types of people and things people will become (from tweaked to entirely redesigned) that you get with humans alone without having to think up Unlikely Stereotypical Alien-with-ridged-forehead-and-attitude-problem 31338.
Of course, it's not going to happen.. tried and tested paper thin plots and people and a few shiny special effects is just too damn easy to throw together and make money out of.
<fume>
Re:Yawn.. can't we have something really spectacul (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Yawn.. can't we have something really spectacul (Score:3)
Nope; you're not going to make a film entirely out of that, there's plenty of room for getting across the raw panic/cold determinism/etc of the people involved, then you've got space for setting up these huge battles, all the politics and interpersonal relationships that caused them etc, then the after effects as people risk their lives to save survivors. And of course, you've got the more mundane aspects of the lives of the main characters.
Really, you're not going to make a movie entirely out of that sort of large scale battle; they're probably not going to last long anyway (how long do you think anyone would survive these sort of battles without either being vaporised, running out of ammo, overheating or deciding to run away?), and nobody's going to go about nuking planets/space stations/each other without good reason. You might as well say the same about any movie; sure, done badly it'll end up being a special effects showcase and nothing else, but hey, it's not going to be any worse than what we already have, is it?
Jar Jar back?! Shocking. Ten serious reservations (Score:2, Interesting)
1 ** Sufferin' Succotash, Speech Impediment:
I understand that Lucas has a difficult task in creating a rich and diverse universe of alien races, each of which needs its own unique culture, look, and language. But he couldn't come up with anything better than "Moi moi, I wuv you!?" This is the first in a series of things that makes Jar Jar less realistic and more cartoonish than necessary.
2 ** Jar Jar, Future Winner of the Darwin Award
All right, you've got a stampede of frightened jungle creatures bearing down on you. They're followed by elephantine troop transports. Also, there's this jedi-hippy Qui-Gon guy heading right at you. What do you do? If you've got any survival instincts at all, you run. YOU RUN! Any creature, big or small, that doesn't flee simply deserves to have its genes exterminated.
2 ** Benedict Arnold. Twice!
Jar Jar, cowardly turncoat, reveals the ultra-secret refuge of his race not once, but twice! First, he reveals where the "secret" underwater city is after about 10 seconds of interrogation. Later, he doesn't even need any prodding to reveal where the backup secret "sacred" place is. I'm sure not telling him where my Y2K survival cabin is.
3 ** Five-Fingered Discount.
MOS ESPA POLICE BLOTTER - Tuesday, 10:45 AM. Local merchant reports that a passer-by attempted to shoplift from a street display of food. The perpetrator was described as a pink male, approximately 7 feet tall, with ritualistic tattoos covering both of his arms. Anyone with information on this crime is encouraged to call the Mos Espa police department's Crime Watch Hotline.
4 ** Bring the GPS Receiver, Jar Jar's 'Navigating.'
"We're going through the planet core, we'll need a navigator." (Or something like that.) Real bang-up job on that, Mr. Binks. He doesn't actually know where anything is, can't give even the most general helpful hint, and in fact, panics during some rather tense moments during the fish chase scene, constituting a distraction which had a very real chance to cause physical harm. Of course, with the force to guide them, the jedi come out ok, but this begs an explanation for why a navigator was so necessary in the first place.
5 ** Road Trip, Destination Mos Espa.
I simply can think of a but single reason Qui-Gon takes Jar Jar along with him on his mission to find a replacement Nubian warp drive. Qui-Gon secretly planned to sell Jar Jar into slavery when nobody was looking, in order to make money for the parts. That was a plan that I'm sure most audience members could have gotten behind. Unfortunately, Padme/Amidala insisted on tagging along, ruining Qui-Gon's plans.
6 ** Who Framed Jar Jar Rabbit?
Jar Jar is supposed to be the first major photo-realistic character in a motion picture completely generated by computers. Realistic. So why is he able to violate several of Newton's laws when he jumps into the water in a completely cartoon-like way? Star Wars is not a cartoon. When he's in Watto's shop, why does he juggle robot parts in the same non-Newtonian way? Star Wars is NOT A CARTOON. When he runs from the blue energy balls, once again--cartoon! George, I'll say it one more time--STAR WARS IS NOT A CARTOON.
7 ** Sun Tzu He Ain't.
Pity the Gungans. They're lead by Boss Nass, a man so blinded by his own inferiority complex that he decides to send his people into a slaughter to prove that not only aren't the Naboo thinkin theysa betta than tha Gungans, but the Gungans may in fact be betta than tha Naboo. Then, the Gungans have Captain Tarpals, who selects his second in command based upon, well, apparently no logic at all, since he selects Jar Jar. And of course, they're led into battle by "General" Jar Jar, who surrenders at the first opportunity (To an army with orders to commit genocide, no less! "Wipe them out--All of them!" Surrender means certain death!). Indeed, the sum total of JJ's military brilliance consists of saying, "Steady, steady." Such is the art of warfare.
8 ** Miscellaneous Dumb Quirks.
The Gungans have a law actually called 'Nocomebackie'? What the heck does "Maxi big da force" mean anyway? (If it means "The force is big," well, that's so dumb it hurts.) What's with Jar jar and the poop 'n' fart jokes? And did Lucas really name the whole race "Gungan" after a nonsense sound his son made? What's next, the "googoogagas?"
9 ** How Wude!
For a creature so obsessed with the social graces of others, berating them with his "How Wude!" sentiment, Jar Jar sure uncouth himself. Tongues are not for grabbing food.
10 ** Success through incompetence.
One of the core values that I hold is that hard work and talent breed success, and incompetence and laziness lead to failure. This isn't really such a novel idea; it should be pretty fundamental to anybody who thinks capitalism is a good thing. It's the basis for the American Dream.
Young Anakin Skywalker is a good example of these values. Anakin is filled with the force, so he's a great pilot without even trying. In spite of this, he also spends his free time exercising his mechanical skills, trying to search for his slave transmitter, and in general making himself a better person. When Anakin succeeds, we feel he deserves it.
Jar Jar is a mockery of these values. He's unintelligent, a coward, and lazy. He's mechanically inept. His clumsiness makes him such a burden on his society that they force him into exile. He is careless with military weaponry. He almost breaks the pod-racer by dropping an tool into a jet engine! And in spite of all of this, he succeeds too!
The idea that Jar Jar can succeed without trying simply because he's good-hearted is offensive to Libertarians everywhere.
Why did Lucas waver again. He has no integrity. First the video trailer clps showing scenes not in the movie, and now this doublecross of his fans.
C3PO (Score:4, Insightful)
Another server, other formats (Score:3, Informative)
The apple server isn't slashdotted (yet). It just wants a specific referring page, or it wants you to come straight in. Click the link from the article, get the error message, click in your URL window, and hit return again.
You can also find the trailer at planetmirror [planetmirror.com]. This completes my collection; now I'll have a full CD-ROM full of stuff to keep me excited until the release date.
He wasn't worried about the romance plot (Score:3, Interesting)
If you look at the Episode 1 trailers, and look at how Lucas does things, you'll see he likes to create a different effect with each trailer. The other trailer was a "love story" trailer, this one is an action trailer. I would not be surprised if there are one or two more that each emphasize a different theme or plot.
Anakin 2 Vader (Score:5, Interesting)
BTW, How come Anakin grows up so fast, and the Queen still looks like a teen? Then they fall in love... in the first movie there was a big age difference... it's a little strange. Oh well, just a movie.
Re:Anakin 2 Vader (Score:2)
Is Anakin going to become Vader in this episode? That would be the best, as the whole next movie we could see him in action. Yet, maybe Anakin is too young...
Well, from the spoilers that I've seen... uhh... I'll save comment on that. But you can definitely see some of the turning - remarks about his arrogance, the chancellor letting him go and also bringing him under his wing. Good stuff. In fact, Palpatine could easily go down as THE evil mastermind of all time if things work out as I think they will.
Re:Anakin 2 Vader (Score:4, Funny)
re:Anakin 2 Vader (spoiler?) (Score:3, Interesting)
Watching EP1 last night on the Movie channel I had a rather interesting insight. That Anakin is/was always the second Sith [candidate].
Anakin 'imaculate conception', hint's of genetic engineer, aka The Clone-Wars.
Palpatine familiarity with Tatooine, 'a minor outland planet on the edge of known space', he clearly knows about it, Why ? He Certainly he has some interest in it!
Tatooine close proximatly to Naboo, Palpatine home planet. Convenient or Coincidence ?
Qui-Gon Jinn believed Anakin to be the Chosen One spoken of in an ancient prophecy, the one who would bring balance to the Force. What does he know to suggest he is not a natural produced/wild Jedi? And Why is training Anakin, the most important thing/ last wish he asked of Obi-Wan ?
Anakin's unatural talent for machines, when Jedi are supposed to be connected to living things.
Anakin 'training' on Tatooine.
Bobafetts links to Tatooine, and Palpatine and Sith's.
Another DiVX 5 mirror and codec link (Score:2, Troll)
If you don't have the DiVX 5 codec, Get that here [divx.com].
Have fun.
What??? No Natalie Portman trolls??? (Score:2)
Attack of the Corn (Score:2, Funny)
MPEG trailer mirror (26 MB) here (Score:5, Informative)
You may download the trailer from: http://lavender.cime.net/~aotc/ep2_clone_war.mpg
I got it from Drestin (thanks, Dude!)
Cheers,
E
Why do this clowns at Apple.. (Score:3, Informative)
GalaxyQuest and the "Crushers" (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Link not active?!! (Score:2, Informative)
They apparently don't want people linked directly too it so they banned anything with certain referer fields (like slashdot).
Follow the URL, copy it from the location bar, go to some other site, then paste it back in. That should take care of it.
Re:Link not active?!! (Score:3, Informative)
Comment removed (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Direct link to the movie (Score:2, Informative)
wget --referer=http://starwars.apple.com/ep2/clone_war
Re: (Score:2)
Before Apple decides to pull the file... (Score:2)
Get it from my mirror: http://www.compsci.duq.edu/~silicon/ep2_clone_war
Re:hmm.. (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Very unimpressed (Score:2)
But put yourself in Lucas' shoes for a minute. Here is a guy who, a couple of decades ago, created something legendary and almost mythical for a generation of movie-goers and sci-fi fans.
He's then charged with the task of one-up'ing his own past greatness with a few new movies. He must create dazzling effects that are better than anything being done with the multi-million dollar movies of current day, and he must make a good story out of it.
In the meantime, he has to worry about impressing the first generation of fans who saw the original films as well as captivating a whole new generation of youngsters with the Star Wars tale.
I guess you could kind of compare it to Michael Jordan's return(s) to the NBA after his initial retirement. People understand that he's not the limber acrobat from 20 years ago, yet it's almost as though they're dissappointed when he doesn't jump from half-court and dunk the ball.
But, the "wise" basketball fan still appreciates him for all that he's given to the game and for the people he's influenced in the process. It should be the same for Lucas.
monolinux.com
Re:Very unimpressed (Score:2)
Dissapointing post (Score:5, Insightful)
C'mon people, please come up with new reasons for not liking the prequels. Do we have to constantly read about "continue milking money out of the franchise" ?
The movie looks like fun, big battles, cool characters, etc. If you've seen previous star wars films you know what to expect. Just saying , "it's not creative" enough amounts to saying nothing. What do you want ? I really doubt that you could come up with anything more creative that the visuals and excitement in those few minutes of the trailer.
Oh BTW, your post is not "creative". Did I already mention that ?
Re:Dissapointing post (Score:3, Insightful)
Here are a few of mine.
-JJB
-Pod Race kinda cool, but a lot of eye candy filler contributes nothing to story.
-Final battle, a bunch of the worst characters ever created lobbing big blue bouncy balls at CGI driods on the Windows XP desktop.
-Samual Jackson, love him but he is No Jedi
-Yoda ain't even good
-Anikan, baaaddd actor; glad he's gone at least
-The Force is bajillions of tiny creatures living inside all of us. Hahahahaha *choke*
Re:Very unimpressed (Score:2)
Personally, I think that lightsaber action rocks. Give the movie a chance. At least, watch it before you judge it. It seems you just bashed it simply because Star Wars bashing is the in thing nowadays in
Re:Very unimpressed (Score:5, Insightful)
Instead he cranked out more fodder, really for nothing more than to continue milking money out of the franchise. Looks like it's continuing.
Let me take this opportunity to say this: Thank god that Peter Jackson filmed all three LOtR at once. Read why before you mod me offtopic:
Lucas had a dream. He made Star Wars. It was... a little campy, in retrospect, but rollicking fun nonetheless.
Years pass.
Lucas made The Empire Strikes Back. It was much more serious. Darker. There's Dagobah and stuff. The sets, the effects, the tone all change. Why? Because Lucas now had better technology, and a different expectation to film for.
Years pass.
Lucas made Return of the Jedi. It was serious, yet fluffy. Dark, yet light. Wonderful effects, of course, now that years have passed. But again, the tone had shifted to become completely different. It reflected years of hindsight and expectations that affected the original artistic vision.
And it's only getting worse with the prequels.
Which is why I'm glad Peter Jackson shot all three LOtR films in one big go. Sure, the CGI is going to still be cranked out for a while. Editing can be affected by time. But overall, he has the chance to make a coherent hole of the trilogy, which is something I don't feel Lucas has been able to do with the time he's had. As Prufrock would say, time for a hundred visions and revisions...
Re:Very unimpressed (Score:2)
Re:Very unimpressed (Score:3, Insightful)
Lucas has ALWAYS been one for new moviemaking toys. On one hand this is a good thing: he alone is responsible for getting ILM and the realm of realistic model-based special effects off the ground back in the Dark Ages of SFX. The same is true more recently for digital film. Hell, Kubrick used to shoot all of his films in mono because he was disgusted at the variance in theater quality. Thanks to Lucas, this may not be a problem in the very near future with digital projection.
On the other hand, this dependance on glitzy looks has the adverse effect, at least on his films, of relieving focus on story. Yeah they look great. Yeah they'll sell lots of toys. Back in the 70's, they sold Star Wars to the masses. Now, in our CG-inundated world, audiences need more than this. As an example, someone posted earlier just to this effect, about wanting more impressive weapons instead of what was in the trailer. I agree. .
Re:Very unimpressed (Score:5, Informative)
I am afraid it is you who are mistaken about many things... You have a decent analysis, but your facts are all wrong. Of course, that is always a bad start.
George Lucas did make the original Star Wars. And that movie turned out pretty much how you describe it. However, George Lucas did not make the two following films. Not really. Not in the sense we usually give that word.
The Empire Strikes Back [imdb.com] was directed by Irvin Kershner [imdb.com]. Lucas is credited with the role of executive producer and with the story, but not the script. Apparently, Lucas gave Kershner a lot of leeway. Kershner put a lot of himself in the film, which explains why it stands out so vividly in the franchise. As for Lucas, he thought it was a bit too dark. (There is an anecdote, verified by Kershner, about Han's macho "I know" line, which he says to Leia when she tells him she loves him. Lucas didn't like the line and wanted it out, but Kershner held his ground. Lucas only let it stand after he saw how the public reacted in a private screening. Sad but true, Lucas would have preferred Han say "I love you too.")
Now admittedly The Return of the Jedi [imdb.com] looks more like a Lucas movie. But he still didn't direct it. He gave that job to Richard Marquand [imdb.com]. Again, Lucas is the executive producer and is credited with the story, but not the script. Obviously the film is going to feel a bit different. Now apart from the advance in technology which you mention, I personnally see this film as a return to the aesthetics of the first film. I think that this is what Lucas wanted when he picked Marquand. Now, I understand that Lucas guided Marquand more than he had Kershner. But maybe Marquand just happened to share Lucas' tastes more than Kershner did.
So do not be surprised if the movies look and feel different... They were made by diferent people. Funny thing is, I think Lucas used to be very open about all of this. But not anymore. He doesn't usually mention neither directed nor wrote the scripts to two of them. Kind of strange. So... As long as Lucas writes and directs the prequels, don't expect any one of them to turn out like Episode V. Especially since he didn't like it that much in the first place.
I suppose that you're unfamiliar with mythology (Score:5, Interesting)
Mythology is rarely original. In fact, Campbell, were he alive, would likely point out that there are only a handful of basic mythological stories and most every contemporary myth has some root in a far more generic myth.
So, my point: indeed, there isn't anything original about Star Wars. It's just another way of characterizing a myth, in this case, the fall from grace, that has been around for thousands of years.
Re:I suppose that you're unfamiliar with mythology (Score:2)
Re:I suppose that you're unfamiliar with mythology (Score:3, Insightful)
Marketing concerns ? A trilogy about how the main character becomes the main villian. A prequel instead of a sequel (which is what most fans originally wanted). A movie about a separatist movement inside of a galactic republic ?
You must be a marketroid if you attribute that to marketing zombies !
Re:I suppose that you're unfamiliar with mythology (Score:2, Interesting)
Besides, there's obvious differences between myths, with some containing elements not contained in others, despite a similarity in theme. Oedipus Rex (for instance) shares many themes with Star Wars, but Luke hardly killed Darth Vader and had sex with Natalie Portman. The stories of Hercules and Jesus are very very similar, but their perception, and their effect, are entirely different. Cambell didn't claim that all myths were the same, he made a checklist of thematic similarities.
I think a more accurate depiction of myth is that there's certain basics beliefs and themes programmed into our minds, and any story has to take these primal beliefs and apply them to our constantly-changing environment, with more sucessful, elementary stories getting elevated to "myth." Another poster claimed the reliance on primal themes means there's no possibility of telling new stories - instead, I think in a more rapidly changing world, there's more possibility (and necessity) of telling new stories.
What holds Star Wars back from being a myth is that it's kind of silly and will probably be ignored as time goes on...
Re:I suppose that you're unfamiliar with mythology (Score:3, Insightful)
Of course, Campbell drew on Robert Graves [robertgraves.org], who himself drew on Sir James Frazer [bartleby.com] and W.B. Yeats [bartleby.com] and so on...
Campbell, Graves as well as very many other mythographers before them recognised that, in Graves' words, "There was one story, and one story only". The study of myth is often just an attempt to relocate its sources. These sources aren't only in literature. They're in all manner of unexplainable things: nature, science, psychology, dream, etc. They all fuel our imaginations and, given that we've not really changed that much over time (we're just a bit better at explaining things and hence, behaving 'rationaly').
One great appeal of the original Star Wars trilogy is that was so faithful to the pattern of proto-myths described by Campbell, Graves and others. The Phantom Menace though, seems more concerned with being faithful to the orginal trilogy than any of the more unversal mythological legends. It's probably why they feel more shallow, more commercial and less about those things that matter to all of us.
No big loss though. The eye candy is great. Most of us will enjoy it. There will be other story tellers who will captivate us with wickedly spun tales.
Re:I suppose that you're unfamiliar with mythology (Score:3)
The films aren't supposed to be constantly breaking new ground and reinventing the dramatic wheel. Furthermore, I think there's a little hypocrisy in expecting them to. I can only imagine the hubbub that would ensue if Lucas decided "oh, I've done this Force and lightsabers nonsense for five movies... I'm not putting them in the next one."
Re:I suppose that you're unfamiliar with mythology (Score:3, Insightful)
Folks, fiction ain't technology. There are no new ideas in the world of plot and characterization. Depending on how finely you slice it, there are only a dozen or so possible plots that make sense to Western minds. You can twiddle with the setting, juggle the characters around a bit, but all you will ever do is create a variation on one of a handful of dreadfully familiar themes. What distinguishes good fiction (and art in general) from bad is the author's mastery of his technique. How many blues songs are based on minor variations of the same twelve-step chord progression? Most of them, both good and bad.
Milking the franchise? I suppose that's what Sophocles was doing with his Oedipus trilogy which is, IMHO, the ultimate source of the Darth Vader/Luke Skywalker/Obi Wan Kenobi subplot. I wonder if we can have a nice thread now about how Oedipus at Colonus was much less imaginative than Oedipus Tyranneus.
People dislike Ep1/2 cause it's chic... (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Very unimpressed (Score:3)
Re:Very unimpressed (Score:2)
Re:Very unimpressed (Score:2)
He's probably not done yet.
Re:Very unimpressed (Score:2)
That was the song that we used to kick ass and take names with in 88 for our drum solo. The song was really fun, lots of for the altos, esp.. all those WHOOP WHOOOP WHOOOOOOPS! that John Williams is famous for making french horns want to kill themselves rather than put up with all that work.
I love John Williams. He makes great music. You all can bite me.
Hating John William is nearly the same thing as being a Patriots Fan in Feb 2002....
Re:Very unimpressed (Score:3, Funny)
high tech past != low tech future (Score:2, Insightful)
Of course the plot seems generic, there are movies and storylines that they have to follow.
They never really showed any other sith for the Jedi to fight. I am sure that they created one, but didn't share that information in the trailers. The only part that I found to be bland in the thing was Yoda's dialogue. I never really understood why someone so old and wise couldn't speak elementary english. But I guess you can't teach an old dog new tricks.
A real problem is that with the high-tech past, how does the future become so mundane in just a generation? They need to do a lot of explaining in the next two movies to show why and how they got from point A to point B, but enough of this off topic rant!
singular craft : mass production (Score:2, Insightful)
Personally, I think it's a neat idea, but I agree with you--he didn't think it all the way through and it looks wierd. How come the technology in the ep. 1 is no less advanced, if not more advanced? Maybe what he should've done is make eps. 1-3 with the exact same moviemaking technology that he used in the 70's, except when he needed a shot that was impossible to do without CG, he should've done some CGI, except make it look like animatronics or puppets, rather than real life. For some reason, I find it a lot easier to suspend my disbelief in eps. 4-6, even though the effects in ep. 1 supposedly look more realistic.
Re:Very unimpressed (Score:4, Interesting)
Why are you dissapointed? (Score:3, Insightful)
In the first Star Wars movie, Lucas got moving out of the gate pretty good. The characters were interesting, the plot was interesting, and the universe he created had so many fascinating possibilities. Empire Stikes Back was his pinnacle though. That movie managed to really develop the characters and it wasn't afraid to take a darker tone.
From there though we've got Return of the Jedi where you can already sense his falling into an obsession with special effects over substance. You can also see his sell out to the toy merchants with the ewoks getting involved. Although I will say, one thing Lucas has always done well is come up with excellent bad guys. The emperor just seethed evil and the whole scene of turning Luke still gets to me when I watch. You know the scene, the dramatic operatic sounding music. Luke shouting DAARRRRTTTHHHH, and just totally losing it. Still though, mostly a special effects and toy selling fest.
This brings us to episode one. Total obsession with special effects and eye candy. Once again, good job on the bad guy in Darth Maul, but the sell out aspect of the movie is huge. Jar Jar... If only he would have died in the first 5 minutes, the movie would have been much better.
So, why should we get our hopes up about Episode 2? We should expect more of the same, a supremely cool bad guy, lots of nifty special effects, and lots of nice tie ins to sell toys to the kids. It'll be a fun movie, but it's not going to take the high road in any way shape or form. If you want that, go see LOTR again
Re:errrm - the link doesn't work (Score:2)
So you point to the link, right-click, copy shortcut (or whatever your browser requires), click in the Address field and paste the address in so that the akamai webserver doesn't know it's being Slashdotted. At the risk of sounding like Nick Burns, Your Company's Computer Guy [jt.org]