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Slashback Media Music Security

Slashback: Ascent, Patents, Transferability 253

Posted by timothy from the tennessee-yet-again dept.
Slashback tonight brings updates on iTunes music sharing (the mentioned auction's been pulled), the continuing fight against software patents in Europe, the recently scuttled balloon-record attempt, and more. Read on for the details.

Your ruse, your clever trick. On August 22nd, we reported that OpenOffice.org's OS X version had been delayed for two years.

However, bluethundr writes "Hold the phone! Is it delayed or isn't it? Well, according to this story in the register, it AIN'T DELAYED...just undermanned. Apparently there are only TWO (count 'em! one...aw heck, where was I?) developers working on the OS X development team. Dan Williams (who is one of the two in question) says that 'the Mac version is in a Catch-22: with only two developers, it desperately needs man power. But no one will join the porting effort until they see momentum behind the Aqua port.' Maybe some of the coders among us could lend them a hand?"

Too late for the colonies, help save the mothership. leif.singer writes "While there still is some time left, please consider signing Eurolinux' petition against software patents in Europe." You'll be in good company: vinsci writes "In their news section, FFII has posted a more detailed story: "Within a few days, the petition calling the European Parliament to reject software patentability accumulated 50,000 new signatures.""

Free as in FreeDOS Jim Hall writes "I thought I'd submit this before the news item fell too far down our web page. If you remember about a year ago, Dell was to offer Windows-less PC's, instead pre-installing FreeDOS. You can now order a Dell with FreeDOS (or Linux) ... and have been for a while now. They are pretty nice machines, too (3.06GHz). We have the news item (with links to Dell) at the FreeDOS Project web site."

Nasty worms ought to at least produce spice. The NRC released an alert about worm infections and nuclear power plants. This is a reaction after the SQL-Slammer attacked the shut-down Davis-Besse nuclear power plant in January.

Tomorrow is another year. RoadKillian writes "New Scientist reports thats the QinetiQ 1, the record-breaking balloon which was supposed to rise to an altitude of 40km (131,000ft) has ripped during inflation. The weather is unlikely to permit another attempt this year."

When EULAs collide. Yesterday's story about selling a song downloaded from iTunes seems to have an unhappy ending: sideswipe76 writes "As I was watching this auction today, it approached $16,600! Now, if you try and check this link from eBay you get 'invalid item.' Is eBay wussing out just to avoid any legal snafus that _might_ occur? Or did he violate some ebay policy? Thoughts?"
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Slashback: Ascent, Patents, Transferability More

Slashback: Ascent, Patents, Transferability

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  • a PC without windows? (Score:4, Funny)

    by PopeAlien ( 164869 ) on Thursday September 04, 2003 @07:02PM (#6874791) Homepage Journal
    ..I think right now I'd rather have a window without PC's..

  • iTunes Sale (Score:5, Informative)

    by rsmith-mac ( 639075 ) on Thursday September 04, 2003 @07:04PM (#6874804)
    According to News.com [com.com], the reason they scrubbed the iTunes auction was because he violated one of eBay's rules, which states that "eBay prohibits the listing of items or products to be delivered electronically through the Internet", aka the "You can't sell it if it doesn't physically exist" policy. Such as transfer may still be legal, but it looks like eBay isn't the place to do it.

    • Re:iTunes Sale (Score:5, Insightful)

      by dave420 ( 699308 ) on Thursday September 04, 2003 @07:10PM (#6874853)
      As was mentioned by another poster in the original thread, eBay regularly allows electronically-transferrable items to be auctioned. the on-line game assets (gold, weapons, etc.) are traded regularly, and they can *only* be transferred electronically.

      I guess eBay is covering its ass with that clause. They probably only pull it out when there's something potentially dangerous being auctioned, and let it slide when something the RIAA isn't going to get pissed about goes under the virtual hammer. With the RIAA in the trigger-happy state its in currently, I can hardly blame them.

      • Not really (Score:3, Interesting)

        by Compact Dick ( 518888 )
        If eBay allows it, then why do I find this:
        eBay prohibits the listing of items or products to be delivered electronically through the Internet.

        on their Downloadable Media Policy [ebay.com] page?

        Or was that secretly added after this song was listed?

        • Re:Not really (Score:4, Insightful)

          by dave420 ( 699308 ) on Thursday September 04, 2003 @07:18PM (#6874917)
          well, this link [ebay.com] shows that eBay has a lot of electronically-distributale items up for bidding, so eBay obviously allows it, otherwise these guys wouldn't waste their time making hundreds of auctions for things that eBay doesn't allow. And, from what I read originally, eBay has had that clause for a long time, to fight off illegal mp3 dealing.

          As I said, they enforce that rule when it helps them, and lets it slide when it doesn't.

        • Re:Not really (Score:3, Insightful)

          by Guppy06 ( 410832 )
          "eBay prohibits the listing of items or products to be delivered electronically through the Internet."

          Does that mean it can be delivered electronically through a different medium? What if the seller dialed up the buyer's modem and set up a zmodem transfer? Or does nobody do that any more?
        • OK, so eBay says: "eBay prohibits the listing of items or products to be delivered electronically through the Internet."

          How about X.25? DecNET? AppleTalk? Token Ring? Maybe they could do IrDA? Or just use IP over a LAN instead of the Internet?

        • Re:Not really (Score:5, Informative)

          by drinkypoo ( 153816 ) <drink@hyperlogos.org> on Thursday September 04, 2003 @09:12PM (#6875536) Homepage Journal
          You have to send the user a physical item. It can be a slip of paper. What most people do is sell a slip of paper with a "password" on it, and you meet the buyer in-game, and they say the password to you, at which time you give them the item.

          The buyer is protected (ostensibly) because the listing says that you will get the item when you tell them the password, thus if this is not true, you are guilty of fraud. And you comply with the letter of ebay's law. I'm guessing they feel the laws are clear on physical objects and claims but not on virtual ones, so they're bringing all the virtual things into the real world.

          Makes me wanna go watch Lain.

      • You are correct. Ebay allows the trading of Online Magic the Gathering cards which only exist in cyberspace.

    • Re:iTunes Sale (Score:5, Informative)

      by superpeach ( 110218 ) <adamfNO@SPAMsnika.uklinux.net> on Thursday September 04, 2003 @07:18PM (#6874911) Homepage
      You can see the email from eBay to George Hotelling here, at his site [hotelling.net] as well as his reply.

    • Re:iTunes Sale (Score:2, Insightful)

      by d34thm0nk3y ( 653414 )
      Actually, maybe it is OK they didn't go through with it. It would have become popular I am sure when people started using it like a used CD store. Ebay (if they managed to defeat the RIAA and Apple) would just have ended up turning into another RIAA...

    • Re:iTunes Sale (Score:5, Informative)

      by bcrowell ( 177657 ) on Thursday September 04, 2003 @07:27PM (#6874977) Homepage
      eBay doesn't actually enforce those rules normally, especially if nobody complains. For instance, they theoretically have a rule against selling anything on CD-ROM. Some guy took my copylefted books [lightandmatter.com], deleted the license and copyright page from each book, and started selling a CD-ROM containing my books. (It would have been OK for him to sell them, but it was a license violation to remove the license.) When I complained, they deleted his auctions, but he's still in business selling stuff like LOTR screensavers, porn screensavers, non-copylefted books, etc. -- all on CD-ROM. I filed reports on all that stuff, but they don't actually enforce this kind of rule or pull the auctions unless the victim is the one who files the report.
      • No, it's only for things on CD-R. Otherwise no one could sell any game software from the last decade or so.

        They will remove auctions for material on CD-R, but only if you can prove that it is - e.g. the auction photo shows a Playstation with a stack of CD-Rs labelled with a Sharpie. If the seller uses CD labels and calls them "CDs" instead of "CD-Rs," you are right, they won't remove the auction.
    • The way to legally get around issues like this (at eBay and other establishments) is to include some cheap object, like a ball-point pen. Then what you're selling is a really expensive pen that just happens to come with a iTunes music file (or whatever it is).

    • Re:iTunes Sale (Score:5, Informative)

      by wizzy403 ( 303479 ) * on Thursday September 04, 2003 @08:15PM (#6875237)
      From the auctioneer's site [hotelling.net]:

      [Update 09-04-2003 3:02 PM]:
      My GPG signed response:
      I do not believe that my auction violates the downloadable media policy, I posted in my auction that I would not be violating it. I specifically ammended [forgot to run ispell] the auction to state that the buyer would not receive the item in question over the Internet.

      Please reinstate my auction ASAP.

      George Hotelling

      [Update 09-04-2003 2:52 PM]:
      Dear George Hotelling (me@mydomain.tld)

      **PLEASE READ THIS IMPORTANT EMAIL REGARDING YOUR LISTING(S)**
      We would like to let you know that we removed your listing(s):

      2555673237 Double Dutch Bus by Devin Vasquez

      for violating our Downloadable Media Policy. Please read our Downloadable Media Policy here:

      http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/downloadable .h tml

      We have credited any associated fees to your account. We have also notified the bidders that the listing(s) was removed, and that they are not obligated to complete the transaction.

      If you relist this item, or any other item that violates eBay policy, your account could be suspended.

      If you believe your listing was removed in error, please let us know by replying
      to this email with supporting information.

      Thank you for your cooperation.

      Respectfully,

      Customer Support (Trust and Safety Department)
      Ebay Inc.
      • "Respectfully,

        Customer Support (Trust and Safety Department)
        Ebay Inc."

        Why does the trust and safety dept. make my ears ring of the ministry of the prevention of vice and the promotion of virtue.
    • WTF? eBay doesn't have any problem with auctions selling currency, items, and characters in MMORPGs. (eBay will pull such auctions if they are against the games rules, but eBay doesn't have a problem with them otherwise).

      How is this any different? The items in those auctions are delivered electronically, and don't physically exist.

    • Does this mean that the German auction [cgi.ebay.de] of a newly-created and virgin empty "Untitled Folder" made on a MacOS 9 machine is also violating ebay's policy? A pity, because I need a few.
    • All he would have had to do is burn the song to a CD and mail it. Wouldn't even matter if the song were playable ... that's the end user's problem. At least then it would have been on a physical media.

  • FreeDOS? (Score:2, Funny)

    by scosol ( 127202 )
    Come on now- what possible use is there for this?

    It sounds about as useful to me as that ~4.xxMB Win95 distribution...

    • Re:FreeDOS? (Score:5, Funny)

      by Arandir ( 19206 ) on Thursday September 04, 2003 @07:08PM (#6874838) Homepage Journal
      It's for all those Debian users who can't stand buying a computer with Redhat preloaded...

    • Re:FreeDOS? (Score:2, Insightful)

      by ragingmime ( 636249 )
      I don't think people intend to use FreeDOS itself for anything big - the point is that you can buy a PC without the "Windows tax." If you're going to install Linux (or BSD or whatever) anyway, there's no reason to pay for a copy of windows to go with your machine. The FreeDOS I'd assume, is so that you can at least boot up the machine when you get it.
    • Here at work we run systems tests on a crapload of old 386 and 486's... that run DOS 6.22. I'm currently investigating pitching a move to FreeDOS once I play with it and see if it can allow a program to use more than 640k of RAM (for some reason we can't with 6.22 and the software we use for testing, and we're running out of space).

      So it has it's uses. Plus you can use it to make some kind of distributable boot disk without having to worry about Microsoft coming after you.
      • and see if it can allow a program to use more than 640k of RAM (for some reason we can't with 6.22

        Oh man, do I feel old and I'm only 23. It's _DOS_, and the 640k limit was probably the most dispised thing about it. You may be interested in a DOS Extender, which gives you protected mode and access to more memory.
    • I wish to inform you that I wrote the Malloc routine for FreeDOS.

      Please send me $299 for each installed copy of FreeDOS you have on your PCs..

      Darl McBride
    • Not the kind that hum in the closet - the kind that hum in the workshop. A few old printers [fullnet.com] - or some surplus pipe, a few roller skate wheels, a trio of stepper motors and a sheet of plywood will provide all you need for your very own CRC machine [iprimus.com.au] - except the brains.

      Now, take an old 200MHz Pentium, FreeDOS, and CNC Pro [yeagerautomation.com] and you got it all.

      There's all kinds of uses for DOS. Lots of people still use it every day, even on their desktops. There's a LOT of old systems out there and recycling is a far better u

    • The FreeDos website has links [dell.com] to the Dell 360 desktop. The interesting thing I found, was that the default configuration with Windows (any version) selected as the OS costs $2863. The exact same options with Red Hat or Free DOS is only $2234.

      Yes, that's right. Dell is rooking $629 for Windows. If that doesn't piss you off enough, read this [cypherpunks.ca].
      However, I do have to say that I am glad there are now 2 major hardware vendors selling desktop systems with Linux as the only OS. IMHO, this is the only thing that IBM

  • Regarding the closed eBay auction... (Score:5, Interesting)

    by MMaestro ( 585010 ) on Thursday September 04, 2003 @07:07PM (#6874823)
    This may just be a crazy theory, but maybe the RIAA "told" eBay to close the auction. After all, if the auction had gone through and people were allowed to resell songs (as long as they gave up their own -only- copy) then the RIAA would have a new set of legal arguments on hand.
    • This may just be a crazy theory...

      It is.

      The right of first sale totally and completely aplies unless--get this--it's specifically waived as a condition of the sale.

      For example, if, for some reason I sell novels and ebooks, and I include a "you may not resell this" clause in the (printed) novels but not the ebooks, and I point the clause out to everyone, and they're the exact same price... well, you're able to bandy around the ebooks, but you can't resell the novels.

      More to the point, I could take you

      • Wouldn't you have to write the "you may not resell this book" clause *outside* the book? Because looks to me like it has nothing to do with copyright - more like contract law actually.

        So basically, you can't write the no resell clause inside the book and expect people to be bound by it. The consumer has to be aware of the restriction before he pays.

        Shrinkwrap licenses can go fuck themselves.

      • If you actually look up the law on this, you will find that some book publishers tried this stunt and were thrown out of the court for this. The "you may not resell" clause was regarded as illegal and invalid.
        No matter what they say, you CAN sell books.

  • iTunes not actually property! (Score:5, Informative)

    by rnd() ( 118781 ) on Thursday September 04, 2003 @07:07PM (#6874828) Homepage
    The fact that the auction has been pulled should convince anyone who has wondered that DRM is the only way for companies to profitably sell music on the internet.

    Incidentally, it is also a testament to the likely success of Microsoft's upcoming music download service, where you pay an annual fee and may download any 60 songs for playback on a handful of certified devices that are digitally tied to your account. If you get tired of some of the songs, you can turn them in and exchange them for new ones.

    When you think about it, this plan makes a lot of sense, since it ushers in the new era of portable digital storage, which you can plug into your car, your expensive Harmon Karden system, or your walkman. It also makes sense in that it will probably make record companies more money than they make today, while making consumers happier.

    Wouldn't you like to pay $120 per year and be able to "rent" any 60 songs at any time for as long as you want???

    Right now, you could buy 8 or 9 CDs, or 120 iTunes songs, which for most people wouldn't be enough to really establish a satisfactory music library.

    I know this post sounds pro-Microsoft, but it's actually pro-capitalism and pro-innovation. Capitalism works so well because it always encourages companies to come up with a better mousetrap, or in this case a better music distribution system.
    • Note: I said 120 iTunes songs because of all of the album discounts that they have on the site. In reality it would probably be closer to 80 or 90 songs for $60, assuming you had some consistent taste among artists/albums.

    • Re:iTunes not actually property! (Score:3, Interesting)

      by Anonymous Coward
      For $120 a year, I can buy ~8 CD's, which contain ~120 songs. I can also sell these CD's to various stores, or trade these CD's with my friends (for permanent or temporary use). After 10 years, I'll have 1200 songs, and you'll still only have 60. Sounds great.

    • Re:iTunes not actually property! (Score:5, Interesting)

      by Lumpy ( 12016 ) on Thursday September 04, 2003 @07:21PM (#6874933) Homepage
      Wouldn't you like to pay $120 per year and be able to "rent" any 60 songs at any time for as long as you want???

      nahh I'll stick with the 6000 I permanently will have access to and OWN.

      how about the 6 albums a week I encode.... no not lame CD's Those strange black plastic things...

      I collect rare records, and in order to enjoy them I play them ONCE in order to rip them to mp3's..

      many of them I can LEGALLY share on the internet as they are no longer copyrighted.

      nahh, there's no legitimate use for P2P music sharing and unrestricted portable music formats...

      enjoy your restricted life... I'll stay with my unrestricted music access and the car stereo, home stereo, boom box and portables that all play this unrestricted mp3 format.
      • Go ahead and stand up for what you believe in. A court may find that you owe the record company some money... if you belive that you are a modern-day Robin Hood, then maybe someday people will tell their kids stories about you... the one thing that is likely is that if the legal system catches up with you you'll end up a bit poorer.
      • Just how many records do you own from prior to 1923? Isn't that the magic year copyright stops? I'm reasonable close I think, its some time in the early part of this century. I was unaware that they had that many that are a) worth owning, and b) still exist in a playable format.

        I'm kinda surprised that somebody who collects old albums doesn't insist on CD quality audio for the digital masters. I'd figure your a serious audiophile if you collect old/rare albums. Personally, I'd turn each album into a C

      • many of them I can LEGALLY share on the internet as they are no longer copyrighted.


        How do you figure this? Albums haven't been around long enough for the copyrights to expire, so for them to be "no longer copyrighted" they'd have to have been explicitly turned over to the public domain. Have they been?

    • Re:iTunes not actually property! (Score:5, Interesting)

      by sageFool ( 36961 ) on Thursday September 04, 2003 @07:25PM (#6874964) Homepage
      > Wouldn't you like to pay $120 per year and be able
      > to "rent" any 60 songs at any time for as long as
      > you want???

      No I wouldn't. So assuming I am not completely braindead and I pick on average mostly songs that I like, then on average I am going to be paying $2 dollars a year for a single song. Which given that I still listen to music I bought 10 years ago (along with all the music I have bought between then and now) on a regular basis that means if I buy the sweet alubum under this plan that has ten songs, it will cost me $200 dollars in order to listen to it for 10 years. That sounds like a totally Bad Idea[tm] from my point of view.

      I think the only way I would use something like this is if I could pay 10 dollars for a single month then go through as many songs as I could, to try and find cool new music (since as we all know most 'preview' clips kind of suck and it would be nice to hear the whole song in all it's hifi glory before making a decision) then just buy the albums of what I really liked.

      Yar!
      • For a service [easynews.com] that allows me to preview just about anything from just about anywhere. If it's not available right now odds are very great that within six months it will be. I can then audition as many tracks from the album as I like, keep all I want, and the quality is almost always at least 192kbps MP3. And if I really like something I can request a lossless version, and usually have it available for download within a matter of hours.

        I like the Spanish [misia-online.com] and Russian [cdsound.com] stuff the best, although I have discovere

      • Which is preferable depends on your listening habits. Personally, I like to put huge playlists on shuffle and have my own radio station (iPod + Smart Playlists rock for this). I may not listen to the same song twice in a month, and I go through about 70 a _day_. So, that's over 2000 songs a month. Microsoft's plan would suck for me.

        Unless I exploit what I believe is a whole in MS's plan. I could trade in song N-1 for song N+1 while I play song N. Voila, I can listen to every song in their library, with no
        • You have a good point. The good news for you is that Microsoft will likely come up with a plan that works for people with listening habits similar to yours. The standard annual fee is likely targeted at the average person.

    • 60 lousy songs? (Score:4, Insightful)

      by Tau Zero ( 75868 ) on Thursday September 04, 2003 @07:28PM (#6874981) Journal
      I'd be bored silly. That's too low for me by at least an order of magnitude, maybe two. (I am not allergic to novelty and comforted by endless repetition of the familiar, unlike children and some other people who haven't grown up.)

      And if I have to keep paying rent instead of a flat fee, I'll go patronize artists who don't expect lifetime tenure or get huffy when I ask them "So what have you written lately?"

    • Re:iTunes not actually property! (Score:2, Interesting)

      by Anonymous Coward

      It's actually pro-capitalism and pro-innovation. Capitalism works so well because it always encourages companies to come up with a better mousetrap, or in this case a better music distribution system.

      Whew, for a minute I thought your post was serious!

      The further it is from Napster, the less successful it will be. Apple is doing it pretty much right. Or as right as they can, considering.

      The first thing I'd do with this MS BS system is convert it to an .AIFF file and store it on a CDR.

      What if my wa

      • Hahaha. The further it is from Napster (total anarchy with no profits being made by anyone, not even Napster). I wonder how long that will succeed.

        The system I described would actually work better than Napster for most people: All good rips of the songs, excellent selection of songs, no viri, fully legal, it won't get shut down just when people get into it.

    • The fact that the auction has been pulled should convince anyone who has wondered that DRM is the only way for companies to profitably sell music on the internet.

      You can resell CDs, this has been proven time and again, in spite of attempts of labels and artists to prevent this. This fact has not driven the commercial music industry under in spite of the fact that there are used CD stores in every city anyone is interested in living in, which means that they are near everyone in the United States, for

      • Good points. I don't think anyone wants DRM to be the only choice, but it definitely makes sense for most mainstream content providers. I think it will come in the form of a dongle, or some kind of encrypted storage device that may be read only by devices that are authorized by the DRM provider.

        Of course, there will still be some artists, and a lot of people trying to spread the word about their music, who will make non-DRM music readily available.
    • Wouldn't you like to pay $120 per year and be able to "rent" any 60 songs at any time for as long as you want??? ... I know this post sounds pro-Microsoft, but it's actually pro-capitalism and pro-innovation.

      WOW! Another incredible innovation from Microsoft! Someone should apply the same model to, say, DVD rentals! We could call it Netflix!

      • Hmm... radio... + telephone.... let's call it a cordless phone. Too bad everyone waited years before thinking to combine the two and sell it as a cordless (or cellular) phone, even though the two technologies existed adequately in separate form for years.

        Sometimes it takes genius to market an idea that anyone could have had and make it a reality. Haven't you seen those Accenture ads?
        • Hmm... radio... + telephone.... let's call it a cordless phone. Too bad everyone waited years before thinking to combine the two and sell it as a cordless (or cellular) phone, even though the two technologies existed adequately in separate form for years.

          The technologies existed but they were hella expensive. The first cordless phone spectrum was allocated by the FCC in 1980. Ten years later, the cost for a half-way usable cordless was around $500 a pop.

    • Here's an idea I've had, but I don't know how legal it would be. Say someone creates a website, he buys a whole bunch of CD's and lets one user "check out" a CD for the duration (i.e. streams it to only one person), when he is done the CD will be available for someone else to check out. The site could also have multiple copies to satisfy demand, but no more than one person would be listening at one time. Of course, one could save the stream using some tools, but that would be against the TOS. I wonder if th
    • DANGER, WILL ROBINSON! You're a hair's breadth beneath the troll threshold on this one.
      ---
      Where is it written that any organization or business should be guaranteed an unending flow of green? That attitude is about as anti-capitalistic, anti-consumer, anti-innovation and for that matter anti-competitive as I can imagine, and I can imagine quite a lot. Business is supposed to respond to the dictates of the marketplace, not the other way around! And the reason that businesses listen to the market is b
    • Wouldn't you like to pay $120 per year and be able to "rent" any 60 songs at any time for as long as you want???

      But.... Will it work on Linux???

  • eBay policy (Score:3, Informative)

    by dboyles ( 65512 ) on Thursday September 04, 2003 @07:09PM (#6874842) Homepage
    This thread [slashdot.org] addresses the part of eBay's policy that has probably been violated.

    Of course, who's to say eBay didn't just roll over under the pressure? Wouldn't be the first time.

  • Music on Ebay (Score:4, Informative)

    by igabe ( 594295 ) on Thursday September 04, 2003 @07:10PM (#6874858) Homepage
    Just a thought, but I have a feeling that when bidding gets to the thousands of dollars for something worth virtually nothing, Ebay starts to get a little weary.

    I know that I once had the great experience of falling for a new TiBook 1GHZ for only $1500. Bidding went well above that, and Ebay then pulled. Turned out it actually was a scam.

    My guess is that Ebay would happily risk stopping a real auction for the small chance it might be a hoax(instead of vica versa). In this case on the chance the bidders won't back their wagers.

    • Worth = principle (Score:4, Interesting)

      by poptones ( 653660 ) on Thursday September 04, 2003 @08:49PM (#6875420) Journal
      He said the music was to be donated to the EFF. I suspect the people participating in the auction knew full well the track wasn't "worth" anything at all. It's "worth" was in this auction's value as a test case, and that $16,000 would, no doubt, be well used defending this sale (should it have passed) in court.

  • eBay policy (Score:3, Informative)

    by Phroggy ( 441 ) * <slashdot3@@@phroggy...com> on Thursday September 04, 2003 @07:13PM (#6874874) Homepage
    eBay policy [slashdot.org]
  • How many auctions have heard on ebay of the buyers not paying up and trying to trick the seller into shipping to a different address then is posted in his profile and sending payment after shipment is recieved.

    I have a close friend that this happened to when he was selling his Powerbook 867Mhz. The guy didn't pay and tried to get him to ship it to a different address...

    like ANYONE is going ot pay $16k for a song ..

  • Email I received from eBay... (Score:4, Informative)

    by MacJedi ( 173 ) on Thursday September 04, 2003 @07:16PM (#6874892) Homepage
    Got the following at about 3pm today:
    The following listing:

    2555673237 - Double Dutch Bus by Devin Vasquez has been removed from eBay for violating eBay policy. Since this listing was removed, you are not required to complete the transaction.

    For a complete list of eBay's policies, please visit: http://pages.ebay.com/help/sell/item_allowed.html

    Regards,
    Customer Support (Trust and Safety Department) Ebay Inc.

    /joeyo

  • Quote:

    "Within a few days, the petition calling the European Parliament to reject software patentability accumulated 50,000 new signatures."

    Radical New Petition Method: Get everyone who signs to send one dollar. Fight Money with Money! $50,000+ should be able to buy a polititian, right?

  • iTunes (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Sanity ( 1431 ) * on Thursday September 04, 2003 @07:18PM (#6874910) Homepage Journal
    Anyone brave enough to question the distilled coolade that is Apple and anything they touch since coming out with OSX ("ooh, ooh, pretty and Unix, ooh, OOH, AAaahhhh..") might find this [downhillbattle.org] spoof of iTunes to be an amuzing antidote.

    • Re:iTunes (Score:5, Insightful)

      by alset_tech ( 683716 ) on Thursday September 04, 2003 @08:23PM (#6875279) Homepage
      Interestingly, the site mentioned above doesn't seem to take into consideration that artists average about the same 10% margin when their music is sold in a store. The site blames Apple for musicians being treated unfairly, but this has been the case ever since Edison (evil man) sold recordings on lathes and kept ALL the profits.

      I would applaud Apple if they kicked more of the cash to artists, but that's like asking Best Buy to pay a share of their profits to the artist. The distribution channel is not responsible to the artist, the record company is. That's where we should look for reform.

      Dan

    • Comment removed (Score:5, Insightful)

      by account_deleted ( 4530225 ) on Thursday September 04, 2003 @08:56PM (#6875451)
      Comment removed based on user account deletion
      • ...but I think the real comparison is between iTunes and something which, unfortunately, doesn't exist yet - a way people can get music which actively bypasses the middlemen and sells itself on this feature. People are yearning for a way they can buy music that is fair to artists - all this site is trying to explain is that iTunes isn't it, and people should know that.

  • Worms in Power Plants (Score:5, Informative)

    by benjamindees ( 441808 ) on Thursday September 04, 2003 @07:22PM (#6874943) Homepage
    One of the national news broadcasts just had a couple people talking about 'computer problems' as a factor in the East Coast blackout. A transcript of the first few minutes of the outage had technicians complaining that their computers were acting strangely and that they couldn't diagnose the problem because of that.

    The CEO of the company that had the 'original' problem asserted that there must have been systems failures at other sites in order to bring down the entire grid. He said his company alone could not have caused the problems that occurred.

    I wonder if any of the MS worms that were circulating at the time actually were to blame for the outage as has been speculated here before?

    The webcast of the hearing will be available here [house.gov] when it's ready.
    • I wonder if any of the MS worms that were circulating at the time actually were to blame for the outage as has been speculated here before?

      If that's true, than the "MS worms" aren't actually to blame. The admins who left those machines open to the net and who also didn't patch two months ago are to blame.
    • I have a story [slashdot.org] in my journal that was rejected by the editors that covers some of this. Amazingly, the machines are connected to the public internet, and they got hit by Slammer last time around.

  • It's obvious (Score:4, Funny)

    by OYAHHH ( 322809 ) on Thursday September 04, 2003 @07:30PM (#6874993)
    For,

    The bids that the guy was getting for his ITunes song, Double Dutch something or nother, should make the RIAA seriously consider selling all of their music on EBAY.

    Heck, I'm thinking about recording a tune or two for that sorta money.
    • Going once...going twice...sold to the small man with the runny nose for 2.3 million.
      ...
      Ok, the next highest bid was I believe yours, sir, with 2.1 million.
      ...
      Yes, well. Were there any serious bids on this item?

  • Your ruse, your clever trick (Score:3, Funny)

    by Chazman ( 6089 ) on Thursday September 04, 2003 @07:41PM (#6875065) Homepage
    Well, then how about THESE two developers, have you heard anything about them working on the OS X port of OpenOffice???

  • We'll, depending on what they meant, they may be getting what they want.

  • Why use e-bay? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by KalvinB ( 205500 ) on Thursday September 04, 2003 @08:03PM (#6875174) Homepage
    E-bay is a nice place for the exposure if you can't get it anywhere else and don't mind the fees, but what's stopping him from firing up a site and taking bids via e-mail? He's certainly got plenty of attention.

    Considering a 99 million dollar bid was placed it'd also be handy to list all the bids placed allowing people to bid in between in case higher bids fall through. It was also aliviate false inflation.

    No point in putting in a fake high bid if anyone can bid lower.

    It would then also be possible to contact the losing bidders at the end and ask them to donate their bid to the EFF or whatever even though they won't get a crappy song for it.

    Using e-bay doesn't test the legality of anything relevant. It simply tests E-Bay's TOS. Selling it himself would test the legality of selling the iTune.

    Ben
  • 'the Mac version ... Maybe some of the coders among us could lend them a hand?"

    Maybe Taco can lend a hand. He can lead them away from Aqua and into the purity of Violent Purple [slashdot.org].

  • Yet another iTunes Auction... (Score:2, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward
    Seems like soneone saw the first auction and posted another iTunes auction. the experiment continues.

    eBay item=2555862144 [ebay.com]

  • OpenOffice already runs on OS X (Score:5, Informative)

    by penguin7of9 ( 697383 ) on Thursday September 04, 2003 @09:02PM (#6875493)
    OpenOffice already runs on OS X. What they are talking about is a Quartz/Aqua port. But, frankly, why bother? Even if people use Quartz/Aqua APIs, OpenOffice still won't look or behave exactly like a Cocoa-native application, so it really won't be any more "native" than the existing X11 port. Furthermore, Apple's X11 server for OS X is just fine for running software like OpenOffice, it's free, and it's easy to install.

    There probably isn't much interest in the Quartz/Aqua port because there doesn't seem to be much point to it: it's a lot of work and won't behave much differently.

    As OS X becomes more mainstream, the "purity" of its user interface (if you can call the mix of Cocoa and Carbon "pure") will increasingly go away: people will port MFC, Swing, .NET, Gtk+, wxWindows, and FLTK applications to it. OpenOffice on X11 is just another toolkit. What people could spend time more profitably on is cleaning up the few remaining glitches in the integration of X11 with the OS X desktop. Most of those can be done fairly easily, but Apple might consider adding a small X11 extension that would allow people to add OS X-specific features to their X11 applications without a complete rewrite.
    • You make a good point - does OpenOffice already offer an 'Office Toolkit' - a library for doing 'officy' things that one can wrap a native GUI around? That would be keen.

  • FreeDOS if only..... (Score:3, Funny)

    by DeadBugs ( 546475 ) on Thursday September 04, 2003 @09:13PM (#6875541) Homepage
    From Dell I can get FreeDOS, but how do I get Free Dell?

  • Or no OS at all! (Score:3, Interesting)

    by DeadBugs ( 546475 ) on Thursday September 04, 2003 @09:20PM (#6875582) Homepage
    According to Tech Bargains [techbargains.com] You can get a DELL [dell.com] 400SC 2GHz server without an OS for $299. (3.2GHz just $622)

    Not too hard to imagine a cluster of these.

  • Scariest line in the article... (Score:4, Interesting)

    by DCowern ( 182668 ) * on Thursday September 04, 2003 @10:30PM (#6876028) Homepage

    The investigation also found plant computer engineering personnel were unaware of a security patch that prevented the worm from working.

    Now I hate to deride any of my fellow IT workers but does Davis-Besse employ trained monkeys to run their network? Seriously. In addition to being plastered all over Slashdot and every IT news site in the known universe, it was covered extensively on all the major news networks. That's incompetence folks, plain and simple.

    News like this (not to mention the actions of SCO, the RIAA/MPAA keiretsu, and the degredation of freedom in the US through the DMCA, PATRIOT I/II acts, et al.) makes me want to move to the most remote tropical island in the world and set up a benevolent technocracy. Who's with me? :-)

    • Now I hate to deride any of my fellow IT workers but does Davis-Besse employ trained monkeys to run their network?

      Nah, the monkeys' demands were too much in this IT job market. They wanted to be paid in bananas, and by the hour no less.
  • In the eBay EULA under 9. Breach: (c) we believe that your actions may cause financial loss or legal liability for you, our users or us.

    Therefore, if they anticipate the item is going to cause legal wrangling, they'll simply pull it. Perhaps that's the clause we should assume eBay is invoking on the sale of the iTunes file.

    The seller freely admits he's testing his rights of resale, which means they could be challenged in court. I'm guessing this was a good decision for eBay.

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