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Lord of the Rings Media Movies Entertainment

Peter Jackson Says "Hobbit" Movie In The Works 442

Patik writes "'Lord of the Rings' Director Peter Jackson is planning to film 'The Hobbit,' according to this Associated Press article. Jackson, who is currently filming 'King Kong', is waiting for New Line and MGM, the two studios with rights to the film, to battle it out for rights to make the prequel. Jackson also mentions wanting the movie to feel just like the LOTR trilogy, including having Ian McKellen return as Gandalf." (This is better than just hinting.)
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Peter Jackson Says "Hobbit" Movie In The Works

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  • by nokilli ( 759129 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @07:46PM (#8487857)
    No, that wouldn't work at all, would it. Or would it? With the motion-capture technology they've so obviously perfected with Gollum, I could see Ian playing a younger Bilbo. And if memory serves, there aren't any other hobbits in the story, right? I mean, it's The Hobbit, not The Hobbits or Meet The Hobbits (or my favorite, Honey, Look What The Wurm Coughed Up.)
    • by r_cerq ( 650776 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @07:50PM (#8487884)
      Maybe... But having Rhys-Davies playing Gloin (Gimli's father) would be delicios and much more feasible...
    • by Roger Keith Barrett ( 712843 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @07:57PM (#8487937)
      What about Hobbits: The Battle for Endor?
    • by Coz05 ( 516513 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:02PM (#8487977) Homepage
      I think I read in the books that Gandalf found Bilbo to not age at all after he obtained the ring. You'll remember even from the movie that Bilbo talks about not feeling older in terms of physical, but that he felt stretched and I guess old because of the tainted ring?

      Anyways, what I'm saying here is that they can have the guy that played Bilbo play it again. Same character, same looks. I can't wait to see the dwarves :)
      • by rah1420 ( 234198 ) <rah1420@gmail.com> on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:14PM (#8488051)
        You'll remember even from the movie that Bilbo talks about not feeling older in terms of physical, but that he felt stretched and I guess old because of the tainted ring?


        He felt like "butter spread across too much bread" because the Ring was exerting more and more of its power over him, turning him inexorably into what Smeagol ultimately became. Which is part of the reason that Gandalf was most insistent that Bilbo leave the Ring at that point (at the beginning of the Fellowship); later he may not have physically been able to do it.
    • Perfected? (Score:5, Interesting)

      by caitsith01 ( 606117 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:03PM (#8487990) Journal
      With all due respect, I felt that Gollum, while good, was still not perfect. You could blatantly tell that it was a CG effect at times - mainly the way it moved, but in certan shots the details looked a bit artificial to me, too. Jackson, while better than (for instance) Lucas, should also learn to hide his CGI characters in the scenery a little better - sometimes a teaspoon full, artfully placed, is worth so much more than a big shovel load right in your face.

      There were various other places in LOTR where you could clearly see how animated things were. A couple of scenes with Legolas, and the scene where Gandalf leads the fellowship through the giant underground hall come to mind.
      • Re:Perfected? (Score:5, Insightful)

        by damiam ( 409504 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:17PM (#8488071)
        That fact that you noticed only a few out of many hundreds of CG enhancements show just how good a job Weta did.
        • by caitsith01 ( 606117 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:22PM (#8488097) Journal
          Hey, I'm not saying they did a bad job, some of it was frickin amazing, especially the scenery IMHO. I'm just saying that when I hear people talking about how CG actors/sets are now a functional replacement for real actors/sets I can't help but think of those little things I still notice. Elijah Wood may be a stumpy little man-boy, but I never thought "gee, his skin texture looks kinda unrealistic" or "no real man-boy would move like that."

          Plus no-one ever thinks of all the unemployed puppets that CG is producing... Falcor and the cast of Labyrinth (except Bowie) are all queued up down at the unemployment office thanks to Weta.
          • Re:Perfected? (Score:4, Insightful)

            by BigKato ( 683307 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @09:50PM (#8488532)
            Gollum may not have been perfect but one could guess that technology will be better when they actually start working on 'The Hobbit'. Maybe 3-4 years of perfecting and refining the process and better technology will aid the production of 'The Hobbit'.
      • Re:Perfected? (Score:4, Insightful)

        by TobiasSodergren ( 470677 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:20PM (#8488083)
        Can you ever get a perfect Gollum? He didn't exist in the first place; everybody that has read the book have their own mental picture of the creature.

        As for the CG effect.. Tolkien maybe meant him to be a sketchy character.. :p
    • by Cerv ( 711134 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:08PM (#8488016)
      And if memory serves, there aren't any other hobbits in the story, right? At the end when Bilbo returns to the Shire he encounters a number of Hobbits in the process of auctioning off his possessions.
    • Well... Ian Holm is no spring chicken, but they did a good job in Fellowship by taping back his jowls and putting a wig on him. I'd much rather see him reprise his role as Bilbo rather than see another actor try to take his place.

      In any case, this is fantastic news!

    • by Scryer ( 60692 ) on Sunday March 07, 2004 @03:12AM (#8489646)
      Ian Holm has already played the younger Bilbo -- in a flashback we see him finding the Ring and popping it in his pocket as an anguished Gollum screams in the background. I think he had a hand double, but his facial wrinkles were smoothed out by pulling his skin back toward his ears, like a temporary facelift.

      I'm sure he'd find it supremely uncomfortable to undergo this for an entire movie shoot, and I'm not sure it could be sustained for all the necessary camera angles. But of course CGI will have advanced significantly in the two or more years before I'd expect the film rights could be straightened out.
  • Uh oh.. (Score:5, Funny)

    by HullBreach ( 607816 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @07:48PM (#8487872)
    Just so they dont make the Simalarion. That was freaking painful!
    • Re:Uh oh.. (Score:5, Informative)

      by Un0r1g1nal ( 711750 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:06PM (#8488005)
      You have to take into account that this book, and all others that were released by his son were mostly just the notes that Tolkien used in the creation of his world, and for the most part were never intended for publication. If your writing something for yourself you write it completly different then if you are going to write for others to read.

      The Silmarillion is all back-ground to the main story of LOTR, and although hard to get though it certainly gives many insights into the world as a whole. Not one to put into film, but definatly a book for anybody who wants to really get to grips with the works of J.R.R Tolkien
      • Re:Uh oh.. (Score:5, Interesting)

        by Anonymous Coward on Saturday March 06, 2004 @09:08PM (#8488352)
        Not one to put into film

        Isolated by chapter, there are at least 3 decent movies in "The Silmarillion". The material included is as complete as it needs to be, for the most part. You don't need a thick novel to make a film out of - look at all the PK Dick movies out there, or all the movies based on Stephen King short stories.

        On the whole, I think an awesome movie could be made about the War of the Silmarils, though it would require looser boundaries than the LOTR adaptation.

        As for The Silmarillion being a tough read, if people aren't taking into account the nature of the book (which is detailed explicitly in the prologue, notes and appendices) then they aren't reading it to begin with...
      • Re:Uh oh.. (Score:3, Informative)

        by SsShane ( 754647 )
        It's a fantastic audiobook too. Same with the Hobbit audiobook. Audible! [audible.com]
    • Re:Uh oh.. (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Lord of Ironhand ( 456015 ) <arjen@xyx.nl> on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:31PM (#8488146) Homepage
      Personally, I quited liked the Silmarillion. It's not exactly easy reading, but if you keep pen & paper handy and take your time, it can be quite rewarding for those really fascinated by Middle-Earth.

      Though I have to agree that there should never be a Silmarillion movie. The information density in The Silmarillion is much, much higher compared to LotR. If The Silmarillion had been written in the same style as LotR, it would probably be many thousands of pages long. There's no way that can be transformed into a watchable movie.

      Should Peter Jackson really feel the need to make more Tolkien movies even after The Hobbit, I think he should look at the tale of Beren and Luthien (one of the more independent chapters from The Silmarillion, and not as complex as the rest of the book).

      • Re:Uh oh.. (Score:4, Interesting)

        by Coryoth ( 254751 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @10:13PM (#8488625) Homepage Journal
        Should Peter Jackson really feel the need to make more Tolkien movies even after The Hobbit, I think he should look at the tale of Beren and Luthien (one of the more independent chapters from The Silmarillion, and not as complex as the rest of the book).

        Actually, I think the tale of Turin would work equally well. You could even, perhaps, make something useful out of Tuor and the fall of Gondolin.

        There's plenty of material to mine in the Silmarillion, you just have to try to find good ways to isolate out elements of it. Usefully, of course, the more of the independent stories you tell, the more background you end up providing along the way, which allows you to work on the slightly more interwoven tales (the story of Earendil, for instance, would be fantastic, assuming a little bit of established background).

        Jedidiah.

        Jedidiah.
    • Re:Uh oh.. (Score:5, Funny)

      by Lord_Dweomer ( 648696 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @09:48PM (#8488528) Homepage
      " Just so they dont make the Simalarion. That was freaking painful!"

      Funny you should mention this. When I was a freshman in 9th grade, we had to do our first ever research paper for our english class. I chose the Silmarilion as my book, thinking I could make a logical argument about the story in my thesis and be done with it. After a couple weeks hammering through it, I began to hallucinate and think it was part of the torah.

      Seriously, half the book was "and so-and-so begot so-and-so, who later went on and married so-and-so who begot so-and-so". By the time I was done, and my fragile little freshman mind was completely fried from trying to figure this thing out, I had a research paper on how Sauron wasn't evil and everybody else was out to get him. I don't remember how I proved this, but I somehow managed to find enough evidence to back it up. I got an A, and was forever known in that class as "the kid has too much time on his hands". God what I wouldn't give to still have a copy of that paper.

    • Re:Uh oh.. (Score:5, Interesting)

      by mrscorpio ( 265337 ) <twoheadedboy.stonepool@com> on Sunday March 07, 2004 @01:51AM (#8489429)
      Actually, I think doing a three-part Silmarillion trilogy would be awesome

      Part 1 - Principal character: Feanor. It would start with the awakening of the elves and then Orome taking the three elves to Valinor, and where they become kings and then return to middle earth to convince the others to come too. But some (the Sindar) stay (story of Thingol and Melian). Aule teaches the Noldor in craft skill and Feanor creates the Silmarils. Melkor and Ungoliant destroy the two trees. Feanor leads the Noldor out of Aman, kinslaying on Tol Eressa to steal the ships of the Teleri, and then Feanor sneaking away from Fingolfin and his host, making them cross the Helcaraxe. The movie would end with the creation of the Sun and Moon and the fortification of Aman.

      Part 2 - Principal Character: Various men

      Starts with the awakening of men and their migration west and sometimes friendly, sometimes weary relations with the elves, continues on to Dagor Bragollach and the battle of Fingolfin and Morgorth. Next would of course be the story of Beren and Luthien, and then the battle of Unnumbered Tears. Next

      Part 3 - Turin, Tuor, Earendil

      Starts with Turin and the slaying of Glauring. Next the ruin of Doriath chapter. Then comes Tuor's quest for Gondolin and the fall of Gondolin, and then finally, the huge finale, Earendil's quest for Valinor and the following War of Wrath.

      There could even be a Part 4 for the Akallabeth. That would also rock.

      I would rather see those four movies made than the Hobbit actually, but it's not my decision :)

      Chris
  • by (eternal_software) ( 233207 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @07:49PM (#8487874)
    Since he says "I guess MGM's lawyers and New Line's lawyers are going to have a huge amount of fun over the next few years trying to work it all out", I question how long he can wait.

    A "few years" may make the movie seem disjointed from the rest of them. One of the great things about the first three is that noone really aged. If he waits 5+ years to make what is supposed to be a prequel, will those look out of place?
    • by kippy ( 416183 )
      Since Bilbo, Golum and Gandalf are the only characters in all the stories, I don't think that'll be a problem. Bilbo's actor can just be made up not to look older since Bilbo was supposed to be 60. Gandalf is always supposed to look old. Golum is just CG so they can make him look however they want.

      I think the only reason to make it ASAP is cause I really want to see it. :)
      • oh yeah, and Elrond but a little makup can probably take care of an extra 5 years on Agent Smith.
      • by gidds ( 56397 ) <slashdot.gidds@me@uk> on Saturday March 06, 2004 @10:31PM (#8488706) Homepage
        Yes, McKellen and Weaving will be fine, but I doubt Ian Holm would be a good choice for Bilbo. Bilbo is about 51 in The Hobbit, but hobbits are longer-lived than we are, and that's probably equivalent to thirty or so in human terms. There's no way Holm can pass for that sort of age any more!

        Nor do I think that continuity with LOTR is a good argument here. Yes, there he's 'well-preserved' for 111, but there are still some changes, and in the flashback to the finding of the ring, he's made to look younger. I doubt that, several years since that was filmed, they'd be able to keep that up for an entire movie.

        No, I think we'll have to get used to the idea of someone else playing Bilbo. If they choose well, that someone will bring a liveliness and sense of humour to the story which will probably turn out for the best.

        • by Overly Critical Guy ( 663429 ) on Sunday March 07, 2004 @04:28AM (#8489809)
          There's no way Holm can pass for that sort of age any more!

          Uh, he did already, in Fellowship of the Ring. I'd be very surprised if they used a different actor for Bilbo. What's going to happen when you finish watching the Hobbit and then go into Fellowship and see that prologue? Ian Holm's gonna be the one stumbling across the ring in Gollum's cave. He's gonna be the one greeting Gandalf at Bag-End in the beginning. And he's the one Gandalf is going to say "hasn't aged a day."

          Christopher Lee is like 82 freaking years old. If he can last three 3-hour movies playing an evil wizard, I think Ian Holm can stand to be a nervous little burglar running around invisibly.
    • by Xeth ( 614132 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:00PM (#8487960) Journal
      Oh come on, it'll be fine. I mean, it's not like George Lucas lost the vision for Star Wars when he did those prequels!

      Wait...

    • by Ugmo ( 36922 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:14PM (#8488058)
      The only people to appear in both books are:

      Bilbo,
      Gandalf,
      Elrond,
      Gollum

      Gandalf should probably appear older than his post-resurrected self anyway, but not much changed than from the Fellowship. Bilbo should appear roughly the same age as in the Fellowship since the ring preserved him. Elrond should appear more or less exactly the same. Gollum shouldn't be a problem age-wise. If they use the same actors they do need to do it within the next 5 or 6 years, I think.

      Outside that, Legolas and Gimili's parents/relatives are in the movie. They might get the same actors to play the roles of the Elvish King of Mirkwood and one of the Dwarves in the Party.

      I look forward to seeing CG Smaug.

      I do have a concern about the Trolls. They are an important part of the book. Bilbo gains the respect of the Dwarves by defeating them. I hope they are handled well.
      The Trolls should look nothing like the Cave Troll in the Fellowship. They are more like country bumpkins. They have clothes, sacks, ropes and know how to make jelly. They have some kind of civilization. They are stupid but are not animalistic like the trolls in LOTR the movie.

      Oh well. I will wait the 5 or 6 years it takes for the movie to come out to be disappointed.

      • by Anonymous Coward on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:32PM (#8488151)
        Um, hate to break it to you, but Bilbo doesn't "beat" the trolls (though he does find their hidden treasure, which leads to his claiming of Sting and the finding of Glamdring and Orcrist). It's Gandalf who defeats the trolls. He comes back and mimic the trolls voices, getting them to argue. They argue until the sun rises, thereby turning them to stone. Bilbo doesn't really get the respect of the dwarves until Gandalf leaves the party and leaves Bilbo in charge. That's when Bilbo saves their asses in Mirkwood, a couple of times.
      • Wrong (Score:5, Informative)

        by plj ( 673710 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:43PM (#8488202)
        Gloin, Gimli's father, was on both books too - on LotR he appeared during Elrond's council.

        He was even shown in the FotR movie, although he remained silent there.
      • by HBergeron ( 71031 ) on Sunday March 07, 2004 @01:09AM (#8489327)
        Uh, Ugmo, If you hadn't noticed, the Trolls are actually in the first movie - the hobbits take some rest beneath their stoney visages. They don't look like the cave troll, and frankly look more like the soccor-hooligan-sounding trolls that JRRT wrote into the hobbit. The important thing to remember is that the Hobbit was intended as more of a childrens story, there is more comic relief and adventure and less legend and world building. I think one of the trolls names was Bob...
    • Only the Elves... (Score:3, Informative)

      by Kjella ( 173770 )
      This prequel is set 60 years before LotR - so no problem with hobbits, men or such. The only ones would be elves and Gandalf (an istari). But Gandalf looks "timelessly old" and would no doubt do that in 5+ years too. I guess the Elves could be the issue, they're immortals as well. But it'd only be a few characters, and not the main characters. I think it'll be just fine.

      Kjella
  • by Bryan Gividen ( 739949 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @07:49PM (#8487878)
    Seriously, Jackson has set a huge standard for himself here. He has the three movies that progressively got better, ending in a movie that won 11 awards. People's expectations will be high (cough*EpisodeOne*cough) and if he doesn't deliver, it won't matter how good of a movie it is, he's going to get ripped a new one.
  • by xankar ( 710025 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @07:50PM (#8487880) Journal
    In related news, Peter Jackson's home just imploded due to excessive Oscar pressure.
  • by jb_davis ( 732457 ) <jb_spa[ ]charterdotnet ['mat' in gap]> on Saturday March 06, 2004 @07:51PM (#8487887)
    When can I download it?
  • yes!! (Score:3, Interesting)

    by liloconf ( 560960 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @07:51PM (#8487889)
    Is anyone else excited to see what they do with smog? I hope they don't make him look all pupety or over cg'd.
  • by mikeophile ( 647318 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @07:53PM (#8487898)
    While the thought of Bilbo climbing the Empire State Building holding Fay Wray is rather entertaining, I think it might disturb the purists.
  • HSX (Score:5, Informative)

    by thenewnoise ( 668578 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @07:53PM (#8487901)
    its already pretty high on the Hollywood Stock Exchange http://movies.hsx.com/servlet/SecurityDetail?symbo l=HOBIT
  • Proper feel? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Fancia ( 710007 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @07:53PM (#8487904)
    It may just be me, but I don't think that the feel of Lord of the Rings would really suit The Hobbit. The Hobbit is much more of a fairy tale than an epic, unlike Lord of the Rings... I don't think the same presentation, &tc. would really be best for The Hobbit.
    • Re:Proper feel? (Score:5, Interesting)

      by digitalhermit ( 113459 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:13PM (#8488049) Homepage
      Though I thoroughly enjoyed the LOTR movies, I did feel that there was just too much steel and horses; it seemed to "epic" for my taste. The characterization seemed a little lost in all the fighting.

      _The Hobbit_ is different. There are plenty of internal conflicts and chances to develop characters. Though the dwarves are a little (har har) cookie cutter, Bilbo and Gandalf can certainly be fleshed out. I personally think that _The Hobbit_ would be *easier* to make because it has a decent plot (questish, but still decent), enough battle scenes and is sufficiently dark to not alienate LOTR fans. With only a couple central characters, it would be more of an actor's movie.

      Dark? The riddle scenes were, when I first read them, pretty engrossing. With a treatment like that given to Shelob, it would as threatening. There's maybe not as much psychological darkness, but there's lots to be said for physical terror (dragon, trolls, Gollum).

      I don't mean to elevate TH above what Tolkien intended, but I have seen more than a couple papers contrasting/comparing TH with Conrad's "Heart of Darkness" and even Dante's "Inferno". Some of these are stretches, true, but I think that to discount the literary aspect of TH and call it strictly a fairy tale would be a disservice to Tolkien.
      • Re:Proper feel? (Score:5, Insightful)

        by Fancia ( 710007 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:19PM (#8488075)
        I mean no disrespect for fairy tales. Rather, I have great respect for them; there's much more to fairy tales than you give them credit for.

        Fairy tales are the centre of quite a lot of literary study, for there's often much more depth than there seems to be on the surface. Certainly, one of my favourite novels and films, The Last Unicorn, is clearly a fairy tale while also being a great piece of literature.

        No, I'd say that The Hobbit is very much a fairy tale; and very much literary, as well. The two are not exclusive.

  • McKellen Up For It (Score:5, Informative)

    by BlightThePower ( 663950 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @07:57PM (#8487934)
    For USian readers, Sir Ian has appeared on a number of chat shows recently promoting RoTK and other recent films of his. He was directly asked about his willingness to appear in "The Hobbit" should it be filmed and basically came across as absolutely desperate to do it and said something along the lines of "fingers crossed Peter Jackson will do it". So there you are. No word from Holm as far as I know though.
  • The Problem (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Hobbex ( 41473 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:01PM (#8487967)
    The problem, as I see it, is that there will be a lot of pressure to make this movie bigger and better than then the previous three. But it shouldn't be: The Hobbit is a smaller story in every sense. Trying to "out do" LOTR with it's story would destroy it completely - it is a really just one small adventure in a very big world.

    Don't get me wrong, it is a great story, and if done right it could be a great movie, but if it made along the lines of "Now we have better computers and can have ten times more people at the final battle" then that would destroy it (and the continuity).

    In that sense, I think trying to make something out of the stories in The Silmarrilion would be better (those battles really were bigger) - but obviously brining that to the screen would involve basically filling a story around the history told in the book. And I doubt the movie rights were ever sold, or that Christoffer Tolkien would not.
    • Re:The Problem (Score:5, Insightful)

      by theMightyE ( 579317 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:25PM (#8488119)
      I think trying to make something out of the stories in The Silmarrilion would be better (those battles really were bigger) - but obviously brining that to the screen would involve basically filling a story around the history told in the book.

      I see your point, but still have to disagree that The Simarrilion would be a better basis for a movie than The Hobbit. The Simarrilion was dripping with exactally the kind of complex histories, tangled family lines, and generally convoluted plots that Jackson et al worked so hard to remove from LOTR to make it watchable by the general public (i.e. people like my sister who had never read the books).

      The hobbit on the other hand has a well-defined group of heros who go on an interesting walk thru the woods and see some nifty stuff along the way. And as for the 'better computers means more people in the final battle' thing, I'd hope the technology would scale well enough to do the battle of five armies justice - that'd just be plain cool.

    • Re:The Problem (Score:4, Insightful)

      by tuffy ( 10202 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:44PM (#8488213) Homepage Journal
      The problem, as I see it, is that there will be a lot of pressure to make this movie bigger and better than then the previous three. But it shouldn't be: The Hobbit is a smaller story in every sense. Trying to "out do" LOTR with it's story would destroy it completely - it is a really just one small adventure in a very big world.

      The execs are getting a movie with trolls, orcs (goblins), eagles, Beorn, a dragon and a battle of five armies. I expect that'll be "epic" enough to suit them and the audience without straying far from the source material.

      Not to mention Peter Jackson will have as much (or more) creative control this time around.

  • by Cerv ( 711134 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:02PM (#8487982)
    You know it makes sense.
  • That is too bad. (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:03PM (#8487983)
    The previously-made hobbit cartoon really was absolutely excellent for what it was, I think it deserves to remain the "precursor" to the LOTR film trilogy. Meanwhile, a hobbit movie would not be able to live up to the LOTR trilogy; the events that take place in The Hobbit are much smaller scale than the LOTR trilogy, and so they couldn't top themselves.

    I'd like to see someone find a worthy writer, hand them one of the stories from one of the Books of Lost Tales or one of Tolkien's other nearly-finished works, say "here, clean this up and turn it into something we can use as a screenplay", and make a movie out of it.
  • by TechnoConfucius ( 550387 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:06PM (#8488008)
    I don't know how much there is the The Hobbit as a movie - it's not on the epic scale of any of the LOTR trilogy, and is pretty linear as a tale. How about interspersing scenes from the Hobbit with the "missing scenes" from LOTR when Frodo and co get back to the Shire and find Saruman as the new leader! Basically - make the film a prequel and sequel. I think it would work really well, (apart from in ROTK you already know the final conclusion of Frodo sailing away from the Havens).
  • budget? (Score:3, Funny)

    by Demon of the fall ( 651054 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:07PM (#8488013)
    Considering the lack of massive war scenes in "The Hobbit", maybe they'll be able to make the movie for a sum smaller than the EU's 10 year budget?
  • by geekoid ( 135745 ) <dadinportland&yahoo,com> on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:08PM (#8488024) Homepage Journal
    The Hobbit elves:
    "Fa, la, la, la lolly"

    LoTR elves:
    "Are time is done, woes."

    Las Vegas Elvis:
    "Do you take the woman to be your lawfully wedded wife"

    San Fransisco Elvis:
    "Do you take the woman to be your lawfully wedded husband"

    Elvis Costello:
    "Hey man, leave me out of you dumb Elvish thing."

    Abbot and Castello:
    "Who's on first..."

    and so on
  • by acvh ( 120205 ) <`geek' `at' `mscigars.com'> on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:14PM (#8488053) Homepage
    if Liv Tyler lives in Laketown and is given credit for killing Smaug I'm out of there.....
  • by caitsith01 ( 606117 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:17PM (#8488069) Journal
    On the subject of Peter Jackson, is there anyone else who feels that, in hindsight, the LOTR trilogy was maybe not quite as great as it could have been? I mean, I'm not going to say it sucked or anything ridiculous like that, it was well made, and had competent acting etc., but overall it left me feeling a bit empty. The first movie was great - no doubt about it. There were fewer characters/factions so the plot was more tightly focused on their development and personal experiences. There were fewer ridiculously huge battle scenes and correspondingly less CG work. And overall, the script felt a lot tighter than the other two movies, especially the last one.

    Overall, while I enjoyed the movies, I would question some of the following:
    - the character acting/development: maybe not bad, but the actors weren't given much to work with at times
    - the script to the last movie: too scattered, trying to cram everything in without ever really coming together neatly in a form palatable for a movie
    - the pacing: considering what was cut, there were some ridiculously ponderous bits and other parts where whole swathes of the book were glossed over in a couple of seconds
    - the feeling that, by the end, Jackson is just telling someone elses story rather than presenting us with a piece of work in its own right. This combined with decisions to reduce Saruman's role and symbolism hurt the broader themes of the trilogy for me.

    I wonder if, perhaps in desperation after what Lucas (*hiss* *hiss* tool of the devil!) and the Warchowskis heaved out this past few years we were all just so damn relieved that the LOTR movies didn't totally blow that we all got a bit carried away?

    Thoughts? Flames?

    PS

    I still expect the Hobbit would rock - based on the above, I think it would be much better suited to Jackson's directing style, with more opportunity for strong character work and humour that is actually meant to be there.
    • Yeah, my sentiments exactly. I think that the complexities of the trilogy showed Jackson as a master administrator -- it's amazing that a project of such scope didn't fall apart as the Matrix sequels did -- but I agree that portions seemed too overblown.

      In some movies you get the idea that the characters are secondary to the plot and the visual. FOTR showed many sides to the characters but these tend to be missing in the latter films. Not that they weren't there, only that the battle was bigger. It felt as
    • by HeghmoH ( 13204 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:38PM (#8488186) Homepage Journal
      Personally, after surviving horrors like Starship Troopers, any time a movie adaptation of a favorite book comes out and doesn't totally stink, I'm really happy. Although really, LotR was great. I loved all three of them. Maybe in some perfect world they could have been better, but I think that what we got is about as good as possible in the real world. As much as I would like every movie adaptation to be like Fight Club, I know that it's impossible and it doesn't stop me from enjoying a great but imperfect adaptation.
      • by caitsith01 ( 606117 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:42PM (#8488200) Journal
        Ah, so torn - you loved Fight Club, yet hated Starship Troopers!

        I know ST was a violent affront to the book, but I tend to view it thus: it was so different it was really not an adaptation at all. I mean, in the book they barely even fight any bugs. As a schlock sci-fi movie with a ridiculous budget, ST has got to be one of the most entertaining movies I've seen, however - kinda like From Dusk Till Dawn in space.

        Speaking of Fight Club, am I insane? Why do so many people hate/dislike this movie? It *is* startlingly great, right? And as an adaptation of a book, it couldn't be better done. As the author said, he felt slightly foolish after he saw how good the movie was, he felt the book didn't do it justice.
    • by MuParadigm ( 687680 ) <jgabriel66@yahoo.com> on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:44PM (#8488211) Homepage Journal

      Not a flame, just wondering if you've seen the extended edition of The Two Towers? While I agree that the cinematic cut of FOTR was the best the three cinematic cuts, The Two Towers EE is far more well structured than the theatrical version. It even *feels* shorter, despite being 45 minutes longer.

      So, I'm waiting for the extended edition of ROTK before commenting on the series as a whole.

      • A fair point, and I'm ashamed to say I haven't seen the EE despite being told by several people that I would like it better. I will make a point of doing so, and I'm also waiting to see exactly what was cut from ROTK and how it might all hang together. Now I just need to find a spare 12 hours...
    • by Jugalator ( 259273 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @09:58PM (#8488557) Journal
      - the character acting/development: maybe not bad, but the actors weren't given much to work with at times
      - the script to the last movie: too scattered, trying to cram everything in without ever really coming together neatly in a form palatable for a movie
      - the pacing: considering what was cut, there were some ridiculously ponderous bits and other parts where whole swathes of the book were glossed over in a couple of seconds
      - the feeling that, by the end, Jackson is just telling someone elses story rather than presenting us with a piece of work in its own right. This combined with decisions to reduce Saruman's role and symbolism hurt the broader themes of the trilogy for me.


      I'll wait for the Extended Edition and its 40 extra minutes before saying anything about ROTK. The EE's for the former parts were excellent IMHO and often added "calmer" scenes when there was much action in the movies, to balance things.

      I think the Theatre Editions are mostly just unfortunate side effects of giving the audience (and the movie company) something easier to swallow and not how PJ truly intended the movies to be watched... The TE's are there to satisfy as many as possible, the EE's are there to satisfy fans like you and me who enter discussions at Slashdot with movie analyses. :-)
    • Wait... (Score:5, Insightful)

      by gidds ( 56397 ) <slashdot.gidds@me@uk> on Saturday March 06, 2004 @10:04PM (#8488579) Homepage
      IKWYM, but I think it's wrong to judge the films on the theatrical versions alone.

      I know that traditionally, the theatrical version has been the 'definitive' one, and that DVD extras have been add-ons thrown in quickly to make up the weight. However, despite PJ's comments a few months ago, IMO the definitive versions of LOTR are really the extended DVD editions. They have better pacing, a more coherent plotline, lots of telling details -- in short, the story is given more room to breathe, and works all the better for it.

      So please don't judge ROTK until you've seen the EE. If the first two are anything to go by, I suspect we'll see a lot more character development (hopefully involving Denethor's corruption, and Faramir's and Eowyn's recoveries, and maybe more of Aragorn, as well as Saruman's closure), better explanation and progression of the plot, better pacing, and more balance in the grand themes and symbolism. Calling the theatrical versions 'edited highlights' would be unfair, but perhaps it wouldn't be that far from the truth. It's amazing what PJ managed to pack into each 3-hour slot; but the EEs are more amazing still.

      Of course, even the EE won't be perfect. There are still flaws, awkward issues and disappointments. But despite those, I think LOTR is a magnificent achievement, wonderful to watch and better than we had any right to hope for.

      BTW, I wonder if his may be the start of a deep change in the industry, where what you see in the cinema is no longer seen as the most important part of moviemaking, and where DVD &c editions may come to take on equal or greater importance overall.

    • by AeroIllini ( 726211 ) <`moc.liamg' `ta' `inilliorea'> on Saturday March 06, 2004 @10:23PM (#8488671)
      My opinion is that yes, the LOTR movies really were that good. In the context of highly anticipated trilogies such as LOTR, Matrix, or the SW Prequels, much of a viewer's impression of the movie is based on the hype. How can it not be, when our entire society is oversaturated with tie-in crap? That being said, take a step back from the films and pretend that you have never heard of LOTR before seeing them, and look at them objectively as book adaptations. On that score, they succeeded.

      The sheer amount of technical work that went into the movies to create a completely believable world is mind-boggling. A great deal of skill also went into turning a dense, rambling, laboring, symbolist epic into a screen adaptation without losing any of its power, grace, or richness. Jackson struck exactly the right chord with most audiences: his version was easy to follow by people who didn't know the books, yet so chock-full of information as to satisfy even the most die-hard fans of the books.

      No movie will ever live up to hype. Ever. Our minds can create expectations that will never be exceeded by the director. Where a movie succeeds despite the hype is how it seems later, when the roar has died down. Rewatching the LOTR films, I get more out of them every time. I pick up on more subtle plot points. I see character relationships I didn't notice before. I see small details. The picture gains depth.

      Contrast this rewatching with something like The Matrix trilogy, or the Star Wars Prequels. Every time I rewatch Episodes I and II, I cringe. They are worse with every viewing, far removed from the gee-whiz special effects hype. The original Matrix movie holds up well, but that was back when the Wachowskis were trying to prove themselves. Reloaded still seems ok, although the mythology is a little cheapened, and the pacing is plodding. I don't like rewatching Revolutions at all, because it's far too over-the-top. There's no substance.

      Do the LOTR movies stand as a work on their own? Well, yes and no. On the one hand, they can't be considered their own work: they are an adaptation of another work. But on the other hand, they are well executed and digestable by people who have not read the books.

      *Disclaimer: I refuse to comment on whether or not Return of the King deserved best picture, either by its own right or as a proxy for the entire trilogy. The five movies nominated were so totally and utterly diverse that comparing them to each other would be a waste of time. There was no "single winner" in that category this year.
  • by chowdmouse ( 155597 ) <ed.murphy@sstar.com> on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:25PM (#8488116)
    How many ending will this one have?
    • by Brandybuck ( 704397 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @09:06PM (#8488344) Homepage Journal
      Glad you asked. I have it on good authority (a friend of a friend of the nanny of some "cute Hobbit children") that there will be only five endings:

      1) Saying goodbye to Thorin. A bittersweet moment, after which the screen goes dark.

      2) Saying goodbye to Bard and the Lakemen. A bittersweet moment, after which the screen goes dark.

      3) Saying goodbye to the Mirkwood elves. A bittersweet moment, after which the screen goes dark.

      4) Saying goodbye to Beorn. A bittersweet moment, after which the screen goes dark.

      5) Saying goodbye to Elrond. A bittersweet moment, after which the screen goes dark.

      Fans of the Hobbit will, of course, be outraged that Peter Jackson didn't film the auction of Bagend. "It's totally changes the whole theme of the story," one fan protests.
  • Okay (Score:5, Funny)

    by cubicledrone ( 681598 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @08:47PM (#8488228)
    two studios with rights to the film, to battle it out for rights to make the prequel.

    In other words, waiting for eight dozen corporate executives and lawyers to agree who gets paid how much and when?

    Buy the book.
  • by quantaman ( 517394 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @09:04PM (#8488334)
    One thing I always wonder when I hear about them planning to do the hobbit is how the heck they'll deal with the ring. It's been a while since I read the Hobbit but I don't remember much of anything about the ring that would suggest it being a super evil thingamabob that is the center of the dark lords power I mean anyone who hasn't read the book but has seen LOTR is going to take one look at gollum and the ring and think of nothing else for the end of the movie, "Hrm, I wonder when gollum will pop out, hrm wonder if the ring will start being evil now".

    Other than gandalf going on for about 5 minutes saying "yeah interesting ring and that gollum creature sounded neat, maybe it will be important in the future but I garuntee that absolutely nothing else will happen with respect to either until long after our adventure is done." I can't see how they'll possibly deal with the ring. Are there people here who read the Hobbit after reading LOTR and remember their reactions? Any ideas how they might deal with the ring?
    • by Speare ( 84249 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @10:29PM (#8488695) Homepage Journal
      The Ring is always "evil" but it's biding its time. The Ring's maker, the Necromancer (aka Sauron), has been attacked and chased back to Mordor, where he begins regaining power. That's what Gandalf is busy with, when he's not actually following the Burglar Bilbo and the Dwarrow Quest. That's also why there seem to be few repercussions for Bilbo to wear the ring occasionally.

      It's only when Gollum researches the origins of his Precious, in order to find it again, that the name 'Baggins' is brought to the attention of Sauron. Gollum is caught and then released, whereupon he found and carefully evaded Shelob... both escapes for a price.

    • by gidds ( 56397 ) <slashdot.gidds@me@uk> on Saturday March 06, 2004 @10:38PM (#8488732) Homepage
      But that's the point. The Ring didn't appear particularly evil when first used; that's why it's such a shock to Frodo in LOTR to find out its origin.

      (Of course, there were suspicious circumstances attached to it: Gollum's extreme possessiveness; its magical nature; Bilbo hiding it and then lying about its origin. Gandalf was suspicious of it from the first; in the film, maybe a few telling glances from him could speak volumes.)

      That's often the nature of evil; it's deceptive and can appear perfectly innocent at first. (I know Tolkien didn't intend any direct allegories in his work, but occasional resonances like that do happen.)

    • by Sabalon ( 1684 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @11:37PM (#8488978)
      It should be used as in the book - a harmless trinkit that makes Bilbo invisible. The story is not about the ring, which wasn't really in the picture as being this huge ring of power when Tolkien wrote the book. The story is about Biblo going from some weed-smoking country boy to an adventurer.

      As long as we don't have to listen to Elrond going on about how man can't handle things. :)
  • by Sleetan ( 679171 ) * on Saturday March 06, 2004 @09:07PM (#8488350)
    Does anything in the article ever say a movie is in the works except for a presumptuous title and some anon AP writer? No.

    It says two film studios have conflicting rights and are battling to see whose rights take precedence.

    It says "if he were going to direct the movie" he would this... "I'd want Ian McKellen"... more *IF* statements.

    Of course the studios want the movie made. Prequal to an 11 Oscars film? $$$

    What the article basicly says is that there *isn't* a movie in the works. If it were in the works, and Peter Jackson was to direct it, he'd "like" this done this way or that way....

    I saw absolutely no quotes where he said anything about something being "done".

    This has offered no new information and just regurgitated wants and hopes and I resent being so happily drawn here by the RSS feed I saw it on.

    Sleet
  • by pacodease ( 687074 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @09:24PM (#8488432) Homepage
    Not sure if anyone else saw this, but a few months back I found what looked like a poor-quality leeked trailer for The Hobit on Kazaa or Bittorrent. It had most of the same characters, a few borrowed scenes, and what looked like new scenes, including CG of the dragon.

    Anyone else see this, or know anything about it?
  • by CadmannWeyland ( 609987 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @09:55PM (#8488545) Homepage
    Considering that "The Hobbit" became a prequel to "The Lord of the Rings", one could consider the possibility of which LOTR characters / actors could appear in "The Hobbit".

    From The Book
    - Bilbo - Ian Holm
    - Gandalf - Ian McKellen
    - Elrond - Hugo Weaving
    - Gollum / Smeagol - Andy Serkis

    Possible LOTR Characters Cameos
    - Legolas - Orlando Bloom (Legolas is the son of King Thranduil of Mirkwood (the Elvenking of "The Hobbit"))
    - Arwen Evenstar - Liv Tyler (daughter of Elrond, but stayed at Lothlorien at times - unlikely to appear, but it could make an appearance)
    - Aragorn / Strider - Viggo Mortenson (Aragorn was raised in Rivendell, and so could make an appearance. He's known in "The Fellowship of the Ring" to be good friends with Bilbo)
    - Barliman Butterbur - David Weatherley (though Bree is not mentioned, I believe, Bilbo and company could easily pass through Bree as its on the way)
    - Other LOTR Elves - most any could show again if desired

    Unlikely To Appear
    - LOTR Hobbits - mostly all too young
    - Gimli - probably too young or not born, as Gloin, Gimli's father, is described, I believe, as a young dwarf in "The Hobbit". On the other hand, dwarves are long lived (compared to humans) and so what's "young"? Hobbits came of age in their 30's or 40's (can't remember which off the top of my head).

    Others?

    Cadmann
  • by Open Council ( 704163 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @10:41PM (#8488744) Homepage
    back in the far distant past the BBC did a 53hr [yes 53 hours] radio dramatisation of Lord of the Rings with a young Ian Holm as Frodo Baggins. Thats probably why he got the part of Bilbo in the movie.

    Yes he could carry off the part of Bilbo in the Hobbit but he would require a lot of care to stay healthy at the age he might be by the time the movie gets to be finally made.

    two outside possibilities would be Bob Hoskins or Armin Shimerman [Quark in DS9}
  • Dammit! (Score:3, Interesting)

    by ericdfields ( 638772 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @10:55PM (#8488795) Homepage
    I was hoping that this would fall through. The Hobbit is nothing like LOTR in terms of themes and parallels with life. It's a fairy tale, with elves and goblins (or whatever rode the wargs in the Hobbit... Orcs i guess?) and dragons and the such. The ring was never hinted as being a _bad_ thing necessarily in The Hobbit, other than the fact that Gollum seemed to act a little strange in its presence. It certainly wasn't a metaphor for the corruption associated with greed and capitalism as it was in LOTR..... When I first read the Hobbit, it more or less manifested itself as a surreal CG fairy tale in my head. It started out with 12 or so dwarves who, unlike Gimli in the movie, wore colored hoods and were very quick-witted and bubbly. the Trolls after that were these enormous dopey monsters, very comical and dumb. Then the elves... nothing like the 6'+, slender, statue-esque figures of Jacksondom at all. I pictured them being more like Santa Claus's elves, with weird little hats and elongated limbs and such... strange and playful, not serious and meloncholy. IMHO, the realization of The Hobbit in the CG cutscenes of the video game I saw advertised are much more on the mark. Superdeformed FFVI characters and the like, and the cartooniness just seemed to make a lot more sense. If Jackson pursues this as he wonderfully did with the trilogy, i fear it can only end in a complete fabrication of anything resembling the original story. It just _can't_ work in live action with these overly serious, forlorn elves (they're my biggest worry, if you couldn't tell). Think Pete reads /.?
  • by Sabalon ( 1684 ) on Saturday March 06, 2004 @11:45PM (#8489015)
    If they are gonna try to get the Ian's (Bilbo and Gandalf) they had best get a move on before something happens - they are neither getting any younger. The only other person who would need to return would be Hugo Weaving (Elrond), but I don't think he'd change too much over a couple years.

    Of course, Andy Serkis would need to reprise Gollum, but he should look about the same, even though time hasn't been good to him so far :)

    I do wonder if they would want Ian Holm as Bilbo or not. While I think he did a great job in LotR, the filming of another movie where he is the main role may take quite a toll on him.

    Also, I would think they would want to try to reuse The Shire set that they built before it gets overgrown with weeds. And there is also the Rivendell set which they should probably reuse.

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