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Education Software Linux

Indiana Schools May Purchase 300K Linux Computers 299

Posted by Zonk from the that's-a-lot-of-tux dept.
GuitarNeophyte writes "According to an article at PC Magazine, Indiana School systems may soon be purchasing around 300,000 Linpire desktop computers. Linspire, via its Education Program has a straight $500-per-school (not per-seat) cost, providing an incredibly-alluring price incentive for this to happen." From the article: "Many schools across the state have already had the chance to try out desktop Linux, and everyone seems excited to get this program going...This groundbreaking initiative makes it possible for schools to afford computers for every student, something that makes a huge impact on their overall educations."
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Indiana Schools May Purchase 300K Linux Computers More

Indiana Schools May Purchase 300K Linux Computers

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  • 300K? (Score:2, Funny)

    by iminplaya ( 723125 )
    For a Linux box?? How much does SCO get?
    • > 300K? For a Linux box?? How much does SCO get?

      $0 and instructions on how to come up with a semi-original joke.

  • And this means... (Score:3, Funny)

    by unixmaster ( 573907 ) on Saturday August 06, 2005 @02:40PM (#13259384) Journal
    Possible 300K KDE deployments ... Those K just goes fine ;-)

  • Yes, but... (Score:2, Funny)

    by isecore ( 132059 )
    does it run Linux?

    Oh, wait...

  • It worked for autodesk (Score:4, Insightful)

    by grozzie2 ( 698656 ) on Saturday August 06, 2005 @02:42PM (#13259401)
    Autodesk saw the schools as a 'market builder' early on. When I did my second stint in post secondary institutions (pc's were not common during the first), the school had a site license for AutoCad, and we all got copies to take home and use on our own pc.

    A whole crop of sudents entered the workforce at a time when the move to CAD was in it's infancy, all familiar with, and able to use AutoCad. They were put in charge of the move to automation, and they all purchased AutoCad when they entered industry.

    A very effective marketing strategy for a company looking beyond the next quarter.

    • Re:It worked for autodesk (Score:4, Interesting)

      by techno-vampire ( 666512 ) on Saturday August 06, 2005 @02:46PM (#13259430) Homepage
      A very effective marketing strategy for a company looking beyond the next quarter.

      You mean like Apple's been using to get Macs into classrooms and get kids hooked on using them instead of PCs?

      • I suspect that the whole Mac at school -> Mac at home thing never really caught on because they're SO FUCKING EXPENSIVE.
        • I believe this never really caught on because kids don't have a couple grand. Their parents are going to buy what sits on their desk at work, not what their kid uses to IM their friends with at school.

          Timmy: Daddy, I want an Mac.
          Daddy: Single button mice? When I was a kid we didn't even have mice. We didn't even have lower case. You're getting a C-64 and you'll LOAD "*" ,8,1 and you'll like it.
    • A very effective marketing strategy for a company looking beyond the next quarter.

      It seems to have worked fantastically for Apple, but that might not be a fair comparison.

      On the other hand, the earlier we start teaching kids about what the Lesser GPL is, why they need libxml2 instead of libxml1, and why all of their productivity apps are at version 0.99.91, the more comfortable they will be with these otherwise-daunting concepts.

      Kidding, but only half so.

  • Let me know when... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by DogDude ( 805747 ) on Saturday August 06, 2005 @02:42PM (#13259402)
    ... when it actually happens. A PR release from the company trying to sell their stuff isn't exactly news; it's marketing.
    • Let me know when...it actually happens. A PR release from the company trying to sell their stuff isn't exactly news; it's marketing.

      Good man, this is an example of Good PR, then.

      School directors, teachers and students will simply see a lot of positive response from various news sources, including slashdot, and that will help them to make a Good decision.

  • Why linspire?... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by tregetour ( 903016 ) on Saturday August 06, 2005 @02:43PM (#13259406) Homepage
    ...ubuntu or such would free, even cheaper no?
    • Linspire has a nice update service which might be more attractive than the free update services from ubuntu.
    • ...ubuntu or such would free, even cheaper no?

      They're buying the Linspire licences and the hardware it's running on. The summary title is literal. They are buying 300,000 computers for $500 per school.
      • They are buying 300,000 computers for $500 per school.

        Never trust a Slashdot title.

        TFA says:
        Linspire offers its Linux-based OS to schools for an annual
        licensing fee of $500 (with no per-unit installation costs) through its Education Program, according to the program Web site.


        Wintergreen Systems is selling them the hardware.
        • Looking at the press release [linspire.com] for the program they say they are going to provide PC's. The PC Magazine writeup seems real confusing, because they keep mentioning Wintergreen and Linspire together and talking about how many more PC's will be in schools.

          The Indiana Access Program is designed to provide affordable classroom computers for every secondary student. This program makes these systems available with the partnership of Indiana-based companies, benefiting the local Indiana economy. Wintergreen Systems,

  • Way to go (Score:2, Insightful)

    by perlwolf ( 903757 )
    Way to go. Good to know there are smart people other than Munich's officials.
  • I know most schools don't operate in class computers and labs in a traditional Windows Domain environment, most of the time running as stand alone workstations. Provided the right setup of these systems, it could be great for them. Not only can they lock the systems down from students, they also remove most of the chance for spyware and other malware. Best of luck to them.

  • Tomorrow's post -- Indiana buys MS (big discounts) (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Blahbooboo3 ( 874492 ) on Saturday August 06, 2005 @02:44PM (#13259420)
    ...MS provided steep discounts to Indiana schools for their purchase of Microsoft software
    • Microsoft has had deals for years with IU, IUPUI, Purdue, Ball State, et al. for their products. Basically, you get all their products in a few different packs for $5 each. Everyone I know in Indianapolis got their XP from an IUPUI student. Viral marketing at its finest...heh.
      • At my college, through the MSDNAA program, we get practically any Microsoft program you can think of for free (by which, of course, I mean it was included in our tuition). This includes XP, Office, Visual Studio, etc.

      • Re:MS already $5 at universities (Score:5, Informative)

        by Trelane ( 16124 ) on Saturday August 06, 2005 @03:46PM (#13259766) Journal
        Microsoft has had deals for years with IU, IUPUI, Purdue, Ball State, et al. for their products. Basically, you get all their products in a few different packs for $5 each.

        My school has this sweet deal too. Just a few niggling details:

        If you follow the money trail, my school takes somewhere between USD30 and USD70 (or maybe more) from my fees (not tuition; the campus usage fees) per semester for the campus student licenses. So we're actually paying somewhere between USD240 and USD560 before the up-front costs (USD5 for Windows XP upgrade; USD6 or 10 for Office full version). The campus tour guides never seem to mention this point when they're talking about the program, and all the students and parents I've talked to about it had no idea these funds were being taken and sent straight to Microsoft for the software.

        Additionally, your Windows is an upgrade copy of Windows only. That means that you must already have a Windows license (though it doesn't seme to check for this in any way; nice if MSFT is gonna come back and audit you to push you to License 7.0). This makes the Windows side of the license practically useless--the version of Windows you have likely works just fine for what you use it, and chances are pretty good you already have XP home, if not pro! Luckily, the MS Office and VStudio, tmk, are full versions, so it's not as useless. But whatever you got with your computer is probably just fine and works for you (nice for Microsoft if you have a competitor of theirs!) Finally, the academic prices are already dirt-cheap (relatively speaking). I don't think the MS site license is really very useful in terms of cheapening software acquisition costs!

        Finally, you cannot keep the license if you don't graduate. That's right; if you quit for a while or if you're kicked out, you lose your license. Not nearly as sweet a deal as the academic price, now is it?

        There are other problems with it from the university side, including problems if they ever want to stop paying Microsoft because maybe they want to standardize on Keynote or OpenOffice or something (long, expensive audit there!), but these are most of the immediately visible student-side problems.

    • Mod parent up!

      I'm jaded by these PR stunts. Wake me up when they actually end up buying the Linux boxen! Till then, it is just a ploy to get super-steep discounts from Microshaft.

  • A hard disk failure every hour, $200,000 per hour (Score:5, Insightful)

    by goombah99 ( 560566 ) on Saturday August 06, 2005 @02:46PM (#13259429)
    500K cheap linux boxes. This is going to be a massive number of hard drive crashes and system rebuilds per day. Why the heck dont schools use thin clients to servers. Or at least use some of those multi-headed configurations that can seat four students per box. Even the power bill makes this attractive. 500K * 200 watts = 100 Megawatts of power at 10 cents a kilowatt hour is $100,000 dollars per hour to operate. In winter time this might offset the cost of heating if they can distribute the heat, but the rest of the year the cooling costs to offset this heat load will double the operating cost. (since it usually takes one watt of cooling to offset 1 watt of heat generation) so $200,000 per hour of operation. Now imagine you had a four headed system. it would cut this cost by half to a third. Will Linspire Netboot. If not they are going to have a lot of corrupt systems to fix every day. yikes!

    • $20,000 per hour (Score:3, Informative)

      by goombah99 ( 560566 )
      oops, dropped a decimal point! make that $20,000 per hour to operate.

      500K cheap linux boxes. This is going to be a massive number of hard drive crashes and system rebuilds per day.

      Why the heck dont schools use thin clients to servers. Or at least use some of those multi-headed configurations that can seat four students per box. Even the power bill makes this attractive.

      500K * 200 watts = 100 Megawatts of power at 10 cents a kilowatt hour is $10,000 dollars per hour to operate. In winter time this migh

      • Re:$20,000 per hour (Score:3, Informative)

        by Vellmont ( 569020 )

        500K * 200 watts = 100 Megawatts of power at 10 cents a kilowatt hour is $10,000 dollars per hour to operate. In winter time this might offset the cost of heating if they can distribute the heat, but the rest of the year the cooling costs to offset this heat load will double the operating cost. (since it usually takes one watt of cooling to offset 1 watt of heat generation)
        You're off on your estimates of every single number. It's 300,000 machines, not 500,000. A PC uses about 60 watts of power, and LCD mo
      • Why the heck dont schools use thin clients to servers.

        I'll keep you posted. I am working with a school that is changing out their W2k-based network for Sun thin clients -- 20 thin clients per server. The numbers look really interesting. The first phase of the installs should be done by end of September. If all things go well, the entire school (labs, computers in classrooms and administrative computers) will be thin clients within two years.

    • Will Linspire Netboot.

      It is Linux, yes. See below.

      If not they are going to have a lot of corrupt systems to fix every day. yikes!

      As if the other OS would not? I think they are on the right track, make the PCs cheap and get an easy to load OS for when it happens recovery is cheap, simple and fast. If it is stolen, cheaper to replace.

      BTW, booting Linux over the net is simple, start with a customized install CD, store a reference image on a server using cpio or tool of choice via NFS. Then with a Li

    • If you have a modern SEER 16 A/C unit then you can typically 'produce' 16 times as much cool and the energy required.

      So it'll increase you cooling costs a fraction of power budget of the computer systems.
    • My kids' school is not air conditioned, you insensitive clod!
    • Why the heck dont schools use thin clients to servers.
      Because students want to plug in USB memories.

      Standard PCs have a lot of flexibility that thin client solutions lack.

  • A donated computer analyser and linuxator (Score:3, Interesting)

    by btempleton ( 149110 ) on Saturday August 06, 2005 @02:47PM (#13259434) Homepage
    There are tons of discarded machines out there that can still run a good linux.

    What would be nice is a distro meant to make it as easy as possible for relatively unskilled people to turn them into a desktop linux. Linspire may have a lot of that, but here's the elements I see.

    A simple program, on a floppy and/or CD, which analyses the hardware in the machine, and gives an estimate of how suitable the machine is to the task. Ie. how well supported the components (chipsets, cards etc.) are, and how much performance one can expect from it.

    It could also estimate what you would have to buy to bring the performance to your specs. "This machine is great but by just adding 128MB of ram -- just $20 -- it would be super." and "The machine is good but the ethernet card is one known to have problems. Cheap solid ethernet cards include these..."

    And so on. School boards, not wanting to do a lot of fussing, might insist on a certain "easy to convert" rating from this program before taking donations.

    Stage 2 is a distro which does a super-simple install on machines that make the cut. It knows the hardware is approved, so it's a hassle-free install, with ideally no questions asked, or barely any.

    Then you would get a lot of computers converted and ready to be linux boxes.
    • Ever heard of CDROM distributions?

      The way to evaluate old hardware is by booting up a CD. If it works OK, then install a full version.
    • That's a neat idea, but I can assure you if I were being paid to set up a school with computers and later support them, I'd charge more to let them use their old junkers than I would to get them brand new systems. Keeping things like monitors, keyboards and printers would be more negotiable.
  • Thought I'd clarify that.

    Not a bad deal, overall ... just not a computer on every desk for $500 or a single laptop.

  • In most schools, the windows computers are soo very old AND locked down, so students don't install random fishy fudge and take the computers down. Unix-like system are perfect for mult-user environments.. They're designed for it. Very Computer literate students will adapt and find that they have more priviledges and options than before.. Like installing applications as a user. Students who care less about computers will continue to flame their admin about how they can't install pirated starcraft on it.

  • Not a good idea (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Eightyford ( 893696 )
    Having a computer for every student is not a good thing, in my opinion. Actually, I believe that any computers in classrooms are for the most part a bad idea - and this is coming from a former computer programming student.

    With computers in every classroom, it really requires each teacher to become a system admin and I think it really distracts the students from their work. I have a friend from Vietnam, who never had computers in his classrooms growing up, and he was way more skillful in math then the r
    • Indeed, it has been shown in many studies that computers can actually reduce the quality of education. It isn't just your opinion. The Computers == Good Education thing is a total myth created by people desparate for a solution to the problems in US schools.

      -matthew

  • Microsoft Bob here to save the day! (Score:5, Funny)

    by infonography ( 566403 ) on Saturday August 06, 2005 @02:58PM (#13259518) Homepage
    Remember kids, buying a computer without an operating system is the first step towards piracy. Act now and call BSA and report anyone who offers you a computers without a licensed operating system. Say No to Piracy.

    Offer not valid outside the USA especially Finland.
  • Is the idea here that once the schools have the licenses, that they'll feel strongly compelled to purchase a service contract agreement with Linspire to provide technical support?

  • Why $500 per school? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by dtfinch ( 661405 ) * on Saturday August 06, 2005 @03:02PM (#13259538) Journal
    Because if it was free, they wouldn't want it.

  • As a student.... (Score:2, Interesting)

    by a10waveracer ( 862795 )
    As a student in the Indiana Public Education program, I can't wait for this. I have long helped teachers out with computer problems and have even used knoppix to fix problems deemed 'unfixable' by our support staff. Now I can't wait to see how much more stable my life will be when people can't fsck everything up. But, however nice this is, the main problem in my school, as I see it, isn't the number of computers, but how they are used. Constantly broken machines that won't let you print to certain print

  • The fight back from the dells and windows (Score:3, Interesting)

    by a3217055 ( 768293 ) on Saturday August 06, 2005 @03:17PM (#13259620)
    What will Dell and windows do? Give out Dell computers for about 300$. And windows might get on them for free or something? I know it sounds crazy but maybe they can make a loss to turn around the market. ( Investment for the future ). I don't know about Linspire but there has been great improvements in Linux desktops in the last couple of years. But for basic stuff it works, just wondering what will happen to all the apps the schools use to teach their students are there Linux ports or wine or vmware solutions that they are implementing ? One thing that will be great is that they will be able to manage these systems and have cleaner networks for there students. With the HALD and usb lot of students can bring in inexpensive memory sticks to save there work, web pages, documents etc ... I wonder how all this work out, will the school departments hire coders to write applications which will teach these new students. Or use 100s of highschool geeks to write GPL'ed educational tools :). Lot of cool things are happening and let's see what happens. -A
  • akes it possible for schools to afford computers for every student, something that makes a huge impact on their overall educations.

    It sure does make a huge impact on their overall educations. They will suffer. Computers != solution for bad teachers. Now we have another babysitter along side of the TV.

    Sure, they can be useful, but they are mostly a distraction and should only be used when neccessary. You know these people will want to use them all day long because of their "investment"

    Has anyone t

  • Here in Wake county North Carolina we couldn't give 3 year old computers to the schools. Too old, too slow not sexy enough. The schools went instead to IBM down the road and got brand new Netvistas for either free or something close to free.
  • Who's distro runs the default user as root, lied about using some new technology to run all Windows software nativly, and ran the worst ad campain that consisted of pissing MS off whenever possible. They give Linux a bad name. Want something windows like with Wine compatibility? Try Xandros [xandros.com]. They are also pushing for centralized management [xandros.com] areas. Something that, I believe, only Sun and MS are doing, with MS the only real complete set of tools.
  • Here's the Coral Cache of the article: http://www.pcmag.com.nyud.net:8090/article2/0,1895 ,1844695,00.asp [nyud.net]
  • in my district, they're linuxphobic. mostly from ignorance, but also because M$ throws freebies to all the techs. it's disgusting really.

    I wonder how much input the IT people had because most of them are probably MCSE's or whatever, and linux poses a real threat to them. and to be honest, schools don't care much, at least fro mwhat I've seen, about costs. Saving money sounds great, but see the problem is that if you don't spend it all, then you get less next year. and if you get alot of value, i.e. lot
    • If a school district wants to spend money on computers they should hire competent UNIX admins for their market rate. Simply having them around the school will rub off some computer literacy on the students, even if they aren't "qualified" to actually teach.
      • sadly, the IT staff is far removed from the kids. they have far more contact with the teachers, most of whom wouldn't know unix from eunochs!! nor would they care. the decision for linux dektops came from the district level, where there are no students and few teachers. but alas, teachers will use whatever is given them, and maybe, just maybe, they can say to the teachers "here's a cd, go home and install it at home..."

        i tried a few years ago to convert an old, and totally useless, lab into a linux thi

  • Good (Score:2)

    by dedazo ( 737510 )
    Having worked extensively in the education market (both private in public) and with the AZ/NV/NM departments of education, I think this is a very good idea. Schools have to find ways to cut their spiraling costs, and this is a good place to start. The next place would be to stop funding sloppy fly-by-night charter schools, but that's another rant.

    I prefer the Microsoft platform for application development, but it makes no difference what the students and teachers are using the access the applications, sin

  • But wouldn't they be better served by Windows boxes? (ducks). Seriously, odds are they will be using Windows in the "real world" once they graduate and move on to college and jobs. How well will the Linux skills translate?
    • wordprocessor=wordprocessor spreadsheet=spreadsheet web browser=web browser email client=email client Which skills in particular are you concerned about? They will learn how to waste countless company hours on personal web browsing, IM, and email using Linux just as easy as they will on Windows. Except with Linux I wouldn't have to waste time clearing off spyware/adware/viruses/worms. The Windows "Real World" isn't a pretty one from my perspective, and the Linux one is a dream. Let's hope it comes true
    • Actually, they'd be best served by something sligthly different from Windows, especially if they're likely to use Windows in the future. Being exposed to slightly different interfaces to perform the same tasks results in an appreciation of the task itself rather than the specific implementation of a user interface for that task on a specfic version of a specific piece of software.

  • Really? (Score:4, Interesting)

    by misleb ( 129952 ) on Saturday August 06, 2005 @04:33PM (#13259997)
    afford computers for every student, something that makes a huge impact on their overall educations."

    Really? I thought it had been shown over and over again that computers do not contribute to the overall quality of education for children. And in some cases, relying on comptuters can actually reduce the quality because the basics get ignored.

    Seriously, what IS the value of having computers in schools besides computer literacy? Sure, kids should have *a* computer class. Maybe a few computer labs for research. But why one computer per student? What is the value? So kids can skip lunch and IM their friends in another room?

    -matthew

  • It's interesting this is starting to be pushed by schools in the US. So far, the pursuit of low-cost computers for education and other markets, has primarily been a focus for developing countries like Brazil, India, China and other Asian countries. The holy grail continues to be the $100 PC, which is still difficult to attain. However Windows PCs have come down in price to about $500 for a desktop and about $700 for a notebook...low, but not low enough. More here: http://mp.blogs.com/mp/2005/07/s_9.html [blogs.com]

  • I Suppose Even Linspire Is A Step Up From MS (Score:4, Insightful)

    by John Hasler ( 414242 ) on Saturday August 06, 2005 @06:17PM (#13260560) Homepage
    Great. It figures that when the schools decide to switch to Linux they would choose the worst distribution available.
  • Anything's better than having to force security with Windows. Took me only a few weeks to crack the programs my high school used. Got a week's suspension for that 'cause someone ratted me out. Hopefully using a more secure O/S will prevent other kids from making that mistake.

  • when the schools actually DO purchase 300,000 Linux installs, let us know THEN.

    This is a pilot project.
  • Wouldn't it be better for them to develop their own distribution for such purposes? Spain has did it (SholeLinux or smth.) so it is the matter of only tweaking the distro to local needs (localizing is not the case, AFAIK the best/primary localization in Linux is english). They just could hire some consulting firm and they will build setup suitable for schools - it would be fair below $500 per machine (I think $200 would be easy).

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