Introducing the Slashdot Firehose 320
What is the Slashdot Firehose?
The Slashdot Firehose is a way for you to participate in the Slashdot editorial process. You are able to see all the content submitted to Slashdot: from RSS Feeds and user submissions, to journal entries and successful completed Slashdot stories.
You can participate by voting on these entries: click the minus icon if you don't think the story is great for Slashdot, and click the plus if you do. Better yet, when you make these choices you can help further refine your decision by clarifying why you made the choice you did. You can tell us if a story was binspam, or a dupe, or insightful. If you don't like the options provided in the pop-up windows, you can always open the tagging box and provide whatever tags you think will help Slashdot Editors, and other Slashdot Readers make informed decisions about the content they are reading.
Why does the Firehose have articles in it?
The Firehose has all data on Slashdot. RSS Feeds. Journal Entries. Story Submissions. And of course, accepted Slashdot Stories. The idea is that this view of Slashdot can provide you a single place to view all Slashdot content in one interface.
If you don't like any particular data type, you can filter it out. If you don't like journals, you can just filter on -journal and they are gone. If you don't want Slashdot stories, -story will get you there.
You will note a variety of interesting options that allow you to control how this page is displayed. For example, if you filter on 'story' and set 'expand top rated' you will see a page that is very similar to Slashdot's main page today... except that it dynamically updates and allows voting and in-place expansion of sectional content. Alternatively, filtering to -story and toggling 'abbreviated mode' will let you see a real-time stream of reader contributions. It's really up to you
What do the colors mean?
The spectrum of colors represents an overall quality rating for content. Red is the most popular, the highest rated, and hopefully the best content on Slashdot. There is relatively little Red content, although most stories we post default to red. Some stories show up as orange. As you work down the spectrum you will find more content. Default submissions to the Firehose start at blue. At indigo you will find a number of RSS feeds and journal entries. At violet you are probably wasting your time, and at black you definitely are!
Play with the color slider to find the level you enjoy reading most at. Use Red or Orange for busy days or if you are a casual reader. The lower you pull the slider, the more content you will see.
How does the calendar widget work?
The Firehose is usable in 3 "Modes". In "latest content" mode you are looking at the last few days of Slashdot content. Display is optimized for you to easily navigate within this small bit of time. In 'Day Of' mode you will see content only from (surprise) any day you specify in the calender. Finally in 'Search Archive' mode you will search the entire database. For now, this goes back only perhaps 6 months but eventually we think this can replace our existing search infrastructure.
What can I do with the Firehose Tabs?
We've found that we like to use the firehose in a number of different ways. Sometimes I want a casual view of Slashdot, and other times i want to see more stories. Sometimes I want to see only the stories I've tagged. Other times I just want to see Journals. Well, shockingly enough, each tab will remember your settings and allow you to quickly return to them later.
If you change your settings, you do so in an 'Untitled' tab. If you click on your tab, you can name it which will save it for later. Also, you can subscribe to an RSS feed for any particular tab if that's your cup of tea. Please keep in mind that we have a robots.txt file that restricts the rate that you refresh pages. I'd suggest a 30 minute minimum.
What browsers are supported?
Currently we work great under Firefox 1.5 and 2.0, as well as Safari. IE7 is functional but has glitches that we are working to fix. The iPhone functions as well with a number of optimizations for small screens (although the bandwidth requirements are still fairly steep so you are probably better off on a WiFi connection for now)
IE6 is known to be broken. Other browsers might work, but we haven't really tested them.
Why didn't you post a submission that made it to red?
Slashdot is a complex beast with readers with a wide variety of interests. Part of the job of Slashdot Editor is to create a website that is interesting to all of us. That means that sometimes our opinions may differ from yours. We use the voting in the Firehose as an indicator of value, but not as the definitive measure of if something is a Slashdot story.
If you don't like that, you can simply remove our Slashdot stories by putting -story in your filter. The firehose you read will be then be completely reader driven. We believe that the way we've built this system can appeal to the wide variety of Slashdot readers without compromising the story quality for our core audience.
Doesn't this make you just like
Well first of all, we're happy to use good ideas when we see them. Countless websites have knocked off our cool ideas, just like we joyously took ideas from those that came before us. But ultimately the idea here is not to imitate any other social network news site. We feel that the editorial layer that exists on top of Slashdot is important. But we also think that having many eyeballs will help us more efficiently sort through the ever increasing volume of content on this here internet of ours. That's why we'll aim to strike a balance. Slashdot stories will continue to be posted by our editors. We will use the advice given to us by our readers. Sometimes we will agree, and other times we won't. You are welcome to read more or less editor content depending on your tastes.
At the end of the day, striking a balance between the wisdom of crowds and the tyranny of mobs is a difficult one. It's also a personal one: some people might regard it as having a moral component. Others may just want to read a bunch of good stories no matter what the methodology. We're hoping that we can strike a balance that will work for everyone. Your feedback can only improve the system for everyone.
The "firehose" reference... (Score:5, Informative)
In case anyone misses the reference, the invitation to "drink from the firehose" is referring to UHF, the 1989 movie [imdb.com] by "Weird Al" Yankovic, in which Stanley Spadowski (played by a pre-Seinfeld Michael Richards) treats a kid who wins a game on his Captain Kangaroo-type show to drink from the firehose. The kid opens his mouth wide to the hose's nozzle, Stanly pulls the lever back, and the kid is promptly blown several feet off his seat.
Really funny stuff, including lots of television and movie genre parodies. If you like Weird Al's music and haven't seen the movie, I highly recommend you check it out. It's gained a cult following (obviously, with obscure references on Slashdot and all...) after having a disappointing theatrical release.
(But to be fair, that summer was particularly strong, with the release of Batman, Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade, Lethal Weapon 2, Back to the Future Part II, Ghostbusters II, The Little Mermaid... Any other year, and it probably would have been a moderate success. As you can tell, I wish Al would make another.)
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In case anyone misses the reference, the invitation to "drink from the firehose" is referring to UHF, the 1989 movie by "Weird Al" Yankovic, in which Stanley Spadowski (played by a pre-Seinfeld Michael Richards) treats a kid who wins a game on his Captain Kangaroo-type show to drink from the firehose. The kid opens his mouth wide to the hose's nozzle, Stanly pulls the lever back, and the kid is promptly blown several feet off his seat.
Yes, but nowadays he just turns the firehose on black protesters.
Re:The "firehose" reference... (Score:5, Informative)
Re:The "firehose" reference... (Score:4, Funny)
A much older reference "firehose" reference... (Score:5, Informative)
MIT President ['71-'80] Jerome Weisner coined the phrase "getting an Education from MIT is like taking a drink from a Fire Hose." [mit.edu]
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On another note, etymology is weird to you? Only interested in the here and now eh?
Oh well, since you didn't ask:
To bite the bullet is 1700s military slang, from old medical custom of having the patient bite a bull
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"This creepy older guy keeps offering me a 'drink from his firehose.'
"Can you show me on this doll where he touched you?"
Re:The "firehose" reference... (Score:5, Funny)
Re:The "firehose" reference... (Score:5, Funny)
Comments:
Bob: +120 Digs
It is beacuse of all the problems with the bush administration... He sucks...
Max: burried -12 digs [view comment]
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Stanley Spadowski (played by a pre-Seinfeld Michael Richards) treats a kid who wins a game on his Captain Kangaroo-type show to drink from the firehose. The kid opens his mouth wide to the hose's nozzle, Stanly pulls the lever back, and the kid is promptly blown several feet off his seat.
Yeah, but the truly hilarious part wasn't the kid getting blown off the chair, it was the fact that the victory condition for the game he won was "[finding] the marble in the oatmeal", and his opponents seemed to be two
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Not sure what you mean... you mean when you went back and looked at a firehose item you had previously nodded or nixed, the nod/nix button did not show up with your choice?
If you can replicate this, please let us know...
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Silly idea, I know.
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Exclusing people (Score:3, Insightful)
There are millions of people using IE on platforms not supported by Firefox?
> Someone who has no idea (or has no privlidges to install software) is not going to care about what
> firefox is. They just want to browse the internet.
And you feel that people who can't install software or have heard of FireFox is the core demographics of
It rubs the lotion on its skin... (Score:3, Funny)
Re:The "firehose" reference... (Score:5, Funny)
Congradulations you get to drink for the Firehose. (Score:2)
Re:Congradulations you get to drink for the Fireho (Score:2)
Huzzah! (Score:4, Insightful)
Story submission now based on subject quality? (Score:5, Insightful)
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If you click on the subject, you get to read the whole article.
Re:Story submission now based on subject quality? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Story submission now based on subject quality? (Score:5, Insightful)
There is plenty of evidence to suggest that not even the paid editors of Slashdot put that much time or thought into deciding whether a submission is good or not, how do you expect the average Slashdot reader to do so?
The Firehose is an easy way for the editors to reduce the number of story submissions they have to look through in order to find the good stuff. It will not reliably bring the best stories to the top, but it should be pretty effective at burying the most obvious garbage. Basically, it's like a spam filter for the editors, and is essentially doing part of their job for them.
Re:Story submission now based on subject quality? (Score:5, Insightful)
I can read articles days in advance on digg. However, digg is cluttered up with crappy "Amazing Photos! title sez it all" articles and insightful, highly rated comments such as +157 "Doucehbag [Reply] ".
I come to slashdot for the community. Not for the articles, not for the crappy non-editing that the mods-called-editors do, but for the intelligent discussion from karmalized nerds with modpoints. If the slashdot community could also have complete control of the story posting system **and summary editing**, that would be the Shangri-la of internet message boards.
Re:Story submission now based on subject quality? (Score:4, Interesting)
The problem with the concept of 'Community' is that the so-called 'Community' is the vocal minority. More than half of Slashdot readership is only interested in the articles those editors you hate so much. Perhaps a third of you are 'The Community'... so we need to strike a balance between what works for each groups particular needs.
My hope is that the hose will give us a chance to satisfy the desires of a broad spectrum of users... the ones who want minimal to no editor involvement and simply want to participate in the community discussion aspect of the site... to the silent majority who simply want the 10-15 best stories, without seeing crap like 'Amazing Photos!' etc...
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I think that part of why Slashdot is relevant is because us editors exist and prevent 'amazing photos! title sez it all".
Of course that's true, but what I'm betting on is that the hurdle has been cleared and the slashdot community has been 'gentrified'. Just as we don't get "Doucebag!" comments modded to +5 Insightful, I likewise don't think we would get "Amazing Photos!" submissions modded to the front page by slashdotters with mod points.
Also, and I don't mean to start a flame war here, but editors have consistently gotten away with poor editing. Most recently, there has been at least threesubmissions with improper usag
Re:Story submission now based on subject quality? (Score:5, Insightful)
If your only concern is that 'Editors' have an inaccurate job title, then I think we are doing just fine.
If you want community oriented tools to actually edit content wiki style or whatever, www.slashcode.com has sourcecode. I've had a user contributed patch/diff system on my TODO list forever, but it's a hard job and I've got another dozen hard jobs ahead of it on the list. We'll get there someday, you could get there tomorrow :)
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The title was orignally 'author' only because thats what the original mysql table was named. 'Editor' really was what readers began calling us in the forums (along with less polite names) and I think Editor is more accurate than Author. We may not grammar/spellcheck, but we *do* edit thousands of submissions down to dozens of submissions. That's not the traditional definition, but it's part of it. There already are 'moderators' so its not like I'm gonna re-use that term.
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People might pay more attention to their subject line and try to do a better job of selling the story. Or they could post leading and inflammatory headlines to get extra attention...that's kind of staple around here anyways...
Re:Story submission now based on subject quality? (Score:5, Informative)
My hope is that the net result will be that we can 'cast a wider net' by importing RSS feeds and such from commonly cool sites. If you throw your slider down to indigo, you will see CNet, Bruce Schneir's blog, Penny Arcade etc. Things that we generally like to see. The hope is that with more participants we can add more RSS feeds and eventually be quicker at finding the good stuff.
Re:Story submission now based on subject quality? (Score:4, Insightful)
Aside from the thinly-veiled slashvertisements we sometimes see, the average front page reader on Slashdot doesn't see the spam, because it's rejected by the editors. With the Firehose, there are at least some eyeballs looking at all those rejected submissions, so it's worth the spammers' time to submit more spam even if it never makes it past the Firehose, because it gets seen on the Firehose.
Re:Story submission now based on subject quality? (Score:5, Informative)
As for your 'thinly veiled slashvertisements' I take offense at that. We pick what we pick because we like what we like. Sometimes we pick stuff that may be a simple press release. Hell, I might post a straight up commercial if I thought it was interesting. But we still to this day pick what we pick because WE want to pick it, and not because we're paid to pick it.
The other practical reality is that we're trying to post a story every 40-50 minutes. By the end of the day, the best stuff is gone... sometimes you choose stories that simply aren't as good. And sometimes those may be advertising or something. We're still choosing it because we think it's the best of what's available, but I don't like when people accuse us of taking bribes for the homepage. Believe me, if we did that, this would be a different site (Like I wouldn't be here).
Re:Story submission now based on subject quality? (Score:4, Insightful)
Since the article was written by its submitter, the quality of the article is mainly on them. If it's pure advertising copy, that's on them, first and foremost. Still, you might consider taking the hint that Slashdotters are offering when the "slashvertisement" tag appears on an article, namely that the article crosses a line that your readership would rather not see crossed.
I've noticed that a lot of times this happens when the article describes a product with purported scientific basis, but when you go to read the linked webpage, it turns out that there's really no scientific substance to it at all. Since most Slashdotters are interested in the nuts and bolts more so than forking over cash for something of dubious usefulness, such articles get railed against.
On a side note, if there are problems with quality-of-article at certain points during the day, you might consider automatic queueing and posting of articles to add some pacing, so that article quality doesn't decrease during the off hours. Instead of several articles showing up during a short span, the editors could add the articles to a queue which automatically adds a new article to the front page after a somewhat random period of time.
On another side note, regarding the Firehose spam in the first place, I don't think nofollow is going to cut it. Lots of weblogs and forums have nofollow on their links as well, and some weblogs and forums haven't even been posted to in months. That doesn't stop the spambots from posting to them, because of the possibility of someone seeing the spam eventually (which is the whole point of spam). If the threshold for worthwhileness of posting spam is that low, the Firehose is a gold mine in comparison.
Re:Story submission now based on subject quality? (Score:5, Informative)
I still don't have a good answer. I think the plan is that we internally have a 'put on hold' bit... and any story that isn't posted in a week or so will be 'rejected' unless it has the 'hold' bit. So hopefully most stuff that might get picked up later will have that bit set. Maybe we should have another state for submissions between 'pending' and 'rejected' because there really is something to be said for the whole 'maybe later' story.
Of course, firehose readers will be able to enjoy that content in real time, so it will matter less to them.
Re:Story submission now based on subject quality? (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Story submission now based on subject quality? (Score:4, Interesting)
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Re:Story submission now based on subject quality? (Score:4, Interesting)
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This is distinct from 'stupid' or 'offtopic' which I think are much more negative... they indiciate that the story is a waste of time... not just mediocre.
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Re:Story submission now based on subject quality? (Score:4, Interesting)
As it, I think the majority votes after skimming the summary. What we need, is a way for people that actually read the article to get the word out. Tags are nice, but not enough. What the firehose needs, is a way for some people to read the article and rate the story according to various criteria.
- Good articly or a stinking pile of self-promoting crap?
- Unbiased or paid for?
- Good summary or in need of a rewrite?
- Enough relevant links (maybe we can add a few more?)
- Dupe or new article?
There are many articles that seem interesting from the summary, or from a quick skim. While closer reading reveals that the text is horribly bad.
Re:Story submission now based on subject quality? (Score:5, Interesting)
And you aren't kidding about the interestingness of stories falling apart upon click. I've rejected 10s of thousands of submissions ;)
Shoud I apply the Firehose ... (Score:2)
(disclaimer: just joking, I enjoy drinking from the Firehose Fountain [mit.edu].)
Like some other sites I could mention... (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Like some other sites I could mention... (Score:5, Funny)
Mode? Really? OK, that's a pretty nerdy putdown.
What's the next insult? "Your wiener has P < 0.1 and a big deviation"
Not so sure (Score:5, Funny)
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If it makes Slashdot more like digg, then bad idea. It's a train wreck of sex and conspiracy theories over there. Well...on second thought maybe we can make it half like digg.
Digg is more like a trainwreck of "OMG LOOK AT THIS PICTURE OMFG!". That and regurgitated blogspam. It's gotten so bad, that you have to click through 3 or more blogs just to get to original article. Each of these blogs has some very "insightful" 2 line commentary and link to another blog. Every moron spams Digg with their own shitty blogs, they know it's a highway for great hitcount and their ego.
I really hope Slashdot doesn't become half like Digg, not even 0.00001% of Digg.
Re:Not so sure (Score:5, Insightful)
As for the community, I like this one. Lots of good folks post here every day. And a few dickheads that I really wish would shut up. Sometimes I wish I was as evil as some of them accuse me of being. It would be a lot easier to simply ban them ;)
Safari Problems (Score:2)
I've been using this for a while now, since it first appeared mostly, but in the last week or two or three (since the last major update) things haven't been rendering correctly for me in Safari 2. It used to work perfectly, but now it doesn't. The problem I have is the article text is there when I expand it, but the links (read more, comment, etc) show up on top of the article text thus making some words and part of a line or two unreadable.
Since it is mentioned that it works in Safari, is anyone else havi
Color coding, bad idea. (Score:5, Interesting)
In general, color-coding is a poor practice when designing any UI. Especially contiguous spectrums.
Call me when you rank your firehose stories by popularity using a number, okay?
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I differentiate red and green fine as long as the tint isn't too light, but as the tint gets lighter and lighter it turns gray for me quicker than it does for people with normal color vision.
Re:Color coding, bad idea. (Score:4, Informative)
Re:Color coding, bad idea. (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Color coding, bad idea. (Score:4, Informative)
That site lets a normal person see how a web-page looks to people with different kinds of color blindness.
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Re:Color coding, bad idea. (Score:5, Insightful)
The lesson I learned from all this is to avoid numbers at all costs because otherwise people create video games where perhaps it is better that none exist. I understand this- it's our nature. I LOVE video games where I earn and spend money. I love games where I gain XP and improve stats. But Slashdot shouldn't be those things... it should promote discussion. It should try to put the spotlight on good stories. It shouldn't be about how much XP You or I accumulate, it should be how much benefit we all collectively get from quality content.
Of course you've demonstrated that you are a cynic. I try to be an optimist here. I've learned an important lesson. Hopefully Slashdot is better off for it.
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Re:Color coding, bad idea. (Score:4, Interesting)
That said, depending upon how many people contribute to firehose community moderation, perhaps the 9% figure is an acceptable loss in the view of the coders. Colour is a faster and arguably more intuitive way of ranking something, in my opinion, although I'm not sure I'd have chosen red as the "approved" colour. Your point is well-taken, though, so perhaps the powers-that-be will add a numeric indicator in addition to the visual one.
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But what about color-blind synesthetes who see numbers as colors, but can't distinguish between certain hues. How will they ever get along using your proposed ranking system??!?!
Call me when you rank your firehose stories by anything other than color or grapheme.
Monochrome is better (Score:5, Insightful)
The best solution might be monochromatic: black to white, or white to red. Or have black be neutral, red be positive, and blue be negative with monochromatic gradients in between. That'd be like a good elevation map: green to brown for increasing altitude of land, light blue to dark blue for increasing depth of water.
AlpineR
Why not call it Slashdot Shovel? (Score:5, Funny)
But does it go... (Score:2)
Opened stories disappearing (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Opened stories disappearing (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Opened stories disappearing (Score:4, Interesting)
O...M...G... (Score:5, Funny)
Reduce dupes?
Improve article summary quality?
Filter irrelevant material?
Tell Zonk to go to hell?
*wicked evil grin blood-curdling cackle of glee*
I welcome myself as your new overlord.
cryptic flags? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:cryptic flags? (Score:5, Interesting)
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WOOHOO! Just what I was looking for
I guess that means my karma is gone now, doesn't it? :)
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Opera (Score:3, Informative)
I use the Firehose quite often with Opera and it seems to work as expected. I'll be letting you know if it stops working. ;)
Having seen the evolution of the Firehose over the last few months I can say that it's definitely going in the right direction. Looks good, am particularly happy that a reason has to be given for modding stuff up/down. It makes me stop and think, rather than just modding things based upon my predisposed opinions.
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Opera 9.2/Windows XP SP2
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I had the same problem on Ubuntu until Opera brought out 9.22.
I've seen videos of Hakon Lie [youtube.com] using Opera on the OLPC to read /. so if there's a problem which stops /. working properly on Opera I doubt it will be a problem for long. :)
Perhaps the /. devs should give more credibility to Opera, since they obviously have some fans high-up in the company!
Re:Opera (Score:4, Informative)
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Firehose questions (Score:5, Insightful)
Why isn't there a "troll" or "flamebait" option in the minus sign menu? These apply to a lot of the journal rants, and several of the submissions too, but the closest thing you can mod them is "stupid".
Is there a way to set the view to show more than 25 entries at a time?
If you click the plus or minus sign, but don't provide a reason in the menu that comes up, does the plus or minus rating still take effect?
Re:Firehose questions (Score:5, Informative)
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Bug? Feature? Weirdness? (Score:4, Insightful)
What happens to the comments if the story gets dumped?
Re:Bug? Feature? Weirdness? (Score:5, Informative)
Linking submissions/ (Score:4, Insightful)
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This could be potentially awesome... (Score:4, Interesting)
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Re: not flamebait, but it does (kinda) suck. (Score:4, Informative)
Re: not flamebait, but it does (kinda) suck. (Score:4, Informative)
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