First Amendment Ruling Protects Internet Trolls 305
I Don't Believe in Imaginary Property writes "A recent ruling by the Court of Appeal of the State of California (PDF) in Krinsky v. Doe H030767 overturned a lower court ruling and decided that the First Amendment right to anonymous speech protects internet trolls, too. Specifically, the ruling said that 'this juvenile name-calling cannot reasonably be read as stating actual facts.' And, even though some of the statements were crudely sexual and accused Ms. Krinsky of being among 'boobs, liars and crooks,' the statements were held to 'fall into the category of crude, satirical hyperbole which, while reflecting the immaturity of the speaker, constitute protected opinion under the First Amendment.'"
Oh dear God... (Score:4, Funny)
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Darwinian M&M duels (Score:5, Funny)
I have found that, in general, the brown and red M&Ms are tougher, and the newer blue ones are genetically inferior. I have hypothesized that the blue M&Ms as a race cannot survive long in the intense theatre of competition that is the modern candy and snack-food world.
Occasionally I will get a mutation, a candy that is misshapen, or pointier, or flatter than the rest. Almost invariably this proves to be a weakness, but on very rare occasions it gives the candy extra strength. In this way, the species continues to adapt to its environment.
When I reach the end of the pack, I am left with one M&M, the strongest of the herd. Since it would make no sense to eat this one as well, I pack it neatly in an envelope and send it to M&M Mars, A Division of Mars, Inc., Hackettstown, NJ 17840-1503 U.S.A., along with a 3x5 card reading, "Please use this M&M for breeding purposes."
This week they wrote back to thank me, and sent me a coupon for a free 1/2 pound bag of plain M&Ms. I consider this "grant money." I have set aside the weekend for a grand tournament. From a field of hundreds, we will discover the True Champion.
There can be only one.
Re:Darwinian M&M duels (Score:5, Insightful)
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Re:Darwinian M&M duels (Score:5, Funny)
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I think you are just perpetuating the myth [salon.com] that Darwin was racist [cotch.net]. I'm pretty sure that the Discovery Institute will be quoting your post in the following way:
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Re:Oh dear God... (Score:5, Funny)
It must be past his bedtime or something.
Re:Oh dear God... (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Oh dear God... (Score:5, Informative)
Not nearly to the extent that "overrated" is used though. Overrated is used to shout down people with unpopular stances by moderators who don't want negative meta-mods(since over/under rated is not meta-modded)
Re:Oh dear God... (Score:5, Informative)
Sometimes I'll find that the post has an insightful, interesting, or informative component, and will use that mod (which at least allows it to be metamodded, and follow the system,) but sometimes funny is the only appropriate mod... so I go underrated.
define "obnoxious" post (Score:4, Interesting)
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Which is achieved by modding them down. If you really want to read them all, you can always read at -1 like I do. Even better: as a registered user, you can set your account to ignore (-1) Troll moderations.
Re:No (Score:5, Insightful)
<sarcasm>Of course it is, because there is no option to browse at -1, whether you are a registered user or not. I guess two clicks are too much work, and having to go to a public library to read a book censors the author because you don't get it sent home just because you think you want to read it right now.</sarcasm>
Preventing would require that those comments were unavailable (or with great difficulty). Two clicks doesn't cut it, for me.
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Of course it's premeditated. That's the entire purpose of any moderation system: to mod posts up that the moderator believes are good and down those he doesn't. Even if you eliminate downmods you're still "censoring" posts by virtue of choosing not to mod them up. The only way to eliminate that oh-so-abhorrent pr
Re:Oh dear God... (Score:5, Funny)
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Re:Oh dear God... (Score:5, Insightful)
Score one for the good guys. You may not like Trolls, but then neither did King George. If protecting my freedom of speech means I get to listen to a few immature Trolls, it's well worth the price.
Re: Vs. King George (Score:5, Funny)
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Mr. Owl, how many licks does it take to get to the center of a Tootsie Roll pop?
1....2....3....Ka-Runch.
Layne
Re:Oh dear God... (Score:5, Insightful)
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Re:Oh dear God... (Score:4, Interesting)
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Makes me wonder what a '+1 whinny' would do to ones soul?
Re:Oh dear God... (Score:5, Funny)
Give it a sudden craving for oats?
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Perhaps it makes one's soul sound like a horse [die.net].
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When was the last time you volunteered to meta-moderate? If enough people meta-moderate unfair Troll moderations then the people who hand those out for opposing viewpoints become less likely to get points.
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Feck Yeah (Score:2, Funny)
democracy and noise (Score:5, Insightful)
But what you consider BS one time might be the truth the next. It is up to you.
This is fantastic news. (Score:5, Funny)
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Obgtry... (Score:4, Funny)
USENET had it right... (Score:2, Interesting)
It only empowers them to wield attack lawyers.
Re:USENET had it right... (Score:5, Funny)
| PLEASE |
| DO NOT |
| FEED THE |
| TROLLS |
+----------+
| |
| |
Teehee
First post! (Score:2)
Goatse.cx (Score:2)
In South Korea all trolls are robots!
Greatest Hits (Score:5, Funny)
Dear Rob, I wrote but you still ain't callin / I left my email, my ICQ, and my yahoo chat at the bottom / I sent two emails back in autumn, you must not-a got 'em / There probably was a problem with your sendmail or somethin / Sometimes I scribble email addees too sloppy when I jot 'em / but anyways; fsck it, what's been up? Man how's your boxes? / My boxes is linux too, I'm bout to be a compiler / once I learn gcc, / I'ma go on and compile for hours / I read about your Palm Pilot too I'm sorry / I had a friend lose his Palm over at the airport in Maradonna / I know you probably hear this everyday, but I'm your biggest fan / I even read all your bullshit Linux news and Microsoft's man / I got a room full of your posters and your pictures man / I like the way you sold your ass out too, that shit was fat / Anyways, I hope you get this man, hit me back, / just to chat, truly yours, your biggest fan / This is Stan
Dear Rob, you still ain't called or wrote, I hope you have a chance / I ain't mad - I just think it's FSCKED UP you don't answer fans / If you didn't wanna talk to me outside your Linux World / you didn't have to, but you coulda signed an autograph for Matthew / That's my Senior sys admin he's only 26 years old / We waited on a 9600 baud for you, / four hours and you just said, "No." / That's pretty shitty man - you're like his fsckin idol / He wants to be just like you man, he likes you more than I do / I ain't that mad though, I just don't like bein lied to / Remember when we met in Boston - you said if I'd write you / you would write back - see I'm just like you in a way / I never had a clue about shit either / I gcc'd shit with my wife then beat her / I can relate to what you're saying in your page / so when I feel like rmusering I read Slashdot to begin the rage / cause I don't really got shit else so that shit helps when I'm depressed / I even got a tattoo of slashdot across the chest / Sometimes I even packet myself to see how much it floods / It's like adrenaline, the DDoS is such a sudden rush of blood / See everything you say is real, and I respect you cause you tell it / My girlfriend's jealous cause I talk about you 24/7 / But she don't know you like I know you Rob, no one does / She don't know what it was like for people like us growin up / You gotta call me man, I'll be the biggest fan you'll ever lose / Sincerely yours, Stan -- P.S. / We should be together too
Dear Mister-I'm-Too-Good-To-Waste-A-Packet-On-My-Fans, / this'll be the last packet I ever send your ass / It's been six months and still no word - I don't deserve it? / I know you got my last two emails / I wrote the @ signs on 'em perfect / So this is my payload I'm sending you, I hope you hear it / I'm on my modem now, I'm doing 9600 baud so fear it / Hey Rob, I drank a fifth of vodka, you dare me to code? / You know the song by Deep Purple or Slayer / its irrelevant by playing on my linux player / while I write some php scripts and play some Dragonslayer / That's kinda how shit is, you coulda rescued me from drowning / Now it's too late - I'm on a 1000 downloads now, I'm drowsy / and all I wanted was a lousy letter or a call / I hope you know I ripped +ALL+ of your pictures off the wall / I love you Rob, we coulda been together, think about it / You ruined it now, I hope you can't sleep and you dream about it / And when you dream I hope you can't sleep and you SCREAM about it / I hope your conscience EATS AT YOU and you can't BREATHE without me / See Rob {*screaming*} Shut up bitch! I'm tryin to code / Hey Rob, that's my senior admin screamin from the comode / but I didn't cut the power off, I just rebooted, see I ain't like you / cause if rm -rf'd we'd suffer more, and then the boxes die too / Well, gotta go, I'm almost BGP bridged now / Oh shit, I f
Re:Greatest Hits (Score:5, Interesting)
Feel free to use this information to your advantage. I thank you for your time.
Anonymous cowards are... well, cowards.
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http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=26315&cid=2850660 [slashdot.org]
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Many of us have gone through the Slashdot existentialist crisis -- seeing the same old themes and memes, but I'm glad to see that the themes and memes are still alive - people are still finding
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Actually the settings page is far more informative, but I agree it's kinda dull.
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Evident corollary (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Evident corollary (Score:4, Insightful)
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Nice argument (Score:2, Insightful)
That is a very nice way of protecting free speech, while still making very plain that that kid should work on his argumentative skills.
Words=Noise, Writing=Squiggles (Score:4, Interesting)
It's like when people put parts of Scientology's texts in public forums. To a true believer, those words are putting them in actual danger or at the very least greatly offending them. But no one cares about that, their a bunch of not jobs.
But in my own experiance, trying to get a t-shirt made that simply says F*** Jesus, has been very hard. And I can't wait to get one made to wear to Wal-Mart... Granted that will probably put me in physical danger, but that's part of the fun of it all.
The point is, the world is a dirty grubby place. And if you can't use your intellect to help you see beyond it all. That's you're problem, people talk shit. Always have always will. IMHO.
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which mixes the two genres..
Jesus loves...
to suck cock
That'll do it
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BTW: They are opening a 'franchise' here in Australia, they have been advertising during the show that they want to audition Aussie hosts from the general public.
Re:Words=Noise, Writing=Squiggles (Score:5, Insightful)
"...trying to get a t-shirt made that simply says F*** Jesus, has been very hard"
So you want to get a T-shirt made with Fuck Jesus on it, but you're too embarrassed to type that almost anonymously on Slashdot?
Um, OK then. Go for it you rebel!
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Make sure you get footage
Funny you mention that, this past 4th of July we stopped by Wal-Mart to beer up and get supplies, I had my digital camera out, trying out various video capture settings to ensure I could get a couple hours worth of footage on the memory card I was using. Well within 5 minutes I had a guy in a red vest behind me, "Sir! Sir! ... Sir!". I could hear him, but I didn't really care. Eventually he was up in my business telling me camera's were not allowed to be turned on on the premises. My first thought was, "We
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You could have just pointed to their security cameras and said "what - those aren't on?"
Besides, what's he gonna do - try to take it away from you? He's a f*cking WallyWorld prole. Go "boo" and he runs away.
how would it not be? (Score:4, Insightful)
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Oh and go ahead and troll this comment, just for kicks.
Re:how would it not be? (Score:4, Insightful)
I sincerely doubt that the people who wrote your constitution had the noble aim of allowing their citizens to call each other "poopyheads" in mind. The aim of the first amendment is presumably to allow the free transmission of ideas and for people to be able to speak their conscience. It doesn't protect every kind of lie, for example.
If the founders had wanted to protect the right to specifically annoy other people, they would have written something like: "The right of citizens to throw balloons full of dog shit at each other shall not be infringed".
Trolls can be funny, but they are more often a nuisance. It's not like much can be done in any case, since the law of the universe is that idiots and assholes must win.
Re:how would it not be? (Score:5, Insightful)
Amen (Score:4, Insightful)
Furthermore, if you want an idea of what kind of speech the American Revolutionaries wanted to protect, just look at the kind of speech they were using. For every civil and well-reasoned "Common Sense", "Declaration of Independence" and "Federalist Papers", there are dozens of newspapers articles and pamphlets published that were crude, hyperbolic, and dripping with vitriol. They were nothing if not flamebait. The founders of this country clearly felt that no one should be above this sort of criticism, and that no government should be able to suppress this sort of dissent.
Admiral Ag is correct in saying that this sort of speech is nothing but a nuisance, but if someone thinks they need the government to step in and "protect" them from something as insignificant as trolling then they have bigger problems on their hands.
How long does it take? (Score:5, Interesting)
_____________________________
That idiotic dumb-ass judge wouldn't know a good judicial decision if it bit him in his lame-ass ass. Where did he go to judge-school anyway, The Universduhity of Dumbasia?
I see it came from California. Everyone knows everybody in California is a stupid liberal anyway with their stupid activist liberal judges who just do whatever their retarded Governator tells them to do. Retards. Someone should shoot them all, wouldn't that be ironic? Here they all go crying "free speech, free speech," and then they get shot? Well, if you don't see the irony, then you're even dumber than that retarted freakin judge.
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OK, now mod it + funny, - troll and we can be done with it.
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you sir (Score:3)
however, i will reciprocate felatoin with you even though you have fat thighs, a fake medical
degree, queefs and have poor feminine hygiene
why can't that happen to me?? (Score:3, Funny)
And i guess that goes for most of us here.
Trolly Comment (Score:4, Insightful)
Hurrah for the courts (Score:4, Informative)
"I may mod down what you have to say, but I shall defend to the death your right to say it."
-- Voltaire
This has not always been the land of the free. Remember Eugene V. Debs:
"June 16, 1918 -- Debs made his famous anti-war speech in Canton, Ohio, protesting World War I which was raging in Europe. For this speech he was arrested and convicted in federal court in Cleveland, Ohio under the war-time espionage law
(from here [eugenevdebs.com])
translation for non-americans (Score:2)
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I hate to self-promote myself but.... (Score:4, Informative)
http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=446180&cid=22344224 [slashdot.org]
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Heh (Score:2)
Translation for those who don't read legalese: "You guys suck at the intertubes, he's a troll get over it"
what? (Score:2)
What...the...fuck...
At what point did 'land of the free' cease to be true? Did I miss a memo?
So nyer! You're wrong again! Poopie head! (Score:2, Informative)
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Some companies don't understand (Score:3, Insightful)
I'm pretty sure those who do seek to actively silence public critics are those who have something to hide, not am image to maintain. If you run the company right, people will rightfully ignore the trolls.
The downside of Free speech (Score:4, Insightful)
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Anonymous posting likely to be gone in Norway (Score:3, Interesting)
There are extremely strong pressures for anonymous posting to be removed from all national newspaper and discussion sites, pretty much every site "run by a company", which is all of them. The social pressure on companies to conform to this could be compared with the Chinese social pressure on companies not to allow 'socially objectionable material' to filter into the public consciousness.
Additionally, every Norway-based social networking site requires a mobile phone for registration, and mobile phones are required by law to be registered to a valid address with SSN-equivalent. You can't buy one without ID.
Very interesting: professionalism = responsibility (Score:4, Insightful)
If you read the summary and the verdict, it actually appears that the main question was whether the statements could reasonably be read as facts, because defamation rules only protect against false factual claims. The judge found that no reasonable person was likely to read them as statements of facts, but rather as 'crude, satirical hyperbole'.
The very strong implication that is likely to have consequences is that the deciding question about any claims is whether they are "likely to be read as facts", which again is going to depend on the professionalism they are delivered with. Whereas posting the commment "Ms. Krinsky likes to suck goats" in a Youtube comment is unlikely to be defamatory, creating a professional-looking blog and writing a post entitled "My disturbing meeting with Ms. Krinsky where she hinted at zoophilia" on the other hand is likely to be.
I completely agree that this is the only sensible and real-life-compatible way for things to be done to be honest, but it is interesting that the court has now spelt it out explicitly. Look forward to the 'convincingness' of internet posts to become an issue in defemation cases in the future. Of course, even if something is not defamatory it could still be harassment or criminal in other ways.
Guess I'm ahead of the times. (Score:2)
To what extent? (Score:4, Insightful)
To me, this is akin to a party. It's your party, do what you want. You may even kick me out for being no troll, you may do whatever name calling you like, but when you're on my lawn, you either keep your mouth shut or get off it. You will not come to my party and advertise for amway, you will not get drunk and harrass all the girls and you will not start political campaigning for a party I do not like.
I do sincerely hope that the courts see that fine difference. Just because I open my house for anyone who wants to party with me does not mean that I allow anyone to come in and do what they like. And the same applies to internet servers. A server is not a "public space". It is owned by someone who may (or may not) present the rules under which this server may be used. Play by those rules or get off my lawn.
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This isn't just directed at you; a lot of people misunderstand the Constitution and Bill of Rights. They are an enumeration and restriction on the powers of government. If you come on my lawn screaming advertisements at my window, I am fully within my rights to have the p
contempt of court vs first amendment? (Score:2)
> of being among 'boobs, liars and crooks,' the statements were held to 'fall into the category
> of crude, satirical hyperbole which, while reflecting the immaturity of the speaker,
> constitute protected opinion under the First Amendment.'"
the obvious smart-arse thing for Ms Krinsky to do here is to immediately turn around and say "In my opinion, this decision just proves that Californian judges are boobs, lia
Pot, meet kettle (Score:3, Funny)
And yes, I know what i wrote. You didn't get the joke perhaps?
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For further reference please see, The War On Drugs(TM).
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I may not like what you have to say, but goddamn it, I'll fight to the death for your right to say it!
BTW, you're right, FOS IS when _I_ have something important to say & non-FOS is when _YOU_ have something...wait. Censorship is when _YOU_ can't say what you...wait.
Nevermind, say whatever you like, just be sure to do it over there, and keep it down so I don't have to listen to you whine again.
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At my school, about a fifth of pupils were Jews, and some of them were good people, some of them were Zionists.
I'll happily abuse someone for being a Zionist, because I believe that Zionism is inherently evil and wrong.
But if your only crime is believing in a religion that's even sillier than Christianity, then go ahead - I won't abuse you for that.
Oh, and by the way - I am a sociopathic atheist :P
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