IBM Seeks Patent On Retailer-Rigged Driving Routes 150
theodp writes "On IBM's Smarter Planet, you may drive further than need be to get to your destination. Big Blue's pending patent for Determining Travel Routes by Using Fee-Based Location Preferences calls for the likes of Walmart, Starbucks, and Best Buy pay a fee in return for having your route calculation service de-optimize driving instructions to make you do a drive-by of their stores, and an additional fee if GPS tracking of your car indicates you actually took the suboptimal route. The same IBM inventors also have a patent pending for Environmental Stewardship Based on Driving Behavior, which calls for yet another fee to be assessed when a retailer-friendly-but-suboptimal route causes your vehicle to enter a congested area and produce more pollution."
Yes or No (Score:4, Insightful)
IBM gets bonus points if they patent these then sit on them, thus disallowing anyone from actually implementing them.
Of course they could turn "Evil"
How many other evil things can we thing of to patent to prevent people from actually doing them?
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Yeah, like modal ads at the operating-system level...
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This is how IBM actually works: (Score:5, Informative)
1. The head of a project takes his bunch of interns into a meeting room to brainstorm random things you could do which have any sort of tenuous tangential connection to the project.
2. Lawyers!!!
3. IBM pays dude a few thousand dollars bonus.
(4. Interns are eligible for bonus if they join IBM, but seek less-dysfunctional workplaces where they don't have to use Lotus Notes.)
Seriously, that's the reason I have my name on a patent which basically says "you could have a weight sensor on a bus, guess the number of passengers, and use that for capacity planning somehow." [slashdot.org] For bonus points, check out the flowchart.
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Until someone else does it also and "someone" sues that "someone else". That'll be public then.
Nah, IBM just wants to remind everyone who is boss (Score:5, Insightful)
This is just a polite cought from IBM to remind Apple, MS, Google, HP, Samsung and the likes who invented original evil. This is classy stuff, forget about silly lawsuits and threathening to sue your customers. Control their every move like the drones they are. THAT is CLASS. That is pure unadulterated evil.
Basically they are saying, "Look out, we are still here and we are still the masters of darkness. Any of you whippersnappers forget that and we will have your headquarters surrounded by a thousand sheep following our GPS to their slaughter."
I have taken the hint and re-labelled my PC as an IBM-compatible to pay homage to the master.
Emergency calls... (Score:2)
How many other evil things can we thing of to patent to prevent people from actually doing them?
We could include a collision detection device in the GPS that automatically calls a vendor sponsoring hospital, even though it might be faster to call 911 and get the closest hospital...
As a side effect the system will also call hospitals whenever you brake hard, which of course is something you'll pay a decent fee for...
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And double their revenue by selling ambulance-chasers subscriptions to the feed.
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Yeah... I'd rather IBM own this patent than a company like Google or Garmin, who would have an incentive to use it in their next navigation software releases for additional revenue.
That said, IBM has been known to sell their patents to the highest bidder. Grr.
No doubt, there will be a user fee as well (Score:5, Insightful)
I would bet that there is also going to be a way for the user to pay a fee not to be sent on the suboptimal route.
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there are times i'd like to be able to get one of these sub optimal routes...
for example:
Driving to my Uncles new home for a house warming thing, I'd like to stop at Target(for those that don't know www.target.com), a hardware store for something, and a ATM for cash for the week, somewhere between here and there, and go out of my as little as possible. I know the nearest target to my house is in the wrong direction, as is the hardware store, so i'd like googlemaps/etc to find the best route between my plac
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Yeah, that's called "the traveling salesman problem", and it's.. well, it's a textbook computer science problem, and will probably be so for years to come...
Re:No doubt, there will be a user fee as well (Score:4, Informative)
Odd - I call it 'Itinerary' - but that's only because my TomTom labels it as such. It's not entirely automated in that I can't specify a destination and then say 'along the route to the destination, find me X, Y and Z' - but I can look at the route it's already plotted for me and find said X, Y and Z on the map and add them as waypoints.
And if you really wanted to do a traveling salesman problem thing.. ..plenty of options to choose from for a limited number of destinations.
http://www.google.com/search?q=traveling+salesman+google+maps [google.com]
Of course the question becomes what is more efficient.. shortest? fastest? least turns? most highways? least highways? most traffic congestion avoidance? etc.
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Doesn't Target do cash back?
debit card cashback - I see what you're saying (Score:2)
You seem to be suggesting debit-card cashback as an ATM substitute.
Target offers that, but they limit it to $40. Other places I used had similar limits: $35, $50. So that's a problem if you want a couple hundred, and going to multiple such stores cuts down on the "fewer trips" advantage. One has to buy at least a little something at each store (which is still better than ATM fees, especially if it's an item you'd buy anyway)
I became very familiar with the debit card cashback feature when taking a summer int
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Sub optimal for one purpose does not make it sub optimal. You're not asking for a sub optimal route, you're asking for the best route that satisfies some additional constraints.
Anyway, this kind of garbage is why the US inaugurated the numbered highway system in 1926. Before that, roads were promoted by private organizations that were not above directing travelers on sub optimal routes, in order to increase business at favored towns, which of course paid for the privelege. An example is the Bee Line Hi
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Actually the highway system was designed with one thing in mind: the US military. It was built to efficiently move tanks from one half of the country to the other and to also provide backup runways in the event of a war.
I think you are mistaking the Interstate Highway System to the much older Federal Highway System. There are also so many fallacies in what you are talking about here I don't know where to begin, most especially the runway issue. For WW II era planes, they might have been able to use something like an interstate highway, but modern jet fighters have a few more problems. The rocks and "foreign object" problems on these highways alone would make merely landing on most interstates a one-way trip where the mi
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Time for reality. Want to do that. Use google maps, create a route from start destination to finish destination. Then do a search on that map for the shops of your choice. If their is not one already on the route, simply drag a route marker point nearest to that store onto that store and watch the route change to suit.
See, the only way people will really accept doing versus any kind of B$ marketing lie.
What it really means is people will be demanding navigation devices with bigger screens so that they
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This is what i do right now. Have fun doing that across a metropolitan area, or better yet, a drive from one to another.
What I want is an interface were i specify my start and end points, then my searches, and have the software pick the shortest time detour(taking into account stop lights, stop signs, etc) taking into account all of my options. I'm betting there are a few times were being able to only look at once search at a time will not provide a best route.
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The optimal method is very difficult to compute. However, you can get 80% efficiency by just planning your route based on the most scarce of the locations.
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That's not what this commenter is saying. Suppose I'm driving from Phildelphia to Washington, DC and I want to stop at a Starbucks for coffee. If I know in advance which specific Starbucks I want to go to, I can use a waypoint. But if I don't care which of the several dozen Starbucks between here and there it is (I just want to minimize the necessary detour), waypoints aren't any help.
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Yes, but you probably don't want to go visit the highest bidder. You'd probably want the one that's either the most convenient or the best coffee.
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Magellan already does that. As I'm driving, I decide I want to stop at the nearest [whatever]. POI, punch in [whatever], click 'Go There Now'. It shows the route, and reroutes to the original destination after the stop. Problem solved.
Now...if you want to quibble about exactly which Starbucks brings the least detour from the total route, it is pro
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The nearest X to me at some particular time may not be the one closest to my route from A to B. To use my example of going from Philadelphi to DC, if I search for the Nearest Starbucks at the start of the trip, it'll have me go a few miles in the wrong direction, adding maybe half an hour to my trip, when I really want to stop at the one at the first rest stop on I-95S, 90 minutes away.
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I doubt it. it will just be a 'feature' that you aren't told about and cant turn off.
Thankfully you can still look at the map yourself and skip the 'helpful' directions. Too bad its getting hard to find a paper map..
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Its better than the units that tell you to drive off a cliff.
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That's not a GPS unit, that's your phone, connected to your mother-in-law.
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How will that compete with an ad-supported GPS unit that is installed to your car completely free of charge?
If you think that people won't stand for free services being provided in exchange for advertising opportunity, I think you might be a bit out of date.. and I don't think AdBlockPlus will run on the provided device.
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It might work in areas with low congestion, but in the UK a diversion via Asda or Starbucks could easily add an hour to a trip by taking you off a bypass and into the centre at peak times. For most people paying £100 to have an optimal route would be mony well worth spending
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A motoring atlas costs a fiver.
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I kinda doubt that they're going to make the GPS units free, especially when we're talking about OEM devices. Car manufacturers LOVE overcharging for stuff like that.
And besides, as videogames have shown us adding advertisements doesn't mean the price will go down, it just means the execs' pockets get lined more.
Just what we need get off hiway and get back onm (Score:4, Insightful)
Just what we need get off highway and get back on for each small town you pass by.
In the past I use to get stuff like that with on line maps where they keep having you get on off the same road but may of been a bug or just poor weighting.
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What is this with people confusing the words "of" and "have"?
Unlike "their"/"they're"/"there" or "once"/"ones", the pronunciation isn't even similar.
I'm not a native speaker, can anyone explain this to me?
It's a common illiteracy from spoken English. (Score:2)
Off topic but I hope that explains it.
best buy GPS "ask geek suard for map updates" (Score:4, Funny)
How long before it the gps says
"Go in to best buy and ask for geek suard for map update service Only $49.99"
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I just searched for "target store" in Google Maps and an ad came up on top of the map that says "Sears Store Finder www.sears.com"
I wouldn't be surprised if there's a destination I can search for that will make the Geek Squad pop up.
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I've got a better one (Score:2)
and then the GPS cuts off your engine / dumps your remaining fuel once you're right next to a service station, and the bio-chhip in your kids makes them hungry whenever you're close to a Mickey D. Off to the patent office for me !
Remote Control is Next (Score:2)
Iguide sucks now and the last thing it needs is (Score:2)
Iguide sucks now and the last thing it needs is more ad's
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Love it (Score:1)
I consider my paranoia validated.
Random thoughts (Score:3)
So, everything someone thinks of while high on pot is now eligible for patenting? This crap doesn't make any sense to me, but I'm not currently high.
Re:Random thoughts (Score:4, Funny)
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That ain't weed they're smokin'...
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Ok. I scanned the patent submission - scanned, because I found the entire proposal odious. From the first paragraph my first reaction was "this is a scam." Everything I read - scanned/quick read/slowed down to read/tried to analyze - only reinforced my first impression. This entire thing is, to my mind, a wondrous new way to screw people: business owners, for ostensible fame and fortune; travellers to get sucked into paying the higher prices for goods or services due to costs of doing business being pa
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Bravo Zulu to you good sir!
GPS craze (Score:1)
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I got a gps with voice prompting for my company van because I was afraid I was going to get in, or cause, a wreck trying to read the Thomas Guide. My short term memory isn't that great, especially if I'm thinking through my next job before I get to it. Having a gps system voice prompt me around a major metropolitan area is, for me, a significantly safer option. But then again, I don't blindly drive off the road into a river/ravine/building just because my gps told me to.
Re:GPS craze (Score:4, Funny)
But then again, I don't blindly drive off the road into a river/ravine/building just because my gps told me to.
Wish I'd read your post five minutes earlier...
- Sent from under water
Re:GPS craze (Score:4, Informative)
Let's see...
Pick up map. Look up destination. Try to find the street on the legend, correspond to a bunch of X/Y grid entries, and get there. Try to determine the best way through all the various highways, one-way streets, etc on the way. Get partway there and run into construction. End up taking a different route. Stop, and re-read map. Plot alternate route. End up discovering that street stops and starts in multiple sections and require a roundabout route to your destination. Arrive at destination, only to discover that it doesn't exist and that you should have been on 1st Ave East and not just 1st ave. (and yes, I've had this experience before).
OR
Turn on location services. Type in "Bob's Market" in your GPS-enabled device. Click "directions." Follow the route given and spoken aloud... which is auto-corrected whenever you are diverted or have to make an unexpected turnoff to pee.
I don't need my GPS when going places in town, but when you're travelling 200+km to a destination you've never visited before, it's sure a nice thing to have...
Most convenient is if you're in an unfamiliar location, and you want to find "Store X." Pop the name into maps, and a few of the most nearby locations pops up for easy navigation.
Very convenient (Score:3)
This is awesome because now you don't need to look for a wal-mart, strabucks, best buy and other when you want to go shopping, you just put your home address as the destination and you'll have a route all setup for you.
Oh crap (Score:2)
Earlier today, I took a bunch of glass bottles to the recycle center, and I drove. How much do I owe IBM?
Useful under user control (Score:3)
Under advertiser control it is pretty ugly, of course. But it would actually be nice if I could map a route and say "along the way, I need to find cheap gas, an Asian grocer, and try to get me to a Walmart or Target (don't care which) if it is it not *too* much deviation.
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...but it can't handle an open-ended stopover request like "the closest Target to the highway between here and my brother's house 2 states over so we can get a toy for our niece"
Re:Useful under user control (Score:4, Informative)
my 2 year old tomtom can handle that "waypoint along route" and it will list the target stores that are on your route, with each one listed as to how much of a detour it is, you then select the one you want.
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That's very cool. I'll have to remember that when my aging Garmin croaks.
Where is the Invention here? (Score:1)
Where is the "invention" here? It uses all the existing APIs. It uses standard business practice (i.e. you do something if someone pays you to do it).
Seri
Bad summary (Score:2)
Where, exactly, does the second linked patent say anything at all about routes, fees, retailers, or congestion? As I read it, the second patent is about charging tailgaters a higher toll, based on the theory that tailgating causes everyone behind the tailgater to increase braking and acceleration, which is bad for the environment.
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It's the first patent that points to the second patent:
"The additional fee is charged for proposing routes for any additional vehicles to travel through the congested area, thereby promoting environmental stewardship by potentially reducing the number of additional vehicles entering the congested area."
Also, check out the listed inventors - same team of five on both patent applications.
This might explain ... (Score:4, Funny)
Prior art (Score:4, Funny)
Bangkok Tuk-Tuk drivers.
New Delhi motorcycle taxis.
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+ Chinese taxi drivers. We would get a Taxi to our hotel but just happen to stop by a Chinese silk factory on the way.
Solution? Opt-out (Score:2)
Remember the good ole days? http://www.thomasguidebooks.com/ [thomasguidebooks.com]
Privacy (Score:2)
Suboptimal indeed (Score:2)
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Would it pay for my extra petrol ? (Score:2)
Presumably the idea is that if one in (say) N people who drive past X brand coffee shop would be tempted to buy a coffee that they otherwise would not have. Let's do some arithmetic:
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It occurs to me that for businesses clubbing together to work, then you have to assume that the motorist would be tempted to stop on 1 in 3 journeys when he would otherwise not stop. It is all a guesstimate, but I can't see how it makes sense.
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Businesses don't care about YOUR overheads. That's an externality.
Who's to say the tyre merchants and fuel stations won't subsidise this, so you spend more with them too?
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Businesses don't care about YOUR overheads. That's an externality.
But I care about MY overheads, so I won't do these longer routes if it costs more than I get. I do understand that some people will be excited at getting the occasional £5 from this scheme while ignoring that it has cost them many times that to ''earn'' that £5. Hopefully most of us are saner than that.
Who's to say the tyre merchants and fuel stations won't subsidise this, so you spend more with them too?
Car tyres last many thousands of miles, ie many, many trips; so unless the system somehow knows that your tyres need replacing it is going to be wasted advertising. The margins of fuel are slim an
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Approving patents nobody wants (Score:2)
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USPTO VISION
The USPTO will lead the way in creating a quality-focused, highly productive, responsive organization supporting a market-driven Intellectual Property system for the 21st Century.
Never mind. No public good there.
What could possibly go wrong dept (Score:2)
How long before street gangs set up pseudo-legit businesses to use this service to send people down the wrong part of town where they can be mugged?
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Patent evil, troll evil, bleed evil, profit! (Score:2)
Patent trolling someone that would use those patents is pure genius!
Pure Evil, but an opportunity ... (Score:2)
for a GPS maker to sell a device which advertizes that it does not included purchased waypoints to misdirect the traffic. But, knowing the ethical level of businesses today, they'd sell a device that currently markets for $100 for $500.
Re:New Patent Laws (Score:4, Informative)
Pure FUD. First to file does NOT mean that prior art is ignored. Prior art will invalidate a patent now just as it did before. The rest of the world has been "first to file" for, like, forever. If someone has published it, then no-one can patent it.
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Prior invention in the sense of I saw somebody else do it, but I'm filing a patent on it?! It absolutely must be disclosed. In fact, it's inequitable conduct to file a patent on something you didn't come up with.
Text of 102(a) now:
`(a) Novelty; Prior Art- A person shall be entitled to a patent unless--
`(1) the claimed invention was patented, described in a printed publication, or in public use, on sale, or otherwise available to the public before
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Posts like these are the reason why we need a "Wrong" moderation category.
If it makes you feel any better, you won't technically be wrong for another 18 months, when first-to-file goes into effect for newly-filed applications.
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I went to mod the above post +1, Funny and got this:
User not allowed to moderate this comment.
WTF!?!????
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Or why you should never buy a GPS system made by IBM.
IBM doesn't usually sell GPS navigation software directly to consumers; instead what will happen is other companies OEM IBM's software in their consumer products, and people will have the software without ever knowing that their shiny new nav unit is actually a piece of hardware running an application written by IBM.
OF course.... the days of shiny new nav units are numbered, as Smart phones such as Android/iPhone, are obsoleting dedicated nav dev
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Wait.... people buy units that are only a GPS? That's absurd! Why would you buy a dedicated GPS when you can get an Android unit that's not only a GPS, but a telephone, a clock, text message client, email client, Web browser, Internet access point, dictaphone, camera, scanner, flashlight, radio, MP3 player, aircraft location scanner, video game console, flight simulator, and all the other things that a smart phone is, all in one?
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There is the $79 once (GPS) vs. $50-$99 every month (phone) tradeoff, that's a consideration for many. :-)
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What exactly is so difficult in having low phone bills?
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And they are often FREE, advertising supported, and always looking for new revenue sources, so watch-out!
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Yeah, your phone. Did you think that high end processing device that came to you absolutely LOADED with crap-ware / ad-ware wouldn't JUMP at the chance to implement this sort of thing? Why not? The de