MIT To Expand Online Learning and Offer Certificates 96
mikejuk writes "MIT has announced an online learning initiative that will offer its courses through a new interactive learning platform that will enable students to participate in simulated labs, interact with professors and other students and earn certificates. Is this just a reaction to the Stanford experiment in running courses complete with exams and informal statements of accomplishment? (The first AI course has just finished and the exam results are in.) If so let's hope it spurs other educational establishments to do the same!"
This will get lecture book publishers crying (Score:4, Insightful)
Book publishers are going to be crying about online learning and courses if they can't get their books required for them. They are already doing all kinds of shady monopoly deals and trying to hinder reselling of books by updating their course material almost every year, resulting in incompatible books for classes. I'm sure that if they cannot get their books forced in other ways, they're going to be doing some suing or forcing schools to shut down these online learning courses.
I'm not sure why people cry so much about RIAA and MPAA when there is such an assholish industry preventing people from learning. That has real results on whole advancement of humankind.
Re:This will get lecture book publishers crying (Score:5, Insightful)
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Re:This will get lecture book publishers crying (Score:4, Interesting)
Simpler reason actually...
We endure buying useless books for 4 years. We listen to music and watch films for the rest of our lives.
One has a great impact. We decry textbooks while students. But ceased to be concerned upon graduation as it passes.
RIAA/MPAA is a persistent hemmoroid on the remainder of our lives.
Quite the contrary, I believe (Score:3, Interesting)
I never attended high-school (I went to vocational school and then started my engineering studies) so I never got to study those interesting-sounding subjects like psychology and philosophy. Now that all the most famous universities have been putting their introductory courses online, I've watched quite a few of them.
When I was watching Introduction to Psychology [academicearth.org] (Prof. Paul Bloom, Yale, extremely interesting and entertaining way to spend some 20-odd hours) I thought "Hell, I could actually do more than w
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MIT has a long history (decade) of offering their entire courseware online for free:
http://ocw.mit.edu/about/next-decade/ [mit.edu]
Meh (Score:4, Funny)
University of Phoenix has been doing this for years.
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Plus University > Institute.
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I'll add to this:
My assistant principal at the school I worked at decided to get his Master of Education from U of Phoenix. On occasions he asked me to proofread essays he was doing. Utter drivel, and badly written, and I told him so. He sent them anyway, then crowed about how the essays I had panned all received marks over 95%
And we wonder why the education system doesn't work...
interesting times (Score:5, Insightful)
Since my day job is CS professor, these kinds of things aren't in my personal interest (unless I land a tenured job at MIT, which is unlikely :P), but I think they have considerable merit. CS, compared to other fields, is already a little bit ambivalent about degrees, and you can get some kinds of jobs by having alternate demonstrations of knowledge, like your Github "resume", or track record of participation in open-source projects. But a lot of companies worry that without a degree you'll lack some theoretical knowledge that will eventually bite you in the ass, because you didn't realize that something was a well-studied problem with an off-the-shelf solution you could've pulled out of one of Knuth's books and implemented, instead of rolling your own buggier, worse one (sometimes this is a founded fear, other times not).
But the bar in many cases is not that high. Even when I've looked for people to work with on, say, a machine-learning project, what I want to know is that they're familiar with the basics of statistics, common techniques and gotchas, correct and incorrect methods of data analysis, etc. This is more likely if they have a degree with some statistics and/or ML courses, but I could see a certificate from a respected course of online instruction being enough to convince me of that, if they keep standards up and it's not easy to cheat.
On the learner's side, it's a really interesting space of possibilities for mixing-and-matching your own education. Since these certificates seem to be much finer granularity than degree programs, if they proliferate and maintain quality, you could more realistically do interdisciplinary programs of study while still being able to prove that you mastered specific things.
Re:interesting times (Score:4, Interesting)
Since my day job is CS professor, these kinds of things aren't in my personal interest (unless I land a tenured job at MIT, which is unlikely :P), but I think they have considerable merit.
It might actually be in your personal interest. Perhaps there's a possibility that some of your students will take these online courses to prep for your courses in the future. Plus, everyone is served by having a well educated society. How to help make that happen is a different thing...
Re:interesting times (Score:5, Insightful)
In a general sense of an educated society I agree, but I do think these kinds of courses will pose a significant challenge for CS programs outside the top 10. I don't think MIT and Stanford's online course offerings will be purely supplemental education taken in addition to a 4-year CS degree or by people who wouldn't have gotten one anyway, though there will also be some of that. I think they'll to some extent also displace some proportion of traditional CS education. Probably not a lot at first, but to the extent anything makes it easier to get a good tech job via a route other than a traditional 4-year CS degree, which is already possible but not super-easy, I think it may reduce enrollments in 4-year CS programs, especially outside the very top schools.
Put differently, just in supply-and-demand terms, MIT and Stanford professors can now each fulfill a much larger portion of the demand for CS lectures, since they can lecture to students outside their classrooms. Unless the new audiences are 100% new audiences (i.e. they bring new demand for CS lectures in a 1:1 ratio to the demand-for-lectures that they fulfill), it'll reduce demand for lectures from non-MIT/Stanford professors.
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Put differently, just in supply-and-demand terms, MIT and Stanford professors can now each fulfill a much larger portion of the demand for CS lectures, since they can lecture to students outside their classrooms. Unless the new audiences are 100% new audiences (i.e. they bring new demand for CS lectures in a 1:1 ratio to the demand-for-lectures that they fulfill), it'll reduce demand for lectures from non-MIT/Stanford professors.
I'm a CS adjunct at a community college, I think my job is safe. :-D
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But you actually teach computer science? Algorithms and patterns? Because at my community college they have a COMPSCI program that has NO algorithm studies at all. The students might as well just code in PHP.
We have a programming logic course here that doesn't have any programming and discusses that stuff. I don't teach that course. But I do try to hit on things like different types of sorts, data structures, etc., even though I only teach programming languages.
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Since these certificates seem to be much finer granularity than degree programs, if they proliferate
WRT to granularity, I'd be happy if video support for the 10 year old OCW program proliferated beyond the 100 level courses.
Some of the higher level class "OCW support" is kind of minimal. Some of the course pages are as minimal as a textbook and a schedule. I'm unimpressed. Here, let me provide you with the "/. discount special vlm CS certificate program" : "Knuth TAOCP, schedule, start on page one first book first day, end on last page last book last day. Also read some of Graham's lisp works. click
CS is to much theory. Tech school is more on track (Score:2)
Of giving the skills need to do IT job's. People with theoretical knowledge / paper MSCE's lack real skills that are needed on the job and some times even in a CS they don't even cover a lot stuff that is covered in a tech school. Now with ambivalent about degrees why not have apprenticeships for IT jobs? or at least make them part of the tech schools. I talking about a REAL apprenticeships like how other skills jobs have them.
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Oddly enough, that's what Technical Institutes were intended to be, which is why they have a different name than University, which was more the classic lectures+reading style of education. A.N. Whitehead, better known for his philosophy but also somewhat of an educational theorist, was a big fan [anthonyflood.com] of that style of early-20th-century education.
Schools like MIT, Georgia Tech, and even the rather evocatively named Colorado School of Mines have more or less converged to a university model of education, though, I'
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I'd guess partly because disciplines got more and more complex to the point where there was significant theory (e.g. engineering today is more about mathematics and less about hands-on work with steel than it was in 1910), and partly for prestige reasons.
Mostly financial reasons. My home town has a tech school, a state extension public U, and a tiny more than 150 year old psuedo-religious private U (psuedo-religious in that I attended for a year and it was religious in that you had to take "a" religion or philosophy class to graduate, but it was not religious in that it only grants doctor of divinity degrees)
The tech school was affordable nearly full time on full time minimum wage and only offered per credit hour classes. The public extension U was about
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Of course it's theory; CS is literally the science of computation. It's not about engineering.
Granted, getting good engineering out of software devs reveals a gaping education/training hole that needs to be addressed, but that is not Computer Science.
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This is sorely needed in the US in particular. I have watched a few documentaries on primary education here in the states, and needless to say, that unmitigated disaster is not going to be fixed anytime soon. So why not let people "pull themselves up by their bootstraps" and learn higher education themselves.
There are a ton of people who don't do well in High School only to realize later that they want a better job. For the most part, we view those people as unfortunate and lost. We say they are ignoran
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I don't think it will happen soon, but someday
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Somewhat misquoted (Score:5, Informative)
Somewhat misquoted
MIT ... will enable students to ... earn certificates.
http://web.mit.edu/newsoffice/2011/mitx-faq-1219 [mit.edu]
Rather, MIT plans to create a not-for-profit body within the Institute that will offer certification for online learners of MIT coursework. That body will carry a distinct name to avoid confusion.
So you'll get a cert from "Internet-U" stating you watched a video.
BTW the OCW calculus video series rocks as a refresher course. HIGHLY recommended. I wish they had video for more than just their 100 level intro courses.
Re:Somewhat misquoted (Score:5, Insightful)
I'd guess it's going to be somewhat in between "MIT Certification" and "Internet-U Certification". They're trying to walk a line of ensuring that the regular MIT degree programs are differentiated, while still leveraging the MIT name to distinguish the online course from just any random online course.
Re:Somewhat misquoted (Score:4, Insightful)
Do the MIT courses have any testing or homework? I just completed the Standford ML class, and it was about as much work as a standard college course. I would imagine that a tested class would carry more weight than a certificate stating that you pressed play on n videos.
Of course, I'd like to believe that the class I completed (and others) will mean something on my resume, but the application process is so streamlined these days that without a degree to make it through the initial filters, I'm skeptical that human eyes will ever see it.
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Do the MIT courses have any testing or homework? I just completed the Standford ML class, and it was about as much work as a standard college course. I would imagine that a tested class would carry more weight than a certificate stating that you pressed play on n videos.
As far as I can tell there's no info yet because it's all in the idea phase. The FAQ says they haven't even built anything. But I have to imagine they are watching the Stanford classes closely -- perhaps even quietly participating in them -- and that they will turn out similar.
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So when can we get degrees from accredited Us? (Score:2)
I... somewhat in between "MIT Certification" and "Internet-U Certification". They're trying to walk a line of ensuring that the regular MIT degree programs are differentiated, while still leveraging the MIT name to distinguish the online course from just any random online course.
So when can we get degrees from an accredited university via online work? Or even course credit that is accepted by other accredited degree-granting schools (accepted either "at all" or "without jumping through extra hoops").
I don
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I'm not sure I care as much about the certificate's prestige, but rather more that I can get a very good bit of instruction in areas which I am not very knowledgeable (statistics). Cool stuff.
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So you'll get a cert from "Internet-U" stating you watched a video.
Have you taken any of the classes currently offered by Open Courseware?
I've only looked at a couple of the linguistics and foreign language courses, but there's definitely a lot more involved than watching a video. The courses I've seen are semester-length courses, with homework and exams.
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I've downloaded and watched several of the video lecture series from OCW. The 100 level calc videos are awesome for light viewing as a refresher course. Needless to say I have not used calc in any form in the previous 20 years, but it all kind of comes back while having the videos on in the background.
To the best of my knowledge, there is no "taking" or "signing up" there are just course pages, with syllabus, suggested readings, sample historical tests and answer keys, etc. Its not like taking a "real on
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So you'll get a cert from "Internet-U" stating you watched a video.
And passed the homework and exams.
I took the AI class. The video segments and fill-in-the-box quizzes, homework and exams mostly worked OK for the topic. I don't like that the textbook cost around $150; I didn't get the textbook because of the price. I did OK without it. Because of lack of time, I only took the 'Basic' class (just watch the videos), not the 'Advanced' class (homework and exams scored, class ranked afterward). I did complete homework and exams when I had time.
The AI class got all o
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Stanford experiment? (Score:5, Funny)
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Meh (Score:3)
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I went to Hamline University in St. Paul, MN in the early 80s, and was able to take classes from 5 other area colleges that went toward my degree. Granted, all these colleges were private, but it's not a new concept.
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When are we getting college degree programs not tied to a campus. I want to enroll at Midwest States University. Take some courses at Illinois State some at the University of Kentucky, some at University of Tennessee, and graduate with a BA after 4 years.
You've just described my undergrad "career" or whatever you want to call it, although all different schools.
Some places let anything transfer, some let you test out even if they won't categorically no-questions asked transfer, and some are rat bastards about forcing you to take certain specific classes at their school, sometimes no rhyme or reason. My advice, especially in this era of online education, is shop around.
I had the privilege (?) of taking calculus in high school (didn't give a F, got C in retur
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Education comes out of the dark ages (Score:5, Insightful)
It's interesting to see how the state of learning has changed in the last 10 years, and the pace of change is accelerating.
Does anyone know why we study the subjects we do in high school? Mostly it's because the subjects are classical - things are studied because it's been that way since ancient times.
Take geometry, for example. It's an important subject, but not nearly as useful to the average person as probability, yet we study one and not the other.
Then there's the mode of teaching, several hundred years old, where the student sits quietly in a seat watching the lecturer write things on a board and explain them.
Newer models have emerged. The Kahn academy still uses the lecturer/blackboard model, but improves it in many ways. The video can be viewed at a time of the student's choosing, parts can be rewound and replayed, and most importantly: the lectures can be improved by redoing them.
The Stanford and MIT online courses are just another example of the changing landscape. The Stanford AI course had lots of technical problems that they were unprepared for - ambiguous English phrasing, uneven level of practice versus test, missing technical explanations, and so on.
Despite the problems, they will get better. Indeed, they will get a lot better even the 2nd time they give the course.
We're apparently watching a competition for "esteem" between the top end universities. The colleges are competing for clarity of presentation, comprehension, and usefulness of the data.
In 10 years or so the traditional university model will be gone. There will be no need to go to college when all the standard subjects can be learned very well online, using methods which have evolved to present the material in the best possible way.
It'll be fun to watch as this evolves over time.
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Agreed. The social experience of college is useful, but not to the degree that a person will be less qualified by forgoing it; just less well rounded. In fact, the social aspect can hinder people who focus on it to the detriment of their studies. Not that I would know anything about that... Ha.
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This experience is fine when you're student-age, but things change once you're a working professional adult who seeks to increase their own understanding for things they're already doing for real. Having well-presented information that's tangibly useful, instead of having to perform lots of self-learning to have it sink in, is exactly what fits the bill.
Many educators seek to create some sort of "community of education" around a student lifestyle, instead of offering direct quality knowledge to experienced
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I took the Stanford database course and it filled in a lot of blanks for me. I'd never had any formal training in databases but have picked up bits and pieces as I figured out how to do stuff (or asked my brilliant wife how to do something.)
Having a schedule and a grade at the end forced me to do it (once i put it on my development plan at work.) And I'm sure work liked it being free.
It was definitely more productive for me than if I'd gone and taken the typical corporate 2-day training class.
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I agree, a lot of the corporate training stuff is not that helpful; it's often too condensed into a continual barrage of nearly-opaque info. Having online courses like this is a great balance between such problems and those of a university setting. (I took the Stanford AI and ML classes)
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The Stanford AI course had lots of technical problems that they were unprepared for - ambiguous English phrasing, uneven level of practice versus test, missing technical explanations, and so on.
But the Machine Learning class was almost perfect. Incredibly clear, precise, complete and human-friendly explanations; gave a thorough treatment of real-world caveats, testing, debugging tips; wasn't so ridiculously focused on locking in grades; and all around a way better experience than the AI class (I took both). I have nothing but respect for Prof. Ng and his staff.
There really was no excuse for the problems the AI class had in its teaching style, and those problems really didn't have anything to do
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University education is about personal enrichment and beyond-the-industry research, not job training. The current western world remains confused about this, with employers who think a degree means the applicant automatically has good on-the-job capabilities (especially in computing), and students thinking a piece of very expensive paper is a magic life betterment token (correlation is not causation).
Tech / vocational / schools / apprenticeships are (Score:2)
Job training but HR does not see it that way and you end up with people with beyond-the-industry research who some times are clueless in doing real work.
I say we need more apprenticeships and tech schools. Tech works should have to schools with big sports teams / theory loaded classes to get a JOB or have a good in the eyes of HR "education".
this could help improve education (Score:3)
Many universities don't actually compete as much as one would think at first - students have issues of geography and financial issues, among other things. When universities are available online, then they DO compete (with other universities online), and they then have to compete. Hopefully that will push them to improve the education they offer.
This is also very empowering. Now any kid anywhere in the world who understands English can get access to education they could never dream of before. Things like this, and Khan Academy, could help pull the poorest areas of the planet out of the ruts they're stuck in, given enough time and support (and continued and expanded access to them).
If you have clean water, food, shelter, medical care, and a reliable Internet connection, you have civilization.
Online education - really? (Score:3, Insightful)
While I agree that expanding the access to education is a great idea, there is no substitute for attending a brick-and-mortar university. Online courses and online lectures are a supplement to learning -- in the same sense that a text book and a lecturer is a supplement to learning. There are certain skills that you will only learn by living on your own; such as learning to balance your social life, classes, managing a schedule, and other activities. However, if you sit in your parent's house (or basement, like most
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Welcome to the 1980s, MIT! (Score:4, Informative)
MIT has discovered distance higher education learning? Welcome to 1969! Over here in the UK we've had high quality university level distance education since then [wikipedia.org] and distance learning offered online since the 1980s [wikipedia.org]. Currently it has over 200,000 distance learning students, many of whom use online environments as part of their learning. Perhaps though the concept of distance learning is not as advanced in the USA as in Europe?
Can any US folks comment? what is the perception of distance and online learning in the US? Over here in the UK, and I believe Europe generally, the idea of doing an online degree is considered a valid method for people to undertake higher education if they cannot get to a university campus (work, family commitments, etc). The Open University is considered to be a high quality degree offering institution and regularly comes high in student satisfaction ratings. This institution offers different media for taking courses, but some of them are offered completely online and have done for some years. I"m suprised that "university offers online teaching' makes news.
Curious - though I suppose it is newsworthy as MIT is such an august educational establishment. Interested to hear a US perspective on how distance and online higher education learning is perceived...
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In brief: Here in the US it's outrageously more expensive to get a degree online than it is to go to a traditional college. As far as the worth of the degrees, there's basically three levels: one from a top school, one from somewhere else, and, at the bottom, one from an unaccredited institution. Generally online degrees don't even specify that they were earned online, so if it's from a top school, it's just as presitigious. Some schools are known to be primarily online schools, but none of those are con
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Could you elaborate to let us know if the UK University would also recognize the course done abroad for the credits the student should be getting for completing it?
No substance in the announcement (Score:1)
As much as I respect MIT and their - unique for the time - OCW initiative, which is a major pillar of free online education along with the Khan Academy, the current MITx announcement oozes of "mee too":
1. Timing: the seminal three Stanford courses just finished, and more than a dozen for early next year introduced
2. Spring start: could mean anything between March and May; i.e. they were probably caught off-guard by the Stanford initiative
3. No details announced: no list of courses, let alone lecturers' vide
MIT and Stanford courses are different (Score:1)
There are significant differences -- MIT's courses are geared to self study while Stanford's are tied to the on-campus class and schedule. MIT is also developing an open source delivery platform and certification will be done for a small fee by an independent organization. See: http://cis471.blogspot.com/2011/12/mits-online-classes-will-be-different.html [blogspot.com].
Problem is... (Score:2)
>earn certificates
Problem here is , this is a new major market just like the slightly varied IT courses given.
The universities around my house all got in on these night time IT courses to advance your training, yet did not even recognize these courses for credit....
will these ecourse count for credit seeing as a University is giving them?