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NASA Has No Plans To Buy More Soyuz Seats (spaceflightnow.com) 87

schwit1 writes: Both Boeing and SpaceX better get their manned capsules working by 2019, because NASA at this point has no plans to buy more seats on Russian Soyuz capsules after the present contract runs out. Spaceflight Now reports: "Even as the commercial crew schedules move later into 2018, NASA officials say they are not considering extending the contract with Roscosmos -- the Russian space agency -- for more launches in 2019. The last Soyuz launch seats reserved for U.S. astronauts are at the end of 2018. It takes more than two years to procure components and assemble new Soyuz capsules, so Russia needed to receive new Soyuz orders from NASA by some time this fall to ensure the spacecraft would be ready for liftoff in early 2019." The second paragraph above notes that even if NASA decided it needed more Soyuz launches, it is probably too late to buy them and have them available by 2019. "A Soyuz is a complicated vehicle, and a complicated vehicle doesn't come into existence in a matter of days," said Kirk Shireman, NASA's space station program manager. "It takes over two years to build a Soyuz, so yes, at some point in time, building a new Soyuz vehicle is not an option. We're working with our Russian counterparts on exactly when that is. We have not crossed that date yet, but I believe the date is in sight. It will be this calendar year when we will cross the point where we won't be able to build a Soyuz in time for when our last seats that we've already procured expire," Shireman said.
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NASA Has No Plans To Buy More Soyuz Seats

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  • Hopefully CONgress properly fund human launch.
  • by sittingnut ( 88521 ) <sittingnut&gmail,com> on Saturday October 15, 2016 @02:48AM (#53080467) Homepage

    "boeing and spacex better get their manned capsules working by 2019"
    lol. perhaps in 2025 at >10x cost of soyuz (inflation adjusted)
    enough said.

    better lay off the astronauts till then.

  • Good (Score:3, Interesting)

    by elrous0 ( 869638 ) on Saturday October 15, 2016 @04:12AM (#53080587)

    ISS, like the Space Shuttle program before, is more of an ongoing PR promotion (and jobs program) than any kind of useful scientific mission.

    Either send humans to Mars or stick with unmanned missions. More manned trips just to sit in LEO and pretend to do something useful are just pissing away money. It's time to end the charade.

    Sadly, NASA will probably just end up funneling even more money to politically-connected contractors with the excuse that we need to build our own rockets, throwing even more good money after bad.

    • by hey! ( 33014 )

      Projects like ISS aren't just one thing. You have many groups involved each with their agenda. One of those groups unquestionably is researchers. Would they rather have all the money spent on ISS go just to their research? Sure. But it's not going to happen. The PR value supports the research, just as it did with Apollo (but obviously on much, much smaller scale).

      Likewise a lot of people would rather see the money that went into ISS go toward a Mars mission; but that would (at the time of ISS's planni

      • by khallow ( 566160 )

        Projects like ISS aren't just one thing. You have many groups involved each with their agenda. One of those groups unquestionably is researchers. [...] Likewise a lot of people would rather see the money that went into ISS go toward a Mars mission

        And a third group just looks at something like the ISS as a profit center. One of three groups got what they wanted.

        This is how the real world works.

    • ISS, like the Space Shuttle program before, is more of an ongoing PR promotion (and jobs program) than any kind of useful scientific mission. Either send humans to Mars or stick with unmanned missions.

      How would sending a handful of astronauts to Mars to live on life support for a few days be any less of a PR stunt than the ISS?

    • You can't go to Mars until you solve the life support, it's a four year mission minimum with no easy resupply from Earth. To solve life support you need a space station.

  • by frank249 ( 100528 ) on Saturday October 15, 2016 @06:01AM (#53080733)

    It is proven technology as it already delivers supplies to ISS and returns safely. They have tested the abort system on the ground along with the other systems. I do not see why they will not be ready for flights in 2018 [spaceflightnow.com]. Boeing on the other hand is still way behind [theverge.com]

    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward

      It is proven technology as it already delivers supplies to ISS and returns safely. They have tested the abort system on the ground along with the other systems. I do not see why they will not be ready for flights in 2018 [spaceflightnow.com]. Boeing on the other hand is still way behind [theverge.com]

      Keep dreaming. SpaceX has never launched a person into space. Dragon 2 may be ready for testing by 2018, but given SpaceX's recent spotty record with launches, NASA in no way will put an astronaut on a SpaceX rocket or an untested Dragon 2. Their safety rating and supplier quality control needs to be dramatically improved before that happens.

    • by Anonymous Coward

      Would this be the same spacex that has blown up two rockets within the last year? One for mysterious reasons unknown?

      I don't think nasa will let its astronauts ride on that contraption until spacex does the hard work to change their corporate culture to value reliability -before- fancy tail landings, no matter what the may have to say publicly.

      And Boeing? always delayed "another 6 months". But to their credit it probably wont' blow up if they ever launch it.

      • One one rocket blew up this year, and one last year (two rockets in two years). The reasons for both are known with over 99% certainty. (CRS-7 was failure of a helium tank strut, AMOS-6 was formation of crystals of solid oxygen within the COPV overwrap). Both NASA and SpaceX investigated the CRS_7 accident and disagreed about probably cause. SpaceX went with the NASA report and implemented ALL of NASAs recommendations. Dragon 2 shares a common design with Red Dragon and there is no way Elon will allow th
        • Oooh, more details on the solid oxygen crystals cause idea? I hadn't seen that one yet.

          Also, I hadn't heard that SpaceX and NASA disagreed on the cause of the CRS-7 failure... more like SpaceX figured out early that the symptoms matched a failed helium tank strut but didn't believe it at first because none of the struts they tested failed similarly, so they went on reviewing and ended up testing most of their strut inventory before they found a few (just two?) that were also dangerously weak. At no part of

  • With the way Russia has been running their space program, I think we may be the one giving the Russians rides to the ISS. While it's embarrassing that we retired our only means of space flight before building something new, I'm glad we were able to pay to hitch a ride with the Russians. Scientific discovery is a long path and to not travel it is to say you care about your pride more than you care about science and that is a dangerous attitude.

  • by Solandri ( 704621 ) on Saturday October 15, 2016 @11:25AM (#53081493)
    2 years to build a new Soyuz capsule after it's ordered? It takes Boeing and Airbus about 80 days to build a 777 [airlinereporter.com] or A380 [techly.com.au].

    Even factoring in number of orders doesn't account for the difference. There are about 15 Soyuz launches per year [universetoday.com]. Airbus is delivering about 30 A380s per year [wikipedia.org]. So that would only account for a factor of 2, putting expected build time for a Soyuz at 160 days, or less than half a year.
    • 2 years to build a new Soyuz capsule after it's ordered? It takes Boeing and Airbus about 80 days to build a 777 or A380.

      Apples and oranges - because the second example doesn't examine the time from order to delivery. So, while it sounds impressive to the uneducated and clueless, your examples are completely meaningless.

    • by speedplane ( 552872 ) on Saturday October 15, 2016 @01:14PM (#53081957) Homepage

      2 years to build a new Soyuz capsule after it's ordered? It takes Boeing and Airbus about 80 days to build a 777 [airlinereporter.com] or A380 [techly.com.au].

      Wow, 80 days to make a 777? It takes Toyota only 17 hours to make a car [reference.com]! Wow, 17 hours to make a car? It takes my corner deli three minutes to make a sandwhich!

      False comparisons anyone?

    • Remember this is Russia. Most of the USSR state owned industry was sold to former Communist party members and other politically well connected people for pennies on the dollar, including the Soyuz factories. It takes 2 years to build a Soyuz because they use the exact same industrial process to build them that they used 40 years ago under Communist rule. It's Govornment subsidized and NASA pays through the teeth for it anyway, so zero incentive to improve inventory management or process efficiency.
    • IIRC the thing is the Russians operate two production lines in parallel to be able to keep the current Soyuz production output. If the US doesn't order more flights they'll just shutter one of the production lines. Oh and if you know anything about computer hardware, like CPU pipelining, you'll probably know that any pipeline (same model also applies to assembly lines) has startup latency and instruction latency. i.e. it may take a long time to restart production in a line until you get the first unit out,

    • Most Soyuz flights are unmanned, it takes a lot longer to prepare for a manned mission, especially when you have Russia's unmatched safety record.

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