Tesla Model 3 Outselling Small, Midsize Luxury Cars In US (forbes.com) 375
WindBourne shares a report from Forbes: In the second quarter of 2018, Tesla produced just over 53,000 vehicles, doubling its output compared to the same quarter last year. For the first time, Model 3 production (28,578) exceeded combined Model S and X production (24,761) with deliveries to customers totaling 40,740 for the quarter. The ramp up in Model 3 production is enabling it to outsell small and midsize luxury car sales in the U.S., according to some number crunching by CleanTechnica's Zachary Shahan.
His analysis claims that the Model 3 is crushing its "competitors" in that segment with total estimated sales for July amounting to 16,000 vehicles. The closest individual model to Tesla's mass-market endeavor is the Mercedes C-Class and even then, its July sales are estimated at just 6,029 units. The Model 3 is still untouchable when sales figures from multiple vehicles produced by the same company are added together. For example, the analysis expects sales of the BMW 2, 3, 4 and 5 Series to hit 12,811 at the end of July in total while customers will get their hands on 11,835 Mercedes C, CLA, CLS and E-Class models. That all means that Tesla would have a 23% share of the small and midsize luxury car market in July, ahead of BMW's 17% and Mercedes' 17%.
His analysis claims that the Model 3 is crushing its "competitors" in that segment with total estimated sales for July amounting to 16,000 vehicles. The closest individual model to Tesla's mass-market endeavor is the Mercedes C-Class and even then, its July sales are estimated at just 6,029 units. The Model 3 is still untouchable when sales figures from multiple vehicles produced by the same company are added together. For example, the analysis expects sales of the BMW 2, 3, 4 and 5 Series to hit 12,811 at the end of July in total while customers will get their hands on 11,835 Mercedes C, CLA, CLS and E-Class models. That all means that Tesla would have a 23% share of the small and midsize luxury car market in July, ahead of BMW's 17% and Mercedes' 17%.
Trucks? (Score:2)
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Every day Ford sells an average of 2,452 F-Series trucks...
http://autoweek.com/article/tr... [autoweek.com]
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They still won't have cleared their model 3 backlog by then, so good luck with that.
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"but, in either 2019 or 2020, Tesla is supposed to have their truck out."
And I think you meant Model Y, not the Tesla Truck - or did you mean Tesla Semi?
If Musk & Straubel are telling the truth they'll still be struggling to meet demand for the S3X mobiles, they'll need a place to build the Semi and they'll still be trying to make enough battery cells for Model 3, PowerPacks and PowerWalls
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I assumed he was talking about the pickup, which comes out after Model Y. But that won't be in 2019 or 2020. 2021 at the earliest.
In some ways, pickup trucks are awesome targets for an EV manufacturer like Tesla. They can produce bonkers amounts of torque. They have a low CG to resist tipping with awkward loads. They can (and Tesla plans to) put high-power AC sockets on the vehicle so you can use your truck in place of a generator on a worksite. Their air suspension will self-level loads, and they're talkin
Re:Trucks? (Score:5, Insightful)
And in 1907 more people bought horse carriages than all automobiles combined, and the city streets were full of manure rather than the air being full of pollution. Change happens.
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So the air went from being smelly to causing cancer?
Re:Trucks? (Score:4, Interesting)
So the air went from being smelly to causing cancer?
From being a vector of immediate disease affecting all ages to being a vector of delayed disease affecting primarily the elderly, yes.
http://www.banhdc.org/archives/ch-hist-19711000.html [banhdc.org]
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Ancient people just happened not to have discovered cancer or properly documented many ailments from burning of wood
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"Tesla's vehicles are not overly expensive"
Watcha smokin there man? Of course Tesla's vehicles are overly expensive. The base price of the cheapest Toyota Camry -- which is what you look at if you have a wife, a couple of kids, a normal job, and need wheels is $23645. Prius (hybrid) is about the same. Likewise Honda Accord, Ford Fusion, and I assume whatever GM is selling to typical North Americans.
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They're comparing to the situation with earlier cars. Early automobiles were seen as luxury toys for wealthy families. The Model T helped change this, but it still wasn't cheap. While a simple "purchasing power" conversion on the $850 starting price is $22,5k in today's money, the average household annual income back then for the bottom 90% was under $10k.
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What Honda Accord does 0-60 in 3.5? Every Tesla outperforms every BMW on the road at the same price point and many cars at higher price points. Performance is why electric is suddenly filling the future roadmaps for all car companies. We love performance.
When electric pickups do hit the market, they are going to have to ban them from tractor pulls. Otherwise, a lot of sensitive folks will be real embarrassed. There have already been a lot of incidents when stock Tesla sedans took the slips from people with
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"You'll see the way non-hybrid, non-EV gas or diesel trucks are advertised change overnight. They will never talk about their towing power again. The low end torque of the electric blows everything else in the consumer market away"
The advantage for towing will probably be claimed by hybrids. Long distance towing at highway speed is too much for the currently available Li-on battery packs.
For the Model X, towing 3500 lbs at 60 mph will probably cut your range by 40-60% depending on road condition & weath
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A Honda Accord is an econobox with a fraction the standard features, it's a silly comparison. And it still loses the performance on that. And even if it wasn't a silly, losing comparison, just the energy cost savings alone (forget about tax credits) would put the Model 3 in front.
And you're apparently unaware that 1) it was not battery overheating that limited how many laps you could do at max power in the Model S and X, but rotor overheating (common misunderstanding), and 2) this does not affect Model 3,
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That's what counts (Score:5, Insightful)
I suppose we can expect more muskisdelusionalandoutofcash postings.
In the last Tesla thread I pointed out that, as an stockholder, what I am looking for is NOT Elon Musk's cute personality or science fantasy. Nor do I care to whig out at every little story of production problems. What I am looking for is:
Technological leadership.
Market presence.
Production leadership.
Most of all: backorders and strong forecast. None of the rest matters unless you have someone willing to buy it. Tesla has that in spades.
So Tesla is delivering. Skepticism is healthy but not to the extent that the Tesla naysayers on /. take it.
Interesting information (Score:5, Insightful)
I suppose we can expect more muskisdelusionalandoutofcash postings.
In the last Tesla thread I pointed out that, as an stockholder, what I am looking for is NOT Elon Musk's cute personality or science fantasy. Nor do I care to whig out at every little story of production problems. What I am looking for is:
Technological leadership.
Market presence.
Production leadership.
Most of all: backorders and strong forecast. None of the rest matters unless you have someone willing to buy it. Tesla has that in spades.
So Tesla is delivering. Skepticism is healthy but not to the extent that the Tesla naysayers on /. take it.
There are a lot of people sending out fake news about Tesla nowadays, but there's an interesting bit of information.
Normally, in the two weeks ahead of a financial report the stock will mirror the report outcome. If the report is good, the stock will rise a little just before the announcement. If the report is bad, the stock will drop a little.
Tesla will be making their Q2 announcement on Wednesday (after the market closes), and it's dropped by 10% in that time.
In any other stock that would indicate bad news, but for Tesla? It could indicate a last-ditch effort for the bears to drive the stock down before a "good news" report. People are changing Tesla from "hold" to "sell", and saying that they're certain Tesla will need another round of financing.
(Musk claims that they will not need another round, and that Tesla will be profitable in Q3 and Q4 of this year.)
Tesla short interest is 34m shares right now [nasdaq.com], and with 170m shares outstanding, that's about 20% of Tesla is being shorted right now. 25% is held by Musk, so that's about 1/4 of public shares are held short.
There are three key periods coming up for Tesla: the Q2 report (Wednesday), and Q3 and Q4 of this year.
Over 50% of Tesla shares are held by 5 entities: Musk, Fidelity, Baillie Gifford, and so on. If the institutions dig their heels into the sand and refuse to sell, and if the other public shareholders also refuse to sell, there will be a short run and the stock price will skyrocket. There's nowhere that the short sellers can go [thebalance.com] to settle.
If no one is selling the stock, or there are many buyers, including panic buyers, caused by other short sellers attempting to close out their positions as they lose more and more money, you may be in a position to incur serious losses.
The institutions know this. Many of the public shareholders know this.
If the stock jumps up and Tesla seems reasonably solvent, it's estimated the short sellers will be out several tens of billions of dollars.
Expect a lot of wailing and gnashing of teeth...
(I own shares in Tesla and want to see them succeed.)
Re: Interesting information (Score:2)
Not that risky (Score:2)
I own some small amount of TSLA.
I don't really consider it risky at all, especially not compared to almost any biotech stock.
Do you seriously think it is riskier than Amazon at this point?
Where is that capital coming from?
*If* they need it, that capital would easily come from these sales figures and market share. The shorts all were betting that Musk would have no access to capital. But if Tesla is meeting or beating delivery forecasts and still has a. good backorder and strong demand, what kind of idiot
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Yeah, 1100100001000, you are right. Tesla is going to lose big. I trust that you have lots of shorts on it? You should go ahead and put everything that you own on it. After all, you are just like Montana Skeptic . You just KNOW that Tesla is going to lose big. By all means, put your money on the shorts.
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How would "bears" drive the stock price down, especially if no one is selling?
If a company is on the stock market there's always going to be at least some selling and buying of their stock, which combined with a small number of people doing this makes the stock price manipulation relatively easy for big players. A stock short is an investment where you essentially borrow someone else's stock, sell it on the stock market and then bet that by the time you need to return those borrowed stocks the stock will be cheaper than you sold that (someone else's) stock and can buy the same number
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What I am looking for is: Technological leadership. Market presence. Production leadership. Most of all: backorders and strong forecast.
I notice that you didn't list 'Making a Profit' in your list.
Quick question (Score:2)
Well then as a stockholder you are looking at the wrong thing then. You can have all those things and still go out of business. The fact is that Tesla is $10 billion in debt and has a negative 90 P/E ratio. In addition, Tesla will need to go back to the capital markets to get more money.
Just a hypothetical question.
Suppose, just suppose, Tesla turns a profit in Q3 and Q4 of this year.
What would that do to the neg 90 P/E ratio, and would they still need to get more money?
Put aside whether they will or wont, first answer the question: If they become suddenly profitable, what will the outlook be like?
Tesla tends to run in the red in the years running up to a new model, then makes a profit for the next year or so. [bloomberg.com]
If Musk is correct, and they start being profitable in Q3 and Q4, what will happe
Ask me in about a year (Score:2)
How do I know if the stock will go up or not? I have no idea. The stock is intrinsically worth about $0 at this point, but it is $291. Tesla has a market capitalization greater than GM. It makes no sense. My point is as an individual stockholder you guys are looking at the wrong thing. You are putting your money at a huge risk with very little additional upside and zero return in your investment until you sell. Do you think Tesla stock will double and go to $600? Then you "made" 100%. What if it goes bankrupt? You lost all your money. Is the risk worth potentially making 100%? That is nuts.
Ask me in about a year - that's my horizon for holding the Tesla stock.
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Nissan produce EVs that normal people can afford, but they don't go very fast or very far, don't have a widespread charging network, and their batteries are notorious for degrading over time (due to their inadequate cooling system). I have no comment on the value of Nissan stock, but I wouldn't buy it based on the assumption that the Leaf is going to take over the world.
And as for Tesla's terrible financials Have you checked Ford's debt load?
I made a bundle on Tesla's stock back during the big run-up when
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Value today (Score:3)
"Tesla has a market capitalization greater than GM. It makes no sense. " - considering GM went bust quite recently and your taxes bailed it out at a billion dollar loss, it makes perfect sense
Your analysis is both flawed and biased. GM went bust a decade ago because they didn't have access to cash to cover their debt obligations. Tesla only survived during the same period by borrowing $465 million from the federal government. Tesla has substantial debt obligations and their near term cash flow is still a question. Tesla is a FAR riskier investment TODAY than GM is. What happened 10 years ago is irrelevant to the discussion. Currently GM is very profitable and Tesla is decidedly not. Tesl
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Yeah everyone knows, Telsa has been shorted to hell but all those shorts are like ticking time bombs because Tesla Roadster. Also the company looking to buy Tesla on the cheap seems to have given up and is instead making their own electric vehicles.
Not that everything is rosy for Tesla, 2019 looks to be the year of electrics, a lot of models coming out across a wide range of manufacturers. Likely 2020 should be the last year you buy a infernal combustion engined vehicle because after that you will be burni
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This quarter could be a special case. There is a 200,000 vehicle trigger for reducing/eliminating government subsidies at Tesla is close to that mark. By delaying deliveries by a few weeks or diverting production to another market, they can push the date when the 200,000 limit is reached into the next quarter, and thus delay the loss of subsidies by a quarter. I've seen this discussed several times, here is the first article discussing it that I found by web search:
http://www.latimes.com/busines... [latimes.com]
Researchers at the online publication Inside EVs said Tesla probably reached the 200,000-unit mark on its models 3, X and S in June. However, Tesla could have worked the numbers so the target will be hit in July, by shipping more cars to Canada, for example.Under Internal Revenue Service rules, the first subsidy cutback, to $3,750, would begin for cars delivered in October or January, depending on when the 200,000 limit is hit.
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They probably had 13,000 cars they had to scrap because their production line is shit.
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Re: That's what counts (Score:2)
Eg: Enron? Yeah... so typical (you are grasping at straws if that's what you use to defend your argument).
Tesla is not lying about it's numbers, or they would look better. Tesla is delivering on their agenda, and continuing to develop products and refine their business WHILE short on capital (Roadster, Model 3, Semi, Model Y).
That demonstrates management's commitment to the vision. Elon will get the money. They fact that there is a story about Tesla in papers every third day tells you that love him or hate
Amazon is different (Score:5, Insightful)
I share your enthusiasm and hope for Tesla to be a successful American auto maker.
Please don't conflate Tesla with Amazon, however. Jeff Bezo could have flipped the switch on profitability 10 years ago. He dragged the shareholders through this long process while building out infrastructure with all revenue brought in. Kind of like in the movie, "There will be blood" where the guy is buying up all the land around the town and nobody knows why, then he starts pumping oil out of all that property and nobody can negotiate a sale of property on the newly-realized value. In the case of Amazon, Bezos wanted to absolutely pave an immense footprint before being held to profitability on a quarterly basis by the shareholders. Now he's got an fairly diversified company that dominates in many sectors (public cloud, online retail, digital media readers, echo).
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How is that different from Tesla? Their debt is also about building out infrastructure. They're also pursuing diverse markets. The recent German tear-down showed their cars are comfortably profitable, even the lowest-priced models.
Re: That's what counts (Score:2)
1. I own no Tesla stocks. Those that do either short them, or see such valuations, that they are prepared for that to happen. Running out of funds isn't something that's going to come as a surprise to anyone, much less shareholders who actively watch the news cycles. Also, that's assuming they don't sell enough to satisfy their debt, a big IF.
2. If you have disdain for the CEO, that's one thing. But your just throwing shade at the company. You run dangerously close to the sort of guys we heard throwing shad
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Of course... (Score:5, Interesting)
All this depends on Tesla being able to get the damn things produced and delivered to customers. The Model 3 production ramp up has been much slower than Elon predicted, but it is steadily improving, even as TSLA stock takes a beating (mostly due to Elon's regrettable antics on social media). Ironically, Elon's bold claims are probably more to blame than Tesla's actual performance. In any other context, a 100% increase in production in one year would be seen as quite strong, but because they keep failing to meet Elon's projections, they keep getting criticized by analysts.
Ultimately, I think they will get over this hump, but "production hell" is going to continue for a good while yet. Ramping up to high-volume production of automobiles is a unique challenge for Elon, and building a production line in tents has an unpleasant aroma of desperation.
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BTW, the 'tent' makes total sense. First off, they are based where they have a nice moderate climate similar to what Europe has. Generally, no real weather extreme. But, here in COlorado, DIA, generally the top rated airport in
Cars don't matter (Score:2)
Re: Cars don't matter (Score:2)
Next time there's a gas crisis, Ford will be looking for their bailout.
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Ford doesn't need to. They can't build trucks fast enough and have jacked prices way up.
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Now what, shorts? (Score:3, Insightful)
Time to get your media buddies to make up some #metoo fake news about Elon before your positions are called.
Or maybe just flee to Thailand before the inevitable happens.
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But the truth is, they need to little of maintenance that there will be a fraction of the companies out there.
not selling - delivering! (Score:2, Interesting)
Tesla and the competition (Score:5, Interesting)
I've seen this theory going around, that other car makers--the big boys, established companies that have been in business for decades--are just waiting until Tesla has done all the expensive R&D for them and primed the market, then they're all going to pile in with their own electric cars and crush poor, naive Tesla.
Good luck with that. So far I haven't seen any indication that any established car makers have the ability to mass-produce a desirable (in particular, long-range) electric car and sell it at a profit, and I haven't seen any indication that any of them are ramping up for an attempt to do so. A recent poll of auto executives found a solid majority of them still expect battery-electric cars to fail in the marketplace, and quite a few of them still think hydrogen fuel cells are the future. Are these the guys who are going to green-light EV production on a massive scale?
The latest "Tesla killer" to get a lot of buzz was the Jaguar I-Pace. They flew a bunch of reporters out to Portugal to show it off, and the machine seems to have impressed many of them. But how many do Jaguar plan to make? How many are they even able to make? The latest numbers I've seen suggest that Tesla are now out-producing Jaguar. I don't mean they're making more electric cars than Jaguar; I mean they're making more cars that Jaguar's total automotive output.
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Other car makers are selling some great EVs too. The Hyundai Kona is the first affordable, long range model, for example. It's got autopilot, 300 mile range, decent performance etc. Costs $20,000 less than a Model 3 equivalent and is available to buy. Unlimited battery warranty too.
Nissan really screwed up with the latest revision of the Leaf, but the one due later this year might allow them to recover. Should have a similar range to the Kona.
Kia has the Niro due early next year, should be a little lower ra
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I don't think it's a theory.
The large car manufacturers are pushing out orders-of-magnitude more cars than Tesla will be able to manage for at least a decade, even with their fantasy growth. They can take the entire market any time they like - how much advertising do they put to that market? Zero. It's just not worth their time at the moment.
But they have R&D and investment and cash-on-hand that Tesla can only dream of, and they can flood the market with a dozen models each in a year or so if they re
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There is a bit of secret sauce. You can't just pull the drive train out of a regular vehicle, drop in electric, and have an EV that performs well. To get near the full advantage in every aspect, especially safety, the vehicle must be designed as electric from scratch. Traditional makers have a lot of rearranging to do, even the major stages of assembly change from a traditional 3 to 2 if you want to compete. Their supply chains will totally change. There are a lot of pluses and minuses for different electri
Very Impressive Numbers... But (Score:3)
It took a lot of hard work by many many people to get to this point. Definitely a HUGE achievement by all the workers at Tesla.
However, one winning quarter cannot be always extrapolated per dot-com-boom hockey stick exponential estimates.
If Tesla can keep these sales percentage numbers this high indefinitely, then they're definitely worth what they're valued at today.
So far Tesla is roughly following the same pattern as as Space-X. One successful landing of a first stage was a HUGE accomplishment, but is not as disruptive as SEVERAL successful landings in a row... Space-X has now accomplished multiple successful launches of reused first stages and is NO DOUBT leading the even the established conglomerates with reliable, low cost launch vehicles. Tesla is not at that stage yet, and it is not 100% certain that it will dominate, but it certainly has a chance, much better today than x months ago which is itself a great achievement.
Re: Regular orders or filling back orders? (Score:5, Informative)
The size of the backlog is still increasing, so demand shows no sign of slowing down anytime soon.
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Then there's the fact that most of the world - including me - can't get theirs yet. Only the US and Canada.
Also there's a number of configs that you just can't get yet. Yes, some are lower profit, like non-PUP and SR battery. But I'm among those wanting, for example, air suspension and a tow hitch, both options Tesla has talked about (air suspension is supposed to be early next year), and neither of which are out. Also, the white interior is now available in the AWD, not just P, but still not RWD.
It's one
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I bought shares with no intent to sell them until late Q4 at the earliest, most likely Q1-Q2 of next year. I'm not a day trader (fees here on US stocks are too high for that!). I'm in this for the Model 3 rampup period. It's a simple wager: Tesla proves that they can mass produce Model 3s profitably and that they have a sustained market for them, or they don't. I say yes, you say no. I put my money in when the shorts made an opportunity for me. I take it out at the end of the rampup, or when it's at leas
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The way it works is the more you spend option wise the more you get bumped up in the queue. Realistically people are spending about $60k for a model 3.
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Basically, yes. A reservation reserves you a place in line.... for a specific 1) configuration grouping, 2) market, and 3) customer status (employee > Tesla owner > non-Tesla owner). It's effectively not one list, but many smaller lists.
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It's my understanding most of the people on the list really wanted the $35K model and are now losing interest and bowing out because Must hasn't delivered on it.
Quite a few were holding out for the AWD / dual-motor which is now being delivered.
I imagine there'll be significant demand for the base ($35k) model with dual motor but those will have to wait until next year which means a Federal tax credit of at most $1900
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No. The US federal tax credit starts next year at $3750, and for the latter half of the year drops to $1875. Model 3 SR is supposed to start shipping around the start of the year.
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There are a lot of people cancelling their per-order. But that is in general money in the bank to Testla as their deposit is non-refundable. For the most part I expect it wasn't people loosing interest but couldn't wait for a new car for one reason or an other. Being their backlog every cancel order is extra money to them and closer to finishing up their backlog.
Just as long the cancellations don't exceed output capacity they should be good.
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The pre-order deposit is fully refundable until you order. I know a few people who have had their refunds lately.
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Deleted from the website, huh? [tesla.com] (search "standard battery")
Funny, that [tesla.com] (Scroll to "Model 3 specs")
That's the press kit and the Model 3 info page, respectively - the two most prominent places on the website to look for info on the Model 3.
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No matter how many times you repeat a myth, that doesn't make it true [slashdot.org].
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They're just filling pre-orders. The numbers make good clickbait though.
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Indeed they are. With production. Which is the whole point, as people on this site have been ranting and raving, "Tesla can't mass produce cars". Except that they can and are.
Re:Regular orders or filling back orders? (Score:4, Insightful)
I think it's funny how I've already seen attempts to spin this negative for Tesla no matter what the sales numbers are. Backlog of orders isn't shrinking? Poor Tesla, they just can't mass-produce them like a real car company, they'll never catch up. Backlog of orders shrinks? Poor Tesla, they're stuck building a product that there just isn't that much demand for after all. Everything is grist for the mill of skeptics.
Re:Regular orders or filling back orders? (Score:5, Insightful)
Unfortunately it's as bad from both sides. You have the people who want Tesla to fail for whatever reason, and the fanboys who can't accept that any other EV might not be a steaming pile of shit.
Tesla makes some good cars. They have also had a lot of quality issues, and their prices are pretty high. Good luck to them, we need more EVs. At the same time, companies like Hyundai and Nissan/Renault have made some good cars too, starting from the affordable end of the market instead, and are now releasing cars with 300 mile range and features like autopilot. Hooray for them too.
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300 miles - you're talking about the Kona. Hyundai expects it to be EPA rated at 250 miles combined for the more expensive variant. Remember that Model 3 LR RWD range actually measured in at 334 miles EPA; Tesla deliberately downrated it so that all variants (including LR P) would get the same EPA range. The long-range Kona will come in somewhat more expensive than the 220 mile Model 3 SR (not out in the US either), but less expensive than the 310/334 mile Model 3 LR. Basically priced in the same range.
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ED: "..nearly the Kona's entire range higher than the Kona's peak power..."
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We have been over all this. Bjorn did 510km in a Kona with normal driving, not hypermiling or anything. He was seeing over 350km range at 125km/h, so exceeding the speed limit constantly. And you are trying to compare with the M3 LR, a car that costs $20,000 more for a similar spec.
Bjorn also noted how well the autopilot works. His only criticism is that it doesn't slow down if you release your hands from the wheel, so pretty much the same as Tesla used to be until the latest software update that owners are
Re:Regular orders or filling back orders? (Score:5, Interesting)
Oh come on. He did 510km in a Kona on eco tires and aero wheels with no passenger at an average speed of under 90kph / 56mph. And you know that.
1) His long-range run was at 120kph, not 125. With an average slightly under that.
2) Going 68% as far at 120kph as at 90kph is a big dropoff, and a testament to the lack of good aerodynamics on the Kona.
120kph (75mph) - while far faster than my speed limit - is not by any stretch an unusual highway speed in much of the world. Many places drive faster. 90kph / 56mph, by contrast, is on the very low end of highway speeds, by global standards. I live in AFAIK the only developed country that doesn't have any roads with speed limits faster than that.
No. Please, at least get your pricing right. Model 3 LR starts at $44k USD. You're adding PUP and who knows what else in. The "long range" Kona starts at £34,500 in the UK (no US pricing yet). So subtracting 20% VAT and converting to USD, that's $37830. Pricewise, that's slotting in 31% of the way between SR and LR. Range-wise, that's 33% of the way between SR and the nominal LR range of 310 miles, or 26% of the way between SR and the measured LR range of 334 miles.
I know you want to try to load up the Model 3 with packages to try to make it more expensive, under the excuse of "anything that Kona has, we'll tack on a Model 3 package for that", but sorry, that's not even remotely a fair comparison, since you're not doing the reverse. Kona doesn't even have a freaking app for crying out loud, let alone literally dozens of standard Model 3 features. I know your favourite package to do this with is Autopilot, but the portions of that which really matter (safety-related) come free.
You don't get to load up one with options to try to artificially boost the price; that's just ridiculous.
Who should I listen to, some not-that-enthusiastic commentary, or my lying eyes? Here, let's quote from the comments section of that video:
"That's... actually rather terrifying." - My comment. One of the most liked comments in the thread :)" :O They need to fix this in case people have a medical situation."
"So the car will turn off the assist and rely on lesser technologies when you need it the most? Incredibly bad design." - THE most liked comment in the thread
"we called it DDM = drunk driver mode not LFA
"This is dangerous
"Thats not good. it need to drop the speed"
"Scary drunk system"
"That’s disappointing "
"WTF I was expecting lexus lfa =("
You seem to be the only person who thinks this is acceptable. This is going to kill people. And I don't mean "one every several hundred million miles, at a rate less than a human driver". I mean frequently. You leave your hands off the wheel for too long and the car decides to drive like you're on heroin? Who the heck thought this up?
1) This is not true. Autopilot has always braked to a stop and put the flashers on if you cease responding to driver input
2) The only thing people were "moaning" about was the frequency of the alerts. In the latest update, they decreased them (but not to as far apart as they were previously) and made the
Re:Regular orders or filling back orders? (Score:5, Interesting)
He drive 510km at normal highway speed in Norway in the tyres/wheels that the car comes with. What do you want Rei, what specific set-up do you require for the Rei Certified Efficient Driving Range Test?
His long-range run was at 120kph, not 125
Look at the speedometer. Anyway, who cares? He was doing the speed limit or slightly above. Most of Europe has the same limit. He got 220 miles, which is the same as the similarly priced Model 3 SR gets with efficient driving. The point is undeniable, even if you do want to quibble over 5 kph.
And your beloved Model 3 also tanks efficiency at higher speeds. That's how drag works. And the Kona is still showing better efficiency at 120 kph in Bjorn's test.
Many places drive faster.
Here's a comprehensive list: https://www.theaa.ie/aa/motori... [theaa.ie]
Most are 120, and handful 130.
Model 3 LR starts at $44k USD. You're adding PUP and who knows what else in.
I'm adding autopilot, because the Kona has something similar. You get fewer luxuries in the M3 at that price, but it's broadly similar.
Here, let's quote from the comments section of that video:
Really, you are quoting the YouTube comments section now? And you take that over what Bjorn, an exert on EVs who has driven them all and extensively tested multiple steering assist systems, says?
Anyway, I'm not convinced that coming to a stop in the middle of a 120km/h highway is such a good idea either. Especially since Autopilot tends to just ram straight into stationary vehicles without bothering to slow down. That sounds even more suicidal.
If lane keeping alone was that dangerous then we would already see all these frequent fatalities as people with cruise control and lane keeping take their hands off the wheel and get little more than a beep or a nudge in the many millions of vehicles that already have it.
Re:Strange (Score:5, Insightful)
Here is a map of just Tesla Super Chargers. I see load in Texas. [supercharge.info]
Here is a map of all commercial electric chargers [energy.gov] Keep in mind with EVs, most of your electricity comes from your own home since few trips are more than 100 miles.
Here is a graph of Tesla registrations by state, about a year ago. [quora.com] Since over 5% are in Texas, that would mean at least 20K cars are Tesla just in Texas.
The real issue is that you are noticing what you want to see.
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Re:Strange (Score:5, Informative)
Maybe you should try visiting Austin sometime. And as far as charging stations in Texas, please let me introduce you to plugshare.com!
Just as an exercise, I zoomed the plugshare map in on the Houston / Galveston area, and it popped up 208 charging locations. And then just for fun I filtered out everything except Tesla-specific locations (i.e. filtering out ones a Tesla would require a simple adapter to use), and came up with 66. However If you actually live in the Houston / Galveston area, you'd probably never use any of them. If you are like most Tesla owners you'd charge your car at home and only use other charging points when you actually travel out of town anyhow.
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Blame the fact that there are less Teslas in Texas than there are elsewhere on the scumbags at the Texas Automobile Dealers Association that have thus far managed to buy out enough politicians to keep their dinosaur business model alive and keep Tesla out of the state.
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I saw the same "report" that you saw, and it was nothing but a rumor. Then Elon Musk responded saying it was false, but didn't release any actual numbers. So I guess you can believe whatever you want to believe. As for the "huge debt load", it's nothing compared to Ford, but somehow I don't see people raging on Ford all the time.
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I saw the same "report" that you saw, and it was nothing but a rumor. Then Elon Musk responded saying it was false, but didn't release any actual numbers. So I guess you can believe whatever you want to believe. As for the "huge debt load", it's nothing compared to Ford, but somehow I don't see people raging on Ford all the time.
TSLA has over 11B in long and short term debt. FMC has 3.1B
You should compare TSLA and FMC finacials.
https://www.nasdaq.com/symbol/... [nasdaq.com]
https://www.nasdaq.com/symbol/... [nasdaq.com]
Re: Market share may solve there problems... (Score:2)
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They're already pre-sold.
More like 13,000 cars failed QA due to production issues or they're gaming the tax credit/government subsidies by delaying shipment.
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That would take time and effort.
I don't spend time researching slashdot comments.
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1) wiki The Tesla Model 3 is a mid-size (US) / compact executive (EU)[7] luxury all-electric four-door sedan manufactured and sold by Tesla, Inc. [wikipedia.org]
2) Car and DriverHowever, in its current form (only models equipped to a price of $50,000 and up are available as of this writing), it is actually more of a compact luxury sedan competing with the BMW 3-series in size and price. [caranddriver.com]
3) Top Gear What is it? Oh, just some sensibly priced electric BMW 3 Series rival from a little-known American start- [topgear.com]
Meanwhile... (Score:3)
...Pickup Trucks are crushing all of them put together.
Re:3... 2... 1... (Score:5, Funny)