YouTube's Biggest Stars Are Pushing a Shady Polish Gambling Site

An anonymous reader quotes a report from The Daily Beast: Untold riches are promised on Mystery Brand, a website that sells prize-filled "mystery boxes." If you buy one of the digital boxes, some of which cost hundreds of dollars, you might only get a fidget spinner -- or you might get a luxury sports car. For just $100, users can win a box filled with rare Supreme streetwear. For only $12.99, they can win a Lamborghini, or even a $250 million mega-mansion billed as "the most expensive Los Angeles realty." Or at least that's what some top YouTubers have been telling their young fans about the gambling site -- with the video stars apparently seeing that as a gamble worth taking, especially after a dip in YouTube advertising rates.

Over the past week, hugely popular YouTube stars like Jake Paul and Bryan "Ricegum" Le have encouraged their fans to spend money on Mystery Brand, a previously little-known site that appears to be based in Poland. In their videos, Paul and Le show themselves betting hundreds of dollars on the site for a chance to open a digital "box." At first, they win only low-value prizes like fidget spinners or Converse sneakers. By the end of the video, though, they have won thousands of dollars worth of tech and clothing, like rare pairs of sneakers or Apple AirPods. If they like the prize, the YouTube stars have it shipped to their house. The gambling site doesn't list the owner or location where it's based, although the site's terms of service say it's "subject to the laws and jurisdiction of Poland." To make matters worse, users of the site might not even receive the items they believed they have won. "During using the services of the website You may encounter circumstances in which Your won items will not be received," the terms of service reads.

Also, while the ToS say that underage users are ineligible to receive prizes, many of the YouTubers promoting the site have audiences who are underage. "[Jake Paul], for example, has acknowledged that the bulk of his fanbase is between 8 and 15 years old," reports The Daily Beast.

Right!

[Locke2005]

There is NO WAY this could POSSIBLY be a scam! There is no way the people who got a Lamborghini for $13 are actually paid actors!

Re:Right!

[zlives]

i don't know, my shelf is full of cars i got for less than 13$s

Re:

[Locke2005]

Granted, that's not the custom, but we say "13 dollars", not "dollars 13", so the custom is technically backwards!

Re:

[zlives]

just breaking the chains of tradition one $ sign at a time :)

Re:Right!

[rmdingler]

Perhaps we should give the product-hawking celebrities the benefit of the doubt... and a bonus anti-tiger rock [youtube.com] for their trouble.

Re:

[Locke2005]

Was Stephen Hawking a product-hawking celebrity?

Re:

[rmdingler]

Hmmmm...Yes indeed, if science can be considered a product.

Sadly, the price he asked was too high for many, since to benefit, you had to be willing to pay attention.

$13 what about $0.75 CAR CAR CAR slots?

[Joe_Dragon]

$13 what about $0.75 CAR CAR CAR slots?

Re:

[SuricouRaven]

But what sort of scam? there are many types. The advertising is almost certainly a scam, yes - but what of the site itsself? Is it an outright scam where no prizes of value are ever won, ever? Or is it merely the acceptable scam of gambling, where the big prizes are won, but only incredibly rarely?

Re:

[Impy the Impiuos Imp]

It' similar to those late-night "auction" web sites where you pay a dollar to make a bid that will almost certainly fail. The accumulation of bid dollars is what pays for the product -- they even reserve the right to cancel the "auction" if they don't get enough $1 bids.

It is mathematically gambling through and through.

Re:

[SuricouRaven]

I actually can envision ways to rig the advertising without paying actors. But paying is probably a lot easier. For example, I could hire someone to monitor Twitch or YouTube live streams for people playing on the site, then correlate their wins with the real-time logs from the server to identify their accounts, and tag those accounts as 'highly visible people' so they get a guaranteed win. It's a lot of effort though, so it'd be easier to just find some unscrupulous mid-tier streamers and bribe them.

This should be illegal

[jonwil]

Online gambling is already illegal in the US, why is it not illegal to run ads for it? YouTube should be pushed into adding a clause to their terms of service that prevents anyone from running ads or sponsors for things that are otherwise illegal.

Re:

[spagthorpe]

They could, but they won't; because YT makes tons of money on them.

Re:

[AmiMoJo]

I dunno, they have sanctioned Logan Paul in the past, dropping him from their premium services and suspending his ad revenue temporarily. He's hardly the only one either, they have closed lots of popular, high revenue channels. Especially those aimed at children, like those creepy Spiderman/Elsa videos.

Re:

[Calydor]

Pretty sure that is already in the ToS, and this is going to backfire HARD.

Re:

[sd4f]

The problem is this is a bigger chestnut to crack than it may seems. Loot boxes have crept into many games, and ultimately it is gambling, but what has been really insidious about it is that it targets children. What this OP mentions, has already happened on Counter-Strike, with certain youtubers promoting their own scam sites for in game items/skins. Just go on youtube and look up any number of unlock videos, there's heaps. People don't bother playing the game, rather they want to just try to unlock digita

Re:This should be illegal

[F.Ultra]

I really wonder if the TOS with "During using the services of the website You may encounter circumstances in which Your won items will not be received" is actually legal in Poland to begin with.

Re:

[RedMagic]

The full text of that TOS paragraph says: 9. DRAWBACKS AND DEFECTS 9.1. During using the services of the website You may encounter circumstances in which Your won items will not be received. In this case, the Web site will make every effort to resolve this situation and try as soon as possible to resolve Your problem. The maximum term of consideration of the defect/error is 45 working days. So, as far as I understand, it's just an explanation of how they'll handle issues with delivery of the prizes (if no

Re:

[Can'tNot]

Because this doesn't count as gambling. There are a huge number of products which do this now, from video games to legos. Here [mgae.com] is a popular line of dolls which does the same thing. The key, the thing which distinguishes this from gambling, is that you always get some kind of prize. Gambling is specifically defined as a possibility to lose your money, not to get something less valuable than you wanted. As long as you always get something with non-zero value, then it doesn't count as gambling.

Re:This should be illegal

[Igmuth]

So, as long as the casino always gives you a penny, or even a just shiny rock back on each bet, it's not gambling?

Re:

[Can'tNot]

Well you don't call them bets, but that's the right idea. Call them lootboxes, or prize packs or something. You might also want to stay away from using money as prizes, since a loss in that case can be easily quantified in court. You'd also probably do better with this if you weren't a casino, which are readily identified with gambling, so that you could claim that this an alternative business model rather than just gambling by another name.

Re:This should be illegal

[thegarbz]

You're comparing them to things that are being classified as gambling and are being banned the world over.

Saying it's "not gambling, it's like lootboxes" is the equivalent of saying "it's not gambling, it's gambling" in pretty much every country which has had a legal inquiry into the practice.

Re:

[Can'tNot]

To my knowledge, the only country which has done anything like what you're describing is Belgium. When you say, "in pretty much every country," which countries are you referring to, exactly?

In the United States I believe that the legal precedent was set quite some time ago over baseball cards, which are functionally equivalent to loot boxes / prize packs / etc. That's a vague recollection though, I would not be able to cite that case.

Re:

[thegarbz]

To my knowledge, the only country which has done anything like what you're describing is Belgium

That's okay, knowledge can be built on:
Belgium - banned.
Netherlands - actively called out what components of it make it gambling and some of the industry has responded by customising how it works in the NL.
UK - not banned but formally recognised as a form of gambling by the UK gambling commission. On hearing this the Isle of Man banned them.
Australia - regulated under gambling laws but recognised difficulty in enforcement.
China - regulated under gambling laws.
Japan - banned.
South Korea - regulated under gam

Re:

[Can'tNot]

I don't know the particulars of all of these, but loot boxes are certainly not banned in Japan. There was a new rule saying that companies had to disclose exactly what was available and with what probability, so they're no longer quite the mystery boxes that they used to be, but loot boxes are still going strong there.

Re:

[thegarbz]

I don't know the particulars of all of these, but loot boxes are certainly not banned in Japan. There was a new rule saying that companies had to disclose exactly what was available and with what probability, so they're no longer quite the mystery boxes that they used to be, but loot boxes are still going strong there.

There were no new rules, in fact no changes in rules or laws at all. The lootbox concept was analysed and a legal opinion was issued determining that they constitute gambling. Most companies then removed the features https://www.japantimes.co.jp/l... [japantimes.co.jp].

Just because some companies skirt the laws (as online gambling companies tend to do) it doesn't change the underlying principle that the practice was banned.

Re:

[rsmith-mac]

So long as you can't then immediately use that item as currency to make a new bet, yeah, there's a legitimately good chance that would pass legal muster right now.

Re:

[Impy the Impiuos Imp]

That communist Harvard guy claims the stock market is gambling and should be illegal.

Re:This should be illegal

[RedMagic]

For the record: online gambling in Poland is also illegal.

Re:

[ISayWeOnlyToBePolite]

Online gambling is already illegal in the US, why is it not illegal to run ads for it? YouTube should be pushed into adding a clause to their terms of service that prevents anyone from running ads or sponsors for things that are otherwise illegal.

The legalese concerning online gambling isn't that simple https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org] (additional state laws may apply).

Re:

[citizenr]

Its also illegal as fuck in Poland.

Re:

[arglebargle_xiv]

Shady? It's not like a bunch of Pollocks run it ... oh, wait

So it's just another phishing [whitbyseaanglers.co.uk] scam?

Who?

[Anonymous Coward]

Yet more YouTube "stars" that I've never heard of before this article.

Re:

[thegarbz]

Yet more YouTube "stars" that I've never heard of before this article.

Do you know all the stars around the world on various platforms? I'm sure there's plenty more for you to discover out there. The internet is a big place with lots of people on them. You should start keeping a list.

By the way what's with the use of the quotes? Angry jealousy that someone like "Ricegum" has over 10 million subscribers and makes an average of $16000 per video he uploads?

Loot boxes

[burtosis]

Now instead of blowing the remaining balance of the last working credit card people have on stupid digital loot boxes that are full of worthless digital items you can blow it all on digital loot boxes that are full of real world worthless items. Jokes on them though, even if you win that mansion or sports car you can't use it without an internet connection.

This is my surprised face

[theCat]

YouTube is predatory on children. There are is a lot worse than this going on. At least children will have a hard time coming up with big money to blow on these gambling schemes, however, some of the other cr*p they run across is absolutely diabolical.

Re:

[Anonymous Coward]

The number of child traumatizing finger family videos that just come up a few layers deep into whatever I put on for my kid is amazing.

These people have money and must hate kids deeper than I can imagine for the time and effort being put into it.

Kids web games are right out once you see how soon they devolve into C-section or infected teeth removal Elsa and all the rest.

Everyone else gets immediately stomped on for copyright infringement (Soulja Boy will probably walk too), but Youtube and all the media com

Re:

[Tapewolf]

These people have money and must hate kids deeper than I can imagine for the time and effort being put into it.

I would expect at least some of it was created by bored teenagers. Back when I was a member of that demographic I put far too much effort into taking things aimed at younger kids and twisting them into something that would today be called 'edgy' for the amusement of myself and my friends. Henry's Cat exhorting people to join an Irish terror group, Honey Monster from Sugar Puffs being turned into a mafia don, editing a Mah-Jongg christmas tile set so the three kings were assassinating baby Jesus in the cri

Re:

[Anonymous Coward]

The whole system is predatory. Not just children.

“If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around them will deprive the people of all property until their children wake up homeless on the continent their Fathers conquered.”
-Thomas Jefferson

Re:

[Gravis Zero]

YouTube is predatory on children. There are is a lot worse than this going on. [...] some of the other cr*p they run across is absolutely diabolical.

What is some of the diabolical stuff? I'm honestly curious.

Re:This is my surprised face

[rsmith-mac]

I'm assuming the GP is making a reference to Elsagate [wikipedia.org]. (Infographic [i.redd.it])

The best way to describe it is extreme shock content, except intentionally aimed at audiences too young to understand parody and satire. The sheer weirdness of the worst content defies all logical explanation.

Gambling

[dohzer]

No need for the word "shady". That's implied by the word "gambling"

What do you expect?

[Chas]

You get these guys, they build big on a platform.

Then you start fucking with their money...

So they turn to alternative methods of securing funding.

Occasionally, you get some of them falling for shit like this.

Re:

[Chas]

Oh yes. Wanting to earn a living is "greedy". Because all YouTube is, is a HOBBY!

Sorry, content creation on the YouTube platform for these people is a JOB.
Why do you think the stink over Patreon is so serious right now? They're fucking with people's livelihoods.
So when YouTube jacks around, puts videos in limited state, demonetizes videos, etc.
Those videos don't get produced for free buddy! They always cost SOMEONE.

Could these content creators have done better due diligence with regard to this gambling

Re:

[Chas]

Thank you for proving that the only greed here is yours.
Oh, and jealousy.

Re:

[sinij]

You get these guys, they build big on a platform.

Then you start fucking with their money...

Spot-on. Youtube is not paying for content creation but profits from it. They are should be held responsible for this.

Re:

[Chas]

I dunno if I'd go that far.
Are they at least partly at fault for this?
Sure. But their part is basically incidental.
The content creators should have done better due diligence on the gambling site.

Loot boxes are gambling

[SmaryJerry]

This is the essence of loot boxes in games, just with larger prizes.

I Don't Trust The Quickstop And Its Lotto Tickets

[Toad-san]

And you expect me to trust some unknown "Youtube star" ?? And an an internet firm in Poland?

Man, there _is_ one born every minute!

Strike 3 ?

[Stan92057]

Strike 3 for JP?? advertising a gambling site to his acknowledged 8-13 year old audience?