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Bitcoin The Almighty Buck

Jack Dorsey's Square Wants to Build a Decentralized Peer-to-Peer Bitcoin Exchange (msn.com) 48

Posted by EditorDavid from the non-custodial-wallets dept.
Business Insider reports: Jack Dorsey, one of bitcoin's biggest advocates, is planning to build an open platform to create a decentralized exchange for bitcoin through TBD, his new business venture, according to his tweet Friday.

A decentralized exchange is a type of cryptocurrency exchange that allows peer-to-peer transactions without the need for an intermediary. Dorsey retweeted an original tweet by TBD project leader Mike Brock, who offered some direction on where the unit is headed... First, Brock said his team believes that bitcoin will be the native currency of the internet. But the problem, he noted, is how trading bitcoin often involves exchanging fiat at a centralized and custodial service... "While there are many projects to help make the internet more decentralized, our focus is solely on a sound global monetary system for all...."

His team wants to make it easy to fund non-custodial wallets globally through a platform that builds on- and off-ramps into bitcoin. Think of it as a decentralized exchange for fiat, he added, one that is "bitcoin-native, top to bottom.... this platform will be entirely developed in public, open-source, open-protocol, and any wallet will be able to use," Brock said. "No foundation or governance model that TBD controls. Permissionless or bust."
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Jack Dorsey's Square Wants to Build a Decentralized Peer-to-Peer Bitcoin Exchange More

Jack Dorsey's Square Wants to Build a Decentralized Peer-to-Peer Bitcoin Exchange

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  • Another daily shitcoin article. (Score:1)

    by Anonymous Coward

    Who cares?

  • Never (Score:3)

    by systemd-anonymousd ( 6652324 ) on Sunday August 29, 2021 @06:31PM (#61742461)

    It'll either never happen or never be useful: the USA PATRIOT Act and a few other regulations require collecting a fuckton of information to make sure that you're not skipping out on taxes. Technically every single exchange of BTC for a good or service requires paying capital gains tax based on the equivalent dollar value, as it's considered bartering. Conversion to fiat requires that as well. The government would never let taxes slip through their fingers from common people.

    • Yep. How to take a good legal idea, and make it illegal in many economically strong countries.

    • Technically every single exchange of BTC for a good or service requires paying capital gains tax based on the equivalent dollar value, as it's considered bartering.

      Does it really though? I can trade baseball cards with you and practically speaking there is no reporting requirement. I can sell stuff on Craigslist or at a flea market and there's no tracking required there either.

      That being said, it might be that technically we're required to record and report it (just like I'm supposed to report out-of-state purchases and pay in-state sales tax) but as long as we're under some limit, the IRS doesn't really care. I wonder what that limit might be.

      • >Does it really though? I can trade baseball cards with you and practically speaking there is no reporting requirement

        There absolutely is a reporting requirement. People just don't do it. Looking up "bartering tax"

        >>Income Tax and Self-Employment Tax. Because "barter dollars," the fair market value of the goods and services you received, are taxed as if they are cash, you can owe income tax, self-employment tax, employment tax, or even excise tax on your bartering income – even if you don't a

  • Demontsrates that bitcoin failed (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Xylantiel ( 177496 ) on Sunday August 29, 2021 @06:35PM (#61742471)

    hmmm. wasn't bitcoin peer-to-peer? This is just a demonstration that bitcoin has failed in its goals.

    And anybody who is marketing a deflationary currency as "a sound global monetary system" is no better than a snake oil salesman who knows his product is actually slightly poisonous. This is too close to a direct contradiction of reality to not be an intentional deceit. This guy is just trying to push the pyramid, knowing full well that he can cash out before the little guys if it comes to that.

    • That was going to be my first question that bitcoin had been defined as a "currency" not beholden to central banks and agencies to make transactions. My last impression was that the transaction costs had become too high for normal day to day transactions rendering it an investor's game. I quit following it at that point.
      • Thats more etherium than some other major cryptos. Even on eth its still too high for small transactions but eip1559 reduced those costs - the max is around half of what it was a few months ago. And eth 2 will fully solve it on that network. So it is a problem, sometimes, but more of a speed bump than a wall.
      • My last impression was that the transaction costs had become too high for normal day to day transactions rendering it an investor's game

        So this is just a karma farming comment then? Right this very second, which is congested compared to what it has been lately, you can send a transaction on the Bitcoin network for 3 sat/byte and be confirmed in the next block. Using the typical 223 byte sized transaction, this means that you would be paying 0.00000669 BTC

    • Re: (Score:1)

      by ceoyoyo ( 59147 )

      Naw, it'll be just fine, just as soon as we build an on ramp! We just need to leverage blockchain technology to build a decentralized ledger, then you can make bitcoin transactions with anybody, no central authority needed!

    • Re:Demontsrates that bitcoin failed (Score:4, Informative)

      by cfalcon ( 779563 ) on Monday August 30, 2021 @08:28AM (#61743963)

      Bitcoin is peer-to-peer. It has not failed.
      This is about a decentralized exchange- a way to exchange bitcoin for fiat, or perhaps many types of crypto and/or fiat for many types of crypto and/or fiat.

      There are already decentralized exchanges for things that exist on one blockchain- for instance, there's several that allow you to exchange BNB and any of the binance based tokens, and there's several that allow you to exchange ethereum and any of the ether based tokens.

      There's also other things that kind of do what he is talking about already- Ren, for instance, is already one. Maybe Dorsey plans to bring some value to this, or maybe he just hopes you don't know about any of the similar alternatives, or maybe he just wants to build hype by saying "bitcoin", I have no idea.

      But this is more a sign of cryptocurrencies being successful, than any kind of failure.

      • Wow, this is an unrealistically cool idea! If there was money , I would invest in it. But so far I'm at zero and I'm studying the topic with cryptocurrency in more detail to understand this.I recently found binance [comprarebitcoin.com], there is so much cool information about cryptocurrency, just dump the heads. I studied this site for several hours and it still didn't work out to the end. I advise you!

  • AML and KYC mean this is completely moot (Score:3)

    by Seven Spirals ( 4924941 ) on Sunday August 29, 2021 @06:36PM (#61742475)
    Anti Money Laundering and Know Your Customer laws apply mostly to banks, but if Bitcoin ever actually achieved some of it's bullshit aims of being a currency, then you can bet Uncle Sam is going to slap those same requirements on anything related to Bitcoin. If you decentralize it and they decide it's a threat, then they will criminalize the transactions by the decentralized users and make the whole thing a pariah. However, if you are a true hodler, move to El Salvador. They are embracing it and I'm sure it'll lift the whole country straight out of poverty, wink wink.

    • Re: (Score:3)

      by JcMorin ( 930466 )
      As far as I know, if you have a REAL bitcoin wallet it doesn't work over there... the fees are several $$ per transaction. Considering how poor they are They created they own custom protocol/wallet and still call it "bitcoin". Even the Lightning network over there doesn't work in most places. And by the way, they own protocol is fully controlled by the gov.

  • Stage 2 would be "Exchange inexplicably robbed, some trillions of coins gone" with Stage 3 concluding with the sudden disappearance of the person who opened the exchange.

    Really, just how often do you need to touch the stove?

  • Bitcoin is already dead, crypto has moved on (but they market hasn't yet). There are already perfectly functional cryptocurrencies that do this. But he's holding a giant bag of Bitcoin so he gets journalists to pump the price of bitcoin by baiting them into writing "positive" news about Bitcoin.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Bomazi ( 1875554 )
      Or rather, Uniswap and co. The ridiculous fees of Ethereum don't make these things very practical yet. What I find annoying in the media coverage (including here) is the sole emphasis on the potential value of coins or tokens as investment. The important thing is the technology and as you pointed out it has considerably improved since bitcoin appeared. It still has a long way to go. What's most interesting is that we don't yet know how to build a really good blockchain-based network, nor do we know which ap
    • The only markets for crypto is either as a way to fleece money from VCs or as a money laundering scheme for Asian businessmen to escape capital export restrictions.

    • Was sort-of gonna say the same thing. Ethereum hosts several swap contracts like SushiSwap and UniSwap that server as decentralized exchanges. There are others of course.

      Using them is not without hazards, and you aren't going to swap to/from fiat using one of those contracts. Though you can certainly get USDC or DAI if you want them.

      Bitcoin lacks the core functionality to execute smart contracts. Rootstock tries to graft that functionality onto the Bitcoin blockchain, but that's like putting a spoiler o

  • Getting tired of hearing about these capitalist manipulators. They havenâ(TM)t done anyone any favors thus far, and surely wonâ(TM)t be doing any to anyone but themselves for the foreseeable future. Garbage in, garbage out. People like this donâ(TM)t really deserve any press coverage for their next self-interest grab.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by nyet ( 19118 )

      Are you actually familiar with how any modern DEx works on anything other than bitcoin or ethereum?

  • Idiotic (Score:2)

    by nyet ( 19118 )

    Bitcoin's transaction fees and truly stone age throughput makes it useless for this.

    There are literally hundreds of better protocols

  • Twitter is running a dangerous course with their CEO, if he really believes his own BS.

    Getting a ton of twitter users to buy into Bitcoin before it's inevitable crash is not good PR. Nevermind all the subsidies necessary to make Lightning work with reasonable fees, which Twitter is likely too large for to saddle anyone else with.

  • Sounds like Jack wants https://tdxp.app/ [tdxp.app] on BTC. Not going to work. Stuff like this only works on the original Bitcoin protocol. Too bad with BTC forking off the protocol, deprecating OP codes and all that..
  • I'm sorry, are we supposed to call existing actual currency "fiat" now? As opposed to what? The false implication that crypto currency doesn't only have value by fiat?

  • I don't get why people keep trying to make that happen.

    Money laundering laws across most of the globe mean that you just can't have an anonymous payment system.

    Decentralising would facilitate money laundering and tax evasion, which helps nobody except those richest few who can profit from doing it.

    So now you have a system that can't be anonymous but which people can commit money laundering and tax evasion (yeah, sounds useful...) or a system that is anonymous and decentralised but can't legally be used as c

  • Yes, you are welcome to re-invent every step of the way of file-sharing software. All the way, across its regression with Bittorrent (which was and still is more primitive than those that came before it), to TOR and beyond.

    Badly.

    But it's not going to change the fundamental fallacies of Bitcoin.
    That it's based on trust in the easily manipulated masses, that are easily overwhelmed by Zerg rush attacks. (Aka the majority of your traders being hostile to you and colluding against you. Or the majority of your TO

  • It's called Bisq. See https://bisq.network/ [bisq.network]

    But Square already knows this, because Bisq used to be called "Bitsquare" but had to change their name. I wonder why ... It might be cool if Square threw some real support behind Bisq instead of creating yet-another competitor.

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