Pakistan Hits 120F as Climate Trends Drive Spring Heatwave (arstechnica.com) 150
An anonymous reader shares a report: Spring has brought remarkably extreme heat to India and Pakistan this year. Unusually extensive heatwaves have followed one after another since March and are continuing well into May. The situation presents a conundrum for rapid studies of the role of climate change in this event, as we can't yet put an end date on it. Nevertheless, a pair of studies have looked into the influence of the climate on March and April's heat. Daily and monthly temperature records have been broken in many areas. Thermometers have hit temperatures as high as 120F (49C), and the heat has been accompanied by abnormally dry weather. Record-breaking heatwaves often coincide with drought, as the dry ground heats up even more without the cooling effect of evaporation. However, the lower humidity has reduced the heat's threat to human health, though at least 90 deaths have been reported so far, and that number is expected to rise.
Let's terraform Earth (Score:3, Funny)
We should try making Earth human habitable before moving on to tougher challenges like Mars and Venus.
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De-terring earth. (Score:2)
Humans are currently "de-terring" earth.
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When you destroy your reference, it's not a reference any more.
There is no other option (Score:2)
We should not try to make Earth human habitable.
We should succeed making Earth human habitable.
There is no other option
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There is no other option
There IS another option, you just don't like it. (Nor do I, just so we're clear)
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Hardly. Starvation and desperation are not known to increase stability and happiness. And heat alone makes people nuts.
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Nobody lives in Death Valley. Kuwait is extremely wealthy, has reliable power and AC, and an ocean and desalination plants. Next please...
Re: Let's terraform Earth (Score:2)
This is just Spring (Score:2)
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Re: This is just Spring (Score:2)
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It's the food, stupid (Score:5, Insightful)
Watched a video of a midwest farmer start to cry when he said he's the last generation that will farm his land as the pumps are starting to suck air and they can't go any deeper.
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Humans are modestly adaptable in the short term to heat waves. We can hide, stay in the shade, run AC (if you're privileged). What's going to cripple civilization is food production. Our staple crops can not tolerate debilitating heat waves, drought, floods, and storms. This is especially true if you consider that major aquifers are drying up. Lake Mead and the Ogalala aquifer are good examples close to home. Watched a video of a midwest farmer start to cry when he said he's the last generation that will farm his land as the pumps are starting to suck air and they can't go any deeper.
I agree. People live with similar weather in Arizona all the time, but they do not produce the food they eat. Also, nothing produces radicals and revolutions quicker than food shortages. Just remember the French Revolution began as a riot over bread prices. World War 3 would no doubt solve our problems with climate change, but the cure would even worse than the disease.
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People live with similar weather in Arizona all the time,
For certain definitions of "live" which involve sitting in an air-conditioned box for most of the day.
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Actually, I do believe there is a pretty good deal of farming in AZ.
Much like CA, they have to pump a lot of water in artificially.
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In the parts of California that I know about, the hotter areas grow cotton, not food. OTOH, that was a few decades ago, and it could be a local custom. And things may be different now. And I don't know anything about temperatures in, e.g., the Imperial Valley, which definitely grows/grew a lot of food, and is quite far South.
That said, even the areas around Madera/Fresno are draining the aquifers a lot faster than they are refilling. (One reason to grow cotton is it doesn't take that much water. And yo
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Actually, they have quite a lot of agriculture in AZ
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They grow more stuff then where I'm from
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"I think you'd need to eliminate 90% of our population to actually halt climate change and the only way a war could do that would be total engagement of all nuclear weapon stockpiles."
The next virus could do it while leaving the infrastructure intact.
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Infrastructure decays pretty quick without skilled people maintaining it.
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Nothing's going to "stop" climate change. The best we can hope for now is to make it not as bad as it could be without trying.
COVID to the rescue (Score:2)
Once again (Score:5, Informative)
For the “climate change is about getting funding for scientists” and the “we are coming out of an ice age” crowd.
https://xkcd.com/1732/ [xkcd.com]
Re:Once again (Score:5, Insightful)
I've always felt this graph would be interesting if it showed the first derivative of the temperature with respect to time -- the speed at which temperatures were *changing*. You could argue that temperatures were almost as warm 5000 years ago, and you'd be right, but it took *4000 years* to get there from the baseline; not 40 years. That's roughly 100x as fast.
It's the rate of change, not the absolute level of temperature, that will stress the environment. A +4C world doesn't look much different if you take 8000 years to get there, but it looks *very different if you've got here in less than a century. Over eight thousands years, even populations of *trees* can migrate hundreds of miles. Doing it in less than a century stresses human societies which are by far the fastest adapting feature of the planet.
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The problem with the first derivative is that it's an unstable indicator. Because of that, it can be used to fit narratives in various ways. I've seen it in finance quite a bit, e.g., "debt increased at the highest rate in years", and then you look and see that while that's technically true, a smoothed curve of the debt is not dramatic at all and they have simply used the first derivative for drama.
Same thing we were taught in our signals and systems course--circuits that operate based on the difference c
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FWIW, we ARE coming out of an ice age. Of course, if I read the projections correctly we should be reentering one just about now...and I wouldn't like THAT, either.
But Canada is still rising from the removal of the weight of the glaciers that used to be on top of it. Presumably this is also true of various other places, like Siberia, but I haven't seen and reports on that. And some people in Oregon want to call earthworms an invasive species, because the last glaciation killed off all the native ones. I
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FWIW, we ARE coming out of an ice age.
No, by definition we are in an ice age. We are in an interglacial during an ice age, but an interglacial that started 12,000 years ago, and it's been gradually cooling since things stablised a bit after the 8.2kya event.
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if I read the projections correctly we should be reentering one just about now.
No, entering a period of glaciation in a few thousand years. Not understanding the timescale was part of the 1970s popular media 'new ice age' panic.
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Here's the data it's based on. https://www.explainxkcd.com/wi... [explainxkcd.com]
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More importantly, the cartoon doesn't show error bars.
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I mean, if the case is "don't use cartoons for anything important" then yeah, it's cracked.
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"don't use cartoons for anything important"
The first rule of presenting information: You need to adjust the presentation for the target audience. The fact that needs to be drawn in crayon for some people doesn't change the data.
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Error bars are important so you better keep them in your cartoon.
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really irritates you types so I'll apply it here: the science is settled.
This doesn't have error bars either.
It's also nonsense. If the science is settled, we can stop funding climate science. Nothing left to research. No one agrees with that, including you.
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Of course as any non autist would deduce from context, "the science" being the fact that human causes are creating a giant rise in greenhouse gases, particularly CO2 and methane, and that these greenhouse gases are creating massive climate change.
That science, is of course, settled. The reason, obviously, we continue to fund climate science is to track the rate at which it happens, the specific causes, and try to come up with solutions and track those solutions. Am I really having to explain this basic shit
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human causes are creating a giant rise in greenhouse gases, particularly CO2 and methane,
Strong evidence supporting this.
these greenhouse gases are creating massive climate change.
There's not so much evidence supporting this. In fact, the changes are nearly unnoticeable thus far.
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Smoking Gun is right!
Everyone knows Jesus killed the last dinosaur Himself with His own personal golden AK-47. Its skull was used to make the Holy Grail.
Serious question. (Score:4, Insightful)
I'd like to abandon slashdot, but it does have relevant technical articles every now and then. Can anyone recommend a tech site / blog that is a good alternative to slashdot?
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Translation: where can I go to keep my head buried in the sand?
The moniker here has always been: news for nerds, stuff that matters.
I appreciate the variety, there are a lot I pass over as well, but also get a taste on matters I may not care about otherwise, and can read comments from a range of viewpoints. I think that's just fine.
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There's nowhere that people communicate where you won't find people obsessed with what they normally think about. And the ones and zeros that you object to ARE part of the physical world. But they *are* only part of it. However, you need to expect those who habitually think about them to communicate with them as a frame of reference. You can generalize this statement to almost any other category of thought.
Answer (Score:5, Interesting)
I'd like to abandon slashdot, but it does have relevant technical articles every now and then. Can anyone recommend a tech site / blog that is a good alternative to slashdot?
You can try Soylent News [soylentnews.org].
Hackaday is pretty good if you're a creative type. It's mostly electronics, but occasionally they branch out into other areas. They have a policy of never posting politically sensitive articles (ie - clickbait), which keeps the trolling to a minimum.
Slashdot used to be a titan of the internet, ranked something like the 14th most visited site. Now it's a fading echo.
I believe (IIRC) this started around 2015 when the (relatively) new ownership stated explicitly that their goal was to use slashdot to promote a societal good (of their choice), rather than the goal of keeping it popular. They made many decisions aimed at promoting their goals at the expense of popularity.
One result of that was the lack of communication. The owners/powers-that-be never ask the readership for feedback, never tell the readership what's going on, never give any sense of direction or community.
As an example, it's been suggested that bots are rampant on slashdot: used to guide the discussion in certain directions, attack certain posters to spoil their experience (and make them leave), and reduce the karma score of particular opinions. Moderation is a tricky subject and something that slashdot does 'sorta well, but it's still a toxic environment and has caused many good readers to complain, then leave. Many, many readers have done exactly that.
Slashdot could work with the readers to solve the issue: ask for suggestions, post information, and try new algorithms.
For example, people might ask "are there single IP addresses that have a lot of accounts"? Do these IP addresses log into accounts sequentially until they find one with moderation? Do some accounts use up moderation quicker than a human would?
Slashdot could make these queries, post the results for readership to see, and then look at the resulting discussion. Working with management would give everyone a sense of community, and removing trolls and bots would make the environment nicer. Readership would go up, ad revenue would go up, more money would be made, lots of benefits.
I'm guessing that management either has several areas of responsibility, with little time for Slashdot, or simply doesn't think this site is worth any attention.
One manager with vision and time could turn this site around pretty quick.
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Just checked Soylent News and they have an article with
"The Science Behind Why Smoke Seems to Follow You Around a Campfire"
Oh yeah, a burning question I have always wondered about. I would rather read something about the very real issues with global warming.
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You can follow CmdrTaco and a number of slashdotters to here https://news.ycombinator.com/ [ycombinator.com]
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In other words, this challenges my opinions and angers me. Sounds like Truth Social is more your speed. You won't be missed.
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To be fair, he didn't say that he should be removed, but rather that he could choose to remove himself. That's really not the same thing.
That said, the original complaint is so vague that it's impossible to be sure what it's actually about. One can guess, but being certain, or even very confident, about that guess is unwarranted.
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To be fair, he didn't say that he should be removed, but rather that he could choose to remove himself. That's really not the same thing.
True. Seems like i was being a jack-ass yesterday. I inferred poorly :)
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sometimes I check https://lobste.rs/ and http://lxer.com/
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I'd like to abandon slashdot
Yet here you are.
but it does have relevant technical articles every now and then.
Then click on those ones instead of obvious climate change ones. This site hasn't been much of a news aggregator for a LONG time. I don't remember the last time I learned of some new news that I hadn't already read elsewhere. There hasn't been anything of value in the summaries in even longer. The only thing this site is good for is the discussions.
Serious question.
Yeah, no it wasn't.
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"This site hasn't been much of a news aggregator for a LONG time. I don't remember the last time I learned of some new news that I hadn't already read elsewhere. "
In my local newspaper, days ago, usually.
Re:Serious question. (Score:4, Funny)
I'd like to abandon slashdot, but it does have relevant technical articles every now and then. Can anyone recommend a tech site / blog that is a good alternative to slashdot?
Ars Technica.
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"I'd like to abandon slashdot, but it does have relevant technical articles every now and then."
Damn, I must have been sick that say.
" Can anyone recommend a tech site / blog that is a good alternative to slashdot?"
There isn't. It's all written by AIs and BeauHD. (same thing really)
Lainchan for aspie CHUDs (Score:2)
Yeah go to lainchan.
It’s probably one of the smarter groups of CHUDs on the internet.
I’d go there but their politics make we want to gag. Have fun!
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"The percentage of political, or politicize-able, articles is getting awfully high."
The paid trolls go everywhere.
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He’s talking for the audience. He has no intention of actually leaving unfortunately.
Funny (Score:2, Interesting)
So...not even a record heat, then?
"The highest temperature ever recorded in Pakistan is 53.7 ÂC (128.7 ÂF) which was recorded in Turbat, Balochistan on 28 May 2017."
But we sure need to report it like it does, don't we?
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So in plain English; It's very hot, it's going to get hotter and it's going to stay hot until autumn.
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I'd say they have technology, air conditioning, humans' proved status as the most adaptable creatures on the planet, and the (in historical terms) fabulous general wealth of Americans to keep them safe but you want to go with the book of an imaginary sky-diety, you be you.
Where is all this pollution coming from? (Score:3)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]
https://www.nasa.gov/topics/ea... [nasa.gov]
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For that first link, that's just a display of where half the worlds population lives. It's fairly logical that half the world's population should produce a significant amount of the world's pollution. We're talking specifically about climate change in this topic, so greenhouse gases are significant. A more realistic way to look at the issue would be per capita. If you look at a per-capita map of greenhouse gas emissions, the countries in that circle are not that bad and certain other countries, well outside
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As for the second link you provide, that's of particulate pollution. That is a serious problem, but it's not particularly relevant to this discussion and it is also something with a specifically local effect.
High altitude particulates have a global effect that lasts years. Large volcanic eruptions are visible in the temperature record, every time. It lasts two years, three at the outside, then reverts to the mean. Particulates definitely aren't always local, and can skew an entire decade's average temperature.
Meanwhile Pakistan is experiencing some weather. It's being reported as if it's unusual for their climate. It's not. This is disingenuous at best, lying at worst. Fucking stop it.
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To be clear, that map was very specifically of "... problematic particles, called fine particulate matter (PM2.5), are 2.5 micrometers or less in diameter, about a tenth the fraction of human hair. These small particles can get past the body’s normal defenses and penetrate deep into the lungs." It was very specifically not about pollution that has any significant effect on climate, but rather pollution that has an outsize effect on human health that is a significant problem when it's at ground level
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So, you think it's irrelevant that China, India, and others in the region are amongst the highest polluters in the world...just because you divide quantity, by population?
If a country of 1 person produces 1 unit of pollution per capita, but another country of 2 people produces .75 units of pollution per capita...the country of 2 people still is more of a climate/earth/pollution problem.
Well, let's consider it terms of other factors. Let's consider food. So, let's say you have a country of one person that consumes 600 kg of food per year and country of 2 people that consumes 800 kg of food per year. Which country consumes more food? Clearly the second one consumes more food in total, but it's feeding twice as many people, and those individual people are consuming only 2/3rds as much. Your argument seems to be that the country where the people consume 2/3rds as much should consume even less
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So, you think it's irrelevant that China, India, and others in the region are amongst the highest polluters in the world....
Per capita, they are not.
rest of the world (Score:2)
If even the main text have the 120F/49C duet, why not the subject? the rest of the world also deserve to know! without having to open the full text
https://news.slashdot.org/user... [slashdot.org]
So? (Score:3)
People would rather go down in a literal blaze of glory than be mildly inconvenienced.
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Time for Engineers to step in (Score:2)
Climate change is something we have always lived with and can live with. Just let the Engineers do their job and keep the social 'scientists' locked u
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Not unusual (Score:2)
Oddly, April-June is the hot season, and temperatures of 50C happen basically every year. Year-to-year variations happen, of course, but afaik this is really nothing unusual.
However, it does make for good clickbait.
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Year-to-year variations happen, of course, but afaik this is really nothing unusual.
From TFA:
From the historical data, this March–April heat is estimated at a 1 percent annual probability—what is commonly referred to as a “100-year event.” But in the model simulations of a 1.2C cooler pre-industrial climate, heat this extreme would be about a 3,000-year event. In other words, climate change made this heatwave about 30 times more likely.
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From the historical data, this March–April heat is estimated at a 1 percent annual probability—what is commonly referred to as a “100-year event.” But in the model simulations of a 1.2C cooler pre-industrial climate, heat this extreme would be about a 3,000-year event. In other words, climate change made this heatwave about 30 times more likely.
Sounds more like the simulation made this 30 times more likely.
When the model conflicts with actual observed data, the model is more likely to be wrong.
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When the model conflicts with actual observed data, the model is more likely to be wrong.
This model doesn't conflict with actual observed data.
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"Oddly, April-June is the hot season, and temperatures of 50C happen basically every year. Year-to-year variations happen, of course, but afaik this is really nothing unusual. "
Yes, in the UK old ladies take the bus all day long because they can't afford to pay for the heating.
The heat wealth is unfairly distributed.
The Ministry for the Future (Score:2)
Headlines like this make me think of Kim Stanley Robinson's The Ministry for the Future. It's a fantastic read, but it it hits much closer to home than many would like.
India and Pakistan (Score:2)
India is the world's 3rd largest emitter of ghg, and has no intention of stopping. Mother Nature is taking corrective action by reducing India's overpopulated population. Nature tends toward equilibrium.
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Because I was not a poor brown skin foreign person."
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Are you having a stroke?
6 Seasons (Score:2)