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Education

Should CS Be Required for a High School Degree? 197

When it comes to the official requirements for graduating from a U.S. high school, there's a push for changes.

Long-time Slashdot reader theodp looks at 2014: Making computer science courses 'count' would not require schools to offer computer science or students to study it," Code.org CEO Hadi Partovi emphasized to lawmakers in his 2014 Congressional testimony following the nation's first Hour of Code, an event organized and run by the tech-backed nonprofit. "It would simply allow existing computer science courses to satisfy a requirement that already exists."

But as the nation's 10th annual Hour of Code kicks off on Monday, Code.org has reversed course on that no-required-CS stance. Speaking at last month's 2022 National Summit on Education, Partovi said, "I want to close with one quick request, which is to talk about "the idea of computer science as a high school graduation requirement for every student (PDF slides). Which may sound controversial, but my goal for the end of this decade is to make that possible in all 50 states" (YouTube).

The announcement comes just months after a who's who of the nation's tech leaders — organized as CEOs for CS by Code.org — joined in a PR campaign that publicly pressed 'the Governors of the United States' to sign a Compact To Expand K-12 Computer Science Education.
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Should CS Be Required for a High School Degree?

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  • by cornfeedhobo ( 6270348 ) on Sunday December 04, 2022 @04:51PM (#63102262)
    No [wikipedia.org]. How about we start by making sure they know algebra first [freakonomics.com].
    • by Anonymous Coward on Sunday December 04, 2022 @04:57PM (#63102284)

      And reading comprehension, and summarising. Critical thinking (not "critical theory", that's just bullshit) and information research ie "fact checking" is probably going to be rather important too.

      And all the other things you used to learn but no longer. At least one foreign language would be good, too.

      The one CS-related thing that would really be useful is touch-typing.

      • Back in olden-times when I was student at least a semester of "Typing Class" was required if you wanted to take a programming related class. Students who just wanted to learn about computers did the minimum, and anyone who wanted to take programming classes (BASIC & PASCAL) all did at least a full year. ~rbs
    • by hazem ( 472289 ) on Sunday December 04, 2022 @05:06PM (#63102310) Journal

      Indeed. Computer Literacy? Absolutely. Some coding? Sure. But "computer science" should be among the science electives like physics and biology.

      People should know the basics of how computers and computer networks work, and particularly what happens with all their data as they use their devices and "cloud services". They should learn how to use all the basic types of applications... spreadsheets, word processors, image editors, etc. And even a little programming would be good just to gain a better understanding of how you can get computers to do what you want.

      But if we're going to go down a road of "every child should be able to code", then we have to decide what we're giving up in the curriculum and school day to accomplish that.

      • I don't think this is talking about making every child a "coder" any more than HS Chemistry is about making every child qualified to be a Chemist's lab assistant coming right out of HS.
        • Agreed, basic personal finance would be a far better use of students time. Simple stuff like why is a title loan a bad idea. Or how much does interest add to the cost of something as opposed to just thinking I can afford the payment. Or what is the difference between an adjustable rate mortgage and a fixed one. Or how much does a child cost to raise. Or how do retailers trick people by product placement, "free" interest for a year, bait and switch, ... And I took chemistry in HS (2 years worth), physics, 5
    • Yep. Betteridge. All I see is a bunch of people who know very little about education pursuing personal agendas for whatever reason. There are sensible, rational, evidence-informed reasons for selecting which subjects they teach their children, what goes on the syllabus of each subject, & how it gets taught. How about they consult the experts &, who knows, maybe they can lift the USA's maths scores from 8 places below the OECD average? (The USA scores between Belarus & Hungary & is 113 points
      • Exactly - I would rather see students have a basic foundation in hard sciences and math up to trig or pre-calculus. The push to include CS in high school is nice if they already have the foundation -- otherwise it smacks of tech companies just wanting high schools to turn out compliant coders without any other career options.
    • And basic biology, physics, and chemistry pretty please. I went to a small town high school where both intro biology and chemistry were mandatory for graduation. I'm shocked that, over a decade later, many college freshmen have never seen a periodic table and can't do basic dimensional analysis. Scary shit.
    • How about we make sure that when they start school they know how to sit still and pay attention to simple directions. That's where it all starts.
    • Computer Science is an advanced topic. Get the math done first, and the science, and all the other stuff. Any "programming" learned is NOT computer science.

  • They are not quite the same thing - and computer science is a branch of mathematics that uses lots of mathematical material not taught in high school.
    • Sure. You could say something similar about Chemistry, but that doesn't mean we don't introduce kids to Chemistry in HS at a level that aligns with the math available to them.
      • Believe it or not, many American HS students never never taken a basic chem course, don't know the metric system, and can't do basic dimensional analysis; let alone know how to read a periodic table or understand basic life processes.
        • by narcc ( 412956 )

          If chemistry is your thing, great, but you're attributing to it far more importance than is warranted. HS kids simply don't need to know how to read a periodic table or how to do dimensional analysis before starting college. It's just not that important.

          Here's an actual problem: College freshmen are completely unprepared for college writing. You'd be hard-pressed to find a single one who was even taught how to write a research paper, let alone one capable of competently producing one. This is a basic s

    • Computer Science covers Mathematics, Engineering, Linguistics, Philosophy, Psychology. Trying to pigeon hole it into Mathematics ignores the many cross disciplinary domains it touches.

      • by narcc ( 412956 )

        No, it's pretty much all math. You'd need to stretch it beyond the breaking point for anything else.

    • by fahrbot-bot ( 874524 ) on Sunday December 04, 2022 @05:39PM (#63102402)

      They are not quite the same thing - and computer science is a branch of mathematics that uses lots of mathematical material not taught in high school.

      I don't know if I'd be that restrictive in the definition. Computer Science encompasses more than just Math and many aspects are often less "science" than the name would imply. Programs are algorithms *and* logic *and* organization *and* (to some extent, to be honest) art -- or at least saying that creative thinking is sometimes (often?) required. Computing / networking systems and their administration are a whole additional things. [I mean, the name "awk" is so functionally descriptive. :-) ]

      I took a Computer Fundamentals class in 10th grade *way* back in '79 -- the school had teletype terminals with punch tape readers and acoustic modems dialing into a remote time-share system -- and it counted as elective credits. I think the programming was (simple) FORTRAN. I have a BSCS and have spent my time almost evenly split as a software engineer and system administrator, both on mostly large, expensive Unix systems -- including a Cray-2 at NASA LaRC back in the day.

      I don't know if people need to have programming skills, but I think they should have at least a basic understanding of how computers and networks actually work. That said, basic curiosity about how things work, rather than just using them, is a requirement for any of this to be helpful.

    • by gweihir ( 88907 )

      Actually, CS can be theoretical CS which is a branch of mathematics or practical CS which is an engineering science.

  • Maybe it is just my definition of computer science. A lot of "computer science" courses I see are more along the lines of how to use a computer. Now, there are serious ones out there. Ones that introduce coding, networks, control structures and functions. All basic, but really how computers work. Others I see are more like using tools to design a web page. One step above using PowerPoint. If you make everyone take a course, they will be more like the later than the former.
    • by Arethan ( 223197 )

      Yup! Also, CS doesn't really seem worthy of a highschool kid's time, imho. They're still too young and trying to sort out their lives. The idea of CS in highschool is likely to score highly here simply because this is a nerd-oriented forum, but it's not actually all that useful in practice. Society still needs medical, manufacturing, food, physics, and art - and I'm probably missing some things here, which is just another example of single minded short sightedness. Regardless, not all of those practices wil

  • by cjonslashdot ( 904508 ) on Sunday December 04, 2022 @04:57PM (#63102286)
    Computing Science includes information theory, complexity theory, digital algorithms, and digital system engineering. What is it that they are saying should be taught?
    • by gweihir ( 88907 )

      CS does include the study of programming languages though as a major tool and that entails some basic skills with them. It does not entail turning CS graduates into proficient programmers though.

    • It won't even be real computer science. It will be a high school level overview. Let's not get our panties in a bunch.

  • by cirby ( 2599 ) on Sunday December 04, 2022 @05:04PM (#63102302)

    Even among the "educated" classes, very few people have a decent understanding of how to use a computer.

    They can mash a few keys, and even open a couple of programs, but it's getting harder and harder to find people who can use a computer to even a "driver's license" level of competence.

    • Even among the "educated" classes, very few people have a decent understanding of how to use a computer.

      And even less about how computers (and networks) actually work.

      • by hjf ( 703092 )

        to be fair, few computer people understand computer networks beyond "the ip address". most here wouldn't know why you'd set up your netmask to other than 255.255.255.0 or that /24 means the same thing. hell, a lot of people still talk in terms of "classes" when CIDR was implemented way back in 1993... probably before they were using the internet.

        a lot of people here in slashdot were defending IPv4 NAT vs IPv6 "because you lose the security you get from NAT since now anyone that knows your IP can access your

    • People shouldn't need to understand how to use a computer. That is a relic of nerds and thick glasses typing in a console in the late 80s / early 90s. A computer should just work and be intuitive. And for the most part they are. My own aunt has enough trouble microwaving her food (to say nothing of actually setting the clock on the damn thing which has flashed 12:00 for the past decade), but has no problem writing word documents, sending emails or browsing the internet.

      Even setting up a computer the first t

      • People who grew up during the iPad era often don't know where their data is located, how to manage files, and how to upload data to even a Web based application. Their idea of a "screenshot" can be "take a picture of the iPad screen with my phone." Modern computing-as-a-prison means that users often don't know anything other than how to use a computer as a media consumption device. Rude awakening coming in college or in their first job.
  • Fuck no (Score:5, Insightful)

    by quonset ( 4839537 ) on Sunday December 04, 2022 @05:10PM (#63102320)

    This was like my requirement to have two years of a foreign language to graduate high school, of which I took three because the first year didn't count.

    Yes, you read that right. I was required to take two years of a foreign language but had to take three because the first did not count? Why you ask? Because I was in an accelerated program which meant the year I took in 9th grade didn't count toward my high school requirement.

    My two choices were latin and french so I took french and passed (somehow). Can I speak the language? If you mean can I pick out a word here and there, oui.

    This reminds me when I went to get my second bachelor's degree and was told I was required to take a programming course even though I had taken programming courses years before. I was able to whittle it down to one course from the orignal two. And no, I didn't pass it because I didn't do the semester project. I was there for project management, not writing code.

    And before anyone says anything about needing to understand coding, the same logic could be said for people going into programming to take a course in how to assemble a PC.

    So no, fuck this shit about being required to take a course in anything other than those for a broad educational background. If someone wants to go into programming then they should be able to substitute a class for a programming course as was originally proposed. Requiring people to take irrelevant course only turns them off and more importantly will impact their grades which will in turn affect what college they might be able to get into.

    Considering the dearth of knowledge people have about basics such as reading, writing, and arithmetic, time could better be spent on those subjects.

    • ...the same logic could be said for people going into programming to take a course in how to assemble a PC....

      That is perhaps not a good example. Every programmer I know can build his own computer, either from new parts ordered online, from parts provided to him, or from spare parts he already has in his home from previous computers he's replaced. It tends to happen organically.

      • Fine. Every programmer needs to take a course in help desk support. That was what I was originally going to write, but changed it to assembling a PC.

      • LOL! No Way! Most programmers don't know which memory is compatible with which video processors, and shouldn't need to know. And if given a room full of boxes of computer parts would not be able to identify which parts to choose from and them assemble a complete and working computer, unless it was pre-assembled!

    • I'd argue that the basics of coding contribute to a broad educational background. Back in the 80s, our high school got a bunch of computers in. And luckily we had a good math teacher who taught the course. Some kids had a computer at home, and some of them knew how to code somewhat, but the teacher focused on a lot of related aspects: breaking down problems, formulating an algorithm to solve them, translating that into working code, troubleshooting, and verifying the work. Most of us improved noticably
    • we need to look for ways to make collage / other learning take less time and cost less

    • I'll bet that it will be easier for your to pick up again if you live in a place where it's commonly spoken for a few months. It's never really lost, only ... dormant.
    • Re:Fuck no (Score:5, Insightful)

      by thegarbz ( 1787294 ) on Sunday December 04, 2022 @06:54PM (#63102574)

      Yes, you read that right. I was required to take two years of a foreign language but had to take three because the first did not count? Why you ask? Because I was in an accelerated program which meant the year I took in 9th grade didn't count toward my high school requirement.

      My two choices were latin and french so I took french and passed (somehow). Can I speak the language? If you mean can I pick out a word here and there, oui.

      I was in the same position except that I took Japanese, yes including the year which didn't count. Was it a waste? I learnt more about English language and language structures than was ever part of a normal English curriculum (which is too focused on naval gazing over Shakespeare to teach people what a damn past-participle was). Absolute waste of time.

      Oh except the advanced part of the course boosted my understanding dramatically for the subjects when they did count and gave me a massive uplift in my overall grades giving me pick of any damn university is so pleased to go to.
      Oh and also except that fast forward 10 years and I live in another country, have now had to learn 3 languages (2 of which I needed proficiency certifications for) and am currently learning a 4th. The world is grand of a place to not understand how different languages work and learning a foreign language is absolutely invaluable.

      While you may not recall any individual vocabulary, no doubt if you were put in a position where you had to learn a romance language you would find it much easier having taken French in highschool.

  • by Anonymous Coward

    There is interest in CS, but the fact that any CS job will be done by someone with an H-1B, if the job isn't completely offshored makes it not worth it. Why bother going into lifelong debt into a field that you have to fight for scraps?

    Instead, best thing for people interested in CS is to go law. There is no such thing as an unemployed lawyer, and a J. D. + Bar membership is a meal ticket for life. No, one may not work for Dewey, Cheatham, & Howe... but you can definitely earn that Audi or BMW you ha

  • Let's start with what I mean by Hamiltonian mechanics. I mean exactly the formulation of classical mechanics formulated by Lagrange, Hamilton, Noether, Pioncare, and the rest during the 19th and early 20th centuries. With abstract algebra of linear operators, Lie derivatives, and all.

    And while I'm at it, I'll also add the mathematical details of the Schroedinger wave functions and the Copenhagen interpretation of quantum mechanics to the list of things that one should not have to demonstrate mastery of in o

    • by gweihir ( 88907 )

      Exactly. Well said.

    • I would like to see some level of math, chemistry, biology, and physics. They don't have to be proficient, but they should be able to do dimensional analysis, understand the fundamental processes of life on a topical level, understand how electricity and mechanical systems work, etc. Without an understanding of how the world works, it's impossible to make informed choices about (say) an HVAC system in your home, or whether the energy policy of a given person running for office is a good idea.
  • Hell No (Score:5, Insightful)

    by MrKaos ( 858439 ) on Sunday December 04, 2022 @05:28PM (#63102366) Journal

    I can't imagine forcing someone into coding. It's intense enough when you *like* doing it, it would be a nightmare if it wasn't your thing.

  • Upper class wants... (Score:5, Interesting)

    by blahplusplus ( 757119 ) on Sunday December 04, 2022 @05:28PM (#63102368)

    ... to deskill CS to lower wages, let's be honest.

    • Yep, the whole point of this CS-everywhere drive is to lower industry pay. We have lots and lots of qualified computer scientists, but not a whole lot who are willing to accept low pay. There are lots and lots of open positions, but very few employers willing to pay appropriately.

      • Hey, what's special about CS people? We have way too many retail and food service workers too, so their wages have been driven down. Why don't we stop people from going into retail work so that retail workers can get paid six figures too? Would you be in favor of that? Just make every kind of worker super expensive. What could go wrong?

    • ... to deskill CS to lower wages, let's be honest.

      If you're implying that a highschooler will graduate with the skills of a CS, then frankly CS is being massively overpaid.

      In other news JP Morgan wants to deskill accountants by teaching pre-schoolers to count using their fingers. Oh the humanity!

  • Should CS Be Required for a High School Degree?

    No, in high school, CS (he theory and practice of software development) is just a "shop" class, a vocational class, not a core class.

    Like a shop class it's perfectly fine to encourage students to take a class to see if they have an interest in it. If they have interest or curiosity, provide a series of CS classes. But don't force it on the uninterested.

    That said, computer literacy is something completely different than CS. A computer literacy class or two should be required. a computer is a tool peopl

    • by narcc ( 412956 )

      But don't force it on the uninterested.

      If we let kids only take the classes they were interested in, they wouldn't learn much of anything.

      a computer is a tool people need to understand how to use. However that is something very different from the theory and practice of software development.

      Nonsense. Programming is very easy to learn and has immense practical value. It is absolutely a basic computer skill.

  • So... you don't want children to do homework, you don't want children to be taught algebra, you don't want... ...but you want them to learn CS? Seriously?

    I mean, we can teach children LaTeX to do math homework and we could kill two birds with a single shot, we can teach children algorithms so they can program and optimize routines (using a B-tree to optimize their spare time), etc.

    But that would mean they have do it at home...

  • No (Score:2, Informative)

    by fbobraga ( 1612783 )
    Next quetion
  • by gweihir ( 88907 ) on Sunday December 04, 2022 @06:03PM (#63102456)

    CS is a specialist skill, there is no sane reason to require it in general. Same goes for programming.

  • If ANY new requirements should be added to High School graduation, it's basic law.

    By the time a student has graduated High School, he/she is required to obey the laws on the books - which they weren't born knowing, and which are written in a technical jargon, ditto. They can be fined, jailed, or even executed for failing to follow these rules. Ignorance of them is no excuse. So they should be able to understand them and have been notified of what they are.

    I'd also like to see, in addition to the jury of twelve, a jury of six recent highschool graduates - to rule on whether the law is understandable to them and, as understood by them, actually prohibits the act/omission of which the defendant is accused.
      - Unanimous "Yes we understand that and the accusation would be a violation." or no conviction.
      - Unanimous "This doesn't make sense." and the law is struck (or at least the case automatically goes to an appellate court on that issue).

    (The cryptic and bloated pile of laws and regulations, already to big to learn in a hundred lifetimes and being generated faster than it can be read, needs a mechanism besides repeal and challenge (by someone already at risk if the challenge fails) to cut it down to size. Do we need more laws than can be taught and understood by graduation from high school? How else can young adults reasonably be expected to obey?)

  • by bjwest ( 14070 ) on Sunday December 04, 2022 @06:37PM (#63102520)
    What does need to be required, however, is personal finances and how to handle money, nutrition and how to stay somewhat healthy.
    • Seconded. Though I grew up in the Netherlands and have teenage kids going to school in Switzerland. Added to that, when do you need to see a doctor, when not, and when you need medication and when not. Perhaps some lackings of the educational system are generic in the western world...?
  • There should be a general computer literacy requirement. You should need to know how to properly use a word processor, spreadsheet, and basics on how computers and the internet work. You could throw a *very* basic coding unit in there so you know the fundamentals, but that should be it.

    Nearly all of my son's course work in grade school is done on a tablet. He knows how to use a word processor and spreadsheet but, having never taken a formal class in either, has a *basic* understanding of how to use them. I

  • One can live a happy life without knowledge of CS possibly happier than with it TBH.
    So why put barriers in the way of people who do not need it in order to be productive and happy citizens?

    This seems to me to be an arrogant overreach, perhaps if philosophy was taught in high school rather than CS this board of experts would understand why.
  • The Harvard CS50 course for HS graduation would be a good choice.
    https://www.edx.org/course/int... [edx.org]

  • People are getting taught too many complex subjects, and that's driving the wages of professional work down. It's all a conspiracy. Education itself should just be very basic, if at all. Just keep everyone stupid so that we can get paid.

    • by narcc ( 412956 )

      Worried you can't compete with a high school graduate? LOL!

      Wages haven't been stagnant for 40 years because kids were getting a better high school education. You can blame anti-union propaganda, Republican policies, and conservative media for that.

  • Look, I know YOU think CS is important.
    Russian history majors think Russian History is important.
    Shop teachers think shop is important.
    Meteorologists believe theirs is the most important field.

    And we used to think humanity was the center of the universe. Then we grew out of that silliness.

  • Consider if it were to be made mandatory. The curriculum would be decided by committees, and would lag years behind. There is need to get everybody understanding computers, coding, and generally how stuff works. But how is the question.

  • Most people don't need Computer Science knowledge, much like they don't need Calculus or more than introductory Physics, Chemistry and Biology. There should be a very basic introductory class, 1 semester at most, teaching the basics of what an algorithm is, what a program is, how to write basic scripts like you'd use to automate putting headings on documents or calculations in a spreadsheet. From there the biggest need isn't CompSci, it's what used to be called "business machines": teaching how to use the s

  • How about we focus on computer literacy. As in, knowing how to actually use a computer including basic troubleshooting? And while we're at it, focus back on basic literacy and numeracy.

  • Selling products to schools is big business. This could easily create a new multi billion dollar industry selling CS products: professional development for teachers, new cert exam fees, computers, software packages, textbooks, etc. This isn't about students or churning out coders to drive down wages. It's about selling products.

  • The name of the game is to offer what students want to buy. Some true education surely goes on, however the idea that you can buy your credentials is quite common, according to prof friends of mine.

    The local universities are doing tons of construction to accommodate thousands of staff and students. From what I can see they are barely keeping up to service currently staffing levels. In other words, business is brisk and the growth outlook is optimistic.

    It a doesn't seem surprising that standards of understan
  • Products are built with intuitive interfaces and completely opaque administrative functions, so what are they talking about that an average HS student could learn? Obviously you can't require coding for a HS diploma, since so many students don't even properly learn math, so what's left?
    • You can teach basic coding concepts in GRADE SCHOOL if you really want to. Anyone remember LOGO for the Apple ][+?
      • "Concepts," sure. Toys and games with nesting gears and levers. But that still leaves the problem of practical familiarity with electronics. There was a story a while back about college professors finding it hard to teach current students the concept of a computer file because all they had ever known were super-abstract graphical interfaces, so the analogy to a file cabinet no longer exists. Electronics are everywhere in their lives, but using them teaches nothing about how they work, unlike in past era
        • I mentioned the file issue in a different post -- I've actually encountered that at work. And once again, screw Stevie J for inventing computing as a prison and normalizing computers as black-box media consumption devices.
          • And files aren't even a fundamental, just the level of abstraction my generation learned by using the interfaces of the time. So I'm a little baffled where average young people today with no special interest in the subject would even begin to understand what a computer does. Especially given that the whole concept of a computer is actually dismal and boring: "You can create illusions by having electrical charges do ungodly amounts of matrix algebra."
  • My friend's teenager is struggling through common core math here in California. They need to fix the existing curriculum before bending to the will of google who wants to flood the market with cheap code monkeys to eventually depress the absurdly high wages they pay some programmers now. Fuck those asshats.
  • Will next, geekie people need a passing grade in football?
  • May kids in the urban schools can't read and write. With public employee education unions consumed with grooming students to enhance their personal sex lives. Teaching CS is never going to happen in any meaningful way. Without the basics (the 3 R's) you can't teach a technical subject.
  • by godrik ( 1287354 ) on Sunday December 04, 2022 @10:05PM (#63102962)

    CS professor here, I've been attending SIGCSE for a few years now. I'm not sure we should REQUIRE CS in high school. I'm glad it's an option that some students can take. But as a requirement in HS school that would be very different.

    For instance, teaching programming is probably counter productive. It takes a while to learn, and I doubt you'll be able to carve more than one year in the curriculum, so doesn't seem particularly helpful.

    Ideally you'd want to teach computational thinking, how automated systems work and why they are designed like that. But that seems relatively hard to teach at high school level.

    So I'm not saying there is not a proposal that could make sense. But gut intuition is "probably no".

  • Basic logic and proofs go together very well with programming and CS more generally. A good program is made up of logic that you can prove achieves some desired purpose. Programming can be a hands-on way of learning how to manipulate logic and how to consider and tie up all the loose ends and edge cases.

    Basic deductive and inductive reasoning along with probability and statistics don't get nearly enough attention in K-12.

    All of those topics are vastly more useful to most people in their lives than the usual

  • by Sarusa ( 104047 )

    No

    (Not everyone can be an artist, not everyone should be a programmer)

  • As long as the kids graduating high school cannot read, write, and do math AT GRADE LEVEL (hardly an unreachable goal given that previous generations could do it on one tenth of the per-pupil spending) there's no excuse for teaching them ANYTHING else. Reading, writing, and math are foundational - if you can do those things well, you can learn anything else later either on your own or with further schooling.

    After the schools prove they can get kids to be competent at reading, writing, and math, then you add

  • I'm sure nobody really means "computer science". An introduction to using computers and programming them would be something that kids would benefit from. If, as the presentation claims, there are schools and students with no access to computers, and the government helps supports such schools (hell, there's probably enough e-waste to provide everyone with PCs), then that's a good thing.

    Then supporting any students who want to learn more, that would be good too.

    Forcing everyone to take it and be tested on it?

  • One problem here is that CS means different things to different people. To some it means basic competency with e.g. Word and Excel; to some it means programming and software engineering; to some it means an understanding of the theoretical underpinnings of data structures and algorithms...

  • Have you seen ChatGPT? This is the worst time in history to get into programming. If you're already a skilled programmer, you probably have a future maintaining old code, or writing really complex new stuff that software hasn't already figured out how to copy, maybe.

    This would have made sense like thirty fucking years ago, not now.

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