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United States Medicine

US Federal Agency Considers Ban On Gas Stoves Amid Health Concerns (cnn.com) 369

A federal agency is considering a ban on gas stoves as concerns about indoor pollution linked to childhood asthma rise, Bloomberg first reported. CNN reports: A US Consumer Product Safety commissioner told Bloomberg gas stove usage is a "hidden hazard." "Any option is on the table. Products that can't be made safe can be banned," agency commissioner Richard Trumka Jr. said in a Bloomberg interview. The report said the agency plans "to take action" to address the indoor pollution caused by stoves.

The CPSC has been considering action on gas stoves for months.Trumka recommended in October that the CPSC seek public comment on the hazards associated with gas stoves. The pollutants have been linked to asthma and worsening respiratory conditions. A December 2022 study in the International Journal of Environmental Research and Public Health found that indoor gas stove usage is associated with an increased risk of current asthma among children. The study found that almost 13% of current childhood asthma in the US is attributable to gas stove use. Trumka told Bloomberg the agency plans to open public comment on gas stove hazards.

Options besides a ban include "setting standards on emissions from the appliances." In a statement to CNN, the CPSC said the agency has not proposed any regulatory action on gas stoves at this time, and any regulatory action would "involve a lengthy process." "Agency staff plans to start gathering data and perspectives from the public on potential hazards associated with gas stoves, and proposed solutions to those hazards later this year," the commission said in a statement. "Commission staff also continues to work with voluntary standards organizations to examine gas stove emissions and address potential hazards."

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US Federal Agency Considers Ban On Gas Stoves Amid Health Concerns

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  • Who in the world cooks on a gas stove without PLENTY (I mean, fans running, plenty) of ventilation? It's obvious this is required if you have a particle count meter nearby. Even being within 3 feet of an open gas stove cooking has much worse air quality than the worst place in China. So yes, ventilate.

    It becomes harder to open windows during the winter. But that's when having electric cookers work nicely, right? :-) Also, you definitely want to open windows during the winter periodically to get rid of built

    • Re:Ventilation (Score:4, Informative)

      by BytePusher ( 209961 ) on Tuesday January 10, 2023 @07:10AM (#63194764) Homepage
      In the US Northeast I've never seen vent hoods that vent outdoors in homes, especially rentals. The few vent hoods I have seen just have some light mesh filtering to trap grease, then send the air straight back into the kitchen.
      • Yep, same for the Midwest. Literally had to rip mine out and do a complete replacement because it’s had too many bends and part was crushed. Same with stair railings, in homes wood railings are poorly attached at the floor and because of that pushing on the railing gets about 20x torque leverage meaning the railings are just for show. This is true in almost every house in this area at least. If you want railings where an adult stumbling into it will actually stop them falling over the drop you nee
      • Stuff from the 80s might not have it but homes I've had that were newer had them, although some of the runs are a bit small to be good enough for gas. The house I had that was built in the 50s had a large wall exhaust fan that would clear that kitchen out effectively even if you'd burnt something and filled it with smoke. Seems like it could be made a code requirement to have a ducted, exhausted fan rather than ban the gas ranges.
    • How many people own a particle count meter lol. It's not exactly a common household tool.
    • by jythie ( 914043 )
      Keep in mind that the big contributor is not the stove when it is being used (and thus people having their vents on), but when it is switched off. They spew small amounts of gas into the hom 24/7.
      • Keep in mind that the big contributor is not the stove when it is being used (and thus people having their vents on), but when it is switched off.

        So why does TFS repeatedly call out gas stove "usage" and not "presence"?

        They spew small amounts of gas into the hom 24/7.

        Some do, some don't, depends on the condition of the valves. And the degree of hazard from natgas in your home depends on quantity and ventilation. It's lighter than air, so if you have a ceiling-mounted ventilation system it will tend to escape through it... or just if your house is drafty.

      • by Bert64 ( 520050 )

        Only if they're faulty.
        In many countries you are required to regularly test your stove for leaks, and it will be condemned and disconnected if leaks are found.

    • by dwywit ( 1109409 )

      "Even being within 3 feet of an open gas stove cooking has much worse air quality than the worst place in China"

      You've been to that worst place in China and measured the air quality, yes?

      And compared it to a variety of domestic situations, yes?

      Are you able to provide scholarly citations for your claims? No?

      Sounds like you're a troll.

      And trolls are scum.

    • Re:Ventilation (Score:4, Insightful)

      by ShanghaiBill ( 739463 ) on Tuesday January 10, 2023 @07:33AM (#63194808)

      Who in the world cooks on a gas stove without PLENTY (I mean, fans running, plenty) of ventilation?

      People who live in cold climates.

    • Furnaces cycle in air from the outside.

      • Furnaces cycle in air from the outside.

        Nowadays high efficiency ones use a heat exchanger to recapture waste heat. It’s important to control how the air is circulated or it’s going to do things you don’t want it to and can lead to some severe moisture problems in some cases.

    • I do. We have a gas stove and no fucking range hood. The house originally had a wood stove, but it was removed instead of converting it to gas.

    • by necro81 ( 917438 )

      Who in the world cooks on a gas stove without PLENTY (I mean, fans running, plenty) of ventilation?

      It is not just the combustion products that are a problem, but the effect of small gas leaks coming from the appliance during the 98% of the time it isn't being used. Thankfully we've mostly moved on from gas stoves that have pilot lights, but even newer ones that supposedly shut off the gas supply have detectable emissions. Not enough to build up to the point of explosion, and usually not enough that you

    • It becomes harder to open windows during the winter. But that's when having electric cookers work nicely, right? :-)

      Nope, the actual gas flame does almost no polluting compared to actual cooking. Don’t believe me? Try cooking jalapeños without proper ventilation on any stove and after you regain your sight let me know how clean the air was. Before I fixed my vent, simply cooking anything with capsaicin reddened the eyes of anyone in the house, even in other rooms.

      Also, you definitely want to open windows during the winter periodically to get rid of built-up carbon dioxide you breath out.

      I hope you dropped an /s there.

  • by davide marney ( 231845 ) on Tuesday January 10, 2023 @07:34AM (#63194810) Journal

    But they can't even balance their own checkbooks. Trust = 0.

  • Safety! (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Snard ( 61584 ) <mike...shawaluk@@@gmail...com> on Tuesday January 10, 2023 @07:34AM (#63194812) Homepage
    "Any option is on the table. Products that can't be made safe can be banned." It's not possible to make knives safe! They have sharp edges, and people are cutting themselves all the time. We need to ban them! Right now! What are you waiting for?
    • Re:Safety! (Score:4, Insightful)

      by Smidge204 ( 605297 ) on Tuesday January 10, 2023 @07:56AM (#63194854) Journal

      The critical difference is: When used properly, knives are safe. Gas stoves create a quantifiable hazard even when used properly.

      Another important difference is the hazard a knife presents is obvious and the consequences of an incident are immediate. The harm associated with poor air quality resulting from using gas stoves indoors is invisible, chronic, and easily ignored. The consequences are subtle until the damage is done and permanent, and is rarely associated with the true cause.

      If we discovered that every time you used a knife you were slightly, invisibly cut over and over until one day, decades later, everyone in your house was just missing a finger and nobody really knew why, we'd probably be talking about banning knives...
      =Smidge=

      • Cooking is almost as unsafe regardless of the heat source ...

      • As many others have said, the solution is venting. It’s a lie that electric cooking is much safer when people are smoking grease and cooking anything at higher temperatures. Sure, it’s less without an open flame, but literally inhaling food is very bad for long term health. Let’s see what happens on an electric stove with inadequate ventilation when you fry up some chilli peppers.

        Instead of knee jerk banning cooking, maybe the emphasis should be put on proper regulations and buildin
        • Instead of knee jerk banning cooking, maybe the emphasis should be put on proper regulations and building codes.

          Strangely enough, the codes exist, down to the amount of air required to be moved.

          Of course, all this requires the contractors to install the code required equipment correctly and the inspector to not approve bad installs.

          Protip for all. If you are building a house, plan to show up at random times to check out what is being done. My boss was building a new house, and with his showing up at random times, sometimes two or more times a day, and checking out the work, having them re-do shitty work, the p

    • Re:Safety! (Score:4, Insightful)

      by Megane ( 129182 ) on Tuesday January 10, 2023 @08:55AM (#63194964)
      If you want a better example: motorcycles. If they hadn't been invented over a century ago, nanny-state safety agencies would never let them exist. Two wheels? Too easy to fall over! No steel body with crumple zones? You could get hurt real bad if you ran into something! No seat belts? You could fall off!
  • Once you have used induction, you won’t look back.
    Power efficient, heats up way faster than gas, repeatable accurate control, easy to clean.
    Gas and Electric elements suck compared to induction.
    We’ve used induction for 10 years now.

    • Interesting. I’ve never seen a commercial establishment use induction, 100% are gas tops. Even most commercial griddles are gas. It is 3x cheaper than electricity per unit of energy and seems to be what most of not all chefs prefer.
    • You should try deductive cooking. It is safer than inductive!
  • by sabbede ( 2678435 ) on Tuesday January 10, 2023 @08:24AM (#63194906)
    how bad can it actually be? What about professional chefs who spend all day surrounded by gas stoves? Are they all asthmatics? No, they aren't. Are they all dropping dead from carbon monoxide poisoning? No, they aren't.

    The health impact can't be all that great, so my money is on this actually being about fossil fuels, and driven by people who don't realize they're just causing more fuel to be burned somewhere else.

    • by Shinobi ( 19308 )

      As early as in the 1980's, Swedish studies show an increased rate of Asthma, chronic bronchitis, lung cancer etc for cooks compared to the population as a whole.

      • I’ve yet to meet a restaurant cook that did not smoke cigarettes like a chimney on their break.
        • by Shinobi ( 19308 )

          Most I'm acquainted with don't smoke. The ones that do tend to be immigrants or 1st generation offspring of immigrants from the middle east or the mediterranean regions.

    • by Bert64 ( 520050 )

      Gas (and electric) stoves are also a relatively modern invention. Before that, people burned wood, charcoal or coal to cook things and yet they are saying the rate of respiratory problems is higher now?

  • I hear they are electric and super efficient. Every day I read another article about them. Iâ(TM)m sure we could pump some heat to the stove top, right? /s

  • "Hidden Hazard"? Is it really hidden if it's the second largest appliance in your kitchen, and you stub your toe on it every time you get a glass of water in the middle of the night?

  • by davide marney ( 231845 ) on Tuesday January 10, 2023 @08:59AM (#63194984) Journal

    Come on, people, you just have to be able to recognize a racket when you see one. They're plainly just making crap up to scare you, and then offering to "protect" you from it.

    In the law, there's a concept called "Prima Facie" -- Latin for "on its face". When a suit is brought that isn't a legitimate complaint on its face, then one doesn't need to argue over the details. It is by definition not a case that can be decided and is dismissed. Example: I can't sue a cheese factory for false advertising because the Moon isn't, in fact, made of green cheese.

    We need to shut down this kind of self-serving governmental re-definition of harms right at the beginning. On its face this is a ridiculous proposal. The government is just creating a reason for its continued existence. Gas-fired appliances have been around for centuries, we have entire networks of gas pipelines to feed it, the entire industry is already regulated.

  • by jenningsthecat ( 1525947 ) on Tuesday January 10, 2023 @09:25AM (#63195050)

    then a significant survival option is also banned. In Winter, when the grid goes down and gas barbecues are buried or have run out of propane, a gas stove in a neighbourhood can make the difference between everyone eating meat from their freezers before it spoils, and living only off canned goods and some dried foods until they run out.

    That happened in 1999 to my wife, when her gas stove - the only one in her neighbourhood - helped keep the neighbours fed for nearly a week.

    • by Joey Vegetables ( 686525 ) on Tuesday January 10, 2023 @11:27AM (#63195500) Journal
      It can also keep people from freezing to death during a blackout. Of course, you're not supposed to use it that way, but, in what is already a life-threatening emergency, and assuming you have working CO detectors, I'd say the risk of getting lung cancer in 50 years is preferable to the risk of freezing to death in 50 minutes.
  • by argStyopa ( 232550 ) on Tuesday January 10, 2023 @09:30AM (#63195068) Journal

    Is anyone considering the air exchange rate in new homes?

    Current construction standards and practices leave homes exceedingly well-sealed against energy loss but result in dwellings so airtight that indoor pollutants skyrocket. Code requires 0.35 home air exchanges per hour, but even that is pretty low.

    Technologies like gas stoves that were perfectly safe 50 or 100 years ago may no longer be so.

    I live in a 120 year old Midwestern home in the US and we immediately notice the stale air when visiting friends in new homes. I'm sure our old home has a much higher exchange rate despite somehow not having excessive heating bills. (This is in winter, obviously, as in summer we have windows open all the time with no a/c...we have friends with new homes that have never opened the windows, ever!)

  • I am not going to disagree that an open flame is releasing particulate matter into the air. That is just common sense. However, I have to feel like the statement was intentional to drive attention to the activity. The reality is that they are entering a comment period to investigate the issue. I have some questions for the committee: Isn't the solution as simple as updating building codes to ensure a hood vent is installed that exhausts air outside the home? What about "vent-free" gas logs?
  • by kackle ( 910159 ) on Tuesday January 10, 2023 @12:02PM (#63195600)

    indoor pollution linked to childhood asthma rise

    Haven't gas stoves been used for decades? So how can you link a recent asthma rise to stoves? Is it as argStyopa posted above, that newer homes are letting in less fresh air?

  • Most people used gas stoves in the 20th century. Why is it suddenly a problem *now*?

    Now, I'm for cutting emission (esp. of /. fascist posters), but I just replaced an electric stove with gas last year.

    You want to replace it? Fine: your tax dollars pay for replacing it with an induction stove, not the cheap crap I was cooking on, and while you're at it, your tax dollars pay for the difference in cost between gas and electric for the next 20 years.

    Oh, and electric stoves REALLY SUCK big time for cooking on. For example, *you* char the skin off a pepper on an electric stove.

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