App That Lets Homeowners Rent Their Swimming Pools Draws Backlash (msn.com) 152
Somewhere in Maryland, an app that lets homeowners rent their swimming pools "has sharply divided suburban residents of Montgomery County as the local government considers formally regulating the short-term amenity rentals," reports the Washington Post, "potentially becoming the first in the nation to do so."
Neighbors have spied on neighbors, reporting unwanted outsiders flocking to their quiet residential streets. "Our entire block has been disturbed," Constance Kiggans, a Chevy Chase resident, said in written testimony to the Montgomery County Council. "It is, for all intents and purposes, like having a pool club on the street..." Unlike long-established home rental and ride sharing apps, newer apps that let people rent out their pools, home gyms and backyards have largely been unregulated across the United States so far. In fact, several jurisdictions, from the city of San Jose to towns across New Jersey to the state of Wisconsin, have tried over the past three years to ban the rentals or set up strict rules that require private pools to meet the same standards as a public pool...
Many homeowners are eager to earn easy money by renting out a backyard pool, despite a murky legal landscape that does not offer clear guidance on whether the rentals are legal or not...
Chief among the complaints detailed by pool sharing opponents is the noise... [36 residents who signed a letter of complaint] argued that the rentals turn quiet residential neighborhoods into bustling business districts, without the infrastructure to support commercial activity. They raised dozens of concerns, largely over the added nuisance of strangers pouring into their neighborhoods because of the apps, congested roads, scarce parking, and noise and safety. Their complaints have shut down at least one pool rental in the county.
Many homeowners are eager to earn easy money by renting out a backyard pool, despite a murky legal landscape that does not offer clear guidance on whether the rentals are legal or not...
Chief among the complaints detailed by pool sharing opponents is the noise... [36 residents who signed a letter of complaint] argued that the rentals turn quiet residential neighborhoods into bustling business districts, without the infrastructure to support commercial activity. They raised dozens of concerns, largely over the added nuisance of strangers pouring into their neighborhoods because of the apps, congested roads, scarce parking, and noise and safety. Their complaints have shut down at least one pool rental in the county.
As someone with a pool, I'll pass. (Score:5, Insightful)
Many homeowners are eager to earn easy money by renting out a backyard pool, despite a murky legal landscape that does not offer clear guidance on whether the rentals are legal or not...
Or what their liability would be should someone get hurt or die (or cause property damage) and/or what their homeowner's insurance would have to say about this type of thing.
Re:As someone with a pool, I'll pass. (Score:5, Informative)
the apps EULA makes them unable to sue anyone
Re:As someone with a pool, I'll pass. (Score:5, Informative)
Like that has ever kept anyone from trying.
Re:As someone with a pool, I'll pass. (Score:5, Insightful)
the apps EULA makes them unable to sue anyone
EULAs can claim whatever they want.
That doesn't mean those clauses will hold up in court.
Re:As someone with a pool, I'll pass. (Score:5, Informative)
Meaningless. Eulas can make agreements, they cant make laws, and if the laws gives you a right to sue, particularly in the case of negligence or illegality, no agreement will invalidate that.
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A EULA can't magically sign away all rights, especially when liability is involved due to what would be seen as negligence or failure to comply with regulations if the place was a commercial building. In fact the more generalised and wide reaching the EULA the more difficult it will be to enforce.
You can write what you want in a EULA. Enforcing it is an entirely different matter.
liability (Score:2)
the apps EULA makes them unable to sue anyone
Yeah, you say that, but it is extremely difficult to sign away your liability. I would bet that the homeowner is still 100% liable. Whether the app service is also liable is also a question. Regardless of any EULA.
Someone is going to trip and fall at the house, and then we'll see how this goes in court. I guarantee the homeowner will be embroiled in YEARS of expensive litigation. Because that's how long those cases run for. And I don't think the homeowner will prevail.
First of all, there's no way their hom
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Or, more importantly, who is liable when the renters pee in your pool?!
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Or, more importantly, who is liable when the renters pee in your pool?!
Exactly. I was thinking of the sanitation problem with renting out a pool since if people are going to be in any one place for what is expected to be hours then there needs to be toilet facilities and water suitable to drink. Unless the pool rental comes with access to the house for use of the toilets, or there is a separate outhouse, pool house, or which ever one might prefer to call it then there is a serious health problem in renting private pools. If there's no toilets then there will be people shitt
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The fine article mentioned a case of a person renting out his pool to a neighbor
That is also totally illegal, and it's just lucky there hasn't been a problem. Inviting your friends and neighbors to swim is one thing. The minute that you charge someone money, you're in the deep end.
*It might not even have to be money. Any contractual exchange of value might be enough to get into trouble with insurance, health departments, etc. If it's not a definite contract, it might not be a problem. The thing is: in any event, it will all be sorted out in court. Court is a place you do not want to be
Re: As someone with a pool, I'll pass. (Score:3)
Re: As someone with a pool, I'll pass. (Score:4, Informative)
The insurance company wouldn't cancel the policy. They'd keep collecting premiums and deny any claims.
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The insurance company wouldn't cancel the policy. They'd keep collecting premiums and deny any claims.
Better to cancel than to risk a sympathetic jury in a lawsuit
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The insurance company wouldn't cancel the policy. They'd keep collecting premiums and deny any claims.
Better to cancel than to risk a sympathetic jury in a lawsuit
When Uber was fairly new, say 6 years ago, if you had a car accident and called your insurance company, the *very* *first* words out of their mouth were, "Has this vehicle EVER been used for ride-share." (Not, are you an Uber driver; Not, was this an Uber?" They clarified: has anyone at any time ever driven this vehicle for ride share.
Because if you admitted that, or if they later figured it out, your policy was voided immediately. Not claim denied -- policy voided. Because your misrepresentation of the us
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Re: As someone with a pool, I'll pass. (Score:2)
Except Uber doesn't have most of the same problems. Insurance covers passengers, doesn't require a commercial business license, doesn't over use shared resources, and doesn't violate ordinances in most jurisdictions.
It has problems but not at the same level.
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Except Uber doesn't have most of the same problems. Insurance covers passengers, doesn't require a commercial business license, doesn't over use shared resources, and doesn't violate ordinances in most jurisdictions.
It has problems but not at the same level.
Originally, Uber was totally illegal. They continued to operate anyway, and bullied the local and State governments into changing the laws and regulations for them. There did not used to be "Transportation Network Companies"' (TNC), which is how Uber and its drivers are licensed and regulated now.
But as you point out, Uber actually provides certain liability coverage for passengers, and I think for drivers, too. Whether it is actually sufficient is unclear. Some places require the drivers to also obtain com
Extremely Risky (Score:5, Insightful)
Selling access to your pool to the public on an AirBNB-like website sounds incredibly risky to me. Especially if you don't have commercial liability insurance.
A few people will lose their entire homes completely before they figure out this is a bad idea.
Re: Extremely Risky (Score:2)
That insurance should be provided by the app service. That how it works for private tool and car rental.
Do the movie "Caddyshack" solution... (Score:2)
Do the movie "Caddyshack" solution to get people out of the pool with a candy bar. Worked in the 1980, and could work now.
For the allusion... https://www.youtube.com/watch?... [youtube.com] "Everybody out of the pool!"
Then local merchant could wonder why candy bar sales suddenly skyrocketed.
JoshK.
NIYBY (Score:2)
Not in your back yard
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>"Not in your back yard"
Except it kinda is. Imagine your neighbor doing this. Now YOUR back yard is abut to a public pool with all the boom boxes, screaming people, possible drug use, smells from excess grill and smoking, alien cars parking everywhere, litter, etc, etc. You are immediately deprived of your peace and possibly safety and sanity. Not at all what you signed up for when you poured your whole financial world into being locked to a piece of land with a house on it.
The kind of persons attrac
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There is some very reasonable logic in zoning
The reason used to be explicitly stated, but then the SCOTUS decided (Buchanan v. Warley 1917) that you couldn't be that blatant in your racism.
Zoning still does essentially the same thing, it's just more stealthy about it.
Reminds me of Indianapolis on race day (Score:2)
...when those who live near the track rent out their lawns for parking. Some even offer barbecue lunches for their customers, even though it probably violates certain food safety rules.
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That's all fine and dandy until something goes wrong and you get to spend a lot of time inside a courthouse explaining why you didn't cause whatever bad thing happened. So please, rent away, and keep your lawyer handy.
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"Your property, you control it."
In what universe? Can you open a nuclear plant on any piece of property you own? An oil refinery? a SuperMarket? A nightclub? Public gym? No. There's city planning, bylaws, licensing, zoning all controlling what you are permitted to do. You bought a house in a suburb that's zoned residential, you can't even open 7-11 on it without permission.
So no, using your residential zoned property as a pay parking lot, or bar/restaurant, or public pool, is not your prerogative just becau
Rent a pool? I've got something better (Score:3)
Come rent my trampoline and self-service knife-juggling equipment!
If you can't afford your house, sell it (Score:3)
Wish everyone who bought a house they couldn't afford would just sell and get it over with. Stop trying to foist your neighborhood with the detritus of your financial and personal failures.
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No, it's a business plan now.
I couldn't find anywhere else to say because of airbnbs, so I had to stay in airbnbs when I first came to Humboldt, and one I stayed in was owned by a woman who had bought three other houses, which are ALSO airbnbs.
People are literally buying homes specifically to turn them into illegal unlicensed hotels.
airbnb is evil, and must be destroyed, and all its ilk with it.
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Most people can't afford their homes. That is not why they try to generate extra cash though; they see opportunities for free income. I had a friend that rented out his home two months a year to pay the property taxes and cover the cost of a vacation. There were certain other tax benefits he could take advantage of as well.
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Wish everyone who bought a house they couldn't afford would just sell and get it over with.
This isn't people buying a house they couldn't afford. This is people seeing an opportunity to make money. It doesn't matter if you have a mortgage or not. When there's money to be made people will make that money.
Rent out someone else's pool (Score:2)
Public pools (Score:3)
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Ewwwwwww (Score:2)
Errrm, sorry but renting out my swimming pool to a bunch of randos is just not something that is ever going to happen.
Look at some of the horror stories from AirB&B and tell me this won't be just as awful. I repeat: Ewwwww.
Nope nope nope.
Happy user of the service (Score:3)
I have rented out pools several times. It is an excellent service. Both of the local pools I use are relatively secluded, so there are no issue with neighbors.
Rent my Ex-Wife, low daily rates (Score:2)
I've started a new app-based business based on my own experiences.
"Rent My Ex-Wife" allows a person to rent another's ex-wife complete with insurance and no commitments, the complete EXE (Ex-Experience). That means you get:
1) Uninterrupted nagging. "Did you mow the lawn yet?" "When are you buying me a new car?"
2) Spending every dime you have while complaining you don't make enough. "We can't be broke, there's still checks in the checkbook?!?"
3) Claiming that the guy she friended on Facebook is just a friend
Got this covered (Score:3)
Montgomery County is not a good place to test the waters. The county ordinances have this covered, fenced in, strapped down, and taped up.
Some of the requirements for operating a public pool include:
Montgomery County Zoning Ordinances [amlegal.com]
Re:Are there *any* freedoms at all? (Score:5, Insightful)
If you're selling access to the public, shouldn't it be taxed like any business is taxed? Regulated like any business is regulated? Have the same safety standards as any other business needs to have? Because that's what this is, a business transaction.
What, next you're going to tell me I should be able to serve food out of my home to the general public, but the health department shouldn't be allowed to make sure I'm keep food stored at the correct temperatures?
Re:Are there *any* freedoms at all? (Score:4, Insightful)
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"Isn't it a bit heavy handed to treat AirBnB or someone renting out their pool as "selling access to public"?"
AirbNB is available worldwide. You have the entire world available to book your house/pool. So yes, I would say it's selling access the public. This isn't a neighborhood get-together. You're selling access to your home on a wide-ranging global website.
"Isn't a six year-old's lemonade stand selling drinks without safety standards?"
Six year-old lemonade stand is generally only serving the people who a
Re:Are there *any* freedoms at all? (Score:4, Interesting)
And the point of the lemonade stand was to make you think where the cutoff point is. What if the lemonade stand is on a busy street? What if it's not on a busy street and in a suburb, but a 40 year old man is selling lemonades? According to you it's okay for kids doing it, but not for the 40 year old.
And I'm glad you brought up liability. So, if I purchase from the kid a lemonade that was made with water from an unfiltered well with bacteria in it and I got sick, why is that liability any less than what could happen in a backyard pool? Furthermore, why would you assume that the home owner's insurance doesn't cover accidents in the pool, whether the home owner is renting or not? See? I believe you're just making many generalizations and assumptions here, that the kid selling the lemonade got the lemonade from city-supplied tap water, or that the home owner hasn't already worked guests swimming in the pool out with his insurance company.
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If you get sick due to unfiltered water, it's criminal negligence, not an accident, and the kid's parents are indeed in trouble. The kid lemonade stands are formally outlaw as unlicensed. Someone could call the police, but are unlikely to do so it if it's a kid (and not a 40 year old) and it's occasional (if it's permanent then you will get into trouble for child labour). Accidents in the pool can happen, they happen all the time in AirBnB rented houses. People don't go to jail over that if they did not com
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Accidents in the pool can happen, they happen all the time in AirBnB rented houses. People don't go to jail over that if they did not commit negligence
It must be true that accidents happen "all the time", but I would be curious how you know about the outcomes and consequences. Do you have some data, or even some anecdotes, that you could share to back up your assertion?
And generally, how does AirBNB insurance work? Also, note that AirBNB is being made explicitly illegal in an increasing number of places. (Finally, AirBNB is probably different from the pool rental app. I wonder exactly in what ways?)
Some stories and detailed explanations would be Informati
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You're treating the "worldwide" AirBnB locations as one single entity.
They're acting as a single entity. Shut down airbnb and all the other similar sites whose business model is profiting from enabling illegal activity, and they won't be a problem (like they weren't before.)
Re:Are there *any* freedoms at all? (Score:4, Insightful)
Isn't it a bit heavy handed to treat AirBnB or someone renting out their pool as "selling access to public"?
No.
That access has an impact on the neighborhood, the town, etc etc. It costs money to let them do it.
Does the government have to take over someone's first amendment right to choose whether they want to buy a cup of lemonade for 50c?
I missed the "right to buy lemonade" in there, but maybe you can show us where it was.
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Exactly. These people expect all of the perks and benefits without having any liability.
Re:Are there *any* freedoms at all? (Score:5, Insightful)
That's a very anti-business view you have there.
The local health department can't shut down any restaurants in town because of unsafe food practices? Ok, I'm immediately going to distrust all restaurants in town and not spend money there.
The government can't mandate that construction companies build structures that won't collapse under normal use? Ok, I'm not going to step a foot inside the building regardless of what commercial wares they have for sale.
Distrust and fear cause people to close up their wallets.
Re:Are there *any* freedoms at all? (Score:5, Informative)
Very true.
All you have to do is look at the buildings in Turkey. They had a recent earthquake. All the buildings that were built to the standard of the EU remained upright and intact. All the buildings that were built to the much more relaxed (corrupt/incomplete) Turkish standards lay in rubble. And we're talking about buildings right next to each other on a street.
Regulations are what keep businesses honest and safe. Because by the time the public finds out there's a problem, it is often too late.
Imagine a restaurant that bought a cow with a slow prion disease and kills everyone who ate the affected tissues.
Re:Are there *any* freedoms at all? (Score:5, Insightful)
Of-course I am against every single business regulation, every single one. Governments shouldn't be regulating businesses at all, it's not their job, that's not what they are for, yes, I am against all business regulations *by governments*.
That's literally the primary purpose of government: To ensure a free and open marketplace. Aside from unhinged libertarians, everyone understands that.
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I wouldn't have a problem with it, if it wasn't, curious enough, the same people who then lament when they get conned and swindled out of their money because government failed to regulate something and some con artist took advantage of it.
For reference, see shitcoins. A perfect example of what happens when an unregulated market hits gullible people.
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That's literally the primary purpose of government: To ensure a free and open marketplace. Aside from unhinged libertarians, everyone understands that.
Wat
No, only unhinged libertarians believe that.
The primary purpose of government is to provide for defense on one hand, and to promote public welfare on the other. Those two things go hand in hand, so they must both be considered primary.
Business is a means to a end, not an end in itself.
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I wholeheartedly agree with you.
I always wanted to open my own restaurant. But those pesky food safety laws, jeesh. What's the harm with a few customers throwing up because their pansy stomachs cannot handle a tiny bit of salmonella? I mean, the market would sort that out after one or two deaths. Three, tops. When people start croaking from coming to my restaurant, people will sooner or later learn that they should avoid it and the market will sort that issue out.
But then again, it's so damn cheap... c'mon,
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What's the harm with a few customers throwing up because their pansy stomachs cannot handle a tiny bit of salmonella?
You make it sound like nobody ever got salmonella from eating at a restaurant.
I mean, the market would sort that out after one or two deaths.
Believe it or not, it usually does. It doesn't even have to be death. Bad reviews, word of mouth, and seeing a roach or a mouse/rat in a restaurant will do.
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You make it sound like nobody ever got salmonella from eating at a restaurant.
Oh, sure people did. But the general government reaction isn't just shrugging some shoulders and a recommendation to avoid eating there. Places like this get shut down pretty damn quickly.
It doesn't even have to be death. Bad reviews, word of mouth, and seeing a roach or a mouse/rat in a restaurant will do.
There's one really problematic thing when it comes to proving you got food poisoning from a restaurant: It's virtually impossible to prove. Yes, you ate there, but what else did you have all day? Reviews are one thing, but they only go so far, not to mention that if you need to back up that accusation because you get calle
Re: Are there *any* freedoms at all? (Score:5, Informative)
There's one really problematic thing when it comes to proving you got food poisoning from a restaurant: It's virtually impossible to prove.
Speaking as a restaurant co-owner it's actually it's fairly easy.
If a restaurant is the cause of an infection, two things will happen.
First, there will be a cause (i.e. a bacterium), which can be found in both the infected person's bowels and the ingredients of the food they ate. All someone needs to do is bother to check, and health authorities actually do this routinely on probable cause.
Second, likely more than one person will get sick and report the incident. This will very rapidly escalate the assessment to "probable cause", and -- see above -- this will trigger investigation by authorities.
Re: Are there *any* freedoms at all? (Score:2)
Word of mouth only works if your business isn't operating as some ever changing pop-up. For instance, the kind you might find run out of a residential kitchen.
Irony detection algorithm (Score:2)
I think the post about pesk food safety laws was a mildly sarcastic response to an earlier post saying there should not be any regulations.
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Bad reviews, word of mouth, and seeing a roach or a mouse/rat.
A MouseRat?
What, now Disney is involved?
It really is a small world, after all!
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Jack in the Box is still in business...
Re: Are there *any* freedoms at all? (Score:2)
Let me take a wager that you do support Governmentâ(TM)s in defining, regulating, and enforcing property rights.
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Actually if you carefully read what I write about rights, you will understand that this is not a contradiction. Just to make sure you understand that I always maintain the same principles, here are comments regarding what rights are: https://slashdot.org/comments.... [slashdot.org]
https://slashdot.org/comments.... [slashdot.org]
a right is a protection against government abuse, only governments can violate rights, everything else is a misnomer and is not a right but some sort of protected class entitlement.
- so a right is a protection against *government* abuse, nothing else. Thus your statement is both correct and is not a contradiction of my position, it only solidifies it.
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a right is a protection against government abuse, only governments can violate rights
So if shoot you and steal your property that is not a violation of your rights so long as I'm not from the government?
Re: Are there *any* freedoms at all? (Score:5, Insightful)
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What does it matter who exactly is on the other side of the fence? I am of the opinion that people have the final authority to use their property, otherwise it's not their property at all.
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What does it matter who exactly is on the other side of the fence? I am of the opinion that people have the final authority to use their property, otherwise it's not their property at all.
Please extend my sympathies to your neighbors.
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So you're ok with me burning old tires in my yard with the smoke kinda ruining your BBQ because your steaks taste like burning rubber?
I'm burning them in my yard after all, not yours.
Re: Are there *any* freedoms at all? (Score:4, Interesting)
Your logical fallacy: Reductio ad Absurdum. There's two sides to this argument, and yours fall on the silly sides. Of all the nuisance examples you could have picked you picked an activity that is actually regulated due to the toxic cloud it generates. That's before you consider personal waste incineration is an illegal activity in most of the USA, and the EPA will have something to say about your land after the fire happened too.
So no there will be a whole world of arseholes who are perfectly happy to make noise but will very much not be okay with your poisoning them with your silly example.
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Have you ever had to live near a place that is suffering from loud noises? Have you tried sleeping or at least relaxing while there's a party next door?
If you prefer a more "natural" smell, how about a goose farm next door? Or a neighbor that enjoys his laser shows that keep hitting your windows from time to time so you can enjoy it too? Also, I don't know about your municipality, in mine, noise pollution actually IS regulated.
For good reason.
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I'm not sure who you think you're arguing against. I agree whole heartedly with your point of nuisance neighbours. Just make the argument appropriately. Equating it with a literal tire fire is stupid because that activity is actively illegal. If you want to make a point then make the point directly, and don't parody your own post into irrelevance like you did.
If you prefer a more "natural" smell, how about a goose farm next door?
There is no goose farm next door, I live in an area where this is also a regulated activity.
You need a permit to raise geese, and the neighbours have
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Noise pollution is a real thing, with real health effects. They happen to be mostly mental health effects unless it is very loud, but so what? Mental health is real.
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Yes it is and the argument should be about that, not about burning tires.
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Of all the nuisance examples you could have picked you picked an activity that is actually regulated due to the toxic cloud it generates.
But in his world, there are no regulations, so suck it up, buttercup. You have no recourse.
Just give all your guests nose plugs because after all, by your own 'logic', he's allowed to do whatever he wants on his property. Your guests will just have to deal with it.
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That is basically the same question as whether smokers (the bbq kind) should be preemptively prohibited in residential communities. [tampabay.com]
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You’re pretty mouthy for renting a basement.
Re: Are there *any* freedoms at all? (Score:5, Informative)
I am of the opinion that people have the final authority to use their property, otherwise it's not their property at all.
This kind of "my property -- my kingdom" attitude is exactly why HOAs were invented. Enough people lived next to a neighbor that thought parking on the grass, burning their yard waste, letting their lawn go to shit, repairing their siding with wood from discarded pallets, and painting their house with leftover automotive paint were acceptable behaviors. These disappointed people got together to create a neighborhood plan that detailed some "common sense" rules for everyone to agree to.
Depending on the state you live in and the HOA regulating that community, "common sense" has to be taken with a grain of salt. Some rules seem sensible to most people -- trash containers should be stored out of site, they should be put away at the end of the trash-pickup day, and yards should be minimally maintained by cutting, trimming, and edging. Others are more controversial -- paint colors must be approved because there is always the odd individual that likes green/purple/gold paint combinations. Pink homes might be the favorite of someone's grandmother but it does give a 1950's vibe to the neighborhood. If you live in an area with narrow streets, then limitations on parking trailers, RVs, or boats might seem like a good idea or might seem overly restrictive.
The advantage to HOAs are similar to gated communities. There are rules the affected homeowners agree to follow but you don't have to live in that community if you don't appreciate or want the restrictions the HOA imposes. If you want a half-acre lot with plenty of space, trees,and privacy, then shop for that type of property. If you want a minimum of order and standards because your neighbor's house is only 19 feet on either side of your house, then read the rules of the HOA to see if they strike an acceptable balance.
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Enough people lived next to a neighbor that thought parking on the grass, burning their yard waste, letting their lawn go to shit, repairing their siding with wood from discarded pallets, and painting their house with leftover automotive paint were acceptable behaviors.
The only one of these things that's the neighbors' business is the burning.
An HOA just codifies neighborhood busybodying. They're like the tattletales in school.
Just let people live their own lives, FFS.
I wonder how many of the "unwanted outsiders flocking to their quiet residential streets" from TFS were noticed for being the wrong race.
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No HOA's have their roots in racist covenants. Now rather "my property - my kingdom" its "my neighborhood - my dictatorship" HOAs are an abominable abrogation of municipal responsibility.
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This kind of "my property -- my kingdom" attitude is exactly why HOAs were invented.
Yes, so that a few property owners could make a neighborhood their kingdom.
You do NOT need HOAs to keep people from doing unreasonable things. You need laws, and enforcement for those laws. Guess what? The HOA is also powered by enforcement of laws, but at best it's an inefficient way to accomplish that because it simply adds another layer to the process.
MOST localities have laws about a whole lot of things in order to protect people from harmful behaviors. They regulate storage of hazardous chemicals, nois
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This kind of "my property -- my kingdom" attitude is exactly why HOAs were invented.
No. Lack of reasonable council regulations is why HOAs were invented. America is the land where everyone needs to form a group of likeminded people because the government is too incompetent to keep society functioning normally. HOAs are a symptom of government disfunction. Unions are too, absolutely essential in America, utterly pointless in many countries where actual employee protection laws exist.
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I am of the opinion that people have the final authority to use their property, otherwise it's not their property at all.
Have fun telling that to the Police when they come to check out the meth lab in your basement / shed ... and get back to us on how that goes. :-)
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What does it matter who exactly is on the other side of the fence? I am of the opinion that people have the final authority to use their property, otherwise it's not their property at all.
I look forward to buying the home next to yours and hosting 24/7 drag shows in the front yard. If you have kids, I'll buy a house across the street from their school and do the same.
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I am of the opinion that people have the final authority to use their property, otherwise it's not their property at all.
The old "Your freedom ends where mine begins" crops up here. If you want a final authority on how to use your property, go live on an island. If instead you chose to live in a society then you do so governed by rules of that society regardless of how much you think you're kink of your castle.
Now go throw a rave on your property at 2am on a weeknight and let me know what the police think of your "my property my rules" argument.
Re: Are there *any* freedoms at all? (Score:2)
Great. I'll just set up an above ground drain on my side above the fence line and flush all my sewage to the edge of my property. If some (or all) of it ends up on your side, then that's now your problem. You can build a taller fence if it's a problem.
Good thing I can lift the support frame...
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You should also charge him for the free fertilizer and your labor and supplies you spent building that structure to provide for his needs. You're a very thoughtful neighbor =]
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When the property next door goes on the market, you have the freedom to buy it and fill it with quiet renters.
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You make it sound like there's no difference with a neighbor having a 4th of July pool party vs someone renting their pool out on a global marketplace to bring countless strangers into the neighborhood every day causing a nuisance.
What freedom is that? (Score:2)
Noise ordinances don't apply until the sun goes down and it's around 10pm.
You don't get to whine because your neighbors are having fun in the middle of the day.
Re:Are there *any* freedoms at all? (Score:5, Interesting)
I'm typically a private property rights and capitalism cheerleader, but I'd have to give this type of service some thought. Why? Because there's a pretty big difference between private and commercial use in many cases. This ends up turning your private residence into a commercial venue.
When it starts disturbing your neighbors, it's not always about "muh freedums!" You need to be a good neighbor as well. A home is not just a person's sanctuary... that previously quiet house in the suburbs is also literally the biggest single investment someone is likely to make in their entire lives. So I'm not entirely sure I think some sort of oversight may be unwarranted here, since such rules are mostly designed to protect those investments for everyone, not to mention neighborhood tranquility. After all, you're probably not legally allowed to simply convert your home's rooms into office space and rent it out to businesses. I hope the reason for that (for zoning laws) are self-obvious enough that I don't need to explain. It seems like this sort of activity is skirting perilously close to the same sort of thing.
No one is outlawing private pools. But commercial businesses ARE regulated, and frankly, for pretty good reasons.
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What would you do if you actually had a rowdy neighbor? You'd first ask him nicely if his kids could keep it down, and if that didn't work, you'd resort to the HOA, or calling the cops, neither of which can do anything, because a pool and kids are loud (and a nuisance - I get it). That's what you get for making your single, biggest investment in a coo
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Most places have noise ordinances which can resort in fines that would make your commercial pool rental unviable and keep your neighbor from being an obnoxious ass with loud private parties.
Most HOAs can and will levy huge fines and slap a retainer on your house plus interest, late fees etc which will rack up very fast and must be paid one way or another. Worst case is they'll take a huge cut when the house sells but in some HOAs you could get sued and wiped out.
There is a huge difference between normal re
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AKA, your rights stop where the next person's begin.
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One of my neighbors ran a small gym/fitness operation from his garage. Maximum of 5 people per hour, 7-11AM weekdays. All his customers loved it, most walked or rode bikes over. A few drove over and parked on the main street. Not a huge impact to the neighborhood but someone ultimately created a stink.
There are maybe 30 such businesses I know of in the area. About half exist because there is essentially no commercially zoned property 7 miles in either direction, and the other half because it is easy. Zonin
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Sure. And of course if you rent out your property to the public, it will be subjected to the same standards as any other property rented out to the public. Your pool will be subject to the same standards and it will be examined by the same authorities that make sure that other public pools are being kept safe for public use.
Alternatively, of course we can abandon it for all the public pools and next time your kid dies from sticking its foot into a pipe that sucks out the water and drowns, well, sucks to be
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All pools have to be operated privately in the first place, governments have no business running pools.
People consistently rate their municipal utilities higher than private ones, why should a pool be any different?
Governments have no business regulating pools.
By all means run along to some third world shithole where nothing is regulated, and let us know how you like it, if you don't wind up in a shallow grave for acting like an asshole.
Re:Where do you draw the line? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Where do you draw the line? (Score:5, Funny)
My constant reminder that the pandemic was by no means lethal enough.
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Well, don't get me wrong, but it looks like an upside down loo.