How $138B in US Student Loans Were Cancelled - Roughly One-Third of Planned Amount (cnn.com) 162
Roughly $138 billion in U.S. student loan debt has now been cancelled, reports CNN. "That's about one-third of the $430 billion that would've been canceled under the president's one-time forgiveness plan, which was struck down by the Supreme Court last year."
It's 9% of all outstanding federal student loan debt, according to the article, "wiping out debts for about 3.9 million borrowers — by using a number of existing programs that aim to offer debt relief for certain groups of struggling borrowers..." What President Biden has been doing — before and after the Supreme Court ruling — is using existing student loan forgiveness programs to deliver relief to certain groups of borrowers, like public-sector workers (through the Public Service Loan Forgiveness program) and borrowers who were defrauded by their college (through the borrower defense to repayment program). His administration also made discharges for borrowers who are totally and permanently disabled. None of these programs expire, meaning they will help qualifying borrowers now and in the future. In some cases, Biden's administration has expanded the reach of these programs, making more borrowers eligible.
And in other cases, it has made an effort to correct past administrative errors made to borrowers' student loan accounts by conducting a one-time recount of borrowers' past payments. This effort helps make sure people receive the loan forgiveness they may already qualify for by having made at least 20 years of payments in an income-driven plan, which calculates monthly payment amounts based on a borrower's income and family size, rather than the amount owed. The recount is expected to be completed by July...
Last year, the administration created a new income-driven repayment plan. Known as SAVE, the new plan offers the most generous terms for low-income borrowers. Those who originally borrowed $12,000 or less will see their remaining debt canceled after making payments for at least 10 years... [The administration] is working on implementing another path toward a broad student loan forgiveness program, this time relying on a different legal authority in hopes that this attempt holds up in court. This proposal is currently making its way through a lengthy rulemaking process and has yet to be finalized.
It's 9% of all outstanding federal student loan debt, according to the article, "wiping out debts for about 3.9 million borrowers — by using a number of existing programs that aim to offer debt relief for certain groups of struggling borrowers..." What President Biden has been doing — before and after the Supreme Court ruling — is using existing student loan forgiveness programs to deliver relief to certain groups of borrowers, like public-sector workers (through the Public Service Loan Forgiveness program) and borrowers who were defrauded by their college (through the borrower defense to repayment program). His administration also made discharges for borrowers who are totally and permanently disabled. None of these programs expire, meaning they will help qualifying borrowers now and in the future. In some cases, Biden's administration has expanded the reach of these programs, making more borrowers eligible.
And in other cases, it has made an effort to correct past administrative errors made to borrowers' student loan accounts by conducting a one-time recount of borrowers' past payments. This effort helps make sure people receive the loan forgiveness they may already qualify for by having made at least 20 years of payments in an income-driven plan, which calculates monthly payment amounts based on a borrower's income and family size, rather than the amount owed. The recount is expected to be completed by July...
Last year, the administration created a new income-driven repayment plan. Known as SAVE, the new plan offers the most generous terms for low-income borrowers. Those who originally borrowed $12,000 or less will see their remaining debt canceled after making payments for at least 10 years... [The administration] is working on implementing another path toward a broad student loan forgiveness program, this time relying on a different legal authority in hopes that this attempt holds up in court. This proposal is currently making its way through a lengthy rulemaking process and has yet to be finalized.
They were fraudulent (Score:5, Informative)
The Biden admin basically reviewed loan terms and contacted loan officers on behalf of people, resulting in the forgiveness.
The take away is that at *least* 1/3 of the student loans were fraudulent.
Also if you like having a job you can thank this program. It's putting a ton of money into the bottom end of the economy, which keeps everything going. Will Rogers said it years ago. [wiredpen.com]
Re:They were fraudulent (Score:5, Insightful)
that's how. The terms of the loans were such that they were due to be forgiven, the principal and lots of interest had long since been paid too. The loan companies were still (illegally) collecting on the loans. The Biden admin basically reviewed loan terms and contacted loan officers on behalf of people, resulting in the forgiveness. The take away is that at *least* 1/3 of the student loans were fraudulent.
Came here to say this. The loans weren’t forgiven, the original terms were finally adhered to after sometimes decades of unilateral acations against the contract and thus illegal fraud on the part of the lenders. The whole idea this is loan forgiveness and the perpetrators aren’t being forced to divest of all illegal gains including all the interest thereof and paying restitution while they are being sentenced to prison says quite a lot about this country.
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They were universally pissed at him likely more due to the reaction of having being bailed out by co-workers taxes.
There is a blatant moral line in between those who need a financial bailout, and those that qualified for one. If you can afford to celebrate by spreading Good Fortune, then maybe you’re more viewed as one who crossed that line.
They weren’t angry because of what he got. They were angry because they had to actually sacrifice for theirs.
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Don't bother. I'm fully Republican and so many people HATE when a fellow person gets a leg up card done for them for any reason at all on both sides of the isle. I just look at this as a mass tax refund due to people. It doesn't bother me at all that people got some of their education paid for them.
Most everyone wouldn’t have a single problem with that either. The difference this time, is we’re seeing how “smart” that graduate is coming out of a school that prioritized a political indoctrination over an education. We’re seeing the effects of those schools that prioritized selling absolute bullshit degrees capitalizing and profiting massively on feelings over the last decade, regardless of the financial reality.
I think everyone should get paid back by the government or through some kind of sleuth work to find bargains/outs for people who already have paid tons of money into something.
And for those who paid “tons of money” for a deg
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There were virtually no bailouts. The original terms were being violated by fraud and the fraud was stopped. The rest were all “forgiveness” plans for non-profit work baked into the original contract decades ago and were due. Literally there are almost none at all, it’s just taking credit for something that already existed.
Posting anon due to previous moderation in this story,
The problem is that the Biden Admin and/or the reporting on this in the news is NOT making that distinction, they are touting these loans being forgiven as if they were part of the original unilateral "Student Loan Forgiveness" program that the Supreme Court shut down saying "no, you don't have the authority to unilaterally forgive those loans"
Regardless of the leadership at the top. The Administration as a whole is not that stupid or ignorant. They knew that not providing that clarity would rile up the other side of the isle, and yet they went with that marketing strategy anyway.
You get what you market. If they wanted to provide that clarity, they have a President that can command global airwaves at any hour of the day. I have little sympathy for the pushback.
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This sounds like BS. Why doesn't the loan taker just stop pay and let the loan giver go to court (and lose) if the loan giver isn't following the contract/conditions?
Don' forget teacher forgiveness, that almost no on (Score:2)
Yet the loan holders simply chose not to honour those contracts. As a teacher (computers and robotics) I am still waiting to see if my teacher loan forgiveness will ever be honoured.
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It's putting a ton of money into the bottom end of the economy
No it is not putting "a ton of money" into the bottom end of the economy. It is helping people like you to have more money to pay other bills. This is doing NOTHING to effect me in a positive way.
I despise people like you who take a free ride on labor like mine. I saw the terms and conditions and declined, not that I ever actually had a chance anyways since I could not even afford the application and admission fees.
You are a whiney weak child who has made bad decisions in life in the hopes of coming out on
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The problem is education is over-funded. Idiots blame high tuition costs on loss of taxpayer subsidies, all while ignoring the fact that tuition rates have been increasing well beyond the rate of inflation for decades.
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I had K-12 education in mind when I wrote that, but that has more to do with Texas than Joe.
I don't really know how higher education is funded, but I know one-time student loan forgiveness won't fix it. It's more performance than substance. Obama at least tried to get us a health care system.
Joe's big legacy was supposed to be wrapping it up in Afghanistan. Somehow he managed to turn that into a negative, now the whole "cleansing Gaza of ragheads" thing. Poor Joe... he never quite fooled me though. We haven
Opinion (Score:2)
The fix for this is to make student loan debt cancellable in bankruptcy after n years. I don't understand why that's such a difficult thing to get pushed through.
Making 20-year loans to 18-year-olds with no income, no job, and intentions to spend the next four years in some state of inebriation should not be a business plan underwritten by the US government.
25% discount (Score:2)
They should limit universities to the final two- or three-year capstone on a bachelors degree and leave High Schools and Community Colleges to get students up to the increased entry level - let's call it "Associates Degree" for want of a better term.
Then encourage employers to open up a lot more positions to people with Associates degrees.
It's not a "loan" ... (Score:2, Insightful)
Those Who Could Not Afford College (Score:2)
And will spend the rest of their lives competing against people who also could not afford college, but went anyway , there is a word for you folks
SUCKERS!!!!
Bwahahahahahah! Take your personal responsibility and stick it squarely in your hamster hole, looo hoooo hoooo hoooozers!
Nah, just kidding, I am sure that Biden has something for you too, you know, for having had to make that heartbreaking decision about your future. He is not going to allow you to be punished for doing the right thing. Chances are, yo
Debt cannot be cancelled (Score:2)
When a person takes out a loan (ANY loan for ANY purpose) with a promise to pay interest, the lender must provide the money and this is often only done with an agreed upon interest for a reason: Money left sitting in a mattress loses value (due to inflation) and therefore is a loss to the investor if simply stored in a "safe" place. The only way the money keeps its value is if it is invested in productive activities so that it grows at a rate faster than inflation. If money is lent to somebody at a lower ra
SOtU guest w/$117k forgiven, $1M home makes $135k (Score:3)
A teacher paid $135,901 last year who had student debt forgiven was the “honored” guest of U.S. Rep. Ayanna Pressley at the State of the Union address.
That teacher, who also owns a home in Dedham with her husband assessed in Zillow online records at about $1 million, was given $117,000 in student debt relief, Pressley says in a press release.
“Priscilla is a first generation American, a proud union educator with Boston Public Schools and the Boston Teachers Union, and the daughter of a Colombian immigrant, who has received over $117,000 in student debt relief under the Biden-Harris Administration’s improved Public Service Loan Forgiveness (PSLF) Program,” Pressley writes.
City payroll records posted by the Herald show that teacher, Priscilla Higuera Valentine, earned $135,901 in 2023; $116,595 in 2022; and $114,112 in 2021.
She is listed as a school teacher at the Conley Elementary School in Roslindale.
Is it actually happening? (Score:2)
Taxpayer looses big. (Score:2)
Re: If they had cancelled the debt (Score:5, Interesting)
Re: If they had cancelled the debt (Score:4, Informative)
Bullshit (Score:4, Insightful)
That's a less worth way, way more than $139 billion. Plus have fun in your 50s when you need surgery and can't find a doctor to do it because you don't like education.
Re: Bullshit (Score:2)
No, there is no debt cancellation. It was paid by tax payers. The colleges got their money already from the government when the person got accepted into college and signed the paperwork for the loan. The loan repayment program is supposed to bring money back into the program to pay for loans for others to go to college.
Have you ever researched these college Endowments? Harvard has over $50 BILLION endowment.
This supposed debt cancellation does not solve anything. It helps colleges hike their tuition up ev
Re: If they had cancelled the debt (Score:2)
When student loans get forgiven it's "teaching people that they don't have to fulfill their commitments".
When corporate entities get gigantic cash infusions to cover their frivolous debts it's called "bailing out firms that are too big to fail".
I can't believe Americans accept this crap. You people deserve the ass fucking your politicians give you because you keep crowing about how much you enjoy it.
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Don't forget, many of these loans were fraudulent and the lenders were breaking rules. The loans were supposed to be at lower rates than general loans under the assumption that they would increase national education levels and the economy, they were not intended to be fast and easy cash cows for banks. If they banks don't like the rules, then they shouldn't be in the program.
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Don't forget teaching 3.9 million people that they don't have to keep their commitments.
Don't forget teaching tens of millions who didn't get a chance to go college that they still need to pay for other people's unfulfilled commitments. But don't worry, they took my Social Security from me too, so I will just die and the problem is solved once and for all.
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I would have taken it. You basically gave a bunch of shops that had every reason to perish instead an upper hand. With the PPPs you could have bought them out and expanded, or you could have provided better service, you could have trained your staff, you could have reached a new height.
Never reject something handed out to everyone for free. You rejecting it only means that someone who doesn't deserve it gets to one-up you.
Re: If they had cancelled the debt (Score:2)
Re: If they had cancelled the debt (Score:2)
Re: If they had cancelled the debt (Score:2)
How does any of this help anybody except for the people that currently have debt? How does this help future generations? How does this help my daughter that is 16 who wants to go to college in the future?
This effort to cancel student debt short term scam to buy votes. It doesnâ(TM)t solve anything except for some relief of a specific voting population. It is not a sustainable solution. Nor does it actually enhance the education of the citizens of the United States.
Ever since Oboma passed the healthca
Re: If they had cancelled the debt (Score:2)
Any company that didn't take it should probably fire their finance team. It was a no brainer with zero downside; all upside.
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We should have let them perish. The bailout wasn't for mom and pop shops, it was for their landlords.
Re: If they had cancelled the debt (Score:2)
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For the recipients, it sure was free.
TANSTAAFL applies everywhere. Whatever someone gets for free, someone else has to pay for. It's the simple law of economics. The only exception is stuff literally everyone gets for free. And rest assured, someone is already pondering how he can stop that and make a dime off it.
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Sure, but for a net gain.
Re: If they had cancelled the debt (Score:2)
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Have you checked my name here?
My belief is for rent. Rent-seeking is more profitable than selling.
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It's free for the recipient.
Sure, someone pays for it, but since when does the one getting it give a fuck?
Re: If they had cancelled the debt (Score:5, Informative)
Blanket forgiveness is actually been ruled by SCOTUS to be not possible with an executive order, Congress would have to do it. Instead they're using existing loan forgiveness programs that are underutilized. Most of these forgiveness programs are complicated and many people may not even realize they qualify for them, so in essence his administration used the existing framework and reviewed federal borrower's loans for them and found where they qualified for forgiveness, they implemented it. This is the point about the Public Loan Forgiveness Program; that's been in place for public sector workers for some time now, but it would seem many didn't even know they could take advantage of it.
And the other part of this whole student loan equation is that there are (by one classification) two types of borrowers, those that take private loans and those that take Federal loans; remember the government is part of the student loan system too. He can only affect those that took government student loans; there is no forgiveness for private loans at all.
What you're saying would be true if they gave the private student loan companies a check to clear those debts on behalf of the debtors; that's not what's happening here. Instead they're clearing the debt off the government's books with tools they already have.
I'm rarely one to support any administration's efforts, but in this case this is a pretty good strategy, and no I don't think it'll affect the student loan issue with the private sector at all.
Re: If they had cancelled the debt (Score:2)
I haven't been able to find good information on this, but it seems to me that if the loan servicer accrues interest for 25 years, then the government steps in to pay the balance, the government is going to save money by just paying off the loans now and saving money on interest.
Assuming 100% of students will never pay off their loans, it would always be better for them to forgive your loan early than late.
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Blanket forgiveness is actually been ruled by SCOTUS to be not possible with an executive order, Congress would have to do it.
I don't see what's controversial about this either. The constitution is very clear about the power of the purse belonging to congress. The president can't just say "Oh hey congress, I'm going to spend federal money to fund something you never approved, even though the constitution explicitly says I'm not allowed to do that."
Either way, what the administration is doing here is really stupid. We basically have a hemorrhaging patient, and the president offers them a bucket to bleed into and does nothing to sto
That's not how this works (Score:2, Insightful)
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>"As long as you don't foolishly put right wing crooks in charge of your public universities then the universities will charge only enough to cover the cost of providing the education."
That is a ridiculous statement. It has nothing to do with "right wing", and of course they will charge to cover their "costs". And those costs include zillions of both useless and damaging "administration staff" and programs which go up continuously.
There is *ZERO RISK* to the universities with these government-backed l
Re:You're confusing private & public Universit (Score:5, Interesting)
>"There have been some rather nasty cases of Republicans (it's always Republicans) putting their cronies in charge and money being wasted. It looks like the University of Arizona is going through that right now, though I'm unclear on the details their governor, a Democrat, is cleaning up the mess. "
Everything with you is so clearly partisan, isn't it? You need to take off those glasses. BOTH parties and MOST politicians are corrupt.
>"Other than that Public Unis run at cost."
That means nothing. The "cost" is whatever they WANT it to be. We "need" to build a new useless diversity center- bam, $20 million more "cost."
>"The money coming in goes to the students."
A lot of it goes to useless fancy new buildings that aren't really needed, racist DEI curriculum, and administrative staff overload (which has vastly outpaced student enrollment). I know, I have been monitoring my alma mater for many years. An average of only 26% goes to instruction. Adjusted for inflation, the average tuition, nation-wide, has gone up from $2440/year in 1970 to $9.349 in 2020.
>"RESTORING THE SUBSIDIES US OLD FARTS ENJOYED WHEN WERE WERE IN COLLAGE"
What I got was exactly two $600 Pell Grants. THAT WAS IT. We were lower-middle class and I had to borrow the rest. And I started working 2/3 time in third year, so it took me 7 years but graduated with only $10K of debt, which I think I paid off in 3 years or so (early).
>" Sorry to shout, but JFC I'm sick of old people who had everything handed to them on a platter pretending they didn't get everything handed to them on a platter."
I can't speak for you, but I didn't have hardly anything handed to me. I worked my ass off. I never did anything social. I drove a crap car and lived in an even crappier studio apartment and missed only a single day of class/work (the one time I ended up in the ER).
These institutions should be held liable (at least PARTIALLY) on government guaranteed loans for both graduation rate AND productive employment AND defaults. Then they will not seek to enroll useless students and/or provide useless degrees to them. Instead, they would do whatever needed to make sure they are providing real value. Students who want to get their own traditional/private loans can do whatever they want. But banks are going to look carefully before forking over the dough.
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>"And I started working 2/3 time in third year"
Clarification. I had been working continuously since age 16, part time (24 hours or so), saving. I continued THAT until third year of University, when I bumped it up to 2/3 for two years, dropping to a part-time student, and then later full-time work in the last 3 years.
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BOTH parties and MOST politicians are corrupt.
I think it's funny how often I see this claim from people who support the biggest grifter in US politics today -- or probably, ever. To be clear, I'm talking about Donald Trump. If we actually enforced the constitutional clause against emoluments he'd have several hundred more indictments, and his kids would also be heading for prison.
The truth, I think, it is that most politicians are not corrupt, at least by proper definition of the word. I think all of them try to flex their opinions in the direction t
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>"but it's not corruption"
Well, I guess it all comes down to one's definition of "corruption." Personally, I think that if a politician uses insider trading info to enrich themselves or their family/friends (which seems pretty common), or sells their vote/power/influence (hello, Biden, and so many others) or trades that for "favors" (either immediately or later), that is corruption. I think we can agree there are problems and it would be nice if there were clearer and better enforced laws regarding the
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Gen X. Well, you may be right on that, I confess that I don't know. But I suspect that even if it were the case, it probably wouldn't explain much of the HUGE difference in tuition year-over-year. Looking at a graph, it is a pretty smooth curve. It doesn't show evidence of some before/after situation, at least not that I detect.
Read university budgets (Score:5, Insightful)
Universities never charge just what is required to cover the cost of providing the education. This is because they are only partly educational institutions, they are also organizations that conduct research, philanthropy, political lobbying, and public outreach. MIT conducts billions of dollars of research each year. According to their 2023 financials, about $1.9 billion of that research was sponsored, while the combined cost of providing education and conducting unsponsored research was less than $1.5 billion (unsponsored meaning it wasn't funded, it came from sources like student tuition). They maintained more than $30 billion in investments and more than $5 billion in real estate and facilities. On top of that they spent another $1.1 billion on administration and overhead. They didn't break out education expenses from unsponsored research, but the numbers mean providing education had to have been far less than a third of their costs.
Among other expenditures, Harvard is funding a huge sustainability initiative, building new programs on climate change and sustainability, buying electric buses and infrastructure, etc.
What we really need to do to cut costs is refocus universities on the job of education.
You can think whatever you want (Score:3, Interesting)
Harvard isn't the benchmark here. Neither is MIT. Your local public Uni is. They got most of their funding from State & Federal subsidies right up until the early 2000s. I know. I was there when the funding was cut. Got in and out just before it. I remember reading about it in the college newspaper. Articles written with the help of the economics dept that predicted exactly what's happening right now, down to the penny.
They all said the same thing. Outsourcing and automation
Jesus Fucking Christ... (Score:2)
Public Universities get most of their money today from tuition. Before 2000 and Bush Jr and the GOP slashed funding it was mostly from State & Federal subsidies.
The boomers and Gen Xers on this forum bitching about college got their educations paid for by the government.
And they really, really hate getting their nose rubbed in that fact. So they show up on every thread about college and bitch about loans and pretend it's overcharging for services rather th
Let's pick a public university (Score:2)
According to their 2024 operating budget, they plan to spend $755 million to put professors in the classroom, compared to $772 million to pay professors for other things ($636 million for researchers, $134 million for public service).
Their strategic plan's mission, vision, and values call for them to prioritize things like:
--Promoting multidisciplina
Um... no. (Score:3)
The fact that you're using the acronym "DEI" is worrisome. You do realize it's the new "woke" right? Which is just the new "SJW". Which was the new "PC". Which was the new "hippy BS", which was the new "beatnik", which was the...
If you're deep enough in the pipeline that you've heard of DEI you should start picking up on the patterns they use to manipulate you. They're laug
Re: Um... no. (Score:2)
I'm using DEI because that's what organizations call it when they assign job titles. It's not my term. How would YOU refer to people who work on the "DEI team"?
Several red states (Score:3)
Re: If they had cancelled the debt (Score:5, Interesting)
Guess what, my country has exactly that system. Not as a bailout, but as, you know, how it works.
I pay for your degree. Well, provided you get one now. Just like someone else paid for mine. Sure, you pay a token sum to be inscribed (like IIRC 200 bucks a semester or something like that, just enough to make it uninteresting to be an eternal student so you get those student amenities like free bank account, free public transport around town and student food in the mensa. And yes, that is 200 dollars, Not 200,000). The rest comes out of my pocket, aka taxpayer money.
The result of something like this is, as you may guess, that EVERYONE wants to study. It's basically free. Which results in an enormous amount of people starting out every year. Which in turn means that nobody gives a fuck about whether you get anywhere with your studying or not. Nobody is holding your hand. Nobody's job is dependent on you being there. If anything, you're a nuisance to professors who'd prefer to do research rather than grading undergrad exams.
The dropout rates are insane. 70% is fairly normal, and 90% to 95% are not unheard of in much sought after degrees.
But what graduates is literally the top 5% of people who want to amount to anything in this field. A degree from my university pretty much means you're one of the best. And it reflects both in how these degrees are regarded and how much you get paid. Because employers don't give half a fuck about how much you paid for your degree. What they care about is whether you can earn them money, and that requires you to be good.
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A degree from my university pretty much means you're one of the best. And it reflects both in how these degrees are regarded and how much you get paid.
I am an American, so forgive my ignorance on this subject: What country do you live in that pays according to your worth rather than your connections? All I see are vast fields of incompetent executives doing jobs they are not even the least bit qualified for.
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That would be Denmark. At least according to the corruption perception index.
And sadly, no, CEOs that are essentially overly expensive magic-8-balls is a global problem. The only thing that does work in terms of meritocracy is that people who hold a degree here are also people who tend to earn this, and thus are in high demand. Usually by the same glorified magic-8-balls that don't have them. They got theirs abroad, usually. I wonder why.
Re: If they had cancelled the debt (Score:2)
In the United States, banks do not issue lost student loans - the federal government does by printing money. https://www.washingtonpost.com... [washingtonpost.com]
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The banks only serviced most of these loans, and the debt is held by the federal government. So taxpayers and future generations are on the hook either way. The only thing lost here is the recurring revenue lost by loan servicers who were doing nothing of value anyway.
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I went to university, graduated, got a job and had no student loan because someone else's taxes paid for my education. Should I now ask to not pay tax for the next generation? Screw you, I got mine?
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Yes. Its not enough to pull yourself up by your bootstraps anymore. You need to bootstrap your own bootstraps.
Re: Reparation for student loan borrowers when? (Score:2)
So because you had it bad everyone else should suffer too?
Bizarre take. How do you ever progress as a society this way?
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Re: Reparation for student loan borrowers when? (Score:2, Troll)
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>The administration is buying votes with taxpayer money"
^^^ This
And it isn't just one administration or anything new. This has been the NORM now for quite a while.
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Theyd be more successful if they cancelled tax debt.
Are you seriously trying to sell Trickle Down in 2024?
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This, and it's worse... the original [canceled by SCOTUS] forgiveness was a vote buying scheme, but the new stuff that Biden did... that was mostly things that should have been done anyway.
So it seems likely that Biden would have allowed all this bullshit to persist if he could forgive the original intended debt.
So he's getting [vote buying] credit for fixing what he [after 40+ years in the Senate & 8 years as VP] allowed to happen in the first place.
Especially as most of these loans were Stafford/DIREC
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> Reparations are ony for black people
reparation /reprSH()n/
noun
the making of amends for a wrong one has done, by paying money to or otherwise helping those who have been wronged.
1. You're wrong. The definition makes no mention of race.
2. You're wrong. Not all black people were wronged.
3. You're wrong. Other races were wronged in the past, not just black people.
4. You're wrong.
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Nothing in that abomination says reparations are exclusive to blacks. In fact it says they're "tackling reparations for black residents". If reparations were only for blacks that statement would be redundant.
Best of luck getting Native Americans to pay reparations to descendants of black slaves, or as we like to call them: free citizens. On second thought I think you should push that agenda. I'll get some popcorn and watch the circus.
Better than any M. Night Shyamalan plot twist: https://www.youtube.com [youtube.com]
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"As self governing entities they weren't subject to the laws of the united states."
"When the civil war ended the five civilized tribes kept their slaves. They refused to liberate their slaves."
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Fuck all the losers that made bad choices and the institutions that helped them
Try again. What is being forgiven is under existing programs to forgive loans. For example, some of these are for people who agreed to go into teaching. If they became a teacher and paid on their loans for X years, any remaining loan is forgiven. That is how the program is set up. They are not being given anything extra.
Now, if you really want to talk about losers that made bad choices and the institutions who helped them, mig
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The problem isn't student loan debt being forgiven. That's almost certainly a bonus to the economy. Especially for low socioeconomic people who started, didn't finish for one reason or another. Now they have loans negatively impacting them in a number of ways starting with credit reports. Forgive these loans and there is an group of people better off. Especially since let's face it, any income increase they get is going to end up in immediate circulation.
The next thing that has to happen is student loa
Re: And what about future students? (Score:2, Troll)
Who gets shafted with someone else's debt?
Making loans harder to obtain (Score:3, Insightful)
Still it's incredibly easy to do away with the scam fake public universities. They have extremely low rates of proper job placements and a
Re: And what about future students? (Score:2, Informative)
Re: And what about future students? (Score:2)
Re: And what about future students? (Score:2)
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Why should we give out any more loans if they will just be forgiven? Why should more loans be given to people who are just gonna major in a degree that has no earning potential to pay it back?
If you want to major in Feminist Goat Yoga, do it on your own dime. Don't expect the public to fund your 4 year vacation.
Honestly? No. We should not be giving out student loans.
It is bad idea to profiteer on the future workforce. It is self-cannibalization on a national level.
If we need college educated workers, set up scholarships to fund the education that provides them. Same thing with trade schools. Make public colleges publicly funded if everyone needs a college education. If that is too communist for you, only let in the most qualified students with the best chance of success: egalitarian competition, survival of t
A well-known campaign promise. (Score:3)
Why should we give out any more loans if they will just be forgiven? Why should more loans be given to people who are just gonna major in a degree that has no earning potential to pay it back?
Why should we not ask who people voted for first? See if they supported this well-known Presidential campaign promise of loan forgiveness, because it sure as hell wasn’t a “surprise”. For any taxpayer.
If you want to major in Feminist Goat Yoga, do it on your own dime. Don't expect the public to fund your 4 year vacation.
And yet, that is EXACTLY the precedent Government just established and defended, paid for by taxpayers and everyone else who sacrificed hard to pay for college. Oh, and I heard they now offer a doctorate program for Feminist Goat Yoga, in case you were wondering about “education
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I kinda prefer our model. Yes, you study on my dime, but we don't offer ridiculous courses nobody needs.
If you want to study that, go to the US and pay for it.
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I never quite understood the idea of going into crippling debt for a degree that doesn't really get you anywhere past the first job you hold.
Seems to be some sort of American custom that we just don't understand over here in old Europe.
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There is plenty of evidence, that even those graduates of "underwater basket weaving" will have - on average - a better financial outcome than folks without any degree. These people are - again: on average - smarter than their peers without a degree, they were - again: on average - able to hone their language, writing and social skills, which helps them in life even if their jobs ultimately do not involve the "weaving of baskets beneath water level".
One could now look and ask "so why would we throw addition
Re:I wonder what it feels like (Score:5, Informative)
Be happy for others people when they have good fortune.
It's not free. *Everybody* is paying for their loans through higher taxes or inflation. The universities are getting paid. The loan companies are getting paid. They are being paid by everybody.
This is objectively false (Score:2)
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Dude let's say I grant that half trillion (Score:2)
Pretty good fucking ROI if you ask me.
As for money we don't have, we've got tons of the stuff. We just have to take back what Hair Fuhrer handed out to the 1% during his term. Which Biden's well on his way to doing.
As for collage, gotta spend money to make money, and that's exactly what an educated populace does. Makes money. Lots of it. For everyone.
Re: I wonder what it feels like (Score:4, Insightful)
Does it really impact you when the sweat to overcome trials and obstacles in your life to obtain something are skipped by someone else who cheats?
Does it really impact you if I get to not have to work and collect the same income as your 9-5? All that effort you put in is pointless and you should just be happy for me.
Does it really impact you if you have to participate in society when others dont? Be proud of them. Keep working to support it too.
Bonus points for having no distinction from those who paid for degrees and those that were gifted them even as both groups talk to people who didnt go because they were wise like they are idiots.
I skipped college and made it through lots of hard work and dedication in my field. I have worked in Wall Street as a high paid consultant even at a few points with people who have phds.
Had more than a few instances of my talent being gatekept from jobs by college bros that were insulted by self taught types.
If you have even a penny of your loan repayed I feel it should be public information just so people who didnt go to college can push back against your gatekeeping.
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Does it really impact you when the sweat to overcome trials and obstacles in your life to obtain something are skipped by someone else who cheats?
Not really. I still got mine. Is mine worth less now that they got it too? After all, I got it earlier than them and I, unlike them, managed to earn a decent wage.
Does it really impact you if I get to not have to work and collect the same income as your 9-5? All that effort you put in is pointless and you should just be happy for me.
Also not really. I still got mine.
Does it really impact you if you have to participate in society when others dont? Be proud of them. Keep working to support it too.
Frankly, I don't see how. At the risk of repeating myself, I still got mine. How does theirs impact me in any way? I could simply ignore them and nothing changes.
I skipped college and made it through lots of hard work and dedication in my field. I have worked in Wall Street as a high paid consultant even at a few points with people who have phds.
Had more than a few instances of my talent being gatekept from jobs by college bros that were insulted by self taught types.
If you have even a penny of your loan repayed I feel it should be public information just so people who didnt go to college can push back against your gatekeeping.
Have you ever noticed how the people who lament about "fairness" usually mean that they're pissed they didn't get to "cheat"? That's not fairness you're
Re: I wonder what it feels like (Score:2)
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Your anger that people who were defrauded, permanently disabled, or chose public service sector jobs get some relief is indicative your parents didn't teach you empathy.
Slashdot had become a vile cesspool of angry and cynical people.
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I hear: "chose to go into debt with no plan to pay it back."
I have neither empathy nor sympathy for people who sideline their heads and let other parts of their anatomy make decisions for them.
Look at it this way: first the country gives you a loan to pursue a college degree. Then you end up working for that country and earn so little, that you can't reasonably pay back that loan. The country can now either:
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Fuck all the deadbeats who made poor decisions, didn't pay their bills, ...
Even those who were defrauded or victims of administrative errors or who are totally and permanently disabled?
Did you even read TFS?
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Known as SAVE, the new plan offers the most generous terms for low-income borrowers. Those who originally borrowed $12,000 or less will see their remaining debt canceled after making payments for at least 10 years...
$12K or less. Over 10 years of payments.
I'm reluctantly OK with the other forgiveness programs. At least they more or less are in line with what Congress authorized. The SAVE plan is what sticks in my craw. If this plan works, what's to stop the next briber-in-chief from further reducing the payments? It's a stealth blanket forgiveness program. In a decade we could see "you have to make a single $1 payment and if your loan balance is under $1 trillion, we'll foist the rest on taxpayers.
Thing is, both the President and Congress are to blame here.
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The SAVE plan is what sticks in my craw. If this plan works, what's to stop the next briber-in-chief from further reducing the payments? [ ... ] In a decade we could see "you have to make a single $1 payment and if your loan balance is under $1 trillion, we'll foist the rest on taxpayers.
If your biggest worry is, what the next "briber-in-chief" is going to cook up, then how about you vote for a functional Congress comprised of members, who actually try to find common ground among their peers to get legislation going? A Congress, which is not held hostage by a bunch of radical lunatics?
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If your biggest worry is, what the next "briber-in-chief" is going to cook up, then how about you vote for a functional Congress comprised of members, who actually try to find common ground among their peers to get legislation going? A Congress, which is not held hostage by a bunch of radical lunatics?
Works for me. That doesn't seem to be the preference of 150 million other voters. And the problem is, I'm quite sure the legislation you and I favor is probably radically different (e.g. I want to eliminate a bunch of departments, cut DoD in half, replace all social welfare programs with a UBI, and balance the budget at no more than 15% of GDP in a few years. Oh yeah, and eliminate all restrictions in immigration.). As long as the country is radically but proportionally divided, gridlock is what we're going