Mark Cuban to fund Grokster vs. MGM case. 246
Deadric writes "According to Mark Cuban's latest blog entry, he will help fund the Grokster vs. MGM case, which threatens to destroy the Betamax shield."
There is very little future in being right when your boss is wrong.
How exciting (Score:5, Funny)
Too late (Score:2)
I think the only thing there's left to fund is a reality series.
Re:Too late (Score:2)
Would you call this (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Would you call this (Score:2, Offtopic)
That's funny! Stupid, but funny and I mean no disrespect, I like my funny like this a lot of the time.
Mod parent up please.
all the best,
drew
Why did you mod me the way you did? (Score:2, Offtopic)
My post was offtopic to the article, but not in a smaller context.
So, what was your thinking? Or were you simply trying to spend your mod points quickly and picked a safe one?
all the best,
drew
Ok, I'll bite... (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Ok, I'll bite... (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Ok, I'll bite... (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Ok, I'll bite... (Score:3, Funny)
Soccer team or something?
Re:Ok, I'll bite... (Score:2)
Guy who rode the boom (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Guy who rode the boom (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Guy who rode the boom (Score:2)
NOT A TROLL (Score:2)
Re:Ok, I'll bite... (Score:2)
Mark Cuban (Score:5, Interesting)
Its nice to see him getting in on this. He might be goofy and really into himself, but he is good at winning.
Re:Mark Cuban (Score:3, Informative)
This from a friend that worked on The Benefactor, from his personal contact and from things he heard from other people.
Re:Mark Cuban (Score:5, Insightful)
In my opinion, that's not ego at all. What's wrong with a guy being aware and proud of his own abilities? It seems today everyone tries to go out of their way to make other people feel important even when they're not contributing shit, and anyone who decides they want to admit they've done well has an "ego". Well, it seems he's earned the right to do so.
Re:Mark Cuban (Score:2)
Re:Mark Cuban (Score:3, Insightful)
Is that what you tell yourself when you come across someone more successful than yourself? Some people might get lucky once (and even that's unlikely when it comes to money, because its a world of vultures anytime a single dollar is involved), but Mark Cuban's business accomplishments simply cannot be denied. It's petty of you to think that he did it without a lot of hard work and soli
Re:Mark Cuban (Score:2)
There's dumb luck. Especially applicable to playing the lottery, given the odds of winning.
There's the luck of the draw. The circumstances to which you were born falls under this. Or what cards you get when playing poker.
Then there's a lucky opportunity. This takes skill, because one must be able to see the opportunity, and then one must be able to act on it. A lucky opportunity might be one of the above types of luck (or a type I didn't think of to list), but what's im
Re:Mark Cuban (Score:5, Funny)
If Phoenix finishes with the best record, Nash is gonna get the MVP award.
Wow, NBA on-top in a slashdot post. Good day so far
The "Betamax shield" may not fit anyway. (Score:5, Interesting)
With P2P, there are no generational losses and it doesn't require any money other than a working computer and an internet connection to distribute as many infringing copies as the user likes.
Re:The "Betamax shield" may not fit anyway. (Score:2, Funny)
Actually... (Score:5, Insightful)
There is no way to rule against Grokster without violating the Betamax shield. Essentially, a tool has legal and illegal uses (specific circumvention tools like DeCSS might not fall under this, but otherwise the Betamax shield is wide). Can we punish the producers because a significant amount of the population chooses to break the law, using their tools?
If so, I would like to see the class action suit against Ford, Mazda, Chevrolet, Toyota, Hyundai, BMW et al for creating tools of speeding. At least around here, official numbers say 90%+ speed at times (and the rest are probably liars). You can fine the perp, but you don't punish the toolmaker.
Kjella
Re:Actually... (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Actually... (Score:5, Insightful)
This serves two purposes: First, it allows the developer and the world time to figure out what the technology is good for. P2P networks are copyright neutral -- anything can go over the network. Thus, copyright holders can take advantage of it as well. Second, it prevents copyright holders -- really a subset of them, in fact (even back in '84, some were in favor of the Betamax) -- to extend their copyright on a specific work to what would effectively be a patent on a technology.
Grokster has won in the lower courts because their case is a slam dunk for Betamax. The only way that they can lose is if Betamax gets overturned.
Same argument applies to the whole internet, too. (Score:5, Interesting)
Note that the same applies to the Internet itself, and to a plethora of its components: Routers, TCP, FTP, cabling, webservers, etc.
There is good reason to believe that a vast majority of the traffic on the Internet is "pirated" copyrighted material. If the movie, music, and broadcast industry conglomerates can use a "mostly used for piracy" argument to shut down one application or one protocol, they can use the same argument to shut down ANY or ALL of them.
The entertainment conglomerates would LOVE to have the Internet go away. (Some of them even flamed it systematically as it was catching on. Some of them still do.) It pulls eyeballs from their products and is thus perceived as cutting into their revenue.
Remember that the Internet itself was designed as a peer-to-peer system - an interconnection of a vast network of endpoints that exchange information. The perception of it as a client-server, vendor-customer network (like, say, a broadcast medium) is an illusion, created by three factors:
- The enormous success of a few client-server apps, such as the web, (where the servers are usually run by a corp or institution),
- the rise of ISPs (with terms of service discouraging consumer-grade customers from hosting servers), and
- the shortage of IPv4 address (leading to workarounds such as dynamic address allocation and NAT, which also impeed hosting a server on a consumer-grade connection).
Re:Actually... (Score:3, Informative)
What the Court said was:
Re:Actually... (Score:2)
"We'll be back after these words fro-[[pause]]... [[unpause]]-lcome Back, everyone!..."
Re:Actually... (Score:2)
That approach requires the user to actually pay MORE attention to the commercials than she would otherwise, so it is not "easily done". Plus, if you are monitoring the commercials while the program is recording, then you are also watching the program as it airs, and not "time shifting" at all.
Re:Actually... (Score:2)
Today: getting something you never had
So exactly who's complaining here?
The HBO network whose Sopranos and Deadwood you are watching without paying for a premium cable subscription. And all the broadcast-TV producers with plans of a DVD release someday in the future.
we punish the tool makers all the time (Score:2, Informative)
Sudafed is now a behind the counter drug in many states (slowing sales) because end users used it to make meth.
Re:The "Betamax shield" may not fit anyway. (Score:5, Informative)
Not true. From the BetaMax Shield [eff.org] link:
Only 9% of users were making legitimate recordings, but the court ruled that these people should not be denied, despite the majority's unlawful behaviour.
Re:The "Betamax shield" may not fit anyway. (Score:3, Funny)
News this week: Huge numbers of people flock to eBay to pick up Betamax recorders so they can tape all their P2P content to the format and remain legit
Ok.. probably not likely
--Jim
Re:The "Betamax shield" may not fit anyway. (Score:5, Insightful)
From the article:
Re:The "Betamax shield" may not fit anyway. (Score:2)
This is one thing that botherse me. If I'm allowed to make VCR copies of shows to time-shift, what's the difference if I download it from p2p? I usually am busy or forget to watch the 1 or 2 TV shows that I want to, and p2p is the only way I'm able to catch up on them.
Re:The "Betamax shield" may not fit anyway. (Score:2)
Re:The "Betamax shield" may not fit anyway. (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:The "Betamax shield" may not fit anyway. (Score:2)
No, that's not true. The questions of fact were dealt with and decided by the lower court, are undisputed (read the plaintiffs briefs, and the oral arguments - they try very hard to claim to dispute the facts, but were clearly unable to do so. The Supremes, furthermore, rarely address questions of
Re:The "Betamax shield" may not fit anyway. (Score:2)
I think that people are reading Betamax way too literally
Actually it fits like a glove... (Score:2)
Umm no. Courts routinely distinguish between the two. Appeals courts do not normally examine matters of fact at all - only whether or not the lower court applied the proper law and procedure in making their determination.
Re:Actually it fits like a glove... (Score:2)
Without facts there is no case. What Grockster is up to is beyond dispute.
The only questions that are in doubt here are whether the 'non-infringement uses' identified meet the standard for fair use under the law. That is a question of law, not fact, the question is what the standard shou
Re:The "Betamax shield" may not fit anyway. (Score:2)
To rule for MGM the Supreme Court must decide that "substantial noninfringing use" isn't enough; they may decide as you've suggested that the "principle" use is what is important. Or more likely they'll apply some sort of fuzzy
Re:The "Betamax shield" may not fit anyway. (Score:2)
That's false. The principle VCR use is negative for the copyright owners, even if that use is merely time-shifting. Fair Use doesn't require zero economic harm, however- only that economic harm has been taken into account as part of the overall consideration.
Re:The "Betamax shield" may not fit anyway. (Score:2)
One already has; it's called the Apple Macintosh. All recent Macs come with 1394 interfaces; just add Apple's free FireWire SDK, some AppleScript, and a tuner with FireWire output, such as the Moto DCT-62xx boxes used by Charter & Comcast, or the Samsung SIR-T165 for ATSC over-the-air, and you've got a DVR fully capable of recording & playing back HD.
I've been doing this for the last year using a $100
Well, in that case... (Score:3, Insightful)
Kjella
The problem is what could *start* with this case (Score:3, Interesting)
Sure, but suppose this case did go the wrong way for P2P. We can probably assume that shortly after the SCOTUS "vindicated" the media industry position, we'd see H.R. 666, a.k.a. the Piracy To Piracy Solicits Users' Extreme Zero Royalties Zero Payments Acts or P2P Sux0rz Pact for short.
Seriously, I'm pretty sure P2P use in the US would die out real fast if all ISPs were required by law to disclose the name and address
Re:The "Betamax shield" may not fit anyway. (Score:2)
Considering I've never stolen anything from them, then, why are they still on my back? Why are they spending billions of dollars on attempts to take away my rights?
Second sentence of the weblog entry... (Score:4, Funny)
I call bullshit.
Re:Second sentence of the weblog entry... (Score:2)
Unfortunately worded (Score:5, Insightful)
This is not the editors' best work.
the obl joke (Score:5, Insightful)
you must be new here
this IS as good as it gets around here!
Insightful? (Score:2)
and should I be posting this twice?
hawk
Re:Unfortunately worded (Score:4, Funny)
He's gotta be strong, & he's gotta be larger t (Score:4, Interesting)
So , the real reason of this blog. To let everyone know that the EFF and others came to me and asked if I would finance the legal effort against MGM. I said yes. I would provide them the money they need. So now the truth has been told. This isnt the big content companies against the technology companies. This is the big content companies, against me. Mark Cuban and my little content company. Its about our ability to use future innovations to compete vs their ability to use the courts to shut down our ability to compete. its that simple
Dood wants to be a Hero - the Benefactor, the Mavericks, this guy is desperate for attention - not that I don't mind his neurosis helping protect my freedoms.
Re:He's gotta be strong, & he's gotta be large (Score:2)
its MGM vs. Grokster (Score:5, Informative)
Its always Plaintiff v. Defendant, NEVER the other way around.
Re:its MGM vs. Grokster (Score:2, Informative)
Re:its MGM vs. Grokster (Score:2)
Kitchen knives (Score:5, Interesting)
Half the Battle (Score:5, Funny)
I don't know about the USA, but in England it has long been held that a manufacturer of a kitchen knife cannot be held responsible for a murder carried out using the knife.
In the USA, we use guns to irresponsibly kill each other. Only in rural and/or southern regions does the concept of a special "kitchen gun" make sense. Now you know!
Re:Half the Battle (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Half the Battle (Score:3, Funny)
Free trade and murder weapons (Score:3, Informative)
I, too, don't know about the USA
The nut of the Betamax case:
In the Betamax case, the Supreme Court ruled that a company was not liable for creating a technology that some customers may use for copyright infringing purposes, so long as the technology is capable of substantial non-infrin
Re:Kitchen knives (Score:2)
However, in England it is illegal to own a kitchen knife.
So there are good and bad sides to it.
Re:Kitchen knives (Score:2)
Re:Kitchen knives (Score:2)
Which is why we really need to get to work with renewed energy on transporter technology.
I mean, how are we supposed to get our throwing knives home from the store if we cant transport them.
I take that back, transporter technology will do us no good in this case as transporting them is already illegal and the technology does not even ex
These Knives Were Made For Throwing ... (Score:2)
Of course you can't transport throwing knives -- you have to throw them.
How the hell are we supposed to manage our planned economy if people go around carrying knives meant for throwing? The mere thought of it staggers my inner social Darwinist
-kgj
Re:Kitchen knives (Score:2)
Of course it's not illegal to own kitchen knives in England! Every iron monger's and supermarket in the country sell them - what on earth do you think we cut food with?
Re:Kitchen knives (Score:2)
hawk
Mod chips (Score:2)
Register your p-p network (Score:2)
I think we are going to see a come-to-jesus moment as Peer to peer, and gun lobbying issues get closer to the same point.
As an aside, I overheard, on a right wing radio show, the other day someone laying blame on all these student killers and prosac. Brilliant, blame the killing spree on prosac. I wonder what caliber that prosac was. If you are not going to hold the fact that the kid had access to weapons as a factor in the latest school killing, at least have the balls to be consistent.
Now here is my
Re:Register your p-p network (Score:2)
There seems to be a lot of confusion nowadays surrounding the phrase public safety. Governments like to cite this as a reason for all sorts of forays into our private lives, from destroying livestock (without just compensation) because it could possibly be infected with the latest virus, to such nonsense as seatbelt legislation, which criminalizes private choices i
Re:Register your p-p network (Score:2)
Re:Register your p-p network (Score:2)
Re:Kitchen knives (Score:2)
(Disclaimer: no, of course I'm not a lawyer)
Re:Kitchen knives (Score:2)
It's not about advertising, it's about function. Guns are for killing. If they were for target practice, they wouldn't be lethal.
Killing can be an offensive or a defense measure. Is defense illegal?
Re:Kitchen knives (Score:2)
I will not say which side of the gun toting side of the debate I am on, but please...
Tell that to the defense departments of every country in the world that has one.
Tell that to every police department.
Se how far you get.
Also,
I am from a country where our rights to gus are much more restricted than the US. For some strange reason, it does not seem to prevent the criminals from having a more than ample supply of weapons. Another strange thing
Re:Kitchen knives (Score:2)
Seriously, how many law-abiding citizens with legally purchased and registered firearms are out committing crimes? There's a reason why many police officers don't even bother to temporarily confiscate a concealed weapon if they pull someone over for a traffic stop and they come up as a permit carrier. Taking the guns away from these people doesn't take them away from those who obtained them illegally i
Re:Kitchen knives (Score:2)
Re:Kitchen knives (Score:2)
---
" Tell that to the defense departments of every country in the world that has one.
There is a world of difference between a trained soldier defending against an invasion of armed individuals and a citizen defending himself. "
You quoted me out of context, I was responding to a post saying that weapons designed for killing are not necessary for defense.
See this post:
http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=143914&thresh o ld=0&commentsort [slashdot.org]
Re:I think we are digressing... (Score:2)
Re:Kitchen knives (Score:2)
Betamax is not in Question (Score:5, Informative)
The original case went to a summary judgement over two laws: contributory infringement [A & M Records, Inc. v. Napster, Inc. (114 F. Supp. 2d)], and vicarious infringement [Fonovisa, Inc. v. Cherry Auction, Inc. (76 F.3d 262)].
In the original case, the judge notes during sumamry judgement that Grokster found a loophole in copyright law, which allowed them to dance around the conditions needed for contributory and vicarious infringement.
The language currently being used for this loophole is "willful blindness".
Willful blindness... (Score:2)
Well, if that's a loophole, many are using it. All common carriers and ISPs are "willfully blind". So is the USPO and FedEx. As is the storage lockers on train stations and god knows how many others. And what about "escor
Re:Betamax is not in Question (Score:2)
#1) A bit of a nitpick: There are no laws (that is, statutes) on contributory or vicarous infringement. These are both judge-created doctrines.
#2) Not a nitpick: Betamax IS exactly about contributory infringement. To claim that a device maker is guilty of same merely for making and distributing a device which has substantial noninfringing uses _is_ to challenge Betamax.
I believe the specific doctrine of vicarious infringement of copyright post-dates Betamax
Sorry couldnt resist this (Score:3, Insightful)
This is wonderfull news , We need more people of his financial stature to help take on the errosions of our libertys
Land of the free as in $
Mark (Score:5, Informative)
Busted (Score:3, Informative)
Good for Mark (Score:3, Insightful)
If record companies stopped killing innovative music, then I think people would care about stealing their stuff. If all people can get it trash, and they see it as trash, then they will respect it as trash. Pop music has become trash. Since people see it this way, and that's the only stuff they can get, they steal it cuz it's worth nothing to them anyways.
People steal music, not software.
We don't want to lose this one... (Score:2, Insightful)
Can the maker of DVD recording equipment be held liable for you or I using that equipment (and/or programs) to distribute copyrighted material. Can ISPs be held liable for any illegal use of their services? And let's push it to its limit: Can gun manufacturers be held liable when the equipment they make i
where is Cuban getting his money from (Score:2)
Yes, shouldn't MGM be suing the end users? (Score:2)
Anyone remember that Ampex invented the VTR? (Score:3, Interesting)
The myth of digital "immunity" to degredation. (Score:2, Interesting)
Digital data does not degrade the same way that for example, generational VCR-dubbing degrades a signal (four generations is pretty crappy on VCRs), but there are similar gremlins which make it much less bulletproof than popular belief holds.
Take your average 1 gigabyte video file from the net.
Once you convert the thing into a
overstated, and missing the big picture (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Copyright bye bye (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Copyright bye bye (Score:2)
The consitution simply guarantees this: To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts, by securing for limited Times to Authors and Inventors the exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries;
First, a corporation is not a person and as such deserves no protection (except now that we let that horrible railroad case stand), second, we all know the limited time is arbitrary and has been extended WAY past its usefulness, third, a right does not