Purdue University Will Freeze Tuition For the 9th Straight Year (wlfi.com) 153
schwit1 writes: Purdue President Mitch Daniels announced Saturday night the university would freeze tuition for the 9th straight year, holding it at 2012 levels through 2021-22.
If Purdue can do it, why can't everyone else?
If Purdue can do it, why can't everyone else?
Because they understand that most of them will die (Score:3)
Not everyone's a socially anxious sociopath, buddy (Score:4, Interesting)
Normal people *like* to be around normal people. Around the world, higher schools are where people get their friends and social skills and colleagues for their future life. And, at least in my time, it was that amazing time of a lot of great parties, sex orgies and group activities you will never be able to do again, later in life.
I'm sorry if everyone's an asshole where you are. But according to studies, that is a mainly US and partially European thing. (Somebody actually overthrew what we thought we knew about human social behavior, because he noticed that all of the experiments had been done with US studends, and decided to simply repeat them elsewhere in the world. Turns out we're really selfish and sociopathic, compared to the global normal.)
No offense. I'm western/European myself.
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There is nothing about University that enables all that.
It turns out that 18-25 year olds, University or not, party, engage in risky behavior, etc. Friends in the trades did the same thing.
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Agree...same thing happened in the military when I was 18-22. Though penalties could be a bit stiff.
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Though penalties could be a bit stiff.
You might end up with a dependa and a Dodge Charger at a 30% interest rate.
student loan bankruptcy laws changing will kill th (Score:2)
student loan bankruptcy laws changing will kill them unless costs go down by a lot.
Re:Because they understand that most of them will (Score:4)
Too many degrees have become saddled with a lot of stuff no one needs, or at least not at the cost of several thousand dollars that the tuition runs up costing. Cut out that and transition it to a free online model so that people seeking a degree can finish in fewer credits and at lower cost and it’ll go a long way to making college more affordable and a lot more valuable.
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Or we could have free brick-and-mortar college if we didn't spend almost half a trillion dollars a year sending our military on killing sprees in every bush-league country that we don't need to be involved in. Imperialism wastes money.
$500 billion = $500,000 million.
Divide this by 1/20 of 325 million (16.25 million) Americans, and you get 30 grand per person.
End the wars. Invest in America and Americans.
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Sure, just as soon as those European countries you hold as a model of social utopia build out their own militaries instead of depending on the US for protection. Of course if they did that then all your valued social programs would go away.
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They said the same thing last century. How did that work out? You're welcome, by the way.
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What a great idea! What could be the down-side of causing nuclear proliferation to suddenly skyrocket? More bombs, more people who can screw up, more environmental horrors from breakneck speed production.
What could possibly go wrong?
As an American citizen, I'd be happy to cut funding to mouth-breathing Eurotrash ingrates who can't comprehend the geopolitical implications of their idiotic platitudes, but that would be unfair to so many others that are just trying to live their lives. I'd much rather our own
Re: Because they understand that most of them will (Score:2)
You're a typical ignorant SOB who doesn't understand that military spending goes to employ Americans in high paying tech sector jobs. Your daddy warbucks shit is obsolete. And a sizable portion of the military budget goes to pay veterans benefits and healthcare.
But keep up your daddy warbucks fantasy if you enjoy it.
Re: Because they understand that most of them will (Score:4, Insightful)
military spending goes to employ Americans in high paying tech sector jobs.
The government does not create jobs. Republicans tell us that [lagrangenews.com] time and again [salon.com]. Even that fake Medal of Freedom winner has said so [rushlimbaugh.com].
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I majored in Mechanical Engineering and had to leave 12 credits short for medical reasons. When I was ready to return, do you think they let me just take those 12 credits? Hahahahaha no, there's too much money to be made - I had to take an additional 30 credits (most of it repeats) because.....reasons.
We need a standard curriculum for undergrad degrees thats eligible for federal funding thats fully transferrable to any other federally funded university. That will cut out a ton of the bloat. Base the avai
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I had to take an additional 30 credits (most of it repeats) because.....reasons.
Reminds me of when I went to get my second degree, this time on the IT side. I still had to take a programming class even though years before I had taken two classes in programming and despite the fact I would never go into programming. As you said, because . . . reasons.
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or maybe community college 2 years fills all gen ed's and MUST TRANSFER in state in FULL.
we need more trades / apprenticeships like germany (Score:2)
we need more trades / apprenticeships like germany has then just collage for all (with an big loan).
Already Sky High? (Score:2)
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Google says it's about $24k/yr including room and board + books. About $9k for just tuition.
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That f-ing insane, so you're going to be 100k in the hole before interest any other extra expenses that come with college or just being a young adult.
Only if you're a total dumbass.
A kid can EASILY make $5K/year starting in high school. If the kid saves all of that money, that's $20K to apply toward school. And just to review the math on that....Sept-June is roughly 43 weeks. At $7/hr, for 10 hours/week average, that comes out to $3000. Average 25 hours/week for the other two months and that's $2150 (more or less). So it is quite doable, even by modest standards. And if you want to complain that payroll taxes come out of that, go complain to the liber
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I have thought about that. Seriously. The problem is that the 18 year old is likely going to just blow all that money on stupid shit because they have not learned any better. So by the time they're 25, they will have no money and no education.
I started a 529 plan for my kid a few months before he was born. He turns 4 this week and the balance is currently.....$17,183.50. At this rate, he will easily have $77K in there by the time he turns 18. In reality, it is going to be a lot more because I'll crank up
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There's also a wide gap between the stated tuition on the website, and what students are actually paying. Possibly the sticker price hasn't changed, but I wonder if that gap has narrowed over the years.
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Probably tacked on an Administrative Fee. In Louisiana they created a program called TOPS where in-state students got free tuition if their high school GPA was average. Now 15-20 years later the "Administrative Fee" they charge those students who have free tuition is higher than the actual tuition they charged before the program existed.
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Purdue has an 'engineering differential fee'. So engineers pay a 'little more'. I haven't investigated if this has gone up over the years.
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Pretty much all colleges do that. NYS forces their private universities to a certain number as well, so they raise the rates of on-campus housing and other 'services' and 'administrative costs'.
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For out-of-state, it is quite expensive, but UVM is even more. And it's not too far from UMass for in-state. Both UMass and UVM have had tuition increases every year. Whereas Purdue has had all fees (including room and board) frozen since 2012. I didn't realize this when my son decided to go there, but every year was the same price, and it made budgeting easier.
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Yeah, pretty much this.
According to google, 18-19 numbers of somewhat comparable schools (public, similarly ranked, and not in massive metropole like seattle, or downtown DC)
Purdue: In-state 9,992 USD, Out-of-state 28,794 USD
The Ohio State: In-state 10,726 USD, Out-of-state 30,742 USD
Stony Brooks: In-state $10,175 Out-of-State $27,845
Florida State: In-state 5,656 USD, Out-of-state 18,786 USD
U of Georgia: In-state 11,830 USD, Out-of-state 30,404 USD
UT Austin: In-state 10,610 USD, Out-of-state 37,580 USD
U Mar
Because of Mitch Daniels, that's why (Score:5, Informative)
Because Mitch Daniels, the president of Purdue, is an absolutely exceptional individual who is truly committed to managing costs and improving education at Purdue. The students and faculty like and respect him. He had some opposition when he first arrived, because some faculty thought that a former politician with business experience was the wrong person to run Purdue. Since then he has won nearly everyone over.
Other schools can't do what Purdue does because they are run by administrators who are completely mired in faculty or identity politics, or who run the campus like their own personal fiefdoms, or who are focused solely on securing their "legacy" on campus by hiking tuition to pay for lots of brand new buildings, while simultaneously starving the department budgets to pay for them. Anyone with experience in higher education should recognize the type.
Re:Because of Mitch Daniels, that's why (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Because of Mitch Daniels, that's why (Score:5, Insightful)
Universities should not be in the buisness of providing mental health counceling. They should be in the buisness of higher education.
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Not to mention the benefits to the student and society (a college degree vs. no degree, and access to mental health care), which is why institutions exist in the first place.
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We'd love to do that, but there's a lot of folks fighting like hell to block any other attempt to provide mental health counseling. Take a look at just how shitty your insurance coverage for mental health is, keeping in mind that once-a-week for years is a pretty common way it's consumed.
So if you'd like the universities to stop, you're gonna have to start someone else.
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Unfortunately, mental health cases in students do not just affect the student with the issues. They affect nearly everyone around them. And they also take a tole on staff and teachers who must put up with them while trying to do their jobs. In the long term, it is probably cost efficient to provide mental health counseling and referral.
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Sorry, this is not true. The advertised tuition price is not the real tuition price because there are discounts. Many universities are raising their discount faster than they are raising the tuition because there is a shortage of students. Purdue is surely shrinking their discount, leading to a cost increase.
Can I answer the question? (Score:2)
If Purdue can do it, why can't everyone else?
Because not a lot of universities have endowments and trust funds the size of what Purdue has.
Re:Can I answer the question? (Score:5, Funny)
If Purdue can do it, why can't everyone else?
Because not a lot of universities have endowments and trust funds the size of what Purdue has.
And also the money they make from selling all that chicken.
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That's what I came here for! Actually, "Because other universities are chicken" would have also been acceptable.
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This.
Their $2.6B endowment probably has a lot to do with it. Where most public schools have had funding cut and in order to make it up they have to raise tuition ... and tuition rates have not kept up with inflation.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]
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Oh kid... (Score:3)
It's not that they can't.
It's that they can not! And don't want to.
Just like evil people always make stupid people believe they're just dumb people. :)
Remember Fight Club? That scene where they get random people to start a fight?
Almost all of the evil on this planet can happen, because good people cannot believe somebody could be that evil, and that it could be that big. Takes forever, before they accept that it's just evil, and not just stupidity. They even made up a nice comforting mantra: Hanlon's razor.
They've got no conscience. Think of them like all-robot Daleks:
You need to stop paying so much, for them to stop taking so much.
UW-Madison has also had tuition frozen since 2013 (Score:2)
...and while it sounds great, it's been a disaster for funding the needs of the educational mission of the university:
https://badgersunited.org/key-... [badgersunited.org]
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The US has the highest cost of education on the planet for both public and private schools. Maybe the schools need to stop wasting so much of the money.
https://www.insider.com/cost-o... [insider.com]
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But we need to pay football coaches tens of millions a year! And billion-dollar stadiums! Otherwise what would be the point of getting an education?!
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I'm in no way fond of that situation, but they produce revenue for the schools.
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If that were true, then why do they need to keep raising tuition so much? Just have the sports program pay for it instead.
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I said that football does. LMGTFY
https://www.businessinsider.co... [businessinsider.com]
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I'm in no way fond of that situation, but they produce revenue for the schools.
Do they produce actual revenue for the schools over what they cost, or do they produce "revenue" like what the IOC-parasite promises gullible host cities. "Let me bite. It'll be good for both of us."
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https://www.businessinsider.co... [businessinsider.com]
What a stupid question. (Score:2)
Non profits exist. If they can to it why can't everyone else?
Michael Phelps won Olympic Gold medals. If he can do it, why can't everyone else?
Many people out there have a functioning brain. If they can, why can't whoever posed this question?
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Apples v. Water Buffalos.
This isn't rocket science, nor the Olympics. This could easily be duplicated.
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That's the ticket isn't it. Someone (including you) assumes there are only Apples completely ignoring the water buffalos eating them. Just like wondering why one group does something why every other doesn't. I mean forget size differences, course differences, prestige differences, donation differences, faculty differences, research program differences, income differences, success of the fucking football team differences, yep all universities are the same right!
I'll lump your response in with the original st
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I didn't say there weren't differences, but your comparison was about as idiotic as could be. You either have your head in the sand, or a vested interest in the status quo.
Have tuition rates really been rising rapidly? (Score:3)
Using this college tuition rate chart [ed.gov] and using the "current dollars" column (which I assume means "not compensated for by inflation"), I see that public university cost in 1995 was $6,256. 20 years later it was $17,237. That means it has increased by about 4.15% per year. That's high only because inflation has been about maybe 2.3% over that period.
But that doesn't sound totally crazy. That doesn't sound like "universities have been gouging and OMG nobody can afford college" kind of prices. What am I missing? Or is the problem that wage growth hasn't kept up? US minimum wage is 7.25 now, -vs- 5.50 in 1995, but at 2.3% growth it should be 9.71. So... it's now harder for a college student to use minimum wage to pay for college? But that varies by state [ncsl.org]... Maryland has $10.10 as the minimum wage, California $13, a bunch are in the high $9 range. I wonder how state college tuition rates compare to minimum wages in those states...?
Sorry for the inner monologue post here. I'm just sharing my thinking so someone can correct me on this.
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Now I'm not saying that all or most of today's college debt situation is due to tuition increases at public universities. Millenials wound up in a very bad employment market where riding it out by staying in school longer and taking out education loans was the best way to get by.
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Now check the tuition of the popular private universities with the sought-after degrees that guarantee very high paying job upon graduation.
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https://nces.ed.gov/fastfacts/... [ed.gov]
According to this chart, the cost has more than doubled including inflation.
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Your chart doesn't go back far enough. The period most people are comparing to is the 1960s/1970s.
Also, your chart doesn't reflect who paid that tuition. For example, in University of California campuses in 1960, the state paid that tuition for in-state students. Which means the students directly paid $0 (there was something like $200-$400 in "fees" the students paid).
Rising costs: rising admins, not faculty (Score:3)
Looking at the root cause of rising university costs it becomes apparent (at least in many institutions) that the funds spend on faculty are either stagnant or rising only slight while the costs (and numbers) of university administration has skyrocketed. Not unlike the fed gov't, those in control of the budgeting tend to expand and spend rapidly, while the real heart of the service/institution (university == education, research) hardly grows at all.
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This is false. Many universities have been laying off their administrators, or finding that they are unable to hire new ones because they cannot pay enough. In reality, health care costs are rising, but student numbers are falling because of low birth rates. University administrators are paid far less than their counterparts in the private sector.
A few rich universities do spend too much on administration.
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You don't even support your "This is false" assertion with the slightest bit of logic. You argue that admin is being paid less than private sector, but that has nothing to do with the NUMBERS of administrators being hired by university, let alone how that compared with the numbers (and costs) of faculty being hired.
Look at, for example, https://www.forbes.com/sites/r... [forbes.com]
"...administrative spending comprised just 26% of total educational spending by American colleges in 1980-1981, while instructional spending
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(I work at a state university)
Yeah, that's not wrong. But it is a complicated situation. Some example:
Because in the US, everything has to be competitive (otherwise we'll be socialist and we can't have that), you end up with universities making stupid expenses to attract student to that university: better gyms, newer roads, nicer food halls. And the state legislatures themselves are contributing to that. To me, that's somewhat of unnecessary expenses.
Also the increase in the number of students has caused a
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BS, the inflation of college costs started well before Obama, but thanks for playing. Now run along and annoy your parents.
"Tuition" is MSRP (Score:2)
I'm not sure holding tuition constant means that much. Having just helped two kids complete their bachelor's degrees, I found advertised tuition is like the MSRP of a car. It's the maximum you might pay but most people pay less. Many people pay substantially less, all the way down to $0. More meaningful might be "Min/mean/median/mode/max/total tuition collected from students, net financial aid.".
This is not to say that Purdue is not doing a great job holding down costs. They might be and kudos if they are.
Why universities raise tuition (Score:2)
- Increasing healthcare costs is the main reason
- Increasing IT costs
- Reduced government subsidies
Also, the advertised tuition price is not the real tuition price. There are discounts. If the real price goes down due to low demand, the advertised price does not go down because that makes the college look desperate, and it makes it easier to raise prices later. Currently, low birth rates and high employment are making demand very low. So discounts are growing.
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At least for public unis, the state supported ones have had their funding cut as pols campaigned on reining in college costs. So the cut the college funding, being simple-minded folk whom the voters were stupid enough to believe. The state schools then turned to their main source of income, students. Then the pols campaigned on those naughty colleges turning out elites at increased tuition. So they decided their states could be run by dingbats who eschewed elite education. And now we have a crop of state ad
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Meanwhile, people and companies are abandoning NYS due to some of the highest taxes in the nation. And SUNY/CUNY are not places you want to go for your education, schools in NYS including K-12 and the State University are massively overfunded ($30-50k/pupil/year) yet are very much underperforming.
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High levels of taxes, but also high levels of services. Decent public insurance, rail transit, well-funded education system. Why are Americans so fucking allergic to taxes when the tax money goes to anything OTHER than sending our military all over the world on killing sprees?
Actually, NY could keep the same (or better) levels of services as it has now if it didn't send more money to DC than it gets back. It's a shame that secession isn't a real option, at least not yet.
As far as "not wanting to go to CU
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Actually, NY could keep the same (or better) levels of services as it has now if it didn't send more money to DC than it gets back.
How about we make a deal? NY gets to keep the money it sends to DC and I get to keep the money that I send to DC.
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You forgot about the unions. Rail unions will never allow self-driving trains, even though they practically do already.
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That's because college educated adults from other parts of the country move to New York City, not because New York does a fantastic job fixing the problems of their public schools in college. Being home to one of the global hypercities has its advantages.
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Wait, I thought "people and companies are abandoning NYS due to some of the highest taxes in the nation."
Now, if the best educated adults from other parts of the country are moving in, who's moving out?
Re: *YAWN* Free frozen (Score:2)
The people who canâ(TM)t afford those high taxes and rents, of course. The global hyper cities are turning into highly stratified regions with a large caste of highly educated, well compensated elites who jet from big city to big city, a larger group of second-tier types who live in far-flung exurbs, and the poor. Anyone in the second-tier who canâ(TM)t afford to live in the city and doesnâ(TM)t want to live in an exurb leaves. Continue that trend and you end up as a weird version of the typi
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The people that are rich(er) are moving out as are a lot of both blue collar and retirees, the middle class (those actually working) are still there but they're not pouring in either.
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SUNY/CUNY rates in the bottom 35%. NYS has a lot of tech (NYS and surrounding areas) that attracts the highly educated. But about 70% of people coming from NYS schools into SUNY/CUNY have to take remedial math, reading and writing lessons.
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... but ranks 10/50 for college-educated adults, also 10/50 for higher degrees.
Top 20%? That is "B-" on a standard 10 point grading scale. I'd expect a lot better than that given their high taxes.
Either they are educating people well and those people leave the state, or they're not attracting many well-educated people, relative to their overall population. Either way, the message is clear: NY Sucks.
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(state university faculty writing)
Really? Stony Brooks and Buffalo are doing very well for themselves.
I work with a high school teacher from NY and they are doing great stuff.
High school don't do anywhere as well around me as the feedback I get from New York. There could be selection bias, but the students educated (K-12) in NY that I work with are much better than local ones.
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Re:*YAWN* Free frozen (Score:4)
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Actually, they both suck. They suck equally but differently.
Not sure of the ideal model, but right now I think a bit of one, tempered with a bit of the other. One can argue at length over the percentages and where the line should be drawn.
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Notice how it isn't available to ANYBODY. Just a tiny, tiny portion of the U.S. population.
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You do realize that Purdue University is one of the Indiana state Universities?
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And a leading engineering and computer science university worldwide, to boot.
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"tuition free college would cost a fraction..."
Nonsense. We have real life examples where that's been tried and all happens is those same university administrators quickly increase the tuition prices faster to absorb whatever subsidy is put in place. Every. Single. Time. That's what happens to ALL government subsidies.
If you want a correction to the higher-ed racket then end government-guaranteed student loans. Introduce the free market, don't interfere with it further. That's what broke it in the first
You mean like Germany (Score:2)
Seems to be working just fine in every single civilized nation. The Estimated Bill in the US is $70 billion annually. For a well educated population that's a bargain. The rich send their kids to college, why wouldn't you?
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Nonsense. We have real life examples where that's been tried and all happens is those same university administrators quickly increase the tuition prices faster to absorb whatever subsidy is put in place. Every. Single. Time. That's what happens to ALL government subsidies.
See: University of California from 1868 to 1960.
Oh! Sorry! That was a case where they did not do that. And a rather large one.
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yeah, those damn over-educated civil engineers putting up bridges and stuff. Hell, I'll bet you could do without any training.