Millions of Borrowers May Be Eligible For a Refund On Student Loan Payments Made During the Pandemic (cnbc.com) 171
There's good news for the millions of people with federal student loans who've made payments on that debt during the Covid pandemic: many of them will be eligible to get the money back. CNBC reports: The U.S. Department of Education says that many borrowers eligible for President Joe Biden's student loan forgiveness plan who made payments on their debt during the pandemic-era pause on the bills will automatically be refunded. The relief policy has been in effect since March 2020, and is scheduled to end Dec. 31. More than 9 million people made at least one payment on their federal student debt between April 2020 and March 2022, according to the government. The vast majority of borrowers haven't made any payments, taking advantage of the suspension of the bills and accrual of interest.
Payments made since March 2020 on federal student loans eligible for the pause should now be refundable, said higher education expert Mark Kantrowitz. The roughly 5 million student loan borrowers who have commercially held Federal Family Education Loans (FFEL) weren't eligible for the payment pause and won't be for the refund either. Any payments made before the pandemic also don't qualify, Kantrowitz said.
Not all borrowers need to apply for the refund, said Elaine Rubin, senior contributor and communications specialist at Edvisors. The refunding process will be automatic for borrowers who are eligible for student loan forgiveness and for those who made voluntary payments during the pause that brought their balance below the maximum forgiveness amount: either $10,000 or $20,000, Rubin said. "They will be offered an automatic refund for the difference," Rubin said. If you paid your loan in full during the pandemic, however, you'll have to take action and request the payments back. Borrowers who have refinanced their federal loans will also need to ask their student loan servicer for the refund, Kantrowitz said.
Payments made since March 2020 on federal student loans eligible for the pause should now be refundable, said higher education expert Mark Kantrowitz. The roughly 5 million student loan borrowers who have commercially held Federal Family Education Loans (FFEL) weren't eligible for the payment pause and won't be for the refund either. Any payments made before the pandemic also don't qualify, Kantrowitz said.
Not all borrowers need to apply for the refund, said Elaine Rubin, senior contributor and communications specialist at Edvisors. The refunding process will be automatic for borrowers who are eligible for student loan forgiveness and for those who made voluntary payments during the pause that brought their balance below the maximum forgiveness amount: either $10,000 or $20,000, Rubin said. "They will be offered an automatic refund for the difference," Rubin said. If you paid your loan in full during the pandemic, however, you'll have to take action and request the payments back. Borrowers who have refinanced their federal loans will also need to ask their student loan servicer for the refund, Kantrowitz said.
Good News, Everyone! (Score:2, Informative)
We stole money from a bunch of really poor people to give to wealthy privileged people, who are more likely to vote for us. Three cheers for us!
Re: Good News, Everyone! (Score:2, Informative)
This steals money from the future. Without knowledge of how the tax code changes over the next few decades, we have no idea who will pay for this.
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This steals money from the future. Without knowledge of how the tax code changes over the next few decades, we have no idea who will pay for this.
Won’t someone think of the grandchildren’s grandparents?
But on a serious note this is why America has browbeat the world into adopting its currency. When it prints more, it dilutes the world and gives to “the right people”. It’s another reason why, historically, quantative easing does not cause inflation at a level you would expect with a cursory domestic analysis. If you can get foreign people you don’t even know to foot a big chunk of the cost, and supreme militar
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There's millions of people for decades past that had student loans and paid them (in some cases paid them off, go figure)....why are we cutting them off from the Uncle Sam college gravy train?
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They're predatory loans with absurd interest rates that cannot be removed via bankruptcy.
ROTFL. While the second part is true, one of the lowest interest rates I ever paid in my life was my student loan... the one I paid myself in full with no subsidy.
Student loans are disproportionately spread among people with Latin heritage. Does that scream "wealthy and privileged" to you?
They have wealth and privilege after they graduate from college because they get better, higher paying jobs with better social connections. Try losing the victim mentality and thinking things through next time.
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100% of the wealthy people I know, including myself, have student loans and plan to take as much out in student loans as available, YOU imbecile. How hard is it to do the math: 10% investment returns - 6% student loan interest = free money and school. (Thus Biden is only giving me the money earlier than it was being given to me anyway. I squeaked in the 2020 threshold at $246K but missed it last year.) Of course, we're not in t
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Wealthy privileged people don't generally have student loans, you imbecile.
The FAFSA line is plenty long at Oberlin, brother.
Those unexpected refunds (Score:5, Insightful)
Those unexpected refunds, the ones going to people who paid their loan during the pandemic. The people that have money. The ones that you're going to give the money back to. I'm sure they won't spend it. I'm sure that won't cause inflation.
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Yes well direct payments to potential voters right before elections is now the go to strategy. I wish I could blame Democrats for this but really it goes back to at least - GWB's 600 dollar checks.
Being able to buy votes with the public purse is not just one more advantage of being the incumbents. I even suspect the public at large sees this for the naked vote purchasing it is - but I also am not confident they care. To be honest I am not sure I care. We are really at an inflection point in our history he
Re:Those unexpected refunds (Score:5, Insightful)
GWB's handout was $200 per person. But at least it was fair. Everybody got it.
This is a big FU to everyone who paid off their loans.
Re:Those unexpected refunds (Score:4, Insightful)
This is a big FU to everyone who paid off their loans.
My husband and I both paid off our loans. This isn't a "big FU" to us. And even if it were, you wouldn't care, because all you're doing is parroting a reactionary talking point. Just because things were shitty for us for a long time doesn't mean we want them shitty for everyone else in perpetuity.
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I do care, and it does make a difference because all this loan forgiveness is going is going to cost 2500$ per a tax payer
So you're concerned that it's costing a tiny fraction of your tax payable once off? Oh no!. Maybe stop funding your war machine instead if you want to save money. Tax is designed to be spent on improving the lives of the general populace. In the grand scheme of what your tax money gets spent on, this isn't very offensive and actually has a positive benefit.
Money and taxes are a zero sum game, if you divert money to one area you take it from another.
Indeed. Stop spending tax money on useless shit and start investing it in people.
Re:Those unexpected refunds (Score:5, Insightful)
Not the same analogy.
The loan "forgiveness" is a zero sum game.
Someone will have to pay.
That means everyone will have to pay what is estimated to be between $2500-$6000 to cover this.
That loan debt doesn't just go *poof* with Biden's signature.
And let's not even get into the fact that Biden by executive actions likely does NOT have the power to do this, and will likely be overturned by the courts.
Even Pelosi is on record saying the president doesn't have the power to do this...the govt. purse strings are controlled constitutionally by the congress.
Re:Those unexpected refunds (Score:4, Interesting)
>> The loan "forgiveness" is a zero sum game.
Not really.
We need to invest in what gets to society the most bang for the bucks. Infrastructure and education (that includes the higher sort) comes top of the list. To the point that we should pay people to get an education not the other way around. Police, firefighters are also there. Military is important (though some of those money could be spent better).
And by the way, though I am currently renting a place, I'm also paying, with my taxes, the tax deductions on the mortgage interest of somebody else's house, maybe even yours. Do i benefit from it? no. Do I bitch about it? neither.
But again, with those money, I'd rather pay for some kid's education instead. It's a better investment than paying for your mortgage. By far.
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I'd use FDR as a better example. Not the first, mind you, but, in general, the "bribe the voters with their own money" thing was about all FDR did other than WW2.
INFLATION? HELLO? (Score:5, Informative)
So inflation is skyrocketing, leading to massive embarrassment just this week for the White House as they staged a very public celebration of the "Inflation Reduction Act" on the same day that another unexpected and huge rise in inflation was announced.
All the economists I've read indicate that this sort of massive government spending will only add fuel to the fire.
So, why is this "good news" again? Because it temporarily helps get votes for the preferred candidate, while impoverishing us all in the long run? The people getting this benefit will pay for it in unaffordable housing, $10 gallons of milk, etc.
Re: INFLATION? HELLO? (Score:4, Informative)
The people it benefits are already at the higher end of the income brackets and cheer for this as higher prices in stores doesnâ(TM)t impact them. The rich always benefit the most from socialism and communism. As Margaret Thatcher said, as long as the gap is smaller, theyâ(TM)d rather have the poor poorer.
Re: INFLATION? HELLO? (Score:2)
Bullshit. My GF makes below poverty wages where she works a job requiring a 4-year degree. She is not even close to being wealthy.
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Do you mind sharing the industry?
Personally, I think it doesn't make sense to spring for a four-year degree in an industry that will then pay below poverty wages. One would be better off going to a trade school and learning a trade that pays much better. Or picking a different four-year degree.
Or is she entry-level and just paying her dues as she builds experience in the field?
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I know a LOT of starter jobs, even for college grads starts low, but below poverty wages?
I'd be curious about what line of work this is for what degree...
And I might recommend she look for a better paying job if this, in fact, is the case...
Good Luck to you and her.
enterprise car rental? must be why they push the a (Score:2)
enterprise car rental? must be why they push the add ones so much.
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What do you consider poverty wages? And why get a degree for that field at all then?
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The people it benefits are already at the higher end of the income brackets ...
The cutoff for the student loan forgiveness is $125k for an individual and $250k for married (see below). Is that what you consider to be the "higher end of the income bracket"? If so, I've got some news for you -- it's not.
Under the administration's plan, federal student loans borrowers who make less than $125,000 per year as an individual – and if married, less than $250,000 in combined income – are eligible to receive $10,000 in forgiveness.
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Inflation is skyrocketing because corporations are raking in record profits knowing that they're untouchable. Oil has been this price-per-barrel before, but for some reason oil companies are making more money than previously. It's because they can. Same with a lot of pre-packaged food companies. They all claim it has something to do with the supply chain, but if you scrutinize them for even half a second you realize that they have no problem making their product and overcharging all of us for it.
And then wh
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So inflation is skyrocketing, leading to massive embarrassment just this week for the White House as they staged a very public celebration of the "Inflation Reduction Act" on the same day that another unexpected and huge rise in inflation was announced.
Yes, because everyone knows that the goals of any bill are fully realized immediately after it's signed into law. They were celebrating the fact that it was passed and signed, not that its goals had been realized one month later -- especially as many of the provisions won't even go into effect for a few years.
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First of all, that's not true. Only one day earlier, the Biden administration had been claiming that inflation was falling.
Secondly, why is the Biden administration implementing inflation reduction measures that, by your own admission, will take years to take effect? Are we expecting to confront crisis-level inflation for years, now? And if so, why is the Biden administration sticking to its increasingly dubious claim that this bout of inflation is temporary?
Third, why do all the economists who look at the
The price of gas and food are going down (Score:2)
Economists I'm reading are saying that we're on track to control inflation unless they're the same Yahoo's trying to cause a recession because they're hoping to get wages down. The problem with inflation was a combination of supply chain issues and huge de facto monopolies. The supply chain issues are clearing up but we've got a long way to go
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So I don't know what the hell you're talking about with inflation skyrocketing.
Yes you do, don't lie. You've got Fark in your damn signature, and there have been several articles on Fark about the inflation numbers that came out this week.
Economists I'm reading are saying that we're on track to control inflation
I guess expecting any level of genuineness in this dialog was shooting for the moon. I missed. You're not clueless, you're a PT Barnum, a marketer.
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If you run the numbers, we're talking about a hundred B$/year in a 25T$/year economy, so even if all the refunds get spent (and it won't) the effect on inflation is less than half of 1%.
Also, to the extent this is paid for in taxes, then the money paid in taxes won't get spent so that has a negative effect (that is decreases) inflation.
So, no, you should not expect loan forgiveness to change inflation in a measurable way.
Re:INFLATION? HELLO? (Score:4, Informative)
None of your claims even make sense. You're literally just posting partisan disinformation. Your actions are the threat to democracy that your other actions seek to warn about.
The government is not going to pay for loan forgiveness.
Yes, they are. This isn't something you can debate, it's just a fact. The government is forgiving these loans, and paying for it with deficit spending.
the only losers here will be the shareholders
I'm not sure what fantasy land you live in, but inflation makes losers of us all, and massive new government spending increases inflation. Again, this isn't somethig you can debate, it's just a fact.
Your leaders are making poor decisions, and instead of acknowledging that and demanding better, you're lying on their behalf. It's incredibly disheartening. Don't you realize that the long term effect of a strategy of ignoring the problems and lying denials is to worsen all the problems you're covering up?
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He does not understand what a 'loan servicer' even does - just ignore that socialist dope.
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It must be hard work being that wrong.
Yes, the government is going to be paying, no, the servicers aren't.
You spoke of 'predatory lenders'. I don't know if you've heard, but Biden's ill-conceived plan only applies to federal student loans... are you calling the feds 'predatory lenders'? News flash: Private loans are not covered under this program.
Yes, this will continue to make inflation worse. Printing money has that effect.
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are you calling the feds 'predatory lenders'?
Yes, obviously. Student loans have been predatory ever since it's been impossible to discharge them through bankrupcty. Fucking duh.
Re: INFLATION? HELLO? (Score:2)
But you also don't have to pay on them if you have no money. And you can never be charged more than you can afford.
Doesn't sound like very effective predation to me.
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But you also don't have to pay on them if you have no money. And you can never be charged more than you can afford.
And if that means the interest causes the principal to literally go up forever and you die in debt, that's the system working as intended! Thank you uncle sam, may I have another!?
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Don't you ever stop to think 'why' before you get all righteous? Of course not, that would make it less satisfying.
What would stop recent students, with little income, little assets, and a boatload of student debt from simply declaring bankruptcy a year or three after graduation and rid themselves of it all? Seems a pretty low risk thing for them, and big risk for the lender. They can't exactly seize degree or learnings as they can a boat or a car should someone not pay their loan.
In your world, how would y
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What would stop recent students, with little income, little assets, and a boatload of student debt from simply declaring bankruptcy a year or three after graduation and rid themselves of it all?
Seven years of shit credit score that not only inhibits their ability to get credit, but also a job these days.
In your world, how would you allow student loans to be discharged and not easily subject to abuse?
In my world we would make education cheaper, and then we would pay for it, so that people could be better educated and make better decisions (including voting ones) and help the world transition into a sustainable future not based on conspicuous consumption, and destruction of natural capital. But this is the Republicans' world apparently, in which under Reagan (and since) they have consistently at
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Lemme get this straight... you think that is enough of a stick to keep people from acting irresponsibly and abusing the sytem... vs knowing that one will have to pay back the money they owe, with interest isn't? People have had a hard enough time selecting worthwhile degrees or actually getting benefits from the education they get.
You may want to read up on the Bankruptcy Reform Act of 2005, as bef
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It's the opposite of sensible for you to be able to discharge debt from buying stuff through bankruptcy, but not from getting an education. Being more educated tends to benefit both you and others around you. We should all want to encourage that. If you have to have an education to be a functional citizen under our capitalist system, and you ask people to pay for it themselves in order to participate, then it has to be realistic for people to actually do that. And that is very much how education is promoted
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Except it does make sense, as 'buying stuff' often creates assets which can be sold or seized in the case of default or bankruptcy. How do you do that with education?
Sounds like you are making a case for the primary beneficiary (you) to pay for it...good thing loans exist in case you don't have rich pren
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The issue is student loans should not be publicly guaranteed at all.
People without assets to put up as collateral or someone with assets to cosign for them simply should not be able to qualify for loads. Its financially stupid to give unsecured loans to 18 year olds with no credit history. -I would also argue offering that group debt is fundamentally predatory because 18 year olds as rule don't "understand" 6-figure sums..
The simple answer is if you don't have money to go directly to university after high s
Bots and sock puppets (Score:2)
What gets me is that every one of these over 40s had 4/5ths of their college paid for by the federal and state gov't via indirect subsidies but because the gov't didn't cut them a check they don't understand what happened.
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the amount of student loan debt forgiveness is relatively small and will have no affect on inflation.
Why do you sit here all day shilling for the Democrat party, posting literal misinformation like this?
Here's CBS, saying the loan forgiveness proposal is likely to cost $600 billion over ten years, with most of that cost front-ended:
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/s... [cbsnews.com] ...what that means is that, during a time when the economy is running WAY too hot, the Biden administration has decided to pour gasoline on the
This is wrong (Score:5, Insightful)
Sometimes people do things where there might be some question about whether it's right or wrong. This is not one of those times. This is flat wrong. It's wrong to force people to pay other's debts. It's wrong for the one who receives it, they didn't earn it. It sends all the wrong messages about how one needs to manage debt. It devalues the currency we're all using, which hurts people on fixed incomes such as retirees. It's unfair on its face, and regressive as hell. It hurts the poor the worst of all, and helps the rich.
Shame on you, Democrats. You complain about the Republicans and then pull a stunt like this. How do you expect people to take what you say seriously or honestly, now? Bah.
Re:This is wrong (Score:5, Insightful)
In that case I expect every republican to immediately repay their forgiven PPP loan.
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That's some pretty weak whataboutism you've got there.
On the one hand, you have a 'loan' program, established through an act of congress and signed into law by a president, which specifically included clear language about forgiveness of PPP loans... on the other hand, you've got a president, acting unilaterally, exploding an existing law going back to 9/11 with clear language about specific and targeted forgiveness, expanding that to a blanket pass, citing an emergency which his administration has not once,
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Remember though - Trump was the the autocrat!
Whatever a Democrat accuses a Republican of doing it is a 100% certainty they either have been doing it themselves for past two decades or have immediate future plans to do something similar but more blatant.
Its just who the type of person that both identifies as a Democrat and actually seeks office is.
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Fine, post all the democrats who took PPP loans. Congress members shouldn't be running million dollar businesses on the side either. Their primary job should be congress.
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Congress members shouldn't be running million dollar businesses on the side either.
Why not? Or is it ok if their spouse or kids does it instead?
Doesn't that depend on how much time congress is actually congressing? They have a loooot of downtime. Isn't it good to have people who understand how things other than congress work?
Can we start with term limits? Citizen legislators, instead of career politicians?
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That's some pretty weak whataboutism you've got there.
No it isn't. I'm supposed to be outraged that a student was forgiven $10k when an already wealthy politician was forgiven $4 million? https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fb... [twimg.com]
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Yes, it is.
You're effectively dismissing speeding through a red light, while being angry that Trump did a lap on a NASCAR track.
Apples and oranges.
Both involve loans/autos, however the conditions around both are widely different. You focus only on the parts you care about and support your argument, and ignore the rest which disproves it.
If you were honest, you'd take a few steps back and realize how very different they are, but you're not.
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Wasn't there some famous quote about democracy being two zombies and a human deciding what to have for dinner?
Re:This is wrong (Score:5, Insightful)
It's wrong to force people to pay other's debts.
In that case, you Republicans can pay for all the times you raised the national deficit in order to provide pork for the MIC, and a few paltry jobs for red staters. Get cracking, you owe us trillions.
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pork for the MIC
You mean the saviors of Ukraine? You're criticizing the saviors of Ukraine?
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You mean the saviors of Ukraine? You're criticizing the saviors of Ukraine?
Hmm, that's a pretty great troll. We The People are the saviors of Ukraine, because our government sent them a bunch of the weapons that the MIC overcharged us for, which We paid for.
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We The People are the saviors of Ukraine
No, the M777 is.
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I did not see Obama ending or even reducing our foot print in Iraq or Afghanistan. I did seem him inserting himself into places like Libya where had no need to get involved in at all... The MIC is about as by partisan as it gets...
Re: This is wrong (Score:2)
Libya? Where ISIL was largely defeated by U.S.-led strikes? No, no need for that sort of thing...
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...But Obama! ...But her emails! ...But Benghazi! ...But his laptop!
Also pay back all the PPP loans you got forgiven (Score:2)
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Sometimes people do things where there might be some question about whether it's right or wrong. This is not one of those times. This is flat wrong. It's wrong to force people to pay other's debts.
On the other hand, "let me craft a system where a group of people are disproportionately and unreasonably likely to have worse debt, through the incentives I create and the structures I set up, and by exploiting every advantage I have".
In such a situation it's right and proper that a group of people who statistically benefited from that exploitation should be the ones who are forced to pay it back.
(I think that US education system, the US prison system for poor people, and US historical racism, all fall int
Re: This is wrong (Score:2)
I agree. Let's stop subsidizing suburban and rural communities who built towns and cities that require federal money to stay afloat. Let the rural communities deal with their own electrical, water, transportation, and data networks and stop expecting urban tax bases to prop up these financially degenerate communities.
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Ah this argument again. The one where some prick ubranite forgets where the contents of his cereal box comes form.
You want to see some inflation at the grocery store - go right ahead cut those subsides to red states. Hint you will pay whatever they tell you to pay for corn, wheat, chicken, etc in that case because you like eating..
With the exception of maybe some parts of Appalachia that has seen the coal industry devastated, those subsides are passed right back onto the rest of the country in the form in i
How old are you? (Score:2)
If you're under 40 you started to see those subsidies removed. But again, if you've over 40 you already had Student Loan Debt Forgiveness, because the gov't paid to make sure you didn't have the debt in the 1st place.
Oh, and if you didn't get a college degree.... what do you think made our economy grow
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I get it, no college degree, so you didn't have an economics course.
This is a pretty ironic statement considering the complete lack of even the most basic economics knowledge that you, drinkypoo, and the other commies in the thread continue to demonstrate.
Remember when your (presumably highly educated) colleague claimed in this thread that inflation's primary cause is corporate wealth hoarding? Yea.
Or when YOU claimed that huge new deficit spending programs would have no effect on inflation? Yeaaaa.
The kind
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Going skip your oil changes for a couple of years and let me know how well your car runs. That's you but for the entire global economy.
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I pick trolls bigger than you out of my teeth.
Trolling is, apparently, when I ask hard questions you can't answer. Or, I guess more accurately, easy questions that are hard for you to answer.
Trolling is definitely not when you completely ignore the point the other person was making, and go on a content-free rant about muh capitalism unfair. I guess.
You don't have anything of value to teach anyone, when you're sitting around in a Slashdot thread claiming that massive new deficit spending doesn't create infla
Re:This is wrong (Score:4, Interesting)
>> Sometimes people do things where there might be some question about whether it's right or wrong. This is not one of those times.
Agreed. Because this is flat out right and it was about time.
Education is a collective good and the most powerful source of progress. We as a society should invest in education, before we spend our taxes in other ways.
>> It sends all the wrong messages about how one needs to manage debt.
If you contributed to electing president somebody that filed for bankruptcy SIX (!) times, then I respectfully think you should stop lecturing people on the morality of debt repayment.
Makes sense (Score:5, Insightful)
Refund money people have already used to pay down their debt.... because they don't have money to pay down their debt.
It makes sense because next we're going to "forgive" that debt, and make everyone else pay it off....you know...that debt the actually debtor already paid...with the money we're refunding.
Honestly.....if you wanted to destroy the country, you would be doing exactly what politicians are doing today.
You're an investor, not a debtor (Score:2)
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When they said that getting a degree is worth over a million dollars over a lifetime, what they didn't tell you is that it's because you'll get the political clout to take money away from poor people, and put it in your pockets.
your government at work! (Score:5, Insightful)
...trying to find every possible way to buy younger voters.
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With the current administration's approval rating, what else can they do? They clearly lack the ability to actually lead this country. All they've done is spend other peoples cash in the form of debt, including money that your children's children haven't even made yet.
The families of those politicians are all that matters. They'll live rich lives at the general public's expense.
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These millionaires are younger voters? https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fb... [twimg.com]
Like they did when they paid for your college? (Score:2)
Congrats, you just got played. Took 20 years to do it and they're laughing at you behind your back. If that makes you angry (it should) wake up and realize you're being m
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Just a load of bullshit.
Please, illustrate those indirect subsidies that paid for 80% of my college.
Looking forward to it. I'm fairly well-versed in college costs in as controlled a comparison as we're likely to find:
To wit: my dad went to U of MN in 1954. $350/year.
I went to the U of MN in 1986: iirc about $3500/ year.
My son went to the U of MN in 2016, $35000/year.
Please (Score:5, Insightful)
Republicans outraged over $10k for a student loan? How fast we forget about the banks.
https://money.cnn.com/news/spe... [cnn.com]
Where was the outrage then?
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The banks were able to do that because the FED sat there letting them have zero percent interest and damn near unlimited credit for almost a decade. Holy shit - give me zero interest loans and a sky high browning limit I'll be able to set myself up to get richer than Gwd too!
Meanwhile the same FED had no-tools at all to address the pandemic - they were already buying up debt so fast your head would spin, they already had rates near zero.. So the "we have to do something" mentality of Washington required th
Middle class (Score:2)
1) The Republicans are taking your children's money.
2) The Democrats are taking your children's money.
May be eligible... (Score:2)
...to take money away from uneducated people in lower economic classes who didn't take out student loans.
The winners here are all the school administrators who have no incentive to lower their prices, or increase their efficiency.
Poor Symptom Treatment With No Fix For The Problem (Score:2)
Borrowers are still taking out loans they can't afford to get degrees that won't lead to making enough money to repay the loans.
Educational institutions of varying qualities are still getting paid large sums of money to hand out those degrees. That includes for-profit institutions that don't even care that their degrees are worthless.
N
And the corrupt educational system wins! (Score:2)
I'm constantly amazed how many former students can't (or refuse to) grasp the reality that they got ripped off by colleges or universities who overpriced and oversold their education. There's all this "woe is me!" going around, about how tough it is to pay off student loan debt. But whether your loan gets "forgiven" or not? It means the school got away with it and fully profited from it.
If government is seriously going to attempt to address this problem? They should start by clawing back the money from the
pulling up the ladder (Score:2)
I see a few issues, #1 of which is that the people in power today benefitted from far lower tuition fees relative to salary when they were at college. I presume that the increases since then have a variety of causes, but if the nation wants educated people to spur the economy then it must not price young people out of an education.
At the very least it could make it more tax efficient to send kids to school
drop the collage for all / add 1-2 years to HS (Score:2)
drop the collage for all / add 1-2 years to HS level of cost / fees.
We can make community college cost the same as HS for at least 1-2 years or make it so that when you are done with HS you are at the AS/AA level and just need 2 more years to get to the BA/BS level.
Re:Here in the UK (Score:4, Insightful)
Universities continued charging their standard - extortionate - rates during the pandemic despite most of them offering only online teaching which was probably not better than a lot of youtube lectures.
Oh just fuck all the way off, will you? This is not the universities fault, and 9k is less than it costs universities to teach STEM courses.
Their costs did not decrease. All the staff needed to be paid, all the buildings needed to be maintained. But then they had a fuckton of extra work to do which was to convert all the courses, teaching and so on to online only.
Where was this discount meant to come from then? Workload increases, costs go up and you expect money to be magicked out of nowhere?
But no, its all about money now at UK universities
Everywhere I go I see teachers in Ferarris, research scientists drinking Champagne...
It's nice that you can sit comfortably behind your keyboard in a nice cushy tech job and tell people they should work for less money. Good for you, you're really sticking it to the man.
Just don't look over there where the government has cut and cut and cut and cut funding to the point where universities need to bring in huge amounts of money from whereever the hell they can in order to fund the teaching.
And you blame... the universities.
Money isn't magic, and it doesn't come from nowhere.
Re: (Score:2)
Just don't look over there where the government has cut and cut and cut and cut funding to the point where universities need to bring in huge amounts of money from whereever the hell they can in order to fund the teaching.
And you blame... the universities.
Money isn't magic, and it doesn't come from nowhere.
The cost of universities has gone up much faster than the rate of inflation. There is no justification for it.
Re: (Score:2)
No, the fees have gone up much faster than inflation. The cost hasn't, but since the government isn't meeting the cost any more the fees rise. The justification from universities is perfectly simple: they have to make ends meet.
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There is a clear and obvious justification for it, but then to understand you might need to have attended a university-level economics class rather than take your education from some guy that can blather on the TV or the radio. A measured inflation rate has been moderated by productivity increases in the entire economy. (A $1 widget moving to $1.10 would have moved to more like $1.13 if we hadn'
Re: (Score:2)
The cost of universities has gone up much faster than the rate of inflation. There is no justification for it.
There is a clear and obvious justification for it, but then to understand you might need to have attended a university-level economics class rather than take your education from some guy that can blather on the TV or the radio. A measured inflation rate has been moderated by productivity increases in the entire economy. (A $1 widget moving to $1.10 would have moved to more like $1.13 if we hadn't figured out how to make and deliver them more efficiently.) There is no way for a personal-service-focused endeavor to match those productivity increases because they are a higher mix of labor inputs than the rest of the economy. It's largely the same reason you see medical inflation so high as well- space aliens could give us technology for free x-rays and insulin, but unless they brought millions and millions of self-replicating robot doctors, nurses, schedulers, claim writers, etc, with them, we'd still see the same result.
"The Cost of Going to College Has Risen at Nearly 5x the Rate of Inflation Over the Last 50 Years"
https://myelearningworld.com/c... [myelearningworld.com]
"A good rule of thumb is that tuition rates will increase at about twice the general inflation rate. On average, tuition tends to increase about 8% per year. An 8% college inflation rate means that the cost of college doubles every nine years."
https://finaid.org/savings/tui... [finaid.org]
"College Tuition Is Rising at Twice the Inflation Rate—While Students Learn At Home"
https://www.fo [forbes.com]
Re: (Score:2)
Where was this discount meant to come from then? Workload increases, costs go up and you expect money to be magicked out of nowhere?
Most universities are sitting on piles of cash from government grants, alumni donations and scientific patents. They really don't need to charge tuition at all.
Re: (Score:2)
This is not the universities fault, and 9k is less than it costs universities to teach STEM courses.
[...]
Everywhere I go I see teachers in Ferarris, research scientists drinking Champagne...
I can't speak to how it works in the UK, but in the USA there IS a big problem at the universities, they HAVE raised prices more than it costs to provide education, but despite that the money is NOT going to the teachers... whose real wages are falling.
The problem is that school administrators are both excessively numerous and making extremely outsized salaries, and have their own union. Since they are not represented by the same union as educators, and do not apparently have the same concerns as educators [reddit.com]*
Re: Here in the UK (Score:2)
Tell me again we need to raise taxes "for the teachers".
Re: (Score:2)
Oh just fuck all the way off, will you? This is not the universities fault, and 9k is less than it costs universities to teach STEM courses.
Their costs did not decrease. All the staff needed to be paid, all the buildings needed to be maintained. But then they had a fuckton of extra work to do which was to convert all the courses, teaching and so on to online only.
A reasonable person say the quality of the product being delivered fell, therefore the price should too. What is cost to produce something does not always translate to its value. Perhaps more of these universities should have taken some losses, seen those endowments erode some etc - you know like much of the rest of the world did due to COVID restrictions!
Also that work transitioning stuff to online isnt dead weight loss - its 'investment in the future' where many education products are certainly going to b
Re: (Score:2)
So you fuck right off! - simple reality modern academia at least in the US
Get a brain, moran.
What part of "here in the UK" makes you think its in the US.
Re: (Score:3)
Students are customers, got it?
And this is the problem with the fantasy that universities are a business. They aren't a business and students are not customers, they are students. It's different and it works differently.
If it's really a business relationship then the students can simply stop paying. You're demanding the decidedly non businessy thing where the university just charges less despite there being no change in costs.
discuss it over champagne with your city banker friends you arsehole.
Hey, I'm not
Re: (Score:2)
Stimulus money made sense - we wanted to keep the economy going strong.
This college loan stuff makes the opposite of sense. Inflation is a result of the economy "going too strong", the very worst time to add "stimulus".