NCAA to Tighten Twitter Rules 116
theodp writes "Facebook and Twitter have made student athletes more accessible than ever, but Tweets that catch the watchful eye of the NCAA could be all that's needed to bring down a successful college athletic program. Among the allegations leveled against the Univ. of North Carolina by the NCAA is a failure to 'adequately and consistently monitor social networking activity,' which the NCAA argues would have caused the school to detect other violations sooner than they did. To cope with the daunting task of monitoring hundreds of accounts on a daily basis, some sports programs are turning to software like UDiligence, while others are opting for a simpler approach, such as having a coach frequently check on posts from the team's players."
well (Score:3)
that is what happens when you post every detail of your life on a billboard, anyone can see it
Re:OH BOY SPAWTS (Score:5, Insightful)
I think the slashdot angle is the crackdown on freedom of speech. Granted, the NCAA isn't the federal government, but that kind of makes it even worse, that a giant multi-million dollar "corporation" can tell the people it exploits what they can or can't say.
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The NCAA isn't a "corporation" it's an association. The "crackdown on freedom of speech" includes monitoring to make sure the college student players are not taking money/gifts under the table, discussing drug use or underage alcohol consumption, etc. You know, things that they agree to when they sign up to be non-professional sports player in university.
Yeah, they'll probably also get caught using it for making themselves look better, but in general it's about protecting the (often immature and stupid) p
What gives them the right? (Score:5, Insightful)
Why should students in the NCAA be any more monitored than regular students? (As in, why at all?). As is, the NCAA athletes often bring in major revenue to schools (for football programs at least) and are not allowed to benefit from it at all, does the NCAA consider them their slaves?
Re:What gives them the right? (Score:4, Insightful)
Why should students in the NCAA be any more monitored than regular students? (As in, why at all?). As is, the NCAA athletes often bring in major revenue to schools (for football programs at least) and are not allowed to benefit from it at all, does the NCAA consider them their slaves?
Simple, we are moving more and more towards a police state.and away from freedom of the press. The NCAA does not want to be publicly criticized when it is anyone's legal right to criticize them. Heaven forefend should a player criticize the holy NCAA!
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It's not about legal rights. It's not about freedom of the press.
Just because you have the right to criticize doesn't mean there aren't repercussions to doing so. You criticize your meal ticket/benefactor at your own risk. This has always been true, it's not at all new.
And it's not about a police state when it isn't the police telling you you can't do it.
Anyway, this isn't about criticizing the NCAA, it's about monitoring the athletes so signs of rule-breaking can be caught earlier. It likely won't go anywh
Re:What gives them the right? (Score:5, Insightful)
Why should students in the NCAA be any more monitored than regular students? (As in, why at all?). As is, the NCAA athletes often bring in major revenue to schools (for football programs at least) and are not allowed to benefit from it at all, does the NCAA consider them their slaves?
Because there is some myth that star college athletes are not in it for the money, but the pure joy of clean, gentlemanly competition and the excitement of the game.
It's the same myth that has made the idea that pro athletes don't / should not use enhancing drugs and therapies.
It's the myth that competition isn't about winning.
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It's the myth that competition isn't about winning.
Actually it is. Competition, in the classic sense, is about performing at ones best and pitting oneself against another is a great way to do it.
The NCAA and college sports are about winning - by any means possible. You see, there's a lot of stupid people with way too much money who give it to schools that win but may not necessarily compete well.
Here's an example from my own past of what I mean in terms of the difference between "winning" and "competing".
*wavy line* wavy lines*wavy lines*
I was competing at
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>>Granted, it's hard to justify, why exactly swimming would give you an advantage in natural selection.
All of evolutionary psychology is hard to justify.
EPers confuse "making shit up" with "doing science".
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I've written long posts on it before, but don't feel like repeating myself.
Consider the following: if you can use a theory to prove any proposition, there is a problem with your theory.
You want a theory that can explain everything, not anything.
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>>But you're a lazy ass in general
Sort of. I have a policy of not wasting time explaining things to anonymous cowards, since it's analogous to throwing your pearls before swine and all that.
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I "won". BUT, I could have "won" even if I doggy paddled the 100 and did it in 10 minutes because of the way the age groups worked.
Everyone gets a trophy. My kids have not won anything, but do have a stack of trophies and ribbons.
Coming home with my ribbon for "First Place" my Mom was soooooo proud. I explained why I didn't give a shit. She said, "But you still won!" and loved to show my "First Place" ribbon to family. When she did that, I wanted to die of embarrassment because it wasn't a "win" to me - I got it on a technicality and BFD!
I guess I can see how people get the win at any cost mentality, but I don't understand how it can be satisfying.
It isn't. My kids simply don't care about their stack of trophies and ribbons more than an hour after they get them. Despite all the talk about this being a sports obsessed overcompetitive nation, we are at least officially trying our formal best to destroy that competitive spirit.
On the other hand, my son is extraordinarily proud of his video game accomplishments... probably because they're the most "real
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On the other hand, my son is extraordinarily proud of his video game accomplishments... probably because they're the most "real" form of competition he will likely every have, at least until he's much older.
Sometimes that can be an understatement. I have played Halo against college students and others my own age and held my own. In fact, in my age group, I am almost god like. I once played against a 13 year old. After about 15 minutes he asked if I had really played before or if I was just lying.
These "video games" can be harder than you think. It ain't Donkey Kong anymore.
If your son is winning victories against South Koreans in Starcraft....... let's just say he made it to the majors and is a top player
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These "video games" can be harder than you think. It ain't Donkey Kong anymore.
Donkey Kong was not watered down, nor most FPS. Other than grindfest MMORPGs (is there any other kind?) games have not been watered down into "everyone's a winner" yet. Give them time, the same poison that ruined baseball will eventually spread to Halo; everyone will "win the game".
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I don't understand how this is possible. My son, aged 11, competes in football, basketball, club level soccer, and track.
His wins are important to him because he works hard and those ribbons and trophies represent his wins and by extension show that his work over time is being rewarded.
How old are your kids and what are they competing in that they can "win" without being competitive and without effort?
Re:What gives them the right? (Score:5, Insightful)
This is to prevent a race to the bottom, where the only way to win is by completely destroying your health. It's also because pro sports are a commercial enterprise, and most fans aren't interested in being a party to death sports. It's the same reason the NFL issued new rules to reduce brain injuries last year, even though such hits are exciting to watch, and have nothing to do with a taboo such as drugs. (Granted, whether these new rules will be initially successful, or will - more likely - require further tweaking, is another matter).
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>>AFAIK injury rates are much much higher for NFL or Rugby than they are for just about every other sport.
That's because having your face mashed into a pulp doesn't count as an "injury" in MMA. An injury is something so serious you can't fight any more.
Jason Von Flue, an acquaintance of mine, came back from a match with black eyes, a split lip and damage all over his body, but he didn't bitch about it once. Whereas a soccer player would fall over and cry on the pitch, rocking back and forth crying for
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I imagine a rugby fan would watch MMA and call them a bunch of wussies for it only being 1 on 1. "There's 20 lads in a scrum, this ponce can't even handle one?!"
Re:What gives them the right? (Score:4, Insightful)
The NCAA is free to set rules and regulations for their scholarships based on their values, and the students are free to not seek NCAA scholarships if they disagree or can't accept those rules.
There is no myth here, merely (some) students who pretend to accept those values but secretly don't. That's a character flaw in the students, not the NCAA's sportsmanship values, or some myth about reality.
That's not a myth either, that's a rule. If pro athletes don't like the rules of the competitions they enter, then they are free to found their own sporting associations and compete in their own games, where they make up the rules so that they can use prohibited drugs and therapies and anything else they like. But if they want to compete in someone else's games, then they have to follow someone else's rules, duh.
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The problem is that the NCAA has a defacto monopoly over college sports. There's also the NAIA, but they're mostly limited to a handful of small schools and attract little athletic talent. If you want to be an NCAA athlete, you have to sign all the compliance stuff and abide by their rules, whether you are on s
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and the universities are free to refuse to accept students on those scholarships if they require them to violate their fundamental principles which should include mutual respect and a reasonable degree of privacy
Well, that's a moot point, since I'm pretty sure that none of the US universities actually DO include "mutual respect and a reasonable degree of privacy" in their fundamental principles.
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Exactly. If the NCAA had of alleged the Univ. of North Carolina had failed to 'adequately and consistently monitor student athletes via phone taps and private investigators' they would be regarded as insane. Sure what the athletes do could embarrass the university or the NCAA, but that is only cause to kick offenders off teams, not have them tracked and monitored.
Sports teams and universities have no duty to ACTIVELY monitor athletes (or other students) to prevent violations. They only have a moral (and som
Re:What gives them the right? (Score:5, Informative)
had failed to 'adequately and consistently monitor student athletes via phone taps and private investigators' they would be regarded as insane.
There's a difference: telephone conversations are private. Twitter posts are public.
Sports teams and universities have no duty to ACTIVELY monitor athletes (or other students) to prevent violations. They only have a moral (and sometimes legal) duty to deal openly and fairly when violations come to their attention.
Yes... "when violations come to their attention". They have a duty to be paying attention though, which includes consuming major publications, such as local newspapers, major news networks, and (yes) Twitter, for possibly inappropriate statements students have provided for public consumption using their name that is associated with the University and the Football program.
This is not about 'monitoring' students; it's about monitoring public venues to protect the image of their brand, and their football team members are part of their brand -- whatever publicity their football team members create has an effect on the University and Football associations' images in the public eye.
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So what about students of arts programs or journalism programs or science programs or history programs?
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So what about students of arts programs or journalism programs or science programs or history programs?
There are not billions of $$s in current profits to protect for student art, journalism, science, and history programs. There is not a big association that sets rules of behavior art students at all schools must follow or be suspended.
And not much news coverage of non-athletes at a university, so the public at large doesn't associate the student with the university, unless they are some type of amba
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The same holds true for teachers and professors. They have both been fired for things they said publicly outside of the school/university.
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The same holds true for teachers and professors. They have both been fired for things they said publicly outside of the school/university.
I thought the whole point of tenure was to protect the freedom of speech of professors.
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I don't particularly know why the NCAA would need to be able to do stuff like this. I do know that if the NFL and NBA had developmental leagues (like MLB and the NHL), there would be no reason for it. If you're a good high school football player, you have to play college football for 3 years until you can be drafted (well technically you just have to be 3 years removed from high school). There'd be no reason for players to violate NCAA policy if they didn't have to go through the NCAA. They could just g
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You seem to be unaware that players in AA (base) ball are under the same strictures as players in the Majors - because they're all part of the same organization.
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Monitoring of students should be done by parents, legal guardians and baby sitters.
College students usually don't have legal guardians or baby sitters; most are 18, the age of majority, or older.
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I got some news for you, pal. The majority of college students around me are 16 or 17.
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Actually, it is. Especially for the summer-born ones that started Kindergarten at 4 or 5.
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What gives them the right?
The theory goes that participation in the NCAA-affiliated athletic programs is a *voluntary* choice for the student, and that as a condition of participation in that program, the student athlete voluntarily gives up certain right/privileges. It's also not a permanent renunciation of rights, as the student can get out from under the requirements at any time by quitting the athletic program. (Of course, that probably also means quitting college and/or repaying the school for loans, as they're probably on an a
Re:What gives them the right? (Score:4, Insightful)
Luckily, as long as we keep pretending, there is room for rampant hypocrisy and more or less continual rule breaking, so that's a win...
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does the NCAA consider them their slaves?
This seems relevant. [southparkstudios.com]
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Why should students in the NCAA be any more monitored than regular students?
The fact that they get more fame than normal means they are more likely to make mistakes?
The fact that history has taught us these kids WILL do bad things and need to be monitored to help protect them from themselves?
Are not allowed to benefit from it at all? Are you fucking kidding?
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Sources will leak. (Score:5, Interesting)
You could just get drunk and blab to TMZ [tmz.com].
Players will start having 2 twitter accounts, 1 for friends, 1 for 'fans'.
Or how about you actually punish schools? No more of this "aww, you did something illegal yesterday, we'll just mark all those Ws as Ls". If NCAA actually wanted to stop violations they'd cancel OSU's foot ball season. No vacating 2010 wins. No small fines. Cancel their season. You play 0 games. You get 0 revenue.
"It's all there, black and white, clear as crystal! You [violated the rules] so you get nothing! You lose! Good day, sir! "
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Die-hard OSU football fan here.
It pays to note that OSU unilaterally decided to vacate their wins from last year. The NCAA had nothing to do with that.
It also pays to note that the players involved in the rule-breaking were simply selling their own possessions. Sure that's against the rules, but it's a pretty shitty rule. A friend of mine pointed out that they must have this rule or else schools could simply buy each player a $100,000 trophy that they could sell...which would get around the ban on paying
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If the school did something wrong, that would be a viable plan. By what they're doing is monitoring student's Twitter feeds to find when students or agents violate the rules, not just schools.
Athletics are more important than academics? (Score:4, Insightful)
Fuck, is anyone really surprised? This is exactly the sort of shit that happens when you let people who are athletically talented, but often academically deficient, into universities solely for the purpose of playing some game. Of course they won't exhibit good judgment when using social media sites. They'll say and write really fucking stupid stuff, because many of them are just really fucking stupid people.
While there might be some marketing or brand recognition benefit to getting the institution's name blared all over the place during the various football bowls or March Madness, none of this truly helps the academic side of things. Any good academic-oriented school will be more than able to make itself widely known based on merit alone.
It'd be one thing if academically-gifted students who also enjoyed sport formed clubs and played games on the side. I enjoyed rugby as a youth, and participated in organized games even up into university, as relief from my studies. But it's a totally different situation when some of the stupidest athletes around are brought in to an academic setting just to play a sport. They are a drain in every way, from their negative presence on campus, to their costly scholarships, to the ill repute they bring to the academic institution.
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There is no reason to mix sports and education.
Hire NON-STUDENT teams that make money, scrap ALL non-profit student sports and let them do their hobbies on their own dime.
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While attending jr college in my home town, I was dismayed at the baseball program and how it was holy. I hate the jocks, they got treatment that nobody else did, they could miss classes or NOT EVEN ATTEND THEM AT ALL. It wasn't just that, they imported people from other countries. Ours is a poor community and it would have been great if some local kids got the free ride that these non English speaking tools got.
I think our fascination and worship of sports will be our downfall. Putting it with academia is
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That's why I like Cal Tech: their sports department has no influence on the admissions process, so to be on their team, you have to legitimately get into Cal Tech. And *damn* the basketball team looked happy on February 22, 2011, when they won their first conference game since 1985. :D
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To be fair, this form of poor judgement is usually a part of just being young and immature. Lots of college students fall into this.
NCAA Hate (Score:1, Troll)
The wrong battle? (Score:2)
Clearly, by being an athlete these students have given up the idea that anything they do is personal. These glorified High School students should try to spend their college time finding out who they are, by being placed under an oppressive regime where their decisions are made for them.
And of course, the problem in this case is Twitter. It doesn't lie with a competitive college culture that prizes showmanship, machismo, and how much money they bring into the campus over personal growth, getting an educati
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All 1st year college students are glorified high school students. I didn't mean to single out athletes in that regard. The point is that they're in a position in their development where they need to be making their own decisions and their own mistakes. And being watched and guarded (and sheltered) continuously during that time is basically the opposite of what they need to do to cross over into adulthood.
And yeah, University Professors being judged by how many papers they publish is also a misappropriati
Solution to piss off NCAA and monitors (Score:4, Interesting)
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Why would a professor ask for a Facebook profile? I certainly wouldn't give them one.
Attractive member of the appropriate sex : obvious
Mostly its used after cheating is suspected. So, vlm and Anonymous Coward turned in rather similar "hello_world.c" programs last week... lets see if there is anything incriminating on their "walls"; perhaps vlm was dumb enough to write, "hey Anonymous, lets meet at the computer lab at 6pm tonight to work on the assignment together, OK?"
The other part is some profs actually have FB profiles and twitter profiles and they don't mind people asking them question
player should be payed for practice at least mini (Score:2)
player should be payed for practice at least mini wage and what other student workers are payed.
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I used to think that way too, until I realized they are getting paid, their tuition, room and board are being paid fro by the college for them to play a sport for the college
What? (Score:3)
Since when is "failure to 'adequately and consistently monitor social networking activity,'" something that is required?
Sounds more like something that would be illegal then something that they are legally bound to do.
I wonder why? (Score:4, Insightful)
What is sad is that for most sports, only 3% of high school players will go to an NCAA school, and of those, only 1% will go to any pro venue. So in from high school, all these kids are told they are working for opportunity, but all they are working for is to have their lives controlled by the lords of the manor who get all the money. I suppose some people like that. And 99.7% of peasants are left with nothing.
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I understand that we have to have rules to that the schools with the most money do not get the best players by giving them the best... drugs.
Perhaps you were working at the wrong lab? The chemistry labs were the worst, I swear all those guys did all day at internship lab rat jobs was manufacture smoking implements out of the glassware. You'd think with the money they got, they could buy professionally mfgrd devices, but no.... I was not part of that scene, but the kids in that scene spent an inordinate amount of time at the beginning and end of each year, discussing which summer internships and which lab jobs were the "best". I can't blame t
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I wonder how many of these violations have to do with kids complaining about doing work with no pay. When I was in school I worked in a lab and gained valuable skills like working with people from various backgrounds, writing assembly language programs to interface devices, playing with equipment that is available no where else but in a research lab, learning to disassemble and fix such equipment, learning to build novel equipment, learning to solve problems on the fly. Writing reports for NASA. You know what? Unlike the NCAA slaves, um, student athletes, I got paid a fair wage. There was never any question that I was there for the experience, that was priceless, but we are in America and in America people are generally paid for their work. And scholarships are not grants. Scholarships pay for education, not being an entertainer.
However, a scholarship, plus the stipend, training table meals, books, fees, tutors and the opportunity to actually get a degree essentially for playing a sport isn't bad remuneration. Yes, many fail to see the big picture and that is their own, and the school's, failing to put academics first. may have the mistaken belief they will have a pro career that makes them rich. many, however, actually do graduate and become productive members of society. Those who graduate from schools where football is a religi
Violations (Score:3)
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Yeah, the article didn't specify anything, nor did a link it contained that *seemed* like it ought to explain more about that...Hm...
For the benefit of the 90% of non-USian readers... (Score:3, Interesting)
... what the hell is the NCAA?
I gather it's some sort of "sports" thing. Surely if you don't want your whole life dictated by them, you just don't need to play their game?
Find a different game to play. One that's fun, and doesn't require you to sign yourself up to a life of servitude.
Re:For the benefit of the 90% of non-USian readers (Score:4, Informative)
Re:For the benefit of the 90% of non-USian readers (Score:5, Insightful)
Well, then that means that you'll have to get a scholarship for being, you know, a scholar. Maybe they should concentrate on studying, instead of playing catch with their friends.
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Americans aren't good at distinguishing such things. If you aren't good at war, then what good are you?
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Well, then that means that you'll have to get a scholarship for being, you know, a scholar. Maybe they should concentrate on studying, instead of playing catch with their friends.
You're overgeneralizing -- not all athletes are lacking in the scholarship department. Where I went as an undergrad, a highly selective public school on the US east coast, the student athletes had a higher average GPA than the student body as a whole. I was on an NCAA D1 team that qualified for the NCAA national championships for all four years of my eligibility and even finished in the top 10 during one year. I still managed to make the Dean's List several times. Furthermore, a large majority of my tea
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I was surprised at how lazy most of the students were because they had so much extra time than I did when I was an undergrad
Thats because there isn't another point in your life where you will actually have more 'free time'. After college you'll continually have more and more responsibilities until you start gaining disabilities, which will start eating into your time.
Most college students think theres not time for anything and its really hard ... and then they get to the real world and find out they have no clue what 'hard' is yet.
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Then they shouldn't expect someone else to pay for it. Or, if they do want to sell themselves into slavery, they shouldn't bitch about having insane and arbitrary rules set to curb their freedom.
by the way... (Score:2)
Even the US military academies (Air Force, Army, Navy), where the scholarship is in exchange for a military service commitment, are NCAA participants.
Re:For the benefit of the 90% of non-USian readers (Score:4, Informative)
I gather it's some sort of "sports" thing. Surely if you don't want your whole life dictated by them, you just don't need to play their game?
Find a different game to play. One that's fun, and doesn't require you to sign yourself up to a life of servitude.
Sorry, but as a parent I can objectively say that even little league has become kind of "office-spaced" or "dilbert-ified". Check out some individual field/facility rules for compulsory volunteering, scheduling, etc.
Americans use their talents and skills to organize all the fun out of any group activity; Sport, business, hobby, anything.
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I think that the implicit assumption is that anyone who needs to have the abbreviations explained to them isn't going to be interested in the story anyway.
Once again, south park gets it right.... (Score:2)
Should have defined the abbreviation NCAA. (Score:2)
Nowhere in the summary or article does it define the abbreviation NCAA. As I had not previously encountered the abbreviation and the articles talked about college athletes in North Carolina, I assumed that it meant "North Carolina Athletic Association".
really... (Score:1)
WGAFF?
One More Exploitation of the Student Athlete (Score:2)
Providing "education" is no excuse for exploitation.
Am I the only one who doesn't understand? (Score:1)
What confuses me is why Twitter (and facebook and or any other social media service) should be seen as a problem. I'm pretty certain they're not gainigna competitive advantage within the sport. And I presume they're allowed to use these in some aspect, just not for specific purposes. So what are the "violations"? Does this stretch as far as IRC? Usenet? let
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