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The Almighty Buck Businesses

Credit Card Payment Systems Crashed Friday at Stores and Restaurants Across America (businessinsider.com) 88

Posted by EditorDavid from the cash-cash dept.
On Friday credit-card payment systems went down for major businesses scattered across the U.S. Business Insider reports: Fiserv, one of the leading payments providers in the US, told Insider, "A widespread internet service provider outage has impacted multiple businesses today." Ann Cave, a company spokesperson, added in an email: "Some Fiserv services that rely on internet connectivity were interrupted. The majority have been restored and we are fully focused on restoring the remainder...."

Customers on Twitter reported outages at Ikea, Forever 21, McDonald's, and Popeyes, as well as at local places like a car wash and the New Jersey Motor Vehicle Commission. Representatives from the businesses weren't immediately available for comment on Friday.
A Chick-fil-A representative confirmed to the site that their systems were unable to process payments for about one hour. "But for some customers, there was a silver lining. Many Chick-fil-A restaurants started handing out free meals during the outage." Miami International Airport also announced warned customers on Twitter about a county-wide outage with credit-card machines "in all taxis."

Long-time Slashdot reader phalse phace sees a lesson. "You know that cashless society that payment network operators, banks and businesses want? It doesn't work when your payment processor can't process those digital payments."
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Credit Card Payment Systems Crashed Friday at Stores and Restaurants Across America More

Credit Card Payment Systems Crashed Friday at Stores and Restaurants Across America

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  • It will be a nice attack if things get out of hand.

  • Live in UK, thankfully..

  • Comment removed (Score:5, Insightful)

    by account_deleted ( 4530225 ) on Sunday February 28, 2021 @05:51PM (#61109462)
    Comment removed based on user account deletion

    • If the ability to spend money is required for you to be able to survive, then you should have cash.

      I mean, shite, if recent events have taught us nothing else, why not diversify your ability to barter during the tough times?

      A friend of mine in Texas, given over to the conspiracy-minded, gave me this advice: "The credit card processors are about to be compromised. I went to the ATM and got 200 in cash."

      Not a decoy but maybe a decoy... Bro, I keep at least $200 in my desk drawer, nearest the front door, to encourage the rapid departure of crackhead daylight thieves... but you go, boy.

      • Hmm my everyday survival kit, the stuff to deal with everyday emergencies, includes $50 in cash should I be low on gas and the only station nearby couldnt process cards (it happened once amd i was lucky i had $5 to get far enough to get to another station 50mi away). But if you think paper money is not a bad idea to have on hand, keep it in your gun safe or fireproof safe if you dont have a gun safe. If paper money becomes worthless then gold, silver, copper are likely the only things left to barter with b

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by jbengt ( 874751 )

        A friend of mine in Texas, given over to the conspiracy-minded, gave me this advice: "The credit card processors are about to be compromised. I went to the ATM and got 200 in cash."

        $200 in cash won't get you far.
        We always have a stash of cash in the house, mostly because of my wife's business, which is largely paid by her clients in cash. And if you say that's to dodge taxes, I'll counter with how often her customer's checks bounce.

    • Re:Always have cash (Score:5, Insightful)

      by thegarbz ( 1787294 ) on Monday March 01, 2021 @03:30AM (#61110458)

      Sure prepper. In the real world we live in a society that puts a certain amount of trust that infrastructure doesn't go down. When you categorise our survival ability you'll realise the overwhelming majority of the population take a lot of things for granted:

      1) We don't all horde fuel or make our own.
      2) We don't all have generators that can flick us off the grid (or fuel that will make that viable for a long time, see 1).
      3) We don't all store massive amounts of tinned goods to survive a fuel shortage.
      4) Non Americans don't horde weapons to to fend off their prepper stash against your neighbours.
      5) We don't all heat our houses with wood fired heaters, or cook in wood fired BBQs.
      6) We don't all have a drinking water supply, hell given 5 we can't even treat our water reasonably.

      Our ability to survive depends on a lot of things we take for granted. Simply having cash won't make you apocalypses immune. In fact the loss of any of the above would very quickly render cash irrelevant.

      Instead of hording cash the focus should be on surviving for a couple of days, which is typically how long any disaster actually knocks out infrastructure in a dysfunctional run down poorly maintained "first" world country like the USA. For most of the rest of the 1st world you may want your survival plan to cover only a couple of hours.

      Mind you we as a species last year freaked the fuck out over toilet paper, so honestly we're too dumb to survive the loss of any utility really.

      • Mind you we as a species last year freaked the fuck out over toilet paper, so honestly we're too dumb to survive the loss of any utility really.

        That's the real message here, isn't it? It's possible to be prepared, but most people aren't. The things you accurately point out most people don't have, most people should have.

        • That's the real message here, isn't it? It's possible to be prepared, but most people aren't. The things you accurately point out most people don't have, most people should have.

          Anyone in Texas last week that could check off half that list is eternally grateful that they made at least half an effort.

        • The one thing we also should have is a cool head.

          It's one thing to prepare for an apocalypse. It's quite another to demand the collective good (government investment of taxes) is done competently. It's not a case that we should be preparing for the apocalypse, it's a case that we shouldn't need to.

          I had a great example of buying fuel during a credit card outage 8 years ago. Filled up, went inside. Machine didn't work. Nation wide credit card outage. I left my name and address and drivers license number, and

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by jbengt ( 874751 )
            What happened to the old mechanical credit card machines with carbon copy paper using the raised credit card numbers? That used to be the back-up when electronic processing went down. Actually, before that, it used to be the normal way for credit card purchases to be processed. If those machines don't exist any more, it could still be done by hand as the back-up, assuming the clerk knows how to do it..

            • On the way to the airport, 7 or 8 years ago, we stopped by a restaurant for a meal en route.
              When we went to pay, the credit card machine was down.
              The waitress pulled out an imprint machine, and my associate was to pay. Neither his AmEx, nor personal card had the card number embossed; merely printed. My non-US card, with the machine readible card-number embossed, worked fine.

              After talking with more co-workers -- it feels like the US is avoiding backwards compatibility with credit-cards by not giving the

      • Comment removed based on user account deletion

        • That's a pretty complicated way of saying "I can't imagine a situation where being unable to pay for things for a couple days would be devastating."

          Then you missed my point in the most spectacular fashion. The point is: cash is the least of your concerns. There's literally thousands of things requiring 100s of possible mitigations to keep your shiny little ass functioning, and unless you're a professional doomsday prepper, you're not covered for any devastation.

          Instead of every household being self sufficient how about you focus on ensuring the critical infrastructure is actually capable of operating at a reliability you expect of a 1st world country.

          • Comment removed based on user account deletion

            • Otherwise known as an apocalypse. Payment networks going down for more than minor temporary inconvenience ultimately means the halt of fundamental financial systems which make our society turn.

              And regardless of what you are talking about it doesn't change anything I wrote. Why are you so focused on only on of the many 1000s of things that you've not prepared for eventuating?

      • Not sure why this is getting up voted - if your not doing at least part of this your an idiot who deserves the bad things that go along with not being at least partially prepared.

        • Sure. I mean if you live in a 3rd world shithole I agree with you. The people voting me up are probably living in a 1st world country and expect things such as basic infrastructure to function... which ... I admit is a stretch in the USA where it's more important to spend your tax dollars on things that go boom when they fall out of the sky.

    • While I agree with your sentiment, and in fact most purchases under 200 I still use all cash, but cash doesn't help with the grocery store that relies on a central server to pull prices as items are scanned, and that server is unreachable for whatever reason.

      If the internet is down, maybe you can pay with cash. But if the electricity is out chances are good you still won't be able to pay simply because the checkout machine will be down; and big Billy the cashier can't do math AND has no way to look up pr

  • "You know that cashless society that payment network operators, banks and businesses want? It doesn't work when your payment processor can't process those digital payments."

    Down Detector, which tracks outages, reported an increase in problems for people with Visa or Mastercard credit cards.

    If any of these companies had accepted Debit or Paypal or Venmo or Facebook Cash or CashApp or... any of the dozens of other cashless options they would have been able to accept cashless payments.

    Or if they were really concerned have a backup Square reader and always-charging android tablet for processing credit cards through an alternative payment processor as a backup for the once-every-5-years outage for an hour.

    • Re: (Score:1)

      by Anonymous Coward

      If any of these companies had accepted Debit or Paypal or Venmo or Facebook Cash or CashApp or... any of the dozens of other cashless options they would have been able to accept cashless payments.

      Or if they were really concerned have a backup Square reader and always-charging android tablet for processing credit cards through an alternative payment processor as a backup for the once-every-5-years outage for an hour.

      None of that would have worked if you were in Texas during the past 2 weeks [wikipedia.org]

      • None of that would have worked if you were in Texas during the past 2 weeks [wikipedia.org]

        Back in the day, a lack of electricity would have been no problem. (Well, assuming you're fine buying a raw chicken sandwich.)

        The cashier would have simply pulled out their huge paper book full of blacklisted credit card numbers and checked your card against it. Then they'd put the card and a carbon-paper slip in that hand-operated machine and go ching-ching. They'd scribble some illegible info about the sale on the slip, then you'd sign it. Transaction complete.

        I guess over time civilization lets some of t

        • Back in the day, a lack of electricity would have been no problem.

          Or last week, if you're in TX.

        • During one of the California outages, I visited a bakery. Their oven is wood fired. The sales counter was running fine with cash and a tackle box till.

        • None of that would have worked if you were in Texas during the past 2 weeks [wikipedia.org]

          Back in the day, a lack of electricity would have been no problem. (Well, assuming you're fine buying a raw chicken sandwich.)

          The cashier would have simply pulled out their huge paper book full of blacklisted credit card numbers and checked your card against it. Then they'd put the card and a carbon-paper slip in that hand-operated machine and go ching-ching. They'd scribble some illegible info about the sale on the slip, then you'd sign it. Transaction complete.

          I guess over time civilization lets some of the capabilities it used to have atrophy.

          The popularity of cash, akin to the fondness for gold and silver in times fraught with bleak outlook, is oft overlooked in times of prosperity... yet those elephants with the longest memory tend to live on and breed, repopulating the earth with their offspring.

          • I'm sure that sounded smarter in your head.

            • I'm sure that sounded smarter in your head.

              I'm not certain it did, and still, I pressed the mouse pointer, with its ironically Mickey-gloved finger, on both Preview and Submit.

              That's chutzpah, right there.

      • Considering most Point of Sale systems are tied into inventory and accounting and databases and customer retention systems... cash also would be an issue without internet or power.

        But extraordinary circumstances could definitely resort to a Shunker machine. Or worst case scenario... as I've seen clerks do not too long ago, they break out a pen and paper and write down your credit card info onto a sheet of paper when they can't find even the shunker.

        • I assume Shunker is the machine where one uses carbon-less paper to record the card numbers. Basically an embossing machine. With that said where the machines that verify checks down too?

    • In the Canadian system, there is a requirement that the businesses accept at least one form of tender as an alternative to credit cards. For years, this was cash and/or checks.

      I don't know if they still do this.

    • If any of these companies had accepted Debit or Paypal or Venmo or Facebook Cash or CashApp or... any of the dozens of other cashless options they would have been able to accept cashless payments.

      Unless those accounts were also linked to a Visa/Mastercard on the back end ...

  • Cue ominous music (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Provocateur ( 133110 )

    This is only the beginning...

  • Something Missing Here (Score:3, Interesting)

    by ytene ( 4376651 ) on Sunday February 28, 2021 @06:12PM (#61109508)
    The OP talks about a widespread break in service for credit card transactions and then lists multiple businesses being hit, including major franchises.

    Does it seem more likely that all these companies happen to use the same ISP for their corporate internet connectivity - and that we hear about a major ISP outage as a break in card processing capabilities... or does it seem more likely that any fault that happened occurred between the card processing provider and their ISP?

    OK, let’s go with the idea that the problem is with the processor. Surely any major corporate customer, with a business that depends entirely on network connectivity, is going to have a fully redundant network, with their ISP connectivity provided by multiple ISPs, with some degree of intelligent routing built in to their card processing terminals?

    Because it would surely be a bit embarrassing if that company had put all their network connectivity eggs in the basket of a single ISP... even if that ISP had offered them ‘divergent routing’ or ‘full network redundancy’ or whatever?

    Can other readers think of a different reason for a single technical outage impacting multiple clients like that, yet with what seems to be zero additional reported impact? The evidence kinda sounds like a fault on the card processor side, but also seems to suggest that we don’t have the whole story...

    Which, if they really do have an embarrassing network fault tolerance issue, might explain the silence.

    • The summary is poorly written, they all use Fiserv as their merchant service provider, and Fiserv had an outage they're blaming on their ISP.

      Not said is whether it was a front end problem connecting to Fiserv, or it was a problem on their backend that required internet connectivity for processing to function, something like fraud detection may have that requirement for example, if they use a hosted service to do it, I'm just speculating, but the claim in the summary is about Fiserv's internet, not all the i

      • Re: (Score:1)

        by eibw ( 7809024 )
        If this was an ISP outage, why are we not seeing other reports of unrelated businesses suffering an Internet outage? Either everyone else had designed for diversity in their use of an ISP and Fiserv had not or the outage may have been more unique to Fiserv and their connection to their ISP such that others were not impacted. Either way, it seems a stretch to believe the root of the issue was with an ISP and not Fiserv.

    • Can other readers think of a different reason for a single technical outage impacting multiple clients like that, yet with what seems to be zero additional reported impact? The evidence kinda sounds like a fault on the card processor side, but also seems to suggest that we don’t have the whole story...

      I think the full story is not out.
      Consider the rash of recent outages, and the increasing occurrences.
      Consider, also, the relatively recent disclosure about the Solarwinds hacks, the full extent of which is still both unknown and unresolved.

      Could we be in a Cyber World War?

  • The problem isnâ(TM)t that the processor or Internet isnâ(TM)t working, most credit card terminals and cash registers can be configured to process offline payments.

    The problem is with whoever set up the system and thought that a maximum 98% compounded uptime would be acceptable.

  • Why are slashdot editors pushing the pyramid? (Score:4, Informative)

    by Xylantiel ( 177496 ) on Sunday February 28, 2021 @06:20PM (#61109540)

    That is the question that should be asked, since they seem to really be pushing the bitcoin pyramid hard recently. Or maybe this is an infantile attempt to "balance" the earlier story about bitcoin consuming an obscene amount of electricity. I mean this is like the second "obscure and not-really-that-bad glitch in payment or transfer processing system" stories we've had in a few days.

    And the entire theme depends upon a misunderstanding of bitcoin. It currently costs around $25 to complete a single bitcoin transaction. So comparing visa & mc to bitcoin today is comparing a payment processing system that had a minor, unusual glitch, to one that is basically totally unusable for everyday purchases and by design will get more so. Fleecing the ignorant.

    "wow looks like your car isn't getting very good gas mileage, want to trade it in for this car that doesn't work at all and will explode and injure you and your family a week from now?"

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by ASDFnz ( 472824 )

      That is the question that should be asked, since they seem to really be pushing the bitcoin pyramid hard recently.

      Wait, your theory is that Bitcoin somehow managed to bring down card processing?

      How exactly would that work? Enquiring minds want to know.

      • I imagine like a vampire it drained all the electricity from card processing systems. Soon to be a Fox special: when Bitcoin attacks.

    • Bitcoin isn't mentioned in the article or summary. Technology glitches are supremely on topic for Slashdot. Sorry, the fiat system failed you though. Can we get an accounting of how much electricity was wasted trying to process those transactions?

      • how much electricity was wasted trying to process those transactions?

        And while we’re at it, how much electricity is wasted on slashdot?

    • That is the question that should be asked, since they seem to really be pushing the bitcoin pyramid hard recently.

      The only person who has mentioned bitcoin is you. Why are *you* keeping bitcoin front and centre? And why do you not think payment processing going down isn't a tech story? Would you prefer Slashdot instead cover's Trump's speech from yesterday?

      Maybe if you don't like IT or tech stories you should find yourself another site.

    • Unfortunately the /. editors have been shilling BitCoin for the past year+. Almost every week there is yet-another-bullshit story about Bitcoin.

      Just ignore all the stories from that moron EditorDavid..

  • Diversity + Cash is king (Score:3)

    by markdavis ( 642305 ) on Sunday February 28, 2021 @06:22PM (#61109544)

    > "You know that cashless society that payment network operators, banks and businesses want? It doesn't work when your payment processor can't process those digital payments."

    It also doesn't work when your card physically malfunctions.
    Or if your bank accidentally disabled the card.
    Or if the store's connection goes down.
    Or if your bank intentionally disabled the card due to possible but incorrect assumption of fraud protection.
    Or if you want to NOT be tracked.

    All responsible people should carry at least two DIFFERENT cards (different payment processing system AND different bank/issuer), as well as some CASH.

    • A cashless system in not resilient (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Beeftopia ( 1846720 ) on Sunday February 28, 2021 @08:34PM (#61109822)

      To build on your point, a cashless system is not resilient. A cashless system requires a tremendous amount of infrastructure - electricity, routers, databases, programmers, etc. Cash does not.

      Also, you need permission to execute a digital transaction. Look at gun purchases [cnbc.com] or pornHub [vice.com] or even Trump or other frowned-upon political activities/figures. [cnet.com]

      As we've seen with deplatforming undesirable (by those with the power) political elements, individuals relying on the tech infrastructure to purchase things can be "deplatformed".

      There's no question cashless transactions can be tremendously fast and convenient as long as a) the infrastructure is functional and b) you are not engaging in frowned-upon transactions. But when you stray outside the expected (or desired) use cases (turn on sound to fully enjoy) [imgur.com], then the transactions cannot occur.

      • ...A cashless system requires a tremendous amount of infrastructure - electricity, routers, databases, programmers, etc. Cash does not...

        (Pablo Escobar, circa financial prime) "Uh, cash ain't that cheap. I spend $2500 a month just on rubber bands..."

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by mad7777 ( 946676 )
      preach on.

      and you forgot to mention the 2-3% drag on the entire economy that results from the fee charged by credit card companies simply for processing the transaction.

      yep. cash sure is cool tech!
      • Transactions are unhackable. No need to worry about who stole your credit card info every time a retailer suffers a security breach.
      • Transactions not stored in any bank's database forever, to be sold to unknown third parties at any time in the future, for any purpose.
      • No middleman taking a percent

  • "It doesn't work when your payment processor can't process those digital payments"

    There are so many times when cash doesnt work (damaged, destroyed, lost, stolen, remote from where you need it) that if an hour of downtime so rarely that it makes the news, is the only thing i am risking by going cashless, i am all for it.

    Or i should say, except for craigslist deals and lawn sales, i have been mostly cashless for years now. So in a sense we already do live in a cashless society.

    • There are so many times when cash doesnt work (damaged, destroyed, lost, stolen, remote from where you need it)

      Yes, you put words together, but whatever point you were trying to make is lost. Literally nothing you said makes sense since, with the exception of damaged, you wouldn't have the cash on hand in the first place. And just because a bill is damaged doesn't make it not work. Unlike credit or debit cards.

      Just yesterday I found a book at Goodwill. In the time it took me to peel off a bill AND a nick

      • Yes, cash is still the fastest payment type, and has no middlemen

        • Maybe we can hire someone to hold our cash and drive up with some when we need it. Maybe call it DoorCash! Wait never you mind, completely ignore that. I have a business idea to work out.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by ceoyoyo ( 59147 )

      Most places here have been strongly encouraging contactless payment as a COVID precaution. No more standing in line behind that one customer who has to pay in dimes and couldn't start counting them, or even dig them out, before the total came up on the register.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by ledow ( 319597 )

      I'm entirely cashless. That's the way things are going and I see no point in clinging to money. "But in a catastrophe money will be usable"?! Nope. 34% of Brits were refused a cash transaction during the pandemic lockdowns. Now imagine what happens when cash is just seen as worthless paper like in Zimbabwe when inflation made it worthless. Your $1 bills aren't worth a thing if people don't accept that they are.

      I got my daughter cashless too. She has a "credit" card, it's a pre-pay thing for children.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by jbengt ( 874751 )

        A cheap GBP40 4G card reader in each of their stores could have let them take people's money, even if at a higher percentage.

        No, it wouldn't have. Those stores were tied to Fiserv, and Fiserv went down. They would have had to have a back-up financial services provider, not back-up wireless hardware.

    • I use my card for most purchases, especially since the pandemic began. But I also carry cash, which has come in handy a couple of times when (shock amazement) a vendor couldn't process card payments for some reason. Yes, specifically since the pandemic began. It's a full idiot move to carry no cash. At least fold up a crisp Benjamin and keep it in your wallet for emerging situations.

  • There was a connectivity problem That wasn't the "system crashing". It could have been someone moving a cable around incorrectly in a data center.

    Reminds me of people who thought "the internet is down" because they can't log in to AOL.

  • this is an attempted invocation of betteridge's law[1] on slashdot's part.

    >Bots hyped up GameStop on major social media platforms, analysis finds

    the source article is much more up front about the situation.

    P.S. this is my second comment on slashdot after lurking for years, and it's about the exact same thing as my first comment, less than a week apart. knock it off, slashdot

    [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]

  • You know how crazy hateful those Lefties are. Do you think for one minute that they're not going to start turning the credit cards off for people and transactions that they don't approve of? It has already happened, and like everything it's only going to get worse. Five years ago you never dreamed it could possibly be as bad as it is now.
    • I knew it was going this way since the 90s. I just hoped that long before it got this bad, people would figure out that this shit needed to be resisted peacefully, but effectively. While it was still possible.

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